So why doesnt God appear every now and again?

[Man of Steel]

Disgusting in your mind, not disgusting to jesus and god's mind though.  Child fucking was all the rage in the Bronze Age.  You didn't know that?

How old do you think Muhammed of Islam's bride was?  They all liked child fucking back then and children fucked them back.  It was lawful and common back then.

Not taking your troll bait.   Already told you God's standards.  You're defending from the world's standards.

[The True Adonis]

Not taking your troll bait.   Already told you God's standards.  You're defending from the world's standards.

Well, Muhammed saw it differently and he is the equivalent to jesus and greater according to billions.

You are defending from today's standards.  Why would jesus be against child fucking when everyone else at the time wasn't?  That does not make any sense.

[Dave D]

Having a discussion with some folks over a local pastor that plead guilty to molesting his foster child for the last 7 years. After someone offered a prayer for her healing I asked "Rather than damage control, why didn't god prevent the molestation by one of his representatives 7 years ago? Isn't it too late to get god involved now? The answer was.. "God gave man dominion over the earth" as if this answer made sense.

So I asked "Which is it? Does god NOT ever get involved as you suggest with your "dominion" reasoning, or does he? You can't have it both ways. You can't pray for healing, or Johnny makes it home safe or give god credit for someone surviving a car accident but then when a tornado wipes out a daycare center, or a child is repeatedly raped for 7 years, throw up your hands and say "God gave man dominion over the earth"....

Thoughts MOS?

I'm sure MOS will give a much more well thought out answer but the reality is bad, horrific things happen in life, the Christian faith and the practice of it doesn't excuse, protect or prevent these atrocities from taking place.

In all honesty if you read the Bible and it's accounts suffering, hardships and travesty are all vital keys to the Christian faith. The primary belief is that Christians are ambassadors of God's kingdom. The trials of this life are nothing in the light of eternity. If the Christ lived out suffering and rejection and overcame it His followers can too.

This can make Christianity a tough faith to believe in.  There are many tough questions that offer no easy/simple answers.

Great question though!

Adonis makes a valid point though, as many biblical scholars believe Mary, the virgin mother, was around 13 years old when she was pregnant.

[Man of Steel]

Well, Muhammed saw it differently and he is the equivalent to jesus and greater according to billions.

You are defending from today's standards.  Why would jesus be against child fucking when everyone else at the time wasn't?  That does not make any sense.

Islam is not of Christ.   

I defend from God's standards.  You're seeking the world's standards.  Jesus Christ is God who entered the world to redeem it.

[The True Adonis]

I'm sure MOS will give a much more well thought out answer but the reality is bad, horrific things happen in life, the Christian faith and the practice of it doesn't excuse, protect or prevent these atrocities from taking place.

In all honesty if you read the Bible and it's accounts suffering, hardships and travesty are all vital keys to the Christian faith. The primary belief is that Christians are ambassadors of God's kingdom. The trials of this life are nothing in the light of eternity. If the Christ lived out suffering and rejection and overcame it His followers can too.

This can make Christianity a tough faith to believe in.  There are many tough questions that offer no easy/simple answers.

Great question though!

Adonis makes a valid point though, as many biblical scholars believe Mary, the virgin mother, was around 13 years old when she was pregnant.

Exactly.

Pregnant with gods sperm.  God fucked her so god fucked a child.  God likes child fucking.  Not hard to deduce at all.

[Man of Steel]

Exactly.

Pregnant with gods sperm.  God fucked her so god fucked a child.  God likes child fucking.  Not hard to deduce at all.

TA I pray you find deliverance in Jesus Christ.  I pray God pours out his mercy upon you.  I pray God blesses you abundantly.

[Man of Steel]

I'm sure MOS will give a much more well thought out answer but the reality is bad, horrific things happen in life, the Christian faith and the practice of it doesn't excuse, protect or prevent these atrocities from taking place.

In all honesty if you read the Bible and it's accounts suffering, hardships and travesty are all vital keys to the Christian faith. The primary belief is that Christians are ambassadors of God's kingdom. The trials of this life are nothing in the light of eternity. If the Christ lived out suffering and rejection and overcame it His followers can too.

This can make Christianity a tough faith to believe in.  There are many tough questions that offer no easy/simple answers.

Great question though!

Adonis makes a valid point though, as many biblical scholars believe Mary, the virgin mother, was around 13 years old when she was pregnant.

Thank you for your words Dave.  What you stated is correct and I affirm it.

[The True Adonis]

TA I pray you find deliverance in Jesus Christ.  I pray God pours out his mercy upon you.  I pray God blesses you abundantly.

Was mary pregnant and was she above the age of consent in today's terms?

[mac33]

[Man of Steel]

Was mary pregnant and was she above the age of consent in today's terms?

We don't know how old Mary was when she became pregnant.  Can't answer your question fully.  Some say 12, some say 16, some say 18, some say 22. 

[Man of Steel]

For anyone unsure as to why i said you are mentally ill, i would invite them to read your words more closely, as they demonstrate perfectly, the mind of a very sick man. You've just said that children are the most precious in God's Kingdom, yet you've posted that God does indeed kill children...but for a variety of ways that you couldn't begin to understand. Not only do you admit that this God you believe in Kills innocent people, you actually try to justify it as something righteous too!

"We make the assumption that the innocents that perished (in the flood for example) died a painful, horrific death. We don't know that"

"Did they lose their lives here on earth?  Absolutely.  As did generations of pagans before them.  Had they been allowed to flourish for another generation or several generations they (the children...the innocent) would've fallen prey to the sinful behavior of their ancestors and been separated from God eternally when they died.  God saw that the pagan nations had come into the fullness of their sin.  So he pronounced judgment upon the wicked and took the innocent to be with him."

What contradictory nonsense: God kills pagans, but he doesn't Kill children because of sin...yet you claim he judged the wicked and took the innocent with him. How can any man be so deluded as to claim that God literally did flood the world, drown everyone - the innocent too, and rightfully so, but we cannot be sure that he didn't magically remove their ability to feel pain as he drowned him?  This is the same type of dangerous fundamentalism that we see being preached by Islamic extremists as they justify honour killings. I cannot believe that people would seriously PM you and thank you for making these kinds of posts. There should be no doubt now as to why it is that you are often called out. It's nothing to do with Atheists "hating god" or being unsure of their own beliefs; there is a clear distinction between someone who has a sense of spirituality, or believes in a deity of sorts, and the militant fundamentalists who justify all the disgusting passages in the bible and use them to condemn everyone to hell. I have no need for wishful thinking, but i don't really have much of a problem with those that do. You stand apart from them, and your posts in this thread demonstrate why.

Answer this succinctly and honestly, please. You've already taken many passages of scripture as literal and attempted to justify them, as with the parable of Christ and the pigs, Noah's Ark etc, so if a man reads passages from the bible which instruct him to kill unbelievers and members of family who have sinned, and takes them as literal, is he right in doing so? and if God appeared before you and asked you to sacrifice your child as a test of faith, would you?

I encourage folks to read my words.....I stand behind them 100%.   If folks read them they'll also get every bit of context you excluded.

[Raymondo]

Since I know you won't agree with my words here are some quick copy and pastes from my previous posts:

Nominal Christian:

That pastor is not a Christian.  Sorry that behavior is demonic and no person made a new man in Christ would or could do such a thing.  Plenty of nominal Christians....even pastors.  Plenty of heretical teachings and sinful practices from "God's representatives" all over the place.

This a prime example of the "no true Scotsman" logical fallacy.

[bigmc]

the one thing you can rely on with religious nuts

as soon as you confront them with facts

they start with the i will pray for your soul crap

i cant believe this is the same man of steel

he used to be funny self depreciating and really got this place



what a shame  

[Man of Steel]

This a prime example of the "no true Scotsman" logical fallacy.

This fallacy is thrown out anytime a genuine Christian identifies another as non-Christian.  I measure others by God's standards and his words.  You don't understand God's word so all you have is the "no true Scotsman" fallacy to rely upon.

[Man of Steel]

the one thing you can rely on with religious nuts

as soon as you confront them with facts

they start with the i will pray for your soul crap

i cant believe this is the same man of steel

he used to be funny self depreciating and really got this place



what a shame 

We know that our old sinful selves were crucified with Christ so that sin might lose its power in our lives. We are no longer slaves to sin.

[Raymondo]

Virtually everything I copy and paste I wrote and researched myself.  It's of God's word it's validation for the Christian perspective.   I seek the things of God not the things of the world.   The world will lead you to sin and hell.  There isn't any evidence or proof of God you will accept.....not my problem, it's yours.

You are abusing the term "research", just like you regularly misunderstand and abuse the terms "facts", "evidence", "personal attack", "space", "time", etc.

There is no hell, no God and no evidence for God.

[Raymondo]

This fallacy is thrown out anytime a genuine Christian identifies another as non-Christian.  I measure others by God's standards and his words.  You don't understand God's word so all you have is the "no true Scotsman" fallacy to rely upon.

Logic is what I have to reply upon. Men use it to make sense of the world. Men.

Curious how you didn't even attempt to refute that your post is as "no true Scotsman" as it gets.

[Man of Steel]

I quoted your two posts in their entirety and highlighted specific parts that i wanted to address; i did not exclude context. Avoid addressing it if you like, the fact that you've said you stand by those words 100% simply adds weight to the point i was making.

I've already addressed your issues in this thread.....please refer to those posts....they aren't changing and I'm 100% behind them.  You're just rehashing your same objections because you don't like the answer.

Perhaps someone else will provide a better reply.

You did include my full posts....I was wrong....I concentrated on your new words.  I stand by my posts nonetheless.

Which passages of scripture tells folks to kill nonbelievers today? 

[BigRo]

What you wrote is very well put.

Many people want to believe their soul will live on in some beautiful place, that it (they) will be reincarnated or somehow immortal. Most people spend their lives surviving. It is hard to give that up.

I'm on my way to reaching my 72nd year. Like a lot of folks, I have no idea when I will end. Unlike a lot of folks, I do not fear it....it is inevitable. In the meantime, I intend to live each day I have to the fullest. It would be difficult to do this, if I was worrying about dying.

I'm curious as to why you sit for hours in an empty church. Does the quiet atmosphere comfort you?

Yes it does, though my motivation for doing so is not comfort. It is to cultivate the ability to dwell in Presence which brings exceeding joy and love and is not a selfish state but a more complete interaction with all that is. People spend hours in the gym to sculpt their bodies. Some spend hours in contemplation to allow the universe to sculpt their mind.

[Raymondo]

Adonis makes a valid point though, as many biblical scholars believe Mary, the virgin mother, was around 13 years old when she was pregnant.

She was not a virgin. Parthenogenesis is not possible in primates.

[Man of Steel]

Logic is what I have to reply upon. Men use it to make sense of the world. Men.

Curious how you didn't even attempt to refute that your post is as "no true Scotsman" as it gets.

I did refute it.  I told you I measure others according to God's standards.....the ultimate standard.  This fallacy references the denial of others according to the behaviors of men and their subjectivity.  I prescribe to the objectivity of God.

[Man of Steel]

She was not a virgin. Parthenogenesis is not possible in primates.

If you engage the Christian worldview you are bound by it terms and therefore God is allowed to be God and his will and abilities transcends the natural world.

[Raymondo]

I did refute it.  I told you I measure others according to God's standards.....the ultimate standard.  This fallacy references the denial of others according to the behaviors of men and their subjectivity.  I prescribe to the objectivity of God.

It is not a refutation
I constantly find myself in the position of having to school you.

You assert that that pastor is not a Christian because he abused a child, whereas you should be proving how child abuse is against what you call "God's standards". And since most reasonably people do not believe in such vague terms, your best bet would be to quote your Holy Book and show me verses where child abuse is proscribed. This is one of few cases where quoting the bible would be appropriate, in contrast to your practice so far, which is to quote the bible when you're having a meltdown.

[Dave D]

She was not a virgin. Parthenogenesis is not possible in primates.

Yes I understand your point.

However Mary's virgin status is vital to establish the impregnation of the Holy Spirit. If she were not a virgin than Jesus wouldn't be who He claims to be.

[Man of Steel]

It is not a refutation
I constantly find myself in the position of having to school you.

You assert that that pastor is not a Christian because he abused a child, whereas you should be proving how child abuse is against what you call "God's standards". And since most reasonably people do not believe in such vague terms, your best bet would be to quote your Holy Book and show me verses where child abuse is proscribed. This is one of few cases where quoting the bible would be appropriate, in contrast to your practice so far, which is to quote the bible when you're having a meltdown.

Saying things like "having to school you" doesn't phase me.

That is correct.  A man identifying as a pastor repeatedly abused a child.  Therefore he is not of Christ....he is not made new in Christ....he is of the devil and his old wicked self.   The pastor needs to repent and be made new in Christ.   This behavior is neither of God nor is this "pastor" saved by grace through faith in Jesus Christ and sanctified by the Holy Spirit in order to fulfill the will of God.  We have a false convert in the form of a pastor still steeped in his sin....the old man did not die but remains a slave to sin.  Not a Christian according to the objective, ultimate standards of God.