Author Topic: So why doesnt God appear every now and again?  (Read 103096 times)

Man of Steel

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Re: So why doesnt God appear every now and again?
« Reply #300 on: March 16, 2016, 03:33:33 PM »
How can you (or anyone else) know about another person's every thought?

We know about Jesus' life.

Jesus Christ was without sin.  He had no sinful thoughts.   

SF1900

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Re: So why doesnt God appear every now and again?
« Reply #301 on: March 16, 2016, 03:34:17 PM »
Good thing we have science and reason to tell us that masturbation, within the confines of a sexual relationship or alone, is healthy.

http://www.webmd.com/sex-relationships/guide/masturbation-guide

While it once was regarded as a perversion and a sign of a mental problem, masturbation now is regarded as a normal, healthy sexual activity that is pleasant, fulfilling, acceptable, and safe. It is a good way to experience sexual pleasure and can be done throughout life.
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Man of Steel

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Re: So why doesnt God appear every now and again?
« Reply #302 on: March 16, 2016, 03:34:33 PM »
but it does equate to having desire even if not acted apon, and your not willing to allow him that humanness.

Jesus Christ was human but perfect in every thought, word and deed.  He was without sin.  The spotless lamb.  The perfect sacrifice for our sin.

Dave D

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Re: So why doesnt God appear every now and again?
« Reply #303 on: March 16, 2016, 03:35:50 PM »
So he was tempted? I thought you said no "pornographic" thoughts.

Which is it?

Raymondo you're obviously very smart and well versed on the subject matter so you already know Jesus was tempted, the scripture recordings give an example of Satan tempting Him with promises.

Just because someone has a thought doesn't make it sin, when you start to dwell/obsess on those thoughts it becomes an issue.

I honestly understand why you consider this belief foolishness, and I appreciate you having well thought out valid points. It causes me to challenge my own beliefs.





Skeletor

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Re: So why doesnt God appear every now and again?
« Reply #304 on: March 16, 2016, 03:38:17 PM »
We know about Jesus' life.

Jesus Christ was without sin.  He had no sinful thoughts.   

Can you really know his every thought?

SF1900

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Re: So why doesnt God appear every now and again?
« Reply #305 on: March 16, 2016, 03:39:11 PM »
Raymondo you're obviously very smart and well versed on the subject matter so you already know Jesus was tempted, the scripture recordings give an example of Satan tempting Him with promises.

Just because someone has a thought doesn't make it sin, when you start to dwell/obsess on those thoughts it becomes an issue.

I honestly understand why you consider this belief foolishness, and I appreciate you having well thought out valid points. It causes me to challenge my own beliefs.






Dwelling on any issue becomes a psychological problem, which can affect quality of life. However, its not a sin.
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Raymondo

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Re: So why doesnt God appear every now and again?
« Reply #306 on: March 16, 2016, 03:41:07 PM »
We know about Jesus' life.

Jesus Christ was without sin.  He had no sinful thoughts.   

Jesus of Nazareth was a man and all men have desires.

Raymondo

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Re: So why doesnt God appear every now and again?
« Reply #307 on: March 16, 2016, 03:42:39 PM »
Raymondo you're obviously very smart and well versed on the subject matter so you already know Jesus was tempted, the scripture recordings give an example of Satan tempting Him with promises.

Just because someone has a thought doesn't make it sin, when you start to dwell/obsess on those thoughts it becomes an issue.

I honestly understand why you consider this belief foolishness, and I appreciate you having well thought out valid points. It causes me to challenge my own beliefs.

Thank you, I appreciate your comments and your tone. I have had many stimulating conversations with believers, although they tend to be of the more "liberal" disposition, religiously speaking.

Dave D

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Re: So why doesnt God appear every now and again?
« Reply #308 on: March 16, 2016, 03:43:59 PM »
If sexual desire was the reason we fell out of paradise and erections usually go in tandem with a libido then if Jesus had sexual desire/erections how could he have a sin free body. I can also believe he lived a chaste life but surely he was tempted to marry and live a normal life with children instead of fulfilling his difficult mission.

Sexual desire? According to the Bible man was removed from paradise because of disobedience. Now whether Adam disobeyed because he wanted Eves acceptance/approval, didn't care what the rule was or simply because he was hungry is all speculation, so to is your sexual reference.

I'm sure Jesus had many temptations. Being married likely would have been one of them (the bible refers to the church as the bride (of Christ)). Jesus was also tempted not to go to the cross, it was said His sweat was like blood while praying that God removed the burden, the very action He came on earth to fulfill.

Temptation isn't sin. Acting on it is.

Dave D

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Re: So why doesnt God appear every now and again?
« Reply #309 on: March 16, 2016, 03:48:28 PM »
Dwelling on any issue becomes a psychological problem, which can affect quality of life. However, its not a sin.

Lol, great point.  I just meant in context of the "generalized definition of biblical sin".

SF1900 I say the same to you as I did Raymando, I know you're intelligent and I understand why you don't believe in this manner, you also do.an excellent job in presenting your points.

SF1900

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Re: So why doesnt God appear every now and again?
« Reply #310 on: March 16, 2016, 03:53:31 PM »
Lol, great point.  I just meant in context of the "generalized definition of biblical sin".

SF1900 I say the same to you as I did Raymando, I know you're intelligent and I understand why you don't believe in this manner, you also do.an excellent job in presenting your points.

Thanks, Dave D. Same to you, broskie.

But that's the thing, I thought that point above is pretty obvious. Yet, religious people have to go around and turn it into a sin and all this complicated nonsense lol
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wes

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Re: So why doesnt God appear every now and again?
« Reply #311 on: March 16, 2016, 03:55:38 PM »
Can anyone give me cliffs on this thread?   LOL   ;D

BigRo

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Re: So why doesnt God appear every now and again?
« Reply #312 on: March 16, 2016, 03:56:56 PM »
Jesus Christ was human but perfect in every thought, word and deed.  He was without sin.  The spotless lamb.  The perfect sacrifice for our sin.

He was tempted by Satan, but the form that temptation took never arose in his consciousness as a desire for wedded intimacy with a beautiful woman? How could he effectively be tempted then?

God does not need a sacrifice for our sin, for the humanness which he himself created to ensure the continuation of the species.

Dave D

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Re: So why doesnt God appear every now and again?
« Reply #313 on: March 16, 2016, 04:00:04 PM »
Thanks, Dave D. Same to you, broskie.

But that's the thing, I thought that point above is pretty obvious. Yet, religious people have to go around and turn it into a sin and all this complicated nonsense lol

Religion is one of the banes of society . It seeks to control and dominant.  

Religious ideas, customs and superstitions can offer comfort and familiarity. When people don't challenge their ideas the become entrapped by them.

BigRo

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Re: So why doesnt God appear every now and again?
« Reply #314 on: March 16, 2016, 04:04:32 PM »
Sexual desire? According to the Bible man was removed from paradise because of disobedience. Now whether Adam disobeyed because he wanted Eves acceptance/approval, didn't care what the rule was or simply because he was hungry is all speculation, so to is your sexual reference.

I'm sure Jesus had many temptations. Being married likely would have been one of them (the bible refers to the church as the bride (of Christ)). Jesus was also tempted not to go to the cross, it was said His sweat was like blood while praying that God removed the burden, the very action He came on earth to fulfill.

Temptation isn't sin. Acting on it is.

Adam and Eve ate of the forbidden fruit, which means sex. Its pretty obvious. Religious man has always had a hangup about sex so he has created these dualities.

Dave D

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Re: So why doesnt God appear every now and again?
« Reply #315 on: March 16, 2016, 04:17:16 PM »
Adam and Eve ate of the forbidden fruit, which means sex. Its pretty obvious. Religious man has always had a hangup about sex so he has created these dualities.

Interesting perspective on the forbidden fruit/sex connotations. I've always read it straight forward as direct disobedience.

There's no question on your second statement though. Sex is still a "taboo" subject for the religious while the secular make it as common as eating.

Ro you're a deep introspective dude.

BigRo

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Re: So why doesnt God appear every now and again?
« Reply #316 on: March 16, 2016, 04:27:24 PM »
Interesting perspective on the forbidden fruit/sex connotations. I've always read it straight forward as direct disobedience.

There's no question on your second statement though. Sex is still a "taboo" subject for the religious while the secular make it as common as eating.

Ro you're a deep introspective dude.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Forbidden_fruit

SF1900

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Re: So why doesnt God appear every now and again?
« Reply #317 on: March 16, 2016, 04:28:04 PM »
Interesting perspective on the forbidden fruit/sex connotations. I've always read it straight forward as direct disobedience.

There's no question on your second statement though. Sex is still a "taboo" subject for the religious while the secular make it as common as eating.

Ro you're a deep introspective dude.

Because it should be as common as eating. The two biggest taboos in america: Death and sex. Yet, both are the most natural things ever. Both should be openly discussed.

The religious people try to control sex, as if its such an immoral thing. Its appears its their own projection onto everyone else, i.e., they have unclean and dirty feelings/thoughts that they try to suppress, thus attempting to inflict a similar morality onto others. Its all a crock.

In fact, part of early childhood development for children is sexual exploration of their genitals. You can do great harm to a child if you scold them for that, which I am sure religious parents do.

Religion does the opposite of everything that is normal and healthy.
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Sizwe

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Re: So why doesnt God appear every now and again?
« Reply #318 on: March 16, 2016, 04:39:13 PM »
Because it should be as common as eating. The two biggest taboos in america: Death and sex. Yet, both are the most natural things ever. Both should be openly discussed.

The religious people try to control sex, as if its such an immoral thing. Its appears its their own projection onto everyone else, i.e., they have unclean and dirty feelings/thoughts that they try to suppress, thus attempting to inflict a similar morality onto others. Its all a crock.

In fact, part of early childhood development for children is sexual exploration of their genitals. You can do great harm to a child if you scold them for that, which I am sure religious parents do.

Religion does the opposite of everything that is normal and healthy.

That's debatable, below is an extract from the Roman Catholic Churches Catechism on chastity. Doesn't sound too abnormal and unhealthy to me.. but in today's hyper saturated world of lust it may be seen as 'abnormal' sure, but this wasn't always so..

http://www.vatican.va/archive/ccc_css/archive/catechism/p3s2c2a6.htm
2351 Lust is disordered desire for or inordinate enjoyment of sexual pleasure. Sexual pleasure is morally disordered when sought for itself, isolated from its procreative and unitive purposes.

2352 By masturbation is to be understood the deliberate stimulation of the genital organs in order to derive sexual pleasure. "Both the Magisterium of the Church, in the course of a constant tradition, and the moral sense of the faithful have been in no doubt and have firmly maintained that masturbation is an intrinsically and gravely disordered action."138 "The deliberate use of the sexual faculty, for whatever reason, outside of marriage is essentially contrary to its purpose." For here sexual pleasure is sought outside of "the sexual relationship which is demanded by the moral order and in which the total meaning of mutual self-giving and human procreation in the context of true love is achieved."139

To form an equitable judgment about the subjects' moral responsibility and to guide pastoral action, one must take into account the affective immaturity, force of acquired habit, conditions of anxiety or other psychological or social factors that lessen, if not even reduce to a minimum, moral culpability.

2353 Fornication is carnal union between an unmarried man and an unmarried woman. It is gravely contrary to the dignity of persons and of human sexuality which is naturally ordered to the good of spouses and the generation and education of children. Moreover, it is a grave scandal when there is corruption of the young.

2354 Pornography consists in removing real or simulated sexual acts from the intimacy of the partners, in order to display them deliberately to third parties. It offends against chastity because it perverts the conjugal act, the intimate giving of spouses to each other. It does grave injury to the dignity of its participants (actors, vendors, the public), since each one becomes an object of base pleasure and illicit profit for others. It immerses all who are involved in the illusion of a fantasy world. It is a grave offense. Civil authorities should prevent the production and distribution of pornographic materials.

SF1900

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Re: So why doesnt God appear every now and again?
« Reply #319 on: March 16, 2016, 04:44:37 PM »

That's debatable, below is an extract from the Roman Catholic Churches Catechism on chastity. Doesn't sound too abnormal and unhealthy to me.. but in today's hyper saturated world of lust it may be seen as 'abnormal' sure, but this wasn't always so..

http://www.vatican.va/archive/ccc_css/archive/catechism/p3s2c2a6.htm
2351 Lust is disordered desire for or inordinate enjoyment of sexual pleasure. Sexual pleasure is morally disordered when sought for itself, isolated from its procreative and unitive purposes.

2352 By masturbation is to be understood the deliberate stimulation of the genital organs in order to derive sexual pleasure. "Both the Magisterium of the Church, in the course of a constant tradition, and the moral sense of the faithful have been in no doubt and have firmly maintained that masturbation is an intrinsically and gravely disordered action."138 "The deliberate use of the sexual faculty, for whatever reason, outside of marriage is essentially contrary to its purpose." For here sexual pleasure is sought outside of "the sexual relationship which is demanded by the moral order and in which the total meaning of mutual self-giving and human procreation in the context of true love is achieved."139

To form an equitable judgment about the subjects' moral responsibility and to guide pastoral action, one must take into account the affective immaturity, force of acquired habit, conditions of anxiety or other psychological or social factors that lessen, if not even reduce to a minimum, moral culpability.

2353 Fornication is carnal union between an unmarried man and an unmarried woman. It is gravely contrary to the dignity of persons and of human sexuality which is naturally ordered to the good of spouses and the generation and education of children. Moreover, it is a grave scandal when there is corruption of the young.

2354 Pornography consists in removing real or simulated sexual acts from the intimacy of the partners, in order to display them deliberately to third parties. It offends against chastity because it perverts the conjugal act, the intimate giving of spouses to each other. It does grave injury to the dignity of its participants (actors, vendors, the public), since each one becomes an object of base pleasure and illicit profit for others. It immerses all who are involved in the illusion of a fantasy world. It is a grave offense. Civil authorities should prevent the production and distribution of pornographic materials.

Abstinence does not work. There is nothing moral about waiting until marriage to have sex. What kind of crock is that anwyay? lol

People have been having sex since the beginning of time, pre-bible.  ::) ::)

Religion DESPISES the body. They have a real hate for anything that feels good. I mean, masturbation is a sin lol. Ridiculous. Research has shown TIME AND TIME AGAIN, that masturbation is a healthy, normal part of development. But of course religion goes and makes it into a sin lol.
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Dave D

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Re: So why doesnt God appear every now and again?
« Reply #320 on: March 16, 2016, 04:48:17 PM »
Because it should be as common as eating. The two biggest taboos in america: Death and sex. Yet, both are the most natural things ever. Both should be openly discussed.

The religious people try to control sex, as if its such an immoral thing. Its appears its their own projection onto everyone else, i.e., they have unclean and dirty feelings/thoughts that they try to suppress, thus attempting to inflict a similar morality onto others. Its all a crock.

In fact, part of early childhood development for children is sexual exploration of their genitals. You can do great harm to a child if you scold them for that, which I am sure religious parents do.

Religion does the opposite of everything that is normal and healthy.

Great points. And of course you're correct. I didn't mean to imply that sex should be taboo. I meant culturally it's "marketed" as the be all end all. Sex has been (or always has been) sensationalized. Quality relationships aren't built on great sex.  Sex is a component of great relationships but communication, trust, honesty and transparency are of far more importance, yet everywhere you look the headlines are 7 keys to a better sex life or become a better lover.

Sex sells, but even in the best of cases at 2 hours(hopefully im using this as a large enough number) a day of intercourse there's still a lot of non Sex relationship issues.

Sex is normal though and should be discussed.

Dave D

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Re: So why doesnt God appear every now and again?
« Reply #321 on: March 16, 2016, 04:51:09 PM »
Abstinence does not work.

Do you mean for those who desire sex? Johhnynoname has 5 years that would say otherwise.  :)

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Re: So why doesnt God appear every now and again?
« Reply #322 on: March 16, 2016, 04:57:23 PM »
Abstinence does not work. There is nothing moral about waiting until marriage to have sex. What kind of crock is that anwyay? lol

People have been having sex since the beginning of time, pre-bible.  ::) ::)

Religion DESPISES the body. They have a real hate for anything that feels good. I mean, masturbation is a sin lol. Ridiculous. Research has shown TIME AND TIME AGAIN, that masturbation is a healthy, normal part of development. But of course religion goes and makes it into a sin lol.

Abstinence does work and many still practice it, we can look at today's single parent, teenage pregnancy, and STD rates to show some of the benefits of waiting until marriage.
And masturbation being a thing to be condoned? Read what I posted above why its not, besides the fact that in order to do it you need to objectify someones body for your own pleasure...And the health benefits of it? if your body really does need the release, it will do so itself.

Dave D

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Re: So why doesnt God appear every now and again?
« Reply #323 on: March 16, 2016, 05:11:05 PM »
Abstinence does work and many still practice it, we can look at today's single parent, teenage pregnancy, and STD rates to show some of the benefits of waiting until marriage.
And masturbation being a thing to be condoned? Read what I posted above why its not, besides the fact that in order to do it you need to objectify someones body for your own pleasure...And the health benefits of it? if your body really does need the release, it will do so itself.

???? Nocturnal emissions? Those aren't considered in the same class because it's in the subconscious?

SF1900

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Re: So why doesnt God appear every now and again?
« Reply #324 on: March 16, 2016, 05:19:16 PM »
Abstinence does work and many still practice it, we can look at today's single parent, teenage pregnancy, and STD rates to show some of the benefits of waiting until marriage.
And masturbation being a thing to be condoned? Read what I posted above why its not, besides the fact that in order to do it you need to objectify someones body for your own pleasure...And the health benefits of it? if your body really does need the release, it will do so itself.

Abstinence rarely works.

"Abstinence-only-until-marriage programs don't work. To date, 11 states have evaluated the impact of their abstinence-only-until-marriage programs. None has been shown to reduce teen sexual activity."

Secondly, single parent, STD and pregnancy often has a lot to do with not educating the youth about proper and safe sex. Teens are going to have sex. Fact. Its best to educate them. Furthermore, a lot of teenage pregnancy has nothing to do with sinning or trying to avoid sexual feelings: a lot has to do with crime, poverty, lack of education, etc.

What does masturbation have to do with objectifying someone elses body?  ??? ???

Research is quite clear that masturbation is a healthy act within reason. You can either cite evidence of the contrary, or be quiet about it and continue to spew your religious stuff, gimmick.

 "intrinsically and gravely disordered action."

Research does not show that masturbation is gravely disordered action. Try again, gimmick.
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