So why doesnt God appear every now and again?

[Agnostic007]

You make many interesting points. Out of all the absurd stories you could have used (Noah and the ark and the flood, anything from Babylon, Samson, and so on) you focus on God allowing slaves to be beat, I'm assuming  making the point that it wasn't God but man making that rule.

I say this over and over here, but I mean it and hope you know I'm being honest, that you're intelligent and well informed.

That said slavery has always been a part of mankind's history. We've "outlawed" it today, labeling it barbaric and oppressive but it still is practiced in less developed countries (sex trade industry ). In the west we are enslaved but we choose to call it debt, and look at it as a part of life.

Without going on a long tirade slavery is practiced throughout the bible, in the Christian view you are either a slave to God or a slave to Satan. Whether people think that's right or wrong, just or unjust isn't the point, that's God's system (from the Christian perspective).

Undoubtedly the books were written from a perspective of their time, and they were relevant to that Era for thousands of years ( and to prove that even though weve become so advanced and that the ideas in the books are out dated we need to remember it's only been since the 1960s that African Americans have been considered "equal" with whites).

There's nothing unusual about that. The rules were important for that time. The old testament was a recounting of the Hebrew nation and it's struggles. The idea that God labeled these people as His chosen is/can be offensive but that's neither here nor there. It would have made no sense to have rules for speed limits or aircraft travel because those things were irrelevant to those people and the time period.

Fast forward to today and the Christian view is that Jesus did away with the laws and rules that people couldn't adhere to (and make no mistake the multiple rules and laws were set up to show man how unclean he was in front of a Holy God, that it was impossible to keep those rules and that was the significance of the death of the Christ, to do away with the laws that kept man separated from God).

There are rules from the old testament that can be beneficial today, but Jesus left us with the golden rule, love others as you love yourself and love God wholeheartedly.


I hope I didn't wonder off topic....

Yes, I could have used many things from the bible to illustrate my point. Beating a slave with a rod because he or she is your property is one. Marrying your rape victim is another. There are multitudes of what we now consider barbaric things which tends to make my point I think. People tell me God never changes. But he sure evolves his morals and what's acceptable along with us humans.

[Dave D]

but..well...uh...but...... yeah.. you have a point there

Lucas created his vision. In it Darth Vader was evil (and was redeemed in the end) and Luke Skywalker was a noble hero.

Yet multiple LOVE Vader and HATE Luke, lol. That wasn't the original idea, but people see what they want.

Same thing with denominations. And again there's the group who only want to cause disruption and chaos and use and take advantage of others (wolves in sheep's clothing). People mess stuff up.

Again I'm not saying you or I are wrong or right. You've, along with many other, challenged me and appreciate your perspective.

[BigRo]

the Eucharist...

[Dave D]

Yes, I could have used many things from the bible to illustrate my point. Beating a slave with a rod because he or she is your property is one. Marrying your rape victim is another. There are multitudes of what we now consider barbaric things which tends to make my point I think. People tell me God never changes. But he sure evolves his morals and what's acceptable along with us humans.

Yeah I guess it's perspective.

God established Adam and Eve, one man one woman yet we see where Jacob, David and Solomon had multiple wives.

Does God's morality change or do people adjust what they deem acceptable and God allows it?

Why was the homosexuality of Sodom and Gomorrah so bad it was burnt to the ground, but today we don't see those actions?

I get your points and observations but I think at the core God is consistent in what He requires even if He is inconsistent with what He allows (if that makes sense, and I'm sure it doesn't because you don't see God as real but I mean outside of that).

[10pints]

There was three short verses of scripture and a refutation of what was presented above.  That wall of text can be read in under a minute.

I've already taken university level biology, genetics, physics, chemistry, organic chemistry, psychology, sociology, geology, calculus, finance, accounting, marketing, management, etc...my passion is my faith and theology.

Fair enough. Perhaps try philosophy?

[Man of Steel]

Hmmmm...nice... but no...

Do construction companies build buildings from the top down or the bottom up?

[SF1900]

There was three short verses of scripture and a refutation of what was presented above.  That wall of text can be read in under a minute.

I've already taken university level biology, genetics, physics, chemistry, organic chemistry, psychology, sociology, geology, calculus, finance, accounting, marketing, management, etc...my passion is my faith and theology.

lol. Stop trying to get something by these people. Like ALL Americans, you took these classes at the basic level, in order to graduate with a Bachelors level degree. In other words, you maybe took 1-3 classes in each subject, then focused the rest of your classes on your major. No way in hell you studied each topic in depth, like you would with your major.

Listen, I have a BA, MA and going for my Doctorate. The amount of specialization that is required at the MA and Doctoral level is MUCH different than you would receive at the BA level. So, you took psychology at the undergrad level. So, did I. All basic stuff. Are you implying that you know as much as someone with a Doctorate in psych because you took it at the undergrad level? hahah. Delusional as they come!  Cheesy Cheesy Cheesy

Furthermore, I took basic classes in geology, biology, math, history, etc., and in no way do I feel I am skilled enough to discusses these topics with an indepth understanding. The education is so basic at the undergrad level, that its near impossible to get a comprehensive understanding of each topic.

[Man of Steel]

Fair enough. Perhaps try philosophy?

Yes, I've taken two philosophy courses.

SF, deleting and reposting his post to get the thread back to the top.....I know the trick.

[SF1900]

MOS, avoiding my response because it exposes him. You can pull one by the Euro guys, who may not understand the American educational system. But, Ive been there, done that.

Implying that youre some sort of expert in all 12 of those fields because you took basic classes at the university level is ridiculous.

This is why you often see religious people with no college degree or just a BA-level degree, trying to tell PhD physicists/biologists about science haha lol. Of course, someone with no college education can no more than a PhD-level physicist, but its EXTREMELY rare. I have not met many people who took undergrad science classes (especially if it was not their major) who know more than PhD-level scientists.

In MOS's mind, he knows more than a PhD level physicists because he took 2 undergrad courses in it. 

[Man of Steel]

Captain Freedom resorting to insults on the poem thread now.....it's alright....I forgive him.

[Raymondo]

Captain Freedom resorting to insults on the poem thread now.....it's alright....I forgive him.

Can you point me towards this thread?

**edit** found it

[Man of Steel]

For the record, I no longer reply to any of SF's posts and he's blocked from PM'ing me.  Numerous folks for the last 2 years repeatedly warned me about his antics and I both defended him and attempted to work with him publically and privately, but he became progressively more aggressive and hostile......EXACTLY as I was warned.  I certainly learned about heeding the warnings of others that have "been there, done that".  It simply got to be too much and when he finally insulted my wife that was it for me.  

So yes I purposefully avoid all of his posts now.

....dust off my feet

[Man of Steel]

Can you point me towards this thread?

**edit** found it

I'm not ashamed of my faith and I don't fear the criticism of God haters.

So here's the poem:

There lives a man who’s made of steel
His views so twisted, contorted
Never one to miss a meal
His body - bloated, distorted

He’ll condemn you to hell with a religious zeal
And give praise to a higher power
He convinces himself his God is real
For he so fears his final hour

A real disgrace, this man of metal
‘Drugs are a sin! You must seek sobriety’
A classic case of pot and kettle
He staggers, drunk on religious piety

Once, in the quiet hours of the night,
He suffered a lapse of concentration,
He struggled but could not find the might
To resist the temptation of masturbation

Help me father! I’ve sinned! He cried
And the lord answered from his celestial station
‘Go commit the act of filicide
To repent for your self-gratification’

So off he went to get his knife
To commit an act so wicked and tragic
But even this is not so sad
As a man- full grown -who believes in magic.

Enjoy.

[SF1900]

That's actually a really good poem by Captain Freedom!!

[Raymondo]

I'm not ashamed of my faith and I don't fear the criticism of God haters.

So here's the poem:

Enjoy.

You try to lay a guilt trip on me just for asking

Is there any chance of you just relaxing, kicking back and indulging in some self-deprecating humour?

[SF1900]

For the record, I no longer reply to any of SF's posts and he's blocked from PM'ing me.  Numerous folks for the last 2 years repeatedly warned me about his antics and I both defended him and attempted to work with him publically and privately, but he became progressively more aggressive and hostile......EXACTLY as I was warned.  I certainly learned about heeding the warnings of others that have "been there, done that".  It simply got to be too much and when he finally insulted my wife that was it for me.  

So yes I purposefully avoid all of his posts now.

....dust off my feet

Oh, geez, grow up. People warned you about me lol. Ive never outted anyone, Ive never involved anyones personal life, Ive never been outright vicious with anyone. Everyone bust chops here. But you've been "warned" about me. Get a grip on reality lol.

You consider some antics hostile and aggressive? haha lol

[dr.chimps]

Almost 20 pages. 



/morons

[Man of Steel]

You try to give me a guilt trip just for asking

Is there any chance of you just relaxing, kicking back and indulging in some self-deprecating humour?

Absolutely I can.  I'm all business in these types of threads because I have to be. 

How I interact with folks (believer and nonbelievers) that don't spend hours at a time attacking every word I say and insulting everything that I am in Christ have a very different relationship with me. 

I know plenty of nonbelievers and atheists.  Worked and sat next to a strong atheist for 3 years.  He knew I was a Christian and I knew he was an atheist.  He never attacked me and I never attacked him.  We talked, did chili cooks off together, worked side by side on projects for years...it was cordial and friendly....he's a sweet, sweet man with a great sense of humor.  He never cursed.  He was generous.  He was a great conversationalist.  He was professional.  He was educated.  He was a delight to work with.  Yet, he disagreed with me 100% as it pertains to God.  I love him and continue to lift him up in prayer.....wish we still worked together but he got another opportunity in another town.  We still talk via email from time to time.

[Raymondo]

Absolutely I can.  I'm all business in these types of threads because I have to be.  

How I interact with folks (believer and nonbelievers) that don't spend hours at a time attacking every word I say and insulting everything that I am in Christ have a very different relationship with me.  

I know plenty of nonbelievers and atheists.  Worked and sat next to a strong atheist for 3 years.  He knew I was a Christian and I knew he was an atheist.  He never attacked me and I never attacked him.  We talked, did chili cooks off together, worked side by side on projects for years...it was cordial and friendly....he's a sweet, sweet man with a great sense of humor.  He never cursed.  He was generous.  He was a great conversationalist.  He was professional.  He was educated.  He was a delight to work with.  Yet, he disagreed with me 100% as it pertains to God.  I love him and continue to lift him up in prayer.....wish we still worked together but he got another opportunity in another town.  We still talk via email from time to time.

I worked next to an evangelical for nearly 3 years. Highly educated guy (Oxford), mathematician, about twice as smart as I (which made him the smartest guy in the building by a certain margin). Generous and professional, too, although not always a pleasure to work with (he would probably say the same for me). I had many stimulating discussions with him, almost always not on religion. We talked about science fiction, politics, astronomy, physics, sociology, etc. In 3 years I only remember him once talking about religion or God with a high degree of fervour. This was around the election of 2010, when the British National Party tried to appropriate Jesus in some way. My colleague was very offended.

I remember him fondly sitting on the bus on the way home reading the Bible.

[Man of Steel]

Haha, you did grant me permission, MOS. And try not to forget that we are on an anonymous and informal website that discusses male beauty pageants...we don't have to keep things 100% serious. Go write one back about me.

Look man, I don't hate you or Raymondo.  I actually like y'all quite a bit.  I'm also easy....keep conversation light even if the topic is heavy and we're good.  The only desire I have towards the folks on this board is love in Christ.  If you don't agree with me that's fine.   We can still discuss things that we differ on and have a beer afterwards (well, I'll have a Coke   ). 

You have to know I'm not you're enemy or Raymondo's enemy or even SF's enemy.  I care a great deal about all of you.....best way I can put it. 

[Man of Steel]

I worked next to an evangelical for nearly 3 years. Highly educated guy (Oxford), mathematician, about twice as smart as I (which made him the smartest guy in the building by a certain margin). Generous and professional, too, although not always a pleasure to work with (he would probably say the same for me). I had many stimulating discussions with him, most of the time not on religion. We talked about science fiction, politics, astronomy, physics, sociology, etc. In 3 years I only remember him once talking about religion or God with a high degree of fervour. This was around the election of 2010, when the British National Party tries to appropriate Jesus in some way. My colleague was very offended.

I remember him fondly sitting on the bus on the way home reading the Bible.

Now, guaranteed I'm not as smart as your friend, but I'm certainly laid back I just have a passion for my faith and love to share it.

[Dave D]

Almost 20 pages. 



/morons

King Jesus  threads> King Shizzo threads.

[BigRo]

 

[Necrosis]

The world is quite a bit more sinful then it has ever been no? hitler wasn't worse then the pagens? nuclear bombs? where is god to step in now?

We are killing more animals then ever, in fact we are in the 6th mass extinction event, we have wrecked the climate, more people likely die in syria and the middle east then over the last ten years then ever in history.

[Primemuscle]

The world is quite a bit more sinful then it has ever been no? hitler wasn't worse then the pagens? nuclear bombs? where is god to step in now?

We are killing more animals then ever, in fact we are in the 6th mass extinction event, we have wrecked the climate, more people likely die in syria and the middle east then over the last ten years then ever in history.

Do you have to be so depressing? Sometimes ignorance is bliss.