Do Black Lives Really Matter to Democrats?

[TuHolmes]

It's a silly, loaded question, and you know it. Any candidate/policy "a large number of blacks" support is gonna rape the fuck outta taxpayers. Which is where you lose (rational, fiscally conservative) whites.

This surprises you?

Why do you believe that it will rape tax payers.

What if it was fiscally responsible and supported lifting the black community up and not simply giving them a hand out.

You're making a judgement that the black community only wants freebies? What if it was not about free, but about enabling success?

[The True Adonis]

Blacks proved this election cycle that they have no interest in a 15 dollar or living wage, no interest in Single Payer Healthcare, No interest in tuition free college, No interest in getting money out of politics.  These are things Bernie was offering to fight for that would have benefited their Camoonity as well as all communities.  They rejected all of that.

[The Ugly]

Why do you believe that it will rape tax payers.

1) What if it was fiscally responsible and supported lifting the black community up and not simply giving them a hand out.

2) You're making a judgement that the black community only wants freebies? What if it was not about free, but about enabling success?

1) This is why they wouldn't support it.

2) This is why the question was loaded.


"Large numbers," he said.

[TuHolmes]

Blacks proved this election cycle that they have no interest in a 15 dollar or living wage, no interest in Single Payer Healthcare, No interest in tuition free college, No interest in getting money out of politics.  These are things Bernie was offering to fight for that would have benefited their Camoonity as well as all communities.  They rejected all of that.

Truly made no sense. I honestly wish I could have gotten a real reason why the black community voted in Hillary in droves. I just don't understand it.

[Al Doggity]

It's a silly, loaded question, and you know it. Any candidate/policy "a large number of blacks" support is gonna rape the fuck outta taxpayers. Which is where you lose (rational, fiscally conservative) whites.

This surprises you?

Sure, it's a loaded, silly scenario.   But when it's reversed, it's fair and logical and reasonable and affects everyone in exactly the same way.  

This is just like the time you said you couldn't believe that having almost all white Academy Awards voters had any impact on  who won Oscars. When I asked you if you thought having all black Oscar voters would have an impact, then, of course you could see how it would have an impact. It would become political and it would be completely different and completely  unfair and I was asking you a trick question.

These weren't loaded questions. Your answers to them are based on your own prejudices.

[Al Doggity]

Truly made no sense. I honestly wish I could have gotten a real reason why the black community voted in Hillary in droves. I just don't understand it.

What do you think it likely was? Do you agree with True Adonis that blacks are just too stupid to vote for their own self interest? Or that we just like being victims too much? Would you say those sound like the two most likely scenarios based on your observations?

[The True Adonis]

What do you think it likely was? Do you agree with True Adonis that blacks are just too stupid to vote for their own self interest? Or that we just like being victims too much? Would you say those sound like the two most likely scenarios based on your observations?

Don't forget to add nostalgia for the 90s in there.  Thats another reason.  Black culture has NOT evolved from the 90s which was its peak.  The dress is the same, mannerism, movies, music, entire black zeitgiest, etc....Has not evolved since then.

[TuHolmes]

What do you think it likely was? Do you agree with True Adonis that blacks are just too stupid to vote for their own self interest? Or that we just like being victims too much? Would you say those sound like the two most likely scenarios based on your observations?

I don't know.

White people vote against their own self interests too. I mean, poor white people vote in rich white guys with some belief that they "understand their plight". Of course they do not and they create policies that hurt them as well.

So I can't really provide the any insight.

I don't know what the statements were of the people who voted. Were there people at the exit polls asking "why did you vote for Hillary?"

I honestly have no clue why they chose Hillary. I think Adonis' other observation is a possible scenario.

The black community has a nostalgic sense that their lives were at their peak during the Bill Clinton years and they associate Hillary with him.

Again, that's just a possible scenario and I have no idea if it is accurate or not.

My family was all aboard the Bernie train to be honest, so they are the wrong black people to ask it seems.

[The Ugly]

Sure, it's a loaded, silly scenario.   But when it's reversed, it's fair and logical and reasonable and affects everyone in exactly the same way.  

This is just like the time you said you couldn't believe that having almost all white Academy Awards voters had any impact on  who won Oscars. When I asked you if you thought having all black Oscar voters would have an impact, then, of course you could see how it would have an impact. It would become political and it would be completely different and completely  unfair and I was asking you a trick question.

These weren't loaded questions. Your answers to them are based on your own prejudices.

Ah.

Probably just me then.

[Al Doggity]

I don't know.

White people vote against their own self interests too. I mean, poor white people vote in rich white guys with some belief that they "understand their plight". Of course they do not and they create policies that hurt them as well.

So I can't really provide the any insight.

I don't know what the statements were of the people who voted. Were there people at the exit polls asking "why did you vote for Hillary?"

I honestly have no clue why they chose Hillary. I think Adonis' other observation is a possible scenario.

The black community has a nostalgic sense that their lives were at their peak during the Bill Clinton years and they associate Hillary with him.

Again, that's just a possible scenario and I have no idea if it is accurate or not.

My family was all aboard the Bernie train to be honest, so they are the wrong black people to ask it seems.

Upthread I posted an article in which even his campaign workers admitted he did try very hard to engage black voters. To you this sounds like it is probably not that likely?


(As an aside, 90s nostalgia really isn't anymore pronounced with black people than it is with other races. Black music, clothing styles, etc aren't even close to being the same. Just a few days ago, my sister was joking with me about how girls used to dress like tomboys in the 90s and black hair  for women was completely different. At this moment, i'm listening to a song called "Timmy Turner" which I can't imagine even being recorded five years ago. I could go on and on, but being nostalgic for the 90s and being trapped in the 90s are two different things and, suffice it to say, I don't think either holds any water. )

[TuHolmes]

Upthread I posted an article in which even his campaign workers admitted he did try very hard to engage black voters. To you this sounds like it is probably not that likely?


(As an aside, 90s nostalgia really isn't anymore pronounced with black people than it is with other races. Black music, clothing styles, etc aren't even close to being the same. Just a few days ago, my sister was joking with me about how girls used to dress like tomboys in the 90s and black hair  for women was completely different. At this moment, i'm listening to a song called "Timmy Turner" which I can't imagine even being recorded five years ago. I could go on and on, but being nostalgic for the 90s and being trapped in the 90s are two different things and, suffice it to say, I don't think either holds any water. )

I made no inference that he didn't try to engage black voters. I'm not making a determination whether it's likely or not.

What I do know, is that for some reason that I do not know, they did not vote for him with any high percentage.

So I will have to ask you. Why did they vote for Hillary in such high percentages. What about her campaign and platform was so appealing to the black community?

[The True Adonis]

I made no inference that he didn't try to engage black voters. I'm not making a determination whether it's likely or not.

What I do know, is that for some reason that I do not know, they did not vote for him with any high percentage.

So I will have to ask you. Why did they vote for Hillary in such high percentages. What about her campaign and platform was so appealing to the black community?

Every single time I hear black demands, (what they want out of a politician), all it has to do with is prisons, courts, jails or drugs.  Is every black person on the verge of being a criminal or something?  They aren't concerned about anything else?  Its fucking bizarre.  The only movement they have going is Black Lives Matter which was founded on lies and bullshit and based on violent criminality and an appropriate police response.  They don't seem to be organizing for jobs, education, cleaner environment, lower taxes, bringing back manufacturing.  No.  Its all about criminals "Dinduing" when they certainly did do something, like assault law enforcement.

I have no idea what black people want.  They do not want to improve their lives as their movements give no indication of that whatsoever.  Black neighborhoods are all degrading.  They just don't value the same things as other cultures.  I get that, but don't force that kind of living on everyone and then claim bias or discrimination.  What it comes down to is a clash of culture.  Black culture simply is not congruent with other cultures and the inverse is true as well. 

I would like to know why they need and expect to be pandered to rather than seeking out information themselves and perhaps making informed decisions based on gathered knowledge and rational assessment.  I suspect I am asking too much here.  Who knows?  They just seem to want to live in squalor, be able to assault and get away with it, and have lighter to no jail sentences.  No idea what they want really.

[Al Doggity]

I made no inference that he didn't try to engage black voters. I'm not making a determination whether it's likely or not.

What I do know, is that for some reason that I do not know, they did not vote for him with any high percentage.

So I will have to ask you. Why did they vote for Hillary in such high percentages. What about her campaign and platform was so appealing to the black community?

There isn't even a mystery. He didn't campaign effectively in the black community. In the article I posted upthread, even his own campaign staff admits this. They talk about how he did not feel he could take black voters from Hillary. Literally, the more money his campaign took in, the less they targeted AfAm voters. A dem candidate just can't do that and expect to win.

If you doubt that it's as simple as a matter of effective campaigning, consider the following. Sanders' campaign strategy was to focus on young, white voters to offset the loss of black voters they wouldn't be targeting. While the race was neck and neck among white voters, he beat Clinton nearly 3-1 among young voters.  He got more under-30 votes than Trump and Clinton combined. Do you really think it's just a coincidence that he got the strongest support from the demo he targeted the most and the least support from the demo he targeted the least?

[The True Adonis]

There isn't even a mystery. He didn't campaign effectively in the black community. In the article I posted upthread, even his own campaign staff admits this. They talk about how he did not feel he could take black voters from Hillary. Literally, the more money his campaign took in, the less they targeted AfAm voters. A dem candidate just can't do that and expect to win.

If you doubt that it's as simple as a matter of effective campaigning, consider the following. Sanders' campaign strategy was to focus on young, white voters to offset the loss of black voters they wouldn't be targeting. While the race was neck and neck among white voters, he beat Clinton nearly 3-1 among young voters.  He got more under-30 votes than Trump and Clinton combined. Do you really think it's just a coincidence that he got the strongest support from the demo he targeted the most and the least support from the demo he targeted the least?

Were blacks too stupid or something that they could not compare Bernie Sanders and Hillary Clinton as candidates?  So you are saying blacks did not bother to seek out info at all about Bernie (it was all readily available and EXTREMELY easy to find) and just voted for Hillary?  Is this what you are saying?   

[Al Doggity]

Were blacks too stupid or something that they could not compare Bernie Sanders and Hillary Clinton as candidates?  So you are saying blacks did not bother to seek out info at all about Bernie (it was all readily available and EXTREMELY easy to find) and just voted for Hillary?  Is this what you are saying?   

That's what you seem to be saying... over and over and over. It's not a logical conclusion to make based on what I said. The last post was pretty clear.

[The True Adonis]

That's what you seem to be saying... over and over and over. It's not a logical conclusion to make based on what I said. The last post was pretty clear.

You are saying that blacks need to be pandered to like children, otherwise they will not seek out info on their own or they won't understand it and hence will not vote unless spoon fed.

You seem to making this claim over and over again.

[Al Doggity]

You are saying that blacks need to be pandered to like children, otherwise they will not seek out info on their own or they won't understand it and hence will not vote unless spoon fed.

You seem to making this claim over and over again.

 

 When candidates campaign, what are they trying to accomplish? 

Uh to get their message out.  

[The True Adonis]

Blacks need to be treated like children is what you are saying and that they are too dumb to do any research on their own if they need to because a message "did not reach them" "directly"?

Is this what you are saying?

[The True Adonis]

[The True Adonis]

 

[LittleJ]

Blacks proved this election cycle that they have no interest in a 15 dollar or living wage, no interest in Single Payer Healthcare, No interest in tuition free college, No interest in getting money out of politics.  These are things Bernie was offering to fight for that would have benefited their Camoonity as well as all communities.  They rejected all of that.

Adam did you ever find a job yet? Hopefully Trump or Hillary can help you land your first job.

[Twaddle]

Bernie should have ran this campaign. 

[Bindare_Dundat]

Bernie should have ran this campaign. 

Holy shit I'm dying over here. Lol

[Twaddle]

Holy shit I'm dying over here. Lol

Seriously though, it probably would have landed him the votes he needed.   

[Thin Lizzy]

Sanders outspent Hillary 2-1 on TV Ads in NY, and Hillary still got 75% of the Black vote.

From NBC News:

"Bernie Sanders' campaign has outspent Hillary Clinton over New York's airwaves by a 2-to-1 margin, according to ad-spending data from SMG Delta.

The Sanders campaign has spent $5.6 million on ads in the Empire State, versus $2.8 million for the Clinton campaign."

****

Hard to believe the results would've been much different had Bernie made a few stops at fried chicken joints in Harlem.