Author Topic: Franco Columbu-High Volume training vs Mike Mentzer-Low Volume training styles  (Read 4269 times)

Incubi

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These two both had very strong Powerlifter type physiques yet no one compares them.

Which method works for you and allows you to get stronger and Getbig?

High volume everyday or Low volume every other day.

Mentzer style works for me i just don't go so insane heavy that i may get injured or need forced reps from a spotter

so I go heavy as possible 5-7 rep max with another immediate drop set with at least 6-8 reps.

Thats one complete continual set with 12-16 reps....Machine weights like Hammer strength for isolation.

I like Francos look better but his approarch to training just doesn't work for me, i feel like i'm overtraining and do not progress or gain strength.

local hero

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These two both had very strong Powerlifter type physiques yet no one compares them.

Which method works for you and allows you to get stronger and Getbig?

High volume everyday or Low volume every other day.

Mentzer style works for me i just don't go so insane heavy that i may get injured or need forced reps from a spotter

so I go heavy as possible 5-7 rep max with another immediate drop set with at least 6-8 reps.

Thats one complete continual set with 12-16 reps....Machine weights like Hammer strength for isolation.

I like Francos look better but his approarch to training just doesn't work for me, i feel like i'm overtraining and do not progress or gain strength.


Somwhere in the middle works for me... You need fresh injury free joins to push it hard enough low volume style..

I could never get away doing hundreds of sets either, after a few sets you end up going numb

Mr Anabolic

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These guys were on drugs... are you?  If you're not, their training methods are pretty much irrelevant to you.

Never1AShow

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You're getting huge on machine weights?

Dokey111

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These guys were on drugs... are you?  If you're not, their training methods are pretty much irrelevant to you.

^

beakdoctor

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Franco one of the strongest bodybuilders of all time and 2 x Mr. Olympia.

Mentzer self ascribed intellectual who had a breakdown and wasted what should've been the best years of his life.

Chidoman

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These two both had very strong Powerlifter type physiques yet no one compares them.

Which method works for you and allows you to get stronger and Getbig?

High volume everyday or Low volume every other day.

Mentzer style works for me i just don't go so insane heavy that i may get injured or need forced reps from a spotter

so I go heavy as possible 5-7 rep max with another immediate drop set with at least 6-8 reps.

Thats one complete continual set with 12-16 reps....Machine weights like Hammer strength for isolation.

I like Francos look better but his approarch to training just doesn't work for me, i feel like i'm overtraining and do not progress or gain strength.

^^^^Train just like You, and find It Best!!...Especially when training without a partner, and Hammer Strength Machines are great for isolation work...I'm with You all the way, fuck the other turds' comments!

FREAKgeek

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Actually, it was Arnold that was more of a volume guy than Franco. And Arnold has a powawifting background too.

wes

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Mentzer built the majority of his size using high volume training and high volume drugs.

Only later did he go to "Heavy Duty" !

The Scott

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I tend to do a variation on Mentzer's theme all the while keeping in mind that he built the majority, if not all, his muscular size and strength while on drugs.  Some days I do the same number of sets I do on HD days, but instead do sets of 20 and more with much lighter weight.  

Without a doubt, drugs make training far more productive and thereby easier. I have witnessed such transformations and it is nothing short of amazing.   Of course when you stop, it goes away faster.  I have zero doubt that if I were to take as much or even half what Mike used (minus the meth) and trained like Mike, I would get bigger and stronger with every workout for more than a few workouts.  I still think training a maximum of 4 times a week is much better than twice a day, days 6 days a week but on drugs gains are going to happen with either system.

Since the early 60s, drugs have been the factor between winning and losing in bodybuilding. Mentzer was no natural mesomorph.  Few are.  I do think it has gone far beyond a reasonable approach and needs to stop being rewarded but the fetishists out there may not be large but they are in charge.




Rmj11

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Let's see. Franco a 2 time Mr olympia vs a has been crybaby that never was. Easy win for Franco.

Dokey111

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These guys were on drugs... are you?  If you're not, their training methods are pretty much irrelevant to you.

edit: Hah I see that I already did this 6 years ago  :o


LurkerNoMore

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These two both had very strong Powerlifter type physiques yet no one compares them.

Which method works for you and allows you to get stronger and Getbig?

High volume everyday or Low volume every other day.

Mentzer style works for me i just don't go so insane heavy that i may get injured or need forced reps from a spotter

so I go heavy as possible 5-7 rep max with another immediate drop set with at least 6-8 reps.

Thats one complete continual set with 12-16 reps....Machine weights like Hammer strength for isolation.

I like Francos look better but his approarch to training just doesn't work for me, i feel like i'm overtraining and do not progress or gain strength.

So you do one set per muscle group or one set per exercise with multiple exercises per muscle group?

The Keto Kid

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I train Dorian Yates style heavy duty on legs, chest, and back. I train higher volume on shoulders and arms. I think logically this is the best approach, heavy weight lower volume on the big body parts, higher volume rep range between 10-15 on smaller body parts.

illuminati

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I Don't count sets or reps its not a math class I'm in gym to count - some times I do higher reps &
lighter weights & some times I do heavier for me weights & lower reps. I'm in gym to stimulate
Muscular growth ( realistically at 62 any gains are very small & I'm battling keeping my muscular
size)

Taken to their logical conclusion both systems are ridiculous - Mikes would be 1 set of 1 rep per body part 1once every [ insert days  ::) ]
And Franco's / volume training would be 10/20/30/40/50 etc etc reps for 10/20/30/40/50/60/ etc etc
sets everyday at least  ::)

There are so many variables that are important more so than counting reps & sets. 

Each to their own I say - if their happy with how they train & enjoy it + hopefully making
gains & progressing Great. 

beakdoctor

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It depends on what you're referencing. Better for what?

What's odd is Franco was a powerlifter but used volume training. Mike, purely a bodybuilder, trained a little bit more like a power lifter...sorta anyway.

For bodybuilding - growing muscle independent of strength- studies suggest volume is better. About 20 sets per body part spread out over the week. Each body part trained 2X using about 10-20 reps with a few of those sets being almost to failure. This, according to studies grow muscle size.

Mike's thoughts on revovery were far too extreme.  What was he basing 'recovery' on? What metric did he use to measure recovery. Was it just anecdotal?

Fact is: Mike was more impressive in 77, 78 than 79 and 80. If what he said was true about how infrequently he trained then I have to believe he did himself a disservice.  He could've continued to improve from 78 if he worked out more. What was he 28 years old? He should've been getting better each year instead he was stagnant at best and actually regressing at worst.

This is not meant to criticize anyone who trains HIT/HD. If it works for you great. I know it works. It works better for some more than others....but Mentzer,  strictly speaking,  went off the rails.

Gym Rat

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These guys were on drugs... are you?  If you're not, their training methods are pretty much irrelevant to you.

This, pretty much ^^^

pamith

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Brutal if true

pamith

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Thin Lizzy

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Two warm up sets. Three working sets for compound movements.

For isolation movements: three sets of 8-12.

Hit each body part once or, at most, twice a week.

That’s it. Anything more is overthinking it.

gib

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There is so much bullshit and misunderstanding on Mentzer's supposed "heavy duty" training style. You would have to be an idiot if you really believe he just can in, did max reps on a range of exercises, and then went home 40 mins later.

Fact is they both did numerous sets with volume, lowering the reps as they upped the weight, and for some exercises, yes they also included 1-3 rep max lifts (eg squat, bench and deadlifts). Mentzer just didn't mention the "warmup" reps, and so claimed only the lower reps as his training, whereas Franco was truthful and told it how it is.

beakdoctor

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There is so much bullshit and misunderstanding on Mentzer's supposed "heavy duty" training style. You would have to be an idiot if you really believe he just can in, did max reps on a range of exercises, and then went home 40 mins later.

Fact is they both did numerous sets with volume, lowering the reps as they upped the weight, and for some exercises, yes they also included 1-3 rep max lifts (eg squat, bench and deadlifts). Mentzer just didn't mention the "warmup" reps, and so claimed only the lower reps as his training, whereas Franco was truthful and told it how it is.

Yeah I realize Mentzers workouts were similar to anyone elses but was his traini g frequency really different.  Was he in the gym once or twice a week like he said or was he in the gym 6 days a week like everyone else?

Rmj11

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Yeah I realize Mentzers workouts were similar to anyone elses but was his traini g frequency really different.  Was he in the gym once or twice a week like he said or was he in the gym 6 days a week like everyone else?

4 to 6 days a week.

Rmj11

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There is so much bullshit and misunderstanding on Mentzer's supposed "heavy duty" training style. You would have to be an idiot if you really believe he just can in, did max reps on a range of exercises, and then went home 40 mins later.

Fact is they both did numerous sets with volume, lowering the reps as they upped the weight, and for some exercises, yes they also included 1-3 rep max lifts (eg squat, bench and deadlifts). Mentzer just didn't mention the "warmup" reps, and so claimed only the lower reps as his training, whereas Franco was truthful and told it how it is.

Same with Yates. He states he only trained for 45 minutes each workout. Not so. He would take long rests between sets as he would train like a powerlifter in a bodybuilding fashion. He even admitted it in his book Blood and Guts that he would rest up to five minutes before doing his max set or sets. Like mentzer, Yates exaggerated a lot on the sets he did. He actually did 4 to 5 sets per exercise

First set warm up
Second set moderate set
Third and fourth set heavy
Fifth set a drop set

This is how he trained most of the time to build up his body.

Humble Narcissist

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These two both had very strong Powerlifter type physiques yet no one compares them.

Which method works for you and allows you to get stronger and Getbig?

High volume everyday or Low volume every other day.

Mentzer style works for me i just don't go so insane heavy that i may get injured or need forced reps from a spotter

so I go heavy as possible 5-7 rep max with another immediate drop set with at least 6-8 reps.

Thats one complete continual set with 12-16 reps....Machine weights like Hammer strength for isolation.

I like Francos look better but his approarch to training just doesn't work for me, i feel like i'm overtraining and do not progress or gain strength.
Why not do low volume everyday?