Author Topic: PDI and IFBB athletes switching contests? (Read 21469 times)

stuntmovie · « **on:** April 04, 2006, 09:59:02 PM »

Is it legal to evict an "athlete" from an organization if that athlete competes in another organization's event.

This legal question came up many years ago when the NPC was just getting started and the court ruled that an amateur athlete could compete in any organization he wanted to without harrassment or banishment by another competitive organization.

I don't think that that court addressed the professional side of that question because it was assumed that professional bodybuilders were under contract to participate within one organization only.

I am not of a legal mind, but it would appear that the IFBB would only have a legal leg to stand on if the competitors were limited to "invitees" only. And they could only banish those who compete in the PDI who are under contract to compete within the IFBB only.

Any legal opinions here? The IFBB could possibly open the doors to a major lawsuit if they choose to castigate competitors who desire to "cross over" between both organizations.

Could be an interesting situation to keep track of.

LuciusFox · « **Reply #1 on:** April 04, 2006, 10:01:25 PM »

Yes, that sounds interesting. How much can athletes be restricted from competing when they are only considered independent contracting. Is the IFBB using a "covenant-not-to-compete" clause, or something entirely different?

240 is Back · « **Reply #2 on:** April 04, 2006, 10:02:41 PM »

IFBB is a non profit canadian organization. They *have* to let qualified pros compete.

Pro Division, Inc is a privately held business. They can fire athletes that show up looking like Jocelyn or the "new" shawn ray.

benchthis · « **Reply #3 on:** April 04, 2006, 10:03:57 PM »

that settles that now the Ifbb will burn in hell and PDI will reign supreme

LuciusFox · « **Reply #4 on:** April 04, 2006, 10:05:43 PM »

Quote from: 240 is Back on April 04, 2006, 10:02:41 PM

IFBB is a non profit canadian organization. They *have* to let qualified pros compete.

Pro Division, Inc is a privately held business. They can fire athletes that show up looking like Jocelyn or the "new" shawn ray.

Arnold and Jim's show can decide who they want to invite and restrict it to the only.

stuntmovie · « **Reply #5 on:** April 04, 2006, 10:06:36 PM »

Another legal thought of which I know nothing about, but .......... isn't there some "restraint of trade" regulation or series of regulations that would be pertinent here? Arn't there business rules and regulations that apply here?

stuntmovie · « **Reply #6 on:** April 04, 2006, 10:10:52 PM »

"Qualified pros" brings up another interesting thought.

It appears that the PDI will recognize a competitor as a "pro" who was determined to be a pro within the IFBB, but will the IFBB reciprocate and recognize those athletes who become pros within the PDI as eligible pros in IFBB contests?

Getting dizzy thinking about all these possible ramifications.

I think some lawyers are going to be making a lot of money soon.

onlyme · « **Reply #7 on:** April 04, 2006, 10:11:54 PM »

Good question. As with SAG you are a member of a union. You cannot do any shows or programs outside of a SAG affiliated gig. If you do you can suffer as much as banishment (like I was warned about). Being a member of the IFBB is really nothing more than a being a member of a "club", like when you join a gym that doesn't mean you can only be a member of that gym. You can join any gym you want. You still pay dues, you have to follow the rules but they don't decided where you can train. They can kick you out of the IFBB you decided to compete in the PDI, if that is a clause in their contract. Just like the Weider contract I would expect. It might say you can only compete in the IFBB or NPC. If you compete in another organization yo could get kicked out. But, I can't see anyone of sound mind signing a contract that totally prohibts them from competiting n another organization and suffering a fine of dollar value. That is just dumb. It would be interesting to hear from Lee who is both an IFBB pro and sponsored to see what penalities are invlved

Disgusted · « **Reply #8 on:** April 04, 2006, 10:15:53 PM »

Quote from: onlyme on April 04, 2006, 10:11:54 PM

Good question. As with SAG you are a member of a union. You cannot do any shows or programs outside of a SAG affiliated gig. If you do you can suffer as much as banishment (like I was warned about). Being a member of the IFBB is really nothing more than a being a member of a "club", like when you join a gym that doesn't mean you can only be a member of that gym. You can join any gym you want. You still pay dues, you have to follow the rules but they don't decided where you can train. They can kick you out of the IFBB you decided to compete in the PDI, if that is a clause in their contract. Just like the Weider contract I would expect. It might say you can only compete in the IFBB or NPC. If you compete in another organization yo could get kicked out. But, I can't see anyone of sound mind signing a contract that totally prohibts them from competiting n another organization and suffering a fine of dollar value. That is just dumb. It would be interesting to hear from Lee who is both an IFBB pro and sponsored to see what penalities are invlved

I am pretty sure there is a clause (at least that is what I was told when I was young

) in the contract. Problem is if you don't sign then you can't compete. Lee will no doubt be banned, but I give him credit where it is due.

benchthis · « **Reply #9 on:** April 04, 2006, 10:17:08 PM »

if it fails im sure ifbb will take him back and if not he could always race cars

240 is Back · « **Reply #10 on:** April 04, 2006, 10:20:09 PM »

Quote from: benchthis on April 04, 2006, 10:17:08 PM

if it fails im sure ifbb will take him back and if not he could always race cars

He is making a good living in endorsements as well.

stuntmovie · « **Reply #11 on:** April 04, 2006, 10:21:25 PM »

If Weider or the IFBB is paying an athlete $40,000 to $60,000 or more to abide by a mutually agreed upon contract, then that athlete would be obligated to abide by that agreement and not enter outside events if that is part of the agreement.

But if an athlete does not have such a contract, he should be allowed to compete in any organization's event that he wishes to enter without interference by anyone.

I don't believe that each of the IFBB athletes are ever offered a contract of any sorts from any IFBB organization or affiliate; so I have to assume that the IFBB has no power to tell anyone not under contract what they can or cannot do unless it strictly pertains to their performance within that contest itself.

Make sense???

Chick · « **Reply #12 on:** April 04, 2006, 10:21:52 PM »

Quote from: stuntmovie on April 04, 2006, 10:10:52 PM

"Qualified pros" brings up another interesting thought.

It appears that the PDI will recognize a competitor as a "pro" who was determined to be a pro within the IFBB, but will the IFBB reciprocate and recognize those athletes who become pros within the PDI as eligible pros in IFBB contests.

Getting dizzy thinking about all these possible ramifications.

I can answer that for you right now...no.

There are a few avenues one can be recognized by the IFBB and gain pro status.

1. win a "pro qualifier" i.e.- the USA, Nationals, N.American, etc
2. win a IFBB affiliated pro qualifier i.e.- a different countries national championship
3. win thee World championships

The IFBB will NOT recognize another "pro" from another "federation" because there are no standards that are recognized by the IFBB. For example..the "PDI" is neither a federation, nor do they have any standards of gaining pro status (at least as of yet). Right now, they are just giving away pro cards to whoever they wish....

If Lee Priest, however, hypothetically were to go and compete in the PDI...the PDI folded after a year, and Lee wanted to compete in the IFBB again....he would still be recognized as a professional by his original qualification to gain pro status in the IFBB. (whether he would be allowed back in, etc is a different topic)

benchthis · « **Reply #13 on:** April 04, 2006, 10:23:37 PM »

all the other pros who dont fair well in shows should just give pdi a chance.... you too bob

240 is Back · « **Reply #14 on:** April 04, 2006, 10:23:57 PM »

Chick, as an independent thinking athlete, would you ever consider jumping to the PDI if the IFBB collapsed?

LuciusFox · « **Reply #15 on:** April 04, 2006, 10:24:08 PM »

Quote from: Chick on April 04, 2006, 10:21:52 PM

I can answer that for you right now...no.

There are a few avenues one can be recognized by the IFBB and gain pro status.

1. win a "pro qualifier" i.e.- the USA, Nationals, N.American, etc
2. win a IFBB affiliated pro qualifier i.e.- a different countries national championship
3. win thee World championships

The IFBB will NOT recognize another "pro" from another "federation" because there are no standards that are recognized by the IFBB. For example..the "PDI" is neither a federation, nor do they have any standards of gaining pro status (at least as of yet). Right now, they are just giving away pro cards to whoever they wish....

If Lee Priest, however, hypothetically were to go and compete in the PDI...the PDI folded after a year, and Lee wanted to compete in the IFBB again....he would still be recognized as a professional by his original qualification to gain pro status in the IFBB. (whether he would be allowed back in, etc is a different topic)

Would you help Lee regain his status with the IFBB?

Bigger Business · « **Reply #16 on:** April 04, 2006, 10:24:38 PM »

Quote from: Chick on April 04, 2006, 10:21:52 PM

If Lee Priest, however, hypothetically were to go and compete in the PDI...the PDI folded after a year, and Lee wanted to compete in the IFBB again....he would still be recognized as a professional by his original qualification to gain pro status in the IFBB. (whether he would be allowed back in, etc is a different topic)

Thats nothing new really

But do you think the IFBB has the stronghold it did before

And I believe Wayne is 'respected' by a lot of the senior athletes

http://golfaustralia.blogspot.com

240 is Back · « **Reply #17 on:** April 04, 2006, 10:25:29 PM »

Quote from: LuciusFox on April 04, 2006, 10:24:08 PM

Would you help Lee regain his status with the IFBB?

Chick is rep for all the athletes. I'm sure he would fight very hard for Lee, if he chose to compete in both federations.

LuciusFox · « **Reply #18 on:** April 04, 2006, 10:26:20 PM »

Quote from: 240 is Back on April 04, 2006, 10:25:29 PM

Chick is rep for all the athletes. I'm sure he would fight very hard for Lee, if he chose to compete in both federations.

I hope he would, but I'm not so sure. What do you say, Bob?

benchthis · « **Reply #19 on:** April 04, 2006, 10:27:46 PM »

i thinks he's doing cardio "as seen on internet broadcast"

Disgusted · « **Reply #20 on:** April 04, 2006, 10:28:21 PM »

Quote from: Chick on April 04, 2006, 10:21:52 PM

..the "PDI" is neither a federation, nor do they have any standards of gaining pro status (at least as of yet). Right now, they are just giving away pro cards to whoever they wish....

Not true

stuntmovie · « **Reply #21 on:** April 04, 2006, 10:32:09 PM »

Thanks, Bob.I do know how IFBB pros are determined but that was all decided upon before the new kid came on the block.

Is there any possibility of "PDI pro recognition" by the IFBB when and if the PDI proves successful? Probably way too early to answer that, but it could prove interesting.

Another possibility here could be that the IFBB and the PDI would mutually co-exist and hold the "Inter-Steller Championships" between IFBB and PDI champions each year at the Mandalay
Bay.

Disgusted · « **Reply #22 on:** April 04, 2006, 10:35:52 PM »

Quote from: stuntmovie on April 04, 2006, 10:32:09 PM

Another possibility here could be that the IFBB and the PDI would mutually co-exist and hold the "Inter-Steller Championships" between IFBB and PDI champions each year at the Mandalay
Bay.

Yeah and I'm going to win the lottery this week.

jeffrey. · « **Reply #23 on:** April 04, 2006, 10:36:37 PM »

Quote from: 240 is Back on April 04, 2006, 10:23:57 PM

Chick, as an independent thinking athlete, would you ever consider jumping to the PDI if the IFBB collapsed?

lol........chick does what he is told so he can keep his paycheck.

LuciusFox · « **Reply #24 on:** April 04, 2006, 10:37:26 PM »

Quote from: stuntmovie on April 04, 2006, 10:32:09 PM

Thanks, Bob.I do know how IFBB pros are determined but that was all decided upon before the new kid came on the block.

Is there any possibility of "PDI pro recognition" by the IFBB when and if the PDI proves successful? Probably way too early to answer that, but it could prove interesting.

Another possibility here could be that the IFBB and the PDI would mutually co-exist and hold the "Inter-Steller Championships" between IFBB and PDI champions each year at the Mandalay
Bay.

Wouldn't that be exciting? No, no it wouldn't.