Author Topic: IFBB Pro League & NPC vs. IFBB Amateur & International  (Read 18438 times)

Simple Simon

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Re: NPC and IFBB Pro League vs. IFBB Amateur Worldwide - War has begun
« Reply #25 on: September 21, 2017, 12:17:57 AM »
Wayne DeMilia on the behalf of the Weiders, I think.

I am sure a lot of details will come out after the Arnold Europe and before the first pro show (I think San Marino).  Looks like promoters around the world will start IFBB Pro League qualifier contests, as well as NPC promoters (aka Musclecontest).  Competitors not born in the US want a chance to turn pro, and some countries made it very very hard for them to do so. This will give them their chances.

I know quite a few that should of turned pro, but could not because the country they were born in would not let them unless the paid, or competed in that country to get a pro card, even though they have lived in the US for years, or another country.

No, the IFBB made it very hard to do so, the overall mens winner at the UKBFF finals gets the chance to APPLY for a pro card, they don't just get one.
one per year. its nothing to do with the UK, its the IFBB that stop people becoming pro.

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Re: NPC and IFBB Pro League vs. IFBB Amateur Worldwide - War has begun
« Reply #26 on: September 21, 2017, 09:18:21 AM »
Here's a thought on who this conflict affects the most: overseas top bodybuilders who either aspire to spend time in the US on green cards or illegally (or legally) to train at meccas here and compete in US pro shows and also top men who want to stay mainly in their own nations but compete at the top level in the US. USA competitors aren't affected at all; they are already fully under the NPC/IFBB umbrella. Conversely, international bodybuilders who don't aspire to live in US or compete in US shows aren't affected either; they will stay with their local promoters and local pro qualifiers and be happy to be Mr. Spain or Mr. Korea, etc. But what about the likes of Ramy, Ruhr, Yates, Wolf, Fux, Rockel, etc? More and more these days, these men are the top names in the sport, not guys from Tennessee or Nebraska, or New York. If this conflict persists, this may prove to be a HUGE pain in the neck for these competitors. These men could be punished along the way in their own localities for jumping ship, yet not really be fully desirous or legal to be 100% in US. Also, these guys may have built in loyalty to the promoters and sponsors who helped them along the way.

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Re: NPC and IFBB Pro League vs. IFBB Amateur Worldwide - War has begun
« Reply #27 on: September 21, 2017, 10:16:47 AM »
THANKS, RON!!!

The information from ROBIN CHANG which you posted is the best info on this subject so far .... and I agree completely.

JIM MANION has done one hell of a good job since he took office.

And yet he will be subjected to ridicule simply doe to the fact that he is the individual who sits in the ruing chair ... and a good example of one who sits there can be seen in The Game of Thrones.

But to get back to the basics ... here is a bit of background that may or may not be interest to most GetBiggers.

Someone provide the precise date  because I have forgotten ...

I think it was 1980 (I am bad when it comes to dates) .... the morning after GARY LEAONARD won the overall title .... when we held a meeting at the Santa Monica Civic Auditorium to make a decision whether or not the NPC should join forces with the IFBB.

Ben and Joe were present and BEN WEIDER presented his side and offered the proposal that if the NPC would officially recognize the IFBB as the world governing body for professional competitive bodybuilding within the USA and for pro and amateur bodybuilding events outside  of the USA .... the IFBB would recognize the NPC as the sole bodybuilding governing body for amateur bodybuilding events within the US  ... and would not compete by promoting amateur bodybuilding contests within  the US.

A vote was taken and Ben Weiders' proposal won.

Any corrections ??? WHAT WAS THE EXACT DATE THAT THE NPC BECAME OFFICIAL?????

There is a lot more to this story ...... but for the sake of briefly ......


jwb

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Re: NPC and IFBB Pro League vs. IFBB Amateur Worldwide - War has begun
« Reply #28 on: September 21, 2017, 07:31:18 PM »
So I'm guess Eric Weider gave up control?
of the amateur ifbb?

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Re: NPC and IFBB Pro League vs. IFBB Amateur Worldwide - War has begun
« Reply #29 on: September 21, 2017, 07:57:22 PM »
THANKS, RON!!!

The information from ROBIN CHANG which you posted is the best info on this subject so far .... and I agree completely.

JIM MANION has done one hell of a good job since he took office.

And yet he will be subjected to ridicule simply doe to the fact that he is the individual who sits in the ruing chair ... and a good example of one who sits there can be seen in The Game of Thrones.

But to get back to the basics ... here is a bit of background that may or may not be interest to most GetBiggers.

Someone provide the precise date  because I have forgotten ...

I think it was 1980 (I am bad when it comes to dates) .... the morning after GARY LEAONARD won the overall title .... when we held a meeting at the Santa Monica Civic Auditorium to make a decision whether or not the NPC should join forces with the IFBB.

Ben and Joe were present and BEN WEIDER presented his side and offered the proposal that if the NPC would officially recognize the IFBB as the world governing body for professional competitive bodybuilding within the USA and for pro and amateur bodybuilding events outside  of the USA .... the IFBB would recognize the NPC as the sole bodybuilding governing body for amateur bodybuilding events within the US  ... and would not compete by promoting amateur bodybuilding contests within  the US.

A vote was taken and Ben Weiders' proposal won.

Any corrections ??? WHAT WAS THE EXACT DATE THAT THE NPC BECAME OFFICIAL?????

There is a lot more to this story ...... but for the sake of briefly ......



Gary Leonard won the Mr. America in 1980 but I think it was still the AAU back then. As I remember it, the IFBB was trying for years to affiliate with the AAU but some of the old school members of the AAU opposed the merger. Both organizations even went to court over the ownership of the Mr. America title. The court ruled in the favor of the AAU. The NPC finally began in 1982 and that was the official amateur sanctioning body of the U.S.A for the IFBB. So, the NPC became official in 1982.

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Re: NPC and IFBB Pro League vs. IFBB Amateur Worldwide - War has begun
« Reply #30 on: September 21, 2017, 08:15:48 PM »
What happens if the IFBB decides to hold competitions in the USA, essentially going against the NPC?

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Re: NPC and IFBB Pro League vs. IFBB Amateur Worldwide - War has begun
« Reply #31 on: September 21, 2017, 08:56:20 PM »
This talk about Arnold going with IFBB international isn't possible as long as he wants pros to compete at the Arnold Classics.  These guys pay for their pro card every year, to Manion's IFBB Pro League.  They can't compete anywhere else. When people talk about the IFBB, they are usually talking about IFBB Pros, not the amature federation that is every bit as corrupt as the NPC.  Rafael Santonja was stupid to cross Jim Manion.

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Re: NPC and IFBB Pro League vs. IFBB Amateur Worldwide - War has begun
« Reply #32 on: September 22, 2017, 11:08:25 PM »
What a mess. No doubt caused by the increased revenue possible in contests with so many new popular divisions.

I didn't like that Ben Weider was the life president of the IFBB. Likewise, how can Manion be removed? If not then this is only a business. He doesn't have to listen to anyone.

Who is responsible for the pathetic judging system used in the NPC? Are they ever going to change that? Nope. There is no transparency. Results do not show what each judge voted for.

I doubt I would support any organization that had Steve Weinberger involved with the judging. I well remember how he once offered to fight those who booed him at a contest.

He is nothing but a stooge and patsy for Manion. They can cleverly control who wins their contests by things such as call outs. The rounds system allows for 'corrections' to be made.

After each Olympia is a feeling of dissatisfaction. Results are accepted eventually but people forget all the controversies.



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Re: NPC and IFBB Pro League vs. IFBB Amateur Worldwide - War has begun
« Reply #33 on: September 23, 2017, 02:54:57 AM »

* The IFBB Professional League does NOT operate under an antiquated system with ridiculous rules, restrictions, and sanctions that no longer apply to the current competitive climate.


So competitors are free to compete in other federations and return?

Joe Roark

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Re: NPC and IFBB Pro League vs. IFBB Amateur Worldwide - War has begun
« Reply #34 on: September 23, 2017, 03:29:53 AM »
THANKS, RON!!!

The information from ROBIN CHANG which you posted is the best info on this subject so far .... and I agree completely.

JIM MANION has done one hell of a good job since he took office.

And yet he will be subjected to ridicule simply doe to the fact that he is the individual who sits in the ruing chair ... and a good example of one who sits there can be seen in The Game of Thrones.

But to get back to the basics ... here is a bit of background that may or may not be interest to most GetBiggers.

Someone provide the precise date  because I have forgotten ...

I think it was 1980 (I am bad when it comes to dates) .... the morning after GARY LEAONARD won the overall title .... when we held a meeting at the Santa Monica Civic Auditorium to make a decision whether or not the NPC should join forces with the IFBB.

Ben and Joe were present and BEN WEIDER presented his side and offered the proposal that if the NPC would officially recognize the IFBB as the world governing body for professional competitive bodybuilding within the USA and for pro and amateur bodybuilding events outside  of the USA .... the IFBB would recognize the NPC as the sole bodybuilding governing body for amateur bodybuilding events within the US  ... and would not compete by promoting amateur bodybuilding contests within  the US.

A vote was taken and Ben Weiders' proposal won.

Any corrections ??? WHAT WAS THE EXACT DATE THAT THE NPC BECAME OFFICIAL?????

There is a lot more to this story ...... but for the sake of briefly ......



Leonard won the AAU Mr. America on Sept 6, 1980 in  Santa Monica.

falco

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Re: NPC and IFBB Pro League vs. IFBB Amateur Worldwide - War has begun
« Reply #35 on: September 23, 2017, 03:49:44 AM »
Bodybuilding seems to be growing. Urology clinics have a promissing future.

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IFBB PRO LEAGUE vs IFBB INTERNATIONAL
« Reply #36 on: October 16, 2017, 01:13:06 PM »
This board has been pretty damn quiet when it comes to what’s up and what’s been happening regarding the situation that occurred during the 2017 Olympia weekend when Rafael S.  terminated the IfBB’s association with the NPC and the IFBB Pro League.

I’m not an insider but here are some basic  bits of information that may clarify this situation for those who are less familiar with it than I am.

I seldom take sides in matters like this but since I’ve known Jim Manion since the beginning and consider him to be doing a good job and since I have never really actually met Rafael S. outside of a simple nod of the head in passing, I find myself taking side with Jim and the IFBB Pro League over  Rafael and the IFBB International.

So with that said …. Here is my ‘interpretation’ of what’s been going on and those whom have been doing it.

If anyone finds me to be in error or can elaborate with FACTS, please feel free to do so. It would be appreciated.

There are two sides involved within this situation:

The IFBB Pro League / NPC  under the guidance of Jim Manion and the IFBB International (Elite?) League under the guidance of Rafael S.

All IFBB Pro League / NPC events promoted within the  US will continue to march as in the past  ….. meaning that there will be no noticeable change.

That part is simple to comprehend.

But now the IFBB Pro League / NPC will have to rely on ‘affiliates’ outside of the USA to promote IFBB Pro League sanctioned events which will be pro-qualifying events ….. and the IFBB Pro League will not accept any contender as a professional who turns pro as a result of  obtaining his/her pro status within an IFBB International (Rafael) sanctioned event.

The above may get a bit confusing simply because both organizations are using the IFBB terminology which is apparently important to both sides.

So it will be interesting to see who these ‘affiliates’ will turn out to be as the affiliates who side with Jim will be personna non grata within the eyes of Rafael.

How loyal are these foreign IFBB promoters to Rafael S.?

And how loyal is Arnold? Will the world wide Arnold events choose to  side with Jim or Rafael?

That's a good  question.

One of the initial IFBB Pro League affiliates will be Bob  Chick who will be promoting three IFBB Pro League sanctioned events in England.

And it is interesting to learn that Wayne Demillia wii side with Rafael S. and return to the IFBB as the  IFBB International representative within the USA.

The loyalty aspects of this situation will prove to be interesting.

More to follow....

Disgusted

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Re: IFBB PRO LEAGUE vs IFBB INTERNATIONAL
« Reply #37 on: October 16, 2017, 01:22:19 PM »
The reality of it is no one here really cares. Ask yourself, how does this affect your "real" life beyond this board.

Joe Pietaro

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Re: IFBB PRO LEAGUE vs IFBB INTERNATIONAL
« Reply #38 on: October 16, 2017, 01:32:28 PM »
This board has been pretty damn quiet when it comes to what’s up and what’s been happening regarding the situation that occurred during the 2017 Olympia weekend when Rafael S.  terminated the IfBB’s association with the NPC and the IFBB Pro League.

I’m not an insider but here are some basic  bits of information that may clarify this situation for those who are less familiar with it than I am.

I seldom take sides in matters like this but since I’ve known Jim Manion since the beginning and consider him to be doing a good job and since I have never really actually met Rafael S. outside of a simple nod of the head in passing, I find myself taking side with Jim and the IFBB Pro League over  Rafael and the IFBB International.

So with that said …. Here is my ‘interpretation’ of what’s been going on and those whom have been doing it.

If anyone finds me to be in error or can elaborate with FACTS, please feel free to do so. It would be appreciated.

There are two sides involved within this situation:

The IFBB Pro League / NPC  under the guidance of Jim Manion and the IFBB International (Elite?) League under the guidance of Rafael S.

All IFBB Pro League / NPC events promoted within the  US will continue to march as in the past  ….. meaning that there will be no noticeable change.

That part is simple to comprehend.

But now the IFBB Pro League / NPC will have to rely on ‘affiliates’ outside of the USA to promote IFBB Pro League sanctioned events which will be pro-qualifying events ….. and the IFBB Pro League will not accept any contender as a professional who turns pro as a result of  obtaining his/her pro status within an IFBB International sanctioned event.

The above may get a bit confusing simply because both organizations are using the IFBB terminology which is apparently important to both sides.

So it will be interesting to see who these ‘affiliates’ will turn out to be as the affiliates why side with Jim will be personnel non grata within the eyes of Rafael.

How loyal are these foreign IFBB promoters to Rafael S.?

And how loyal is Arnold? Will the world wide Arnold events choose to  side with Jim or Rafael?

That's a good  question.

One of the initial IFBB Pro League affiliates will be Bob  who will be promoting a couple of IFBB Pro League sanctioned events in England.

And it is interesting to learn that Wayne Demillia wii side with Rafael S. and return to the IFBB as the  IFBB International representative within the USA.

The loyalty aspects of this situation will prove to be interesting.

More to follow....

I just completed a live interview with Wayne DeMilia, who has been brought in by Santoja to run the USA amateur division of the IFBB Pro Elite/Amateur. Lots of info regarding the Arnold Classic shows, TV, etc.

It will be posted to my YouTube channel (MuscleSportTV) soon once post-production editing is done. We have a studio, green screen, etc. and give a fuck about our appearance, unlike that bag of shit company Muscular Development I used to be employed at.

Neptuno

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Re: IFBB PRO LEAGUE vs IFBB INTERNATIONAL
« Reply #39 on: October 16, 2017, 01:34:33 PM »
Two facts.


- IFBB International has now a PRO level called IFBB ELITE PRO. The first event was celebrated in Helsinki (a former Pro League event) 6.000 euros in each division (Men´s Physique and Bikini) Dollars 7500 in each class.

- The famous IFBB Logo is with the real IFBB. The other was created after Pro Division fall
w

mphgrove

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Re: IFBB PRO LEAGUE vs IFBB INTERNATIONAL
« Reply #40 on: October 16, 2017, 01:55:18 PM »
The reality of it is no one here really cares. Ask yourself, how does this affect your "real" life beyond this board.

As said before, all this will have absolutely no impact within the United States. But it will cause confusion in other countries where many competitors, and some promoters, will be confused on what to do. If Manion hires some internationally savvy business guys, he may come through this successfully. But if he falls back on the likes of Winebergers and Chicherellos, etc., he will be in trouble.

stuntmovie

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Re: IFBB PRO LEAGUE vs IFBB INTERNATIONAL
« Reply #41 on: October 16, 2017, 03:34:15 PM »
DISGUSTED, , I  gotta disagree with ya and I do believe that a hell of a lot of people are interested regarding the process and the eventual outcome of this subject matter.

Although it has no effect on my personal life, I find it to be more interesting than who will be winning next years’s Olympia events.

I was one of the usual suspects who was involved in the decision making process when we made the initial association agreement with Joe and Ben Weider  which became a vital part of competitive bodybuilding history … and I think that whats going on now is even of more importance to competitors and fans and others who are actively involved.

I think that we wil soon see that history does in fact repeat itself in one form or another.

Thanks, Dis,    Stunt

stuntmovie

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Re: IFBB PRO LEAGUE vs IFBB INTERNATIONAL
« Reply #42 on: October 16, 2017, 03:58:33 PM »
MPH, I don't know how much help that Chick and Wineberger will be able to provide in regions outside of the USA, but I do know that both are willing to be of assistance in any way possible and Bob is presently doing so  by promoting sanctioned events in England.

But Jim will need a ton of a lot of help overseas ... so it will be interesting to see who comes to his assistance.

But  it is my understanding that Rafael is pretty damn 'powerful' over there.

And I'd bet ya one-dollar to one of your doughnuts that the lawyers are licking their chops as we speak .... maybe even shit we know nothing about.

Thanks, MPH

dj181

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Re: IFBB PRO LEAGUE vs IFBB INTERNATIONAL
« Reply #43 on: October 16, 2017, 04:22:29 PM »
The reality of it is no one here really cares. Ask yourself, how does this affect your "real" life beyond this board.

do you think id have a shot in mens classic bb?  :D

i guess one is 10 pounds lighter than the other

Hypertrophy

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Re: IFBB PRO LEAGUE vs IFBB INTERNATIONAL
« Reply #44 on: October 16, 2017, 04:34:39 PM »
The reality of it is no one here really cares. Ask yourself, how does this affect your "real" life beyond this board.

LOL exactly. This is like arguing between which organization better represents Ultimate Frisbee...

stuntmovie

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Re: IFBB PRO LEAGUE vs IFBB INTERNATIONAL
« Reply #45 on: October 16, 2017, 05:01:03 PM »
JOE, Thanks! I  just finished watching you initial report on your upcoming DeMillia interview.

If Arnold is allowed to have individual events sanctioned by both organizations, will that mean that other promoters can do likewise?

I think that there will be some serious legal discussions concerning that issue.

I have a gut feeling that he will choose one over the other exclusively eventually.

Looking forward to hearing thatWayne interview.

Did you realize that the name MR. AMERICA was registered for the exclusive use of a USA  shirt manufacturing company at one time?


Disgusted

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Re: IFBB PRO LEAGUE vs IFBB INTERNATIONAL
« Reply #46 on: October 16, 2017, 05:11:17 PM »
DISGUSTED, , I  gotta disagree with ya and I do believe that a hell of a lot of people are interested regarding the process and the eventual outcome of this subject matter.

Although it has no effect on my personal life, I find it to be more interesting than who will be winning next years’s Olympia events.

I was one of the usual suspects who was involved in the decision making process when we made the initial association agreement with Joe and Ben Weider  which became a vital part of competitive bodybuilding history … and I think that whats going on now is even of more importance to competitors and fans and others who are actively involved.

I think that we wil soon see that history does in fact repeat itself in one form or another.

Thanks, Dis,    Stunt



Me too.  ;D

Disgusted

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Re: IFBB PRO LEAGUE vs IFBB INTERNATIONAL
« Reply #47 on: October 16, 2017, 05:39:41 PM »
DISGUSTED, , I  gotta disagree with ya and I do believe that a hell of a lot of people are interested regarding the process and the eventual outcome of this subject matter.

Although it has no effect on my personal life, I find it to be more interesting than who will be winning next years’s Olympia events.

I was one of the usual suspects who was involved in the decision making process when we made the initial association agreement with Joe and Ben Weider  which became a vital part of competitive bodybuilding history … and I think that whats going on now is even of more importance to competitors and fans and others who are actively involved.

I think that we wil soon see that history does in fact repeat itself in one form or another.

Thanks, Dis,    Stunt


Just bout anything  is.  ;D

dj181

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Re: IFBB PRO LEAGUE vs IFBB INTERNATIONAL
« Reply #48 on: October 17, 2017, 12:45:18 AM »
Just bout anything  is.  ;D

brutal double quote

p.s. 15 just gave me this comp on 15.org, notice the last sentence 😎😉

Rambo!

straight out Rambo,,

im not kiding by the way,, but as I told you back in the day you need more lean poundage,, if you could add more kilograms.. about 5-10kg really that's all you need.. you will look amazing

gh15 approved

Disgusted

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Re: IFBB PRO LEAGUE vs IFBB INTERNATIONAL
« Reply #49 on: October 17, 2017, 01:37:22 AM »
brutal double quote

p.s. 15 just gave me this comp on 15.org, notice the last sentence 😎😉

Rambo!

straight out Rambo,,

im not kiding by the way,, but as I told you back in the day you need more lean poundage,, if you could add more kilograms.. about 5-10kg really that's all you need.. you will look amazing

gh15 approved


The question is why is it taking so long.