Once again we try and fight a no win battle

[phreak]

Hahahahahahha. You believe that? The drugs would have to be taxed and regulated, and guess what? Dealers don't have to pay taxes, so it's cheaper to go to the dealer. Then who pays for the resulting care of individuals who are high? And what about the places where they get high? Who cares for their children? The tax payer that is who. And furthermore, what has happened is that it has help grow the police forces, help grow the government. Remember, crime pays.

Following your logic use of illegal tobacco should be a major societal problem then, since the price of cigarettes is largely taxes. Is it a massive crime problem, with tens of thousands killed and millions incarcerated?

Come on, I thought you were a man of logic and reason.

[Bindare_Dundat]

Hahahahahahha. You believe that? The drugs would have to be taxed and regulated, and guess what? Dealers don't have to pay taxes, so it's cheaper to go to the dealer. Then who pays for the resulting care of individuals who are high? And what about the places where they get high? Who cares for their children? The tax payer that is who. And furthermore, what has happened is that it has help grow the police forces, help grow the government. Remember, crime pays.

It's worked in Portugal. At least that's what initial reports suggest.

[Parker]

Following your logic use of illegal tobacco should be a major societal problem then, since the price of cigarettes is largely taxes. Is it a massive crime problem, with tens of thousands killed and millions incarcerated?

Come on, I thought you were a man of logic and reason.

It is a major societal problem. Not only is lung /throat cancer from second hand smoke a big problem, but there is an up swing on addiction now that Vaping give more a dose than reg cigs, and kids are far more addicted to it. They call it JUULing https://www.google.com/amp/amp.kansascity.com/news/local/article171369972.html

Now, heroin/opioids, PCP, cocaine, meth, are way harder than tobacco, and the US already has a serious, serious heroin/opioid and crack cocaine addiction problem. The way to handle it, is get to the root causes of the problem.

 And if Big Tobacco takes over the drug trade...


Police forces have noticed that in places where say marijuana is legal, the dealers are still present, because the dispensaries and supplies all have to pay taxes on the product. Which raises the prices on the product, the illegal dealer doesn't pay taxes, which means the product is cheaper.
And if you look at the fentanyl situation---where dealers are cutting their heroin with fentanyl, the people who OD and get brought back, want more, and so do the people who are addicts and witness it. So, where would a person get said product in a legalized drug situation? Well, the dealer, that is who.

[Bevo]

I’m a child of the eighties.

This “war on drugs” horseshit has been going full-tilt since my teen years. And as said, it’s worse than ever. Total joke.

Many are just too weak to resist chemi-assistance. Just like many are libs. Reality is simply too tough for these folks.

I always hope a rec-drug user will overdose and die or run afoul of some filthy dealer. Their deaths always cheer Fortress.  

Pathetic and weak.

Just die.

Will esfitness die soon?

[Thin Lizzy]

 As others have said, it’s been a complete and total failure. Other than create large criminal enterprises, what is it accomplished? It hasn’t reduce drug use at all.

It’s a classic example of the state trying to legislate morality. Drug use is a victimless crime. If someone buys drugs from another person and it’s consensual. Who is the victim?

[dan18]

Legalize all drugs.

This will reduce criminality and allow the police to focus manpower and funds on things that actually matter.

Those who want drugs can at least get under doctor supervision and get good quality which will be safer.

Then you create more issues that's like saying lets give guns to everyone and there will be no more killings doesn't work

[dan18]

It is a major societal problem. Not only is lung /throat cancer from second hand smoke a big problem, but there is an up swing on addiction now that Vaping give more a dose than reg cigs, and kids are far more addicted to it. They call it JUULing https://www.google.com/amp/amp.kansascity.com/news/local/article171369972.html

Now, heroin/opioids, PCP, cocaine, meth, are way harder than tobacco, and the US already has a serious, serious heroin/opioid and crack cocaine addiction problem. The way to handle it, is get to the root causes of the problem.

 And if Big Tobacco takes over the drug trade...


Police forces have noticed that in places where say marijuana is legal, the dealers are still present, because the dispensaries and supplies all have to pay taxes on the product. Which raises the prices on the product, the illegal dealer doesn't pay taxes, which means the product is cheaper.
And if you look at the fentanyl situation---where dealers are cutting their heroin with fentanyl, the people who OD and get brought back, want more, and so do the people who are addicts and witness it. So, where would a person get said product in a legalized drug situation? Well, the dealer, that is who.

theres vaping as were you get 3 6 and 12 mg of nicotine then theres juules they are 20 to 26mg don't get the 2 confused vaping is a great way to kick the ciggs electronic cigs and juules are made by the cigg companies vaping is not

[bigbychoices]

its simple. if its illegal then who ever is caught selling or making  it no matter the amount should be put to death. plain and simple. if there is no fear of punishment people will keep doing it. like all crime. we need to get tuff on it. some crimes we are tuff on but those are not even real crimes. just a smoke screen to make the stupid public think the gov is doing something about things. but the problem is our own gov is so involved in the drugs and crime its unbelievable. plus there are so many jobs and so much money  that would be lost. the gov lies about everything. everything is about money not our safety. drugs dont kill unless you take them or fight for them. guns dont kill unless you pull the trigger. but idiots all scream guns kill drugs kill etc ban guns ban drugs. but guess what? cars kill more people everyday than guns or drugs but why dont people scream ban cars? again cars dont kill unless a person starts it up and drives. so in every instance nothing kills unless a PERSON  does it. so if we eliminate stupid people all the other things will sease or go to an incredible low. our problemm is not guns drugs cars etc its the fact we let stupid people get away with being stupid. make laws tuff and stick to them. the death penalty should be that. your guilty you die the next day. likie barretta used to say "dont do the crime if you cant do the time"

[Tapeworm]

I don't care what anyone does as long as the tax payer doesn't end up picking up the tab for their long term care and rehab stints..

The accountant's measuring stick isn't the one to use when it comes to individual rights.  Besides, the biggest killers (and most costly to the tax payer) are heart disease and diabetes.  Obesity is a huge drain on the system but I haven't heard anything about a War On Doughnuts.

[dan18]

The accountant's measuring stick isn't the one to use when it comes to individual rights.  Besides, the biggest killers (and most costly to the tax payer) are heart disease and diabetes.  Obesity is a huge drain on the system but I haven't heard anything about a War On Doughnuts.

[Griffith]

It is a major societal problem. Not only is lung /throat cancer from second hand smoke a big problem, but there is an up swing on addiction now that Vaping give more a dose than reg cigs, and kids are far more addicted to it. They call it JUULing https://www.google.com/amp/amp.kansascity.com/news/local/article171369972.html

Now, heroin/opioids, PCP, cocaine, meth, are way harder than tobacco, and the US already has a serious, serious heroin/opioid and crack cocaine addiction problem. The way to handle it, is get to the root causes of the problem.

 And if Big Tobacco takes over the drug trade...


Police forces have noticed that in places where say marijuana is legal, the dealers are still present, because the dispensaries and supplies all have to pay taxes on the product. Which raises the prices on the product, the illegal dealer doesn't pay taxes, which means the product is cheaper.
And if you look at the fentanyl situation---where dealers are cutting their heroin with fentanyl, the people who OD and get brought back, want more, and so do the people who are addicts and witness it. So, where would a person get said product in a legalized drug situation? Well, the dealer, that is who.

https://www.thefix.com/content/decrim-nation-portugal-ten-years-later

Portugal legalized ALL drugs and it has been a success, ''drug use has plunged dramatically''

“Judging by every metric, drug decriminalization in Portugal has been a resounding success. It has enabled the Portuguese government to manage and control the drug problem far better than virtually every other Western country."

"By freeing its citizens from the fear of prosecution and imprisonment for drug usage, Portugal has dramatically improved its ability to encourage drug addicts to avail themselves of treatment. The resources that were previously devoted to prosecuting and imprisoning drug addicts are now available to provide treatment programs to addicts."

[funk51]

once again look to our leaders for the answer.

[dan18]

once again look to our leaders for the answer.
[/quote
YOU GO SILLY WHITE WOMAN THINKING THAT A SLOGAN WILL STOP DRUGS

[Thin Lizzy]

Then you create more issues that's like saying lets give guns to everyone and there will be no more killings doesn't work

There are trade-offs in life. It’s unavoidable. Most intelligent people who don’t do drugs wouldn’t do them even if they were legal. And you wouldn’t be giving drugs to everyone they would have to buy them just as they would have to buy guns.

The current approach hasn’t reduced usage and has created huge criminal enterprises that have terrorized communities and even entire countries.

[Griffith]

There are trade-offs in life. It’s unavoidable. Most intelligent people who don’t do drugs wouldn’t do them even if they were legal. And you wouldn’t be giving drugs to everyone they would have to buy them just as they would have to buy guns.

The current approach hasn’t reduced usage and has created huge criminal enterprises that have terrorized communities and even entire countries.

Exactly.
 

[residue]

Then you create more issues that's like saying lets give guns to everyone and there will be no more killings doesn't work

sure it is, if people randomly around sticking folks with needles filled with heroin

[dan18]

There are trade-offs in life. It’s unavoidable. Most intelligent people who don’t do drugs wouldn’t do them even if they were legal. And you wouldn’t be giving drugs to everyone they would have to buy them just as they would have to buy guns.

The current approach hasn’t reduced usage and has created huge criminal enterprises that have terrorized communities and even entire countries.

Too some degree im with you but if the state controls the drugs they will come at a higher price so the drug dealers will not go away and drugs will still be brought into the country

[Griffith]

Too some degree im with you but if the state controls the drugs they will come at a higher price so the drug dealers will not go away and drugs will still be brought into the country

Where drugs are legal, they're far cheaper.

For instance in Thailand you can buy steroids and HGH for considerably cheaper as they're straight from a factory and generics can be manufactured and sold directly to the public.

People will still prefer to buy real quality instead of home made drugs, the amount they'd be saving would maybe be 10-15 % or however much VAT is if they bought from underground dealers.

For instance, if they wanted cocaine they'd at least know there was no glass or rat poisen or whatever if they bought it from a factory.

Also, they could be sold online too so that would cut down costs anyway.

It would no longer be a rarity and that alone would cut down the costs and appeal, and there would be far more competition.

[dan18]

Where drugs are legal, they're far cheaper.

For instance in Thailand you can buy steroids and HGH for considerably cheaper as they're straight from a factory and generics can be manufactured and sold directly to the public.

People will still prefer to buy real quality instead of home made drugs, the amount they'd be saving would maybe be 10-15 % or however much VAT is if they bought from underground dealers.

For instance, if they wanted cocaine they'd at least know there was no glass or rat poisen or whatever if they bought it from a factory.

Also, they could be sold online too so that would cut down costs anyway.

It would no longer be a rarity and that alone would cut down the costs and appeal, and there would be far more competition.

At the end of the day it doesn't matter it will never happen look how long it took pot to get partially legal drugs like cocaine heroin it will never happen

[Griffith]

At the end of the day it doesn't matter it will never happen look how long it took pot to get partially legal drugs like cocaine heroin it will never happen

It happened in Portugal and worked.

[dan18]

It happened in Portugal and worked.

Ok and that is one place they are a sovereign state not all of spain they have a set of rules that differ from the united states its not like Kansas one day can just rule all drugs legal in there state doesn't work that way here..

[phreak]

It is a major societal problem. Not only is lung /throat cancer from second hand smoke a big problem, but there is an up swing on addiction now that Vaping give more a dose than reg cigs, and kids are far more addicted to it. They call it JUULing https://www.google.com/amp/amp.kansascity.com/news/local/article171369972.html

Now, heroin/opioids, PCP, cocaine, meth, are way harder than tobacco, and the US already has a serious, serious heroin/opioid and crack cocaine addiction problem. The way to handle it, is get to the root causes of the problem.

 And if Big Tobacco takes over the drug trade...


Police forces have noticed that in places where say marijuana is legal, the dealers are still present, because the dispensaries and supplies all have to pay taxes on the product. Which raises the prices on the product, the illegal dealer doesn't pay taxes, which means the product is cheaper.
And if you look at the fentanyl situation---where dealers are cutting their heroin with fentanyl, the people who OD and get brought back, want more, and so do the people who are addicts and witness it. So, where would a person get said product in a legalized drug situation? Well, the dealer, that is who.

No, no, no. Now you are changing the argument. The question was whether legal sale of tobacco would still bolster a massive and violent drug trade. The question was not the societal impact of tobacco. Can I take your deflection as an admission that legal tobacco has for the most part made illegal tobacco irrelevant?

[NelsonMuntz]

Hahahahahahha. You believe that? The drugs would have to be taxed and regulated, and guess what? Dealers don't have to pay taxes, so it's cheaper to go to the dealer. Then who pays for the resulting care of individuals who are high? And what about the places where they get high? Who cares for their children? The tax payer that is who. And furthermore, what has happened is that it has help grow the police forces, help grow the government. Remember, crime pays.

I could be wrong but drug dealers when they launder their money through legit means are paying tax on that now "legit" money.

also everyone is taxed through both hidden taxes that make part of the markup on products that businesses factor into costs plus sales taxes on items(here in ontario sales tax is 13%)

also you might as well consider the taxing that law enforcemnt and government get from dealers on the side for bribes and protection

[NelsonMuntz]

Then you create more issues that's like saying lets give guns to everyone and there will be no more killings doesn't work

considering there are probably 300 millions legal firearms in private hands I would say your logic fails because its a small minority of retards doing the shooting, most of whom are using illegally bought and stolen/smuggled forearms

[NelsonMuntz]

its simple. if its illegal then who ever is caught selling or making  it no matter the amount should be put to death. plain and simple. if there is no fear of punishment people will keep doing it. like all crime. we need to get tuff on it. some crimes we are tuff on but those are not even real crimes. just a smoke screen to make the stupid public think the gov is doing something about things. but the problem is our own gov is so involved in the drugs and crime its unbelievable. plus there are so many jobs and so much money  that would be lost. the gov lies about everything. everything is about money not our safety. drugs dont kill unless you take them or fight for them. guns dont kill unless you pull the trigger. but idiots all scream guns kill drugs kill etc ban guns ban drugs. but guess what? cars kill more people everyday than guns or drugs but why dont people scream ban cars? again cars dont kill unless a person starts it up and drives. so in every instance nothing kills unless a PERSON  does it. so if we eliminate stupid people all the other things will sease or go to an incredible low. our problemm is not guns drugs cars etc its the fact we let stupid people get away with being stupid. make laws tuff and stick to them. the death penalty should be that. your guilty you die the next day. likie barretta used to say "dont do the crime if you cant do the time"

how do you feel about anabolic steroids? Joe Public thinks they are a dreg on society as much as heroin