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Author Topic: onlyme...ray mentzer training  (Read 8275 times)
powerforward
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« on: April 17, 2006, 06:51:50 AM »

read previous post that you made about knowing ray mentzer, would you mind telling us what his training was like? was it the way mike described it. or more traditional in terms of sets and reps?

thanks in advance.
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« Reply #1 on: April 17, 2006, 12:09:02 PM »

You knwo I really didn't know about his training methods.  We trained differently when we training together.  We did something he told me was the Russian Strength Workout.  It was awesome, plus he had me do allot of negatives.  He had the Keiser Machines that worked on air pressure.  They were great for negatives.  The workout was easy to remember but hard to do.

No warmup sets.  Which I still practice today.  Your opening set is equal to 80% of your peak.  Then each set after that you go up 5% till your last set you are doing 110% of your peak.  So if your peak is 500 then your last set is with 550.  Obviously you have to have a couple spotters.  The important thing is that you control and go down as slow as possible on the heavier weight.  This helps with tendon strength.  The only real difference that we didn't do was in Russia they got a massage between every set.  This helps with recouperation and blood flow.  I wish we did that too. 
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« Reply #2 on: April 17, 2006, 03:40:39 PM »

thanks for the reply, i have always admired the physique that both ray and mike developed and have always been curious if they really trained in the manner that mike wrote about.

thanks and please share more stories.
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« Reply #3 on: April 17, 2006, 03:41:47 PM »

Shocked thats a crazy way to train did how what kind of excesses would u do using this method
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« Reply #4 on: April 17, 2006, 04:49:01 PM »

Bench, Incline, Shoulder Press, and sometimes barbell curls.  I don't how anyone could do this all body parts.  Very tiring and probably impossible to do all the time.  Mostly bench though.
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« Reply #5 on: April 19, 2006, 07:11:37 PM »

Hey onlyme I started training fullbody workouts three times a week like Steve Reeves used to do. Would it be usefull to skip all the warm ups?
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« Reply #6 on: April 19, 2006, 09:40:30 PM »

Hey onlyme I started training fullbody workouts three times a week like Steve Reeves used to do. Would it be usefull to skip all the warm ups?

I don't think it is something you jump right into.  But I do think that take your chest for example.  If you bench first you do one or at the most 2 warmup sets and thats it for your entire chest in regards to warmup.  So when you go next to the incline or whatever you immediately start your regular workout no warmup,  You should beplenty warmed up after doing the bench press enough to start immediately into working out.  Same with every body part.  After the initial warmup and first sets of the bodypart you should be plenty loose and blood flowing without having to waste anymore time warming up.
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« Reply #7 on: April 20, 2006, 12:04:09 AM »

This goes back a while but I can recall Mike coming into the old Santa Monica Gold's and training like a madman and departing within the hour (or even less). Am I correct in recalling that he only trained once or twice a week?

I do know for a fact that he rode his bike a lot along the beach walk between Santa Monica Pier and Venice Beach.

Alexx, if that is you back photo, it looks like you have some great potential. Have you entered any local contests yet? I used to train military guys who had great potential and we won the state title for 8 years running, but back then it wasn't the norm to be a bulked up monster. (Respectfully stated of course!)
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« Reply #8 on: April 20, 2006, 08:28:31 AM »

I don't think it is something you jump right into.  But I do think that take your chest for example.  If you bench first you do one or at the most 2 warmup sets and thats it for your entire chest in regards to warmup.  So when you go next to the incline or whatever you immediately start your regular workout no warmup,  You should beplenty warmed up after doing the bench press enough to start immediately into working out.  Same with every body part.  After the initial warmup and first sets of the bodypart you should be plenty loose and blood flowing without having to waste anymore time warming up.

Thanks for the info. I will use that next time I do a split training type of routine. I know my friends train like that but from reading so much flex and from guys like Shawn "little guy" Ray, I decided to follow their lead and warm up on every single exercise. Now I know better. 
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« Reply #9 on: April 20, 2006, 08:32:32 AM »

This goes back a while but I can recall Mike coming into the old Santa Monica Gold's and training like a madman and departing within the hour (or even less). Am I correct in recalling that he only trained once or twice a week?

I do know for a fact that he rode his bike a lot along the beach walk between Santa Monica Pier and Venice Beach.

Alexx, if that is you back photo, it looks like you have some great potential. Have you entered any local contests yet? I used to train military guys who had great potential and we won the state title for 8 years running, but back then it wasn't the norm to be a bulked up monster. (Respectfully stated of course!)

Thanks Stuntmovie! That was me three years ago and I always had that low bodyfat percentage. In my recent pictures posted on the pics boards, I gained quite a bit of fat I am guessing 12% and 40 pounds heavier then in my avatar. Right now I am cutting down and think will always keep this low bodyfat percentage. Not competed yet but thinking about it soon.

Any chance you guys know exactly how Steve Reeves trained? I read he was a natural and thats what I would like to stay.
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« Reply #10 on: April 20, 2006, 12:53:13 PM »

I don't think it is something you jump right into.  But I do think that take your chest for example.  If you bench first you do one or at the most 2 warmup sets and thats it for your entire chest in regards to warmup.  So when you go next to the incline or whatever you immediately start your regular workout no warmup,  You should beplenty warmed up after doing the bench press enough to start immediately into working out.  Same with every body part.  After the initial warmup and first sets of the bodypart you should be plenty loose and blood flowing without having to waste anymore time warming up.

this was basically the same thing that was used when the Max-OT thing came out, it made me rethink warm ups and makes alot of sense.
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« Reply #11 on: April 20, 2006, 03:11:37 PM »


No warmup sets.  Which I still practice today.  Your opening set is equal to 80% of your peak. 

Thats how I train & still do today.

I guess it was the way my old lifting partner started me out & I never really questioned it. 

I remembered it took awhile to get used to it, but he was always amazed that the more sets & weights he would pile on me, the stronger I would become during the actual set.  It was like I couldn't fatigue. 

For example...typically when you pyramid up....your reps drop.....

mine would increase.

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« Reply #12 on: April 20, 2006, 05:26:36 PM »

Thats how I train & still do today.

I guess it was the way my old lifting partner started me out & I never really questioned it. 

I remembered it took awhile to get used to it, but he was always amazed that the more sets & weights he would pile on me, the stronger I would become during the actual set.  It was like I couldn't fatigue. 

For example...typically when you pyramid up....your reps drop.....

mine would increase.



Mabe because you where not going to failure..
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« Reply #13 on: April 20, 2006, 05:36:00 PM »

Alexx, I hung around with Steve for a couple of days while he was in Hawaii and we did discuss the present steroid situation and he simply stated that it was a sad thing and he was definitely against using them himself.

To the best of my knowledge, roid useage wasn't too common until the early to mid 60's and Steve was just about out of the bodybuilding loop by then anyway. It would have been interesting to see how he would have progressed on a good roid program if they were available to one and all in the 40's and 50's.

I just found some pictures that we took while he was here and I'll do my best to post them once I get back from my next venture into the unknown.

Looking at the photos I now notice that Steve appears 30 years younger than the the same era guys in the shot. He definitely was a genetic exception.
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« Reply #14 on: April 20, 2006, 09:26:20 PM »

I think Bill Pearl my buddy falls in that same genetically gifted as Reeves.  There is no bodybuilder of today like Bill Pearl.  Such a nice guy and still looks great for 70+ years young
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« Reply #15 on: April 21, 2006, 08:41:50 AM »

Alexx, I hung around with Steve for a couple of days while he was in Hawaii and we did discuss the present steroid situation and he simply stated that it was a sad thing and he was definitely against using them himself.

To the best of my knowledge, roid useage wasn't too common until the early to mid 60's and Steve was just about out of the bodybuilding loop by then anyway. It would have been interesting to see how he would have progressed on a good roid program if they were available to one and all in the 40's and 50's.

I just found some pictures that we took while he was here and I'll do my best to post them once I get back from my next venture into the unknown.

Looking at the photos I now notice that Steve appears 30 years younger than the the same era guys in the shot. He definitely was a genetic exception.


 Shocked Bro thats awesome how many professionals you guys have hanged out with. Please do post the pictures and if you could tell me what his program looked like would be greatly appreciated. Smiley Do you think that Reeves would actually go on the juice if he had the chance and knew there where no side effects?
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« Reply #16 on: April 21, 2006, 11:53:59 AM »

Hey onlyme I started training fullbody workouts three times a week like Steve Reeves used to do. Would it be usefull to skip all the warm ups?

if you're gonna do a full body workout you should probably concentrate on heavy compound movements so skipping the warm up's might not be a good idea.  I guess you could warm up your chest, bench press and then your shoulders and tri's would be ok to go.  You could deadlift and then your arms would be good to go, legs would be a litte different........what's the workout you're doing?
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« Reply #17 on: April 21, 2006, 12:56:32 PM »

I don't know how anyone can do a full body workout in one day.  No way in the world could I do it the way I lifted.  I could barely move after chest.  I can't see how you can lift with maximum effort and weight and still do your whole body. 
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« Reply #18 on: April 21, 2006, 03:05:12 PM »

I started doing it this week and each day I made progress. Here's what it looks like:

1.behind neck barbell press
2.wide grip chins
3.high incline bench
4.close grip bench
5.barbellcurls
6.deadlifts
7.squats
8.leg curls
9.standing calf raises
10. abs


All for 3 work sets of 8 - 12 reps. I make sure to strech really well after the workout. Takes about 2 hours to complete but feels great afterwards.
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« Reply #19 on: April 21, 2006, 03:25:10 PM »

Mabe because you where not going to failure..

No actually I would go beyond failure.

Lets say with given weight I would just get 10 "unassisted reps out"....I would go another 3-4 reps beyond failure.  Usually the last rep I felt like the weight was going to come crashing down.  On bench press....I would go until the weight was resting on my chest & I couldn't move it....then with an assist.....I would then go into negatives until I feel the weight was going to collapse on me. 

It was complete faliure back then.
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« Reply #20 on: April 21, 2006, 03:28:03 PM »

No actually I would go beyond failure.

Lets say with given weight I would just get 10 "unassisted reps out"....I would go another 3-4 reps beyond failure.  Usually the last rep I felt like the weight was going to come crashing down.  On bench press....I would go until the weight was resting on my chest & I couldn't move it....then with an assist.....I would then go into negatives until I feel the weight was going to collapse on me. 

It was complete faliure back then.


You must hace a barrel for a chest.
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« Reply #21 on: April 21, 2006, 03:41:43 PM »

You must hace a barrel for a chest.

yeah....that I do......& it grows by doing nothing but push-ups if I want it too.

I now train chest just once like every other week or every two weeks.

The only problem after all that benching is about 5-6 years ago my shoulder is a little messed.  Doesn't hurt when I train....but it aches for days afterwards.
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« Reply #22 on: April 24, 2006, 02:50:15 PM »

I don't know how anyone can do a full body workout in one day.  No way in the world could I do it the way I lifted.  I could barely move after chest.  I can't see how you can lift with maximum effort and weight and still do your whole body. 

I can't figure that out either but some swear by it. If you work your legs hard how could you have anything left in the tank?
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« Reply #23 on: April 24, 2006, 03:35:32 PM »

Shit after a hard shoulder workout I can't even keep my arms hanging.  I have to hold them up on a table or something.  I am so tired.  I never train shoulders with any other upper body except tris sometimes which I usually do after chest.
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« Reply #24 on: April 25, 2006, 09:53:30 AM »

Shit after a hard shoulder workout I can't even keep my arms hanging.  I have to hold them up on a table or something.  I am so tired.  I never train shoulders with any other upper body except tris sometimes which I usually do after chest.

that's because you "know" how to train.  It takes along time to learn how to train to failure, it's not something you wake up one day and say "I'm gonna go past failure today"..yes, conceptually it's easy, and you might think you're doing it but you can always go to another level
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