Author Topic: Holding precious metals for this shit?  (Read 7853 times)

Rambone

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Re: Holding precious metals for this shit?
« Reply #50 on: March 30, 2020, 05:16:32 PM »
How about past history. Do you really think it will stay at $20/barrel?

Yes, oil is cheap, but who knows how long will it take to get back to say $40 a barrel, and what would you use as a trade vehicle? I’m not saying you’re wrong in your optimism of higher pricing, but you also can‘t just buy and hold oil forever, and it can take years to get back to $40 or it could take weeks. The time and trade vehicle both matter because who knows if something like the S&P will outperform oil in comparison during that timeframe. Are you buying an individual company, an oil service or exploration etf, a leveraged etf or using crude futures/options?

Thin Lizzy

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Re: Holding precious metals for this shit?
« Reply #51 on: March 30, 2020, 05:45:08 PM »
No, I mean why is it a sign of "unsophistication" that someone uses paper checks instead of electronic transfers to fund their accounts so that they have the cash on hand to execute trades. I mean, how unsophisticated can this guy be with his finances? He was an older guy and a lot of them are just not comfortable or trust computers and the internet.

How are you doing financially? Are you able to drop million dollar checks?

How much I have is irrelevant. When I ask you for a fucking loan then you can worry about my finances. Lots of people who can buy and sell me many times over don’t know as much about the market. Walking into a broker with a check is like 2000 shit. You keep associating how much money a person has with how good they are at the stock market. There usually isn’t a correlation. In fact very often it’s the opposite.

This guy can buy and sell all of Getbig yet he got scammed:


Tech Legend Steve Wozniak Scammed Out of $70K in Bitcoin - CoinDesk

https://www.coindesk.com/tech-legend-steve-wozniak-scammed-70k-bitcoin



Mr.1derful

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Re: Holding precious metals for this shit?
« Reply #52 on: March 30, 2020, 05:45:15 PM »
Do you honesty think if things collapsed that you’d be going to the store with a pouch full of gold coins? The world would be chaotic where anything goes. Guns>gold

Why not have both?

pellius

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Re: Holding precious metals for this shit?
« Reply #53 on: March 30, 2020, 05:55:00 PM »
How much I have is irrelevant. When I ask you for a fucking loan then you can worry about my finances. Lots of people who can buy and sell me many times over don’t know as much about the market. Walking into a broker with a check is like 2000 shit. You keep associating how much money a person has with how good they are at the stock market. There usually isn’t a correlation. In fact very often it’s the opposite.

This guy can buy and sell all of Getbig yet he got scammed:


Tech Legend Steve Wozniak Scammed Out of $70K in Bitcoin - CoinDesk

https://www.coindesk.com/tech-legend-steve-wozniak-scammed-70k-bitcoin




No, I'm associating money with financial saavy. One can speculate and lecture all they want but in the end it's whether you win or lose. If you are giving advice and/or strategies on financial success it is relevant to ask how it has worked out for you.

Anyway, you seem to take personal offense at being questioned so I'll desist. I'm trying to avoid the constant confrontations people like to engage in.

Rambone

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Re: Holding precious metals for this shit?
« Reply #54 on: March 30, 2020, 05:58:10 PM »
Why not have both?

Because one has a purpose and one is just a hunk of metal

Methyl m1ke

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Re: Holding precious metals for this shit?
« Reply #55 on: March 31, 2020, 01:22:38 AM »
Historically in these situations, people always react the same.  Panic buying, pulling cash from the banks and panic into bullion.  You want to be early to this party, not late.  Bullion is selling out and is getting hard to get, especially with refiners and mints shutting down.  Silver is very cheap at the moment, as it's being supressed.  Gold and silver have been money for thousands of years.  Fiat currency always fails and goes to its intrinsic value of zero.   Gold is great, but harder for the common man to afford.  In a currency crisis, it may be hard to make change for a 1 ounce gold coin that is at that time worth several thousands of dollars.  Silver is more advantageous in that scenario, but silver is much bulkier to store and carry comparitively based on worth.

Why invest in things that have no real value if shit actually does hit the fan? Buying land, properties, guns, non-perishable foodstuffs, shoes, socks, that sort of thing or is the logistics of having to store millions in shoes and guns unreasonable? Im just curious because I know people like you are smart and you already thought of what Im thinking and i'm curious to know exactly why you make some of the decisions that you make.

Mayday

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Re: Holding precious metals for this shit?
« Reply #56 on: March 31, 2020, 03:04:54 AM »
No, I mean why is it a sign of "unsophistication" that someone uses paper checks instead of electronic transfers to fund their accounts so that they have the cash on hand to execute trades.

You are asking Lizzy a lot of question and not listening.

Stereotype's form for a reason. The articles online specifically finger point older investors as the ones who lose the most and buy in at the wrong time. Nobody under 40 knows WTF a cheque is. You have given a the perfect example of exactly who Google and others are calling out in their articles as a warning NOT to buy.......

The information right now is futures are getting obliterated. Buying now is a ticket to losing your money. Be patient. Wait.

Methyl m1ke

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Re: Holding precious metals for this shit?
« Reply #57 on: March 31, 2020, 03:55:48 AM »
No, I'm associating money with financial savvy. One can speculate and lecture all they want but in the end it's whether you win or lose. If you are giving advice and/or strategies on financial success it is relevant to ask how it has worked out for you.

Anyway, you seem to take personal offense at being questioned so I'll desist. I'm trying to avoid the constant confrontations people like to engage in.

Then be less confrontational. (avoid reading the rest of this post unless you're bored.)

I realize your pretty intelligent, it's obvious by the manner in which you converse (as far as conversing on Getbig is concerned.)  Intelligence begets the art of Persuasion my friend. That's usually what you're after, to either sway a person or people from whatever they believe now over to whatever you believe (both could be the same just seen from different perspective and of course the perspective which benefits you the most is the correct one) or to shift their focus to whatever is important to you (and likely not them) and the key to both is the ability to accomplish all this without the other person(s) realizing they are being manipulated.

My friend here worked for Lockheed as an engineer his entire career. He never had another employer in his life (well the navy but that's besides the point.) He ascended fairly high, I think he oversaw 10k people at Vandenburg a site he opened. (I don't know too much about Lockheed but I believe vandenburg is a big missile and testing site for California.)

The point- Mike (My friend) told me the higher you go in business (meaning ascending the ranks of the company) the tougher the people are to leap frog over (to him, a boss is just the next guy to eliminate or partner up with to eliminate someone else and then get eliminated) and he said the biggest most noticeable asset/strength/skill always seemed to be the ability to get others to see things your way. The manager he never got past Mike forgot his name but told me he had figured out some way to save Lockheed a lot of money on a satellite project or something and his (mikes) thinking was that the idea was a slam dunk and it created a position for his boss with the logic being your boss promoted is as good as you getting promoted (assuming your boss doesn't hate you or consider you incompetent) SO Mike went to go see this manager and he gets all his paperwork and blueprints and all that shit (imagine a scientist guy in a suit with coke bottle glasses and all kinds of stuff white and blue papers spilling out his arms in every direction lol.) and runs into him in the lobby (ground floor) so they take the elevator up together and Mike spends a couple minutes explaining to this manager, in Mikes way that  he does this shit where he has an answer or solution to a situation or a problem and it definitely sounds logical and makes perfect sense-except Mike does not ever leave any room for a plan B and if the situation changes his idea probably has to be totally reworked. But over time Mike seems to have developed his own method for getting people to think and do what he wants (within reason.)

As Mike tells the story when they get to the managers office the manager wishes him luck and closes his office door and Mike gets back on the elevator and says for a few minutes he was really excited because the manager agreed with him and validated his logic and all of that. but then after some time Mike realizes that the manager actually rejected his entire idea and instead sold him on this other idea and on top of that- he made Mike think it was actually Mike's idea all along.

Mike has told this story COUNTLESS TIMES I wish I had more particulars but it seems Mike hit his theoretical ceiling or his mental limits and for him, that's very memorable. Anyway I just wrote all of that maybe because im a little bored and maybe because i can type 138 wpm and typing is actually very therapeutic for me and possibly just because i know Kwon will read every single word of it.

Point being you are getting into endless circular nonsense with people mostly because you both say "im right and this is my proof" but usually you cannot both be right. so one of you has to concede that the other person is more right and this is usualy in the form of more accurate data or obvious flaws in logic.

however, people are pretty stubborn. if you can really master persuading people to agree with whatever you do, make them value what you value and find important what you do you'll be like the king of the world man. food for thought perhaps.

joswift

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Re: Holding precious metals for this shit?
« Reply #58 on: March 31, 2020, 03:57:39 AM »
tell me how much an oz of gold is worth without using currency....

Methyl m1ke

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Re: Holding precious metals for this shit?
« Reply #59 on: March 31, 2020, 03:59:20 AM »
tell me how much an oz of gold is worth without using currency....

value is determined by whoever agrees to buy it

its worth a lot to the Gods the Sumerians worshipped. it's worth exactly nothing to me. in fact it's heavy as fuck so less than nothing.

joswift

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Re: Holding precious metals for this shit?
« Reply #60 on: March 31, 2020, 04:14:00 AM »
value is determined by whoever agrees to buy it

its worth a lot to the Gods the Sumerians worshipped. it's worth exactly nothing to me. in fact it's heavy as fuck so less than nothing.
and they need currency to buy it

I always laugh when people say Gold creates value, its actually currency that gives the Gold its value

Dokey111

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Re: Holding precious metals for this shit?
« Reply #61 on: March 31, 2020, 05:39:01 AM »
How much I have is irrelevant. When I ask you for a fucking loan then you can worry about my finances. Lots of people who can buy and sell me many times over don’t know as much about the market. Walking into a broker with a check is like 2000 shit. You keep associating how much money a person has with how good they are at the stock market. There usually isn’t a correlation. In fact very often it’s the opposite.

This guy can buy and sell all of Getbig yet he got scammed:


Tech Legend Steve Wozniak Scammed Out of $70K in Bitcoin - CoinDesk

https://www.coindesk.com/tech-legend-steve-wozniak-scammed-70k-bitcoin




Keep it coming TL, we're listening...

loco

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Re: Holding precious metals for this shit?
« Reply #62 on: March 31, 2020, 05:56:40 AM »
Just because old, technology challenged people use paper checks to buy into the stock market today, it doesn't follow that they are unsophisticated investors.

Likewise, just because a person has millions in the bank, it doesn't follow that this person is a sophisticated investor.

In times such as this, most people who are already invested in the stock market will be afraid and tempted to sell their stock.  And most people who are not already invested in the stock market will be afraid to buy stocks.  Others will try to time the market:  Get out at the "right time", then get back in at the "right time", which is a huge gamble and works only rarely and only because of luck.  Nobody knows the "right time."

Better thing to do is to buy and hold, as early as possible, as often as possible, and as much as possible, rain or shine:

1. A whole US stock market index fund or an S&P 500 Index fund
2. A whole US bond market index fund
3. A whole International stock market index fund

That's after paying off all consumer debt and accumulating a year worth of expenses in a savings account and CDs for true emergencies.

Flexacon

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Re: Holding precious metals for this shit?
« Reply #63 on: March 31, 2020, 12:45:00 PM »
Just because old, technology challenged people use paper checks to buy into the stock market today, it doesn't follow that they are unsophisticated investors.

Likewise, just because a person has millions in the bank, it doesn't follow that this person is a sophisticated investor.

In times such as this, most people who are already invested in the stock market will be afraid and tempted to sell their stock.  And most people who are not already invested in the stock market will be afraid to buy stocks.  Others will try to time the market:  Get out at the "right time", then get back in at the "right time", which is a huge gamble and works only rarely and only because of luck.  Nobody knows the "right time."



Ni@@a puhlese...

This. Recession is inevitable. If not 2020 then very soon.

I've pulled out, bought some silver and waiting for shit to hit the fan.

http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?topic=658882.msg9311006#msg9311006

Mr.1derful

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Re: Holding precious metals for this shit?
« Reply #64 on: March 31, 2020, 05:27:09 PM »
Because one has a purpose and one is just a hunk of metal

Sure, that's why it's been money for 5,000 years and central banks are buying it up.

Methyl m1ke

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Re: Holding precious metals for this shit?
« Reply #65 on: March 31, 2020, 05:44:28 PM »
Sure, that's why it's been money for 5,000 years and central banks are buying it up.

Central banks had better be otherwise the currency they print is meaningless.

pellius

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Re: Holding precious metals for this shit?
« Reply #66 on: March 31, 2020, 09:14:41 PM »
Yes, oil is cheap, but who knows how long will it take to get back to say $40 a barrel, and what would you use as a trade vehicle? I’m not saying you’re wrong in your optimism of higher pricing, but you also can‘t just buy and hold oil forever, and it can take years to get back to $40 or it could take weeks. The time and trade vehicle both matter because who knows if something like the S&P will outperform oil in comparison during that timeframe. Are you buying an individual company, an oil service or exploration etf, a leveraged etf or using crude futures/options?

Isn't that what investing in the stock market is all about? Taking risks based on available evidence, past behavior, and the likelihood of your predictions. Does anybody really think that it will take many years for oil to be back up to $40.

If you're not in it for the long haul you shouldn't be in it.

pellius

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Re: Holding precious metals for this shit?
« Reply #67 on: March 31, 2020, 09:19:20 PM »
You are asking Lizzy a lot of question and not listening.

Stereotype's form for a reason. The articles online specifically finger point older investors as the ones who lose the most and buy in at the wrong time. Nobody under 40 knows WTF a cheque is. You have given a the perfect example of exactly who Google and others are calling out in their articles as a warning NOT to buy.......

The information right now is futures are getting obliterated. Buying now is a ticket to losing your money. Be patient. Wait.

I'm asking him just one question. Investors need to fund their account so that they can trade. Why are they less sophisticated because they use a check instead of electronic transfer? We take in about 40 to 60 checks a day, and that's just from walk ins and not counting the checks we get in the mail. And many of them are under 40 years old. I don't know where you get this that people under 40 years old don't even know what a check is. You thing they don't have a checking account?

pellius

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Re: Holding precious metals for this shit?
« Reply #68 on: March 31, 2020, 09:21:48 PM »
Then be less confrontational. (avoid reading the rest of this post unless you're bored.)

I realize your pretty intelligent, it's obvious by the manner in which you converse (as far as conversing on Getbig is concerned.)  Intelligence begets the art of Persuasion my friend. That's usually what you're after, to either sway a person or people from whatever they believe now over to whatever you believe (both could be the same just seen from different perspective and of course the perspective which benefits you the most is the correct one) or to shift their focus to whatever is important to you (and likely not them) and the key to both is the ability to accomplish all this without the other person(s) realizing they are being manipulated.

My friend here worked for Lockheed as an engineer his entire career. He never had another employer in his life (well the navy but that's besides the point.) He ascended fairly high, I think he oversaw 10k people at Vandenburg a site he opened. (I don't know too much about Lockheed but I believe vandenburg is a big missile and testing site for California.)

The point- Mike (My friend) told me the higher you go in business (meaning ascending the ranks of the company) the tougher the people are to leap frog over (to him, a boss is just the next guy to eliminate or partner up with to eliminate someone else and then get eliminated) and he said the biggest most noticeable asset/strength/skill always seemed to be the ability to get others to see things your way. The manager he never got past Mike forgot his name but told me he had figured out some way to save Lockheed a lot of money on a satellite project or something and his (mikes) thinking was that the idea was a slam dunk and it created a position for his boss with the logic being your boss promoted is as good as you getting promoted (assuming your boss doesn't hate you or consider you incompetent) SO Mike went to go see this manager and he gets all his paperwork and blueprints and all that shit (imagine a scientist guy in a suit with coke bottle glasses and all kinds of stuff white and blue papers spilling out his arms in every direction lol.) and runs into him in the lobby (ground floor) so they take the elevator up together and Mike spends a couple minutes explaining to this manager, in Mikes way that  he does this shit where he has an answer or solution to a situation or a problem and it definitely sounds logical and makes perfect sense-except Mike does not ever leave any room for a plan B and if the situation changes his idea probably has to be totally reworked. But over time Mike seems to have developed his own method for getting people to think and do what he wants (within reason.)

As Mike tells the story when they get to the managers office the manager wishes him luck and closes his office door and Mike gets back on the elevator and says for a few minutes he was really excited because the manager agreed with him and validated his logic and all of that. but then after some time Mike realizes that the manager actually rejected his entire idea and instead sold him on this other idea and on top of that- he made Mike think it was actually Mike's idea all along.

Mike has told this story COUNTLESS TIMES I wish I had more particulars but it seems Mike hit his theoretical ceiling or his mental limits and for him, that's very memorable. Anyway I just wrote all of that maybe because im a little bored and maybe because i can type 138 wpm and typing is actually very therapeutic for me and possibly just because i know Kwon will read every single word of it.

Point being you are getting into endless circular nonsense with people mostly because you both say "im right and this is my proof" but usually you cannot both be right. so one of you has to concede that the other person is more right and this is usualy in the form of more accurate data or obvious flaws in logic.

however, people are pretty stubborn. if you can really master persuading people to agree with whatever you do, make them value what you value and find important what you do you'll be like the king of the world man. food for thought perhaps.

Give an example of me being confrontational. I asked a simple question freely admitting that I am no expert and that Lizzy seems more informed in these matters than I am. So many people here taking offense of being questioned and asked to defend or provide evidence for their position.

And, as I have stated many times, I am not as concerned about persuading anybody or winning an argument but rather clarity. To be crystal clear what a person's position is and to get to the truth. I have been wrong many times and forced to change my views in light of new evidence that I wasn't aware of. If I lose an argument I consider myself the winner as I am now a wise person than I was before.

pellius

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Re: Holding precious metals for this shit?
« Reply #69 on: March 31, 2020, 09:32:43 PM »
value is determined by whoever agrees to buy it

its worth a lot to the Gods the Sumerians worshipped. it's worth exactly nothing to me. in fact it's heavy as fuck so less than nothing.

Exactly. The duct-taped banana art piece was worth $120,000 because someone was willing to pay it. Johnny Carson was asked what made he think he deserved five million a year for doing a one-hour talk show. He replied, "Because I can get it."

The problem arise when a third party, that has no vested interest, suffers none of the consequence if things go awry, tries to dictate the terms mutually agreed to by the borrow and seller. How much they think you should pay or receive.

The biggest offenders in this regard is obviously the government.

pellius

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Re: Holding precious metals for this shit?
« Reply #70 on: March 31, 2020, 09:34:44 PM »
Just because old, technology challenged people use paper checks to buy into the stock market today, it doesn't follow that they are unsophisticated investors.

Likewise, just because a person has millions in the bank, it doesn't follow that this person is a sophisticated investor.

In times such as this, most people who are already invested in the stock market will be afraid and tempted to sell their stock.  And most people who are not already invested in the stock market will be afraid to buy stocks.  Others will try to time the market:  Get out at the "right time", then get back in at the "right time", which is a huge gamble and works only rarely and only because of luck.  Nobody knows the "right time."

Better thing to do is to buy and hold, as early as possible, as often as possible, and as much as possible, rain or shine:

1. A whole US stock market index fund or an S&P 500 Index fund
2. A whole US bond market index fund
3. A whole International stock market index fund

That's after paying off all consumer debt and accumulating a year worth of expenses in a savings account and CDs for true emergencies.

How is your stock portfolio looking?

Rambone

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Re: Holding precious metals for this shit?
« Reply #71 on: April 01, 2020, 02:50:11 AM »
Isn't that what investing in the stock market is all about? Taking risks based on available evidence, past behavior, and the likelihood of your predictions. Does anybody really think that it will take many years for oil to be back up to $40.

If you're not in it for the long haul you shouldn't be in it.

You didn’t answer my question. What trading vehicle would you use to do so? From a trader’s perspective, when somebody says to buy oil, it means to buy future contracts which have an expiration. Is that your suggested move? You talk about the long haul, yet if you’re trading physical oil, there is a cost to hold meaning that your timing is very important and that you would need a move sooner rather than later.

pellius

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Re: Holding precious metals for this shit?
« Reply #72 on: April 01, 2020, 03:06:29 AM »
You didn’t answer my question. What trading vehicle would you use to do so? From a trader’s perspective, when somebody says to buy oil, it means to buy future contracts which have an expiration. Is that your suggested move? You talk about the long haul, yet if you’re trading physical oil, there is a cost to hold meaning that your timing is very important and that you would need a move sooner rather than later.

I don't feel qualified to give any advice or strategy in investing. My only argument was that I think it is unlikely that oil will remain at $20/barrel and will eventually go up.

Before our office was closed at TD Ameritrade we got a real uptick in people coming in opening new accounts and those funding existing accounts so that they could buy while the market is low. Some think that's smart others don't but looking at their accounts they seem to know what they're doing. One person told me that he's been through this before and just rides it out.

Last day at the office before it was closed. It was a rainy dreary day.

 

Rambone

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Re: Holding precious metals for this shit?
« Reply #73 on: April 01, 2020, 03:18:01 AM »
I don't feel qualified to give any advice or strategy in investing. My only argument was that I think it is unlikely that oil will remain at $20/barrel and will eventually go up.

Before our office was closed at TD Ameritrade we got a real uptick in people coming in opening new accounts and those funding existing accounts so that they could buy while the market is low. Some think that's smart others don't but looking at their accounts they seem to know what they're doing. One person told me that he's been through this before and just rides it out.

Last day at the office before it was closed. It was a rainy dreary day.

 

I agree with that as well, but my point is that the time that it takes for that to happen matters since you can’t just buy and sell oil without a drag in terms of holding it. Buying XLE would be a decent play although it’s not a 1:1 correlation to oil, but it’s close enough plus you’d be collected the dividend (although they will be cut by most companies) as you wait for the positive move up.

loco

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Re: Holding precious metals for this shit?
« Reply #74 on: April 01, 2020, 07:17:52 AM »
How is your stock portfolio looking?

On target, and exactly as expected.  This ain't my first rodeo.  Thank you for asking, and good luck to you!

If you are interested in learning about investing in the stock market, read this free book written by a knowledgeable wealthy investor who isn't interested in making money selling books.  Don't let the word "Millennials" in the title fool you or turn you off.  Any beginner at any age will learn a great deal from it.

http://tuttle.merc.iastate.edu/Bernstein_If_You_Can.pdf