Author Topic: Afghanistan - USA pulls out and Taliban moves in right away  (Read 26701 times)

BBSSchlemiel

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Re: Afghanistan.
« Reply #175 on: August 16, 2021, 12:11:45 PM »
I’m no economist or political science major, but it seems Chinas political system of today, is the fascism of Nazi Germany.

Pretty much. They’re a National Socialist country, communist in name only.

Thin Lizzy

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Re: Afghanistan.
« Reply #176 on: August 16, 2021, 12:20:48 PM »
Yeah, China for me too. The worse case scenario during our lifetimes is that the US elite joins forces with the Chinese Communist party and People's Liberation Army to divide up the world. Still, despite advances, the Chinese have somewhere to go to catch up with the US militarily ie they've only started work on their first nuclear powered aircraft carrier -  a ship type the US has operated since the 60's and of which they currently operate 10.

 Muslims ,though useful as pawns by the great powers, have never been a force in the world ,since the fall and dismemberment of the Ottoman Empire after World War I - maybe even earlier.

Particularly, worth noting, that since America's complete abandonment of the gold standard(1973) and the 1973 oil crisis,the US financial system has been backed by the petro-dollar. Here the US bought oil from the Arabs and in turn the Arabs reinvested the money into US bonds and the US economy. Indeed,it's the biggest protection racket in the history of the world. This to me more than anything signals the relative powerless of Muslims.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Petrodollar_recycling#1974%E2%80%931981_surge

The whole sequence of events during that time has always been sold to the general public as the Muslim Gulf Arabs,lead by Saudi Arabia, ultimately calling the shots to the US, by placing an oil embargo ,due to their anger at America's support of Israel ,during the Yom Kippur War(1973). On the other hand, the actual long-term economic facts indicates those actions to be pure theatre.

You hit the nail on the head as the real root cause of a lot of the countries’ problems is a fiat money system. With the government not being held to any kind of standard they’re going to always spend too much and as a result there will always need to be some crisis ginned up in order to print more money. Covid being the latest.

The next will probably be another war which is why I suspect we might see a draft again in our lifetimes.

Kwon

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Re: Afghanistan.
« Reply #177 on: August 16, 2021, 12:25:03 PM »
You hit the nail on the head as the real root cause of a lot of the countries’ problems is a fiat money system. With the government not being held to any kind of standard they’re going to always spend too much and as a result there will always need to be some crisis ginned up in order to print more money. Covid being the latest.

The next will probably be another war which is why I suspect we might see a draft again in our lifetimes.

I hope the next war will be soon.


Would love if there was another World War culling the worlds population by 50 %.
Q

IroNat

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Re: Afghanistan.
« Reply #178 on: August 16, 2021, 12:26:36 PM »
Absolutely. I am also not knocking anyone of our brave service men and women (past or present). I have family that served/still serve.

But I honestly wonder why they did take the draft away? Many countries require service.

Maybe that's the freedom they are touting now. We have supposedly been free since 1776.

I love my country, but hypocrisy can easily be spotted.

That's why I believe that they (goverment) will have carte blanche in the future, to continue to amend the Constitution. "Well, our forefathers did live in a different time", they will say.

The Constitution, in reality, is a relic that they can play both sides with, whenever they want.

Removing the draft allowed the government and military much greater freedom in operations because it no longer had to deal with citizen soldiers and people who protested the draft, and who would question operations and war.

People don't like to be forced into fighting foolish wars but if you volunteer you can't complain.  You signed up!

Don't complain about your son getting killed.  Nobody forced him to join the Marines.

Rome did the same thing when it went from citizen soldiers to permanent and professional armies.

When is the last time you heard of protests against wars in America?

The problem with this is it can create a warrior class and give the military and it's leaders too much power.  The military becomes elite and apart from the ordinary citizens.

King Shizzo

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Re: Afghanistan.
« Reply #179 on: August 16, 2021, 12:32:00 PM »
Removing the draft allowed the government and military much greater freedom in operations because it no longer had to deal with citizen soldiers and people who protested the draft.

People don't like to be forced into fighting foolish wars but if you volunteer you can't complain.  You signed up1

Rome did the same thing when it went for citizen soldiers to permanent and professional armies.

When is the last time you heard of protests against wars in America?

The problem with this is it can create a warrior class and give the military and it's leaders too much power.  The military becomes elite and apart from the ordinary citizens.
That's Part of the problem. We are free, but that "itch" that our dog has, is with our elite soldiers and upper brass. They feel that they have to let the dogs out (No pun intended) every so often, to justify the huge spending budget for the military.

Then again, are the books really the books? Obviously not.

IroNat

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Re: Afghanistan - USA pulls out and Taliban moves in right away
« Reply #180 on: August 16, 2021, 12:47:43 PM »
One benefit of fighting endless wars is that it hones the edge of the military.

The soldiers become experienced fighters and the military progresses in tactics and tech.

It costs too much though and eventually it bankrupts the country.

King Shizzo

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Re: Afghanistan - USA pulls out and Taliban moves in right away
« Reply #181 on: August 16, 2021, 12:50:39 PM »
One benefit of fighting endless wars is that it hones the edge of the military.

The soldiers become experienced fighters and the military progresses in tactics and tech.

It costs too much though and eventually it bankrupts the country.
There are no benefits to fighting. What happened to Sparta?, What happened to Rome?
Stop fighting. Start defending. America will last forever.
 

Thin Lizzy

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Re: Afghanistan - USA pulls out and Taliban moves in right away
« Reply #182 on: August 16, 2021, 12:59:36 PM »
Recent war efforts have been mainly nation building exercises and we seem to be pretty piss poor at that.

SOMEPARTS

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Re: Afghanistan - USA pulls out and Taliban moves in right away
« Reply #183 on: August 16, 2021, 01:21:51 PM »
Has the mushmouth spoken yet?

Is he taking any questions?



EDIT:

Can Straw and Lurker please explain what this guy is saying?

ThisisOverload

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Re: Afghanistan.
« Reply #184 on: August 16, 2021, 01:33:05 PM »
We should have never been there (Afghanistan) in the first place.

9/11 occurred, we had the smartest president in the history of the US (George Bush Jr) declare war on Iraq (a country that had nothing to do with the 9/11 attacks). We take down Saddam Hussein (again, a guy that had nothing to do with 9/11, nor did Iraq have weapons of mass destruction) and destabilized the region, but didn't actually attack Al-Qaeda. $2 Trillion dollars was spent in the Iraq war alone.

We then assume the terrorists behind the 9/11 attacks were hiding in Afghanistan. We stage a "made-for-TV" attack on Afghanistan were fighter jets fired missiles at a bunch of mountain areas that have probable caves beneath them. This gets the American people all riled up and cheerful. Slowly, Americans that actually read, realized that Afghanistan has never been conquered. Deemed the "graveyard of empires", it's a black hole for military conquests. Today, we have tallied up about $2.5+ Trillion in our efforts within Afghanistan. After 20 years in that country, it took the Taliban a few days to take it right back.

Meanwhile, Osama Bin Laden was hiding in that Shangri-La of a place we call Pakistan. The USA didn't decide to annihilate Pakistan. Why not? Maybe, just maybe, the region didn't provide it with any key resources to further US interests. Who the fuck knows?!? What's worse is that we didn't even give Osama Bin Laden a rightful funeral. Osama Bin Laden's corpse should have been brought to the World Trade Center site, his arms and legs cemented into the center grounds between where the 2 World Trade Center buildings stood and should have had his bare face and torso left to open air so that all victims who lost family members can walk by on a daily basis and urinate or defecate onto his face/chest and furthermore post onto their social media apps. This is heroic. This is the American way. But no, instead he gets a proper burial by sea!?! Why???

Sorry for the rant, but all of this is just so fucking disturbing when you think about it all. Our US national debt is at about $28.6 Trillion (https://www.usdebtclock.org/#), to think that about 17.5% of our National debt can be attributed to these 2 bullshit "WARS" in Irag & Afghanistan (accounting for about $5 Trillion) is absolute madness.

What did we accomplish with these wars aside from losing so many of our American brothers & sisters in the process and amassing massive debt today that becomes tomorrow's taxes for our children? We are chipping away at the quality of life that our future generations can have by funding these "wars" for the ultra rich and massive government institutions.

I say we pull out of Afghanistan and close the fucking book on it. We had no business in Vietnam, just as we had no business in Iraq or Afghanistan.

"1"

Agreed.

If you look at the process that took place after 9/11, it's all been one big shit show.

Most Americans are too stupid to think for themselves, so they believed all the nonsense they were fed.

Pack up and leave the middle east. Focus on our problems here in the US.

SOMEPARTS

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Re: Afghanistan - USA pulls out and Taliban moves in right away
« Reply #185 on: August 16, 2021, 01:34:05 PM »
No questions taken.

Did this script reading idiot just say we are bringing tens of thousands of Afghans to the USA?

SOMEPARTS

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Re: Afghanistan.
« Reply #186 on: August 16, 2021, 01:36:33 PM »
Focus on our problems here in the US.


Most of the problems we have acquired in the last 20 years are the result of too much govt, not like they are going to get out of the fuckery business.

King Shizzo

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Re: Afghanistan.
« Reply #187 on: August 16, 2021, 01:39:43 PM »
Agreed.

If you look at the process that took place after 9/11, it's all been one big shit show.

Most Americans are too stupid to think for themselves, so they believed all the nonsense they were fed.

Pack up and leave the middle east. Focus on our problems here in the US.
I don't agree with your post. 9/11 deserved a response. They just had no idea what the fuck to do. We got blindsided. But our enemies have known for many years, due to diplomacy, that we have backed ourselves into a corner.

You can't be a gentle killer.

Megalodon

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Re: Afghanistan.
« Reply #188 on: August 16, 2021, 01:42:36 PM »


Sooo... you're saying that actually the Taliban have some good ideas? 🤔

I'd have to know their stance on TERFs and girl dick.  🤔  :D

Thin Lizzy

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Re: Afghanistan.
« Reply #189 on: August 16, 2021, 01:43:11 PM »

Most of the problems we have acquired in the last 20 years are the result of too much govt, not like they are going to get out of the fuckery business.

One of the biggest took place right after World War II when the government instituted wage price controls. Companies responded by offering healthcare which became pre-tax. Prices started rising. People began retiring, and losing their health plans and couldn’t afford insurance. This paved the way for Medicare which is hopelessly bankrupt.

No questions taken.

Did this script reading idiot just say we are bringing tens of thousands of Afghans to the USA?

Didn’t see it but, Gee, what a surprise😉

OneMoreRep

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Re: Afghanistan.
« Reply #190 on: August 16, 2021, 01:54:50 PM »
Agreed.

If you look at the process that took place after 9/11, it's all been one big shit show.

Most Americans are too stupid to think for themselves, so they believed all the nonsense they were fed.

Pack up and leave the middle east. Focus on our problems here in the US.

Wholeheartedly agree.

We have way too many problems within our nation at the moment to pretend to have the bandwidth to tackle the "supposed" problems of the middle east. I say supposed, because the USA will never get involved in any foreign affairs unless they get something in exchange for their time and money. It's not like the USA has sent troops to Africa to stop the various genocides that have taken place over the years.

Currently, I see America facing too many issues. We have growing Inflation at an alarming rate (CPI rates are continuously increasing on a monthly basis + hard assets like Real Estate & Stocks have been skyrocketing in prices), growing national debt and trade deficit, continuous increases in unemployment, a widening wealth gap between the rich and poor, dollar devaluation and other countries are losing their faith in the USA knowing what they're truly doing. Plus, if matters couldn't get any worse, you have a nation that's divided between the vaccinated and unvaccinated and is furthermore being led by a demented senior citizen that never goes off script. We're in trouble man and Afghanistan is the least of our worries.

For decades we've allowed for the Military–industrial complex to get away with murder given that their strength has lent this nation enough fear-inducing muscle which has made neighboring nations never want to truly fuck with us due to fear of being severely crushed by our military. That has been cool since 1945 following WW2, but now that we're imploding and losing touch of what's important, we can't keep feeding into this bullshit about invading or keeping a military presence in these turd-infested dustbowls we call countries. America needs to stay innovative, keep technologically advanced, make itself a true contender in world trade, keep a smart workforce on hand and continue to build itself as the lead superpower. We've lost sight of what's important. We've become a nation obsessed with celebrity influencers, portraying false lives to our friends via social media, government hand-me-downs and hair-sniffing demented pedophiles.

Somewhere, Xi Jinping and Vladimir Putin are sitting by a fireplace, sipping on Scotch and laughing at the fact that the USA is slowly destroying itself due to shit leadership at the government level and the perpetual carte blanche we've given central banks (ie Federal Reserve).

"1"

ThisisOverload

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Re: Afghanistan.
« Reply #191 on: August 16, 2021, 02:00:22 PM »
I don't agree with your post. 9/11 deserved a response. They just had no idea what the fuck to do. We got blindsided. But our enemies have known for many years, due to diplomacy, that we have backed ourselves into a corner.

You can't be a gentle killer.

Most Americans are too stupid to think for themselves, so they believed all the nonsense they were fed.

ThisisOverload

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Re: Afghanistan.
« Reply #192 on: August 16, 2021, 02:04:00 PM »

Most of the problems we have acquired in the last 20 years are the result of too much govt, not like they are going to get out of the fuckery business.

That's another can of worms. ;D

Wasting trillions of dollars and thousands of human lives on a war for oil and corporate profits is not appropriate.

And with zero facts to back up the war.

I agree with you 100% but i feel our money and resources should always focus on the USA.

Even though over Government will piss it away, at least we may have SOME improvements here. And my friends that died in Iraq and Afghan would still be alive, most likely.


King Shizzo

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Re: Afghanistan.
« Reply #193 on: August 16, 2021, 02:06:53 PM »

Make no mistake,  the U.S. could end things in that region by morning/mourning

Take your pick. We need to abort.

It's time to ignore the cries of foreigners. It weakens us.

tommywishbone

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Re: Afghanistan - USA pulls out and Taliban moves in right away
« Reply #194 on: August 16, 2021, 02:21:53 PM »
 Probably a bad time for an LGBGT rally in Kabul. 
a

ThisisOverload

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Re: Afghanistan.
« Reply #195 on: August 16, 2021, 02:24:48 PM »
Wholeheartedly agree.

We have way too many problems within our nation at the moment to pretend to have the bandwidth to tackle the "supposed" problems of the middle east. I say supposed, because the USA will never get involved in any foreign affairs unless they get something in exchange for their time and money. It's not like the USA has sent troops to Africa to stop the various genocides that have taken place over the years.

Currently, I see America facing too many issues. We have growing Inflation at an alarming rate (CPI rates are continuously increasing on a monthly basis + hard assets like Real Estate & Stocks have been skyrocketing in prices), growing national debt and trade deficit, continuous increases in unemployment, a widening wealth gap between the rich and poor, dollar devaluation and other countries are losing their faith in the USA knowing what they're truly doing. Plus, if matters couldn't get any worse, you have a nation that's divided between the vaccinated and unvaccinated and is furthermore being led by a demented senior citizen that never goes off script. We're in trouble man and Afghanistan is the least of our worries.

For decades we've allowed for the Military–industrial complex to get away with murder given that their strength has lent this nation enough fear-inducing muscle which has made neighboring nations never want to truly fuck with us due to fear of being severely crushed by our military. That has been cool since 1945 following WW2, but now that we're imploding and losing touch of what's important, we can't keep feeding into this bullshit about invading or keeping a military presence in these turd-infested dustbowls we call countries. America needs to stay innovative, keep technologically advanced, make itself a true contender in world trade, keep a smart workforce on hand and continue to build itself as the lead superpower. We've lost sight of what's important. We've become a nation obsessed with celebrity influencers, portraying false lives to our friends via social media, government hand-me-downs and hair-sniffing demented pedophiles.

Somewhere, Xi Jinping and Vladimir Putin are sitting by a fireplace, sipping on Scotch and laughing at the fact that the USA is slowly destroying itself due to shit leadership at the government level and the perpetual carte blanche we've given central banks (ie Federal Reserve).

"1"

Good post.

We are imploding ourselves due to bad direction and leadership. Coupled with a very biased media that is filled with lies and agendas.

What's happening in the USA today will not end well.

I have a lot of friends all over the world and they are all laughing at what is happening here. The whole George Floyd and BLM thing.

The problem my friends overseas have is that what happens in America often trends to other parts of the globe within 5-10 years. More or less.

I was in Mexico over the weekend and everything there is going pretty well, Covid aside. They were asking me about all these racial and social injustices happening in America. They are very confused about the whole white supremacy thing and LGBT+ movement. It was hard for me to explain, but they agreed issues that effect less than one percent of the population should not take precedence. These issues are real but so minor they do not cause problems with our society as a whole. You cannot govern based on the minority.

While they didn't like Trump, they know that things are getting worse here. We talked about all the refugees coming through Mexico. The surge at the border are not Mexicans, they are farther south, also many are African. Anyone can enter Mexico no questions asked. The issue with the surge at our border is Mexico's fault. Their government intentionally sends them to us. They give them nothing, let them in freely and then give them bus rides to border towns. It's all very real.

In Juarez there are thousands of Africans now, it's crazy. They are just trying to get into America. Even the Mexicans are up in arms about it, but the government acts like they don't exist.

I was in Villa Ahumada (middle of nowhere Mexico) to visit a friend. It's a major checkpoint for the Mexican National guard, only main road into Juarez. A bus came in with refugees that got detained. It was a very weird thing to see. In this little town they have old cattle pens that are now build into concrete block walls for detaining people outside. No food or water, out in the 100 degree heat. They are treated like cattle.

But the crazy part is after a few days, they bus these people to a small town East of Juarez and let them go free. They get them away from their towns and place them on the edge of the border so they can walk across. These areas don't have a wall to keep them out.

Anyway, i'm rambling. ;D

King Shizzo

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Re: Afghanistan.
« Reply #196 on: August 16, 2021, 02:29:01 PM »
Good post.

We are imploding ourselves due to bad direction and leadership. Coupled with a very biased media that is filled with lies and agendas.

What's happening in the USA today will not end well.

I have a lot of friends all over the world and they are all laughing at what is happening here. The whole George Floyd and BLM thing.

The problem my friends overseas have is that what happens in America often trends to other parts of the globe within 5-10 years. More or less.

I was in Mexico over the weekend and everything there is going pretty well, Covid aside. They were asking me about all these racial and social injustices happening in America. They are very confused about the whole white supremacy thing and LGBT+ movement. It was hard for me to explain, but they agreed issues that effect less than one percent of the population should not take precedence. These issues are real but so minor they do not cause problems with our society as a whole. You cannot govern based on the minority.

While they didn't like Trump, they know that things are getting worse here. We talked about all the refugees coming through Mexico. The surge at the border are not Mexicans, they are farther south, also many are African. Anyone can enter Mexico no questions asked. The issue with the surge at our border is Mexico's fault. Their government intentionally sends them to us. They give them nothing, let them in freely and then give them bus rides to border towns. It's all very real.

In Juarez there are thousands of Africans now, it's crazy. They are just trying to get into America. Even the Mexicans are up in arms about it, but the government acts like they don't exist.

I was in Villa Ahumada (middle of nowhere Mexico) to visit a friend. It's a major checkpoint for the Mexican National guard, only main road into Juarez. A bus came in with refugees that got detained. It was a very weird thing to see. In this little town they have old cattle pens that are now build into concrete block walls for detaining people outside. No food or water, out in the 100 degree heat. They are treated like cattle.

But the crazy part is after a few days, they bus these people to a small town East of Juarez and let them go free. They get them away from their towns and place them on the edge of the border so they can walk across. These areas don't have a wall to keep them out.

Anyway, i'm rambling. ;D
I was in Mexico over the weekend.... ::)




OneMoreRep

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Re: Afghanistan.
« Reply #197 on: August 16, 2021, 02:31:12 PM »
Good post.

We are imploding ourselves due to bad direction and leadership. Coupled with a very biased media that is filled with lies and agendas.

The problem my friends overseas have is that what happens in America often trends to other parts of the globe within 5-10 years. More or less.

I was in Mexico over the weekend

In Juarez there are thousands of Africans now, it's crazy.

Anyway, i'm rambling. ;D

Our media dances to the beat of the highest bidder.

I agree in that what happens in the USA tends to reoccur in lesser developed nations after a few years. The Mexico situation doesn't surprise me.

"1"

Thin Lizzy

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Re: Afghanistan - USA pulls out and Taliban moves in right away
« Reply #198 on: August 16, 2021, 02:39:21 PM »
Why is Mexico allowing everyone to enter?

Moontrane

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Re: Afghanistan.
« Reply #199 on: August 16, 2021, 03:08:43 PM »
why would they turn a fellow countryman over without evidence of his guilt?  If the US was interested in avoiding war, they could have attempted diplomatic channels first.  But that wouldn't have generated lucrative military contracts.

 I actually don't know - so indulge me - was bin Laden a citizen of Afghanistan?  If so, when did he get his citizenship?

We have a simple disagreement: you believe that, had we provided the Taliban our intel on bin Laden, they would’ve turned him over to us.  I do not believe that.

Discussion of anything downstream (Halliburton, war for oil, US imperialism, is the mandalorain gay, blah, blah) would be pointless.