Afghanistan - USA pulls out and Taliban moves in right away

[SOMEPARTS]

Where are Strawman and Lurkernomore? 

[OneMoreRep]

Crazy part is, we still don't have a clear answer as to what the fuck the USA was doing there for 20 years.

We weren't looking for terrorists behind the 9/11 attacks, as they were never in there to begin with.

Short of that, why else did we continue to poor trillions of dollars into Afghanistan? I've heard the argument of "well once you have all those massive military contracts in place (ie Halliburtons of the world) that employ so many people, you kind of have to keep the machine going as to not cause financial difficulties", but that shouldn't be enough for Americans to keep their mouths shut and cross their hands.

I feel like Americans just take it on the arm with these matters. They blindly accept the fact that every year they are slowly paying more and more in taxes with no good explanation as to where these tax dollars are going.

"1"

[SOMEPARTS]

Crazy part is, we still don't have a clear answer as to what the fuck the USA was doing there for 20 years.

We weren't looking for terrorists behind the 9/11 attacks, as they were never in there to begin with.

Short of that, why else did we continue to poor trillions of dollars into Afghanistan? I've heard the argument of "well once you have all those massive military contracts in place (ie Halliburtons of the world) that employ so many people, you kind of have to keep the machine going as to not cause financial difficulties", but that shouldn't be enough for Americans to keep their mouths shut and cross their hands.

I feel like Americans just take it on the arm with these matters. They blindly accept the fact that every year they are slowly paying more and more in taxes with no good explanation as to where these tax dollars are going.

"1"

We are now in a shift from the resource based military-industrial complex to the pharma-industrial and info-industrial complexes.

Every high level political decision is about keep the troughs full for the pigs that are already there.

[Grape Ape]

Crazy part is, we still don't have a clear answer as to what the fuck the USA was doing there for 20 years.

We weren't looking for terrorists behind the 9/11 attacks, as they were never in there to begin with.

Short of that, why else did we continue to poor trillions of dollars into Afghanistan? I've heard the argument of "well once you have all those massive military contracts in place (ie Halliburtons of the world) that employ so many people, you kind of have to keep the machine going as to not cause financial difficulties", but that shouldn't be enough for Americans to keep their mouths shut and cross their hands.

I feel like Americans just take it on the arm with these matters. They blindly accept the fact that every year they are slowly paying more and more in taxes with no good explanation as to where these tax dollars are going.

"1"

Generals lied, military complex made $.

The fact that the Taliban took it over so fast pretty much shows it was inevitable, no matter how long our presence.

I'm no fan of the Democrats at all....but getting out will save American lives.

Could they have planned this better?  Absolutely - it's a fuck up, and disingenuous to blame the prior admin.

But ultimately is the right move to get out.

[joswift]

Generals lied, military complex made $.

The fact that the Taliban took it over so fast pretty much shows it was inevitable, no matter how long our presence.

I'm no fan of the Democrats at all....but getting out will save American lives.

Could they have planned this better?  Absolutely - it's a fuck up, and disingenuous to blame the prior admin.

But ultimately is the right move to get out.

They can leave it six months until there is another terrorist attack then re-invade and reboot the 20 year cycle.

[Thin Lizzy]

Crazy part is, we still don't have a clear answer as to what the fuck the USA was doing there for 20 years.

We weren't looking for terrorists behind the 9/11 attacks, as they were never in there to begin with.

Short of that, why else did we continue to poor trillions of dollars into Afghanistan? I've heard the argument of "well once you have all those massive military contracts in place (ie Halliburtons of the world) that employ so many people, you kind of have to keep the machine going as to not cause financial difficulties", but that shouldn't be enough for Americans to keep their mouths shut and cross their hands.

I feel like Americans just take it on the arm with these matters. They blindly accept the fact that every year they are slowly paying more and more in taxes with no good explanation as to where these tax dollars are going.

"1"

Unless you have friends or family over there you’re not really being affected by it. If they were to bring back the draft and, in the name of equality, include women you’d see the real popularity of these wars.

[OneMoreRep]

Unless you have friends or family over there you’re not really being affected by it. If they were to bring back the draft and, in the name of equality, include women you’d see the real popularity of these wars.

I think all Americans are affected by it in one way or another. The most obvious way is by taxes. These wars are funded through our tax dollars. The spending this country has done on both Iraq & Afghanistan totaled close to $5 Trillion dollars. Our national debt is partly as high as it is due to these expenditures, expenditures which we are still trying to pay down.

I don't want any draft.

"1"

[Thin Lizzy]

I think all Americans are affected by it in one way or another. The most obvious way is by taxes. These wars are funded through our tax dollars. The spending this country has done on both Iraq & Afghanistan totaled close to $5 Trillion dollars. Our national debt is partly as high as it is due to these expenditures, expenditures which we are still trying to pay down.

I don't want any draft.

"1"

They’re funded primarily through central bank money printing and inflation which is not as obvious. I’m certainly not telling you something you don’t already know.

[loco]

[Megalodon]

The "Biden"(puppet) administration and the Taliban agree on gun control.

[Humble Narcissist]

I think all Americans are affected by it in one way or another. The most obvious way is by taxes. These wars are funded through our tax dollars. The spending this country has done on both Iraq & Afghanistan totaled close to $5 Trillion dollars. Our national debt is partly as high as it is due to these expenditures, expenditures which we are still trying to pay down.

I don't want any draft.

"1"

We left a shitload of military equipment over there like Humvees.  You would think we would have taken that stuff home with us before leaving.

[OneMoreRep]

They’re funded primarily through central bank money printing and inflation which is not as obvious. I’m certainly not telling you something you don’t already know.

Absolutely. Taxes come in many forms. You can create a new tax to fund government spending or pay national debt. You can also get that same money that taxes would have gathered through the back door.

Federal reserve monetizing debt --> which leads to additional currency created that is --> then utilized for war funding --> you ultimately increase circulating money supply --> which leads to inflation (following increase in the velocity of money)--> which in itself is a tax on the money that people currently hold in their wallets and pocketbooks.

If "money printing" leads to a decrease in the overall purchasing power of money, we've got a hidden tax given that the government will still collect more money from sales tax as well as income taxes when your salary is adjusted for inflation.

"1"

[Thin Lizzy]

So, where does this rank as far as  biggest military blunders in US history?

[Humble Narcissist]

So, where does this rank as far as  biggest military blunders in US history?

Probably #2 to the Civil War.

[OneMoreRep]

So, where does this rank as far as  biggest military blunders in US history?

Hmm, forgetting overall costs for a moment and instead considering the amount of US military deaths and actual GAIN from the war, I think it ranks at #4.

Echoing Humble Narcissist, the #1 absolute biggest military blunder must have been the Civil War with over 750,000 Americans lost in a stupid battle.

Vietnam should be the #2 shittiest military blunder for the US. We lost over 58,220 soldiers in Vietnam. Fuck did we accomplish? Why were we even there besides the notion of stopping the spread of communism?

The Iraq War probably ranks at #3. We lost 4,410 soldiers in that "war". Why were we there? We "thought" they had weapons of mass destruction and also felt there might have been some ties to the terrorist attacks of 9/11. Ultimately, we removed Saddam Hussein and destabilized the region, but hey it only cost us the lives of 4,410 Americans.

At my #4 is certainly the Afghanistan "war". We wasted 20 years in an area that has been known as the "graveyard of empires" and have lost about 2,500 American soldiers. Why were we there? Oh, just chasing after imaginary terrorists that were never there to begin with. 20 years later, we start to leave and the area gets overturned by the Taliban in a few days.

Some wars have been instrumental in our rise as the superpower that we are today, hence why I didn't mention a bunch of them regardless of American casualties. For instance, World War 2 allowed for us to fly in at the perfect time to reap the rewards of being instrumental for good to win over evil. That same card we played allowed for us to become the dominant world empire since 1945. Sadly, I think we are on the tail end of our glorious era. Much like the British and Dutch empires before us, we are committing the same mistakes and going down the same path.

"1"

[ThisisOverload]

We left a shitload of military equipment over there like Humvees.  You would think we would have taken that stuff home with us before leaving.

That's normal.

We've done that in a lot of wars over the years.

There are fields of our surface equipment still on display in Cambodia and Vietnam.

They will just make more.

[tommywishbone]

Probably #2 to the Civil War.

HAHAHAHA

[Hypertrophy]

Crazy part is, we still don't have a clear answer as to what the fuck the USA was doing there for 20 years.

We weren't looking for terrorists behind the 9/11 attacks, as they were never in there to begin with.

Short of that, why else did we continue to poor trillions of dollars into Afghanistan? I've heard the argument of "well once you have all those massive military contracts in place (ie Halliburtons of the world) that employ so many people, you kind of have to keep the machine going as to not cause financial difficulties", but that shouldn't be enough for Americans to keep their mouths shut and cross their hands.

I feel like Americans just take it on the arm with these matters. They blindly accept the fact that every year they are slowly paying more and more in taxes with no good explanation as to where these tax dollars are going.

"1"

We were there just to spend money with defense contractors.


I was at a defense expo in Poland two years ago and I shared a booth called the "American Pavilion". This is where a number of US companies, mine included, were able to setup shop at a reduced cost. I happened to strike up a conversation with a guy in the booth area who represented a soldier tracking system company and found out he had served two tours in Afghanistan.


He gave me the rundown. After about a year or two there the mission went from finding Bin Laden and beating up the Taliban to simply occupying the country and hoping the US could turn it into a democracy (or more accurately a republic). He said that was pretty much impossible given the culture and history- so he realized that it was just another endless war the US was in (his words).


His job there was to act as a scout and call in airstrikes on enemy positions. He told me that he was involved in at least 100 missions where US planes bombed the Hell out of terrorist training camps- but as soon as one was blown up another quickly formed. Seems there was no shortage of radicals.


The only people who made out after 20 years were defense contactors, politicians who got kickbacks, and local Afghani officials who were corrupt as all get out.

[ThisisOverload]

We were there just to spend money with defense contractors.


I was at a defense expo in Poland two years ago and I shared a booth called the "American Pavilion". This is where a number of US companies, mine included, were able to setup shop at a reduced cost. I happened to strike up a conversation with a guy in the booth area who represented a soldier tracking system company and found out he had served two tours in Afghanistan.


He gave me the rundown. After about a year or two there the mission went from finding Bin Laden and beating up the Taliban to simply occupying the country and hoping the US could turn it into a democratic country. He said that was pretty much impossible given the culture and history- so he realized that it was just another endless war the US was in (his words).


His job there was to act as a scout and call in airstrikes on enemy positions. He told me that he was involved in at least 100 missions where US planes bombed the Hell out of terrorist training camps- but as soon as one was blown up another quickly formed. Seems there was no shortage of radicals.


The only people who made out after 20 years were defense contactors, politicians who got kickbacks, and local Afghani officials who were corrupt as all get out.

Sounds about right.

I've known a few "contractors" from the area.

Similar stories.

[OneMoreRep]

We were there just to spend money with defense contractors.


I was at a defense expo in Poland two years ago and I shared a booth called the "American Pavilion". This is where a number of US companies, mine included, were able to setup shop at a reduced cost. I happened to strike up a conversation with a guy in the booth area who represented a soldier tracking system company and found out he had served two tours in Afghanistan.


He gave me the rundown. After about a year or two there the mission went from finding Bin Laden and beating up the Taliban to simply occupying the country and hoping the US could turn it into a democracy (or more accurately a republic). He said that was pretty much impossible given the culture and history- so he realized that it was just another endless war the US was in (his words).


His job there was to act as a scout and call in airstrikes on enemy positions. He told me that he was involved in at least 100 missions where US planes bombed the Hell out of terrorist training camps- but as soon as one was blown up another quickly formed. Seems there was no shortage of radicals.


The only people who made out after 20 years were defense contactors, politicians who got kickbacks, and local Afghani officials who were corrupt as all get out.

Makes me wish I had gotten into that line of work when younger. Devote 10-15 years of your life to that line of work and you're set for life.

"1"

[Humble Narcissist]

Hmm, forgetting overall costs for a moment and instead considering the amount of US military deaths and actual GAIN from the war, I think it ranks at #4.

Echoing Humble Narcissist, the #1 absolute biggest military blunder must have been the Civil War with over 750,000 Americans lost in a stupid battle.

Vietnam should be the #2 shittiest military blunder for the US. We lost over 58,220 soldiers in Vietnam. Fuck did we accomplish? Why were we even there besides the notion of stopping the spread of communism?

The Iraq War probably ranks at #3. We lost 4,410 soldiers in that "war". Why were we there? We "thought" they had weapons of mass destruction and also felt there might have been some ties to the terrorist attacks of 9/11. Ultimately, we removed Saddam Hussein and destabilized the region, but hey it only cost us the lives of 4,410 Americans.

At my #4 is certainly the Afghanistan "war". We wasted 20 years in an area that has been known as the "graveyard of empires" and have lost about 2,500 American soldiers. Why were we there? Oh, just chasing after imaginary terrorists that were never there to begin with. 20 years later, we start to leave and the area gets overturned by the Taliban in a few days.

Some wars have been instrumental in our rise as the superpower that we are today, hence why I didn't mention a bunch of them regardless of American casualties. For instance, World War 2 allowed for us to fly in at the perfect time to reap the rewards of being instrumental for good to win over evil. That same card we played allowed for us to become the dominant world empire since 1945. Sadly, I think we are on the tail end of our glorious era. Much like the British and Dutch empires before us, we are committing the same mistakes and going down the same path.

"1"

WW1 was a huge blunder as well.  With the exception of WW2 which made the US a world power, all wars seem to be blunders.

[Hypertrophy]

Makes me wish I had gotten into that line of work when younger. Devote 10-15 years of your life to that line of work and you're set for life.

"1"

The amount of money to be made is sick. Seems there is no end to how much countries will spend to kill each other.


One day an entourage of Iraqi generals came through the expo with a shopping list for weaponry. They stood in front of a missile booth (full scale btw) and were in negotiations to buy a shitload. It was no different than grocery shopping.


I also chanced to talk to a guy from Lockheed Martin who had an F16 parked in his pavilion area! I asked if he had sold any yet and he laughed- the US government is giving aid to Poland but in return they have to spend it with US companies. So Lockheed was there to meet and greet.


BTW you don't have to make bombs to sell at these trade shows- they have everything from boots, tents, food, RV's, you name it. It's a regular Walmart of war stuff, lol

[IroNat]

Crazy part is, we still don't have a clear answer as to what the fuck the USA was doing there for 20 years.

We weren't looking for terrorists behind the 9/11 attacks, as they were never in there to begin with.

Short of that, why else did we continue to poor trillions of dollars into Afghanistan? I've heard the argument of "well once you have all those massive military contracts in place (ie Halliburtons of the world) that employ so many people, you kind of have to keep the machine going as to not cause financial difficulties", but that shouldn't be enough for Americans to keep their mouths shut and cross their hands.

I feel like Americans just take it on the arm with these matters. They blindly accept the fact that every year they are slowly paying more and more in taxes with no good explanation as to where these tax dollars are going.

"1"

Afghanistan was seen as a strategic location between Russia and China.

See thread.

http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?topic=674159.msg9628283#msg9628283

[Thin Lizzy]

We were there just to spend money with defense contractors.


I was at a defense expo in Poland two years ago and I shared a booth called the "American Pavilion". This is where a number of US companies, mine included, were able to setup shop at a reduced cost. I happened to strike up a conversation with a guy in the booth area who represented a soldier tracking system company and found out he had served two tours in Afghanistan.


He gave me the rundown. After about a year or two there the mission went from finding Bin Laden and beating up the Taliban to simply occupying the country and hoping the US could turn it into a democracy (or more accurately a republic). He said that was pretty much impossible given the culture and history- so he realized that it was just another endless war the US was in (his words).


His job there was to act as a scout and call in airstrikes on enemy positions. He told me that he was involved in at least 100 missions where US planes bombed the Hell out of terrorist training camps- but as soon as one was blown up another quickly formed. Seems there was no shortage of radicals.


The only people who made out after 20 years were defense contactors, politicians who got kickbacks, and local Afghani officials who were corrupt as all get out.

Anyone who tells you something other than this is just peddling bullshit propaganda.

The amount of money to be made is sick. Seems there is no end to how much countries will spend to kill each other.


One day an entourage of Iraqi generals came through the expo with a shopping list for weaponry. They stood in front of a missile booth (full scale btw) and were in negotiations to buy a shitload. It was no different than grocery shopping.


I also chanced to talk to a guy from Lockheed Martin who had an F16 parked in his pavilion area! I asked if he had sold any yet and he laughed- the US government is giving aid to Poland but in return they have to spend it with US companies. So Lockheed was there to meet and greet.


BTW you don't have to make bombs to sell at these trade shows- they have everything from boots, tents, food, RV's, you name it. It's a regular Walmart of war stuff, lol

This is foreign aid in a nutshell. Really just a kickback to special interests.

[OneMoreRep]

Afghanistan was seen as a strategic location between Russia and China.

See thread.

http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?topic=674159.msg9628283#msg9628283

Will have a read at that!

"1"