Whoa - lots of discussion here - but will try to give some thoughts..
hey Ron being in the business yourself what type of dollars do these supplement companies put up for that type of show and what are the arrangements?
It varies. A lot of the supplement companies want some return for their investment, whether it is seeing their logo on the posters, advertisements, internet boards, magazines, and seeing a good show with traffic. The more people, the better your investment is. That being said, it is tougher to get various companies to sponsor shows, unless they have a lot of traffic, and they are part of a package deal (like an NPC California package where you pay for a number of shows at a time). Some supplement companies, with seeing last year a show with not a lot of traffic or ticket sales, didn't feel like it was worth it this year.
bodybuilding is a "dying" sport. I doubt there's any hardcore conspiracy against anyone here, and I doubt anyone's gonna benefit from this show being cancelled.
There is no conspiracy here. The promoter needs sponsors, he got very few, not able to cover costs, and not enough athletes willing to come to the show to compete. A simple financial decision of losing thousands of dollars now vs. a ton more afterwards.
I would like to think that if and when situations such as this arise, the governing organization can be counted on to step in and ensure that the competition be held as originally planned.
It would be nice to see the IFBB take a more active role in working with a promoter to see if they can sustain the funds, financials and people to see a bodybuilding show. Sort of like the Pro Volleyball federation that makes sure that it is sustained from city to city, and is worth it.
I have word that supplement company's (ie: Muscletech) did not want to put much money to promote the show because of the way it was run last year. They did not see the benefit into putting money into a show that was not properly promoted compared to many other pro shows, that they invest in.
Without naming any company, that is true. They did not see the benefit of putting money into a show which didnt have a lot of traffic. Booths take money, shipping, people to run them, hotel rooms, foods, etc to sustain. Benefit vs. Costs.
Also, Shawn Ray wasn't payed for his "master of ceremonies" work in the same show last year. He slammed the promoter in the magazines for that.
Shawn was paid for the work. What was in dispute was the theory of who is going to pay for a cab ride, and various expenses that were not negotiated in.
Stop blaming the athletes. The IFBB is to blame, period. The promotor should be banned from ever putting on a show again.
It is both. If athletes do not support the show, then the show will not survive. The IFBB should make sure the promoter is financially viable, and perhaps help, not just take a sanction fee. The promoter should not be able to run another show again unless he can prove there are finances and a plan in place. Things happen.
Bob, were you aware of this fact when you went on about him being such a "great guy" tonight?
Winston is a great guy! Really cool! Great influence in bodybuilding. He has a harder time in promoting a show without support of sponsors and athletes.
Bob, the thing I'm saying is, why didn't the athletes rep INSIST on a safeguard to make sure this exact same promoter didn't do the exact same thing, 2 years later?
I think Bob did that in one of his motions that the prize money would be secured.
The fact that you, the rep, don't INSIST on greater accountability is sad. What are you doing to ensure this doesn't happen to the athletes again in 2 years, AGAIN, with the same promoter?
I agree that greater accountability is important. I know that last year, this was a tough situation for the IFBB becase Winston is a great guy, but the finances needed to be in order before the show. It wasn't. At least he cancelled way before instead of right before, or worse, afterwards.
However- Why was he more concerned about talking up Winston tonight, instead of talking up the NEED for athletes to get involved and DEMAND contracts?
Athletes want contracts? Are you serious? I think the promoter would love to have athletes provide them contracts 4-5 months before the show, but the truth is, a few do, because they want to be ready, they want to see who is competing, etc. And they drop out whenever they want. If contracts are a go, should it be BINDING both ways. What will be the consequences? A fine? A suspension? Or can you get a note from a doctor, and be excused because you are not up to par. How many will fall ill a week or two before the competition if they are not ready.
Also, WinFit (our good friend Winston) still has the Toronto Pro on his own website.
This occured today. It takes a few days for the sites to update them. This was not an easy decision for them.
I'm not really seeing the difference here between Winston and james (the promoter of the Orlando Pro show in 2004), except that Winston ran out of funds before James did.
Really? Did Winston not pay the athletes? Did Winston not pay his expenses? No, he did. He owes no one anything. Flights can be rerouted...
One thing I would like to see, Is the IFBB give something back to the promoters, and take more of an active role in helping promote, advertise, etc.
Bob is correct here. Each IFBB show represents the whole in a year. One cancellation doesn't look good for all of the shows. A system of brotherhood is needed with all promoters, and sponsors to ensure that the bodybuilding pro circuit does well.
