Author Topic: Dorian Yates kicks Ronnie's ass Hulkster is a punk Bitch and fuck any truce  (Read 3524034 times)

Necrosis

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Re: Hulkster I'm calling for a Truce
« Reply #22175 on: January 27, 2007, 08:16:26 AM »
again what quality would theory would allow dorian to look better in person then on film but not ronnie, you have to have a theory that offers predictions of this statement. if i guess something someone was thinking it would be telepathy, but with no theory of why, or how, or when it is a moot point. just like for some reason dorian looks better in person and some worse and vice versa, with no explanation as to why that is logical it is not true in a scientific sense. why would he look better in person, and this magic quality if it exsisted would only be in some and not others.

what is this quality, and why does it occur in some, and what predictions can you offer on who will look better then others on different medium. obviously you cant therefore your claim lacks substance and any objectivity again being subjective and offering no support to your claim.

Hulkster

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Re: Hulkster I'm calling for a Truce
« Reply #22176 on: January 27, 2007, 08:26:44 AM »
Quote
again what quality would theory would allow dorian to look better in person then on film but not ronnie,

I know!

bias and stupidity...

 :-\

this has been brought up before but ND is too stupid to understand it.

Flower Boy Ran Away

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Re: Hulkster I'm calling for a Truce
« Reply #22177 on: January 27, 2007, 08:30:50 AM »
it sort of goes along with my argument about ronnie's hardness at the AC vs. the 99 Olympia

they were VERY similar according to the pics and to both sets of screencaps:

but according to ND, there was some magical property that Ronnie has that allows all this extra hardness to hide itelf on film and pics, but reveals itself when you are there in person.

observe:

almost no difference:

if you didn't know before hand which contest he was a lot harder at, could you even tell which pics are from which contest?

probably not.

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Hulkster

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Re: Hulkster I'm calling for a Truce
« Reply #22178 on: January 27, 2007, 08:32:55 AM »
Screencap comparison:

can you tell which contest shows Ronnie looking much harder if you didn't know which contest was which before hand?

I doubt it.
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NarcissisticDeity

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Re: Hulkster I'm calling for a Truce
« Reply #22179 on: January 27, 2007, 08:35:04 AM »
nope im not, ive read one post by him. so what is the point of this thread, i suppose again by your own admission unless you've seen them compete at there best(the poit of the debate) then you cant comment, another moot point since no one has. your truly a moron. i said ronnie is better conditioned fromt he MM pic in the splits then dorian and he is based on the criteria called definition which is the primary criteria in conditioning. shape would be the secondary as poorly conditioned muscles lack shape.

is this the best you have, im owning you badly. thank you for the compliment on intelligence by comparison to preator. heard he was a smart dude from suckmymuscle.

Oh yes you're owning me so badly LMFAO Ronnie 2003 is better conditioned than Dorian and you're owning me? kid keep trying , and again YOU CANNOT comment on Dorian's conditioning unless you were live & in person and even then there are to many variables like when you were sitting , knowing what to look for , and how well your memory is , and then you have the balls to compare it Ronnie 2003 and unless you were there live & in person can you comment on his conditioning and lets say you were there on both occasions now we have to factor in other intangibles like your personal preferences and your memory retention etc, etc

Now seeing that I wasn't there I have a limited resources available and I readily admit this , but going on what I have to work with I proved my case many more times than my adversaries and the parts I can't fully comment on I take ON THE AUTHORITY OF OTHERS more knowledgeable than myself , someone who was live & in person , someone who is objective , and I can post a lot of quotes that favor my point of view and what I've been maintaining all along , I know this whole thread is redundant and the whole argument was redundant but thats why I started this thread , I don't know if Ronnie at his best would beat Dorian at his , I know there odds and probability favor Dorian but in the end its all just an opinion , however my opinion is based more on all the available information and not like my adversaries narrow focus and limited capabilities and not to mention bias


And believe me comparing you to Preator is NO compliment the fact that you think it is raises an eyebrow ( muscle maturity anyone? ) unlike the others Preator knew how to articulate his point of view but that wasn't the problem his point of view was lol so in the end you're only owning yourself I just point it out for you  ;)

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Re: Hulkster I'm calling for a Truce
« Reply #22180 on: January 27, 2007, 08:40:43 AM »
again what quality would theory would allow dorian to look better in person then on film but not ronnie, you have to have a theory that offers predictions of this statement. if i guess something someone was thinking it would be telepathy, but with no theory of why, or how, or when it is a moot point. just like for some reason dorian looks better in person and some worse and vice versa, with no explanation as to why that is logical it is not true in a scientific sense. why would he look better in person, and this magic quality if it exsisted would only be in some and not others.

what is this quality, and why does it occur in some, and what predictions can you offer on who will look better then others on different medium. obviously you cant therefore your claim lacks substance and any objectivity again being subjective and offering no support to your claim.

I've posted a quote that come bodybuilders look better in person than on paper/film and then I posted a bunch of quotes saying specifically Dorian looks better in person than in paper/film and someone like Shawn Ray doesn't , I've never once read this comment applied to Ronnie Coleman and its obvious from the pictures he photographs well , so please spare me the excuses your comparisons and critique of Dorian is limited just as on the authority of others , when you do claim something how much weight does it carry now knowing this?  ;) not much at all.

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Re: Hulkster I'm calling for a Truce
« Reply #22181 on: January 27, 2007, 08:42:30 AM »
I know!

bias and stupidity...

 :-\

this has been brought up before but ND is too stupid to understand it.



Peter McGough Flex Magazine May 2002

Let it be said that the camera can lie at physique contests. Some guys look great onstage but not so great on final film (Dorian Yates, for one) and vice versa (Shawn Ray is an example).


Hulkster you're owned by Peter McGough and moi by proxy  ;)

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Re: Hulkster I'm calling for a Truce
« Reply #22182 on: January 27, 2007, 08:49:27 AM »
I've posted a quote that come bodybuilders look better in person than on paper/film and then I posted a bunch of quotes saying specifically Dorian looks better in person than in paper/film and someone like Shawn Ray doesn't , I've never once read this comment applied to Ronnie Coleman and its obvious from the pictures he photographs well , so please spare me the excuses your comparisons and critique of Dorian is limited just as on the authority of others , when you do claim something how much weight does it carry now knowing this?  ;) not much at all.

your trying to be reductionist and scientific yet your applying a unknown undescribable quality that allows some to photograph better then others, and some to look better on different media, yet have no way of proving it, nor any predictions you can make, nor any variables that allow this quality, nor a name for this quality , nor a test to prove it, basically making an empty argument.

so agian are the quotes from others that were there not as good for some reason, obviously with so much conflicting data and reports its a safe bet to say the pics are the best evidence not the quotes since others have different opinoins and the bias and leaning of certain individuals. if you cant comprehend this then your closed minded. pics dont lie people do.

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Re: Hulkster I'm calling for a Truce
« Reply #22183 on: January 27, 2007, 09:00:37 AM »
your trying to be reductionist and scientific yet your applying a unknown undescribable quality that allows some to photograph better then others, and some to look better on different media, yet have no way of proving it, nor any predictions you can make, nor any variables that allow this quality, nor a name for this quality , nor a test to prove it, basically making an empty argument.

so agian are the quotes from others that were there not as good for some reason, obviously with so much conflicting data and reports its a safe bet to say the pics are the best evidence not the quotes since others have different opinoins and the bias and leaning of certain individuals. if you cant comprehend this then your closed minded. pics dont lie people do.

Again I'll take it on the authority of someone who was there and the irony is I have at least four different quotes from four different people who all agree that Yates doesn't translate as well on film & video , four independant sources confirm each other and thats NOT proof? so it may be ' empty ' to YOU because it contradicts your claim but this for all intents & purposes is as good as it gets regaurdless if you agree or not

And pics don't lie? wow what a limited assessment that , pictures aren't always accurate , they can be deceiving and are just brief moments in the big picture so when you say pics don't lie and people do its a nonsense claim , now the conspricy theories rear their ugly head , thats usually a sign of grasping at straws   but hey you're of the opinion that Ronnie is better conditioned than Yates so you're used to grasping at straws , please refrain from commenting on Dorian's conditioning compared to Ronnie because each time you do you will be laughed at

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Re: Hulkster I'm calling for a Truce
« Reply #22184 on: January 27, 2007, 09:09:03 AM »
Again I'll take it on the authority of someone who was there and the irony is I have at least four different quotes from four different people who all agree that Yates doesn't translate as well on film & video , four independant sources confirm each other and thats NOT proof? so it may be ' empty ' to YOU because it contradicts your claim but this for all intents & purposes is as good as it gets regaurdless if you agree or not

And pics don't lie? wow what a limited assessment that , pictures aren't always accurate , they can be deceiving and are just brief moments in the big picture so when you say pics don't lie and people do its a nonsense claim , now the conspricy theories rear their ugly head , thats usually a sign of grasping at straws   but hey you're of the opinion that Ronnie is better conditioned than Yates so you're used to grasping at straws , please refrain from commenting on Dorian's conditioning compared to Ronnie because each time you do you will be laughed at

dude i already said there are uber quotes from people saying ronnie is great etc. i would imagine that all are more impressive in person because of comparison to ordinary people, contexts etc.

what are you basing dorians better conditioning on? please tell me. there is a round called definition which is seperation, cuts , and striations that compose conditioning. all of which cannot be achieved without huge muscle,low bf, and dryness. so using the criteria(please dont refer to hardness), again using this criteria which is used to judge all shows tell me how he wins global or overall conditioning, ronnie has better conditioning based on the criteria. i will support my assertion but please assert yours.

how is yates better conditioned as a whole?

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Re: Hulkster I'm calling for a Truce
« Reply #22185 on: January 27, 2007, 09:13:43 AM »
so if you have quotes purporting one thing and i the other who is right? we dont know that is why quotes suck, you'd have to judge each person seperatly on knowledge,experiece,perception,and bias something you cant nor i can do. so quotes are moot, stop being a moron.



if yates is better in person, im assuming ronnie is too since theres no name for your magical quality that cannot be measure or quantified, and not even qualitatively measured as there is no standard nor criteria. your showing your lack of intelligence by clinging to these beliefs.

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Re: Hulkster I'm calling for a Truce
« Reply #22186 on: January 27, 2007, 09:22:46 AM »
dude i already said there are uber quotes from people saying ronnie is great etc. i would imagine that all are more impressive in person because of comparison to ordinary people, contexts etc.

what are you basing dorians better conditioning on? please tell me. there is a round called definition which is seperation, cuts , and striations that compose conditioning. all of which cannot be achieved without huge muscle,low bf, and dryness. so using the criteria(please dont refer to hardness), again using this criteria which is used to judge all shows tell me how he wins global or overall conditioning, ronnie has better conditioning based on the criteria. i will support my assertion but please assert yours.

how is yates better conditioned as a whole?

There is NO round called the definition round where do you come up with this nonsense? its called the muscularity round , lmfao definition round yes and in that round part of the criteria is ' muscle maturity '  ;)

I agree that separation , cuts and striations are part of the criteria judges but striations ARE NOT a grea indicator of conditioning/definition whatever term you want to use , and neither is vascularity , striations & vasculairty are both genetic , hence why all bodybuilders don't have striations or extreme vascularity which you may find favorable but we don't judge contests using your fantasy criteria

Dorian is better conditioned why? because he has less subcutaneous fat & water in his muscles and less in his entire body especially compared to Ronnie 2003 , I've posted many , many pictures and quotes from independant sources to back up my claim and to be honest with you feel free to scour these pages to look for them especially considering you're ' new ' to this debate , because franky I've established my point of view to ad nausem and I could care less about ' proving ' anything to you I could care less if you agree or not I like to listen to other peoples point of views and give them a chance but I've heard the broken record you're playing many times before and I did give your opinion a chance until you said Ronnie has better conditioned in 03 than Yates when in fact he wasn't better conditioned to 1998/2001 NEVERMIND Dorian , so after that I corrected you and sent you on you're way , you're still trying to impress me and you've failed , so play on playa when you learn some more maybe I'll entertain your nonsense further  ;) but for now run along and play

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Re: Hulkster I'm calling for a Truce
« Reply #22187 on: January 27, 2007, 09:29:11 AM »
so if you have quotes purporting one thing and i the other who is right? we dont know that is why quotes suck, you'd have to judge each person seperatly on knowledge,experiece,perception,and bias something you cant nor i can do. so quotes are moot, stop being a moron.



if yates is better in person, im assuming ronnie is too since theres no name for your magical quality that cannot be measure or quantified, and not even qualitatively measured as there is no standard nor criteria. your showing your lack of intelligence by clinging to these beliefs.

You have quotes saying Dorian actually looks better in paper/film than in person ? well why didn't you say so ? hell post away and wait for my apology lol

And you do some times have conflicting opinions from informer sources but it all depends on the context in which their stating the opinion and if they're all using the same criteria , I have several quotes from people stating Dorian has the best back ever and other saying Ronnie , who is right? depends on the criteria the people are using to gauge their opinion , so the fact that many are arguing over the point means that they're ' relatively ' the best would be determined by a set criteria and how many would agree that criteria favors one over the other .

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Re: Hulkster I'm calling for a Truce
« Reply #22188 on: January 27, 2007, 09:35:17 AM »
There is NO round called the definition round where do you come up with this nonsense? its called the muscularity round , lmfao definition round yes and in that round part of the criteria is ' muscle maturity '  ;)

I agree that separation , cuts and striations are part of the criteria judges but striations ARE NOT a grea indicator of conditioning/definition whatever term you want to use , and neither is vascularity , striations & vasculairty are both genetic , hence why all bodybuilders don't have striations or extreme vascularity which you may find favorable but we don't judge contests using your fantasy criteria

Dorian is better conditioned why? because he has less subcutaneous fat & water in his muscles and less in his entire body especially compared to Ronnie 2003 , I've posted many , many pictures and quotes from independant sources to back up my claim and to be honest with you feel free to scour these pages to look for them especially considering you're ' new ' to this debate , because franky I've established my point of view to ad nausem and I could care less about ' proving ' anything to you I could care less if you agree or not I like to listen to other peoples point of views and give them a chance but I've heard the broken record you're playing many times before and I did give your opinion a chance until you said Ronnie has better conditioned in 03 than Yates when in fact he wasn't better conditioned to 1998/2001 NEVERMIND Dorian , so after that I corrected you and sent you on you're way , you're still trying to impress me and you've failed , so play on playa when you learn some more maybe I'll entertain your nonsense further  ;) but for now run along and play

well that was a horrible rebuttal agian, just empty claims with no proof and half-truths. definition is the main criteria for conditioning, which according to the ifbb is seperation,cuts,and striations(intramuscular seperation) dryness and hardness are not mentioned, defintion is the by-product of them. size has little to do with conditioning as does symmetry,proportion. shape may be a mild barometer.

SCORE #2--ROUND 2—Muscularity in the 7 Compulsory Poses—20%
WHAT ARE THE JUDGES LOOKING FOR: The judges are looking for size, muscularity, definition and separation based just upon the seven compulsory poses.

PROCEDURE: The athletes will be judged in the seven compulsory poses:


A. Front Double Biceps
B. Front Lat Spread
C. Side Chest
D. Rear Double Bicep
E. Rear Lat Spread
F. Front Abdominal & Thighs
G. Front Most Muscular Crab
The athletes will come out and do the seven compulsory poses individually (when there are more than 20 athletes in a competition, the athletes will be brought out 2 at a time), then be brought out and compared in groups of 2, 3 or 4.


again why is dorian better conditioned, striations and seperation are the paramount variables in conditioning. a person with non striated delts, and chest is marked down. people are being marked down less then striated glutes now adays. striations are not genetic, cutler never started with striated glutes but this year striations are showing, the main reason better glute conditioning.


HAHAHAHAH ARE YOU SAYING THAT MUSCLE FIBERS ARENT STRIATED IN NATURE IN SOME HUMAN BEINGS. OBVIOUSLY IF NOTHING WAS OBSCURING THE MUSCLE STRIATIONS WOULD SHOW ON EVERYONE UNLESS THEY HAVE SOME MUTANT GENES AND HAS NONE STRIATED MUSCLE, YOUR RIGHT IT IS GENETIC, FORTUNATLY IT IS GENETIC IN EVERY HUMAN AHAHAHHAHAHA. you are truly a moron

Because a muscle fiber is not a single cell, its parts are often given special names such as
-sarcolemma for plasma membrane
-sarcoplasmic reticulum for endoplasmic reticulum
-sarcosome for mitochondrion
-sarcoplasm for cytoplasm
although this tends to obscure the essential similarity in structure and function of these structures and those found in other cells.  
The

nuclei and mitochondria are located just beneath the plasma membrane
-the endoplasmic reticulum extends between the myofibrils.
Seen from the side under the microscope, skeletal muscle fibers show a pattern of cross banding, which gives rise to the other name: striated muscle.

The striated appearance of the muscle fiber is created by a pattern of alternating

-dark A bands and
-light I bands.
The A bands are bisected by the H zone ,the I bands are bisected by the Z line

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Re: Hulkster I'm calling for a Truce
« Reply #22189 on: January 27, 2007, 09:40:27 AM »
You have quotes saying Dorian actually looks better in paper/film than in person ? well why didn't you say so ? hell post away and wait for my apology lol

And you do some times have conflicting opinions from informer sources but it all depends on the context in which their stating the opinion and if they're all using the same criteria , I have several quotes from people stating Dorian has the best back ever and other saying Ronnie , who is right? depends on the criteria the people are using to gauge their opinion , so the fact that many are arguing over the point means that they're ' relatively ' the best would be determined by a set criteria and how many would agree that criteria favors one over the other .

my point exactly, thanks for paying attention hence the unknown veracity of the speakers and our relative little knowledge of the personality etc of the speaker makes decinding which quotes to accept/dimiss moot. hence stop posting quotes, hence stick to the pics you said are not a good source of evidence hence your losing the argument.

pics are worthless according to you, even though no one has seen both compete at there best, it is the only way to tell making your 900 pages of arguing completely ridiculous while you knew the difference making you a giant retard or you have no life. then you rest your case on quotes which you again show that the veracity of those medium are pointless making another moot point. then you go back to pics but state that dorian magically looks better in person not giving ronnie this quality only dorian yet offer no axioms to establish your assertion, thus making it pointless and in terms of pure logic, ridiculous.

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Re: Hulkster I'm calling for a Truce
« Reply #22190 on: January 27, 2007, 09:53:43 AM »
my point exactly, thanks for paying attention hence the unknown veracity of the speakers and our relative little knowledge of the personality etc of the speaker makes decinding which quotes to accept/dimiss moot. hence stop posting quotes, hence stick to the pics you said are not a good source of evidence hence your losing the argument.

pics are worthless according to you, even though no one has seen both compete at there best, it is the only way to tell making your 900 pages of arguing completely ridiculous while you knew the difference making you a giant retard or you have no life. then you rest your case on quotes which you again show that the veracity of those medium are pointless making another moot point. then you go back to pics but state that dorian magically looks better in person not giving ronnie this quality only dorian yet offer no axioms to establish your assertion, thus making it pointless and in terms of pure logic, ridiculous.

Quote
you a giant retard or you have no life

I honestly laughed out loud when I read this , all the other garbage is just your brand of rehashed nonsense  , but this quote made me laugh and why? because you're Preator Fenix and your dumbass was owned so badly before you you had to give up and bow down to the superior intellect and leave this thread with your tail between your legs and now you've returned for more of the same punishment under a new " norm de plume " and you call me ' giant retard ' ? talk about irony lol

like before you talked a good game but you still have limited capabilities , especially compared to me , so welcome back under the new name and let me end this with the old adage " the more things change the more the remain the same " you're argument is still flawed and you're still an idiot and even more so than now that you had to create a new name lol

pobrecito

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Re: Hulkster I'm calling for a Truce
« Reply #22191 on: January 27, 2007, 09:58:43 AM »
hahahahahahaha "Isuckdicks" OWNED again by ND hahahahaha.

What a fucking joke, you get owned and make a new account...how original ::)

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Re: Hulkster I'm calling for a Truce
« Reply #22192 on: January 27, 2007, 10:00:49 AM »
Nine-hundred fucking pages of Yates dominance thanks to ND.

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Re: Hulkster I'm calling for a Truce
« Reply #22193 on: January 27, 2007, 10:13:15 AM »
I honestly laughed out loud when I read this , all the other garbage is just your brand of rehashed nonsense  , but this quote made me laugh and why? because you're Preator Fenix and your dumbass was owned so badly before you you had to give up and bow down to the superior intellect and leave this thread with your tail between your legs and now you've returned for more of the same punishment under a new " norm de plume " and you call me ' giant retard ' ? talk about irony lol

like before you talked a good game but you still have limited capabilities , especially compared to me , so welcome back under the new name and let me end this with the old adage " the more things change the more the remain the same " you're argument is still flawed and you're still an idiot and even more so than now that you had to create a new name lol

first make a reply

well that was a horrible rebuttal agian, just empty claims with no proof and half-truths. definition is the main criteria for conditioning, which according to the ifbb is seperation,cuts,and striations(intramuscular seperation) dryness and hardness are not mentioned, defintion is the by-product of them. size has little to do with conditioning as does symmetry,proportion. shape may be a mild barometer.

SCORE #2--ROUND 2—Muscularity in the 7 Compulsory Poses—20%
WHAT ARE THE JUDGES LOOKING FOR: The judges are looking for size, muscularity, definition and separation based just upon the seven compulsory poses.

PROCEDURE: The athletes will be judged in the seven compulsory poses:


A. Front Double Biceps
B. Front Lat Spread
C. Side Chest
D. Rear Double Bicep
E. Rear Lat Spread
F. Front Abdominal & Thighs
G. Front Most Muscular Crab
The athletes will come out and do the seven compulsory poses individually (when there are more than 20 athletes in a competition, the athletes will be brought out 2 at a time), then be brought out and compared in groups of 2, 3 or 4.


again why is dorian better conditioned, striations and seperation are the paramount variables in conditioning. a person with non striated delts, and chest is marked down. people are being marked down less then striated glutes now adays. striations are not genetic, cutler never started with striated glutes but this year striations are showing, the main reason better glute conditioning.


HAHAHAHAH ARE YOU SAYING THAT MUSCLE FIBERS ARENT STRIATED IN NATURE IN SOME HUMAN BEINGS. OBVIOUSLY IF NOTHING WAS OBSCURING THE MUSCLE STRIATIONS WOULD SHOW ON EVERYONE UNLESS THEY HAVE SOME MUTANT GENES AND HAS NONE STRIATED MUSCLE, YOUR RIGHT IT IS GENETIC, FORTUNATLY IT IS GENETIC IN EVERY HUMAN AHAHAHHAHAHA. you are truly a moron

Because a muscle fiber is not a single cell, its parts are often given special names such as
-sarcolemma for plasma membrane
-sarcoplasmic reticulum for endoplasmic reticulum
-sarcosome for mitochondrion
-sarcoplasm for cytoplasm
although this tends to obscure the essential similarity in structure and function of these structures and those found in other cells. 
The

nuclei and mitochondria are located just beneath the plasma membrane
-the endoplasmic reticulum extends between the myofibrils.
Seen from the side under the microscope, skeletal muscle fibers show a pattern of cross banding, which gives rise to the other name: striated muscle.

The striated appearance of the muscle fiber is created by a pattern of alternating

-dark A bands and
-light I bands.
The A bands are bisected by the H zone ,the I bands are bisected by the Z line

and on a second note im not preator, ask NEO we argued for weeks about evolution, religion and ive been a member for over a year, and grill people on the V and am a bastard. i dont know anything about preator. also, you are clearly losing the argument and are starting to dodge posts, however, you claim to be more intelligent yet are being dominated. whatever helps you sleep at night. im not preator, is this your last ploy at remaining in the argument, claim im someone else you;ve argued with to make your position more credible?

please show me were your dominating me. fromt the criteria yates loses. lets go through each one if you want, you arent smart enough to stay with me.

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Re: Hulkster I'm calling for a Truce
« Reply #22194 on: January 27, 2007, 10:18:23 AM »
first make a reply

well that was a horrible rebuttal agian, just empty claims with no proof and half-truths. definition is the main criteria for conditioning, which according to the ifbb is seperation,cuts,and striations(intramuscular seperation) dryness and hardness are not mentioned, defintion is the by-product of them. size has little to do with conditioning as does symmetry,proportion. shape may be a mild barometer.

SCORE #2--ROUND 2—Muscularity in the 7 Compulsory Poses—20%
WHAT ARE THE JUDGES LOOKING FOR: The judges are looking for size, muscularity, definition and separation based just upon the seven compulsory poses.

PROCEDURE: The athletes will be judged in the seven compulsory poses:


A. Front Double Biceps
B. Front Lat Spread
C. Side Chest
D. Rear Double Bicep
E. Rear Lat Spread
F. Front Abdominal & Thighs
G. Front Most Muscular Crab
The athletes will come out and do the seven compulsory poses individually (when there are more than 20 athletes in a competition, the athletes will be brought out 2 at a time), then be brought out and compared in groups of 2, 3 or 4.


again why is dorian better conditioned, striations and seperation are the paramount variables in conditioning. a person with non striated delts, and chest is marked down. people are being marked down less then striated glutes now adays. striations are not genetic, cutler never started with striated glutes but this year striations are showing, the main reason better glute conditioning.


HAHAHAHAH ARE YOU SAYING THAT MUSCLE FIBERS ARENT STRIATED IN NATURE IN SOME HUMAN BEINGS. OBVIOUSLY IF NOTHING WAS OBSCURING THE MUSCLE STRIATIONS WOULD SHOW ON EVERYONE UNLESS THEY HAVE SOME MUTANT GENES AND HAS NONE STRIATED MUSCLE, YOUR RIGHT IT IS GENETIC, FORTUNATLY IT IS GENETIC IN EVERY HUMAN AHAHAHHAHAHA. you are truly a moron

Because a muscle fiber is not a single cell, its parts are often given special names such as
-sarcolemma for plasma membrane
-sarcoplasmic reticulum for endoplasmic reticulum
-sarcosome for mitochondrion
-sarcoplasm for cytoplasm
although this tends to obscure the essential similarity in structure and function of these structures and those found in other cells. 
The

nuclei and mitochondria are located just beneath the plasma membrane
-the endoplasmic reticulum extends between the myofibrils.
Seen from the side under the microscope, skeletal muscle fibers show a pattern of cross banding, which gives rise to the other name: striated muscle.

The striated appearance of the muscle fiber is created by a pattern of alternating

-dark A bands and
-light I bands.
The A bands are bisected by the H zone ,the I bands are bisected by the Z line

and on a second note im not preator, ask NEO we argued for weeks about evolution, religion and ive been a member for over a year, and grill people on the V and am a bastard. i dont know anything about preator. also, you are clearly losing the argument and are starting to dodge posts, however, you claim to be more intelligent yet are being dominated. whatever helps you sleep at night. im not preator, is this your last ploy at remaining in the argument, claim im someone else you;ve argued with to make your position more credible?

please show me were your dominating me. fromt the criteria yates loses. lets go through each one if you want, you arent smart enough to stay with me.

You are owned. Get the fuck out of here kid.

RocketSwitch625

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Re: Hulkster I'm calling for a Truce
« Reply #22195 on: January 27, 2007, 10:34:44 AM »
Nice symetrical traps. LOL

The pot calling the kettle black.




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Re: Hulkster I'm calling for a Truce
« Reply #22196 on: January 27, 2007, 10:44:03 AM »
first make a reply

well that was a horrible rebuttal agian, just empty claims with no proof and half-truths. definition is the main criteria for conditioning, which according to the ifbb is seperation,cuts,and striations(intramuscular seperation) dryness and hardness are not mentioned, defintion is the by-product of them. size has little to do with conditioning as does symmetry,proportion. shape may be a mild barometer.

SCORE #2--ROUND 2—Muscularity in the 7 Compulsory Poses—20%
WHAT ARE THE JUDGES LOOKING FOR: The judges are looking for size, muscularity, definition and separation based just upon the seven compulsory poses.

PROCEDURE: The athletes will be judged in the seven compulsory poses:


A. Front Double Biceps
B. Front Lat Spread
C. Side Chest
D. Rear Double Bicep
E. Rear Lat Spread
F. Front Abdominal & Thighs
G. Front Most Muscular Crab
The athletes will come out and do the seven compulsory poses individually (when there are more than 20 athletes in a competition, the athletes will be brought out 2 at a time), then be brought out and compared in groups of 2, 3 or 4.


again why is dorian better conditioned, striations and seperation are the paramount variables in conditioning. a person with non striated delts, and chest is marked down. people are being marked down less then striated glutes now adays. striations are not genetic, cutler never started with striated glutes but this year striations are showing, the main reason better glute conditioning.


HAHAHAHAH ARE YOU SAYING THAT MUSCLE FIBERS ARENT STRIATED IN NATURE IN SOME HUMAN BEINGS. OBVIOUSLY IF NOTHING WAS OBSCURING THE MUSCLE STRIATIONS WOULD SHOW ON EVERYONE UNLESS THEY HAVE SOME MUTANT GENES AND HAS NONE STRIATED MUSCLE, YOUR RIGHT IT IS GENETIC, FORTUNATLY IT IS GENETIC IN EVERY HUMAN AHAHAHHAHAHA. you are truly a moron

Because a muscle fiber is not a single cell, its parts are often given special names such as
-sarcolemma for plasma membrane
-sarcoplasmic reticulum for endoplasmic reticulum
-sarcosome for mitochondrion
-sarcoplasm for cytoplasm
although this tends to obscure the essential similarity in structure and function of these structures and those found in other cells. 
The

nuclei and mitochondria are located just beneath the plasma membrane
-the endoplasmic reticulum extends between the myofibrils.
Seen from the side under the microscope, skeletal muscle fibers show a pattern of cross banding, which gives rise to the other name: striated muscle.

The striated appearance of the muscle fiber is created by a pattern of alternating

-dark A bands and
-light I bands.
The A bands are bisected by the H zone ,the I bands are bisected by the Z line

and on a second note im not preator, ask NEO we argued for weeks about evolution, religion and ive been a member for over a year, and grill people on the V and am a bastard. i dont know anything about preator. also, you are clearly losing the argument and are starting to dodge posts, however, you claim to be more intelligent yet are being dominated. whatever helps you sleep at night. im not preator, is this your last ploy at remaining in the argument, claim im someone else you;ve argued with to make your position more credible?

please show me were your dominating me. fromt the criteria yates loses. lets go through each one if you want, you arent smart enough to stay with me.


Quote
first make a reply

well that was a horrible rebuttal agian, just empty claims with no proof and half-truths. definition is the main criteria for conditioning, which according to the ifbb is seperation,cuts,and striations(intramuscular seperation) dryness and hardness are not mentioned, defintion is the by-product of them. size has little to do with conditioning as does symmetry,proportion. shape may be a mild barometer.

You have NO proof that Dorian looked just as good on film/paper than he did live & in person YET you continue to use pictures & video as a 100% accurate depiction of his conditioning and its faulty , you already lost your argument because you don't have all the required information , its lacking and you refuse to take on authority others opinions that Yates simply looks much better in person so stop insisting Dorian's conditioning is lacking compared to Ronnie's because its a retarded statement based on limited resources which aren't 100% factual , here is the Offical IFBB judging criteria and NO WHERE does it mention striations or aesthetics which you have argued are part of the criteria

When assessing a competitor’s physique, a judge should follow a
routine procedure which will allow a comprehensive assessment of
the physique as a whole. During the comparisons of the
compulsory poses, the judge should first look at the primary
muscle group being displayed. The judge should then survey the
whole physique, starting from the head, and looking at every part
of the physique in a downward sequence, beginning with general
impressions, and looking for muscular bulk, balanced
development, muscular density and definition. The downward
survey should take in the head, neck, shoulders, chest, all of the
arm muscles, front of the trunk for pectorals, pec-delt tie-in,
abdominals, waist, thighs, legs, calves and feet. The same
procedure for back poses will also take in the upper and lower
trapezius, teres and infraspinatus, erector spinae, the gluteus
group, the leg biceps group at the back of the thighs, calves, and
feet. A detailed assessment of the various muscle groups should
be made during the comparisons, at which time it helps the judge
to compare muscle shape, density, and definition while still
bearing in mind the competitor’s overall balanced development.
The comparisons of the compulsory poses cannot be overemphasized
as these comparisons will help the judge to decide
which competitor has the superior physique from the standpoint of
muscular bulk, balanced development, muscular density and
definition.

Front Double Biceps (see Figure 1)
Standing face front to the judges, with the legs and feet
in-line and a short distance apart, the competitor will raise
both arms to shoulder level and bend them at the elbows.
The hands should be clenched and turned down so as to
cause a contraction of the biceps and forearm muscles,
which are the main muscle groups that are to be assessed
in this pose. In addition, the competitor should attempt
to contract as many other muscles as possible as the
judges will be surveying the whole physique, from head to
toe.

The judge will first survey the biceps muscles looking for a
full, peaked development of the muscle, noting whether
or not there is a defined split between the anterior and
posterior sections of the biceps, and will continue the
head-to-toe survey by observing the development of the
forearms, deltoids, pectorals, pec-delt tie-ins, abdominals,
thighs, and calves. The judge will also look for muscle
density, definition, and overall balance.

Front Lat Spread (see Figure 2)
Standing face front to the judges, with the legs and feet a
short distance apart, the competitor will place the open
hands, or clenched fists, against, or gripping, the lower
waist or obliques and will expand the latissimus muscles.
At the same time, the competitor should attempt to
contract as many other frontal muscles as possible. It
shall be strictly forbidden for the competitor to pull up on
the posing trunks so as to show the top inside of the
quadriceps.
The judge should first see whether the competitor can
show a good spread of the latissimus muscles, thereby
creating a V-shaped torso. Then the judge should
continue with the head-to-foot survey, noting first the
general aspectsof the physique and then concentrating on
the more detailed aspects of the various muscle groups.

3. Side Chest (see Figure 3)
The competitor may choose either side for this pose, in
order to display the “better” arm. He will stand with his
left or right side towards the judges and will bend the arm
nearest the judges to a right-angle position, with the fist
clenched and, with the other hand, will grasp the wrist.
The leg nearest the judges will be bent at the knee and
will rest on the toes. The competitor will then expand the
chest and by upward pressure of the front bent arm and
contract the biceps as much as possible. He will also
contract the thigh muscles, in particular, the biceps
femoris group, and by downward pressure on his toes,
will display the contracted calf muscles.
The judge will pay particular attention to the pectoral
muscles and the arch of the rib cage, the biceps, the leg
biceps and the calves, and will conclude with the head-tofoot
examination. In this pose the judge will be able to
survey the thigh and calf muscles in profile, which will
help in grading their comparative development more
accurately.

Back Double Biceps (see Figure 4)
Standing with his back to the judges, the competitor will
bend the arms and wrists as in the Front Double Biceps
pose, and will place one foot back, resting on the toes.
He will then contract the arm muscles as well as the
muscles of the shoulders, upper and lower back, thigh
and calf muscles.

The judge will first survey the arm muscles and then do
the head-to-foot survey, during which there are more
muscle groups to look at than in all of the other poses.
This includes the neck, deltoids, biceps, triceps, forearm,
trapezius, teres, infraspinatus, erector spinae, external
obliques, latissimus dorsi, gluteus, thigh biceps, and
calves. This pose, probably more than the others, will
help the judge to determine the quality of the
competitor’s muscle density, definition, and overall
balance.

Back Lat Spread (see Figure 5)
Standing with his back to the judges, the competitor will
place his hands on his waist with his elbows kept wide,
one foot back and resting on the toes. He will then
contract the latissimus dorsi as wide as possible and
display a calf contraction by pressing downward on the
rear toes. The competitor should make an effort to
display the opposite calf to that which was displayed
during the back double biceps pose so the the judge may
assess both calf muscle equally. It shall be strictly
forbidden for the competitor to pull up on the posing
trunks so as to show the gluteus maximus muscles.
The judge will look for a good spread of the latissimus
dorsi, but also for good muscle density and will again
conclude with the head-to-foot survey.

6. Side Triceps (see Figure 6)
The competitor may choose either side for this pose so as
to show the “better” arm. He will stand with his left or
right side towards the judges and will place both arms
behind his back, either linking his fingers or grasping the
front arm by the wrist with his rear hand. The leg nearest
the judges will be bent at the knee and the foot will rest
flat on the floor. The competitor will exert pressure
against his front arm, thereby causing the triceps muscle
to contract. He will also raise the chest and contract the
abdominal muscles as well as the thigh and calf muscles.
The judge will first survey the triceps muscles, and
conclude with the head-to-foot examination. In this pose,
the judge will be able to survey the thigh and calf muscles
in profile, which will help in grading their comparative
development more accurately.

Abdominals and Thighs (see Figure 7)
Standing face front to the judges, the competitor will
place both arms behind the head and will place one leg
forward. He will then contract the abdominal muscles by
55
“crunching” the trunk slightly forward. At the same time,
he will contract the thigh muscles of the forward leg.
The judge will survey the abdominal and thigh muscles,
and then conclude with the head-to-foot examination.



Quote
SCORE #2--ROUND 2—Muscularity in the 7 Compulsory Poses—20%
WHAT ARE THE JUDGES LOOKING FOR: The judges are looking for size, muscularity, definition and separation based just upon the seven compulsory poses.

PROCEDURE: The athletes will be judged in the seven compulsory poses:


A. Front Double Biceps
B. Front Lat Spread
C. Side Chest
D. Rear Double Bicep
E. Rear Lat Spread
F. Front Abdominal & Thighs
G. Front Most Muscular Crab
The athletes will come out and do the seven compulsory poses individually (when there are more than 20 athletes in a competition, the athletes will be brought out 2 at a time), then be brought out and compared in groups of 2, 3 or 4.

The muscularity round is worth 20% where did you get this figure from ? and how about the definition round? whats the percentage of that round? LMFAO or the aesthetics round and the striation round?


Quote
HAHAHAHAH ARE YOU SAYING THAT MUSCLE FIBERS ARENT STRIATED IN NATURE IN SOME HUMAN BEINGS. OBVIOUSLY IF NOTHING WAS OBSCURING THE MUSCLE STRIATIONS WOULD SHOW ON EVERYONE UNLESS THEY HAVE SOME MUTANT GENES AND HAS NONE STRIATED MUSCLE, YOUR RIGHT IT IS GENETIC, FORTUNATLY IT IS GENETIC IN EVERY HUMAN AHAHAHHAHAHA. you are truly a moron

Because a muscle fiber is not a single cell, its parts are often given special names such as
-sarcolemma for plasma membrane
-sarcoplasmic reticulum for endoplasmic reticulum
-sarcosome for mitochondrion
-sarcoplasm for cytoplasm
although this tends to obscure the essential similarity in structure and function of these structures and those found in other cells. 
The

nuclei and mitochondria are located just beneath the plasma membrane
-the endoplasmic reticulum extends between the myofibrils.
Seen from the side under the microscope, skeletal muscle fibers show a pattern of cross banding, which gives rise to the other name: striated muscle.

The striated appearance of the muscle fiber is created by a pattern of alternating

-dark A bands and
-light I bands.
The A bands are bisected by the H zone ,the I bands are bisected by the Z line

Striations are genetic and NOT an accurate indicator of the best possible conditioning , Ronnie had striations in 2000 yet he was covered in a layer of water , thats a contradiction to your claim , striations are NOT a clear indication of extreme conditioning , and striations are genetic some people have more like Andreas Munzer and Hamdullah Aykutlu , in fact Munzer was THE ONLY guy I ever seen with striations on his retus femoris and long head of his triceps Ronnie never did well gee if Ronnie was so conditioned and everyone has the ability to have striation were are Ronnies? why doesn't he have them? he didn't have them at his absolute best conditioning in 2001 or 1998 why? so much for your theory , and this all goes back to Dorian NOT translating as good in film/print than in person YOU can't say what his conditioning is or isn't so once again please refrain from doing so

Quote
and on a second note im not preator, ask NEO we argued for weeks about evolution, religion and ive been a member for over a year, and grill people on the V and am a bastard. i dont know anything about preator. also, you are clearly losing the argument and are starting to dodge posts, however, you claim to be more intelligent yet are being dominated. whatever helps you sleep at night. im not preator, is this your last ploy at remaining in the argument, claim im someone else you;ve argued with to make your position more credible?

please show me were your dominating me. fromt the criteria yates loses. lets go through each one if you want, you arent smart enough to stay with me.

BULLSHIT you're not Preator your nonsense is HIS nonsense verbatim , we both know you are  ;) and I never dodged any of your posts they've all been addressed and corrected then dismissed for what they are ignorant garage and don't break your arm patting yourself on the back sport I'm being dominated by whom? someone who will have us believe that opinions of people who live & in person are WRONG and yours are RIGHT based on compressed video & scans? LMFAO you're owning me? you're owning yourself and I sit back and point it out and laugh on high because all your points have been throughly addressed many , many times before on this thread and you bring nothing new or relevant to this topic , so if you want to know my point of view its on here , try searching because your posts bore me I gave you my attention that you craved you can't hold my intrest , run along and play now  ;)

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Re: Hulkster I'm calling for a Truce
« Reply #22197 on: January 27, 2007, 10:47:22 AM »
pathetic excuse for a comeback claim im someone else, ultimate admission of defeat.

why do you think im preator? i read one argument by him with sucky about rhomboids. i have been posting here for a year or so and just now entered the thread what would that tell you moron.

again i have argued about neuroscience with sucky,religion and physics with NEO and made most of my first posts in the V.

again reply to the post were you claim striations are a genetic thing.





You are owned. Get the f**k out of here kid.

cry foul all you want im not preator, if you want to continue thinking i am so be it, adress the arguments. if you want my personal stats, location etc ask i dont give a fuck, your just a internet pseudointellect making empty claims and mucking up the scientific process, with fantastical claims of yates being different in life but not others.

agian reply, then why do i remind you of preator, what was his argument or education, im sure i can do away with the assertion once i know who your comparing me too.

IceCold

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Re: Hulkster I'm calling for a Truce
« Reply #22198 on: January 27, 2007, 10:50:17 AM »
ND, why do you keep falling back on quotes when someone proves you wrong using reality?

 ::)


you really cant be this stupid.

ingoring reality?

so people who are deemed experts on bodybuilding and guys that competed against dorian who were actually at the contest arent using realiy?

no matter who they are and their opinion, they're wrong - according to you.

flex, dillet, judges, writers, etc. are all wrong bc you say so. 

R.I.P. DIMEBAG DARRELL ABBOTT (1966-2004)

IceCold

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Re: Hulkster I'm calling for a Truce
« Reply #22199 on: January 27, 2007, 10:52:04 AM »
when will you realize that most of these guys have publicly stated that Ronnie is the greatest of all time? ::)


then do what i've done 100 times - post the quotes.

we all know you wont. 
R.I.P. DIMEBAG DARRELL ABBOTT (1966-2004)