Suckmyasshole, you want a concise argument why 99 Ronnie would beat Dorian? here you go:
First, we have to look at why dorian won so much (this argument assumes all judging is fair, which we all know every single Mr. O has been given gifts, including ronnie and dorian).
Dorian won the 1994 Olynpia fair and square. As for the 1997 Olympia, he won with straight-firsts scores from all judges in all rounds. Compare this to Coleman, who lost both the muscularity and symmetry rounds to Cutler in 2001 and still won. So what gift was greater, Huckster?
He won because:
a) he was bigger than most of his opponents
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the guys who finished right behind him ususally placed higher than all other big guys. Shawn Ray came in second at the 1996 Olympia, at 205 lbs, and defeated a 285 lbs Nasser. So you can't use the excuse of size.
and
b) he had a great back, of which NONE of his larger opponents had.
Jean-Pierre Fux actually surpassed Dorian in terms of lat width and thickness, and yet ne never placed anywhere near Dorian. Levrone also had a great back -although not as good as Dorian's - and yet he lost to Dorian not by points, but with straight-firsts victories for the winner.
Now, Dorian easily beat a prepubscent Ronnie for a whole number of reasons, such as:
-lack of conditioning on Ronnie's part
-lack of a lower body at all (ronnie didn't even really have decent quads until 99 to begin with)
-lack of width relative to his frame (look at mid 90's shots of Ronnie compared to 99 - he looked odd until his frame filled out with muscle)
-lack of exposure on ronnie's part
Nothing but excuses.
Ronnie was 260 lbs at the 1996 CPC, and he entered the 1996 Olympia at 255 lbs, only 5 lbs lighter than Dorian. Even Pumpster has pointed out that Ronnie's lats were as wide as Dorian's at the 1996 Olmpia. Even your allies disagree wtih you, Huckster. Lack of exposure? Ronnie had a contract with none other than MetRx, which was the leading muscle brand of the time. But yes, Ronnie didn't have good conditioning at the 1996 Olympia like he had at the 1996 CPC. So what? His greatest conditioning ever, was only good to defeat a Wheeler who was off. Ronnie's best condiotioning is only as good as Flex's best, and is inferior to Dorian's.
Now, look at 99 Ronnie:
1. he had a back that surpassed dorian's even if only slightly
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It did not surpass Dorian's. FLEX magazine regarded Dorian's back as the biggest ever until the 2003 Olympia. Ronnie's back wa slightly smaller than Dorian's. the reason why it appears as big or bigger is due to his smaller waist, which gives the illusion of size.
2. He was the same size
Yes, so no advantage for Ronnie here.
3. He was just as wide
Yes, so no advantage for Ronnie.
4. but had a much smaller waist and more dramatic taper.
And I have always pointed out that this constitutes an advantage while stading relaxed from the front. What you ignore is that Ronnie 1999 had seveal muscular disproportionalities that Dorian didn't have. These include: no calves, biceps that overpower the triceps, lack of middle-back thickness and a mildly distended gut that was a symmetry liability form the sides. So Ronnie is better than Dorian while standing relaxed from the front. Big deal! That's one of three angles of the symetry round, which constitutes 50% of the judging points. Ronnie gets his ass handed to him in the symmetry round in the other two angles, where his lack of calves and large glutes distract from perfection.
5. He had much better detail from the front.
Dorija had better abdominals and serratus separations than Ronnie, and those are the most important details from the front. So how can you say that Ronnie has better details from the frotn is beyond me.
Mandatories:
front double bi - ronnie easily
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Agreed. Except for abs.
side chest - Ronnie easily - look at the side chest shots from 99. Dorian doesn't come close.
Oh, don't make me laugh! Dorian's pectoralis are just s thick as the 1999 coleman - although smaller than Ronnie's in 2003. The difference is that Dorian has calves and better vastus lateralis in this pose. Dorian's side chest is picture perfect. They are tied for thickenss, but Dorian has him on symmetry.
most muscular - see above
Agreed. Ronnie's crab shot is spectacular. To be honest with you, i think he should have won the 2006 Olympia exclusively due to his crab shot, which is the best ever. The thickness, separations and shape of his most muscular is incredible. But then, this wasn't even a mandatory during Dorian's competitive years, so it's not fair to pitch him against ronnie here.
Side tri - dorian- even though his tris lack striations, they look better in this pose than ronnie's.
And don't forget that Dorian is more symmetrical, with calves, traps and vastus lateralis all in sync here.
Back double bi - Ronnie - dorian wins from the knees on down.. 
Makes dorian's back look paper thin and armless..
The only thing that Ronnie has on Dorian are biceps peak. Dorian's latissimus attach lower and thus look more impressive. The 1995 Dorian had as much separation in this shot as Ronnie and comparable thickness, but was harder. Also, symmetry is the other 50% and Dorian has smaller glutes and bigger claves - as a male should have. I would say that their back is equal, but Dorian is more complete. Dorian wins.
Rear lat spread - Ronnie easily - look at the width and taper. Hell, the dorian fans are even claiming that the shots are 'stretched' when in reality, that is what a lat spread looks like when you have the lats of dorian with the waist of someone like Flex: you get Ronnie.
Dorian's lats are wider or as wide as that of the 1999 Coleman. Also, take in consideration that symmetry is also judged and Dorian has it. But yes, Ronnie doee have better taper. But he loses in symmetry. Tie.
Ab and thigh: dorian - even though his thighs are piss poor compared to 99 Ronnie's, his abs are way better than Ronnie's alien abs.
and his waist is smaller and he has better taper in this shot. Don't forget that.
Front Lat Spread: Dorian, even though he has no cuts in sight in this pose, his lats look a lot better from the front.
Ronnie has nothing on Dorian in this mandatory. Nothing. Don't make up advantages that don't exist.
Ronnie wins the mantatories: 5 to 3.
Yes, dorian wins 5 of the mandatories, loses tow and ties one.
Relaxed Round:
Front relaxed: ronnie by a landslide - way better taper, cuts. dorian looks like well, twigs on a barrel (with a keg stomach in 93) in this pose
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Agreed. Except for the cuts thing. Dorian's abs, which are visible in this pose, are more separated than Ronnie'
Side shots: even. no advantage either way here.
Obviously false. Ronnie has no calves and his gut is slightly distended. His triceps is attached lower in the tendom than Dorian's and this is visible. Dorian is more symmetrical from the sides
Back relaxed: ronnie easily - equal width, more dramatic taper. way way better glutes and hams. dorian has better calves. thats it.
False again. The only thing that Ronnie has on Dorian is taper. Droian has bigger claves and smaller glutes and these are advantages. A man is not supposed to have big glutes. Why? Becasue that's a female trait! The glutes, together with the abs are the only parts that should not be hypertrophied. In the back relaxed round, they tie for muscularity and Dorian wins for symmetry as he has two advantages over Dorian, while Ronnie only has one advantage over Dorian.
So, for rounds one and two, its Ronnie.
No, Ronnie wins the first angle and loses the other two. It's Dorian who wins.
Posing Round : even. both of these guys would receive a perfect score in this round like they always do if they are in shape.
Not at a fair contest, which is what we're arguing. Dorian is the better pose.
Conclusion: Ronnie 99 wins, based on the merits of his physique.
Conclusion: Dorian wins two parts of tree in the symmetry round, and has the btter combo of muscularity&symmetry in five of the seven mandatories- the crab shot goes to Ronnie but wasn't a mandatory in Dorian's times.
Some pics: Ronnie relaxed back shot, Ronnie front shot. dorian front shot, Ronnie 99 side chest:
Sure, in our carefully selected, perfectly lighted shots of Ronnie at his best, agains the 1994 Dorian with bad lighting, porr tan and at his worst.
SUCKMYMUSCLE
