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Getbig Main Boards => Politics and Political Issues Board => Topic started by: blacken700 on August 30, 2012, 04:55:14 AM
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Paul Ryan's vice presidential acceptance speech ran into a lot of trouble with fact-checkers and journalists.
It seemed like some reporters' heads were going to explode on Twitter as Ryan spoke. For instance, he blasted President Obama for not doing more to keep a GM plant in his hometown open. The problem was that the plant closed before Obama took office. He also criticized Obama for rejecting recommendations from a debt commission that he himself sat on, and whose findings he also rejected.
The Washington Post flatly said, "Ryan misleads on GM plant closing."
Some media watchers expressed initital frustration at the lack of fact-checking they were seeing on television during Ryan's speech:
On CNN, Wolf Blitzer and Erin Burnett began by slightly skirting the issue immediately after the speech.
"I marked seven or eight points I'm sure the fact checkers will have some opportunities to dispute if they want to go forward," Blitzer said. "I'm sure they will." He did not specify what the points were.
After a correspondent's interview with Ryan's family — and a fair amount of criticism — Blitzer noted that he had been getting emails from Democrats and others about what, in his words, "they claim were falsehoods, misleading statements, lies, if you will, that were made by Paul Ryan. And I guess that fact-checking is only beginning."
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Paul Ryan fails -- the truth
By Jonathan Bernstein
It was, by any reasonable standards, a staggering, staggering lie. Here’s Paul Ryan about Barack Obama:
He created a bipartisan debt commission. They came back with an urgent report. He thanked them, sent them on their way, and then did exactly nothing.
“They.” “Them.” “Them.” Those words are lies. Because Paul Ryan was on that commission. “Came back with an urgent report.” That is a lie. The commission never made any recommendations for Barack Obama to support or oppose. Why not? Because the commission voted down its own recommendations. Why? Because Paul Ryan, a member of the commission, voted it down and successfully convinced the other House Republicans on the commission to vote it down.
That wasn’t the only bit of mendacity – lazy mendacity, incredibly lazy mendacity – in Ryan’s speech. Twitter lit up as soon as he started telling the story of the Janesville auto plant that Barack Obama didn’t save – a plant that, it turns out, closed before Obama was president. And of course there’s the infamous cuts to Medicare that Ryan lambasted Obama for without happening to mention that those very same cuts were in Paul Ryan’s own budget. Yes: absolutely everything in Obamacare is an abomination, says Paul Ryan, except for (as he forgets to mention) the cuts to Medicare that he supports – and yet he still singles that part out to use as an attack ...
http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/plum-line/post/paul-ryan-fails----the-truth/2012/08/29/bbfe1eac-f254-11e1-b74c-84ed55e0300b_blog.html
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"We're not going to let our campaign be dictated by fact-checkers," Romney pollster Neil Newhouse said at a panel organized by ABC News.
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
here's one truth :D :D :D :D :D
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HAHAHAHHAha
Oh brother.
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Chris Matthews Hints Ryan's 'Very Nasty' Speech Was Directed to Racists
NewsBusters ^
Posted on Thursday, August 30, 2012 7:23:01 AM
Minutes after Paul Ryan finished his RNC speech on Wednesday, MSNBC's Chris Matthews slammed the Republican vice presidential candidate for supposedly ignoring blacks during his "very constricted, very negative, very nasty speech," and suggested that he was directing the address to racists: "It's clear that Paul Ryan was talking to people who think about rights as something...produced by Thomas Jefferson, ignoring the people for whom the rights only came in the 1960s."
Matthews added that "for some reason, they never mentioned those things, because they're talking to people - let's be honest about this - who didn't feel – the benefit, at all, from those civil rights, and I think that's very important to point out."
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How is that a lie? We went over simpson Bowles many times here and Erskine Bowles himself said obama did not push it due to politics in the WH
Paul Ryan fails -- the truth
By Jonathan Bernstein
It was, by any reasonable standards, a staggering, staggering lie. Here’s Paul Ryan about Barack Obama:
He created a bipartisan debt commission. They came back with an urgent report. He thanked them, sent them on their way, and then did exactly nothing.
“They.” “Them.” “Them.” Those words are lies. Because Paul Ryan was on that commission. “Came back with an urgent report.” That is a lie. The commission never made any recommendations for Barack Obama to support or oppose. Why not? Because the commission voted down its own recommendations. Why? Because Paul Ryan, a member of the commission, voted it down and successfully convinced the other House Republicans on the commission to vote it down.
That wasn’t the only bit of mendacity – lazy mendacity, incredibly lazy mendacity – in Ryan’s speech. Twitter lit up as soon as he started telling the story of the Janesville auto plant that Barack Obama didn’t save – a plant that, it turns out, closed before Obama was president. And of course there’s the infamous cuts to Medicare that Ryan lambasted Obama for without happening to mention that those very same cuts were in Paul Ryan’s own budget. Yes: absolutely everything in Obamacare is an abomination, says Paul Ryan, except for (as he forgets to mention) the cuts to Medicare that he supports – and yet he still singles that part out to use as an attack ...
http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/plum-line/post/paul-ryan-fails----the-truth/2012/08/29/bbfe1eac-f254-11e1-b74c-84ed55e0300b_blog.html
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Obama and his media hacks busted again.
http://twitchy.com/2012/08/30/obama-lied-about-janesville-gm-auto-plant-not-ryan
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Ryan used very well-written wording - I believe "lawlerly" is the phrase. He will be technically covered on every position.
And repubs can't show the video of these alleged falsehoods without showing the blue-eyed golden boy smiling with tens of thousands of people cheering for him.
I don't think much of this footage ends up in ads.
it's like hating on Angelina Jolie for farting in the shower. You're still looking at a naked wet Angelina Jolie. Ya know?
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The only liars are those calling Ryan a liar.
Everything he said is true and it will be even more clear and evident to the American public when he debates Biden. That is going to be a beatdown of epic proportions. Ryan will be to Biden what Tyson was to Trevor Berbick.
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Ryan used very well-written wording - I believe "lawlerly" is the phrase. He will be technically covered on every position.
And repubs can't show the video of these alleged falsehoods without showing the blue-eyed golden boy smiling with tens of thousands of people cheering for him.
I don't think much of this footage ends up in ads.
it's like hating on Angelina Jolie for farting in the shower. You're still looking at a naked wet Angelina Jolie. Ya know?
I think it's actually "smarticalistic."
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The left is melting down about Ryan calling out RATbama for simpson bowles failures. Funny - Even Erskine Bowles attacked obama for putting politics ahead of the nation.
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The left is melting down about Ryan calling out RATbama for simpson bowles failures. Funny - Even Erskine Bowles attacked obama for putting politics ahead of the nation.
Come on, man. What the hell are you doing? Why do you keep bringing facts into this topic?
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Gotta love George Stephonoplus getting an email from a DEMOCRATIC OPERATIVE directly after the speech.....AND THEN READING IT ON AIR.
What a joke, an absolute joke. The medias coverage of the RNC has been a pathetic sham, journalists they are not.
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Obama Camp Melts Down Over Ryan's Speech
By Guy Benson
8/30/2012
http://townhall.com/tipsheet/guybenson/2012/08/30/obama_camp_melts_down_over_ryans_speech
The Obama campaign is lashing out at Paul Ryan, claiming that his fantastic convention speech last night was packed with falsehoods and lies. Here's their hysterical response video:
To the surprise of no one, the ad's "rebuttals" are misleading and wrong themselves. Point by point:
(1) They begin with video of CNN reporters discussing accusations of Ryan's "lies." This is proof that the Obama campaign sent out a lot of angry emails, and nothing else.
(2) Medicare - Sorry, guys, but it is 100 percent true that Obamacare raided $716 Billion from Medicare to pay for itself. It does cut benefits to current seniors. And Paul Ryan's plan took the president's Medicare "savings," and re-routed them back into Medicare to shore up the program. Mitt Romney's plan would undo those cuts altogether. Obama took those cuts and used them to pay for Obamacare. He has admitted this on camera:
(3) The GM Plant - Part of the factory Ryan mentioned was shut down under Bush, despite the initial GM bailout (which Senator Obama supported). The plant finally fully closed in April of 2009, during Obama's presidency, as this report clearly states. Obama's problem is that he showed up and made empty promises to pander for votes. Ryan never said Obama was personally responsible for the plant's closure, but he accurately stated that it closed down within a year of candidate Obama's hope-filled speech and remains closed today. Obama goes on and on about "saving" the auto industry and his economic recovery. That boarded-up Janesville plant tells a different story.
(4) The Stimulus - Pointing out that Paul Ryan asked that his district receive a slice of a giant, wasteful pie after it was passed -- and despite his opposition -- is at worst an instance of hypocrisy. It does not disprove anything that Ryan said in his speech, and it does not change the empirical fact that Barack Obama's borrowed stimulus has utterly failed based on the metrics for success Obama himself set out for it.
(5) The debt commission - What Ryan said is absolutely correct. The Obama ad quotes Chris Wallace, who notes that Ryan was on that commission and voted against it. True. He refused to abide the section maintaining Obamacare, and voted no on its final findings. Still, he was intimately involved in the group's deliberations and proposed solutions. Not fully happy with the final outcome, he went on to craft two budgets of his own, with numerous elements based on the Simpson-Bowles framework. The commission's Democratic co-chairman (Bowles of Simpson-Bowles) has praised Ryan's proposals to the hilt. Barack Obama, who convened the commission in the first place after deriding commissions on the campaign trail, completely ignored its recommendations and proceeded to propose to wildly reckless, debt-busting budgets that received a total of zero votes in either house of Congress. Correctly asserting that Ryan opposed the final Simpson-Bowles recommendations is no way absolves Obama for his demonstrable abdication of leadership on these issues. It's more smoke and mirrors -- and more petty Obama blame, another central theme of Ryan's address.
(6) Chris Matthews called the speech "nasty." Stop the presses!
If this is all they've got, it's no wonder they're freaking out. Paul Ryan told the truth about Barack Obama, and the president's campaign can't handle it.
UPDATE - More smoking-gun video, this time on the GM plant. This aired in April 2009:
Guy Benson
Guy Benson is Townhall.com's Political Editor. Follow him on Twitter @guypbenson.
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FACT CHECK: Obama promised and failed to keep Janesville GM plant open
August 30, 2012 | 9:36 am
14Comments
Senior Editorial Writer
The Washington Examiner
E@conncarrollDConn on FB
Popular in Politics
FACT CHECK: Obama promised and failed to keep Janesville GM plant open
Last night, in his Republican National Convention speech, Paul Ryan said:
President Barack Obama came to office during an economic crisis, as he has reminded us a time or two. Those were very tough days, and any fair measure of his record has to take that into account. My home state voted for President Obama. When he talked about change, many people liked the sound of it, especially in Janesville, where we were about to lose a major factory.
A lot of guys I went to high school with worked at that GM plant. Right there at that plant, candidate Obama said: “I believe that if our government is there to support you … this plant will be here for another hundred years.” That’s what he said in 2008.
Well, as it turned out, that plant didn’t last another year. It is locked up and empty to this day. And that’s how it is in so many towns today, where the recovery that was promised is nowhere in sight.
The Washington Post, and a host of other liberal media outlets, are calling this passage “misleading” because the Janesville plant “closed before the president was inaugurated.” The Post is dead wrong. Here are the facts:
1. On February 13, 2008 Obama said in Janesville : “I believe that if our government is there to support you, and give you the assistance you need to re-tool and make this transition, that this plant will be here for another hundred years.”
2. In June 2008 GM announced that the Janesville plant would stop production of medium-duty trucks by the end of 2009, and stop production of large SUVs in 2010 or sooner.
3. In October 2008 Obama doubled down on his promise to keep Janesville plant open: “As president, I will lead an effort to retool plants like the GM facility in Janesville so we can build the fuel-efficient cars of tomorrow and create good-paying jobs in Wisconsin and all across America.”
4. In December 2008 GM idled production of GM SUVs at the Janesville plant. Medium-duty truck assembly continued.
5. In April 2009, four months after Obama was inaugurated, GM idled production of medium-duty trucks.
6. In September 2011, more than two years after Obama was inaugurated, GM reiterates that Janesville plant is on “stand by status.” Auto industry observer David Cole, tells the Milwaukee Journal-Sentinel it would be premature to say the Janesville plant will never reopen.
6. Today the GM facility in Janesville still has not been retooled “so we can build the fuel-efficient cars of tomorrow and create good-paying jobs,” as Obama promised.
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8/30/2012 @ 1:21AM |9,920 views
Yes, Paul Ryan Spoke the Truth About Obama's Fiscal Record at the Republican Convention
TAMPA, FL - AUGUST 29: Republican vice presidential candidate, U.S. Rep. Paul Ryan (R-WI) waves with his family during the third day of the Republican National Convention at the Tampa Bay Times Forum on August 29, 2012 in Tampa, Florida. (Image credit: Getty Images via @daylife)
Progressive bloggers and TV personalities are up in arms about Paul Ryan’s speech at the Republican National Convention last night. Several of their accusations revolve around Paul Ryan’s own fiscal record, and his description of President Obama’s. I asked my liberal friends on Twitter to send me an itemized list of Ryan’s alleged lies, and they kindly obliged. So far, Ryan appears to have the better of the argument.
(Disclosure: I am an outside adviser to the Romney campaign on health care issues, but the opinions in this post are mine, and do not necessarily correspond to those of the campaign.)
Dave Weigel of Slate compiled a useful list. (For a longer one, visit ThinkProgress.) Wrote Weigel, “Ryan plowed through one of the more impressive strings of whoppers we’ve seen at this level,” wrote Weigel. Here are his complaints, in order of importance.
Charge #1: Paul Ryan accused Obama of cutting Medicare by $716 billion, but Ryan’s own budget preserved those cuts.
Here’s what Ryan actually said (emphasis added):
“
And the biggest, coldest power play of all in Obamacare came at the expense of the elderly.
You see, even with all the hidden taxes to pay for the health care takeover, even with new taxes on nearly a million small businesses, the planners in Washington still didn’t have enough money. They needed more. They needed hundreds of billions more. So, they just took it all away from Medicare. Seven hundred and sixteen billion dollars, funneled out of Medicare by President Obama. An obligation we have to our parents and grandparents is being sacrificed, all to pay for a new entitlement we didn’t even ask for. The greatest threat to Medicare is Obamacare, and we’re going to stop it.
In Congress, when they take out the heavy books and wall charts about Medicare, my thoughts go back to a house on Garfield Street in Janesville. My wonderful grandma, Janet, had Alzheimer’s and moved in with Mom and me. Though she felt lost at times, we did all the little things that made her feel loved.
We had help from Medicare, and it was there, just like it’s there for my Mom today. Medicare is a promise, and we will honor it. A Romney-Ryan administration will protect and strengthen Medicare, for my Mom’s generation, for my generation, and for my kids and yours.
So our opponents can consider themselves on notice. In this election, on this issue, the usual posturing on the Left isn’t going to work. Mitt Romney and I know the difference between protecting a program, and raiding it. Ladies and gentlemen, our nation needs this debate. We want this debate. We will win this debate.
Here are the facts. It’s true that Ryan’s budgets in 2011 and 2012 preserved Obamacare’s cuts to Medicare. However, there is a huge difference between cutting Medicare by $716 billion to fund $1.9 trillion in new health spending, as Obamacare did, and cutting Medicare by $716 billion to shore up the solvency of the Medicare program itself, as the Ryan budget sought to do.
Secondly, the Romney Medicare plan fully repeals Obamacare, including the $716 billion in Medicare cuts.
APOTHEFACT JUDGMENT: Ryan is correct. Ryan makes the appropriate distinction between improving Medicare’s solvency and cutting its spending to fund spending elsewhere.
Charge #2: Paul Ryan criticized Obama for ignoring the recommendations of the Simpson-Bowles deficit commission. But Ryan voted against those recommendations himself.
Here’s what Ryan said (emphasis added):
“
He created a bipartisan debt commission. They came back with an urgent report. He thanked them, sent them on their way, and then did exactly nothing.
Republicans stepped up with good-faith reforms and solutions equal to the problems. How did the president respond? By doing nothing – nothing except to dodge and demagogue the issue.
It’s true that Paul Ryan voted against the Simpson-Bowles recommendations. He did so because Simpson-Bowles raised taxes while doing little to nothing about health-care spending, the biggest driver of growing deficits. However, by rejecting Simpson-Bowles, Ryan felt morally obligated to put forth his own plan, and did so—several times, in the form of his Path to Prosperity and his 2011 and 2012 House budget resolutions.
Notably, he took advantage of his tenure on the Bowles-Simpson commission to forge a bipartisan compromise with Bill Clinton’s budget chief, Alice Rivlin, on Medicare reform.
By contrast, President Obama scuttled a bipartisan Congressional deal to achieve long-term fiscal reform. A few months ago, President Obama sent a budget to Congress for fiscal year 2013, that did not bother to attempt to balance the budget, and was defeated unanimously in both houses, failing to even get a single Democratic vote.
Here’s what Erskine Bowles, President Clinton’s former chief of staff and the leader of President Obama’s deficit commission, had to say about Paul Ryan in September of 2011:
“
I’m telling you, this guy is amazing. I always thought I was okay with arithmetic. This guy can run circles around me. He is honest, he is straightforward, he is sincere. And the budget he came forward with is just like Paul Ryan. It is a sensible, straightforward, honest, serious budget and it cut the budget deficit just like we did by four trillion dollars.
By contrast, here is what Bowles said about Obama’s budget:
“
The president came out with his own plan. And the president, as you remember, came out with a budget. And I don’t think anybody took that budget very seriously. The Senate voted against it 97 to nothing.
He therefore, after a lot of pressure from folks like me, he came out with a new budget framework. And in that budget framework, he cuts the budget by four trillion dollars over twelve years. And, to be candid, this four trillion dollars cut was very heavily back-end loaded. So, that if you looked at it on a ten-year basis and compared apples to apples, it really was about a two and a half trillion dollar cut.
APOTHEFACT JUDGMENT: Ryan is correct. Ryan’s credibility on deficit reduction is on the record, and has been endorsed by prominent Democrats. By contrast, Obama’s FY 2013 budget didn’t garner a single vote in Congress.
Charge #3: Paul Ryan blamed Obama for Standard & Poor’s downgrade of American government debt from AAA to AA+, but Paul Ryan is actually to blame because he resisted tax increases that would have closed the deficit.
Here is what Ryan said: President Obama’s term “began with a perfect Triple-A credit rating for the United States; it ends with a downgraded America.”
I suppose it’s true that you can blame Ryan and the rest of the GOP for opposing trillions in tax increases, but it’s conversely true that you can blame Democrats for opposing spending cuts. At the end of the day, the question is who has been more constructive on the question of improving our long-term fiscal situation.
APOTHEFACT JUDGMENT: Ryan is correct that Obama has presided over this historic downgrade, but Republicans deserve a meaningful proportion of the blame for the fiscal situation that Obama inherited and then made worse.
Charge #4: Paul Ryan opposed the stimulus, but he lobbied for stimulus grants that went to his district.
Here is what Ryan said (emphasis added):
“
The first troubling sign came with the stimulus. It was President Obama’s first and best shot at fixing the economy, at a time when he got everything he wanted under one-party rule. It cost $831 billion – the largest one-time expenditure ever by our federal government.
It went to companies like Solyndra, with their gold-plated connections, subsidized jobs, and make-believe markets. The stimulus was a case of political patronage, corporate welfare, and cronyism at their worst. You, the working men and women of this country, were cut out of the deal.
What did the taxpayers get out of the Obama stimulus? More debt. That money wasn’t just spent and wasted – it was borrowed, spent, and wasted.
We can debate the merits of the stimulus, but I certainly share Ryan’s view that the stimulus was a case of political patronage and corporate welfare at its worst. It is also true that Ryan did seek some stimulus money for his district after the law was passed. Ryan had initially said that he had not taken any stimulus money, but was forced to correct that record after it turned out that his staff had sought stimulus money for two of his constituents.
In addition, Ryan voted for a similarly misguided temporary stimulus package under President Bush.
The substantive question is: once a stimulus is a fait accompli, is it immoral for a Congressman to ensure that his constituents’ federal tax dollars are redirected back into his district? To me, that’s not a big deal, but others may disagree.
APOTHEFACT JUDGMENT: Ryan is correct in his criticisms of the Obama stimulus, but it is true that Ryan voted for wasteful spending measures in the 2000s. In the minds of many, including me, Ryan’s courage in taking on entitlement reform redeems those earlier failures. But others may disagree.
Parting thoughts
Finally, Weigel and a number of other commentators complained about the Janesville General Motors plant that Ryan cited in his speech. Ryan pointed out that Obama promised that, under his administration, “this plant will be here for another hundred years.” But it closed in December 2008, before President Obama was inaugurated, and didn’t reopen under President Obama’s GM bailout, which is the focus of Ryan’s criticism. As this is a health-care and fiscal blog, I’m going to let others argue about that one.
If there are other things about Paul Ryan’s speech that you want me to write about, put them in the comments and I’ll add updates. In the meantime, I’m going to bed.
Follow Avik on Twitter at @aviksaroy.
UPDATE: Jonathan Adler of National Review offers these observations about the Janesville GM plant closing:
“
Pundits and fact-checkers are claiming that Paul Ryan misrepresented the history of the Janesville, Wisconsin General Motors plant in his convention speech. The primary charge is that the plant closed when Bush was still President. It seems the fact-checkers need to double-check their facts, however. While GM first announced plans to shutter the plant in 2008, the plant was not actually idled until 2009 (as reported here and noted here), and the shut-down schedule was faster than GM had initially announced. In 2008 GM said it would close the plant by 2010. What many of the “fact-checkers” missed is that an auto plant can produce more than one thing, so ending one production line need not lead to an actual plant closure. Conn Carroll has the rundown of the actual facts here. (More at Twitchy.)
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This article is available online at:
http://www.forbes.com/sites/aroy/2012/08/30/yes-paul-ryan-spoke-the-truth-about-obamas-fiscal-record/
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You know that Ryan is saying the truth when the Dems and their supporters are melting all over the place claiming Ryan lied but can't provide a single fact or evidence supporting their assertion.
Democratic party is a disgrace.
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I like how people defer to these self-anointed "fact checkers" as some sort of authority. It's cute.
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I like Facts.
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1. The speech was perfect - not over the top, not rock star, but controlled and positive and really did what it needed to do to support Romney. EXACTLY what you want from a veep.
2. Yes, there were some items that were false, such as this one. Paul Ryan gave a great speech but did miss this one.
Ryan then noted that Obama, while campaigning for president, promised that a GM plant in Wisconsin would not shut down. "That plant didn’t last another year. It is locked up and empty to this day. And that’s how it is in so many towns today, where the recovery that was promised is nowhere in sight," Ryan said.
Except Obama didn't promise that. And the plant closed in December 2008 -- while George W. Bush was president.
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I like Facts.
Good - because what Ryan said was truth last night.
There is no defense whatsoever to obamas' horrible record.
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1. The speech was perfect - not over the top, not rock star, but controlled and positive and really did what it needed to do to support Romney. EXACTLY what you want from a veep.
2. Yes, there were some items that were false, such as this one. Paul Ryan gave a great speech but did miss this one.
Ryan then noted that Obama, while campaigning for president, promised that a GM plant in Wisconsin would not shut down. "That plant didn’t last another year. It is locked up and empty to this day. And that’s how it is in so many towns today, where the recovery that was promised is nowhere in sight," Ryan said.
Except Obama didn't promise that. And the plant closed in December 2008 -- while George W. Bush was president.
BULLSHIT!
I debunked that shit already three times. Why do you keep lying?
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1. The speech was perfect - not over the top, not rock star, but controlled and positive and really did what it needed to do to support Romney. EXACTLY what you want from a veep.
2. Yes, there were some items that were false, such as this one. Paul Ryan gave a great speech but did miss this one.
Ryan then noted that Obama, while campaigning for president, promised that a GM plant in Wisconsin would not shut down. "That plant didn’t last another year. It is locked up and empty to this day. And that’s how it is in so many towns today, where the recovery that was promised is nowhere in sight," Ryan said.
Except Obama didn't promise that. And the plant closed in December 2008 -- while George W. Bush was president.
That wasn't a miss, 240. Did you not read the other posts? The plant was partially closed in 2008. Then in 2009...after Obama's speech there, it was totally shuttered and remains so to this day.
Reading is a skill.
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I debunked that shit already three times. Why do you keep lying?
Sorry, i've been at the zoo all morning and missed getbig, this was the first thread i read. Link to proof? Dont go jumping on me, i was petting manta rays all morning.
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Sorry, i've been at the zoo all morning and missed getbig, this was the first thread i read. Link to proof? Dont go jumping on me, i was petting manta rays all morning.
The Washington Post, and a host of other liberal media outlets, are calling this passage “misleading” because the Janesville plant “closed before the president was inaugurated.” The Post is dead wrong. Here are the facts:
1. On February 13, 2008 Obama said in Janesville : “I believe that if our government is there to support you, and give you the assistance you need to re-tool and make this transition, that this plant will be here for another hundred years.”
2. In June 2008 GM announced that the Janesville plant would stop production of medium-duty trucks by the end of 2009, and stop production of large SUVs in 2010 or sooner.
3. In October 2008 Obama doubled down on his promise to keep Janesville plant open: “As president, I will lead an effort to retool plants like the GM facility in Janesville so we can build the fuel-efficient cars of tomorrow and create good-paying jobs in Wisconsin and all across America.”
4. In December 2008 GM idled production of GM SUVs at the Janesville plant. Medium-duty truck assembly continued.
5. In April 2009, four months after Obama was inaugurated, GM idled production of medium-duty trucks.
6. In September 2011, more than two years after Obama was inaugurated, GM reiterates that Janesville plant is on “stand by status.” Auto industry observer David Cole, tells the Milwaukee Journal-Sentinel it would be premature to say the Janesville plant will never reopen.
6. Today the GM facility in Janesville still has not been retooled “so we can build the fuel-efficient cars of tomorrow and create good-paying jobs,” as Obama promised.
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Sorry, i've been at the zoo all morning and missed getbig, this was the first thread i read. Link to proof? Dont go jumping on me, i was petting manta rays all morning.
GetBig comes before manta rays and your children.
Get your ass a smart phone, park yourself in a bathroom stall at the zoo and take care of business.
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gotcha
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gotcha
240 - what is the date of this clip?
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GM decided to close the plant before Obama even won the election and even before he won the Democratic Primary. Besides, I thought Republicans wanted Obama to leave the Private Sector alone. Shouldn`t you be praising Obama here? ???
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GM decided to close the plant before Obama even won the election. Besides, I thought Republicans wanted Obama to leave the Private Sector alone. Shouldn`t you be praising Obama here? ???
And obama promised that if he got his bailout the place would retool and stay open for 100 years.
He got his bailout and the plant still closed.
FAIL
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And obama promised that if he got his bailout the place would retool and stay open for 100 years.
He got his bailout and the plant still closed.
FAIL
He did? Where?
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He did? Where?
The Washington Post, and a host of other liberal media outlets, are calling this passage “misleading” because the Janesville plant “closed before the president was inaugurated.” The Post is dead wrong. Here are the facts:
1. On February 13, 2008 Obama said in Janesville : “I believe that if our government is there to support you, and give you the assistance you need to re-tool and make this transition, that this plant will be here for another hundred years.”
2. In June 2008 GM announced that the Janesville plant would stop production of medium-duty trucks by the end of 2009, and stop production of large SUVs in 2010 or sooner.
3. In October 2008 Obama doubled down on his promise to keep Janesville plant open: “As president, I will lead an effort to retool plants like the GM facility in Janesville so we can build the fuel-efficient cars of tomorrow and create good-paying jobs in Wisconsin and all across America.”
4. In December 2008 GM idled production of GM SUVs at the Janesville plant. Medium-duty truck assembly continued.
5. In April 2009, four months after Obama was inaugurated, GM idled production of medium-duty trucks.
6. In September 2011, more than two years after Obama was inaugurated, GM reiterates that Janesville plant is on “stand by status.” Auto industry observer David Cole, tells the Milwaukee Journal-Sentinel it would be premature to say the Janesville plant will never reopen.
6. Today the GM facility in Janesville still has not been retooled “so we can build the fuel-efficient cars of tomorrow and create good-paying jobs,” as Obama promised.
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He did? Where?
Right there...you see.... because 3333 thinks it in his head... and Failure is soely measured by his fluctuating definition, if 3333, the self appointed authority on all things Obama says something is a failure... well by Jeebus... its a darn fail
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The Washington Post, and a host of other liberal media outlets, are calling this passage “misleading” because the Janesville plant “closed before the president was inaugurated.” The Post is dead wrong. Here are the facts:
1. On February 13, 2008 Obama said in Janesville : “I believe that if our government is there to support you, and give you the assistance you need to re-tool and make this transition, that this plant will be here for another hundred years.”
2. In June 2008 GM announced that the Janesville plant would stop production of medium-duty trucks by the end of 2009, and stop production of large SUVs in 2010 or sooner.
3. In October 2008 Obama doubled down on his promise to keep Janesville plant open: “As president, I will lead an effort to retool plants like the GM facility in Janesville so we can build the fuel-efficient cars of tomorrow and create good-paying jobs in Wisconsin and all across America.”
4. In December 2008 GM idled production of GM SUVs at the Janesville plant. Medium-duty truck assembly continued.
5. In April 2009, four months after Obama was inaugurated, GM idled production of medium-duty trucks.
6. In September 2011, more than two years after Obama was inaugurated, GM reiterates that Janesville plant is on “stand by status.” Auto industry observer David Cole, tells the Milwaukee Journal-Sentinel it would be premature to say the Janesville plant will never reopen.
6. Today the GM facility in Janesville still has not been retooled “so we can build the fuel-efficient cars of tomorrow and create good-paying jobs,” as Obama promised.
The plant is on standby status and not closed. Your number 6 even states its not closed yet.
But that doesn`t really matter because I don`t see where Obama made any promises to specifically keep any plant open.
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Also, shouldn`t you be glad Obama hasn`t intervened? Republicans, if they really believe what they say, should be praising him here.
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The plant is on standby status and not closed. Your number 6 even states its not closed yet.
But that doesn`t really matter because I don`t see where Obama made any promises to specifically keep any plant open.
GMAFB
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Also, shouldn`t you be glad Obama hasn`t intervened? Republicans, if they really believe what they say, should be praising him here.
Obama put over 20,000 out of work in the bailout which was only meant to give money to the unions , not help the company be viable.
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Obama lies while America dies.
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Right there...you see.... because 3333 thinks it in his head... and Failure is soely measured by his fluctuating definition, if 3333, the self appointed authority on all things Obama says something is a failure... well by Jeebus... its a darn fail
I posted his own statement on re-tooling the plant and it staying open for 100 years.
Again, like the typical obama sycophant, obama is never at fault for his failed promises, never to blame for his lies and deceit, etc.
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3. In October 2008 Obama doubled down on his promise to keep Janesville plant open: “As president, I will lead an effort to retool plants like the GM facility in Janesville so we can build the fuel-efficient cars of tomorrow and create good-paying jobs in Wisconsin and all across America.”
HOW THE FUCK CAN YOU CLOWNS SPIN THIS?
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Paul Ryan voted for the Bailout too. Does that mean he was part of the promise to keep the plant open?
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http://articles.latimes.com/2012/aug/18/nation/la-na-ryan-gm-20120818
Rep. Paul Ryan fought to bail out GM plant in Wisconsin district
Conservatives view Mitt Romney's running mate as a symbol of fiscal austerity and Democrats see him as a radical ideologue. Neither characterization fits his effort to save the GM plant.
August 18, 2012|By Kathleen Hennessey, Washington Bureau
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The shuttered General Motors plant in Janesville, Wis., hometown of Rep.… (Andy Manis, Associated…)
JANESVILLE, Wis. — In September 2008, as Wall Street was roiling with calamity, Rep. Paul D. Ryan was facing another looming disaster back home.
A General Motors plant, the lifeblood of his hometown, was set to close. The huge Suburbans and Tahoes from the Janesville production line were no longer in vogue. The aging plant was to stop production by Christmas — unless Ryan and other Wisconsin officials could save it.
Ryan, then the ranking Republican on the House Budget Committee, flew to Detroit to cajole GM executives. For more than an hour, he and other officials made a PowerPoint proposal that mixed union concessions with unprecedented state and local tax breaks for GM.
"We put an enormous package on the table," said then-Wisconsin Gov. Jim Doyle, a Democrat, of the state-led effort.
Two years later, as chairman of the budget committee, Ryan became known for another PowerPoint presentation — a slide show on the federal government's ballooning debt. In that pitch, Ryan touted his budget plan, which includes a vow to "end corporate welfare."
Now Ryan's plan and his salesmanship have helped him become GOP presidential candidate Mitt Romney's running mate. The choice has thrilled conservatives who view him as a symbol of unwavering fiscal austerity and delighted Democrats who see him as a radical ideologue.
Neither characterization fits Ryan's effort to save the GM plant in his district. Despite his paeans to free markets, Ryan voted for $14 billion in emergency federal loans to help bail out the auto industry during the waning days of the George W. Bush administration.
Ryan was closely involved in a task force that helped craft two incentive packages with large state tax breaks for GM, and personally lobbied GM executives to accept the bids.
"I would say Congressman Ryan did what a good member of Congress would do for his district," Doyle said. He added that like many other Republicans, Ryan made sure to "complain about the so-called stimulus and bailouts while also lining up to make sure their districts were getting taken care of."
Ryan's record of seeking federal money for his district came under close scrutiny last week after he denied and then acknowledged requesting money available under the $800-billion stimulus bill passed by Congress in 2009. Ryan had voted against the bill, and decried it as wasteful. In a statement Thursday, he said constituents' requests for stimulus funds "should have been handled differently."
A Ryan aide, who asked for anonymity because he was not authorized to discuss the issue, said that although Ryan's proposed budget plan promises to take the federal government "out of the business of picking winners and losers in the marketplace," he makes a distinction between what is appropriate for the federal and state governments. Ryan believes states are free to compete for business as they see fit, the aide said.
No one in Janesville was surprised that their native son would try to save the GM plant.
Ryan's family had been in the blue-collar town for five generations, even longer than the GM plant, then 82 years old. Ryan's father had worked there one summer during high school. Ryan regularly campaigned outside the gates when he ran for Congress.
Rumors of the plant's demise were perennial, however. When GM finally announced in May 2008 that it would stop production by year's end, local and state officials scrambled to save more than 4,000 jobs.
Local, state and federal leaders formed a task force to persuade GM to give Janesville another look. Ryan's chief of staff was a fixture at the meetings and Ryan regularly reached out to GM Chief Executive Rick Wagoner, with whom he had forged a close working relationship, participants said.
Ryan "knew what it meant, how devastating it would be," said Tim Cullen, the task force co-chairman and now a Democratic state senator. "I think he showed he has a pragmatic streak in him."
At the September 2008 meeting in Detroit, Ryan helped pitch a $224-million proposal that included roughly $50 million in state enterprise zone tax credits, local government grants worth $22 million, and major contract concessions from the United Auto Workers union local.
But it soon became clear that the future of Janesville — and all of GM — hinged on federal intervention.
In late November, executives from Detroit's Big Three flew to Washington to ask for a bailout. The next day, Mitt Romney made his opposition clear in a New York Times op-ed titled, "Let Detroit Go Bankrupt."
Ryan disagreed. He supported a House bill that offered $14 billion in fast-tracked loans to GM and Chrysler. Ryan cited his district's "gut-wrenching" experience with layoffs, and a commitment to the auto industry. He also suggested that, under other circumstances, he might have voted no.
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And your point is?
The bottom line is that Obama pissed away the $$$$ and broke his promise TO LEAD AN EFFORT TO RETOOL THE PLANT
http://articles.latimes.com/2012/aug/18/nation/la-na-ryan-gm-20120818
Rep. Paul Ryan fought to bail out GM plant in Wisconsin district
Conservatives view Mitt Romney's running mate as a symbol of fiscal austerity and Democrats see him as a radical ideologue. Neither characterization fits his effort to save the GM plant.
August 18, 2012|By Kathleen Hennessey, Washington Bureau
Email
Share
The shuttered General Motors plant in Janesville, Wis., hometown of Rep.… (Andy Manis, Associated…)
JANESVILLE, Wis. — In September 2008, as Wall Street was roiling with calamity, Rep. Paul D. Ryan was facing another looming disaster back home.
A General Motors plant, the lifeblood of his hometown, was set to close. The huge Suburbans and Tahoes from the Janesville production line were no longer in vogue. The aging plant was to stop production by Christmas — unless Ryan and other Wisconsin officials could save it.
Ryan, then the ranking Republican on the House Budget Committee, flew to Detroit to cajole GM executives. For more than an hour, he and other officials made a PowerPoint proposal that mixed union concessions with unprecedented state and local tax breaks for GM.
"We put an enormous package on the table," said then-Wisconsin Gov. Jim Doyle, a Democrat, of the state-led effort.
Two years later, as chairman of the budget committee, Ryan became known for another PowerPoint presentation — a slide show on the federal government's ballooning debt. In that pitch, Ryan touted his budget plan, which includes a vow to "end corporate welfare."
Now Ryan's plan and his salesmanship have helped him become GOP presidential candidate Mitt Romney's running mate. The choice has thrilled conservatives who view him as a symbol of unwavering fiscal austerity and delighted Democrats who see him as a radical ideologue.
Neither characterization fits Ryan's effort to save the GM plant in his district. Despite his paeans to free markets, Ryan voted for $14 billion in emergency federal loans to help bail out the auto industry during the waning days of the George W. Bush administration.
Ryan was closely involved in a task force that helped craft two incentive packages with large state tax breaks for GM, and personally lobbied GM executives to accept the bids.
"I would say Congressman Ryan did what a good member of Congress would do for his district," Doyle said. He added that like many other Republicans, Ryan made sure to "complain about the so-called stimulus and bailouts while also lining up to make sure their districts were getting taken care of."
Ryan's record of seeking federal money for his district came under close scrutiny last week after he denied and then acknowledged requesting money available under the $800-billion stimulus bill passed by Congress in 2009. Ryan had voted against the bill, and decried it as wasteful. In a statement Thursday, he said constituents' requests for stimulus funds "should have been handled differently."
A Ryan aide, who asked for anonymity because he was not authorized to discuss the issue, said that although Ryan's proposed budget plan promises to take the federal government "out of the business of picking winners and losers in the marketplace," he makes a distinction between what is appropriate for the federal and state governments. Ryan believes states are free to compete for business as they see fit, the aide said.
No one in Janesville was surprised that their native son would try to save the GM plant.
Ryan's family had been in the blue-collar town for five generations, even longer than the GM plant, then 82 years old. Ryan's father had worked there one summer during high school. Ryan regularly campaigned outside the gates when he ran for Congress.
Rumors of the plant's demise were perennial, however. When GM finally announced in May 2008 that it would stop production by year's end, local and state officials scrambled to save more than 4,000 jobs.
Local, state and federal leaders formed a task force to persuade GM to give Janesville another look. Ryan's chief of staff was a fixture at the meetings and Ryan regularly reached out to GM Chief Executive Rick Wagoner, with whom he had forged a close working relationship, participants said.
Ryan "knew what it meant, how devastating it would be," said Tim Cullen, the task force co-chairman and now a Democratic state senator. "I think he showed he has a pragmatic streak in him."
At the September 2008 meeting in Detroit, Ryan helped pitch a $224-million proposal that included roughly $50 million in state enterprise zone tax credits, local government grants worth $22 million, and major contract concessions from the United Auto Workers union local.
But it soon became clear that the future of Janesville — and all of GM — hinged on federal intervention.
In late November, executives from Detroit's Big Three flew to Washington to ask for a bailout. The next day, Mitt Romney made his opposition clear in a New York Times op-ed titled, "Let Detroit Go Bankrupt."
Ryan disagreed. He supported a House bill that offered $14 billion in fast-tracked loans to GM and Chrysler. Ryan cited his district's "gut-wrenching" experience with layoffs, and a commitment to the auto industry. He also suggested that, under other circumstances, he might have voted no.
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Oh, Romney and Paul are truly a match made in Heaven. ROFLMAO.
How you Republicans support them is beyond amusing.
So do you support Ryan`s Bailout vote and his Secret Bailout Meetings with GM or do you support his nonsense afterwards? Which Ryan is it?
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The meltdown Ryan has generated tells me his speech was quite effective.
Obama lies while America dies.
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And your point is?
The bottom line is that Obama pissed away the $$$$ and broke his promise TO LEAD AN EFFORT TO RETOOL THE PLANT
Looks like it was more of Ryan`s promise to Bailout the plant than Obama. He even had meetings with them and did a power point presentation as well tried to broker a deal with the Bailout money to pay the Unions.
Ryan must have failed on his promise eh?
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Oh, Romney and Paul are truly a match made in Heaven. ROFLMAO.
How you Republicans support them is beyond amusing.
So do you support Ryan`s Bailout vote and his Secret Bailout Meetings with GM or do you support his nonsense afterwards? Which Ryan is it?
We are A B O
I would vote for Charles Manson / Ed Geins' corpse to get this piece of shit of office.
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We are A B O
I would vote for Charles Manson / Ed Geins' corpse to get this piece of shit of office.
TA...you know youve won a debate with 3333 when he goes the ABO route
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TA...you know youve won a debate with 3333 when he goes the ABO route
Well its just hilarious to even see this kind of nonsense. They are essentially arguing against Obama when he stayed pretty much out of the whole GM plant thing. Whereas, you had Ryan flying to the plant, holding meetings with GM, discussing what he could do for them with the Bailout Money, then voting for the Bailout, then Failing to deliver.
Somehow Obama is at fault for Ryan`s actions here. Its amusing really.
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TA...you know youve won a debate with 3333 when he goes the ABO route
LOL - I posted obama's own words that HE WOULD LEAD AN EFFORT TO RE-TOOL THE PLANT!
Did obama do that YES or NO?
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Well its just hilarious to even see this kind of nonsense. They are essentially arguing against Obama when he stayed pretty much out of the whole GM plant thing. Whereas, you had Ryan flying to the plant, holding meetings with GM, discussing what he could do for them with the Bailout Money, then voting for the Bailout, then Failing to deliver.
Somehow Obama is at fault for Ryan`s actions here. Its amusing really.
I have always been of the opinioin that if you as a Gov took Bail out money, you shouldnt utter a word against Obama as it pertians to the Economy/Jobs...
Now if you didnt take the money and your State's economy and Jobs stayed in tact, or weathered the storm.. then you have a leg to stand on.. Otherwise.
We built this!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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LOL - I posted obama's own words that HE WOULD LEAD AN EFFORT TO RE-TOOL THE PLANT!
Did obama do that YES or NO?
Isn`t it clear that Ryan who flew to the plant, held private meetings with GM, discussing what he could do for them with the Bailout Money, then voting for the Bailout, promised them he would keep it open and really failed big time?
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I have always been of the opinioin that if you as a Gov took Bail out money, you shouldnt utter a word against Obama as it pertians to the Economy/Jobs...
Now if you didnt take the money and your State's economy and Jobs stayed in tact, or weathered the storm.. then you have a leg to stand on.. Otherwise.
We built this!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Ryan is a little shit-head. Its hilarious how Republicans support him, yet he votes and does completely the opposite of what they claim to believe in.
The thought processes of Republicans are just not all there I think.
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GetBig comes before manta rays and your children.
Get your ass a smart phone, park yourself in a bathroom stall at the zoo and take care of business.
LMAO.... manta rays are badass.
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I have always been of the opinioin that if you as a Gov took Bail out money, you shouldnt utter a word against Obama as it pertians to the Economy/Jobs...
Now if you didnt take the money and your State's economy and Jobs stayed in tact, or weathered the storm.. then you have a leg to stand on.. Otherwise.
We built this!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
3. In October 2008 Obama doubled down on his promise to keep Janesville plant open: “As president, I will lead an effort to retool plants like the GM facility in Janesville so we can build the fuel-efficient cars of tomorrow and create good-paying jobs in Wisconsin and all across America.”
DID OBAMA LEAD AN EFFORT - YES OR NO?
NOW GO GET YOUR SHINE BOX MORON
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3. In October 2008 Obama doubled down on his promise to keep Janesville plant open: “As president, I will lead an effort to retool plants like the GM facility in Janesville so we can build the fuel-efficient cars of tomorrow and create good-paying jobs in Wisconsin and all across America.”
DID OBAMA LEAD AN EFFORT - YES OR NO?
NOW GO GET YOUR SHINE BOX MORON
I think Ryan was the lead effort here given that it was Ryan who flew to the plant, held private meetings with GM, discussing what he could do for them with the Bailout Money, then voting for the Bailout, promised them he would keep it open and really failed big time.
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3. In October 2008 Obama doubled down on his promise to keep Janesville plant open: “As president, I will lead an effort to retool plants like the GM facility in Janesville so we can build the fuel-efficient cars of tomorrow and create good-paying jobs in Wisconsin and all across America.”
DID OBAMA LEAD AN EFFORT - YES OR NO?
NOW GO GET YOUR SHINE BOX MORON
Uhohhh you mean business.. you typed in CAPS...
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I think Ryan was the lead effort here given that it was Ryan who flew to the plant, held private meetings with GM, discussing what he could do for them with the Bailout Money, then voting for the Bailout, promised them he would keep it open and really failed big time.
LOL - a house member has no ability to do that all on his own. Obama did.
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LOL - a house member has no ability to do that all on his own. Obama did.
Oh no, Ryan was the one who flew to the plant, held private meetings with GM, discussing what he could do for them with the Bailout Money, then voted for the Bailout after the meetings.
Only problem was, that he didn`t deliver.
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Oh no, Ryan was the one who flew to the plant, held private meetings with GM, discussing what he could do for them with the Bailout Money, then voted for the Bailout after the meetings.
Only problem was, that he didn`t deliver.
LOL. you are clueless.
Ryan as a single house member could not veto the efforts of Obama's car czar.
The lengths you will go to cover his failed presidency is astounding.
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LOL. you are clueless.
Ryan as a single house member could not veto the efforts of Obama's car czar.
The lengths you will go to cover his failed presidency is astounding.
Why would Ryan want to veto something he fully supported? ??? ??? ???
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Why would Ryan want to veto something he fully supported? ??? ??? ???
He supported the initial bailout - but obama then used the packaged bankruptcy to give 55% of the company to the UAW.
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He supported the initial bailout - but obama then used the packaged bankruptcy to give 55% of the company to the UAW.
Ryan planned to give the Bailout Money to them also. He even met with them Pre-Bailout vote to hear their concerns and wanted to give them what they asked for. He failed though.
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He supported the initial bailout - but obama then used the packaged bankruptcy to give 55% of the company to the UAW.
Not only did he support it, he voted for it and wanted to use the money to specifically channel it to the Janesville Plant. He failed.
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Ryan planned to give the Bailout Money to them also. He even met with them Pre-Bailout vote to hear their concerns and wanted to give them what they asked for. He failed though.
It was obama's car czar that dictated the closures, no one else.
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It was obama's car czar that dictated the closures, no one else.
General Motors already planned to close the plant way before Obama even won the Democratic Primary.
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It was obama's car czar that dictated the closures, no one else.
Do you support Ryan Flying to the plant, holding private meetings with GM, discussing what he could do for them with the Bailout Money, then voting for the Bailout?
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General Motors already planned to close the plant way before Obama even won the Democratic Primary.
As a part of their Restructure plans?
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The Truth about the GM Janesville Plant
Actually, Paul Ryan left out something about the Janesville GM plant — it was one of three plants GM was considering reopening back in 2010. We posted this piece from the WSJ on it. Sadly, Janesville lost out because of “community impact” and its “carbon footrpint.” The bribe from Michigan probably helped as well:
How GM is Choosing its New Plants
From today’s WSJ:
When it was deciding where to build its new compact car, General Motors Corp. made a point of saying it would push politics aside and use strictly commercial criteria.
So Tennessee’s three top officials were astonished last month, in a meeting with GM, when they were told the first two criteria were “community impact” and “carbon footprint” — or how the choice would affect unemployment rates and carbon-dioxide emissions.
“Those didn’t strike us as business criteria at all,” said Tennessee Sen. Lamar Alexander, who was joined in the meeting by fellow Republican Sen. Bob Corker and the state’s Democratic governor, Phil Bredesen. Those factors, Mr. Alexander said, “seemed odd for a company struggling to get back on its feet.”
On June 26, after a monthlong competition, GM tapped an existing factory in Orion, Mich., pushing aside competing plants in Spring Hill, Tenn., and Janesville, Wis.
And . . .
Michigan won the bidding by offering $779 million in business tax credits over the next 20 years, along with $130 million in federal funds for worker training. Local officials threw in additional $102 million in incentives.
I asssume this deal makes the most sense for GM, but I wonder if anyone in Michigan owns a calculator. Is a $779 million business-tax credit for the 1,400 jobs this plant will create really the best use of taxpayer money in Michigan?
So, there you have it. Maybe if the good folks of Janesville all held their breath to reduce their CO2 emissions, they would’ve had a better shot at winning the business.
And, to top it off, the NYT editorialized in the summer of 2008, “R.I.P. to the S.U.V.”
Janesville made S.U.V.s. A fact we pointed out to the Times in October 2008 when Janesville was slated to closed.
http://www.nationalreview.com/planet-gore
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The Truth about the GM Janesville Plant
Actually, Paul Ryan left out something about the Janesville GM plant — it was one of three plants GM was considering reopening back in 2010. We posted this piece from the WSJ on it. Sadly, Janesville lost out because of “community impact” and its “carbon footrpint.” The bribe from Michigan probably helped as well:
How GM is Choosing its New Plants
From today’s WSJ:
When it was deciding where to build its new compact car, General Motors Corp. made a point of saying it would push politics aside and use strictly commercial criteria.
So Tennessee’s three top officials were astonished last month, in a meeting with GM, when they were told the first two criteria were “community impact” and “carbon footprint” — or how the choice would affect unemployment rates and carbon-dioxide emissions.
“Those didn’t strike us as business criteria at all,” said Tennessee Sen. Lamar Alexander, who was joined in the meeting by fellow Republican Sen. Bob Corker and the state’s Democratic governor, Phil Bredesen. Those factors, Mr. Alexander said, “seemed odd for a company struggling to get back on its feet.”
On June 26, after a monthlong competition, GM tapped an existing factory in Orion, Mich., pushing aside competing plants in Spring Hill, Tenn., and Janesville, Wis.
And . . .
Michigan won the bidding by offering $779 million in business tax credits over the next 20 years, along with $130 million in federal funds for worker training. Local officials threw in additional $102 million in incentives.
I asssume this deal makes the most sense for GM, but I wonder if anyone in Michigan owns a calculator. Is a $779 million business-tax credit for the 1,400 jobs this plant will create really the best use of taxpayer money in Michigan?
So, there you have it. Maybe if the good folks of Janesville all held their breath to reduce their CO2 emissions, they would’ve had a better shot at winning the business.
And, to top it off, the NYT editorialized in the summer of 2008, “R.I.P. to the S.U.V.”
Janesville made S.U.V.s. A fact we pointed out to the Times in October 2008 when Janesville was slated to closed.
http://www.nationalreview.com/planet-gore
Ok, so now we are back to praising Obama because the plant was going to re-open, thus the Bailout worked? ???
Which is it?
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Ok, so now we are back to praising Obama because the plant was going to re-open, thus the Bailout worked? ???
Which is it?
The plant did not re-open, did not re-tool, and is still closed.
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I don`t understand.
Janesville made SUV`s, their equipment and tools were made to make SUV`s. Americans were not buying SUV`s. SUV`s sales were in the gutter. Nobody was buying SUV`s.
Why would the plant have stayed open? Did Ryan want them to continue to make SUV`s that nobody was going to buy?
GM realized nobody was buying their SUV`s so they decided to cut many production models. If nobody is buying, you change your product. Why would they need the plant if they were no longer going make SUV`s?
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The plant did not re-open, did not re-tool, and is still closed.
So you support Ryan`s efforts here, flying to the plant, holding private meetings with GM at the plant , discussing what he could do for them with the Bailout Money, then voting for the Bailout.
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I don`t understand.
Janesville made SUV`s, their equipment and tools were made to make SUV`s. Americans were not buying SUV`s. SUV`s sales were in the gutter. Nobody was buying SUV`s.
Why would the plant have stayed open? Did Ryan want them to continue to make SUV`s that nobody was going to buy?
GM realized nobody was buying their SUV`s so they decided to cut many production models. If nobody is buying, you change your product. Why would they need the plant if they were no longer going make SUV`s?
What part of Obama's promise TO LEAD AN EFFORT TO RETOOL THE FACTORY did you miss?
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What part of Obama's promise TO LEAD AN EFFORT TO RETOOL THE FACTORY did you miss?
???
Correct me if I`m wrong but it was Ryan who flew to the plant, held private meetings with GM, discussing what he could do for them with the Bailout Money, then voting for the Bailout, promised them he would keep it open and really failed big time?
I take it you support this. ???
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???
Correct me if I`m wrong but it was Ryan who flew to the plant, held private meetings with GM, discussing what he could do for them with the Bailout Money, then voting for the Bailout, promised them he would keep it open and really failed big time?
I take it you support this. ???
Post a link
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Posted at 11:22 AM ET, 08/30/2012
Ryan freaks out Obamaland
By Jennifer Rubin
http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/right-turn/post/ryan-freaks-out-obamaland/2012/08/30/be97852e-f2ac-11e1-adc6-87dfa8eff430_blog.html
The Democrats are losing it, literally. The Obama camp and its surrogates are losing the fight to control the narrative about Mitt Romney and Rep. Paul Ryan (R-Wis.) They are losing the effort to distract voters through the presence at the GOP convention of Obama campaign staffers such as Robert Gibbs and Ben LaBolt, who spend their time wandering about and whining to the media here in Tampa about the “negativity” of the other side. They are losing the ability to con the media into focusing on likability, as if perceptions of Romney and Ryan wouldn’t improve after this event.
That spilled over last night in a group outburst from Romney-Ryan critics over Paul Ryan’s speech. Needless to say, the speech was a ringing success with delegates and in much of the mainstream media. Ryan bloodied President Obama with blow after blow, all the while appearing cheery and sincere. The crowd loved it. So nearly en masse the left decided that Ryan “lied.”
For starters, that is the ultimate compliment. It is in effect saying the speech worked so well and was received so well that the only thing to say is that it was a con job.
But the “lies” turn out not to be lies at all. They are not even misrepresentations or exaggerations.
Take Ryan’s criticism of Obama’s ignoring Simpson-Bowles. This is a fact. That Ryan voted for it and then put together the only comprehensive budget using some elements of Simpson-Bowles (a premium-support Medicare plan, block-granting Medicaid) doesn’t make his remarks about Obama a lie. A true statement — Obama ignored Simpson-Bowles — is not a lie because there is another true statement — Ryan voted no and came up with his own plan. This is a standard of “lying” that has never been applied to the president, by the way.
Then there is the “lie” that Obama took $716 billion out of Medicare. That is also a fact. That Ryan, who has now signed onto Romney’s plan which puts the money back, previously took those cuts to put back into the Medicare trust fund does not make the statement false. Obama can defend the cuts and say it wasn’t so bad or say that sticking the money into Obamacare was justified, but Ryan did relate what Obama did.
Then there is the accusation that Ryan “lied” about the Janesville GM plant. Let’s recall exactly what he said: “‘I believe that if our government is there to support you … this plant will be here for another hundred years.’ That’s what [Obama] said in 2008. Well, as it turned out, that plant didn’t last another year. It is locked up and empty to this day. And that’s how it is in so many towns today, where the recovery that was promised is nowhere in sight.” Ryan quoted Obama accurately.
Ryan never said the plant was closed by Obama; he said Obama promised to revive the plant and couldn’t deliver. That is a fact, not a ”lie.” Well, it’s not a lie by Ryan; and I’ll not call Obama’s promise to keep the plant open a “lie.” Obama just didn’t deliver. The Romney-Ryan campaign points to a story in the Milwaukee Journal-Sentinel verifying that a decision was made in 2011, well after Obama’s Janesville appearance, to keep the plant on standby. (“Since they were shut down in 2009, both the Janesville and Tennessee plants have been on standby status, meaning they were not producing vehicles, but they were not completely shut down.”)
The stings on these issues cut so deeply that I suppose that the Obama team and its media allies are crazed to turn facts into lies and aspirations into distortions. Take Ryan’s statement that he’ll keep GDP below 20 percent. What Ryan critics say is “misleading” is in fact a policy difference. Ryan’s budget does bring spending to about 20 percent of GDP, with an increase in defense spending. It’s fine to say that’s a bad choice; but it’s not misleading.
It is likewise not misleading to say: “None of us have to settle for the best this administration offers — a dull, adventureless journey from one entitlement to the next, a government-planned life, a country where everything is free but us.” That is an accurate description of Obama’s own “Life of Julia” Web site, which depicted exactly that. If anyone blew it, it was the Obama team in putting out a caricature of the liberal welfare state.
I understand the frustration of Obama’s camp and its supporters. Moreover, I think much of the media accusations were offered in haste in an effort to get out the instant reaction without the media doing their full homework. It is a revealing moment, for the press and the Obama camp. For members of the Obama team, it means they are losing the race, and they know it.
By Jennifer Rubin | 11:22 AM ET, 08/30/2012
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Post a link
http://articles.latimes.com/2012/aug/18/nation/la-na-ryan-gm-20120818
Rep. Paul Ryan fought to bail out GM plant in Wisconsin district
Conservatives view Mitt Romney's running mate as a symbol of fiscal austerity and Democrats see him as a radical ideologue. Neither characterization fits his effort to save the GM plant.
August 18, 2012|By Kathleen Hennessey, Washington Bureau
Email
Share
The shuttered General Motors plant in Janesville, Wis., hometown of Rep.… (Andy Manis, Associated…)
JANESVILLE, Wis. — In September 2008, as Wall Street was roiling with calamity, Rep. Paul D. Ryan was facing another looming disaster back home.
A General Motors plant, the lifeblood of his hometown, was set to close. The huge Suburbans and Tahoes from the Janesville production line were no longer in vogue. The aging plant was to stop production by Christmas — unless Ryan and other Wisconsin officials could save it.
Ryan, then the ranking Republican on the House Budget Committee, flew to Detroit to cajole GM executives. For more than an hour, he and other officials made a PowerPoint proposal that mixed union concessions with unprecedented state and local tax breaks for GM.
"We put an enormous package on the table," said then-Wisconsin Gov. Jim Doyle, a Democrat, of the state-led effort.
Two years later, as chairman of the budget committee, Ryan became known for another PowerPoint presentation — a slide show on the federal government's ballooning debt. In that pitch, Ryan touted his budget plan, which includes a vow to "end corporate welfare."
Now Ryan's plan and his salesmanship have helped him become GOP presidential candidate Mitt Romney's running mate. The choice has thrilled conservatives who view him as a symbol of unwavering fiscal austerity and delighted Democrats who see him as a radical ideologue.
Neither characterization fits Ryan's effort to save the GM plant in his district. Despite his paeans to free markets, Ryan voted for $14 billion in emergency federal loans to help bail out the auto industry during the waning days of the George W. Bush administration.
Ryan was closely involved in a task force that helped craft two incentive packages with large state tax breaks for GM, and personally lobbied GM executives to accept the bids.
"I would say Congressman Ryan did what a good member of Congress would do for his district," Doyle said. He added that like many other Republicans, Ryan made sure to "complain about the so-called stimulus and bailouts while also lining up to make sure their districts were getting taken care of."
Ryan's record of seeking federal money for his district came under close scrutiny last week after he denied and then acknowledged requesting money available under the $800-billion stimulus bill passed by Congress in 2009. Ryan had voted against the bill, and decried it as wasteful. In a statement Thursday, he said constituents' requests for stimulus funds "should have been handled differently."
A Ryan aide, who asked for anonymity because he was not authorized to discuss the issue, said that although Ryan's proposed budget plan promises to take the federal government "out of the business of picking winners and losers in the marketplace," he makes a distinction between what is appropriate for the federal and state governments. Ryan believes states are free to compete for business as they see fit, the aide said.
No one in Janesville was surprised that their native son would try to save the GM plant.
Ryan's family had been in the blue-collar town for five generations, even longer than the GM plant, then 82 years old. Ryan's father had worked there one summer during high school. Ryan regularly campaigned outside the gates when he ran for Congress.
Rumors of the plant's demise were perennial, however. When GM finally announced in May 2008 that it would stop production by year's end, local and state officials scrambled to save more than 4,000 jobs.
Local, state and federal leaders formed a task force to persuade GM to give Janesville another look. Ryan's chief of staff was a fixture at the meetings and Ryan regularly reached out to GM Chief Executive Rick Wagoner, with whom he had forged a close working relationship, participants said.
Ryan "knew what it meant, how devastating it would be," said Tim Cullen, the task force co-chairman and now a Democratic state senator. "I think he showed he has a pragmatic streak in him."
At the September 2008 meeting in Detroit, Ryan helped pitch a $224-million proposal that included roughly $50 million in state enterprise zone tax credits, local government grants worth $22 million, and major contract concessions from the United Auto Workers union local.
But it soon became clear that the future of Janesville — and all of GM — hinged on federal intervention.
In late November, executives from Detroit's Big Three flew to Washington to ask for a bailout. The next day, Mitt Romney made his opposition clear in a New York Times op-ed titled, "Let Detroit Go Bankrupt."
Ryan disagreed. He supported a House bill that offered $14 billion in fast-tracked loans to GM and Chrysler. Ryan cited his district's "gut-wrenching" experience with layoffs, and a commitment to the auto industry. He also suggested that, under other circumstances, he might have voted no.
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The plant is on standby status and not closed. Your number 6 even states its not closed yet.
But that doesn`t really matter because I don`t see where Obama made any promises to specifically keep any plant open.
HEHEHEHE!!
You must have failed the Hooked on Phonics course.
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and - at the time he was in the minority party. You act like a single congressman in the minority party can do all this on his own?
Geez dude.
http://articles.latimes.com/2012/aug/18/nation/la-na-ryan-gm-20120818
Rep. Paul Ryan fought to bail out GM plant in Wisconsin district
Conservatives view Mitt Romney's running mate as a symbol of fiscal austerity and Democrats see him as a radical ideologue. Neither characterization fits his effort to save the GM plant.
August 18, 2012|By Kathleen Hennessey, Washington Bureau
Email
Share
The shuttered General Motors plant in Janesville, Wis., hometown of Rep.… (Andy Manis, Associated…)
JANESVILLE, Wis. — In September 2008, as Wall Street was roiling with calamity, Rep. Paul D. Ryan was facing another looming disaster back home.
A General Motors plant, the lifeblood of his hometown, was set to close. The huge Suburbans and Tahoes from the Janesville production line were no longer in vogue. The aging plant was to stop production by Christmas — unless Ryan and other Wisconsin officials could save it.
Ryan, then the ranking Republican on the House Budget Committee, flew to Detroit to cajole GM executives. For more than an hour, he and other officials made a PowerPoint proposal that mixed union concessions with unprecedented state and local tax breaks for GM.
"We put an enormous package on the table," said then-Wisconsin Gov. Jim Doyle, a Democrat, of the state-led effort.
Two years later, as chairman of the budget committee, Ryan became known for another PowerPoint presentation — a slide show on the federal government's ballooning debt. In that pitch, Ryan touted his budget plan, which includes a vow to "end corporate welfare."
Now Ryan's plan and his salesmanship have helped him become GOP presidential candidate Mitt Romney's running mate. The choice has thrilled conservatives who view him as a symbol of unwavering fiscal austerity and delighted Democrats who see him as a radical ideologue.
Neither characterization fits Ryan's effort to save the GM plant in his district. Despite his paeans to free markets, Ryan voted for $14 billion in emergency federal loans to help bail out the auto industry during the waning days of the George W. Bush administration.
Ryan was closely involved in a task force that helped craft two incentive packages with large state tax breaks for GM, and personally lobbied GM executives to accept the bids.
"I would say Congressman Ryan did what a good member of Congress would do for his district," Doyle said. He added that like many other Republicans, Ryan made sure to "complain about the so-called stimulus and bailouts while also lining up to make sure their districts were getting taken care of."
Ryan's record of seeking federal money for his district came under close scrutiny last week after he denied and then acknowledged requesting money available under the $800-billion stimulus bill passed by Congress in 2009. Ryan had voted against the bill, and decried it as wasteful. In a statement Thursday, he said constituents' requests for stimulus funds "should have been handled differently."
A Ryan aide, who asked for anonymity because he was not authorized to discuss the issue, said that although Ryan's proposed budget plan promises to take the federal government "out of the business of picking winners and losers in the marketplace," he makes a distinction between what is appropriate for the federal and state governments. Ryan believes states are free to compete for business as they see fit, the aide said.
No one in Janesville was surprised that their native son would try to save the GM plant.
Ryan's family had been in the blue-collar town for five generations, even longer than the GM plant, then 82 years old. Ryan's father had worked there one summer during high school. Ryan regularly campaigned outside the gates when he ran for Congress.
Rumors of the plant's demise were perennial, however. When GM finally announced in May 2008 that it would stop production by year's end, local and state officials scrambled to save more than 4,000 jobs.
Local, state and federal leaders formed a task force to persuade GM to give Janesville another look. Ryan's chief of staff was a fixture at the meetings and Ryan regularly reached out to GM Chief Executive Rick Wagoner, with whom he had forged a close working relationship, participants said.
Ryan "knew what it meant, how devastating it would be," said Tim Cullen, the task force co-chairman and now a Democratic state senator. "I think he showed he has a pragmatic streak in him."
At the September 2008 meeting in Detroit, Ryan helped pitch a $224-million proposal that included roughly $50 million in state enterprise zone tax credits, local government grants worth $22 million, and major contract concessions from the United Auto Workers union local.
But it soon became clear that the future of Janesville — and all of GM — hinged on federal intervention.
In late November, executives from Detroit's Big Three flew to Washington to ask for a bailout. The next day, Mitt Romney made his opposition clear in a New York Times op-ed titled, "Let Detroit Go Bankrupt."
Ryan disagreed. He supported a House bill that offered $14 billion in fast-tracked loans to GM and Chrysler. Ryan cited his district's "gut-wrenching" experience with layoffs, and a commitment to the auto industry. He also suggested that, under other circumstances, he might have voted no.
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So like a ping pong ball, Adonis is now arguing that Ryan is wrong for taking Stim money after being shown that the "fact checkers" for the left lied about when the Janesville plant closed. So in the end, Ryan didn't lie, the left did. Thanks.
Typical liberals.
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So like a ping pong ball, Adonis is now arguing that Ryan is wrong for taking Stim money after being shown that the "fact checkers" for the left lied about when the Janesville plant closed. So in the end, Ryan didn't lie, the left did. Thanks.
Typical liberals.
Where have I argued anything? I am just presenting the facts.
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So like a ping pong ball, Adonis is now arguing that Ryan is wrong for taking Stim money after being shown that the "fact checkers" for the left lied about when the Janesville plant closed. So in the end, Ryan didn't lie, the left did. Thanks.
Typical liberals.
???
The plant closing was put in action before Barack even won the election. Ryan who flew to the plant, held private meetings with GM, discussing what he could do for them with the Bailout Money, then voting for the Bailout, promised them he would keep it open and really failed.
What more is there to know?
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???
The plant closing was put in action before Barack even won the election. Ryan who flew to the plant, held private meetings with GM, discussing what he could do for them with the Bailout Money, then voting for the Bailout, promised them he would keep it open and really failed.
What more is there to know?
YES BUT OBAMA PROMISED TO KEEP IT OPEN AND LEAD AN EFFORT TO RETOOL IT SO IT COULD STAY OPEN 100 YEARS.
HE DID NOT FOLLOW THROUGH W THAT PROMISE
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"We're not going to let our campaign be dictated by fact-checkers," Romney pollster Neil Newhouse said at a panel organized by ABC News.
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
here's one truth :D :D :D :D :D
this should have been the theme of the RNC convention
Although their "we built it" theme is pretty much the same thing
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this should have been the theme of the RNC convention
Although their "we built it" theme is pretty much the same thing
Well these so called "fact checkers" completly shit the bed to kneepad obama since his failed presidency is being taken to task.
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Well these so called "fact checkers" completly shit the bed to kneepad obama since his failed presidency is being taken to task.
obviously you've forgotten that you imagine something and then pretend its actually true
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???
The plant closing was put in action before Barack even won the election. Ryan who flew to the plant, held private meetings with GM, discussing what he could do for them with the Bailout Money, then voting for the Bailout, promised them he would keep it open and really failed.
What more is there to know?
You are business stalwart.
By all indication the plant was not going to close as long as there was a profit to be made. That was clear by the appearance of your messiah at the plant. Promising that it would stay open.
Or are you saying that Obama was too stupid to realize that the plant was going to close anyway and still made those statements? Reminds me of Solyndra.
Thanks for proving why lil barry should be voted out.
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You are business stalwart.
By all indication the plant was not going to close as long as there was a profit to be made. That was clear by the appearance of your messiah at the plant. Promisin that it would stay open.
Or are you saying that Obama was too stupid to realize that the plant was going to close anyway and still made those statements. Reminds me of Solyndra.
Thanks for proving why lil barry should be voted out.
Imagine that, having to make a profit to say in business.
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Imagine that, having to make a profit to say in business.
Obama is against profit remember?
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Facts and evidence.... Republican minds "have a way to shut that down".
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Imagine that, having to make a profit to say in business.
Obama takes that profit and gives it to the leeches.
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Politifact Lies About Paul Ryan and the Janesville GM Plant
Stephen Gutowski
Thursday, August 30, 2012 - 11:25am
Last night Politifact Wisconsin issued one of the least factual and most skewed "fact checks" I've ever seen. Not only do they bend over backwards to provide cover to one of the most impotent promises President Obama ever made, they also simply lie about the key facts they use to label Paul Ryan's claim false. Here is Politifact's ruling:
Ryan said Obama broke his promise to keep a Wisconsin GM plant from closing. But we don't see evidence he explicitly made such a promise -- and more importantly, the Janesville plant shut down before he took office.
We rate Ryan's statement False.
Let's start with what Obama said and see if any reasonable human being who isn't simply shilling for the President could possibly reach the same conclusion as Politifact:
I know that General Motors received some bad news yesterday, and I know how hard your Governor has fought to keep jobs in this plant. But I also know how much progress you’ve made – how many hybrids and fuel-efficient vehicles you’re churning out. And I believe that if our government is there to support you, and give you the assistance you need to re-tool and make this transition, that this plant will be here for another hundred years. The question is not whether a clean energy economy is in our future, it’s where it will thrive. I want it to thrive right here in the United States of America; right here in Wisconsin; and that’s the future I’ll fight for as your President.
So, President Obama went to the Janesville GM plant and told them that if the policies he supports were enacted, the plant would "be here for another hundred years". If a presidential candidate comes to your plant and tells you the execution of his policies will keep it open for another hundred years that's a promise or a guarentee or whatever you want. However, it most certainly isn't meaningless as Politifact would like us all to believe.
And, of course, President Obama's policies were enacted but the Janesville GM plant didn't even survive through all of 2009. Instead, it shut down on April 23rd 2009. Which brings me to the next point. Politifact is just plain lying about when the Jainsville plant closed.
They claim it "effectively" closed in December of 2008. That's simply false. While the SUV line in the plant was shut down in December of 2008 the plant's truck line remained up and running until April 23rd 2009.
There's just no way around that. Throwing in a weasel word like "effectively" doesn't change anything. The simple fact is that closed factories don't build trucks.
So, there you have it. President Obama promised the Janesville GM plant would go on building for a hundred years but even after the government bought GM and Obama came into office the plant shut down. That's the reality of the situation whether the liberals at Politifact like it or not.
http://mrctv.org/blog/politifact-lies-about-paul-ryan-and-janesville-gm-plant
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Why the Left freaked out about Paul Ryan telling the truth about the Janesville closing
RedState ^ | August 30, 2012 | Moe Lane
Posted on August 30, 2012 11:12:08 AM EDT by Cincinatus' Wife
From Paul Ryan’s convention speech yesterday:
>>>President Barack Obama came to office during an economic crisis, as he has reminded us a time or two. Those were very tough days, and any fair measure of his record has to take that into account. My home state voted for President Obama. When he talked about change, many people liked the sound of it, especially in Janesville, where we were about to lose a major factory.
A lot of guys I went to high school with worked at that GM plant. Right there at that plant, candidate Obama said: “I believe that if our government is there to support you … this plant will be here for another hundred years.” That’s what he said in 2008.
Well, as it turned out, that plant didn’t last another year. It is locked up and empty to this day. And that’s how it is in so many towns today, where the recovery that was promised is nowhere in sight.<<<
This is, by the way, a perfectly accurate statement. There was a GM plant in Janesville. Barack Obama did make a speech there in 2008. He did, in that speech, make those comments. And the plant did not “last another year” – despite, I should note, the Obama administration’s bailout of GM that the administration is kind-of, sort-of touting as an ‘achievement.’ These are all true things; which has not kept the Left from screaming otherwise, to the point where the Obama campaign has officially (and in my opinion, unwisely) called Paul Ryan a liar.
There are two things that jump out at me about the reaction to Ryan’s comments:
1. The liberals who were not aware of the details originally are displaying what is frankly an appalling level of ignorance about… well, take your pick. The President’s embarrassingly bad track record when it comes to his promises? The state of America, outside of the Leftist Pale that is the Beltway? Paul Ryan’s rhetorical history? – Pick one or another; they all fit. Particularly this last one; nobody should have been surprised to see the Republican VP nominee talk about a factory closing in his home town.
2. And that leads to the liberals who were aware of the details originally: those folks are being pretty appalling, all on their own. There’s a certain level of ignorance here, as well – but there’s rather more mendacity. You see, unlike the Leftist blogs and websites and rank-and-file membership, the people running the Democratic party actually know what is going on with the world today. They can’t help but know about it; after all, they’re almost exclusively responsible for the state of affairs which has made this economic recovery the weakest one within most people’s memory.
And yet, instead of simply gritting their teeth and taking the hit, the Democratic Establishment is trying to incite its base by calling something true a lie. Which to me suggests that the Left – specifically, the Obama for America team – is simultaneously utterly contemptuous of its own base’s ability to reason, and quietly terrified that said base might eventually wise up to the fact that it’s being taken for the Mother Of All Rides. That these two attitudes are subtly contradictory should be no surprise: to mangle Lewis Carroll, the Left has long been accustomed to believing six impossible things before breakfast.
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well this has to be true it's from redstate :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D
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well this has to be true it's from redstate :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D
I posted the rebuttal from Forbes. did you not see that?
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I posted the rebuttal from Forbes. did you not see that?
I saw that even Fox News called him out on his bullshit.
Why bother defending this weasley schmuck at this point?
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Facts and evidence.... Republican minds "have a way to shut that down".
It comes with their religion
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well this has to be true it's from redstate :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D
That's actually a pretty damn good blog.
Anyways, here is the skinny.
-GM had scheduled to close the Janesville plant, which was a joint Izuzu/GM venture, during the summer of 2008.
-Production of GM vehicles ended during the later part of 2008, while Bush was still in office.
-The plant remained open to complete production of the last remaining light/medium duty trucks until April of 2009.
-After orders were filled the plant was shuttered and decommissioned.
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Bump for Straw and Option FAIL
FACT CHECK: Obama promised and failed to keep Janesville GM plant open
August 30, 2012 | 9:36 am
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Senior Editorial Writer
The Washington Examiner
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FACT CHECK: Obama promised and failed to keep Janesville GM plant open
Last night, in his Republican National Convention speech, Paul Ryan said:
President Barack Obama came to office during an economic crisis, as he has reminded us a time or two. Those were very tough days, and any fair measure of his record has to take that into account. My home state voted for President Obama. When he talked about change, many people liked the sound of it, especially in Janesville, where we were about to lose a major factory.
A lot of guys I went to high school with worked at that GM plant. Right there at that plant, candidate Obama said: “I believe that if our government is there to support you … this plant will be here for another hundred years.” That’s what he said in 2008.
Well, as it turned out, that plant didn’t last another year. It is locked up and empty to this day. And that’s how it is in so many towns today, where the recovery that was promised is nowhere in sight.
The Washington Post, and a host of other liberal media outlets, are calling this passage “misleading” because the Janesville plant “closed before the president was inaugurated.” The Post is dead wrong. Here are the facts:
1. On February 13, 2008 Obama said in Janesville : “I believe that if our government is there to support you, and give you the assistance you need to re-tool and make this transition, that this plant will be here for another hundred years.”
2. In June 2008 GM announced that the Janesville plant would stop production of medium-duty trucks by the end of 2009, and stop production of large SUVs in 2010 or sooner.
3. In October 2008 Obama doubled down on his promise to keep Janesville plant open: “As president, I will lead an effort to retool plants like the GM facility in Janesville so we can build the fuel-efficient cars of tomorrow and create good-paying jobs in Wisconsin and all across America.”
4. In December 2008 GM idled production of GM SUVs at the Janesville plant. Medium-duty truck assembly continued.
5. In April 2009, four months after Obama was inaugurated, GM idled production of medium-duty trucks.
6. In September 2011, more than two years after Obama was inaugurated, GM reiterates that Janesville plant is on “stand by status.” Auto industry observer David Cole, tells the Milwaukee Journal-Sentinel it would be premature to say the Janesville plant will never reopen.
6. Today the GM facility in Janesville still has not been retooled “so we can build the fuel-efficient cars of tomorrow and create good-paying jobs,” as Obama promised.
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I saw that even Fox News called him out on his bullshit.
Why bother defending this weasley schmuck at this point?
Yeah, its very funny at this point
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It's almost like Obama doesn't constantly lie through his teeth.
LOL @ bitter butthurt "progs" who are getting a taste of Chicago politics.
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Bump for Hugo
Obama Camp Melts Down Over Ryan's Speech
By Guy Benson
8/30/2012
http://townhall.com/tipsheet/guybenson/2012/08/30/obama_camp_melts_down_over_ryans_speech
The Obama campaign is lashing out at Paul Ryan, claiming that his fantastic convention speech last night was packed with falsehoods and lies. Here's their hysterical response video:
To the surprise of no one, the ad's "rebuttals" are misleading and wrong themselves. Point by point:
(1) They begin with video of CNN reporters discussing accusations of Ryan's "lies." This is proof that the Obama campaign sent out a lot of angry emails, and nothing else.
(2) Medicare - Sorry, guys, but it is 100 percent true that Obamacare raided $716 Billion from Medicare to pay for itself. It does cut benefits to current seniors. And Paul Ryan's plan took the president's Medicare "savings," and re-routed them back into Medicare to shore up the program. Mitt Romney's plan would undo those cuts altogether. Obama took those cuts and used them to pay for Obamacare. He has admitted this on camera:
(3) The GM Plant - Part of the factory Ryan mentioned was shut down under Bush, despite the initial GM bailout (which Senator Obama supported). The plant finally fully closed in April of 2009, during Obama's presidency, as this report clearly states. Obama's problem is that he showed up and made empty promises to pander for votes. Ryan never said Obama was personally responsible for the plant's closure, but he accurately stated that it closed down within a year of candidate Obama's hope-filled speech and remains closed today. Obama goes on and on about "saving" the auto industry and his economic recovery. That boarded-up Janesville plant tells a different story.
(4) The Stimulus - Pointing out that Paul Ryan asked that his district receive a slice of a giant, wasteful pie after it was passed -- and despite his opposition -- is at worst an instance of hypocrisy. It does not disprove anything that Ryan said in his speech, and it does not change the empirical fact that Barack Obama's borrowed stimulus has utterly failed based on the metrics for success Obama himself set out for it.
(5) The debt commission - What Ryan said is absolutely correct. The Obama ad quotes Chris Wallace, who notes that Ryan was on that commission and voted against it. True. He refused to abide the section maintaining Obamacare, and voted no on its final findings. Still, he was intimately involved in the group's deliberations and proposed solutions. Not fully happy with the final outcome, he went on to craft two budgets of his own, with numerous elements based on the Simpson-Bowles framework. The commission's Democratic co-chairman (Bowles of Simpson-Bowles) has praised Ryan's proposals to the hilt. Barack Obama, who convened the commission in the first place after deriding commissions on the campaign trail, completely ignored its recommendations and proceeded to propose to wildly reckless, debt-busting budgets that received a total of zero votes in either house of Congress. Correctly asserting that Ryan opposed the final Simpson-Bowles recommendations is no way absolves Obama for his demonstrable abdication of leadership on these issues. It's more smoke and mirrors -- and more petty Obama blame, another central theme of Ryan's address.
(6) Chris Matthews called the speech "nasty." Stop the presses!
If this is all they've got, it's no wonder they're freaking out. Paul Ryan told the truth about Barack Obama, and the president's campaign can't handle it.
UPDATE - More smoking-gun video, this time on the GM plant. This aired in April 2009:
Guy Benson
Guy Benson is Townhall.com's Political Editor. Follow him on Twitter @guypbenson.
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why do you post some right wing hack as truth ::)
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why do you post some right wing hack as truth ::)
Funny coming from the guy who posts ThinkProgress articles without sourcing them because he knows how biased they are. ::)
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why do you post some right wing hack as truth ::)
Forbes is right wingto you
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Funny coming from the guy who posts ThinkProgress articles without sourcing them because he knows how biased they are. ::)
i like how you and your boyfriend stick up fpr one another :D :D it's nice :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D
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BY GABRIEL MALOR
The Democrats' least effective spokesperson said today that Republicans should have further reduced their convention plans out of respect for the victims of Hurricane Isaac. Within minutes, I was bombarded by delighted emails, tweets, and texts most of which expressed some variation of "she's done it again!"
Look, there are things that -- as a person who simply does not have enough hours in the day -- I am not going to give serious consideration to no matter how much you want to talk about them: conspiracy theories, diet plans, Debbie Wasserman Schultz, atonal post-punk revival. You get the idea.
So instead of dwelling on President Obama's worst proxy of the day, I thought it would better to consider the President's best: media fact checkers.
Just after Rep. Paul Ryan's speech last night, Obama campaign manager Jim Messina sent an e-mail blast claiming that Ryan had "lied" about Medicare, the stimulus, the deficit and the General Motors plant closure in Ryan's home town. The media jumped like good little lapdogs, claiming that the cited parts of Ryan's speech were indeed false. This Associated Press "fact check" is typical. But every Ryan statement criticized is either absolutely true or not a fact at all, but a matter of opinion.
Townhall's Guy Benson blows up each of the AP's (and Messina's) objections. The bottom line is that the fact checker criticisms of Ryan's speech come in only one form: "Yes it's true, but here's some context that Democrats want to talk about." That's not fact checking; that's advocacy. And it's not persuasive, it's absurd.
If they stay on this course, media fact checkers, as a class, are going to be regarded as having as much credibility as Wasserman Schultz. This has already begun. In response to Republicans' continued riffs on the President's "you didn't build that" comment, Washington Post Fact Checker Glenn Kessler yesterday pulled out the big guns, saying he was "compelled to increase the Pinocchio rating to Four." In response, I'm compelled to observe that this will not change Republicans' minds -- I give it four hallucinating Dumbos.
Human Events' Jon Cassidy took a hard look at another media fact checker, PolitiFact, which instead of the Washington Post's childish Pinocchios, rates political statements on a scale of "True" to "Pants on Fire." Cassidy found that in many cases PolitiFact writers investigated claims that are matters of opinion, rather than fact. That's not fact checking, either; that's punditry. And (ahem) pundits are a dime a dozen.
I get why media fact checking got so popular in the past four years. Assigning truth values to the silly things elected officials say is entertaining and, often, enlightening. But as fact-checking becomes less about checking facts and more about checking opinions, attention will fade. Wasserman Shultz is ineffective not because she fails to entertain, but because she's not credible. As readers come to realize that media fact checkers are merely writing op-eds by another name, they too will be dismissed as easily as Wasserman Schultz.
(Photo: New York Daily News)
http://www.nydailynews.com/blogs/the_rumble/2012/08/fact-checking-the-fact-checkers