Author Topic: Billions of Missing Links  (Read 14027 times)

Dos Equis

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Billions of Missing Links
« on: November 05, 2007, 11:08:41 AM »
I'm reading the book "Billions of Missing Links:  A Rational Look at the Mysteries Evolution Can't Explain," by Dr. Geoffrey Simmons.  (For you intellectually dishonest people, the book was actually written by the Discovery Institute.)

It is my weekend reading, so it will take me a while to finish, but fascinating read so far.  Through the first five chapters he talks about the many, many improbable coincidences that resulted in life as we know it.  The foreword has a discussion of all of the steps involved in childbirth.  I've been through it four times, having been present for the birth of all four of my children (except one c-section), but the amount of things that all have to take place, perfectly, for childbirth is remarkable. 

Here are some things I've found particularly interesting in the first few chapters:

1.  He believes the earth is billions of years old.

2.  Evolution scientists have apparently ignored the tenets of their own scientific method:  (1) observation; (2) hypothesis formulation; (3) prediction; and (4) testing of predictions. 

3.  There are no published experiments that clearly show one species naturally evolving into another species.  Darwin apparently admitted this in "forgotten passages in many of his writings." 

4.  You cannot prove either evolution or intelligent design through testing. 

5.  He identifies a number of animals with no clear cut ancestors, including whales, cuttlefish, giraffes, amoebas, hummingbirds, the illuminated net devil fish, Komodo dragon, etc.

6.  "Fossil records suggest that the Earth's temperatures and climate have remained essentially the same for 3.5 billion years.  It cleans, refreshes, protects, defends, regenerates, maintains, and repairs itself.  In a sense, it may breathe, and it definitely has a circulatory system.  No one knows how our planet acquired these abilities or remained stable.  The only choices appear to be improbable coincidences, Intelligent Design, or incredible luck." 

7.  Since Darwin's days we have discovered thousands of new life-forms.  Some experts say we know of 14 million.  When you add the seas and microscopic worlds, we could be up to 100 million different species, all of whom should have several intermediates or predecessors if they were the product of evolution. 

More next week.   :)

MB_722

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Re: Billions of Missing Links
« Reply #1 on: November 05, 2007, 11:28:40 AM »
I remember listening to this guy on Coast 2 Coast AM awhile back.

Dos Equis

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Re: Billions of Missing Links
« Reply #2 on: November 05, 2007, 11:46:08 AM »
I remember listening to this guy on Coast 2 Coast AM awhile back.

I heard him on the radio too.  That's how I learned about the book. 

loco

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Re: Billions of Missing Links
« Reply #3 on: November 05, 2007, 01:52:28 PM »
3.  There are no published experiments that clearly show one species naturally evolving into another species.  Darwin apparently admitted this in "forgotten passages in many of his writings." 

5.  He identifies a number of animals with no clear cut ancestors, including whales, cuttlefish, giraffes, amoebas, hummingbirds, the illuminated net devil fish, Komodo dragon, etc.

7.  Since Darwin's days we have discovered thousands of new life-forms.  Some experts say we know of 14 million.  When you add the seas and microscopic worlds, we could be up to 100 million different species, all of whom should have several intermediates or predecessors if they were the product of evolution. 

"If it could be demonstrated that any complex organ existed, which could not possibly have been formed by numerous, successive, slight modifications, my theory would absolutely break down." -- Charles Darwin, The Origin of Species: A Facsimile of the First Edition, Harvard University Press, 1964, p. 189.

columbusdude82

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Re: Billions of Missing Links
« Reply #4 on: November 05, 2007, 02:56:33 PM »
Right, loco. And no such complex organ has been demonstrated to exist :)

gcb

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Re: Billions of Missing Links
« Reply #5 on: November 06, 2007, 08:18:17 PM »
How many planets are there in the universe? Is it so unlikely that given the number of planets, evolution took place on one of them?

Colossus_500

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Re: Billions of Missing Links
« Reply #6 on: November 07, 2007, 05:31:38 AM »
This book sounds very interesting, Beach. 

columbusdude82

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Re: Billions of Missing Links
« Reply #7 on: November 07, 2007, 06:51:07 AM »
This book sounds very interesting, Beach. 

If this stuff had any real science in it, they'd be publishing it in real scientific journals and presenting it in real scientific conferences, but since ID is just religious non-science, they push it on the lay public in books like these aimed to debauch science and mislead the reader.

Like I said, you might as well be reading books on Flat Earth Geology by the Flat Earth Society.

Dos Equis

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Re: Billions of Missing Links
« Reply #8 on: November 12, 2007, 02:51:58 PM »
 More observations:

1.  Apparently, nearly everything about the cockroach defies the theory of evolution.  It has been unchanged for about 350 million years.  It's one of the smartest nonhumans.  Researchers who challenge animals to solve mazes say a cockroach is nearly as smart as an octopus, which ranks just below dolphins and chimps.  They have a very complex anatomy.  They molt about five to seven times, which could not have evolved in stages.  Partial molting would result in death (keeps moisture in and bacteria out).  They have a second set of teeth in their stomach.  They have two brains.   :o  One in their head and one in their rear end.  There is no precedent for a second brain or second set of teeth. 

2.  No predecessor for the elephant. 

3.  No predecessor for the emperor penguin and their crazy mating ritual.  You can appreciate this if you've seen March of the Penguins.   :)

4.  No predecessor for the flea or beaver.  There are no intermediate home-builders. 

5.  The octopus is unique.  It has "'distributed intelligence,' meaning that its thinking occurs both in the brain as well as in billions of neurons distributed along its tentacles."  Also one of the few animals with "observational intelligence."  An experiment was conducted that "had a group of octopi watching (from their separate aquariums) while another octopus would receive food whenever it played with a red ball, not a yellow ball.  Overwhelmingly, the octopi observers selected the red ball when they were given their turn."  They can change colors to fit their environment, change color to reflect emotions, and change shapes for offense or defense.  "Some octopi as large as ten feet across can slip through a one-and-a-half-inch pipe."   :o  Every mother octopus dies very soon after her babies are born, which defies the theory of evolution.  "Most of the intermediate links to the octopus appear to be missing." 

6.  According to the theory of evolution, dolphins are not direct descendants of fish.  They allegedly began as warm-blooded land animals that returned to the sea many millions of years ago have not changed in five million years.  Evolutionists don't explain how this happened.  They are warm-blooded mammals who bear their young alive and nurse their offspring.  No gills, scales, eggs, or swim bladders.

Will read about airborne animals next week.   
 

columbusdude82

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Re: Billions of Missing Links
« Reply #9 on: November 12, 2007, 03:07:28 PM »
If this stuff had any real science in it, they'd be publishing it in real scientific journals and presenting it in real scientific conferences, but since ID is just religious non-science, they push it on the lay public in books like these aimed to debauch science and mislead the reader.

Like I said, you might as well be reading books on Flat Earth Geology by the Flat Earth Society.

You're only misinforming yourself. :)

Educated people learn real science.

Parker

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Re: Billions of Missing Links
« Reply #10 on: November 12, 2007, 06:12:00 PM »
I remember listening to this guy on Coast 2 Coast AM awhile back.

I thought I was one of the only people to listen to that show (at 2 am in the morning)

Al-Gebra

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Re: Billions of Missing Links
« Reply #11 on: November 12, 2007, 06:14:31 PM »
You're only misinforming yourself. :)

Educated people learn real science.

which is not taught at "the" Ohio state university . . . hth.

columbusdude82

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Re: Billions of Missing Links
« Reply #12 on: November 13, 2007, 05:13:29 AM »
which is not taught at "the" Ohio state university . . . hth.

Another sore Michigan fan, I see 8)

the Pure Majestic

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Re: Billions of Missing Links
« Reply #13 on: November 13, 2007, 12:32:27 PM »
Unfortunately, humans will never be able to grasp the vastness of the universe.  It is on a scale that our brains cannot understand. 
We throw out things like "100 million species," or "how did the billions and billions of processes that need to be present for life to happen just happen.....what are the chance?"

What people don't understand is that those processes are nothing compared the vastness of the universe. 

Compared to potential number of planets in the universe, the chance that the same billions and billions of processes involved in life just "happened" isn't even a chance.  It is a mathematical fact.

The chance that all those process just "popped up" somewhere else in the universe is about the same as the chance that a coin will land heads just once if you flip it 10,000 times. 

The number of potential planets divided into the processes in our body is a laughable number. 

Most can't grasp this.  Most can't even grasp the concept that the earth doesn't move around the sun.  It moves in a straight line.  The gravitational pull of the sun warps space enough to cause that straight line to wrap around the sun in an apparent circle. 


loco

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Re: Billions of Missing Links
« Reply #14 on: November 13, 2007, 12:55:25 PM »
Unfortunately, humans will never be able to grasp the vastness of the universe.  It is on a scale that our brains cannot understand. 
We throw out things like "100 million species," or "how did the billions and billions of processes that need to be present for life to happen just happen.....what are the chance?"

What people don't understand is that those processes are nothing compared the vastness of the universe. 

Compared to potential number of planets in the universe, the chance that the same billions and billions of processes involved in life just "happened" isn't even a chance.  It is a mathematical fact.

Very true:

Marcel-Paul Schützenberger:
The Miracles of Darwinism
http://www.arn.org/docs/odesign/od172/schutz172.htm


Dos Equis

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Re: Billions of Missing Links
« Reply #15 on: December 08, 2007, 12:35:20 PM »
1.  Evolution has no answer for airborne creatures.  It was not possible for a species to learn how to fly in sequential steps.  If a species did not have all of the tools needed to take flight, stay in the air, and land safely, it would have never survived. 

2.  "Bat fossils that remarkably resemble modern bats are dated back to 50 million years ago, but no apparent predecessor species has been found."

3.  No explanation for the woodpecker and its beak design.

4.  "The pelican's nostril has a flap that closes when it dives.  Kiwi birds sniff along the ground like a dog and they are the only bird with nostrils at the tip of their beak." 

5.  "The red knot bird flies nearly 9000 miles each year to feast on millions of horseshoe crab eggs laid along Delaware's coast.  Within ten days, the female lays four large eggs.  All this is described by ornithologist Brian Harrington:  'It is no exaggeration to liken her accomplishment to a woman giving birth to a sixty-pound baby within ten days of completing a six-thousand mile hike at altitudes higher than the Himalayas!'"

columbusdude82

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Re: Billions of Missing Links
« Reply #16 on: December 08, 2007, 02:14:34 PM »
Beach Bum, I am sorry to tell you that whoever wrote this book is talking out of his colon.

1 is blatantly false. The ability to be in flight for 1 second is better than the inability to fly, and the ability to fly for 2 seconds is better than the ability to fly for just 1, and so on. Evolution has very elegant explanations for flight.

2 I don't know if it's true or not.

3 is false as well. For very elegant evolutionary explanations of 1 and 3, I refer you to Richard Dawkins' brilliant book "The Blind Watchmaker."

Really, the author of your book should have opened a basic collegiate biology textbook before writing a book of his own... Every idiot thinks he's got a winning argument against natural selection, but none of them know what they're talking about...

Dos Equis

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Re: Billions of Missing Links
« Reply #17 on: December 08, 2007, 05:52:45 PM »
Regarding subterranean life:

1.  There are "trillions of miles of fungal threads, penetrated by quintillions of root hairs, and inhabited by a near-infinite number of viruses, bacteria, molds, fungi, protozoa, insects, crabs, worms, reptiles, and mammals.  A pinch of soil can have a billion or more lives, each of them incredibly complex in their own, every system governed by unique rules."

2. "One might ask how plants could have 'evolved' without the ability to recover nitrogen.  Surely, survival of the fittest should have brought out more autonomous groups.  For some reason it didn't, and interestingly, it can't be just any plant using any nitrogen-fixing bacteria.  There are very particular compatibility issues.  Somehow, the right bacteria is capable of finding the right root, and both it and the root know how to set up a mutually beneficial shop without ever having seen each other before.  To date, scientists have found over 20 genes that aid in this process." 

Will post some interesting info about worms later.  Have to run . . . .

Dos Equis

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Re: Billions of Missing Links
« Reply #18 on: December 22, 2007, 10:34:14 AM »
Interesting stuff about the earthworm:

1.  "According to fossil studies, worms have been here for nearly half a billion years. . . .  They can easily go forward and backward, hibernate for years several feet under the ground, and have enormous capabilities to regenerate lost parts."

2.  They can grow another head if it is bitten off by a predator.  "Worms can be cut into pieces and every segment will grow another worm.  Cut the worm at segment 18 and it will grow exactly 18 segments back and add the appropriate head or tail."

3.  "One can suture the tail from one worm with the middle section from another and a head from a third, and they will soon function as a new worm.  Try connecting the dots on this evolutionary game.  Impossible?"

4.  "They have one to five hearts in a row and a primitive brain."

5.  "Many worms are hermaphrodites . . . ."   

Viruses next . . . .

loco

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Re: Billions of Missing Links
« Reply #19 on: December 22, 2007, 01:31:41 PM »
Beach Bum, thanks very much for these!  Very interesting stuff!  Keep them coming.   ;D

Havenbull

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Re: Billions of Missing Links
« Reply #20 on: December 22, 2007, 01:44:18 PM »
The author of this book must be delirious.

Absurd notions that life is too complex to warrant complete evolution.

columbusdude82

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Re: Billions of Missing Links
« Reply #21 on: December 22, 2007, 03:13:25 PM »
The author of this book must be delirious.

Absurd notions that life is too complex to warrant complete evolution.

Why do you hate the Lord Jesus Christ so much? ???

Havenbull

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Re: Billions of Missing Links
« Reply #22 on: December 22, 2007, 04:17:07 PM »
Why do you hate the Lord Jesus Christ so much? ???

He was a great salesman, that guy

Dos Equis

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Re: Billions of Missing Links
« Reply #23 on: December 28, 2007, 10:06:24 PM »
Beach Bum, thanks very much for these!  Very interesting stuff!  Keep them coming.   ;D

No problem mang.  Ask and ye shall receive.   :)

1.  Viruses are everywhere and "it seems likely they have helped shape life on Earth since its beginning." 

2.  "Their predecessors are unknown, however, and they may also represent the biggest collection of missing links of all.  Every type of virus would have needed millions of chemicals in different combinations and varied shapes that somehow successively built upon themselves.  There is also the possibility that they broke free from already living beings--renegade cell parts.  No one knows how viruses fit into the theory of evolution, but their overwhelming presence, seeming ancient age, and incredible impact demands an explanation form evolutionists." 

3.  "Viruses are by far the most common organism on the this planet, and altogether they easily outnumber all other living entities combined."

4.  "[N]o one has ever shown a virus mutating into another species of microorganism."

5.  We also have bad viruses.  "A hemorrhagic virus may have destroyed the Aztec nation in the 1500s, not Hernando Cortes.  The influenza epidemic of 1918 killed 20 million people worldwide."  It's possible humans are "accidental hosts" for some viruses. 

6.  "Throughout the years, supporters of the theory of evolution have chosen to ignore viruses.  Dr. Stephen Gould, in The Book of Life, allotted them only a single paragraph (out of 250 pages).  It begins, 'There is one other problematic group, the viruses, which are particularly hard to define.'  Dr. Roger Lewin's The Thread of Life:  The Smithsonian Looks at Evolution does not have viruses listed in its glossary.  In contrast, Dr. Scott Freeman's Biological Sciences textbook has a very comprehensive chapter on viruses.  In it, he says, 'But currently, there is no widely accepted view where viruses came from.'" 

Up next, "Improbable Natural Designs" . . . 

columbusdude82

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Re: Billions of Missing Links
« Reply #24 on: December 29, 2007, 04:36:42 PM »
Beach Bum, I have a book for you. It's by Michael Shermer: "Why Darwin Matters - The Case Against Intelligent Design."

He writes from a staunch evolutionist's perspective, of course, and harshly exposes ID for the pseudoscience that it is, but with a great deal of respect and bending over backwards for religion. Check out some reviews of the book, and maybe read the excerpts on Amazon if there are any. If it interests you and you decide to read it, let us know what you think.