leg training

[candidizzle]

small, weak people say this a lot. they don't seem to figure out that it's completely nonsensical.

ummm.... so, what; our bodies have little scales and gauges inside that know exactly how much tension in lbs is being put on each muscle fiber ? 


you sure are a training genius

[jpm101]

For the most part, I agree with S'80's protest against the pump. Do stay on a solid workout plan for at least 6 weeks. Takes 2 to 3 weeks to get adjusted to something new. Keeps a log book.

One rule that had been ingrained into me by a couple of old BB'ing vet's is, avoid going to failure at any time.  Have 1 or 2 (at the most) reps left in the tank. If progress is slow  or stopped than have more days between workouts or take a whole week off from training. I usually take two weeks after Power Rack and partial heavy training cycles.

Advancing weight on the bar is important. But with the progressive load system (the backbone of training), increasing the reps to the desired number is also importent. So if you are doing 200lbs on the BP for 5 reps on a 5-8 rep protocol, do not increase the weight on the bar the next workout until you can do the full 8 reps. Than the next workout add weight weight and go back the 5 reps again. See too many guy's getting caught up with adding weight with no mind as to how many reps they should do. Rushing the weight before the body becomes adapted to that new load with more reps. Good Luck.

[candidizzle]

working 2 reps short of failure is a complete waste of a set.


heres the deal. working to complete failure the desired rep range for you goals, will result in achieving what that rep range is supposed to do.   if you are constantly reaching true muscular failure in the rep range of 6-12, then every workout you will HAVE to increase the weight SOME because the last workout did stimulate SOME strength gains. but you dont move up in weight any quicker than what your strength progression naturally occurs at while training t complete failure in th 6-12 rep range

lets say your bench pressing 245. you reach complete failure at 8 reps. next workout you do 245 again, well your a little big stronger from your last workou so this time you hit 9 reps. next workout, still a litttle stronger, so you hit 10 reps. then 11, then 12. now because yove gotten to the upper end of the rep range you increase the weight to lets say 265 and now you should be back down to hitting true failure at 6-8 reps. then as your strength progresses you move higher into the rep range...then ocne youve reached your upper end you up the weight and go back to the lower end.

 its not the weigth but the reaching of muscular failure that is going to make your satellite cels activiate and cause those micro tears and make you grow.

[jpm101]

To the Mercurial Messiah of Manteca:

Three Words...Central Nervous System (CNS)

Two Words.....Fuzzy Logic

One Word......Recovery


Final Words........Good Luck, you will need it.


Side Bar: Catch Phase...Satellite Cells

[candidizzle]

To the Mercurial Messiah of Manteca: whoa epic stalking/lurking for somebody i have never seen posin before to name my town

Three Words...Central Nervous System (CNS)what bout it

Two Words.....Fuzzy Logic to me it seems pretty clear maybe you need some glasses

One Word......Recovery what does that have to do with this ? lol..


Final Words........Good Luck, you will need it. i agree !


Side Bar: Catch Phase...Satellite Cells do you even know what those are ?   

[MisterMagoo]

i'mma agree with candi that leaving 2 reps in the tank is pointless with two exceptions:

1) when on an INCREDIBLY specific training protocol that calls for sets with a % of your 1RM.

2) isolation/auxiliary work (depending if you're BB or PL). going to balls-out failure on things like curls, side raises, flyes, or leg curls is just crazy.

positive failure is your best bet for general purposes. go as far as you can take it but don't grind any more out. forced reps are a stupid idea and i think HIT has wrecked many an otherwise diligent trainer.

[wes]

lets say your bench pressing 245. you reach complete failure at 8 reps. next workout you do 245 again, well your a little big stronger from your last workou so this time you hit 9 reps. next workout, still a litttle stronger, so you hit 10 reps. then 11, then 12. now because yove gotten to the upper end of the rep range you increase the weight to lets say 265 and now you should be back down to hitting true failure at 6-8 reps. then as your strength progresses you move higher into the rep range...then ocne youve reached your upper end you up the weight and go back to the lower end.

Looks great on paper but virtually impossible for most in the real world.

Sattelite cells = too much reading and not enough real world experience!! LOL 

[MisterMagoo]

Looks great on paper but virtually impossible for most in the real world.

Sattelite cells = too much reading and not enough real world experience!! LOL 

at that SPEED yes, but as a hypothetical it works.

point is with straight sets you can gauge progress much better than trying mega weird giant sets. i used to use the 2x9 theory pretty well. soon as i hit two sets of 9 i moved up. then i could usually hit the first set of 9 with the new weight, but set 2 would die early.

[candidizzle]

Looks great on paper but virtually impossible for most in the real world.

Sattelite cells = too much reading and not enough real world experience!! LOL  

print in bold = small, close minded foolish way of thinking

 

first i need to read more then i read too much



the only reason you grow AT ALL from working out is because you create trauma to the muscle which activates things called SATELLITE CELLS that signal for your body to come down and repair and build up the muscle tissue

they are normally dormant and in most human beings they only get activated after physical injury occurs... but as a bodybuilder you are constantly tricking your body into using these satellite cells to make you grow more muscular..

you know how guys will say, i want to hit my upper chest, my middle chest, my lower chest, my inner chest..so i get a big full chest ??   why do you think hat is ? if all you do if flat bench, then most of the tension from those sets occurs on a portion of muscle fibers in the middle portion of the chest. and all the trauma from that sets occurs in those fibers. and only satellite cells in those fibers where trauma occurs get activated. so only growth occurs where those satellite cells were activated, and only satellite cells get activated where trauma occurs.
 

take some notes old man youve ben taken to school and NO haters theres no google no copy and past no referencing others this is straight from the brain and 100%acurate

[MisterMagoo]

you know how guys will say, i want to hit my upper chest, my middle chest, my lower chest, my inner chest..so i get a big full chest ??

bench press.

hope that helps.

[candidizzle]

bench press.

hope that helps.

  why do you think hat is ? if all you do if flat bench, then most of the tension from those sets occurs on a portion of muscle fibers in the middle portion of the chest. and all the trauma from that sets occurs in those fibers. and only satellite cells in those fibers where trauma occurs get activated. so only growth occurs where those satellite cells were activated, and only satellite cells get activated where trauma occurs.
 

hope that helps

[MisterMagoo]

hope that helps

i'm not sure you were listening.

Bench.

Press.

it's always teenage know-it-alls and FLEX magazine hucksters that talk about how if you only flat bench you'll have a droopy chest, despite the fact that even EMG tests don't support that ludicrous statement. if you want a big chest, move all your benching to a 30 degree incline and use dumbbells. bam.

[candidizzle]

 
okay do your bench press

[MisterMagoo]

okay do your bench press

you want studies? here's the first one i found (though i'm not going to spend six hours finding all of them): http://forum.bodybuilding.com/showthread.php?t=471725 . i had seen this study in its original form but cannot find it off-hand. you can look around all you want.

what i want you to notice is how the decline uses 93% of the chest, for example. not 93% of the lower chest, just 93% of the chest. the fact of the matter is that the "common wisdom" of "this hits lower, this hits inner, this hits outer" is complete and utter bunk. you can find other such studies, they're all about the same.

the point is that no exercises target vastly different areas of the chest, they're all within 5-8 percentage points in terms of how much of your chest is activated. if you want an idea for what that is, put your hand on your pec and realize that 5% of the surface area is about the pad of one of your fingers. even if that 93% was the lower 93, it'd be irrelevant.

am i saying all you need is one exercise? no, it'll get stale and the mental aspect is often bigger than the physical. but what i am saying is you're actually wasting both time and effort by trying to attack it from different angles.

[candidizzle]

you do realize that that study says nothing about which area of the chest is stressed the most ?

sure 93% of the entire pectoralis is firing to some extent. but which portion is undertaking the biggest workload and being stimulated the most ?


 

[MisterMagoo]

you do realize that that study says nothing about which area of the chest is stressed the most ?

sure 93% of the entire pectoralis is firing to some extent. but which portion is undertaking the biggest workload and being stimulated the most ?


 

according to you, without studies to back up your words, your opinion is worthless.

thus, until you provide a study to prove your claims, you're basically full of shit. just, you know, using the logic you've been proclaiming in every debate we have.

[candidizzle]

according to you, without studies to back up your words, your opinion is worthless.

thus, until you provide a study to prove your claims, you're basically full of shit. just, you know, using the logic you've been proclaiming in every debate we have.

you havent provided any studies that show that inclines dont stress the upper chest and flat becnh doesnt stress the middle chest and declines dont stress the lower chest....

so i guess were both full of shit

but the difference is

i have every bodybuilding trainer and expert and almost every professional there ever was agreeing with me. and youve got slave and panda. 

[MisterMagoo]

find a way to draw out 93% of the chest that doesn't hit every part of it. even if you cut off the entire top 7% that's an incredibly negligible area. my point was that decline, flat, and incline hit pretty much everything. that's why people say dips are the best for the chest despite being, basically, an extremely declined press.

as for who agrees with who, again, you're just making shit up now. the "people" who agree with you are flex magazine articles and milos's wonky methods.

but you know what, fine. you keep on keepin' on with your "methods". you are somewhere between 19 and 25 years old and could not naturally get much above 200 pounds, regurgitating crap you read in a magazine that you undoubtedly did not buy with your own money, and you're going to use your drug-inflated physique as "proof" that you know what you're talking about even as you increase your dosages and still remain smaller and weaker than naturals who "don't know what they're talking about".

thanks for playing, candy pants. you're off my radar now.

[wes]

Zach,I agree with you on the straigt sets and increasing reps to gauge progress,BUT only if strength is a priority.

I guage my progress on how I look in the mirror.

I use as heavy a weight as possible for the targeted rep range of any set.

I increase weight each set and decrease reps.

There is a point where no further weight can be added to the bar and no more reps done with a certain weight,except for long periods of time,then you may be able to eke out another rep,maybe even two but this could take foreverotherwise we`d all be benching 1000 pounds in a few years of training.

Intensity is key for me...........getting the most possible work done in the shortest amount of time while going as heavy as possible with good form.

Candi,thanks for teaching this old man something new ...............I must have missed that issue of Flex magazine!!  

[candidizzle]

 Magoo your study only says that 93 percent was involved.   thats pretty much obvious regardless of your stance on this issue. the study doesn't at all address how the tension from each movement is dispersed in those regions activated.

I'm pretty stupid Magoo, but even i can see that.

try again if you have a study that actually proves what your saying then ill concede



Wes, i don't read flex, BRO; its called MUSCULAR DEVELOPMENT 

anyways nice try to avoid my point and avoid the fact that you don't really have any kin of real knowledge

[wes]

Dude,I`m not a scientist by any stretch but I`ve forgotten more than you will ever know about lifting weights.

[jaejonna]

My high rep leg workout which i do when in my 'cuttin phase' aka now ...

Smith Squat 20X(45 on each side),15 (two 45s),12 (three 45s), 8 (four 45s) (drop two 45s for ss of 8 more), 6 (four 45s and a 25 ) (drop to two 45's to ss for 6 more)
Leg press 25,20,15,10 superset all sets with Sissy Squats(usually on 6-8)
Leg Extensions 30,25,20,15
Lying Leg Curls 20,15,10
Seated Leg Curl 20, 10
Lower Back Ext. (really streching out and contracting the hams here) 15,15,15
Calves 5 sets of whatever after 2 warm up sets. I ussually jack the wieght up to the most it can hold.

------------------------

[slaveboy1980]

My high rep leg workout which i do when in my 'cuttin phase' aka now ...

Smith Squat 20X(45 on each side),15 (two 45s),12 (three 45s), 8 (four 45s) (drop two 45s for ss of 8 more), 6 (four 45s and a 25 ) (drop to two 45's to ss for 6 more)
Leg press 25,20,15,10 superset all sets with Sissy Squats(usually on 6-8)
Leg Extensions 30,25,20,15
Lying Leg Curls 20,15,10
Seated Leg Curl 20, 10
Lower Back Ext. (really streching out and contracting the hams here) 15,15,15
Calves 5 sets of whatever after 2 warm up sets. I ussually jack the wieght up to the most it can hold.

------------------------

looking at your legs there is no way those squats are deep.

as for the rest of your workout, epic pump addiction.

[jaejonna]

looking at your legs there is no way those squats are deep.

as for the rest of your workout, epic pump addiction.

ass to the floor deep brah!!! ...

[slaveboy1980]

ass to the floor deep brah!!! ...

floor must be real high.