Author Topic: Don’t like the stimulus? Be glad it averted depression.  (Read 11944 times)

Benny B

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Don’t like the stimulus? Be glad it averted depression.
« on: September 01, 2009, 10:14:06 AM »
Don’t like the stimulus? Be glad it averted depression
It’s flawed. It’s expensive. But that’s much better than the alternative.
- USA Today Editorial

Our view on jolting the economy: Don’t like the stimulus? Be glad it averted depression
It’s flawed. It’s expensive. But that’s much better than the alternative.

No question about it, Republicans are in a defiant mood when it comes to President Obama's fiscal stimulus.

When the $787 billion in tax cuts and spending initiatives was up for a vote last winter, Republicans took pride that only three of their senators, and none of their House members, joined in. Never mind that the overwhelming consensus among business leaders and economists was that dramatic action was needed to avert a possible depression.

Now with the economy showing some signs of life, many Republicans are calling for cancelling the stimulus' unspent parts. It is, they say, not effective. Or it's too slow take effect. Or it's just not affordable. For a party seeking to rally its base and rediscover its fiscally conservative roots, the position makes some political sense. But as public policy, it's a uniquely bad idea.


To start with, the nightmare scenario that scared first the Bush administration and then its successor into backing massive stimulus appears to have been averted. There is no depression — no bread lines, no bottomless economic collapse, no pending decade of 25% unemployment as happened in the 1930s.

Further, the spending so far, mostly tax cuts, aid to states and extended unemployment benefits, has already had a measurable positive effect. In the first three months of this year, before the stimulus went into effect, jobs were vanishing at a staggering rate of about 691,000 per month. By the second quarter, as federal spending began to surge, job losses were cut to about 422,00 per month. In July, the first month of the third quarter, the number was down to 247,000, with predictions for August's numbers — due out this Friday — in that range as well.

As for what to expect in the future, the recovery is still tentative at best. Many economists predict a "double dip" recession even without a paring back on the stimulus.

Federal Reserve Chairman Ben Bernanke, the central banker appointed by President Bush and now renominated by Obama, has given no indications he is ready to pull back on the massive stimulus he has deployed to keep lenders lending. If a non-partisan official such as Bernanke, who has the threat of inflation to worry about, is not pulling back, it's hard to see why politicians should.

Most economists express similar sentiments. Typical is Mark Zandi, co-founder of Moody's Economy.com. An adviser to John McCain in last year's presidential race, Zandi said earlier this summer that, if anything, Congress should be thinking about another stimulus package.

Many critics point to the $9 trillion in projected deficits over the next 10 years as reason to pull back. Granted, these are huge numbers. But they are not the result of a one-time spending and tax cut package. The government's budget woes are the result of the staggering sums of cash and tax subsidies that it pours into health care, aggravated by the looming Social Security time bomb. In recent decades, entitlement programs for health care and retirement have come to dominate federal spending, far outstripping the cost of core government functions.

Anyone who really cares about the state of the economy would look for ways to restrain the health care spending over the long run, not pick nits with a stimulus that is providing a vital short term boost. Unfortunately, some on the right advocate doing just the opposite.
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Re: Don’t like the stimulus? Be glad it averted depression.
« Reply #1 on: September 01, 2009, 10:21:31 AM »
Crickets.

Everybody want to hate on obama, don't nobody wanna see their 401k turned into Charmin.

Eric15210

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Re: Don’t like the stimulus? Be glad it averted depression.
« Reply #2 on: September 01, 2009, 10:25:30 AM »
wait until inflation hits and unemployment rates keep going up

RIP Bob Probert

tonymctones

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Re: Don’t like the stimulus? Be glad it averted depression.
« Reply #3 on: September 01, 2009, 10:26:25 AM »
at what cost?

Soul Crusher

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Re: Don’t like the stimulus? Be glad it averted depression.
« Reply #4 on: September 01, 2009, 10:39:58 AM »
Crickets.

Everybody want to hate on obama, don't nobody wanna see their 401k turned into Charmin.

Ok 240 - how is UE going for you? 

We spent trillions of dollars in a short peior of time - of course there is going to be a small bounce.

However, considering the consumption is 70% of GDP, and UE is still increasing, DESPITE EVERYTHING THE GOVT HAS DONE, there is no recovery other smoke and mirrors that the puppet masters get you to believe. 

a_joker10

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Re: Don’t like the stimulus? Be glad it averted depression.
« Reply #5 on: September 01, 2009, 10:41:36 AM »
How did spending 795 billion avert a depression.

Especially since less than 20% of the money has been spent.

Stop the washing machine already.
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MM2K

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Re: Don’t like the stimulus? Be glad it averted depression.
« Reply #6 on: September 01, 2009, 10:43:36 AM »
Really???? DId it REALLY avert a depression? Do the people at McNewspaper really beleive this? This is the most inempt article they have written in a while. Do the people there really beleieve that we would have gone into a depression without it? Do these people really beleive that a few less bucks withheld from my paycheck is going to allow me to stimulate the economy? Do they think a few public jobs are going to stimulate the economy? I havent even felt that all year. There was nothing stimulative about this bill. There was nothing done at the tax margin that changed behavior.

And if the next jobs report is still in the 200 thousand loss range, how can they even dare say that this is working?

And why are they confusing monetary policy with fiscal policy?
Jan. Jobs: 36,000!!

Soul Crusher

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Re: Don’t like the stimulus? Be glad it averted depression.
« Reply #7 on: September 01, 2009, 10:50:08 AM »
Really???? DId it REALLY avert a depression? Do the people at McNewspaper really beleive this? This is the most inempt article they have written in a while. Do the people there really beleieve that we would have gone into a depression without it? Do these people really beleive that a few less bucks withheld from my paycheck is going to allow me to stimulate the economy? Do they think a few public jobs are going to stimulate the economy? I havent even felt that all year. There was nothing stimulative about this bill. There was nothing done at the tax margin that changed behavior.

And if the next jobs report is still in the 200 thousand loss range, how can they even dare say that this is working?

And why are they confusing monetary policy with fiscal policy?

Another thing 240 -

Most of the stim money went to propping up state budgets' bloated spending.  As far as I can tell sales tax and income tax receipts are stilli falling.  What happens when the stim money runs out? 

   

2ND COMING

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Re: Don’t like the stimulus? Be glad it averted depression.
« Reply #8 on: September 01, 2009, 10:56:56 AM »
im glad to see benny post articles like this.

when you have guys on this board posting david frum articles with some conspiracy on how obama had a hand in the releasing the lockerbie bomber, then benny posts an article on how pelosi's stimulus adverted a depression

equal stupidity is good  :)

240 is Back

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Re: Don’t like the stimulus? Be glad it averted depression.
« Reply #9 on: September 01, 2009, 11:02:08 AM »
Ok 240 - how is UE going for you? 

it rocks.  more time to post.

60% national employment means we have way more quality posters on getbig.


Fury

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Re: Don’t like the stimulus? Be glad it averted depression.
« Reply #10 on: September 01, 2009, 11:02:38 AM »
it rocks.  more time to post.

60% national employment means we have way more quality posters on getbig.



Your posts are a shell of what they were two years ago. Haven't been the same Kamali neutered you and Bob put you on the bb.com payroll.  RIP 240's balls.

240 is Back

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Re: Don’t like the stimulus? Be glad it averted depression.
« Reply #11 on: September 01, 2009, 11:09:55 AM »
ouch!  sad but true.

on a plus side, the politics board has been very feisty lately. 

Fury

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Re: Don’t like the stimulus? Be glad it averted depression.
« Reply #12 on: September 01, 2009, 11:16:23 AM »
ouch!  sad but true.

on a plus side, the politics board has been very feisty lately. 

Haha, just breaking balls.

It has been feisty lately. Whiners ahoy.

Soul Crusher

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Re: Don’t like the stimulus? Be glad it averted depression.
« Reply #13 on: September 01, 2009, 11:18:08 AM »
Your posts are a shell of what they were two years ago. Haven't been the same Kamali neutered you and Bob put you on the bb.com payroll.  RIP 240's balls.

Kamali ran a BB show near me in Tarrytown NY a few years ago.  In person he looks extremely unhealthy. 

Fury

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Re: Don’t like the stimulus? Be glad it averted depression.
« Reply #14 on: September 01, 2009, 11:19:40 AM »
Kamali ran a BB show near me in Tarrytown NY a few years ago.  In person he looks extremely unhealthy. 

Hell, he looks unhealthy in his pictures. He did manage to take 240's balls with the threat of lawsuits, though.  :D

BM OUT

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Re: Don’t like the stimulus? Be glad it averted depression.
« Reply #15 on: September 01, 2009, 11:20:02 AM »
It was tarp that helped the economy.The stimulous has done NOTHING.Not one job created,not one thing beneficial from it.It was a democratic boondoggle and has been an utter absolute waste of money.The idea that any asshole would say it helped stave off a depression is insane.THEY HAVENT EVEN SPENT OVER A TENTH OF IT IT HASNT DONE A FUCKING THING!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Soul Crusher

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Re: Don’t like the stimulus? Be glad it averted depression.
« Reply #16 on: September 01, 2009, 11:23:14 AM »
Hell, he looks unhealthy in his pictures. He did manage to take 240's balls with the threat of lawsuits, though.  :D

Serious, in person he looks like he is going to burst, not in a good way.  He was sweating horribly and just looked awful.  It just looked like he was laboring to move around.       

OzmO

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Re: Don’t like the stimulus? Be glad it averted depression.
« Reply #17 on: September 01, 2009, 11:32:46 AM »
im glad to see benny post articles like this.

when you have guys on this board posting david frum articles with some conspiracy on how obama had a hand in the releasing the lockerbie bomber, then benny posts an article on how pelosi's stimulus adverted a depression

equal stupidity is good  :)
8)

240 is Back

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Re: Don’t like the stimulus? Be glad it averted depression.
« Reply #18 on: September 01, 2009, 11:33:49 AM »
Hell, he looks unhealthy in his pictures. He did manage to take 240's balls with the threat of lawsuits, though.  :D

Me & King get along better these days!   :D

www.gbnscience.com

Soul Crusher

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Re: Don’t like the stimulus? Be glad it averted depression.
« Reply #19 on: September 01, 2009, 11:38:20 AM »
Me & King get along better these days!   :D

www.gbnscience.com

Im not kidding, I almost felt bad for the guy as he looked like an animal that belonged in the zoo. 

Soul Crusher

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Re: Don’t like the stimulus? Be glad it averted depression.
« Reply #20 on: September 01, 2009, 11:50:29 AM »
GREAT VIDEO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


Soul Crusher

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Re: Don’t like the stimulus? Be glad it averted depression.
« Reply #21 on: September 01, 2009, 11:54:00 AM »
Notice how the news guy tries to get him off of the issue of Obama so quickly. 


Benny B

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Re: Don’t like the stimulus? Be glad it averted depression.
« Reply #22 on: September 01, 2009, 12:08:38 PM »
im glad to see benny post articles like this.

when you have guys on this board posting david frum articles with some conspiracy on how obama had a hand in the releasing the lockerbie bomber, then benny posts an article on how pelosi's stimulus adverted a depression

equal stupidity is good  :)
Great comedy!  ;D

You have soup lines where you live? An economist you (clearly) ain't, brother.
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Benny B

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Soul Crusher

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Re: Don’t like the stimulus? Be glad it averted depression.
« Reply #24 on: September 01, 2009, 12:14:07 PM »
substantive  ::)

BENNY: 

FORDHAM ROAD AND GRAND CONCOURSE, BRONX, N.Y. FOR A LITTLE CHAT. 

WHAT U SAY?