Author Topic: Obama throws support behind controversial Islamic center  (Read 17175 times)

Fury

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Re: Obama throws support behind controversial Islamic center
« Reply #25 on: August 14, 2010, 12:04:04 PM »
One and done.

The Democratic Party is going to be wiped off the map by 2012.

Here in NYC, I've never seen people so pissed off. The KSM trial is one thing. This is a whole other ballgame. My fear is that somebody is going to do something about it in a violent manner.

Of course if that happens, the left is going to try to divert attention away from Islamic terrorism and focus on "home grown right wing extremist groups".

Hey heres an idea for the knobs on here that just don't get it-- How about the "Museum of Lynching" next to NAACP headquarters? Or, since many of you like to absurdly reference Oklahoma City, how about if the group responsible decided to open a shooting range+meeting hall for it's local chapter a few feet away from where the Federal building stood?

Forget about the constitution and all of the other legal arguments over the building of this monstrosity--- Are you people just complete fucking idiots that have been living under a rock the last 10 years? It's offensive and incendiary (two words that douchebags on the left using when convenient for their agendas) for a radical Imam that refuses to denounce terrorism to build a giant Mosque a block away from Ground Zero. Can you wrap your tiny brains around that idea?

Hypothetically, let's say some radical Christian blows it up. Would the left be OK with building a church there 10 years later?

Another great post, though. I agree 100%.

Simple question. Should there be a shrine to Emperor Hirohito built at Pearl Harbor? Would anyone be OK with that?

Arnold jr

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Re: Obama throws support behind controversial Islamic center
« Reply #26 on: August 14, 2010, 12:54:09 PM »
this is a land of laws and we have to follow them. not the emotions of people ;D

Very true and I agree completely but there is a standard that must be met first. You are only entitled to the protection of those laws and the rights they provide if you yourself are eligible, follow the law of the land yourself and do not pose a threat to the security and well-being of the rest of the population. If you meet all three of these then guess what, you're right but if you fall short on even one, you are not qualified to be given the same rights the constitution grants.

Montague

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Re: Obama throws support behind controversial Islamic center
« Reply #27 on: August 14, 2010, 03:27:02 PM »
Hypothetically, let's say some radical Christian blows it up. Would the left be OK with building a church there 10 years later?

Another great post, though. I agree 100%.

Simple question. Should there be a shrine to Emperor Hirohito built at Pearl Harbor? Would anyone be OK with that?


Damn you and your logical & sensible analogies.

No, Rob240 is right.
There’s no law against sanctioning, condoning, praising and celebrating the deaths of 3,000+ U.S. citizens.
And - I guess in Rob240’s book - the fact that the sneaky extremists of this religion are continually plotting and attempting further strikes is a moot point.

We are the land of the free, and should openly embrace ALL people - even if they wish us dead and try to facilitate those ends.

And, most importantly, we must extend these terrorists and their supporters every right contained within our Constitution (and even some that maybe aren’t in it) because if we select who receives those rights, that would be “dangerous…”
Not like a “flying planes into buildings” dangerous, but…some other kind of “dangerous.”

Rob240's approach seems to be "lets empower those who want us dead and actively pursue that desire."
I'm not sure why he fails to understand the stance of those of us who wish to live.

The bottom line is he supports the rights of our enemies over OUR rights & safety.
Which rights?
The right to live - the same right they happily took from us nine years ago amidst parties in honor of murders.

Lord of the Roidz

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Re: Obama throws support behind controversial Islamic center
« Reply #28 on: August 14, 2010, 04:08:36 PM »
I wonder if the Ku Klux Klan decided to build their national headquarters right next to Martin Luther King's former house...if Obama would endorse their constitutional rights to do so ?....Or I wonder if Stormfront or some other jewish hating organization wanted to put up a building next to The Holocaust Museum in New York...Think that would ever get built? Want to hear 240 on this. Those examples are no more absurd than an Iman with ties to radicals and terrorists being in charge of putting up a Mosque at Ground Zero.

Dos Equis

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Re: Obama throws support behind controversial Islamic center
« Reply #29 on: August 14, 2010, 05:14:05 PM »
Glad he cleared that up.   ::)  So here he is, again, taking sides in an ongoing local dispute.  Time for another beer summit? 


Under Fire, Obama Clarifies Support for Ground Zero Mosque
Published August 14, 2010 | FoxNews.com

President Obama on Saturday sought to clarify his comments supporting the building of a mosque near ground zero that have ignited a political firestorm ahead of a difficult election season for Democrats.

During a trip to Florida for a family vacation, Obama said his comments on Friday night were only directed at the constitutional right of the mosque to be there.

"I was not commenting and I will not comment on the wisdom of making the decision to put a mosque there," he said in response to a reporter's question after he spoke about efforts to aid the Gulf Coast region. "I was commenting very specifically on the right people have that dates back to our founding. That's what our country is about."

Obama came under instant fire after jumping into the middle of a cultural clash Friday night with comments that have elevated the contentious issue to the presidential level.

White House spokesman Bill Burton released the following statement on behalf of Obama's stance on constructing the mosque.

President Barack Obama has expressed his support for the construction of a Muslim Community Center and Mosque near the World Trade Center site in downtown Manhattan, as many protest the plan, saying it is wrong to build a mosque so close to the site of the Sept. 11 attacks.

"Just to be clear, the President is not backing off in any way from the comments he made last night. It is not his role as President to pass judgment on every local project. But it is his responsibility to stand up for the Constitutional principle of religious freedom and equal treatment for all Americans. What he said last night, and reaffirmed today, is that If a church, a synagogue or a Hindu temple can be built on a site, you simply cannot deny that right to those who want to build a Mosque."

Some victims' advocates and Republicans have strongly condemned Obama's support for the mosque, which would be part of a $100 million Islamic community center two blocks from where nearly 3,000 people perished when hijacked jetliners slammed into the World Trade Center towers on Sept. 11, 2001.

"Barack Obama has abandoned America at the place where America's heart was broken nine years ago, and where her true values were on display for all to see," said Debra Burlingame, a spokeswoman for some Sept. 11 victims' families and the sister of one of the pilots killed in the attacks.

Building the mosque at ground zero, she said, "is a deliberately provocative act that will precipitate more bloodshed in the name of Allah."

Sally Regenhard, whose firefighter son was killed at the World Trade Center, said the president had failed to understand the issue. "As an Obama supporter, I really feel that he's lost sight of the germane issue, which is not about freedom of religion," she said. "It's about a gross lack of sensitivity to the 9/11 families and to the people who were lost."

Rep. Peter King, R-N.Y., said the president is "wrong."

"It is insensitive and uncaring for the Muslim community to build a mosque in the shadow of ground zero," he said in a written statement.

"While the Muslim community has the right to build the mosque, they are abusing that right by needlessly offending so many people who have suffered so much," he said. "The right and moral thing for President Obama to have done was to urge Muslim leaders to respect the families of those who died and move their mosque away from ground zero. Unfortunately, the president caved into political correctness."

Entering the highly charged election-year debate, Obama surely knew that his words would not only make headlines in the U.S. but be heard by Muslims worldwide. The president has made it a point to reach out to the global Muslim community, and the over 100 guests at Friday's dinner in the State Dining Room included ambassadors and officials from numerous nations where Islam is observed, including Saudi Arabia and Indonesia.

While his pronouncement concerning the mosque might find favor in the Muslim world, Obama's stance runs counter to the opinions of the majority of Americans, according to polls. A CNN/Opinion Research poll released this week found that nearly 70 percent of Americans opposed the mosque plan while just 29 percent approved. A number of Democratic politicians have shied away from the controversy.

Opponents, including some Sept. 11 victims' relatives, see the prospect of a mosque so near the destroyed trade center as an insult to the memory of those killed by Islamic terrorists in the 2001 attacks.

"The decision to build this mosque so close to ground zero is deeply troubling, as is the president's decision to endorse it. The American people certainly don't support it," House Minority Leader John Boehner, R-Ohio, said in a written statement.

"The fact that someone has the right to do something doesn't necessarily make it the right thing to do," he added. "That is the essence of tolerance, peace and understanding. This is not an issue of law, whether religious freedom or local zoning. This is a basic issue of respect of a tragic moment in our history."

Former Republican Sen. Rick Santorum of Pennsylvania told Fox News that Obama seems to misunderstand that Islam is not just a religion, but also a political doctrine. He also said the mosque is being run by a man who accused the U.S. of being an accomplice in the Sept. 11 attacks.

Santorum compared the ground zero mosque to a minister who wants to builds a church near the location where the Rev. Martin Luther King was killed but preaches racial separation and the notion that King brought his death upon himself.

"I don't think Barack Obama would say, 'Well we have religious tolerance, we're going to allow them to do that,'" he said. "That is the wrong way to look at this. This is not whether it's a legal right to do it. People have legal rights to do a lot of things in this country."

"We have the will of the American public," he said, noting the polls show most oppose the mosque. The imam is "ignoring the will of the American public, as by the way, Barack Obama is by siding with him."

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2010/08/14/obamas-support-ground-zero-mosque-draws/

OzmO

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Re: Obama throws support behind controversial Islamic center
« Reply #30 on: August 14, 2010, 05:23:51 PM »
After reading some of the posts, it seems like some believe that the muslim religion's purpose is to destroy America.  It looks an ignorant belief.  Don't get me wrong, although some of you will certainly do, I am very much against a structure like this that close to ground zero for many of the reasons that have been stated so far.  

However, we are a country of laws build on many freedoms including the freedom of religion, and these same laws that radical Islamic terrorist defer to as part of the great Satan are the same ones that allow a building like this to be constructed.  That puts Obama in a politically precarious position.  If he speaks against it, he's going against the freedoms we all profess we are entitled to, if he says people have the right to build a place of worship on private property then he can be viewed as supporting it.

After reading his comments i don't think he's doing either.  I only hope he's saying publicly what he has to, but privately doing what he can to stop it.  But how much power does he have to stop it without violating this group's rights?  You think Bloomberg would do more, but i think they are both in a political pickle.  

the real question everyone should be asking is how do we stop it?

Dos Equis

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Re: Obama throws support behind controversial Islamic center
« Reply #31 on: August 14, 2010, 05:32:40 PM »
After reading some of the posts, it seems like some believe that the muslim religion's purpose is to destroy America.  It looks an ignorant belief.  Don't get me wrong, although some of you will certainly do, I am very much against a structure like this that close to ground zero for many of the reasons that have been stated so far.  

However, we are a country of laws build on many freedoms including the freedom of religion, and these same laws that radical Islamic terrorist defer to as part of the great Satan are the same ones that allow a building like this to be constructed.  That puts Obama in a politically precarious position.  If he speaks against it, he's going against the freedoms we all profess we are entitled to, if he says people have the right to build a place of worship on private property then he can be viewed as supporting it.

After reading his comments i don't think he's doing either.  I only hope he's saying publicly what he has to, but privately doing what he can to stop it.  But how much power does he have to stop it without violating this group's rights?  You think Bloomberg would do more, but i think they are both in a political pickle.  

the real question everyone should be asking is how do we stop it?

He shouldn't be doing anything to stop it, because it's a local issue.  This is something the mayor, city council, and citizens should be all over. 

It's really not a religious freedom issue.  No one is saying they don't have the right to worship or build a mosque led by the man who spit on the 911 victims after the tragedy.  They just need to do it someplace else. 

The place to stop it is in the city council.  IF NYC is like most other cities, the city council should control zoning.  They ought to just say no new religious buildings within a certain radius and grandfather in any existing buildings.  Problem solved.  Easier said than done. 

Montague

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Re: Obama throws support behind controversial Islamic center
« Reply #32 on: August 14, 2010, 05:36:12 PM »
"The fact that someone has the right to do something doesn't necessarily make it the right thing to do," he added. "That is the essence of tolerance, peace and understanding. This is not an issue of law, whether religious freedom or local zoning. This is a basic issue of respect of a tragic moment in our history."

Former Republican Sen. Rick Santorum of Pennsylvania told Fox News that Obama seems to misunderstand that Islam is not just a religion, but also a political doctrine. He also said the mosque is being run by a man who accused the U.S. of being an accomplice in the Sept. 11 attacks.

That is an excellent article with many exceptional ideas.
The two above are simply ones that stood out a bit to me.
Who wrote it? I see no credits.


After reading some of the posts, it seems like some believe that the muslim religion's purpose is to destroy America.  It looks an ignorant belief.

It is a justified belief.
The only time I hear Muslims speak publicly about America is to condemn it.
Yet, not a single one condemns the 9/11 attacks committed in the name of their “god.”


OzmO

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Re: Obama throws support behind controversial Islamic center
« Reply #33 on: August 14, 2010, 05:42:56 PM »
It is a justified belief.
The only time I hear Muslims speak publicly about America is to condemn it.
Yet, not a single one condemns the 9/11 attacks committed in the name of their “god.”

No it isn't.  It's a belief based on ignorance.  Think about what you just said:

Quote
The only time I hear Muslims speak publicly about America is to condemn it.

So you have heard every statement ever made by every Muslim in public?  I've heard many condemnations, both privately, for anyone to hear and in the media.

There's a difference between "Luke warm" Muslims, children of Muslims born and raised int he US that don't practice the religion, Muslims that do practice their religion and Radical Nut Jobs living in the 13th century hell bent on our destruction.

Grouping these people into one pile is religious stereotyping.  That's how some of the nut jobs that slammed the planes in the WTC's felt about the thousands of innocent people they murdered.

Dos Equis

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Re: Obama throws support behind controversial Islamic center
« Reply #34 on: August 14, 2010, 05:44:21 PM »
That is an excellent article with many exceptional ideas.
The two above are simply ones that stood out a bit to me.
Who wrote it? I see no credits.



Those are some excellent points.  Not sure who wrote the article.  It's a Fox/AP story. 

OzmO

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Re: Obama throws support behind controversial Islamic center
« Reply #35 on: August 14, 2010, 05:45:07 PM »
He shouldn't be doing anything to stop it, because it's a local issue.  This is something the mayor, city council, and citizens should be all over. 

It's really not a religious freedom issue.  No one is saying they don't have the right to worship or build a mosque led by the man who spit on the 911 victims after the tragedy.  They just need to do it someplace else. 

The place to stop it is in the city council.  IF NYC is like most other cities, the city council should control zoning.  They ought to just say no new religious buildings within a certain radius and grandfather in any existing buildings.  Problem solved.  Easier said than done. 

Actually OB shouldn't have made any comment at all save acknowledging people's concerns.  But I'm not his PR adviser, he gave that job to the village idiot.

Montague

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Re: Obama throws support behind controversial Islamic center
« Reply #36 on: August 14, 2010, 05:59:25 PM »
I've heard many condemnations, both privately, for anyone to hear and in the media.

Well, I'm opened to the idea.
If you post some links, I'll eagerly listen to these Muslims' proclamations condemning the evil atrocities of their religion’s radicals.
And I’m not being pretentious.
I really do hope they exist, and I really would like to listen to and/or read them.


There's a difference between "Luke warm" Muslims, children of Muslims born and raised int he US that don't practice the religion...

Then the luke warm ones who don't practice don't need a Mosque - anywhere.
And, I would presume that the ones who practice "peacefully" would maybe be a little more sensitive to our "emotions" concerning this issue.

Dos Equis

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Re: Obama throws support behind controversial Islamic center
« Reply #37 on: August 14, 2010, 06:02:14 PM »
Actually OB shouldn't have made any comment at all save acknowledging people's concerns.  But I'm not his PR adviser, he gave that job to the village idiot.

lol

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Re: Obama throws support behind controversial Islamic center
« Reply #38 on: August 14, 2010, 06:07:54 PM »
The place to stop it is in the city council.  IF NYC is like most other cities, the city council should control zoning.  They ought to just say no new religious buildings within a certain radius and grandfather in any existing buildings.  Problem solved.  Easier said than done. 

I agree with that 100%.  Just exclude EVERY religion - not SOME religions.  Cause while this one seems cut and dry, we all know the govt may abuse any 'selective enforcement of the constitution' in the future, once precedent has been set.

keep in mind I would personally punch in the face anyone making anti-american noise in my face.   Keep in mind I disagree with their ideology 1000%.  Keep in mind I believe there are a million ways to prevent this thing from happening, aside from saying "we're singling out your religion in violation of the constitution".

Tie it up for 10 years with lawsuits or whatever else.  Picket them.  hit their sponsors or whatever.  You're telling me "the media" can chase a sitting US Governor out of office with frivolous BS suits, but 310 million americans can't get keep one group of d-bags from completing a project in a city with a myriad of laws and regulations and red tape?

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Re: Obama throws support behind controversial Islamic center
« Reply #39 on: August 14, 2010, 06:47:16 PM »
One and done.

The Democratic Party is going to be wiped off the map by 2012.

Here in NYC, I've never seen people so pissed off. The KSM trial is one thing. This is a whole other ballgame. My fear is that somebody is going to do something about it in a violent manner.

Of course if that happens, the left is going to try to divert attention away from Islamic terrorism and focus on "home grown right wing extremist groups".

Hey heres an idea for the knobs on here that just don't get it-- How about the "Museum of Lynching" next to NAACP headquarters? Or, since many of you like to absurdly reference Oklahoma City, how about if the group responsible decided to open a shooting range+meeting hall for it's local chapter a few feet away from where the Federal building stood?

Forget about the constitution and all of the other legal arguments over the building of this monstrosity--- Are you people just complete fucking idiots that have been living under a rock the last 10 years? It's offensive and incendiary (two words that douchebags on the left using when convenient for their agendas) for a radical Imam that refuses to denounce terrorism to build a giant Mosque a block away from Ground Zero. Can you wrap your tiny brains around that idea?

+1

Well said

Kazan

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Re: Obama throws support behind controversial Islamic center
« Reply #40 on: August 15, 2010, 05:35:15 AM »
this is a land of laws and we have to follow them. not the emotions of people ;D

Then show me the law that says anyone has a right to build a place of worship.
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blacken700

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Re: Obama throws support behind controversial Islamic center
« Reply #41 on: August 15, 2010, 06:16:33 AM »
no, you have to show me where it says you can't build a place of worship, thats the way it works

Kazan

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Re: Obama throws support behind controversial Islamic center
« Reply #42 on: August 15, 2010, 06:37:25 AM »
no, you have to show me where it says you can't build a place of worship, thats the way it works

No it doesn't, you claim it is a right, show me in the constitution where it says you have a right to build a place or worship.

Oh that's right you can't, so you are going to try the usual tactic of redirection. Sorry but you have to go home empty handed, but thanks for playing.
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blacken700

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Re: Obama throws support behind controversial Islamic center
« Reply #43 on: August 15, 2010, 06:49:55 AM »
i have to admit your about as smart as a bag of rocks. why don't you go there with your logic and stop them from building it :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D

Kazan

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Re: Obama throws support behind controversial Islamic center
« Reply #44 on: August 15, 2010, 07:07:56 AM »
i have to admit your about as smart as a bag of rocks. why don't you go there with your logic and stop them from building it :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D

Just what I expected from you ::)
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blacken700

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Re: Obama throws support behind controversial Islamic center
« Reply #45 on: August 15, 2010, 07:15:26 AM »
if i was you i would go to new york and present you case and i'm sure they will say,hey this guy is right and build it somewhere else :D :D :D :D :D :D :D

Kazan

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Re: Obama throws support behind controversial Islamic center
« Reply #46 on: August 15, 2010, 07:28:23 AM »
if i was you i would go to new york and present you case and i'm sure they will say,hey this guy is right and build it somewhere else :D :D :D :D :D :D :D

Whatever, if you don't want to debate the topic just say so, trying to redirect the argument is a tired tactic.
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blacken700

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Re: Obama throws support behind controversial Islamic center
« Reply #47 on: August 15, 2010, 08:00:21 AM »
theres really nothing to debate your wrong ,emotionally you don't want the center there.you can't debate emotion

Fury

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Re: Obama throws support behind controversial Islamic center
« Reply #48 on: August 15, 2010, 08:06:52 AM »
i have to admit your about as smart as a bag of rocks. why don't you go there with your logic and stop them from building it :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D

Oh, the irony.  :-X

You've become quite the embarrassment. Is it no wonder that you're a joke on here? You have the grammatical skills of an elementary school student.

blacken700

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Re: Obama throws support behind controversial Islamic center
« Reply #49 on: August 15, 2010, 08:42:17 AM »
stick to the topic nerdy boy