Author Topic: Walker offers concessions, pro union ppl please read this...  (Read 12712 times)

The Showstoppa

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Re: Walker offers concessions, pro union ppl please read this...
« Reply #25 on: March 10, 2011, 06:51:48 AM »
The discrepancy between the supporters on each side shows where the public stands on the issue, which was the point.  ::)






No it doesn't.  Surveys say otherwise.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/02/18/labor-union-polls-wisconsin-protests_n_825363.html


 ::)

The Showstoppa

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Re: Walker offers concessions, pro union ppl please read this...
« Reply #26 on: March 10, 2011, 06:56:58 AM »
with the amount of hours he's working you will have to hire another person to cover the hours,so now you have another persons 40m hour pay and his benefit package to pay for . i don't know what should a bus driver make an hour ???

But the deal is that if you are paying somebody 40 or 50 hrs of OT (time and a half), you could most certainly hire a few more workers and save money.  And the term "benefit package" isn't an entitlement, so that SHOULD be a variable.  I've had jobs that didn't include health insurance, etc.. so why should a bus driver have that as mandatory?  That should be a stepping stone job to a better one.

And the "hiring freeze" mentioned by another poster because a of contract dispute simply makes the case for getting out of these contracts and union controls.  Where I live, NC, unions are weak.  So if bus drivers decided to not show up, guess what the most likely scenario is?  John Q. would take his place on the route tomorrow and not miss a beat.   

blacken700

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Re: Walker offers concessions, pro union ppl please read this...
« Reply #27 on: March 10, 2011, 07:06:49 AM »
so he should have no health insurance while he's working as a bus driver ::)

Soul Crusher

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Re: Walker offers concessions, pro union ppl please read this...
« Reply #28 on: March 10, 2011, 07:08:07 AM »
Should be privatized. 

Taxpayers can't afford this chaos any longer.

The Showstoppa

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Re: Walker offers concessions, pro union ppl please read this...
« Reply #29 on: March 10, 2011, 07:11:21 AM »
so he should have no health insurance while he's working as a bus driver ::)
 

Buy his own, like millions of people do.  If the taxpayer can't afford to provide it to him, which we can't anymore, then get his own.  Simple as that.  And on 160k a yr, I think he could afford it, huh?  8)

Al Doggity

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Re: Walker offers concessions, pro union ppl please read this...
« Reply #30 on: March 10, 2011, 07:11:40 AM »
But the deal is that if you are paying somebody 40 or 50 hrs of OT (time and a half), you could most certainly hire a few more workers and save money.  And the term "benefit package" isn't an entitlement, so that SHOULD be a variable.  I've had jobs that didn't include health insurance, etc.. so why should a bus driver have that as mandatory?  That should be a stepping stone job to a better one.



And the "hiring freeze" mentioned by another poster because a of contract dispute simply makes the case for getting out of these contracts and union controls.  Where I live, NC, unions are weak.  So if bus drivers decided to not show up, guess what the most likely scenario is?  John Q. would take his place on the route tomorrow and not miss a beat.  

Have you ever driven a bus? It actually requires  skill and a mediocre bus driver costs lives .When you couple that with the rapid growth of the transit system in Madison, no you don't want a heavy turnover rate for those positions. For a  multitude of fairly obvious reasons, it's a job where you want to retain skilled workers.It's not a stepping stone job. Everyone is not going to be a lawyer.


No it doesn't.  Surveys say otherwise.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/02/18/labor-union-polls-wisconsin-protests_n_825363.html


 ::)

That article is an argument for the unreliability of polls. And still, when deconstructed, they pretty much show the public being pro-union. Regardless, the simple fact of the matter is that if there were more people who supported Walker, the counterprotests would have been bigger.

blacken700

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Re: Walker offers concessions, pro union ppl please read this...
« Reply #31 on: March 10, 2011, 07:15:37 AM »
 

Buy his own, like millions of people do.  If the taxpayer can't afford to provide it to him, which we can't anymore, then get his own.  Simple as that.  And on 160k a yr, I think he could afford it, huh?  8)

but i have a feeling you would want to pay him 12 dollars an hour not going to buy insurance for that ::)

The Showstoppa

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Re: Walker offers concessions, pro union ppl please read this...
« Reply #32 on: March 10, 2011, 07:17:17 AM »
Have you ever driven a bus? It actually requires  skill and a mediocre bus driver costs lives .When you couple that with the rapid growth of the transit system in Madison, no you don't want a heavy turnover rate for those positions. For a  multitude of fairly obvious reasons, it's a job where you want to retain skilled workers.It's not a stepping stone job. Everyone is not going to be a lawyer.

Actually i have, on a very limited basis I was required to when stationed in Iceland, but that is neither here nor there.  You simply can not justify paying 160k a yr for one bus driver.  The laws of supply and demand do not dictate it.....the only thing that dictated it was the "hiring freeze" from "union contracts." 

That article is an argument for the unreliability of polls. And still, when deconstructed, they pretty much show the public being pro-union. Regardless, the simple fact of the matter is that if there were more people who supported Walker, the counterprotests would have been bigger.

That was why I used that site and poll.  You state it like a fact that overwhelmingly people are against Walker.  That is simply not the case at all.  Are the unions more vocal and organized?  Sure.  Doesn't mean that the majority of citizens agree with them.

Soul Crusher

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Re: Walker offers concessions, pro union ppl please read this...
« Reply #33 on: March 10, 2011, 07:17:27 AM »
Conservatives are mostly people who work and don't have time to scream like idiots to demand more free shit from already overburdened taxpayers. 

I would fire every single of these union thugs and open every job for hire to the general public.  Millions will flood the state tommorow for those jobs. 

Enough is enough w these greedy pigs ever demanding more free benes and perks that were not affordable in the best of times, let alone now.

The Showstoppa

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Re: Walker offers concessions, pro union ppl please read this...
« Reply #34 on: March 10, 2011, 07:18:28 AM »
but i have a feeling you would want to pay him 12 dollars an hour not going to buy insurance for that ::)

12hr plus insurance would be very doable.  Someone quoted $20+....for a bus driver?  Nah.   ::)

Al Doggity

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Re: Walker offers concessions, pro union ppl please read this...
« Reply #35 on: March 10, 2011, 07:44:27 AM »
Actually i have, on a very limited basis I was required to when stationed in Iceland, but that is neither here nor there.  You simply can not justify paying 160k a yr for one bus driver.  The laws of supply and demand do not dictate it.....the only thing that dictated it was the "hiring freeze" from "union contracts." 

 ::)  There is a difference between explaining why 1 bus driver made an anomalistic sum during a specific period of time and arguing that said sum should be his base pay.

Hiring freeze was dictated by the city budget- they intentionally opted to force Metro to use overtime instead of new workers as a means of saving money. This was reversed when it became obvious that "supply" of buses far exceeded the "demand" from riders and overtime was actually turning out to be the more expensive option.

So , once again, this is hardly an example of the broken union system.



Quote
That was why I used that site and poll.  You state it like a fact that overwhelmingly people are against Walker.  That is simply not the case at all.  Are the unions more vocal and organized?  Sure.  Doesn't mean that the majority of citizens agree with them.

 I was responding to the poster who claimed that outside of the pro-union protesters, there was no public union support. It is a simple fact that if anti-union sentiment was really that all encompassing, then the counterprotests would have been larger.

Al Doggity

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Re: Walker offers concessions, pro union ppl please read this...
« Reply #36 on: March 10, 2011, 07:45:02 AM »
12hr plus insurance would be very doable.  Someone quoted $20+....for a bus driver?  Nah.   ::)

This would actually be ridiculous. A bad bus driver is actually LETHAL. This is a job where you don't want to scrape the bottom of the barrel.

Princess L

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Re: Walker offers concessions, pro union ppl please read this...
« Reply #37 on: March 10, 2011, 07:59:14 AM »
This would actually be ridiculous. A bad bus driver is actually LETHAL. This is a job where you don't want to scrape the bottom of the barrel.

Are you saying by paying a busdriver $26/hr + full bennies makes him/her a better driver?
:

Al Doggity

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Re: Walker offers concessions, pro union ppl please read this...
« Reply #38 on: March 10, 2011, 08:07:55 AM »
Are you saying by paying a busdriver $26/hr + full bennies makes him/her a better driver?

Experience makes someone a better driver. A decent salary will go a long way in retaining experienced drivers.

Soul Crusher

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Re: Walker offers concessions, pro union ppl please read this...
« Reply #39 on: March 10, 2011, 08:15:37 AM »
Why not pay them 100 an hour? 

blacken700

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Re: Walker offers concessions, pro union ppl please read this...
« Reply #40 on: March 10, 2011, 08:24:09 AM »
Why not pay them 100 an hour? 

whats that  ???

Soul Crusher

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Re: Walker offers concessions, pro union ppl please read this...
« Reply #41 on: March 10, 2011, 08:33:57 AM »
Bus driver.

blacken700

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Re: Walker offers concessions, pro union ppl please read this...
« Reply #42 on: March 10, 2011, 08:38:08 AM »
whats that  ???

i know bus driver,what do you mean by the comment

Soul Crusher

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Re: Walker offers concessions, pro union ppl please read this...
« Reply #43 on: March 10, 2011, 08:41:00 AM »
Take a hint. If the bus driver is so vital - why stop at 26 a hour and not pay 100 an hour.

blacken700

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Re: Walker offers concessions, pro union ppl please read this...
« Reply #44 on: March 10, 2011, 08:45:47 AM »
i think you just have to pay a fair wage so you can keep them to have an experienced person.i don't think 12hr is going to do that

Soul Crusher

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Re: Walker offers concessions, pro union ppl please read this...
« Reply #45 on: March 10, 2011, 08:47:59 AM »
What will and who decides.

Kazan

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Re: Walker offers concessions, pro union ppl please read this...
« Reply #46 on: March 10, 2011, 08:49:15 AM »
i think you just have to pay a fair wage so you can keep them to have an experienced person.i don't think 12hr is going to do that

What special skill is required to drive a bus that would merit high pay?
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blacken700

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Re: Walker offers concessions, pro union ppl please read this...
« Reply #47 on: March 10, 2011, 08:57:21 AM »
What special skill is required to drive a bus that would merit high pay?


i'm sure it's not as important as your job ::) but i'm sure it take some know how to manuver them around in a save manner.i don't think you want a new 18 yr old every 3 months doing it

Kazan

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Re: Walker offers concessions, pro union ppl please read this...
« Reply #48 on: March 10, 2011, 09:09:59 AM »
i'm sure it's not as important as your job ::) but i'm sure it take some know how to manuver them around in a save manner.i don't think you want a new 18 yr old every 3 months doing it

But you have no problem with an 18 yr old preparing food for your consumption? Should they make $26/hr to? I guess its just me put I would think any competent driver would be able to drive a bus, most I have seen are not rocket scientist exploring other career options. So you tell me, since you seem to think you are the authority on "fair pay", what is fair pay for unskilled labor?
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blacken700

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Re: Walker offers concessions, pro union ppl please read this...
« Reply #49 on: March 10, 2011, 09:16:31 AM »
for one thing i don't think its unskilled, and i think it's quite comical that you compare thowing a burger in the microwave the same as driving ten ton bus around full of people on the city streets ;D