Author Topic: Obama has been a successful POTUS  (Read 16352 times)

syntaxmachine

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Obama has been a successful POTUS
« on: June 22, 2012, 08:35:36 AM »
Sorry to burst everyone's bubbles around here, but by objective standards Obama has been a successful POTUS and a far more competent one than his predecessor. The primary such standard is the amount of legislation proposed/passed/implemented, a value that makes Obama far above average.

His foreign policy has been a success: his election instantly boosted world public opinion, which matters to the extent that it feeds into our soft power, or ability to influence others. His emphasis on multilateralism is sound and the operation in Libya to secure those oil resources for the world (no, democracy was not and almost never is the primary goal) was a stellar success that cost zero American lives and a mere $2 billion (we each payed a little over $6 for it). On the other hand his administration's emphasis on drone strikes and covert operations has won the war on terror: Al Qaeda has been genuinely ravaged and barely functions as an organization. Such operations included the personally-authorized killing of OBL, an important symbolic victory.

Things are more complex at home. Banking regulation was passed, which includes the Volcker Rule banning proprietary trading and other measures that are seemingly necessary to prevent another bailout, but nobody knows just how much regulation is optimal. Obama also stepped up and addressed the issue predecessors pussied out on, healthcare. The resultant legislation was a centrist plan (anyone who calls it 'socialist' has never been to Europe or examined their public policy) based on a conservative policy proposal that originated with the Heritage Foundation (a mandate to tackle the free riders that increase costs). That it may get struck down does not reflect on Obama as he has no control over SC deliberations to begin with. He can only be evaluated for his specific actions.

Finally, we come to the economy, which is what actually dtermines elections anyway. There is an extraordinary amount of confusion about this as  certain posters think we live in a system where the POTUS wields magical powers that determine the course of the economy. The misunderstanding is reinforced by presidents who take credit for growth and pundits who blame/credit everything happening to a president. The fact is this: we live in a capitalist where private actors control productivity. Corporations invest and hire/fire according to their plans, households only spend according to their perceptions of wealth, and banks lend in response to demand. Presidents do not control any of these variables, and can at best moderately nudge them in one or another direction.

Even considering this, CBO estimates put the number of jobs saved by the stimulus in the hundreds of thousands. The subsequent recovery has been tepid and has disappointed Obama and everybody else. But the point is, if the economic variables are all controlled by exogenous factors outside the WH, how can we lump all of the blame against Obama all the same? There is no evidence at all that a Republican president would have done anything differently, especially not since the stimuls contains much Friedman-esque monetary policy as is (the continued actions of the Fed belie the notion that the stimulus has been purely Keynesian).

In short, Obama has been an above-average president and performed admirably given the inherent limitations on the office (the position just isn't as powerful as many make it out to be) and the simply unprecedented circumstances inherited. People focus on the POTUS as a convenient symbol for everything the USG is doing and everything happening in the economy; the position is a convenient beacon for love and hate with a human face, when the real causality is mostly reserved for faceless machines comprised of the decisions of millions of individual actors (the USG + markets). People ought to understand as such when evaluating a US president.

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Re: Obama has been a successful POTUS
« Reply #1 on: June 22, 2012, 08:46:01 AM »
Disagree.

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Re: Obama has been a successful POTUS
« Reply #2 on: June 22, 2012, 08:48:04 AM »
t

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Re: Obama has been a successful POTUS
« Reply #3 on: June 22, 2012, 08:53:43 AM »
Sorry to burst everyone's bubbles around here, but by objective standards Obama has been a successful POTUS and a far more competent one than his predecessor. The primary such standard is the amount of legislation proposed/passed/implemented, a value that makes Obama far above average.

His foreign policy has been a success: his election instantly boosted world public opinion, which matters to the extent that it feeds into our soft power, or ability to influence others. His emphasis on multilateralism is sound and the operation in Libya to secure those oil resources for the world (no, democracy was not and almost never is the primary goal) was a stellar success that cost zero American lives and a mere $2 billion (we each payed a little over $6 for it). On the other hand his administration's emphasis on drone strikes and covert operations has won the war on terror: Al Qaeda has been genuinely ravaged and barely functions as an organization. Such operations included the personally-authorized killing of OBL, an important symbolic victory.

Things are more complex at home. Banking regulation was passed, which includes the Volcker Rule banning proprietary trading and other measures that are seemingly necessary to prevent another bailout, but nobody knows just how much regulation is optimal. Obama also stepped up and addressed the issue predecessors pussied out on, healthcare. The resultant legislation was a centrist plan (anyone who calls it 'socialist' has never been to Europe or examined their public policy) based on a conservative policy proposal that originated with the Heritage Foundation (a mandate to tackle the free riders that increase costs). That it may get struck down does not reflect on Obama as he has no control over SC deliberations to begin with. He can only be evaluated for his specific actions.

Finally, we come to the economy, which is what actually dtermines elections anyway. There is an extraordinary amount of confusion about this as  certain posters think we live in a system where the POTUS wields magical powers that determine the course of the economy. The misunderstanding is reinforced by presidents who take credit for growth and pundits who blame/credit everything happening to a president. The fact is this: we live in a capitalist where private actors control productivity. Corporations invest and hire/fire according to their plans, households only spend according to their perceptions of wealth, and banks lend in response to demand. Presidents do not control any of these variables, and can at best moderately nudge them in one or another direction.

Even considering this, CBO estimates put the number of jobs saved by the stimulus in the hundreds of thousands. The subsequent recovery has been tepid and has disappointed Obama and everybody else. But the point is, if the economic variables are all controlled by exogenous factors outside the WH, how can we lump all of the blame against Obama all the same? There is no evidence at all that a Republican president would have done anything differently, especially not since the stimuls contains much Friedman-esque monetary policy as is (the continued actions of the Fed belie the notion that the stimulus has been purely Keynesian).

In short, Obama has been an above-average president and performed admirably given the inherent limitations on the office (the position just isn't as powerful as many make it out to be) and the simply unprecedented circumstances inherited. People focus on the POTUS as a convenient symbol for everything the USG is doing and everything happening in the economy; the position is a convenient beacon for love and hate with a human face, when the real causality is mostly reserved for faceless machines comprised of the decisions of millions of individual actors (the USG + markets). People ought to understand as such when evaluating a US president.

Foreign policy is in shambles and the world does not look better upon us.

 

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Re: Obama has been a successful POTUS
« Reply #4 on: June 22, 2012, 09:00:56 AM »
Disagree.

LOL.  Short, precise and to the point.  Props for that.

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Re: Obama has been a successful POTUS
« Reply #5 on: June 22, 2012, 09:06:48 AM »
Totally disagree.

Is your post meant to be a purposely contrarian one?

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Re: Obama has been a successful POTUS
« Reply #6 on: June 22, 2012, 09:08:08 AM »
Sorry to burst everyone's bubbles around here, but by objective standards Obama has been a successful POTUS and a far more competent one than his predecessor. The primary such standard is the amount of legislation proposed/passed/implemented, a value that makes Obama far above average.

His foreign policy has been a success: his election instantly boosted world public opinion, which matters to the extent that it feeds into our soft power, or ability to influence others. His emphasis on multilateralism is sound and the operation in Libya to secure those oil resources for the world (no, democracy was not and almost never is the primary goal) was a stellar success that cost zero American lives and a mere $2 billion (we each payed a little over $6 for it). On the other hand his administration's emphasis on drone strikes and covert operations has won the war on terror: Al Qaeda has been genuinely ravaged and barely functions as an organization. Such operations included the personally-authorized killing of OBL, an important symbolic victory.

Things are more complex at home. Banking regulation was passed, which includes the Volcker Rule banning proprietary trading and other measures that are seemingly necessary to prevent another bailout, but nobody knows just how much regulation is optimal. Obama also stepped up and addressed the issue predecessors pussied out on, healthcare. The resultant legislation was a centrist plan (anyone who calls it 'socialist' has never been to Europe or examined their public policy) based on a conservative policy proposal that originated with the Heritage Foundation (a mandate to tackle the free riders that increase costs). That it may get struck down does not reflect on Obama as he has no control over SC deliberations to begin with. He can only be evaluated for his specific actions.

Finally, we come to the economy, which is what actually dtermines elections anyway. There is an extraordinary amount of confusion about this as  certain posters think we live in a system where the POTUS wields magical powers that determine the course of the economy. The misunderstanding is reinforced by presidents who take credit for growth and pundits who blame/credit everything happening to a president. The fact is this: we live in a capitalist where private actors control productivity. Corporations invest and hire/fire according to their plans, households only spend according to their perceptions of wealth, and banks lend in response to demand. Presidents do not control any of these variables, and can at best moderately nudge them in one or another direction.

Even considering this, CBO estimates put the number of jobs saved by the stimulus in the hundreds of thousands. The subsequent recovery has been tepid and has disappointed Obama and everybody else. But the point is, if the economic variables are all controlled by exogenous factors outside the WH, how can we lump all of the blame against Obama all the same? There is no evidence at all that a Republican president would have done anything differently, especially not since the stimuls contains much Friedman-esque monetary policy as is (the continued actions of the Fed belie the notion that the stimulus has been purely Keynesian).

In short, Obama has been an above-average president and performed admirably given the inherent limitations on the office (the position just isn't as powerful as many make it out to be) and the simply unprecedented circumstances inherited. People focus on the POTUS as a convenient symbol for everything the USG is doing and everything happening in the economy; the position is a convenient beacon for love and hate with a human face, when the real causality is mostly reserved for faceless machines comprised of the decisions of millions of individual actors (the USG + markets). People ought to understand as such when evaluating a US president.

All this blather was simply a long-winded way to say "It's Bush's fault".

Thanks for the laugh.

Try a 43% approval rating, at least 8% unemployment for 41 straight months, at least 9% unemployment for 33 months.

The only president to get us downgraded, the first in 70 years tho have his party bleed 60 House seats and 6 Senate seats.

The first president in nearly 80 years to have a month with literally ZERO jobs.

The only president that will LOSE more jobs than he created in his first (and likely LAST term).

Try having his approval rating PLUNGE to the 30s, three months after killing Bin Laden.

Two major scandals, the unions proclaiming they won't fund his campaign, and at least half a dozen vulnerable Democrats who will NOT show up at the DNC in Charlotte.


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Re: Obama has been a successful POTUS
« Reply #7 on: June 22, 2012, 09:08:17 AM »
His foreign policy has been a success: his election instantly boosted world public opinion, which matters to the extent that it feeds into our soft power, or ability to influence others. His emphasis on multilateralism is sound and the operation in Libya to secure those oil resources for the world (no, democracy was not and almost never is the primary goal) was a stellar success that cost zero American lives and a mere $2 billion (we each payed a little over $6 for it).


________________________ ________

1.  Egypt is a mess.

2.  Syria is a mess

3.  Relations w Russia suck

4.  Relations w Chinese are no better and Obama get embarassed by the Premier

5.  Europe and USA are blaming each other for the coming recession/depression

6.  Lybia?   GMAFB.  10,000 missles just went into the hands of Al Queada which are going to be used by Hamas and smuggled into the Gaza.  

7.  Pakistan is a mess.

8.  Afghanistan we just passed out 2,000th casualty, 80% of which occurred under Obama.  

9.  Drone strikes? Fine, but for obama to claim that as his own is laughable.  



So spare me the foregin relations nonsense.   Obama has been a DISASTER for foregin policy.  

garebear

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Re: Obama has been a successful POTUS
« Reply #8 on: June 22, 2012, 09:11:21 AM »
Good post, although prepare to be flamed.

Counterfactual history is almost never considered. A case in point is the Clinton Administration's involvement in Bosnia and Kosovo. How many lives were saved?

So many among us would bash the bailout, but imagine if it hadn't happened. Where would the economy be today?

If it were worse, there would be just as much noise.
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Re: Obama has been a successful POTUS
« Reply #9 on: June 22, 2012, 09:12:55 AM »
Good post, although prepare to be flamed.

Counterfactual history is almost never considered. A case in point is the Clinton Administration's involvement in Bosnia and Kosovo. How many lives were saved?

So many among us would bash the bailout, but imagine if it hadn't happened. Where would the economy be today?

If it were worse, there would be just as much noise.


Worst "recovery" since the great depression.   


You = FAIL 

garebear

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Re: Obama has been a successful POTUS
« Reply #10 on: June 22, 2012, 09:17:44 AM »
Sorry to burst everyone's bubbles around here, but by objective standards Obama has been a successful POTUS and a far more competent one than his predecessor. The primary such standard is the amount of legislation proposed/passed/implemented, a value that makes Obama far above average.

His foreign policy has been a success: his election instantly boosted world public opinion, which matters to the extent that it feeds into our soft power, or ability to influence others. His emphasis on multilateralism is sound and the operation in Libya to secure those oil resources for the world (no, democracy was not and almost never is the primary goal) was a stellar success that cost zero American lives and a mere $2 billion (we each payed a little over $6 for it). On the other hand his administration's emphasis on drone strikes and covert operations has won the war on terror: Al Qaeda has been genuinely ravaged and barely functions as an organization. Such operations included the personally-authorized killing of OBL, an important symbolic victory.

Things are more complex at home. Banking regulation was passed, which includes the Volcker Rule banning proprietary trading and other measures that are seemingly necessary to prevent another bailout, but nobody knows just how much regulation is optimal. Obama also stepped up and addressed the issue predecessors pussied out on, healthcare. The resultant legislation was a centrist plan (anyone who calls it 'socialist' has never been to Europe or examined their public policy) based on a conservative policy proposal that originated with the Heritage Foundation (a mandate to tackle the free riders that increase costs). That it may get struck down does not reflect on Obama as he has no control over SC deliberations to begin with. He can only be evaluated for his specific actions.

Finally, we come to the economy, which is what actually dtermines elections anyway. There is an extraordinary amount of confusion about this as  certain posters think we live in a system where the POTUS wields magical powers that determine the course of the economy. The misunderstanding is reinforced by presidents who take credit for growth and pundits who blame/credit everything happening to a president. The fact is this: we live in a capitalist where private actors control productivity. Corporations invest and hire/fire according to their plans, households only spend according to their perceptions of wealth, and banks lend in response to demand. Presidents do not control any of these variables, and can at best moderately nudge them in one or another direction.

Even considering this, CBO estimates put the number of jobs saved by the stimulus in the hundreds of thousands. The subsequent recovery has been tepid and has disappointed Obama and everybody else. But the point is, if the economic variables are all controlled by exogenous factors outside the WH, how can we lump all of the blame against Obama all the same? There is no evidence at all that a Republican president would have done anything differently, especially not since the stimuls contains much Friedman-esque monetary policy as is (the continued actions of the Fed belie the notion that the stimulus has been purely Keynesian).

In short, Obama has been an above-average president and performed admirably given the inherent limitations on the office (the position just isn't as powerful as many make it out to be) and the simply unprecedented circumstances inherited. People focus on the POTUS as a convenient symbol for everything the USG is doing and everything happening in the economy; the position is a convenient beacon for love and hate with a human face, when the real causality is mostly reserved for faceless machines comprised of the decisions of millions of individual actors (the USG + markets). People ought to understand as such when evaluating a US president.
WARNING: Your post has triggered a fifty page 333386 meltdown.
G

garebear

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Re: Obama has been a successful POTUS
« Reply #11 on: June 22, 2012, 09:19:00 AM »
WARNING: Your post has triggered a fifty page 333386 meltdown.
But hey, he's got time.

G

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Re: Obama has been a successful POTUS
« Reply #12 on: June 22, 2012, 09:19:50 AM »
Sorry to burst everyone's bubbles around here, but by objective standards Obama has been a successful POTUS and a far more competent one than his predecessor. The primary such standard is the amount of legislation proposed/passed/implemented, a value that makes Obama far above average.

His foreign policy has been a success: his election instantly boosted world public opinion, which matters to the extent that it feeds into our soft power, or ability to influence others. His emphasis on multilateralism is sound and the operation in Libya to secure those oil resources for the world (no, democracy was not and almost never is the primary goal) was a stellar success that cost zero American lives and a mere $2 billion (we each payed a little over $6 for it). On the other hand his administration's emphasis on drone strikes and covert operations has won the war on terror: Al Qaeda has been genuinely ravaged and barely functions as an organization. Such operations included the personally-authorized killing of OBL, an important symbolic victory.

Things are more complex at home. Banking regulation was passed, which includes the Volcker Rule banning proprietary trading and other measures that are seemingly necessary to prevent another bailout, but nobody knows just how much regulation is optimal. Obama also stepped up and addressed the issue predecessors pussied out on, healthcare. The resultant legislation was a centrist plan (anyone who calls it 'socialist' has never been to Europe or examined their public policy) based on a conservative policy proposal that originated with the Heritage Foundation (a mandate to tackle the free riders that increase costs). That it may get struck down does not reflect on Obama as he has no control over SC deliberations to begin with. He can only be evaluated for his specific actions.

Finally, we come to the economy, which is what actually dtermines elections anyway. There is an extraordinary amount of confusion about this as  certain posters think we live in a system where the POTUS wields magical powers that determine the course of the economy. The misunderstanding is reinforced by presidents who take credit for growth and pundits who blame/credit everything happening to a president. The fact is this: we live in a capitalist where private actors control productivity. Corporations invest and hire/fire according to their plans, households only spend according to their perceptions of wealth, and banks lend in response to demand. Presidents do not control any of these variables, and can at best moderately nudge them in one or another direction.

Even considering this, CBO estimates put the number of jobs saved by the stimulus in the hundreds of thousands. The subsequent recovery has been tepid and has disappointed Obama and everybody else. But the point is, if the economic variables are all controlled by exogenous factors outside the WH, how can we lump all of the blame against Obama all the same? There is no evidence at all that a Republican president would have done anything differently, especially not since the stimuls contains much Friedman-esque monetary policy as is (the continued actions of the Fed belie the notion that the stimulus has been purely Keynesian).

In short, Obama has been an above-average president and performed admirably given the inherent limitations on the office (the position just isn't as powerful as many make it out to be) and the simply unprecedented circumstances inherited. People focus on the POTUS as a convenient symbol for everything the USG is doing and everything happening in the economy; the position is a convenient beacon for love and hate with a human face, when the real causality is mostly reserved for faceless machines comprised of the decisions of millions of individual actors (the USG + markets). People ought to understand as such when evaluating a US president.

Wow. I'm convinced.  ::)

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Re: Obama has been a successful POTUS
« Reply #13 on: June 22, 2012, 09:24:00 AM »
Obama also stepped up and addressed the issue predecessors pussied out on, healthcare. The resultant legislation was a centrist plan (anyone who calls it 'socialist' has never been to Europe or examined their public policy) based on a conservative policy proposal that originated with the Heritage Foundation (a mandate to tackle the free riders that increase costs). That it may get struck down does not reflect on Obama as he has no control over SC deliberations to begin with. He can only be evaluated for his specific actions.

________________________ _______________


Absurd on so many levels.  

obamaCare was passed on a huighly partisan basis w no input from the GOP.   Its a result of corruption w Big Pharma as reported by many sources and was 100% the opposite of obama's promises.   No public option, a mandate, no drug re-importation to lower costs.   Causing health costs to spike, not to mention ridiculous medical device tax.   And if it gets thrown out all it shows is that obama delegating this task to thuglosi and reid proved a massive FAIL.  

And spare my the heritage foundation nonsense.   Their recomendation was far more limited and was an idea as opposed to what Hillary was proposing at the time behind closed doors.  

ObamaCare also resulted in the GOP winning in a massive landslide in 2010 thus ending is legislative and governing mandate or ability.  


ObamaCare is a massive fail on so many levels its not funny that now 2/3, which includes many democrats as well.  



 

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Re: Obama has been a successful POTUS
« Reply #14 on: June 22, 2012, 09:27:04 AM »
Obama also stepped up and addressed the issue predecessors pussied out on, healthcare. The resultant legislation was a centrist plan (anyone who calls it 'socialist' has never been to Europe or examined their public policy) based on a conservative policy proposal that originated with the Heritage Foundation (a mandate to tackle the free riders that increase costs). That it may get struck down does not reflect on Obama as he has no control over SC deliberations to begin with. He can only be evaluated for his specific actions.

________________________ _______________


Absurd on so many levels.  

obamaCare was passed on a huighly partisan basis w no input from the GOP.   Its a result of corruption w Big Pharma as reported by many sources and was 100% the opposite of obama's promises.   No public option, a mandate, no drug re-importation to lower costs.   Causing health costs to spike, not to mention ridiculous medical device tax.   And if it gets thrown out all it shows is that obama delegating this task to thuglosi and reid proved a massive FAIL.  

And spare my the heritage foundation nonsense.   Their recomendation was far more limited and was an idea as opposed to what Hillary was proposing at the time behind closed doors.  

ObamaCare also resulted in the GOP winning in a massive landslide in 2010 thus ending is legislative and governing mandate or ability.  


ObamaCare is a massive fail on so many levels its not funny that now 2/3, which includes many democrats as well.  



 
From Truman to Nixon to Clinton, it has been tried, all to no avail.

Like it or not, he got it through.

Might fall in the Supreme Court, but no one got it through before.

BTW, your assertion that it was a result of "big pharma" might just be THE most ridiculous thing you've ever posted.

And that's saying something.

G

garebear

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Re: Obama has been a successful POTUS
« Reply #15 on: June 22, 2012, 09:28:02 AM »
One time you said that Obama had "Saudi handlers" while he was in Jr. High, btw.

Never gonna forget that one.

G

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Re: Obama has been a successful POTUS
« Reply #16 on: June 22, 2012, 09:29:41 AM »
HAHAHAHAHAHA!!!

I needed a laugh and this article did the trick.

After SCOTUS declares the health care reform unconstitutional, the question will be: What did Obama achieve during his presidency?

The correct and truthful answer is NOTHING. He achieved NOTHING!

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Re: Obama has been a successful POTUS
« Reply #17 on: June 22, 2012, 09:29:53 AM »
From Truman to Nixon to Clinton, it has been tried, all to no avail.

Like it or not, he got it through.

Might fall in the Supreme Court, but no one got it through before.

BTW, your assertion that it was a result of "big pharma" might just be THE most ridiculous thing you've ever posted.

And that's saying something.



Really?   That statement alone proves you are a dumb fuck and a typical ignorant leftist troll.  

i'll tell you what you pathetic fuck - I'll bump the threads proving this and you delete your account.   Deal?  

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Re: Obama has been a successful POTUS
« Reply #18 on: June 22, 2012, 09:30:05 AM »
From Truman to Nixon to Clinton, it has been tried, all to no avail.

Like it or not, he got it through.

Might fall in the Supreme Court, but no one got it through before.

BTW, your assertion that it was a result of "big pharma" might just be THE most ridiculous thing you've ever posted.

And that's saying something.


To be fair, big PHrMA was a huge backing to Obamacare, lots of money spent, not to mention Obama's WH deal with them preventing generic imports from Canada after he promised to make it more affordable for people.

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Re: Obama has been a successful POTUS
« Reply #19 on: June 22, 2012, 09:31:06 AM »
One time you said that Obama had "Saudi handlers" while he was in Jr. High, btw.

Never gonna forget that one.



Too easy 


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Re: Obama has been a successful POTUS
« Reply #20 on: June 22, 2012, 09:35:14 AM »
An estimated 45,000 people die each year from lack of healthcare.

That is literally more than a 9/11 every month, every year, forever.

How much did we spend after that day to fight back?

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Re: Obama has been a successful POTUS
« Reply #21 on: June 22, 2012, 09:36:33 AM »
An estimated 45,000 people die each year from lack of healthcare.

That is literally more than a 9/11 every month, every year, forever.

How much did we spend after that day to fight back?



STFU - go respond to the thread I bumped about your messiah and the pharma bribes he and axelrod got. 

garebear

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Re: Obama has been a successful POTUS
« Reply #22 on: June 22, 2012, 09:51:03 AM »
STFU - go respond to the thread I bumped about your messiah and the pharma bribes he and axelrod got. 
Tell you what, tough guy.

I'm leading a study tour of Chinese students in July in NYC. Why don't you come down (unarmed, like a man) and you can tell me to STFU to my face?
G

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Re: Obama has been a successful POTUS
« Reply #23 on: June 22, 2012, 10:00:22 AM »
Tell you what, tough guy.

I'm leading a study tour of Chinese students in July in NYC. Why don't you come down (unarmed, like a man) and you can tell me to STFU to my face?


I'll do it now instead - STFU and go respond to the bribes obama got from the dug companies to get obamacare passed.

By the way - how to the Chinks treat the Twinks in China? 

garebear

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Re: Obama has been a successful POTUS
« Reply #24 on: June 22, 2012, 10:10:44 AM »

I'll do it now instead - STFU and go respond to the bribes obama got from the dug companies to get obamacare passed.

By the way - how to the Chinks treat the Twinks in China? 
No excuses. No clips. No weapons.

Yes or no?

I would just like to hear it once to my face.

G