Author Topic: Obama has been a successful POTUS  (Read 16423 times)

garebear

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Re: Obama has been a successful POTUS
« Reply #75 on: June 24, 2012, 08:35:29 AM »
How is Obama responsible for how Muslim nations vote?

If Bush were still in office, would they have all changed their minds?

G

Soul Crusher

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Re: Obama has been a successful POTUS
« Reply #76 on: June 24, 2012, 08:42:34 AM »
How is Obama responsible for how Muslim nations vote?

If Bush were still in office, would they have all changed their minds?



Obama helped push mubarack fro power remember?  Of course you don't remember since you are still all stary eyed and in love w the messiah.

Straw Man

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Re: Obama has been a successful POTUS
« Reply #77 on: June 24, 2012, 08:47:44 AM »
I've mentioned the specifics repeatedly throughout the thread. This last post was meant to explain the criteria I'm using, which is more or less what you asked for. If it's just a 'bunch of words' to you then that reflects something about you, not the post. It's pretty clear in its meaning.

333's brain can only recognize word, concepts, ideas, facts that mirror his preconceived beliefs

Often his brain will dissasemble the content and reassemble it as something he agrees with

This is why he can watch a video, listen to a recording or read text and see and hear things that aren't there

garebear

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Re: Obama has been a successful POTUS
« Reply #78 on: June 24, 2012, 08:51:39 AM »
Obama helped push mubarack fro power remember?  Of course you don't remember since you are still all stary eyed and in love w the messiah.
Why shouldn't he have been?

When you have democracy in a country, those people determine whom they elect.

The same thing happened under Bush with Hezbollah. Bush didn't control the minds of individual Lebanese.

I never blamed Bush for the way other people voted.

Your pathalogical history has removed any semblance of rationality you may have once held.

Get a job, develop human realtionships and things might start looking up for you.


G

Straw Man

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Re: Obama has been a successful POTUS
« Reply #79 on: June 24, 2012, 08:53:08 AM »
Obama helped push mubarack fro power remember?  Of course you don't remember since you are still all stary eyed and in love w the messiah.

And of course you "remember" it

Memories and imagination are the same thing inside your head

garebear

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Re: Obama has been a successful POTUS
« Reply #80 on: June 24, 2012, 08:56:48 AM »
Maybe Obama's Saudi handlers in Jr. High also influenced the entire nation of Egypt. - 333386
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Straw Man

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Re: Obama has been a successful POTUS
« Reply #81 on: June 24, 2012, 08:59:33 AM »
Maybe Obama's Saudi handlers in Jr. High also influenced the entire nation of Egypt. - 333386

333 probably remembers that

Soul Crusher

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Re: Obama has been a successful POTUS
« Reply #82 on: June 24, 2012, 09:06:18 AM »
333's brain can only recognize word, concepts, ideas, facts that mirror his preconceived beliefs

Often his brain will dissasemble the content and reassemble it as something he agrees with

This is why he can watch a video, listen to a recording or read text and see and hear things that aren't there
[/quote



LOL. - I refuted everything he cited , as did others w specifics.   

andreisdaman

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Re: Obama has been a successful POTUS
« Reply #83 on: June 24, 2012, 09:10:33 AM »
Sorry to burst everyone's bubbles around here, but by objective standards Obama has been a successful POTUS and a far more competent one than his predecessor. The primary such standard is the amount of legislation proposed/passed/implemented, a value that makes Obama far above average.

His foreign policy has been a success: his election instantly boosted world public opinion, which matters to the extent that it feeds into our soft power, or ability to influence others. His emphasis on multilateralism is sound and the operation in Libya to secure those oil resources for the world (no, democracy was not and almost never is the primary goal) was a stellar success that cost zero American lives and a mere $2 billion (we each payed a little over $6 for it). On the other hand his administration's emphasis on drone strikes and covert operations has won the war on terror: Al Qaeda has been genuinely ravaged and barely functions as an organization. Such operations included the personally-authorized killing of OBL, an important symbolic victory.

Things are more complex at home. Banking regulation was passed, which includes the Volcker Rule banning proprietary trading and other measures that are seemingly necessary to prevent another bailout, but nobody knows just how much regulation is optimal. Obama also stepped up and addressed the issue predecessors pussied out on, healthcare. The resultant legislation was a centrist plan (anyone who calls it 'socialist' has never been to Europe or examined their public policy) based on a conservative policy proposal that originated with the Heritage Foundation (a mandate to tackle the free riders that increase costs). That it may get struck down does not reflect on Obama as he has no control over SC deliberations to begin with. He can only be evaluated for his specific actions.

Finally, we come to the economy, which is what actually dtermines elections anyway. There is an extraordinary amount of confusion about this as  certain posters think we live in a system where the POTUS wields magical powers that determine the course of the economy. The misunderstanding is reinforced by presidents who take credit for growth and pundits who blame/credit everything happening to a president. The fact is this: we live in a capitalist where private actors control productivity. Corporations invest and hire/fire according to their plans, households only spend according to their perceptions of wealth, and banks lend in response to demand. Presidents do not control any of these variables, and can at best moderately nudge them in one or another direction.

Even considering this, CBO estimates put the number of jobs saved by the stimulus in the hundreds of thousands. The subsequent recovery has been tepid and has disappointed Obama and everybody else. But the point is, if the economic variables are all controlled by exogenous factors outside the WH, how can we lump all of the blame against Obama all the same? There is no evidence at all that a Republican president would have done anything differently, especially not since the stimuls contains much Friedman-esque monetary policy as is (the continued actions of the Fed belie the notion that the stimulus has been purely Keynesian).

In short, Obama has been an above-average president and performed admirably given the inherent limitations on the office (the position just isn't as powerful as many make it out to be) and the simply unprecedented circumstances inherited. People focus on the POTUS as a convenient symbol for everything the USG is doing and everything happening in the economy; the position is a convenient beacon for love and hate with a human face, when the real causality is mostly reserved for faceless machines comprised of the decisions of millions of individual actors (the USG + markets). People ought to understand as such when evaluating a US president.

this post is genius.......notice the person who posted a rebuttal after you could only muster a weak one word response

andreisdaman

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Re: Obama has been a successful POTUS
« Reply #84 on: June 24, 2012, 09:18:24 AM »
The entire foundation of your argument is inaccurate.  Proposed and passed legislation is not the primary measure of a successful presidency.  What if the legislation he proposes is crap and harmful to the country?  That is not success.

Like any CEO, manager, etc., you measure success by the health of the company.  With presidents, you have to ask whether the country is better off today than it was four years ago.  In this case, the answer is clearly no.  The economic indicators are worse.  Unemployment is up. Job growth is down.  Businesses are afraid to expand.  Spending, the deficit, and debt have exploded.  He failed to submit a balanced budget.  Gas prices are up.  Consumer confidence is down.  Home prices are down.  Our credit rating has been downgraded.  His signature, partisan "achievement" is not only unpopular, it's likely going down in flames in the supreme court.
Polls show the overwhelming majority of the country believe the economy is headed in the wrong direction.  

That's failure.
actually it is..... a president shows how effective he is by being able to persuade people to jump onto and vote for his agenda....the president can't wave a magic wand and make gas prices go down....he has no power over gas prices whatsoever....our credit rating was downgraded because the republicans did not want to go along with anything Obama wanted to do......and also our credit should have never been downgraded in the first place because America has never defaulted on anything or missed a debt payment....all of the pundits said that....Businesses are not afraid to expand....they don't hire because they have found they can get by with less workers.....


your post is ludicrous except for the unemployment stuff..Obama deserves blame for that

Shockwave

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Re: Obama has been a successful POTUS
« Reply #85 on: June 24, 2012, 09:19:31 AM »
this post is genius.......notice the person who posted a rebuttal after you could only muster a weak one word response
Or I just didnt feel like writing a page on why I disagree with what was written, when everyone here has heard all the reasons 10,000x.

andreisdaman

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Re: Obama has been a successful POTUS
« Reply #86 on: June 24, 2012, 09:20:06 AM »
I've mentioned the specifics repeatedly throughout the thread. This last post was meant to explain the criteria I'm using, which is more or less what you asked for. If it's just a 'bunch of words' to you then that reflects something about you, not the post. It's pretty clear in its meaning.

it doesn't matter what evidence you post...3333 is not going to acknowledge anything you present which will put Obama in a positive light..I learned this years ago and stopped arguing with him because it is pointless...

andreisdaman

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Re: Obama has been a successful POTUS
« Reply #87 on: June 24, 2012, 09:22:00 AM »
How is Obama responsible for how Muslim nations vote?

If Bush were still in office, would they have all changed their minds?



It was Obama's speech way back in 2009 in Egypt that he made to the muslim world that gave the muslim masses the go-ahead to topple their leaders and have the right to vote...how they choose to vote is another matter and out of his control

andreisdaman

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Re: Obama has been a successful POTUS
« Reply #88 on: June 24, 2012, 09:23:14 AM »
Why shouldn't he have been?

When you have democracy in a country, those people determine whom they elect.

The same thing happened under Bush with Hezbollah. Bush didn't control the minds of individual Lebanese.

I never blamed Bush for the way other people voted.

Your pathalogical history has removed any semblance of rationality you may have once held.

Get a job, develop human realtionships and things might start looking up for you.




very good post and good recall of facts...also under Bush (who I supported, but am not partisan about) HAMAS was elected in GAZA after he called for Democracy there

Soul Crusher

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Re: Obama has been a successful POTUS
« Reply #89 on: June 24, 2012, 09:49:48 AM »
1.  Has obama swayed the american electorate to the progressive viewpoint?   No. 

2.  Has obama helped or hurt the democrat party electorally?  Hurt

3.  Has obama passed bi-partisan bills that most of the electorate wants or likes?  No, despite the fact that LBJ, Nixon, Reagan, Clinton, GWB did.

4.  Has obama improved or worsed our foreign policy?  Ask Russia or China about that one

5.  If ObamaCare goes down, what will obama's legacy be? 

6.  Has obama inspired confidence in the economy for growth or expansion?  no. 

7.  Has obama been faithful to the USC overall?   No 

8.  Has obama been true to his promises of bringing people together and having a transparent admn?  No 

9.  Has obama addressed the most serious issues of the day?  Simpson Bowles anyone? 

10.  If obama is so effective, why his is blaming everyone for everything as opposed to running on his record?

11.  If Obama is so effective, why are increasin numbers of democrats running away from him? 

12.  If Obama is so successfull, why have 3 million democrats left the part since he was elected? 

13.  What specific criteria are we looking at?  By most measures everything is worse than when he came in by his own measure 3 years ago. 
   

Soul Crusher

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Re: Obama has been a successful POTUS
« Reply #90 on: June 24, 2012, 09:57:44 AM »
Obama’s Muslim World Fantasy: Early Hopes Undermined by Drone War


Looking at the latest Pew poll from the Middle East, the promise of a reboot in relations after the president’s vaunted 2009 Cairo speech is history.

by Elise Jordan (/contributors/elise-jordan.html)  | June 24, 2012 4:45 AM EDT


http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2012/06/24/obama-s-muslim-world-fantasy-early-hopes-undermined-by-drone-war.print.html




Three years ago this month, President Barack Obama promised a transformation in America’s relations with the Muslim world. He gave the first television interview of his presidency to the Al Arabiya news channel six days after his inauguration, and sent a Persian New Year video address to the people of Iran a few months later.  The high water mark of his stated quest to rehab our reputation occurred in Cairo, in a speech titled “A New Beginning.” (/articles/2009/06/05/the-arab-world-reacts.html) There, Obama apologized for past sins against the Muslim world (like colonialism) and heralded the religion’s historical “tolerance and racial equality.”
 
To stay on message, Obama avoided mentioning some of the more uncomfortable realities—that our most significant terrorist threat is from those using Islam as a shield, as well as the gender discrimination Muslim women face, one of the world’s most egregious and systematic abuses of human rights.
 

But despite these efforts, it’s now clear that his platitudes didn’t get him very far. The men and women of the region, it seems, have seen through the Obama hype. According to a recently released Pew poll on Obama’s favorability in the Muslim world

(http://www.pewglobal.org/2012/06/13/global-opinion-of-obama-slips-international-policies-faulted/) , 76 percent of Egyptians would like to make him a one-termer. Majorities in Pakistan, Lebanon, and Jordan don’t want to see Obama re-elected, either. “Respondents in predominantly Muslim countries continue to have a low opinion of Obama, and the American leader’s ratings have slipped significantly since 2009 in the five Muslim countries where trends are available, including a 13 percentage-point poll drop in Egypt,” according to Pew. “Opinion is generally against Obama in most of the predominantly Muslim countries surveyed.”
 

Why the backlash against Obama?
 

In Cairo, Obama promised a relationship with the Muslim world built on “mutual interest and mutual respect.” He avoided any strong calls for the democratic movements that would sweep the region two years later, leaving dissidents feeling like they were standing alone. “What touched on democracy and human rights in the speech was far less than we wanted,” said Ayman Nour, a prominent Egyptian political prisoner, after the remarks.
 

Obama then missed a series of opportunities to be on the right side of history.   First, in real time, he didn’t lend support for democratic dissidents in Iran in 2009, where today’s nuclear endgame might be quite different if he did so. His policy of non-interference left Tehran’s leadership empowered to torture and imprison leaders of the Green movement and closer than ever to obtaining a nuclear weapon. Obama was behind the eight ball on Egypt, largely silent on the Saudi crackdown on Bahrain

(http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/article/ALeqM5grCsXLkRIB9gZHMeL8q-zYdqdVMw?docId=0d768417377049eeab301bb80ef8b9c3) , and appears at a loss about who to back in Syria.
 
Supporters of Pakistani religious party Sunni Tehreek raise their hands condemning President Obama during an anti-American rally in September in Hyderabad, Pakistan. (Pervez Masih / AP Photo )
 

Although he did choose to bomb Libya and oust Gaddafi—a despot, but one who had renounced his nuclear program to avoid Saddam Hussein’s fate—support on the Arab Street was fleeting because of our inconsistent policy of ousting dictators who serve no American interest, but tolerating despotic royals in Saudi Arabia and Bahrain (/articles/2011/05/19/stop-defending-saudi-arabia-obama.html) .
 

Obama did, however, promise the Muslim world he’d respect “principles of justice and progress”—exactly the opposite of our policy of a remote-controlled drone war, the most hated policy, according to the Pew poll. Unsurprisingly, of 20 countries surveyed, majorities in 17 nations disapprove of the U.S. military’s use of drones in Pakistan, Yemen, and Somalia.
 

That kind of widespread anger used to be a major talking point when it was President George W. Bush who was blamed for it. But now among Democrats and so-called progressives, there’s a particularly egregious double standard. Bush’s detention policies were universally condemned by liberals, while Obama’s outright killing of suspected terrorists, including an American citizen turned al Qaeda operative, with no due process, was applauded.
 

During Obama’s presidency, the use of drones increased fivefold. Once in office, he’s decided to fight terrorism with no accountability or transparency—and yet he still wants to win hearts and minds in the Muslim world.
 

It’s telling that despite the pomp and circumstance surrounding Obama’s reconfiguring relations, our approval rating hasn’t even held steady, but plummeted because of an over-reliance on the drone campaign.


There might be a way to do this, but it has more risk attached to it than giving a well-written speech. To pursue a terrorism policy that’s based on capturing and interrogating the bad guys, rather than just randomly blowing up a bunch of people who might be threat. It’s a lot harder to capture a terrorist, keep them alive for interrogation, and figure out to do with them afterward than it is to kill by remote control thousands of miles from the battlefield.
 

When war—as our bombing campaigns in Pakistan and Yemen should be called—becomes anonymous, un-measurable in its outcome, and relatively risk-free in human cost on our end, it’s unsurprising that the Pakistanis and Yemenis we ostensibly don’t want to radicalize are angered by our targeting campaign (/articles/2012/06/02/a-son-carries-benazir-bhutto-s-mantle-after-her-death.html) .
 

After all, there’s no illusion that America was beloved in Pakistan in 2008. But it’s telling that despite the pomp and circumstance surrounding Obama’s reconfiguring relations, our approval rating hasn’t even held steady, but plummeted because of an over-reliance on the drone campaign. Obama’s dithering has sent more than 120,000 Syrian refugees into Jordan, intensifying Jordan’s chronic water shortage and state fiscal crisis, as well as raising fears that Assad loyalists are infiltrating the Hashemite Kingdom. Like Americans who bought into “change you can believe in,” audiences abroad are frustrated by Obama’s habit of overpromising in rhetoric. When Obama accepted his Nobel Peace Prize, he gave lip service to multilateral institutions, when in reality America’s foreign policy will not ever be subjugated to the whims of flawed international organizations.
 

The world has wised up to the harsh reality of Obama’s leadership. The Nobel laureate is all words and no deeds, save anonymous strikes. And where the Muslim world senses weakness, Europe sees decline. According to the Pew poll, the rest of the world increasingly shares agreement that China is the leading economic superpower.
 

But it’s not all doom and gloom. The depressing irony is in what the Muslim world does respect about America. More than half of Jordanians, Egyptians, Tunisians, and Lebanese respond favorably about our capitalistic model. They like the way we do business—more trade, less drones might not be a bad policy for the president to pursue.

Straw Man

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Re: Obama has been a successful POTUS
« Reply #91 on: June 24, 2012, 10:08:05 AM »
actually it is..... a president shows how effective he is by being able to persuade people to jump onto and vote for his agenda....the president can't wave a magic wand and make gas prices go down....he has no power over gas prices whatsoever....our credit rating was downgraded because the republicans did not want to go along with anything Obama wanted to do......and also our credit should have never been downgraded in the first place because America has never defaulted on anything or missed a debt payment....all of the pundits said that....Businesses are not afraid to expand....they don't hire because they have found they can get by with less workers.....


your post is ludicrous except for the unemployment stuff..Obama deserves blame for that

Repubs get plenty of blame too

they didn't do anything to help employment and they prevented Obama from increasing government employment in spite of the fact the 3 former Republican POTUS's grew government employment as one means to reduce unemployment and effectively stimulate a recovery

Unlike the recession during Reagan, Bush1 and Bush2, government employment has actually gone down under Obama

Soul Crusher

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Re: Obama has been a successful POTUS
« Reply #92 on: June 24, 2012, 10:11:09 AM »
Repubs get plenty of blame too

they didn't do anything to help employment and they prevented Obama from increasing government employment in spite of the fact the 3 former Republican POTUS's grew government employment as one means to reduce unemployment and effectively stimulate a recovery

Unlike the recession during Reagan, Bush1 and Bush2, government employment has actually gone down under Obama

Straw - where does the money come from to fund more govt employment at the state level? 

garebear

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Re: Obama has been a successful POTUS
« Reply #93 on: June 24, 2012, 10:12:49 AM »
Obama’s Muslim World Fantasy: Early Hopes Undermined by Drone War


Looking at the latest Pew poll from the Middle East, the promise of a reboot in relations after the president’s vaunted 2009 Cairo speech is history.

by Elise Jordan (/contributors/elise-jordan.html)  | June 24, 2012 4:45 AM EDT


http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2012/06/24/obama-s-muslim-world-fantasy-early-hopes-undermined-by-drone-war.print.html




Three years ago this month, President Barack Obama promised a transformation in America’s relations with the Muslim world. He gave the first television interview of his presidency to the Al Arabiya news channel six days after his inauguration, and sent a Persian New Year video address to the people of Iran a few months later.  The high water mark of his stated quest to rehab our reputation occurred in Cairo, in a speech titled “A New Beginning.” (/articles/2009/06/05/the-arab-world-reacts.html) There, Obama apologized for past sins against the Muslim world (like colonialism) and heralded the religion’s historical “tolerance and racial equality.”
 
To stay on message, Obama avoided mentioning some of the more uncomfortable realities—that our most significant terrorist threat is from those using Islam as a shield, as well as the gender discrimination Muslim women face, one of the world’s most egregious and systematic abuses of human rights.
 

But despite these efforts, it’s now clear that his platitudes didn’t get him very far. The men and women of the region, it seems, have seen through the Obama hype. According to a recently released Pew poll on Obama’s favorability in the Muslim world

(http://www.pewglobal.org/2012/06/13/global-opinion-of-obama-slips-international-policies-faulted/) , 76 percent of Egyptians would like to make him a one-termer. Majorities in Pakistan, Lebanon, and Jordan don’t want to see Obama re-elected, either. “Respondents in predominantly Muslim countries continue to have a low opinion of Obama, and the American leader’s ratings have slipped significantly since 2009 in the five Muslim countries where trends are available, including a 13 percentage-point poll drop in Egypt,” according to Pew. “Opinion is generally against Obama in most of the predominantly Muslim countries surveyed.”
 

Why the backlash against Obama?
 

In Cairo, Obama promised a relationship with the Muslim world built on “mutual interest and mutual respect.” He avoided any strong calls for the democratic movements that would sweep the region two years later, leaving dissidents feeling like they were standing alone. “What touched on democracy and human rights in the speech was far less than we wanted,” said Ayman Nour, a prominent Egyptian political prisoner, after the remarks.
 

Obama then missed a series of opportunities to be on the right side of history.   First, in real time, he didn’t lend support for democratic dissidents in Iran in 2009, where today’s nuclear endgame might be quite different if he did so. His policy of non-interference left Tehran’s leadership empowered to torture and imprison leaders of the Green movement and closer than ever to obtaining a nuclear weapon. Obama was behind the eight ball on Egypt, largely silent on the Saudi crackdown on Bahrain

(http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/article/ALeqM5grCsXLkRIB9gZHMeL8q-zYdqdVMw?docId=0d768417377049eeab301bb80ef8b9c3) , and appears at a loss about who to back in Syria.
 
Supporters of Pakistani religious party Sunni Tehreek raise their hands condemning President Obama during an anti-American rally in September in Hyderabad, Pakistan. (Pervez Masih / AP Photo )
 

Although he did choose to bomb Libya and oust Gaddafi—a despot, but one who had renounced his nuclear program to avoid Saddam Hussein’s fate—support on the Arab Street was fleeting because of our inconsistent policy of ousting dictators who serve no American interest, but tolerating despotic royals in Saudi Arabia and Bahrain (/articles/2011/05/19/stop-defending-saudi-arabia-obama.html) .
 

Obama did, however, promise the Muslim world he’d respect “principles of justice and progress”—exactly the opposite of our policy of a remote-controlled drone war, the most hated policy, according to the Pew poll. Unsurprisingly, of 20 countries surveyed, majorities in 17 nations disapprove of the U.S. military’s use of drones in Pakistan, Yemen, and Somalia.
 

That kind of widespread anger used to be a major talking point when it was President George W. Bush who was blamed for it. But now among Democrats and so-called progressives, there’s a particularly egregious double standard. Bush’s detention policies were universally condemned by liberals, while Obama’s outright killing of suspected terrorists, including an American citizen turned al Qaeda operative, with no due process, was applauded.
 

During Obama’s presidency, the use of drones increased fivefold. Once in office, he’s decided to fight terrorism with no accountability or transparency—and yet he still wants to win hearts and minds in the Muslim world.
 

It’s telling that despite the pomp and circumstance surrounding Obama’s reconfiguring relations, our approval rating hasn’t even held steady, but plummeted because of an over-reliance on the drone campaign.


There might be a way to do this, but it has more risk attached to it than giving a well-written speech. To pursue a terrorism policy that’s based on capturing and interrogating the bad guys, rather than just randomly blowing up a bunch of people who might be threat. It’s a lot harder to capture a terrorist, keep them alive for interrogation, and figure out to do with them afterward than it is to kill by remote control thousands of miles from the battlefield.
 

When war—as our bombing campaigns in Pakistan and Yemen should be called—becomes anonymous, un-measurable in its outcome, and relatively risk-free in human cost on our end, it’s unsurprising that the Pakistanis and Yemenis we ostensibly don’t want to radicalize are angered by our targeting campaign (/articles/2012/06/02/a-son-carries-benazir-bhutto-s-mantle-after-her-death.html) .
 

After all, there’s no illusion that America was beloved in Pakistan in 2008. But it’s telling that despite the pomp and circumstance surrounding Obama’s reconfiguring relations, our approval rating hasn’t even held steady, but plummeted because of an over-reliance on the drone campaign. Obama’s dithering has sent more than 120,000 Syrian refugees into Jordan, intensifying Jordan’s chronic water shortage and state fiscal crisis, as well as raising fears that Assad loyalists are infiltrating the Hashemite Kingdom. Like Americans who bought into “change you can believe in,” audiences abroad are frustrated by Obama’s habit of overpromising in rhetoric. When Obama accepted his Nobel Peace Prize, he gave lip service to multilateral institutions, when in reality America’s foreign policy will not ever be subjugated to the whims of flawed international organizations.
 

The world has wised up to the harsh reality of Obama’s leadership. The Nobel laureate is all words and no deeds, save anonymous strikes. And where the Muslim world senses weakness, Europe sees decline. According to the Pew poll, the rest of the world increasingly shares agreement that China is the leading economic superpower.
 

But it’s not all doom and gloom. The depressing irony is in what the Muslim world does respect about America. More than half of Jordanians, Egyptians, Tunisians, and Lebanese respond favorably about our capitalistic model. They like the way we do business—more trade, less drones might not be a bad policy for the president to pursue.

But he's still a secret Muslim?

You can't have it both ways.

Or maybe his Saudi handlers in Jr. High planned all of this?

Jesus Christ, get a job.
G

Straw Man

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Re: Obama has been a successful POTUS
« Reply #94 on: June 24, 2012, 10:19:37 AM »
Straw - where does the money come from to fund more govt employment at the state level? 

various sources and as you well know, many states receive more in federal funds than they pay in taxes

net increase in dollars from the federal goverment allows other state resources to be used to maintin or increase employment

As you also well know, some of the stimulus money was targeted specifically to increase employment at the state level

Soul Crusher

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Re: Obama has been a successful POTUS
« Reply #95 on: June 24, 2012, 10:21:55 AM »
various sources and as you well know, many states receive more in federal funds than they pay in taxes

net increase in dollars from the federal goverment allows other state resources to be used to maintin or increase employment

As you also well know, some of the stimulus money was targeted specifically to increase employment at the state level

And I don't agree w that at all since all it is is a band aid.   We have a Federal system and the Fedzilla should not be propping up bloated state govts that need to be cut anyway whether they are in NY, Cali, or WV or Miss. 

Straw Man

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Re: Obama has been a successful POTUS
« Reply #96 on: June 24, 2012, 10:28:47 AM »
And I don't agree w that at all since all it is is a band aid.   We have a Federal system and the Fedzilla should not be propping up bloated state govts that need to be cut anyway whether they are in NY, Cali, or WV or Miss. 

yet Repubs had no problem with it when their party was in power during prior recessions

Maybe they understood that more employment especially in the lower and middle classes is a de facto stimulus because when the poor and middle class have money they spend it.

When the rich get more money they save it or invest it in ways that don't do anything for the economy

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Re: Obama has been a successful POTUS
« Reply #97 on: June 24, 2012, 10:31:52 AM »
yet Repubs had no problem with it when their party was in power during prior recessions

Maybe they understood that more employment especially in the lower and middle classes is a de facto stimulus because when the poor and middle class have money they spend it.

When the rich get more money they save it or invest it in ways that don't do anything for the economy

Savings and investments held in the bank are used for what by banks again? 

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Re: Obama has been a successful POTUS
« Reply #98 on: June 24, 2012, 10:33:59 AM »
Savings and investments held in the bank are used for what by banks again? 

no comparison to $'s paid in wages being spent for goods and services


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Re: Obama has been a successful POTUS
« Reply #99 on: June 24, 2012, 10:37:41 AM »
no comparison to $'s paid in wages being spent for goods and services



For shit made in China.   Savings is used to lend to business and expand existing operations.   We need growth and production, not more consumption. 

Do you even know how banking works? 

When you deposit money into the bank - they use it to lend to business or other loans.