The Official Pro-Argi 9 Experiment!!!!!!!!!!! How much is it really worth????

[Vince G, CSN MFT]

Now, I've been hearing Jaguar day in and day out preach about how great Pro-Argi 9 is.  But everyone has been ragging her down constantly.

So after some hard thought, I decided to see how much it is actually worth.  Here's what I did.  I created a ProArgi 9 Ebay Ad and placed the ad online.  The address is listed below

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=5659027558


To be more than generous and fair, I created an ad more expensive than all of my ads I currently have.  The total amount I spend on posting this ad was a whooping $5.15 compared to my average cost on one of my ads for 70 cents.  This gives all the exposure for anyone to see and to bid on the ad.  I also started the price at .01 reserve to make it the biggest bulleye possible.

If this product sells, I will process the order and give Judi all the money to send it out.

Can Pro-Argi 9 make the grade???  Find out!!!! 

[Havenbull]

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

well done Vince

[Havenbull]

But Vince, I just thought of something.

What if Jag get a phoney ebay account and runs up the bidding on her shit product...

just so she can prove you wrong?

[24KT]

Now, I've been hearing Jaguar day in and day out preach about how great Pro-Argi 9 is.  But everyone has been ragging her down constantly.

So after some hard thought, I decided to see how much it is actually worth.  Here's what I did.  I created a ProArgi 9 Ebay Ad and placed the ad online.  The address is listed below

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=5659027558


To be more than generous and fair, I created an ad more expensive than all of my ads I currently have.  The total amount I spend on posting this ad was a whooping $5.15 compared to my average cost on one of my ads for 70 cents.  This gives all the exposure for anyone to see and to bid on the ad.  I also started the price at .01 reserve to make it the biggest bulleye possible.

If this product sells, I will process the order and give Judi all the money to send it out.

Can Pro-Argi 9 make the grade???  Find out!!!! 

How many places are you going post this?

http://www.boom7.com/index.php?topic=478.msg5872#msg5872

http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?topic=53128.0

And no this is like the 3rd time I'm answering this. At this point it's cut & paste

 

Vince,
I don't know if this is your attempt to be supportive, ...or to try to bash me and/or my products again 
...but I do have to state I think it is very ill-advised for a number of reasons, ...the least of which:

• What are you going to do if someone requests Orange or Grape flavoured ProArgi-9?
• You are not a licensed distributor of the product
• Even if you were... you are contravening Synergy's P&P by placing it on eBay
• You are not educated about this particular product
• You are not qualified to answer questions about the product
• You have no personal experience with this product
• You are unable to provide fulfillment for the product
• Whether or not it sells, is by no means any sort of accurate barometer of it's efficacy
• Your advertising for sale, and accepting money for something you do not have and cannot provide fulfillment for IS FRAUD & LARCENY!

I truly don't understand what you are hoping to accomplish, ...or why? 
Is this some attempt on your part to make amends for the onslaught of unfounded & libelous statements you have subjected me to for the past 2 years? If it is, I appreciate the gesture, ...but it is unecessary. Very unecessary. Or is this some attempt to settle any questions in your mind once and for all?  If that's the case, the only way to settle that debate, is to actually use the product yourself and judge it based on your results, how YOU respond to it, rather than how some anonymous web surfer responds to your ad. That, by far is a more effective barometer than anything else, because not all people have the same response to l-arginine. Listen to this recorded interview <--clickable link

You see Vince, a successful network marketing business isn't built upon the retailing of something you deem saleable to anonymous people you encounter. It's built upon consumers who LOVE a product, use a product, become products of the product (I'm sure you've heard that phrase before) and as a result can then gladly inform others, letting them know of it's existence and potential to meet their needs. And in that recommendation, they are able to speak knowledgeably & truthfully about both the product and the personal results and/or benefits they've received from using it. They are not order takers from Walmart where the consumer upon entering the store already knows what they want, and all you have to do it point them to the aisle in which it is located. That's what a retailer is. To introduce a new product which incorporates new technology to a consumer, there requires some interaction and education, ...neither of which can be properly accomplished through an eBay website, or any other sort of static website for that matter. Feel free to view this interview with Paul Zane Pilzer who really articulates the difference between the dynamics of a retail sale vs. a network marketing sale.

Paul Zane Pilzer interview  <--clickable link

Every single one of us have been network marketing since the age of 5, when we recommended baseball or hockey cards to our friends on the playground, ...or told our parents which cool sneakers or jeans we wanted, and we've continued to do it ever since. The only difference is some of us pick up a cheque for something we would gladly do for free.

If you have a problem with ProArgi-9, or are skeptical about it, ...ignore it. It's really very simple.

PS - I hope you were able to check into that info I gave you about Garden of Life?

[Vince G, CSN MFT]

But Vince, I just thought of something.

What if Jag get a phoney ebay account and runs up the bidding on her shit product...

just so she can prove you wrong?

My account will not accept a bid without a feedback score of more than 3.  Or at least I think so   But I'll be able to tell if its real or fake.  Besides, if it is phony, then I'll get my money back by filing a Unpaid Listing Credit   

[Vince G, CSN MFT]

And I'm not trying to embarrass her at all, if I was, would I post this

http://web.archive.org/web/20050128071721/http://jaguarenterprises.com/


Tell us Judi, what is Monavie??? 

You folks have got to hear the audio message for the payment plan 

[weedoutheweak]

This is very sad.

[Billy Rosewood]

Vince, was this pic taken of you before or after your last contest?

[GetItOnNY]

Vince, I am a chemist, I formulate for companies as well as custom formulations for pro athletes.This product is just okay, nothing special trust me.It has a proprietory blend 5100 mg, of L-Arginine, some BCCAS , and some Gammo O.The product isnt some cutting edge supplement by al means.If you wanted to make the product kick some serious ass, add 12 grams of L-Glutamine, 10 grams of BCAAS, 5 grams of L-Arginine, 3 grams of AAKG,3 grams of Taurine.Then you might want ot add 3to 5 grams of KRE-ALKALYN, the best creatine ever created.Then back it up with like a 5 step time released carb, then throw in an ester to make it a 6 stage time released carb.If you wanted to put Gammo O in you could ,just to give it a lil more bang.This L-Arginine Jaguar is selling is bad, but it isnt great either.It is an inexpensive formulation with only 5100 mg of proprietory ingredients, that only 5.1 grams, that not alot .That means you might have 1 to 2 grams of L-Arginine, and maybe 1 gram of BCCCAS ,which is not alot at all.Yes the formulation I spoke about is 1000 times better, and will knock you on your as in a good way.

[24KT]

And I'm not trying to embarrass her at all, if I was, would I post this

http://web.archive.org/web/20050128071721/http://jaguarenterprises.com/


Tell us Judi, what is Monavie???  

You folks have got to hear the audio message for the payment plan  

Monavie is an Acai berry drink that was released through a different Utah based company in Jan 2005.
In the fall of 2004, at one point I flirted with carrying it because it was Acai, and functional beverages are in high demand.

After doing a little more due diligence and speaking with the CEO Dallin Larsen, and experiencing the product prior to the launch, I decided I didn't want to pursue it. It was the only product in their lineup I had any interest in at all, and decided I wasn't happy with everything I saw about their company, including how the product was manufactured, and the integrity thereof. I'm glad I made the decision I did too.

We saw a large amount of Synergy distributors join Monarch when Monavie launched, simply because they were losing patience with Synergy's delay in releasing Acai berry juice. Just as quickly as they jumped in, quite a few jumped right back out upon seeing the quality of their Acai product, and those who lacked the ability to decifer the comp plan going in (which attempted to mimic synergy's), got a quick lesson in breakage, that favoured the heavy hitter but crushed the little guy. I developed a huge downline by osmosis and spillover prior to the launch, but never pursued it, ...and redirected the url that pointed there elsewhere.

It took another year, not until Sept 2005 before Synergy finally launch her own Acai juice blend. They didn't slap it together lickety split like the other company, they instead made sure their product formulation was of the highest quality, and independant lab testing subsequently bears this out. It was a long time coming, ...but unlike other companies, Synergy didn't need the product to save it from impending bankruptcy, so there was no need to rush doing a half-baked job which so many companies unfortunately tend to do. Unlike others, whats in our bottle cost more than the actual bottle itself, ...which is something that can't be said for far too many companies out there.

Hope That Clarifies,

[Bossa]

Will synergy products give you results like this

[24KT]

Vince, I am a chemist, I formulate for companies as well as custom formulations for pro athletes.This product is just okay, nothing special trust me.It has a proprietory blend 5100 mg, of L-Arginine, some BCCAS , and some Gammo O.The product isnt some cutting edge supplement by al means.If you wanted to make the product kick some serious ass, add 12 grams of L-Glutamine, 10 grams of BCAAS, 5 grams of L-Arginine, 3 grams of AAKG,3 grams of Taurine.Then you might want ot add 3to 5 grams of KRE-ALKALYN, the best creatine ever created.Then back it up with like a 5 step time released carb, then throw in an ester to make it a 6 stage time released carb.If you wanted to put Gammo O in you could ,just to give it a lil more bang.This L-Arginine Jaguar is selling is bad, but it isnt great either.It is an inexpensive formulation with only 5100 mg of proprietory ingredients, that only 5.1 grams, that not alot .That means you might have 1 to 2 grams of L-Arginine, and maybe 1 gram of BCCCAS ,which is not alot at all.Yes the formulation I spoke about is 1000 times better, and will knock you on your as in a good way.

GetItOnNY,

I'm not gonna call you a liar, or a BS artist. I'm going to give you the benefit of the doubt and for the sake of argument won't contest your professing to be a chemist. OK, so you are a chemist, ...you are not an arginine bio-chemist, and the advice you just gave is inaccurate. For one, each serving contains 12.5 grams of product (part of which is 5 grams of arginine). The remaining 7.5 grams is the glycoside rider crucial to ensuring the arginine takes the correct isoform pathway. In addition taking arginine with some of the other products you mention will cause it to respond like an ordinary protein and it's properties when isolated from it's brother & sister amino acids will not manifest. You will simply have wasted your money. That's like buying an umbrella, but keeping it closed in the trunk of your car, while you're out walking in a rain storm. Why bother using a product if you're not going to use it as it was designed to be used? You'd be better off not to even bother purchasing it to begin with, and saving the money to use on a gym membership or food.

[24KT]

Will synergy products give you results like this

No, ...but Knny187's photoshop might. 

[GetItOnNY]

I just read the label again the propreitory blend5100mg contains, L-Arginine, L-Leucine, L-Isoleucine, L-Valine Gamm O ,and Trans Feulic Acid .It does not contain 5000 mg of L-Arginine it contains 5100mg of these 6 diffrent components.I didnt say the product was bad it is just okay, nothing special, nothing cutting edge.This product except for the Gamma O, is like 1990 technology.I work with alot of pro athletes, if you dont beleive my formulations dont work, ask Troy Alves, or even Gustavo Badell about me.I was the first company to come out with time released protein 1995, first first Calcium Pyruvate, 1996, the first time released L-Glutamine 1998, just ot name a few.Jaguar I have read your post, and you seem very noledgeable.But when it comes to formulations, trust, me, I am one of the best in the industry.

[GetItOnNY]

Where on this label does it say it contains 5 grams of L-Arginine?I see a proprietory blend containing 5100 mg including L-Arginine .Is the label not telling the truth?

[GetItOnNY]

Another thing, why just L-Arginine, why not add AAKG, Its more effective then L-Arginine, increases NO into the muscle belly when used with l-Arginine?Also why so little branched chain Amino Acids?Why not put 5 to 8 grams of BCCCAS in there to make it kick ass? What about Alpha Lapoic Acid? Why only chromium alone?You could also throw some Vanadium  Citrate in there to really get them carbs rolling.Like I said before the product is okay it just has alot of gaps in it.

[Van_Bilderass]

Another thing, why just L-Arginine, why not add AAKG, Its more effective then L-Arginine, increases NO into the muscle belly when used with l-Arginine?Also why so little branched chain Amino Acids?Why not put 5 to 8 grams of BCCCAS in there to make it kick ass? What about Alpha Lapoic Acid? Why only chromium alone?You could also throw some Vanadium  Citrate in there to really get them carbs rolling.Like I said before the product is okay it just has alot of gaps in it.

Could you elaborate on your background a bit more? I find your knowledge of supplements and how they work very poor, no offence. 

[GetItOnNY]

What knowledge did you find that I posted not very creadable?
I have 7200  hours of labtime in biochem,chemistry, and chemistry science

[24KT]

I just read the label again the propreitory blend5100mg contains, L-Arginine, L-Leucine, L-Isoleucine, L-Valine Gamm O ,and Trans Feulic Acid .It does not contain 5000 mg of L-Arginine it contains 5100mg of these 6 diffrent components.

I'm not refering to the proprietary blend, I was refering to the l-arginine content alone.

I didnt say the product was bad it is just okay, nothing special, nothing cutting edge.This product except for the Gamma O, is like 1990 technology.I work with alot of pro athletes, if you dont beleive my formulations dont work, ask Troy Alves, or even Gustavo Badell about me.I was the first company to come out with time released protein 1995, first first Calcium Pyruvate, 1996, the first time released L-Glutamine 1998, just ot name a few.Jaguar I have read your post, and you seem very noledgeable.But when it comes to formulations, trust, me, I am one of the best in the industry.

I was not discussing your formulation. I believe the subject was ProArgi-9. Your formulation may do whatever it does, however, it does not do what ProArgi9 does which is to access the homodymers <sp?>. In order to do that, it would require the glycoside rider which  it does not. Without it, it will not do that?

So tell me GetItOnNY, which isoform pathway does your formulation take? And how do you negate the negative effects of oral arginine ingestion. How is yours synthesized, and what is it's glycemic index? And how do you negate the horrific taste of the arginine? Try to tell me (with a straight face) that making arginine taste good is not a monumental cutting edge high-tech accomplishment in it's own right worthy of a medal, if not one's own weight in gold? Come 'on, I dare ya, ...infact I double dog dare ya? 

I'm refering strictly to the Pina-Colada. I do not care for the Berry flavour at all! 

[24KT]

Damn you Vince, GetItOnNY!

I just got a manicure on Friday, ...and with all this darn typing it's chipped already.

You're getting cut & paste from here on out!   

[Van_Bilderass]

What knowledge did you find that I posted not very creadable?
I have 7200  hours of labtime in biochem,chemistry, and chemistry science

It's just that the ingredients and the formulations you talk about do not "kick ass" in any way IMO. The whole arginine bandwagon, whether it's L-Arginine or AAKG or whatever is a huge scam IMO, and wont put one ounce of muscle on you.

Could you elaborate why the following formulation would "kick ass"? What would it do for me?

"If you wanted to make the product kick some serious ass, add 12 grams of L-Glutamine, 10 grams of BCAAS, 5 grams of L-Arginine, 3 grams of AAKG,3 grams of Taurine.Then you might want ot add 3to 5 grams of KRE-ALKALYN, the best creatine ever created.Then back it up with like a 5 step time released carb, then throw in an ester to make it a 6 stage time released carb.If you wanted to put Gammo O in you could ,just to give it a lil more bang."

Why would "gammo o" give it more "bang"? Do you feel gamma oryzanol builds muscle? If so, what's your evidence?

[24KT]

...This L-Arginine Jaguar is selling is bad,...

I just read the label again the propreitory blend5100mg contains, L-Arginine, L-Leucine, L-Isoleucine, L-Valine Gamm O ,and Trans Feulic Acid .It does not contain 5000 mg of L-Arginine it contains 5100mg of these 6 diffrent components.I didnt say the product was bad it is just okay, nothing special, nothing cutting edge.This product except for the Gamma O, is like 1990 technology.I work with alot of pro athletes, if you dont beleive my formulations dont work, ask Troy Alves, or even Gustavo Badell about me.I was the first company to come out with time released protein 1995, first first Calcium Pyruvate, 1996, the first time released L-Glutamine 1998, just ot name a few.Jaguar I have read your post, and you seem very noledgeable.But when it comes to formulations, trust, me, I am one of the best in the industry.

Do you have MPD or was the first comment a typo?

Forgive me if I choose not to trust the word of someone who posts anonymously and claims to have 7200hrs of lab time, over someone I know who is recognized as the foremost authority on arginine, with well over 23 years experience as an arginine researcher, and one of only 3 arginine biochemists in the world. I'm done typing. Please visit the nutrition board, there are a few threads over there that already explain things you clearly are not aware of. I've got to go eat, ...and try to fix my manicure. 

[what:]

Yeah Vince.  Bee Pollen isn't a BS product now is it.  Just behold the power it packs.

[GetItOnNY]

First of all Van B a friend of mine owns Gamma O his name is John.I have sen alot of good data on Gamma O and elevating Testosterone .I personally wouldnt put Gamma O in there I would put it into a testosteone booster instead.Seeing that there product had Gamma  in it, I was just giving my input on what I would do.
Jaguar my formulations used several diffrent carbohydrate molecules,including Vitargo, which is fast and slow in release. I wont put all of them down because then you could copy one of my many formulations.Plus if you put ALPHA Lapoic Acid , chromium, Vanadium Citrate, and maybe some Pyruvate, ( it being a 3 carbon molecule itself) .These elements would transport the carbs and nutrients into the muscle cell To increase NO I would add Arginine, AAKG,  Citruline Malate,  Potasium Citrate, sodium Phospahte .Then add CO Q 10, with  D-Pinotol, cinamon extract and Taurine to increase circulation to the muscle belly .
As far taste goes, you could use Sucralose or Lohan Kou, to sweeten it  along with a good flavoring system .The formualtion I just put down its pretty simple yet basic.I can make them very simple to very eloborate.Do I hear a little wager maybe, lets say $1000- says I can out formulate anything you can come up with.I am not cocky, I am confident god fearing man, who knows his stuff

[GetItOnNY]

I am a chemist, but I am a big man, 5'11 275 at 8% bodyfat.My hands are huge, so its hard for me to type, that why I have a secretary.That was a type o, I meant to say the product wasnt bad.The product is not bad, just not cuting edge.Here is a pic of me at taken July 2005