Getbig.com: American Bodybuilding, Fitness and Figure
Getbig Main Boards => Gossip & Opinions => Topic started by: JDawg on May 24, 2007, 08:26:52 AM
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Not sure why, but I been thinking... Is there an existing "Code of Conduct" (for lack of a better name) for IFBB athletes? Seems to me it would be a solution to at least some of the issues that plague or reflect poorly on the "sport". Encouraging or requiring athletes and judges to behave in a manner that is in fact "Professional". I understand that everyone has a different idea of what constitutes morality/professionalism...some might even argue that bodybuilding in and off itself is the antithesis of the aforementioned terms. We could start with some broad generalities
- recreational drug use or abuse = suspension or fine
- drug trafficking = suspension
- Spouse abuse = fine
- Pornography of anykind = fine or suspension
- G4P = suspension or fine
- Etc.
Holding "athletes"/representatives accountable for their actions by directly impacting their ability to compete or make money in the sport seems like a relatively easy solution to problems that are driving bodybuilding into an early grave. I have only seen fines/suspensions imposed in recent years when it comes to contract violations or participating in a competitive federation's event in some capacity.
I dont know....call me crazy...just seems to make sense to me.
Thoughts?
JD
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bruce patterson.
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Yes, there is a code of conduct. Has been for some time.
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bob paris
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Yes, there is a code of conduct. Has been for some time.
Thanks Bob....could you elaborate? What is the "Code"? Does it address conduct outside of the competitive arena? What are the penalities and how are they enforced? We have had quite a few "athletes" of questionable (by my definition) character get rewarded over and over, which to me reflects poorly on the sport and its athletes as a whole. Not trying to stir anything up, just curious as to the terms, penalties and process.
JD
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Thanks Bob....could you elaborate? What is the "Code"? Does it address conduct outside of the competitive arena? What are the penalities and how are they enforced? We have had quite a few "athletes" of questionable (by my definition) character get rewarded over and over, which to me reflects poorly on the sport and its athletes as a whole. Not trying to stir anything up, just curious as to the terms, penalties and process.
JD
The Code of Conduct" is a outline of beliefs that the IFBB has as a guideline as to how to conduct yourself as an IFBB athlete...
You can check them out yourself at www.ifbb.com
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The Code of Conduct" is a outline of beliefs that the IFBB has as a guideline as to how to conduct yourself as an IFBB athlete...
You can check them out yourself at www.ifbb.com
Can you tell everyone why their is a Code of Conduct, yet it is never upheld. Just wondering. It couldn't be if they did uphold it there would be no one left to compete is it.
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http://www.ifbb.com/amarules/IFBBRulebook_2006-2007Edition.pdf
APPENDIX 1
IFBB CODE OF ETHICS
Introduction:
The IFBB Code of Ethics exist as a set of beliefs that have been
written to serve as guidelines for the way in which all Members,
be they athletes, judges, officials, administrators or others,
should strive to conduct themselves as Members of the IFBB
family. National Federations and other Members join the IFBB of
their own free will and, in so doing, agree to abide by the IFBB
Constitution and Rules of which the Code of Ethics forms an
integral part. Any Member who is found to have contravened the
Code of Ethics may be subject to disciplinary measures.
(they have sections for athletes, judges, and officials, all saying pretty much the same thing)
[...]
7. to work for the IFBB, not against it, in promoting its
values, morals and ethics; to exercise our right of
protest in a courteous, respectful manner, following the
proper chain of command; to refrain from innuendo,
malicious gossip and rumour-mongering; to refrain from
personal attacks against any other Member of the IFBB.
(No one breaking that rule here)
8. to continue striving for bodily perfection and correct
moral principles.
[...]
12. to oppose the use of banned substances and methods
and to compete drug free.
(for the offiicals)
12. to oppose the use of banned substances and methods
and to take reasonable measures to ensure that all
athletes are competing drug-free.
(but nothing about being arrested or doing porn)
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Can you tell everyone why their is a Code of Conduct, yet it is never upheld. Just wondering. It couldn't be if they did uphold it there would be no one left to compete is it.
What makes you say it's never upheld? Do you have any knowledge of warnings that have been issued, or suspentions for infractions?
Maybe you know something I don't....
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What makes you say it's never upheld? Do you have any knowledge of warnings that have been issued, or suspentions for infractions?
never upheld in the high profile cases. Drugs: Dennis James, Rodney St Cloud, Victor Martinez, on and on. How many top women and men are known prostitutes?
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What makes you say it's never upheld? Do you have any knowledge of warnings that have been issued, or suspentions for infractions?
Maybe you know something I don't....
Well can you tell me how many guys take steroids in the IFBB. I guess none since no one has been fined or suspended for using them. And doing naked sex stuff that i printed and on the internet is okay then right. Teachers, cops and allot of other jobs usually get fined, suspended or even fired for doing stuff the IFBB guys do. But, then again the Code of Conduct doesn't apply. Sorry.
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What makes you say it's never upheld? Do you have any knowledge of warnings that have been issued, or suspentions for infractions?
Maybe you know something I don't....
Bob, you know from speaking to me and reading my posts that I fully support your efforts as IFBB pro rep.
But seriously, to try and defend what actually goes on with the pros in terms or "conduct" and drug use ,is a 180 degrees from the actual written rules. I think your main focus is on getting the best for the pros rather than what the rule book says. It is kinda retarded looking to see all the drug testing rules and personal conduct rules that we know are not followed/enforced....so why even have them ????The awkward thing is seeing these kind of things in print as "official " for the IFBB pros.
I say why not drop all the drug testing rules and personal conduct crap and concentrate on trying to improve the sport with some workable sensible ideas. As IFBB rep you might try to advise the IFBB brass to delete these sections and be consistant.
I was glad to see you made health Ins available for the pros. Do many take advanatge of that?
As a fan I really feel your efforts are sincere and in the best interest of our sport overall.
Ok, I gotta ask this. * Do you think it is possible to convince more pros to not be so extreme in terms of drug use?
I am not suggesting we think drug free, just sensible is all.
Ya know, I could care less what a top pro does to get ready for a show. I just hate reading and seeing horrid looking physiques, big bellys and guys I respect on dialysis.
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Bob, you know from speaking to me and reading my posts that I fully support your efforts as IFBB pro rep.
But seriously, to try and defend what actually goes on with the pros in terms or "conduct" and drug use ,is a 180 degrees from the actual written rules. I think your main focus is on getting the best for the pros rather than what the rule book says. It is kinda retarded looking to see all the drug testing rules and personal conduct rules that we know are not followed/enforced....so why even have them ????The awkward thing is seeing these kind of things in print as "official " for the IFBB pros.
I say why not drop all the drug testing rules and personal conduct crap and concentrate on trying to improve the sport with some workable sensible ideas. As IFBB rep you might try to advise the IFBB brass to delete these sections and be consistant.
I was glad to see you made health Ins available for the pros. Do many take advanatge of that?
As a fan I really feel your efforts are sincere and in the best interest of our sport overall.
Ok, I gotta ask this. * Do you think it is possible to convince more pros to not be so extreme in terms of drug use?
I am not suggesting we think drug free, just sensible is all.
Ya know, I could care less what a top pro does to get ready for a show. I just hate reading and seeing horrid looking physiques, big bellys and guys I respect on dialysis.
They (ifbb) can't delete the "banned" substances section. It provides legal cover. This way there is plausible deniability when the laws start poking around.
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They (ifbb) can't delete the "banned" substances section. It provides legal cover. This way there is plausible deniability when the laws start poking around.
Ya but can you imagine this in open court with real lawyers and a judge????
Why do think they caved in about that "diurectic failure" when Jay got that close 2nd a few years back.
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The sport of bodybuilding is already very small in terms of audience.
You would have to ban most athletes and make it even smaller.
I would just ban the hypocrisy!
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The sport of bodybuilding is already very small in terms of audience.
You would have to ban most athletes and make it even smaller.
I would just ban the hypocrisy!
Yup! well said
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So what is the penalty for killing your "personal assistant" and burning her in your Jag?
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Thanks for the link Bob.
My issue is more with regard to athletes being held accountable for their actions both on and off the stage
Alot of that document in reference to athletes is pretty fluffy and not really measureable
For example...
14. to conduct ourselves at all times in a manner that
reflects positively upon the image of the sport and the
IFBB.
What does that mean? Everyone will have a different interpretation!
Where is the "consequence" section? How is this all enforced? I honestly feel that people will aspire to be better if the expectation is placed upon them. To state that "no one would be left" is rediculous... but if there is no standard or expectation clearly and measurably established people will realize that low expectation. There needs to be more accountability!
JD
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never upheld in the high profile cases. Drugs: Dennis James, Rodney St Cloud, Victor Martinez, on and on. How many top women and men are known prostitutes?
you wouldn't have any knowledge either way, would you?
don't make assumptions based on what YOU think...
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Thanks for the link Bob.
My issue is more with regard to athletes being held accountable for their actions both on and off the stage
Alot of that document in reference to athletes is pretty fluffy and not really measureable
For example...
14. to conduct ourselves at all times in a manner that
reflects positively upon the image of the sport and the
IFBB.
What does that mean? Everyone will have a different interpretation!
Where is the "consequence" section? How is this all enforced? I honestly feel that people will aspire to be better if the expectation is placed upon them. To state that "no one would be left" is rediculous... but if there is no standard or expectation clearly and measurably established people will realize that low expectation. There needs to be more accountability!
JD
The code is just that..a code, a eference, a guideline...there is a reason they are seperate from the rules.
Athletes are held accountable on a individual basis...case by case, and depending on the severity of the infraction, or number of occurances, they may be issed a verbal warning, a written warning, etc...
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gets followed as well as the drug testing rules :-X
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Athletes are held accountable on a individual basis...case by case, and depending on the severity of the infraction, or number of occurances, they may be issed a verbal warning, a written warning, etc...
That's selective enforcement by a nonprofit org. Interesting.
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Bob, you know from speaking to me and reading my posts that I fully support your efforts as IFBB pro rep.
But seriously, to try and defend what actually goes on with the pros in terms or "conduct" and drug use ,is a 180 degrees from the actual written rules.
I don't "defend" it...I explain tp people how it works.Personally, I would get rid of it or enfoce it to the letter...obviously, there isn't much you can with the grey area stuff....
I think your main focus is on getting the best for the pros rather than what the rule book says. It is kinda retarded looking to see all the drug testing rules and personal conduct rules that we know are not followed/enforced....so why even have them ????The awkward thing is seeing these kind of things in print as "official " for the IFBB pros.
Agreed, but it's in print for a reason...much like any business/ company has similiar "rules" that are rarely enforced, but there if they need it.
I say why not drop all the drug testing rules and personal conduct crap and concentrate on trying to improve the sport with some workable sensible ideas. As IFBB rep you might try to advise the IFBB brass to delete these sections and be consistant.
I do what I can...can't change it all overnight.
I was glad to see you made health Ins available for the pros. Do many take advanatge of that?
As a fan I really feel your efforts are sincere and in the best interest of our sport overall.
Thanks...yes, many have taken advantage...i would hope many more would.
Ok, I gotta ask this. * Do you think it is possible to convince more pros to not be so extreme in terms of drug use?
no.
I am not suggesting we think drug free, just sensible is all.
Ya know, I could care less what a top pro does to get ready for a show. I just hate reading and seeing horrid looking physiques, big bellys and guys I respect on dialysis.
The judging criteria could put an end to it very easily....just don't place those guys high...they'll stop looking like that...much like the FBB discussion, stop rewarding a look that doesn't sell, and they'll (the girls) stop looking so extreme. You get what you pay for...
You'll be in Colorado, Howie?
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That's selective enforcement by a nonprofit org. Interesting.
Different circumstances may lead to different results...multiple infractions will always be treated more harsh than a one time infraction...this is the way it's done at every level, at every company, and at every workplace...being non-profit is here nor there.
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Well can you tell me how many guys take steroids in the IFBB. I guess none since no one has been fined or suspended for using them.
She wasn't fined or suspended but sean gay did get disqualified for testing positive for winstrol at the Arnold Classic.
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Different circumstances may lead to different results...multiple infractions will always be treated more harsh than a one time infraction...this is the way it's done at every level, at every company, and at every workplace...being non-profit is here nor there.
okay. I definitely don't know the law about it. My thinking is that if I got arrested for drugs and my boss didn't fire me for breaking the company stated rules on ethics, but my co-worker was 3 minutes late for the third time, and got fired... he might have something actionable. I could be wrong tho.
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you wouldn't have any knowledge either way, would you?
indictments are enough. receiving of packages is enough.
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Not sure why, but I been thinking... Is there an existing "Code of Conduct" (for lack of a better name) for IFBB athletes? Seems to me it would be a solution to at least some of the issues that plague or reflect poorly on the "sport". Encouraging or requiring athletes and judges to behave in a manner that is in fact "Professional". I understand that everyone has a different idea of what constitutes morality/professionalism...some might even argue that bodybuilding in and off itself is the antithesis of the aforementioned terms. We could start with some broad generalities
- recreational drug use or abuse = suspension or fine
- drug trafficking = suspension
- Spouse abuse = fine
- Pornography of anykind = fine or suspension
- G4P = suspension or fine
- Etc.
Holding "athletes"/representatives accountable for their actions by directly impacting their ability to compete or make money in the sport seems like a relatively easy solution to problems that are driving bodybuilding into an early grave. I have only seen fines/suspensions imposed in recent years when it comes to contract violations or participating in a competitive federation's event in some capacity.
I dont know....call me crazy...just seems to make sense to me.
Thoughts?
JD
AS BOB SAYS THERE IS ONE FOR ATHLETES AND OFFICIALS....BUT IT IS NEVER HELD TO...THEY DONT DO SHIT ABOUT THE RULES OR CONDUCT...ONLY IF YOU COMPETE ELSEWHERE :)
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14. to conduct ourselves at all times in a manner that
reflects positively upon the image of the sport and the
IFBB.
JEE NONE DOING THAT NOW..........THAT ONE IS JUST FUNNY....HIT HALF THE GUYS ARE DOING SHIT THAT DOSENT REFLECT A POSITIVE IMAGE FOR THE IFBB.....
LIKE I HAVE SAID THROW THAT RULE BOOK AWAY IT IS BULLSHIT......AND CODE OF CONDUCT FUCK ME WHAT A JOKE......LOOK AT HALF THE OFFICIALS AT SOME OF THESE SHOWS.....FUCKIN CONDUCT YEAH RIGHT...PLEASE BOB...COME ON DONT BE AN IFBB ASS ALL YOUR LIFE...
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indictments are enough. receiving of packages is enough.
Anyone can be indicted, anyone can have charges brought up against them, anyone can be sued....hope you wouldn't be on any jury of mine..! Guilty before charged, right?
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Anyone can be indicted, anyone can have charges brought up against them, anyone can be sued....hope you wouldn't be on any jury of mine..! Guilty before charged, right?
NO YOU COULD BE SUSPENDED TILL CHARGES ARE CLEARED AND FOUND NOT GUILTY......THAT HAPPENS ALOT....
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okay. I definitely don't know the law about it. My thinking is that if I got arrested for drugs and my boss didn't fire me for breaking the company stated rules on ethics, but my co-worker was 3 minutes late for the third time, and got fired... he might have something actionable. I could be wrong tho.
Well...I do know a little something of the law. There is a reason there are different levels of breaking the law. Misdemeanor, felony, disrupting the law, traffic infraction, etc...
There are different infractions for lets say...littering, than lets say...arson. And yes, as a first time offender, you are given a different look than a multiple felon who had history and record.
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Anyone can be indicted, anyone can have charges brought up against them, anyone can be sued....hope you wouldn't be on any jury of mine..! Guilty before charged, right?
we are not talking about a court of law. we are talking about employer-employee relationships or about business contracts.
If a package containing $347,000 of controlled substances were delivered to me or my spouse, I'd be out of a job real quick, even if a jury later found me not guilty on a technicality.
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NO YOU COULD BE SUSPENDED TILL CHARGES ARE CLEARED AND FOUND NOT GUILTY......THAT HAPPENS ALOT....
Could be...no question about it. Doesn't mean the "offender" has done anything actionable by the federation.
Shouls Milos have been suspended for having charges against him? Ultimately, not much happened and no admission of guilt was ever indicated...should he have been suspended? Of course not.
You yourself Lee, broke the code of conduct many times...anything ever happen as a result? A few etters of apology, a written warning or two? Just like anyone else....
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Well...I do know a little something of the law. There is a reason there are different levels of breaking the law. Misdemeanor, felony, disrupting the law, traffic infraction, etc...
There are different infractions for lets say...littering, than lets say...arson. And yes, as a first time offender, you are given a different look than a multiple felon who had history and record.
You make a good point.
Okay - is the severity based upon 1) Damage to the IFBB, or 2) Damage to society?
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we are not talking about a court of law. we are talking about employer-employee relationships or about business contracts.
If a package containing $347,000 of controlled substances were delivered to me or my spouse, I'd be out of a job real quick, even if a jury later found me not guilty on a technicality.
Not neccessarily...what if someone just had a package sent to you...without your knowledge and without your involement? Please...there are a hundred senario's....none of which lend much to this discussion.
Bottom line is, you're making broad generalizations without any direct knowledge of what action (if any) have been taken on various athletes for infractions of the C.O.C. I happen to know for FACT, that many athletes have been issued warnings both verbal and written.
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You make a good point.
Okay - is the severity based upon 1) Damage to the IFBB, or 2) Damage to society?
The sevarity is based on whatever the individual has done...and to what extent. Talking shit about another competitor is prety low on the totem pole...talking shit about an Official / judge is higher....making accusations of contest fixing is higher yet....competing in a rival organization...see ya later.
All depends on the 5 W's....
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The sevarity is based on whatever the individual has done...and to what extent. Talking shit about another competitor is prety low on the totem pole...talking shit about an Official / judge is higher....making accusations of contest fixing is higher yet....competing in a rival organization...see ya later.
All depends on the 5 W's....
Lee is a high profile guy who jumped. That was damaging to the IFBB. No denying that. IFBB took some loss, even if we cannot measure it.
Some of the other guys did things like drugs or prostitution or pornography which - without argument - was a greater damage to SOCIETY.
Lee might have swayed a few sponsors to give their money to someone other than the IFBB promoters. And a few ticketbuyers might have skipped the NY Pro for the NOC. So yes, there was an impact.
Do they put a hgher value on damage done to their own firm, than damage done to society?
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Lee is a high profile guy who jumped. That was damaging to the IFBB. No denying that. IFBB took some loss, even if we cannot measure it.
Some of the other guys did things like drugs or prostitution or pornography which - without argument - was a greater damage to SOCIETY.
Lee might have swayed a few sponsors to give their money to someone other than the IFBB promoters. And a few ticketbuyers might have skipped the NY Pro for the NOC. So yes, there was an impact.
Do they put a hgher value on damage done to their own firm, than damage done to society?
As I said...It's not my call as to what they place a greator emphasis on. Even with your senario...it depends on what has happened and to what extent. Murder charges, lets say....will definately be looked at harder than having a DUI.
Too many variables to be more specific...
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Lee is a high profile guy who jumped. That was damaging to the IFBB. No denying that. IFBB took some loss, even if we cannot measure it.
Some of the other guys did things like drugs or prostitution or pornography which - without argument - was a greater damage to SOCIETY.
Lee might have swayed a few sponsors to give their money to someone other than the IFBB promoters. And a few ticketbuyers might have skipped the NY Pro for the NOC. So yes, there was an impact.
Do they put a hgher value on damage done to their own firm, than damage done to society?
NO PORN IS GOOD..SO WHEN YOUNG KIDS HAVE A HERO MALE OR FEMALE THEY CAN GOOGLE THEM AND SEE THIER GREAT PORN MOVIES......THAT IS GOOD IMAGE FOR IFBB
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Not neccessarily...what if someone just had a package sent to you...without your knowledge and without your involement? Please...there are a hundred senario's....none of which lend much to this discussion.
yeah, someone is going to send me $300k of drugs out of the goodness of their heart. (Please, just click on the donation button on musclememory.com instead.)
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As I said...It's not my call as to what they place a greator emphasis on. Even with your senario...it depends on what has happened and to what extent. Murder charges, lets say....will definately be looked at harder than having a DUI.
Too many variables to be more specific...
IS TITUS A MEMBER IN GOOD STANDING OR DID IT LAPSE FOR NONPAYMENT?
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The sevarity is based on whatever the individual has done...and to what extent. Talking shit about another competitor is prety low on the totem pole...talking shit about an Official / judge is higher....making accusations of contest fixing is higher yet....competing in a rival organization...see ya later.
I don't know. To me throwing a hissy fit about someone competing in another organization does more damage to the IFBB than the athlete actually competing in another org.
Dismissing out of hand that a senior official may be corrupt, threatening someone for even raising the possibility (especially when there have been such rumors for years) does more damage to the IFBB. Every top level athlete throughout Asia had heard these rumors, many believed them.
What causes the most damage to the IFBB is that it appears to be an oligarchy with no accountablity. When it appears that the powers that be are only trying to protect their power and finances, fans stop coming to contests.
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IS TITUS A MEMBER IN GOOD STANDING OR DID IT LAPSE FOR NONPAYMENT?
Good point.
What date did Craig Titus' IFBB Membership become voided?
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rank these on how much damage they do to the reputation of the IFBB?
1) being caught with hundreds of vials of an anabolic steroid along with 19 ecstasy tablets, but never being charged, the rumor being that you turned states evidence
2) doing jack off videos on the internet
3) competing in a non-sanctioned contest
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rank these on how much damage they do to the reputation of the IFBB?
1) being caught with hundreds of vials of an anabolic steroid along with 19 ecstasy tablets, but never being charged, the rumor being that you turned states evidence
2) doing jack off videos on the internet
3) competing in a non-sanctioned contest
1. 1
2. 3
3. 2
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4) murder someone
5) die from abuse
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I'm pretty sure if Lee jumped over to Dillets Federation instead of the PDI, the IFBB probably wouldn't mind. But since Wayne is a threat to them he got the hammer.
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I'm pretty sure if Lee jumped over to Dillets Federation instead of the PDI, the IFBB probably wouldn't mind. But since Wayne is a threat to them he got the hammer.
Non sanctioned is non sanctioned...there is no affiliation with Dilletts federation (should it come to be)....as such, the penalty is the same.
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there are so many athletes that do the Musclemania AND the NPC, but the IFBB never cares... but PDI, ....
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there are so many athletes that do the Musclemania AND the NPC, but the IFBB never cares... but PDI, ....
One is the NPC, and one is the IFBB...
IFBB- PRO
NPC- AMATEUR
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One is the NPC, and one is the IFBB...
and there is a court order (http://www.musclememory.com/wiki/index.php?title=NPC_AAU_Settlement) that prevents the NPC (and Jim Manion by name) from penalizing anyone for entering another organization's contests.
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and there is a court order (http://www.musclememory.com/wiki/index.php?title=NPC_AAU_Settlement) that prevents the NPC (and Jim Manion by name) from penalizing anyone for entering another organization's contests.
You are correct, sir....amateurs can compete wherever they want.
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amateur is not Pro....whats so hard to understand?
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The NPC is the US amateur division of the IFBB ... the same federation.
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The NPC is the US amateur division of the IFBB ... the same federation.
What aren't you getting here?
Amateur rules are different than professional rules...
And no, they aren't the same federation...no different than a AAA baseball club being the same as a Major league team, even though they are a farmclub for that team...
get it now?
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The NPC is part of the IFBB, so it is the same federation.
Otherwise the NPC could not send any athletes to the IFBB World Championships.
The IFBB has amateurs and professionals, two divisions within the same federation.
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The NPC is part of the IFBB, so it is the same federation.
Otherwise the NPC could not send any athletes to the IFBB World Championships.
The IFBB has amateurs and professionals, two divisions within the same federation.
yikes.....
What is your point?
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.... Teachers, cops and allot of other jobs usually get fined, suspended or even fired for doing stuff the IFBB guys do....
bodybuilding does not qualify as a job
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The NPC is part of the IFBB, so it is the same federation.
Otherwise the NPC could not send any athletes to the IFBB World Championships.
The IFBB has amateurs and professionals, two divisions within the same federation.
Not quite sure whats so hard to understand...
The "pro league" is a division of the IFBB, as is the IFBB amateur, and other affiliates around the world...
The NPC is a totally seperate entity with different rules, different officers...they are affiliated as the NPC is the ONLY amateur org. in the U.S. that the IFBB recognizes.
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Are there any NPC athletes that have a weider contract or supplement contract?
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Are there any NPC athletes that have a weider contract or supplement contract?
Weider contracts? No.
Supp contracts...I assume there may be a few. As an amateur, I believe you can make a certain amount of money a year and retain your amateur status. Not 100% sure...
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My point is that amateurs AND professionals are part of the IFBB.
The NPC is part of the IFBB, not a seperate federation, just like the IFBB amateurs of Spain.
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My point is that amateurs AND professionals are part of the IFBB.
The NPC is part of the IFBB, not a seperate federation, just like the IFBB amateurs of Spain.
I cant explain it any more simple for you...you're wrong.
There is IFBB Pro and IFBB amateur (which encompasses Europe and everything but the U.S.)
The NPC is a totally seperate entity, it's only under the IFBB as an affiliate...
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Supp contracts...I assume there may be a few.
Stan McQuay comes to mind. He probably made more money from his endorsement contracts than did most pros.
As an amateur, I believe you can make a certain amount of money a year and retain your amateur status. Not 100% sure...
there is no legal definition in US law on what is an amateur.
and the NPC has no rules, or at least no enforceable rules, regarding what is an amateur. Again, Stan McQuay competed as a pro in Musclemania in 2000 and 2001, and also competed in the NPC at the same time.
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Not sure why, but I been thinking... Is there an existing "Code of Conduct" (for lack of a better name) for IFBB athletes? Seems to me it would be a solution to at least some of the issues that plague or reflect poorly on the "sport". Encouraging or requiring athletes and judges to behave in a manner that is in fact "Professional". I understand that everyone has a different idea of what constitutes morality/professionalism...some might even argue that bodybuilding in and off itself is the antithesis of the aforementioned terms. We could start with some broad generalities
- recreational drug use or abuse = suspension or fine
- drug trafficking = suspension
- Spouse abuse = fine
- Pornography of anykind = fine or suspension
- G4P = suspension or fine
- Etc.
Holding "athletes"/representatives accountable for their actions by directly impacting their ability to compete or make money in the sport seems like a relatively easy solution to problems that are driving bodybuilding into an early grave. I have only seen fines/suspensions imposed in recent years when it comes to contract violations or participating in a competitive federation's event in some capacity.
I dont know....call me crazy...just seems to make sense to me.
Thoughts?
JD
I've made the same argument and the same suggestions for fines and suspensions on here for along time over and over again..........Bob just makes excuses for the lack of enforcment, without coming rightout and saying it, all of the above you mentioned is ok, but if compete in another organization, you get suspended.........right Lee?
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Stan McQuay seems to be for the fitness industry what Brad Pitt is to the move industry. Despite there being thousands of other men equally as good looking, they both get all the press for some reason.
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What aren't you getting here?
Amateur rules are different than professional rules...
And no, they aren't the same federation...no different than a AAA baseball club being the same as a Major league team, even though they are a farmclub for that team...
get it now?
Bad analogy. A Triple A ball club is also professional. You can't play Triple A ball and then go to college and play there. The rules are the same for the farm clubs as for the Majors. And playing Triple A ball can easily make you allot of money.
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I cant explain it any more simple for you...you're wrong.
There is IFBB Pro and IFBB amateur (which encompasses Europe and everything but the U.S.)
The NPC is a totally seperate entity, it's only under the IFBB as an affiliate...
The old amateur IFBB division in Europe is now EFBB.
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The NPC might be fairly independent, but it represents the IFBB amateurs in the US.
While the IFBB president is also the president of the EFBB, the president of the NPC is also the president of the IFBB Pro League.
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Bad analogy. A Triple A ball club is also professional. You can't play Triple A ball and then go to college and play there. The rules are the same for the farm clubs as for the Majors. And playing Triple A ball can easily make you allot of money.
Not exactly, and not to nitpick , but I know of a handful of guys that played minor league baseball and then played college football. A former QB for Florida state did that I believe. I also know that the NPC/IFBB allowed figure/fitness girls to return to the NPC ranks to earn a pro card after winning $$ in the FAP organization
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Bad analogy. A Triple A ball club is also professional. You can't play Triple A ball and then go to college and play there. The rules are the same for the farm clubs as for the Majors. And playing Triple A ball can easily make you allot of money.
Sorry, Keith...
The IDEA was that they are owned by different people, one is a MINOR league and one is MAJOR league and one is used as a feeder (farm club) to the other...
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The NPC might be fairly independent, but it represents the IFBB amateurs in the US.
While the IFBB president is also the president of the EFBB, the president of the NPC is also the president of the IFBB Pro League.
Great.....WHAT IS YOUR POINT?
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I think Christinafitness better use the "google" search & get some clear facts before you start babbling nonsense
you're looking like an idiot
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Great.....WHAT IS YOUR POINT?
I think the point is that the IFBB Rule Book applies to both amateur and professional bodybuilding. The webpage states "Rules and Regulations governing the sport disciplines of Men's and Women's Bodybuilding, Men's and Women's Fitness, Women's Body Fitness and Men's Classic Bodybuilding". Since there is no pro classic bodybuilding, the rule book is meant to cover the amateur branch of the IFBB.
The IFBB claims to be a federation. A federation is "an organization or group within which smaller divisions have some degree of internal autonomy". The smaller divisions are the country organization. In the US, that is the NPC.
The NPC is the US branch of the IFBB, just as much as the CBBF is Canada's and UKBBF is Britain's. So if the IFBB's rule book applies to athletes, judges and officials in the IFBB affiliate in Bahrain, it applies to the people in the NPC.
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I am not sure which fact I got wrong.
There is the misconception in the US, that IFBB is "professional" only, which is not the case.
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there are so many athletes that do the Musclemania AND the NPC, but the IFBB never cares... but PDI, ....
Well...here is her first post on the subject.
She is asking why the IFBB doesn't care...MY point is that they wouldn't care, as it's a NPC matter.
The PDI is portrayed as a PROFESSIONAL organization, hence the IFBB will enforce it's rules which clearly state that you cannot compete for a rival federation.
The IFBB doesn't (and naver have) gotten involved in NPC matters, THEY ARE TWO DIFFERENT ORGANIZATIONS.
The NPC doesn't (and never have) gotten involved in IFBB matters, THEY ARE TWO DIFFERENT ORGANIZATIONS.
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I am not sure which fact I got wrong.
There is the misconception in the US, that IFBB is "professional" only, which is not the case.
You know why that is?
BECAUSE THERE IS NO IFBB AMATEUR IN THE U.S.
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Well...here is her first post on the subject.
She is asking why the IFBB doesn't care...MY point is that they wouldn't care, as it's a NPC matter.
The PDI is portrayed as a PROFESSIONAL organization, hence the IFBB will enforce it's rules which clearly state that you cannot compete for a rival federation.
The IFBB doesn't (and naver have) gotten involved in NPC matters, THEY ARE TWO DIFFERENT ORGANIZATIONS.
The NPC doesn't (and never have) gotten involved in IFBB matters, THEY ARE TWO DIFFERENT ORGANIZATIONS.
Amazing you defend the right to suspend someone because they went to a different orgnization but you choose not to enforce the other "rules"
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If the IFBB has no amateurs in the US, who goes to the IFBB World Championships?
And if the IFBB has no amateurs in the US, who goes the the "North Americans", which is an IFBB amateur contest.
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You know why that is?
BECAUSE THERE IS NO IFBB AMATEUR IN THE U.S.
then there is no IFBB amateur in Canada, there is the CBBF, and no IFBB amateur in the UK, there is the UKBBF. which means there is no amateur IFBB in any country, and the IFBB is only the organization that runs the international events.
But the website says "The IFBB is a democratic federation, currently comprised of 176 National Federations."
The NPC is the US national organization of the IFBB (although it is not a federation).
If a CBBF athlete is a member of the IFBB, then an NPC athlete is a member of the IFBB.
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If the IFBB has no amateurs in the US, who goes to the IFBB World Championships?
And if the IFBB has no amateurs in the US, who goes the the "North Americans", which is an IFBB amateur contest.
A team comprised of winners from the NPC Team Universe.
Members of the NPC. It's only "IFBB" in that it is comprised of Canada, mexico, and the U.S. Since the NPC's only jurisdiction is in the United States.
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Amazing you defend the right to suspend someone because they went to a different orgnization but you choose not to enforce the other "rules"
Amazing that *I* don't defend anything...*I* don't "enforce" rules...as it clrearly states...THE IFBB. I don't own the federation...
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Amazing that *I* don't defend anything...
you're always defending the way things are in the IFBB
I don't own the federation...
you're just their official spokesman, whether you meant to be or not
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you're always defending the way things are in the IFBB
you're just their official spokesman, whether you meant to be or not
I explain them...there is a difference. If I agreed with everything...I wouldn't make the changes I have, or tried to form a union a few years ago.
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Amazing that *I* don't defend anything...*I* don't "enforce" rules...as it clrearly states...THE IFBB. I don't own the federation...
You "defended" the IFBB as to their suspending Lee for going to a different organization, and yes, you do defend the rules!
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I explain them...there is a difference. If I agreed with everything...I wouldn't make the changes I have, or tried to form a union a few years ago.
It's funny....that no one realizes that.
I think it's because no one ever asks you Bob where you disagree on matters. They just automatically assume you support every endeavor with the IFBB...
& you know what happens when you automatically assume
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A team comprised of winners from the NPC Team Universe.
Members of the NPC. It's only "IFBB" in that it is comprised of Canada, mexico, and the U.S. Since the NPC's only jurisdiction is in the United States.
Do your search and find out how Ronnie Coleman won his por status.
Hint: it wasn't by winning any NPC national show!!! And he's american, for the best of my knowledge ;)!!
It's never too late to take your foot outta your mouth, Chicky boy!!
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Who is in charge of the NPC now?
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If the IFBB has no amateurs in the US, who goes to the IFBB World Championships?
And if the IFBB has no amateurs in the US, who goes the the "North Americans", which is an IFBB amateur contest.
YEAH BOB GO ASK JIM THAT WE WILL WAIT :)
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Who is in charge of the NPC now?
SAME GUY WHO RUNS THE IFBB.....THAT THEY ARE NOT CONNECTED :P
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I explain them...there is a difference. If I agreed with everything...I wouldn't make the changes I have, or tried to form a union a few years ago.
After your failed attempt at a union, it is quite obvious that you found out being an IFBB spokeperson is to your benefit
and hence your actions and words reflect that.
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The code is just that..a code, a eference, a guideline...there is a reason they are seperate from the rules.
Athletes are held accountable on a individual basis...case by case, and depending on the severity of the infraction, or number of occurances, they may be issed a verbal warning, a written warning, etc...
Chick, has every pro been given a written warning not to use drugs?
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Chick, has every pro been given a written warning not to use drugs?
I CAN ANSWER THAT NO.......WE NEVER HAVE BEEN.......
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SAME GUY WHO RUNS THE IFBB.....THAT THEY ARE NOT CONNECTED :P
Thats what I thought. How can Chic possibly say their is no connection between the NPC and IFBB. These people practice "conflict of interest" as a regular everyday thing.
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Not quite sure whats so hard to understand...
The "pro league" is a division of the IFBB, as is the IFBB amateur, and other affiliates around the world...
The NPC is a totally seperate entity with different rules, different officers...they are affiliated as the NPC is the ONLY amateur org. in the U.S. that the IFBB recognizes.
Who is Jim Manion and what is is title. Just wondering since they are two separate entities in the same industry, why isn't he suspended. Do you see a conflict here or not.
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Howdy, folks! You know who this is here. It's Vince Goodrum, CSN MFT! ....
Oops, wrong thread. Bob should do stand up comedy. He is a natural straight guy and certified stooge. The moral issues here sure make funny copy. Keep it up!
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Do your search and find out how Ronnie Coleman won his por status.
Hint: it wasn't by winning any NPC national show!!! And he's american, for the best of my knowledge ;)!!
It's never too late to take your foot outta your mouth, Chicky boy!!
Goddam you're an idiot....
Ronnie was chosen to represent the U.S. for the HW division at the World championships, he won his class, thus making him a pro.
No one said an American couldn't win the worlds...
putz.
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Thats what I thought. How can Chic possibly say their is no connection between the NPC and IFBB. These people practice "conflict of interest" as a regular everyday thing.
Do you even bother to read?
I never said there was "no connection" between the two...I said just the opposite actually.
I said they are two different businesses, they have an affiliation as the NPC is the U.S. Amateur "farm club" to the IFBB pro league.
Anything else you wish to be corrected on today?
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I said they are two different businesses, they have an affiliation as the NPC is the U.S. Amateur "farm club" to the IFBB pro league.
The IFBB pro league is just a subdivision of the IFBB. What is the relationship between the amateur IFBB and the amateur NPC? The later is a member of the former. Members of the NPC are also members of the amateur IFBB
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the title of this thread in itself is a funny thing.
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Chic why is Manion the President of the NPC and IFBB. Was there a vote by the members of the IFBB. Or did they use the excuse you use about not being able to get ahold of all of them (except of course when it is membership dues time). When Manion was appointed the President of the NPC the people who voted him in did NOT realize or was told it was a lifetime appointment. Like in most situations as this, elections are set up and then votes are casted by members. But in all these years NO election EVER. Way is that? Why isn't their an election? You know how we do it i SAG. They send out ballots and we vote for who we (the members) want. There has to be a reason. And you do realize that anyone (in the past at least) who wanted to run against Manion was immediately removed from their position in the NPC. Is this practice still used today. Just wondering.
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Chic why is Manion the President of the NPC and IFBB. Was there a vote by the members of the IFBB. Or did they use the excuse you use about not being able to get ahold of all of them (except of course when it is membership dues time). When Manion was appointed the President of the NPC the people who voted him in did NOT realize or was told it was a lifetime appointment. Like in most situations as this, elections are set up and then votes are casted by members. But in all these years NO election EVER. Way is that? Why isn't their an election? You know how we do it i SAG. They send out ballots and we vote for who we (the members) want. There has to be a reason. And you do realize that anyone (in the past at least) who wanted to run against Manion was immediately removed from their position in the NPC. Is this practice still used today. Just wondering.
Manion wa never appointed to president of the NPC....HE STARTED IT. It's HIS company, genius.
Are you that blinded by stupidity that you just make shit up all the time?
Why would Manion send out ballots to be elected (or not elected) to his own business? It's not a publicly traded company, there are no shares of stock or stockholders.
You sound dumber everyday.
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We underestimate Bob, he is the IFBB!!
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Vince, i cant believe you havent posted a pic of yourself in this thread. ;D
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Manion wa never appointed to president of the NPC....HE STARTED IT. It's HIS company, genius.
Are you that blinded by stupidity that you just make shit up all the time?
Why would Manion send out ballots to be elected (or not elected) to his own business? It's not a publicly traded company, there are no shares of stock or stockholders.
You sound dumber everyday.
Dude you obviously didn't call Manion on this one. Manion was elected, unanimously. QUIT trying to sound like you know everything. One of my best friends were flown to Atlanta to cast his vote for Jim. If it was Manions company the why was their a vote. Please answer this smart guy. The people involved wanted Manion as the president at the time cause the person who was going to be appointed could not do it cause of the conflict on interest and he really didn't want the job. I just tried to call my friend but he didn't answer the phone (time difference). But I will try to get the exact story. And does Manion OWN this company. Is he really listed as the owner. I am not sure of this, so need to know. It is a privately owned company or a corporation. Are there not officers i this company. Dude really you shouldn't try to answer questions you have no idea about till you talk to Manion. If his phone is busy or you can't get ahold of him for the answers then go to bed.
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Dude you obviously didn't call Manion on this one. Manion was elected, unanimously. QUIT trying to sound like you know everything. One of my best friends were flown to Atlanta to cast his vote for Jim. If it was Manions company the why was their a vote. Please answer this smart guy. The people involved wanted Manion as the president at the time cause the person who was going to be appointed could not do it cause of the conflict on interest and he really didn't want the job. I just tried to call my friend but he didn't answer the phone (time difference). But I will try to get the exact story. And does Manion OWN this company. Is he really listed as the owner. I am not sure of this, so need to know. It is a privately owned company or a corporation. Are there not officers i this company. Dude really you shouldn't try to answer questions you have no idea about till you talk to Manion. If his phone is busy or you can't get ahold of him for the answers then go to bed.
I remember going to one of the first meetings with Jim Rockell...this was back in 1981 or so, I was about 14. Manion was the head of the AAU at the time, he and a few others broke off and decided to run their own federation, thus the NPC was born...
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I remember going to one of the first meetings with Jim Rockell...this was back in 1981 or so, I was about 14. Manion was the head of the AAU at the time, he and a few others broke off and decided to run their own federation, thus the NPC was born...
YOU BEEN AROUND JIM AND ROCKELL SINCE THEN...MMMMMMMMMM...IT ALL FALLS INTO PLACE NOW......
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YOU BEEN AROUND JIM AND ROCKELL SINCE THEN...MMMMMMMMMM...IT ALL FALLS INTO PLACE NOW......
It's no secret Bob is Manion's puppet/mouthpiece/pet chimp.
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YOU BEEN AROUND JIM AND ROCKELL SINCE THEN...MMMMMMMMMM...IT ALL FALLS INTO PLACE NOW......
The only thing that has fallen into place is is you successfully painting yourself into a corner, and out of the sport.
Good job.
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Manion wa never appointed to president of the NPC....HE STARTED IT. It's HIS company, genius.
well, at least now we know it's not really a non profit sports federation.
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I remember going to one of the first meetings with Jim Rockell...this was back in 1981 or so, I was about 14. Manion was the head of the AAU at the time, he and a few others broke off and decided to run their own federation, thus the NPC was born...
Do you know who the Others were. This is a dumb arguement. All I really wanted to know was why no election
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The president of the IFBB is Rafael Santonja. He took over from Ben Weider last October.
Jim Manion is the president of the IFBB Professional league and the NPC (IFBB Amateurs in the US)
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The only thing that has fallen into place is is you successfully painting yourself into a corner, and out of the sport.
Good job.
NO I AM STILL HERE IN IT.....WERE YOU EVER IN IT.......I MEAN REALLY IN IT......YOU HAVE KNOWN THEM SINCE 14...YOU KNOW THAT CHILD MOLESTATION HAS NO STATUTE OF LIMITATIONS IF YOU WHISH TO SPEAK UP NOW....... :P ;D.......NOW I TRULY UNDERSTAND THE OLD SAYING...........
"TO GET AHAEAD.. YOU MUST GIVE IT "
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NO I AM STILL HERE IN IT.....WERE YOU EVER IN IT.......I MEAN REALLY IN IT......YOU HAVE KNOWN THEM SINCE 14...YOU KNOW THAT CHILD MOLESTATION HAS NO STATUTE OF LIMITATIONS IF YOU WHISH TO SPEAK UP NOW....... :P ;D.......NOW I TRULY UNDERSTAND THE OLD SAYING...........
"TO GET AHAEAD.. YOU MUST GIVE IT "
TELL IT LIKE IT IS !
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Manion wa never appointed to president of the NPC....HE STARTED IT. It's HIS company, genius.
Are you that blinded by stupidity that you just make shit up all the time?
Why would Manion send out ballots to be elected (or not elected) to his own business? It's not a publicly traded company, there are no shares of stock or stockholders.
You sound dumber everyday.
Just to get things straight, Manion DID NOT start the NPC. Is that why you love him so much. You think he started it. It was a group of guys who wanted a certain person to actually be the president but he couldn't and they decided to elect Manion. One of my closet friends was flown to Atlanta to cast a vote for Manion. I asked and called all three of the guys I know who were involved in the very first meeting and the election of Manion and ALL of them had no idea it was going this long (him acting as president). I ended up that Manion got a few loyal stooges to make sure that he stayed in so that they always had the control. If anyone challenged Manion they would find themselves out of the NPC. His accountant who we know, probably has made the NPC now Manions company. Have no idea, but if anyone could he can. So basically it might be his company now, which would explain allot of the shit he does. Does it sck CHic to be controlled by Manion, just a question. I would hate having someone like him having 100% control over what I did day in and day out.
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What is the official definition of a sports federation??
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I just noticed someone put IFBB, moral and ethical in the same sentence. Is that legal. If so it should'nt be. Shame on you.. That like putting Sean Ray in the same sentence with words like man, honest, integrity, honor, truthful and Christian. Unless of course you put no or non in front of the words
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That sneaky Sean Rey is trying to depict Only me as a bloke wrapped in bed sheets eating doughnuts all day! Any truth to that, Keith?
Watching Bob and Sean discuss morals is quite humourous. Bob, being the IFBB, knows all about following rules, however.
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That sneaky Sean Rey is trying to depict Only me as a bloke wrapped in bed sheets eating doughnuts all day! Any truth to that, Keith?
Watching Bob and Sean discuss morals is quite humourous. Bob, being the IFBB, knows all about following rules, however.
I don't eat donuts anymore. I like bananas and strawberries.
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I don't eat donuts anymore. I like bananas and strawberries.
We aren't talking about Keith weight any longer...it has no place here!
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Well, Keith was in hospital a few months ago so I hope he is mobile and better. Trust Sean to put crap on someone because of health issues. Keith doesn't need anyone to support him because he does just fine on his own. Sean needs all manner of characters to defend his sorry ass.
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Well, Keith was in hospital a few months ago so I hope he is mobile and better. Trust Sean to put crap on someone because of health issues. Keith doesn't need anyone to support him because he does just fine on his own. Sean needs all manner of characters to defend his sorry ass.
Why do you find it necessary to judge people? Shawn has been a good friend to me and my family for years, so we have a difference of opinion. Why hate?
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The president of the IFBB is Rafael Santonja. He took over from Ben Weider last October.
Jim Manion is the president of the IFBB Professional league and the NPC (IFBB Amateurs in the US)
There is no such thing as the "IFBB Amateurs".
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There is no such thing as the "IFBB Amateurs".
Forget it Jim...she doesnt get it.
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While we are talking about unethical behaviour have a look at the crap Sean posted about Milos. Talk about behaving in a way that brings disrepute to the IFBB. What Sean did was despicable. He is a certified rat because of what he did to others re the DEA. It is all on the record here and he had ample time to defend himself. Oh, he tried but failed miserably.
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While we are talking about unethical behaviour have a look at the crap Sean posted about Milos. Talk about behaving in a way that brings disrepute to the IFBB. What Sean did was despicable. He is a certified rat because of what he did to others re the DEA. It is all on the record here and he had ample time to defend himself. Oh, he tried but failed miserably.
You live across the pond, what proof other than the BS you get here do you have that he ratted anyone out? He's not listed on whoarat.com.
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You live across the pond, what proof other than the BS you get here do you have that he ratted anyone out? He's not listed on whoarat.com.
Other than Sean (you) admitting that he sat down with the DEA and served them iced tea and talked about Milos, other than that I guess we have no proof. ::)
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Noooooo..let him ramble on, Bubba....please, tell us all what went down with Shawn and the DEA, Vince....
Please, share some of your first hand knowledge..I'm begging you.
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I have no first hand knowledge of the Sean-Milos feud. Those two posted about happened and Milos detailed what he believed happened. I rather doubt Sean is innocent of all charges. He is a good talker, however, much like Bob and Texasboof. Those guys can bullshit all day long!
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I have no first hand knowledge of the Sean-Milos feud. Those two posted about happened and Milos detailed what he believed happened. I rather doubt Sean is innocent of all charges. He is a good talker, however, much like Bob and Texasboof. Those guys can bullshit all day long!
"I have no first hand knowledge " should be your middle name...yet, somehow, you're able to make detailed accounts of what goes on, who said what, who is right and who is wrong....face it, you form your opinions based on complete heresay on the internet.
Shawn has admitted to talking to the DEA...SO WHAT? If he had nothing to say, it makes no difference....they also talked to 13 other athletes and people in the industry. Milos has said from day one that he is innocent of all charges and has never delt steroids....I beleive him.
That being said, if he's done nothing wrong, then there is nothing Shawn could have said to implicate him.
As usual..STFU about things you dont have a clue about. You make yourself look like a damn fool.
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"I have no first hand knowledge " should be your middle name...yet, somehow, you're able to make detailed accounts of what goes on, who said what, who is right and who is wrong....face it, you form your opinions based on complete heresay on the internet.
Shawn has admitted to talking to the DEA...SO WHAT? If he had nothing to say, it makes no difference....they also talked to 13 other athletes and people in the industry. Milos has said from day one that he is innocent of all charges and has never delt steroids....I beleive him.
That being said, if he's done nothing wrong, then there is nothing Shawn could have said to implicate him.
As usual..STFU about things you dont have a clue about. You make yourself look like a damn fool.
you've heard of a lie before haven't you?
I know, it's illegal to lie to the authorities, but Sean isn't exactly Mr. Innocent himself, ya dig?
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That will be the day when Bob decides on what is moral and ethical behaviour on the net!
Sean is a rat. A certified one, too. Bob, is living proof of how oblivious stooges can be.
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you've heard of a lie before haven't you?
I know, it's illegal to lie to the authorities, but Sean isn't exactly Mr. Innocent himself, ya dig?
Exactly, he sure didn't come forward when the someone who gave him life was in trouble (and thats the worse). So yes Sean is capable of anything to save his own ass or make it look better.
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you've heard of a lie before haven't you?
I know, it's illegal to lie to the authorities, but Sean isn't exactly Mr. Innocent himself, ya dig?
Lie?? For what?
He never saw Milos dealing drugs.....has said so himself. Milos has said he's never dealed....Shawn was retired and certainly in no danger of being busted for anything...there was nothing to lie about.
What about the other 13 people that were questioned, including Titus?
Vince.....STFU.
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Bob, don't let me get under your skin. Stop posting in an ethics thread that you know absolutely zero about.
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Lie?? For what?
He never saw Milos dealing drugs.....has said so himself. Milos has said he's never dealed....Shawn was retired and certainly in no danger of being busted for anything...there was nothing to lie about.
What about the other 13 people that were questioned, including Titus?
Vince.....STFU.
ha Titus had his own issues then and now. Personal vendetta's can be dangerous and very self involving Bob.
Did you and Milos get a chance to talk at the show this weekend?
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ha Titus had his own issues then and now. Personal vendetta's can be dangerous and very self involving Bob.
Did you and Milos get a chance to talk at the show this weekend?
We did, actually.....nothing was accomplished.
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We did, actually.....nothing was accomplished.
haha, you refuse to listen did you? ;)
oh well, I guess,if it's change you want, you have to fight for it. >:(
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haha, you refuse to listen did you? ;)
oh well, I guess,if it's change you want, you have to fight for it. >:(
We listened to each other...we just have different philosophies on how to run the ship. Bottom line is, I'm the captain right now, and I'll run it the way I see fit...not the way Milos would like it run. If he wants my position, he can run for it...all the power to him.
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We listened to each other...we just have different philosophies on how to run the ship. Bottom line is, I'm the captain right now, and I'll run it the way I see fit...not the way Milos would like it run. If he wants my position, he can run for it...all the power to him.
cool, still the mutual respect for each others opinion?
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cool, still the mutual respect for each others opinion?
We have respect for one another...We both have the best interests of bodybuilding and the bodybuilders when it comes to improving the sport. There is no question we both have a passion for professional bb.
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We have respect for one another...We both have the best interests of bodybuilding and the bodybuilders when it comes to improving the sport. There is no question we both have a passion for professional bb.
never doubted your passion, Chick. 8)
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Chick is doing the best he can on the 4 cylinders he was born with. It is amusing that he describes himself as the captain when he is but a foot soldier. Guess all that 'power' has gone to his head. Milos has a philosophy and lives by it. Bob has .....well, IFBBitis.
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Chick is doing the best he can on the 4 cylinders he was born with. It is amusing that he describes himself as the captain when he is but a foot soldier. Guess all that 'power' has gone to his head. Milos has a philosophy and lives by it. Bob has .....well, IFBBitis.
and you have cellulitis...STFU goof.
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Nice try, Bob. You make a lot of noise but not many pay the slightest attention to you.
Do you honestly think anyone here needs to have the rules interpreted for them? Why on earth you think you are important re the IFBB is a mystery. You are the IFBB. Hook, line, and sinker!!
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Nice try, Bob. You make a lot of noise but not many pay the slightest attention to you.
Do you honestly think anyone here needs to have the rules interpreted for them? Why on earth you think you are important re the IFBB is a mystery. You are the IFBB. Hook, line, and sinker!!
I think ou got it backwards old man....no one pays atention to YOU. You talk like you know whats going on...you dont. You're stuck in 1972...You have no input, no inside track, no idea what goes on in the meetings, who makes what decisions...NOTHING.
I am involved in every aspect of pro bb, while you think you've invented the wheel when you make a leg extension machine recline 45 degrees...congratulation s...they've only been around for 25 years.
Way to go Edison...!
You continue to show your ignorance with every post...
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Bob, you are the limited guy here. You are debating with a philosopher and naturally you descend to personal attack because you are devoid of sensible arguments. My comments are descriptive and I hope are accurate about you.
So what if you are in with the IFBB? Big deal. You might get some sympathy from the beginners around here but you aren't fooling the older guys. You lost your integrity when you sold your soul to the IFBB. We understand. Your wife is pleased that you are making money and still manage to built stuff at home and babysit your daughter. You sound like a regular guy but are over your head on the internet.
Come to think of it, you remind me of that guy who stayed at my place with his wife, Bev. Good old "Don't Bother!" Steve.
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We see that the IFBB is getting guys from other federations and then threatening them that if they go to another federation they will be suspended. Adhering to the rules is one thing but with this kind of action more pros will make the switch and if it didn’t work they will apologies or get an influence to get back in the IFBB. So if that is the case why have the rule on not going to other federation in the fist place.
Just to name a few. These are some of the relevant case
Eryk Bui: another Musclemania to NPC and an IFBB pro now
Melvin Anthony: another Musclemania to NPC and an IFBB pro now
Dennis James: NABBA, NPC and now an IFBB pro.
Toney Freeman: AAU, NPC and now an IFBB pro.
Bob Cicherillo: AAU, NPC and now IFBB pro and Athletes rep.
Hasan Saqa: won the NABBA Mr. Universe then did the Asian Games – IFBB with influence of his local federation.
Flex Lewis: won the Mr Universe - NABBA, Junior then did the British Championships - IFBB, with influence of the EBBF
Sami Hadad: did the PDI NOC now will do the world Championship-IFBB (after apologizing from Paul Chua when he was in Dubai)
Lee Priest: can get back anytime if he stops doing the PDI shows and apologies
Stan McQuay: after doing the Musclemania for four years he went to the NPC and now he is a pro in the IFBB
Paul L.
http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?topic=150992.0
what about this ??
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Bob, you are the limited guy here. You are debating with a philosopher
Who doesn't know what he's talking about.
and naturally you descend to personal attack because you are devoid of sensible argments. My comments are descriptive and I hope are accurate about you.
"You hope" just about cuts it...your WRONG on just about everything you say. YOU are the one without sensible argument, as you get your info from 3rd party/ internet ramblings.....I'm the one in the meetings and making decisions.
So what if you are in with the IFBB? Big deal. You might get some sympathy from the beginners around here but you aren't fooling the older guys. You lost your integrity when you sold your soul to the IFBB.
Feel free to explain how I "sold my soul"....
We understand. Your wife is pleased that you are making money and still manage to built stuff at home and babysit your daughter. You sould like a regular guy but are over your head on the internet.
Come to think of it, you remind me of that guy who stayed at my place with his wife, Bev. Good old "Don't Bother!" Steve.
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http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?topic=150992.0
what about this ??
What about it?
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Get a clue, Bob. No one envies you for that IFBB connection and the meetings you attend. Even your mate Sean junked that position. He knew it was just a way to cop crap from everyone. Not you, though, because now they have the perfect believer and pompous stooge who delights in being connected. I can now add gullible to your obliviousness that is truly remarkable.
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And as usual, "Mr Philosophy"...I notice you cant address a single response I gave...speaks volumes. Following your own advice about having nothing worthwhile to say, and resorting to name calling, Vince..?
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Bob, have you been instructed to 'get rid of that nuisance Basile'? Seems so. I guess this is one thread you can't be seen to lose. You are making an ass out of yourself defending the IFBB. They are immoral. They don't follow their own rules. You should be ashamed of agreeing with what they do. Resign that appointment and become the regular guy you prefer to be. You really are a stooge. I bet you don't even know what it means to be one?
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Bob, have you been instructed to 'get rid of that nuisance Basile'? Seems so. I guess this is one thread you can't be seen to lose. You are making an ass out of yourself defending the IFBB. They are immoral. They don't follow their own rules. You should be ashamed of agreeing with what they do. Resign that appointment and become the regular guy you prefer to be. You really are a stooge. I bet you don't even know what it means to be one?
Still cant answer, huh?
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I picked two subjects that, unfortunately, everyone thinks they are expert in. Exercise and philosophy.
You see, Bob, what is the test of truth and sense here? Surely not you! Therefore, you do not win debates just because you have been annointed by those higher up in the IFBB.
Let Milos do the rep job. At least he is involved deeply in many aspects of the irongame. You seem to have retired from your masters glory. Sit back and commentate on everything in your media role. You will have more integrity when you speak your mind instead of being a puppet for your masters. A decent media guy should have an open mind and not be controlled. That is what a stooge does. The Three Stooges made the word 'stooge' be associated with the lack of intelligence. Naturally, you get easily offended and strike back. Just acknowledge you should move on and let an elected representative deal for those so called professional bodybuilders. I doubt you can even appreciate the damage the pro division has done to bodybuilding. Instead, you do your job and blame others. Nope, Bob, you are part of the problem and not the solution.
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I picked two subjects that, unfortunately, everyone thinks they are expert in. Exercise and philosophy.
You see, Bob, what is the test of truth and sense here? Surely not you! Therefore, you do not win debates just because you have been annointed by those higher up in the IFBB.
You're right...I win debates because I have FACTS to back me up...you have nothing except the internet and things you hear on it. Thats your source for info.
Let Milos do the rep job. At least he is involved deeply in many aspects of the irongame. You seem to have retired from your masters glory. Sit back and commentate on everything in your media role. You will have more integrity when you speak your mind instead of being a puppet for your masters. A decent media guy should have an open mind and not be controlled. That is what a stooge does. The Three Stooges made the word 'stooge' be associated with the lack of intelligence. Naturally, you get easily offended and strike back.
The only stooge here is you....a old fossil that thinks he's "in the know", and talks as if he's in the loop. No stooge like an old stooge, huh Vince.
Just acknowledge you should move on and let an elected representative deal for those so called professional bodybuilders. I doubt you can even appreciate the damage the pro division has done to bodybuilding. Instead, you do your job and blame others. Nope, Bob, you are part of the problem and not the solution.
I'm the problem? I'm the only one getting things done. My efforts have gotten the athletes more money, more opportunity and rules changed in OUR favor....just what are YOUR contributions? You're a has-been that never was "Mr. Canada". our opinion counts for ZERO. You think Milos is the answer? Did ou happen to notice all the pro's that posted their disapproval of m efforts after Milos got his posing trunks in a bunch...? One...Melvin...who after learning the truth, rescinded his comments and his position....now were back to ZERO.
One would think a "great philosopher" like yourself could put two and two together..obviously not.
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I swear, Bob, you are so far up the proverbial ass of the IFBB that you literally can't see anything clearly. You have been there so long you don't even notice the stench! That is true obliviousness.
When is it going to sink in that you are the last guy the pros are going to bitch to? They know you run to Manion, etc., so no one tells you anything negative. From your deep and comfortable position there you think you are in the know but are such a stooge and puppet that you just can't or won't see it. You are popular on the boards but if what Lee says is true then most of the lads tell you bugger all. So you look around and figure everything is fine in your department.
There should be a gullibility test for that position. No stooges allowed.
Come to think of it why do they have only one pro rep? Why not another for the black athletes? Why not another for the Asian bodybuilders? Why not another for the European guys? There is a lot that can be done to improve things. You either don't care or it is outside your expertise. Accept your plaque and let someone else get elected to your position. While you hold that appointed position you are a travesty to democracy.
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and you have cellulitis...STFU goof.
atleast chick has humor LOL
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There is no such thing as the "IFBB Amateurs".
Nobody in the US understands the fact that there are IFBB AMATEURS.
They are in part represented by the countries affiliated to the IFBB
Check the IFBB website, check the list of NATIONAL FEDERATIONS and UPCOMING EVENTS
http://www.ifbb.com/ (http://www.ifbb.com/)
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I swear, Bob, you are so far up the proverbial ass of the IFBB that you literally can't see anything clearly. You have been there so long you don't even notice the stench! That is true obliviousness.
When is it going to sink in that you are the last guy the pros are going to bitch to? They know you run to Manion, etc., so no one tells you anything negative. From your deep and comfortable position there you think you are in the know but are such a stooge and puppet that you just can't or won't see it. You are popular on the boards but if what Lee says is true then most of the lads tell you bugger all. So you look around and figure everything is fine in your department.
There is your first clue.....
There should be a gullibility test for that position. No stooges allowed.
Come to think of it why do they have only one pro rep? Why not another for the black athletes? Why not another for the Asian bodybuilders? Why not another for the European guys?
!!
There is a lot that can be done to improve things. You either don't care or it is outside your expertise. Accept your plaque and let someone else get elected to your position. While you hold that appointed position you are a travesty to democracy.
Sure...what a great idea!! Here's a better one, how about everyone just represents themselves like it's always been....and NOTHING GETS ACCOMPLISHED! BRILLIANT!!
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We listened to each other...we just have different philosophies on how to run the ship. Bottom line is, I'm the captain right now, and I'll run it the way I see fit...not the way Milos would like it run. If he wants my position, he can run for it...all the power to him.
the bottom line is make sure to not cross good old Jim, and you get you keep your "appointed" post. (which you claim to have invented)
by the way does the IFBB even claim to conduct an election for your position? Considering their unitque ability to make up the rules
as they go, I doubt it.
You make the IFBB proud with your presence on these boards, which allows for good entertainment.
Good job.
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Bottom line is there are no "ethical and moral" codes of conduct in the IFBB, it's only unethical when someone goes to another organization and it costs the IFBB money!
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the bottom line is make sure to not cross good old Jim, and you get you keep your "appointed" post.
Bob's been around these guys since he was like 12 or something.... he's their trained chimp.
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Bob's been around these guys since he was like 12 or something.... he's their trained chimp.
stop insulting trained chimps..sometimes bobo fights back. I don't ever forsee Chick ever saying anything but "yes sir"
that fucker ran back stage and harrassed Silvio because Shawn told him to. What a fucking douche bag
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If you want to see how the IFBB worked then get a copy of Pumping Iron II, The Women. Bev Francis from Australia enterred and came in looking incredibly muscular and bigger than the others. Ben made sure Bev didn't win. Not good for the sport, you understand. Bev placed a disappointing 8th and that placing is now an honour for recalcitrant people and others the IFBB doesn't know what to do with. After the results Steve W was shaking his head wondering what happened. Bev never did win the Ms Olympia. Not good for the sport, you understand. In some ways I regret encouraging Bev to do bodybuilding. She was into athletics and then powerlifting and always considered bodybuilding a mirror sport. Who would have predicted she would one day own a bodybuilding gym and live in New York?
Where were the ethics re Bev Francis? The IFBB does what it likes and could care less about the athletes. If they were fair dinkum they would have done rigorous drug testing long ago. They did not test all the time because it wasn't good for business.
To come here and read Chick pathetically defending the IFBB really is sad. The whole professional scene has helped taint the sport. The IFBB is afraid of rival organizations getting the biggest competitors if they do drug testing. There is this puppet and self-important, pompous stooge trying to do things for the professional bodybuilders. What a vision!
At least the IFBB can predict what the supposedly apathetic bodybuidlers would do. The IFBB engineered the decadence that is now bodybuilding. They have no clue at all about how to fix things. Get rid of professional groups and get rid of the drugs. Then start again from the ground up with new criterion and procedures.