Getbig.com: American Bodybuilding, Fitness and Figure
Getbig Main Boards => Gossip & Opinions => Topic started by: Stavios on July 18, 2007, 08:46:44 PM
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smart move 8)
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horrible move 8)
I agree Stavios
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smart move 8)
hidetada looks like a cartoon compared to JOJ in this comparison
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hidetada looks like a cartoon compared to JOJ in this comparison
no he just look wider because of the way he twist his body
JOJ's muscle shape is sick. shame his quads and hams don't have that roundness.
Still, imagine him with Silvio-like conditionning and fullness :o
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there's a zillion pics here: www.koloseum.com
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there's a zillion pics here: www.koloseum.com
Nice pics Garraeth...but eventually I got tired of looking at 17 different pics of the same 2-inches of movement. I did make it all the way to 158 though, which had 0 views before I got there, so I guess I outlasted everyone else in my schmoe-ness.
You're looking pretty big in some pics. How much can we paypal you to see you standing shirtless next to Johnnie O?
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Nice pics Garraeth...but eventually I got tired of looking at 17 different pics of the same 2-inches of movement. I did make it all the way to 158 though, which had 0 views before I got there, so I guess I outlasted everyone else in my schmoe-ness.
You're looking pretty big in some pics. How much can we paypal you to see you standing shirtless next to Johnnie O?
a Richard Simmons autograph I'm sure
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great pictures and thank you.
and hidetada does looks like a cartoon posing next to JOJ.
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Nice pics Garraeth...but eventually I got tired of looking at 17 different pics of the same 2-inches of movement. I did make it all the way to 158 though, which had 0 views before I got there, so I guess I outlasted everyone else in my schmoe-ness.
You're looking pretty big in some pics. How much can we paypal you to see you standing shirtless next to Johnnie O?
heh, yeah...Milos snaps pics really fast...and likes getting all positions of a movement -- all the way at top to all the way at bottom and all in between.
paypal: sales@mall23.com
I'll take $100. ;D
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heh, yeah...Milos snaps pics really fast...and likes getting all positions of a movement -- all the way at top to all the way at bottom and all in between.
paypal: sales@mall23.com
I'll take $100. ;D
$100 to stand shirtless next to Johnny J, easy money Garraeth. But you have to post the pics here for all to see. might as well stand between Johnny and Hide and make it interesting :D
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$100 to stand shirtless next to Johnny J, easy money Garraeth. But you have to post the pics here for all to see. might as well stand between Johnny and Hide and make it interesting :D
np...I'm cheap
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heh, yeah...Milos snaps pics really fast...and likes getting all positions of a movement -- all the way at top to all the way at bottom and all in between.
paypal: sales@mall23.com
I'll take $100. ;D
You're a cheap date. I'm gonna hold you to that number and raise the fundage to get that pic up here on Getbig. Have Milos take one next time you and JOJ are together and we'll trust you to post it once the money is in. Just to make it easy, I'll put up the second $50!
Getbiggers, get your Paypal on! The most humbling/humiliating physique moment of my adult life was standing shirtless next to Levrone in the mirror on the eve of the 2000 Olympia. But hey, at least it was a private moment. I'd gladly pay for Garraeth's public errr, humbling.
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You're a cheap date. I'm gonna hold you to that number and raise the fundage to get that pic up here on Getbig. Have Milos take one next time you and JOJ are together and we'll trust you to post it once the money is in. Just to make it easy, I'll put up the second $50!
Getbiggers, get your Paypal on! The most humbling/humiliating physique moment of my adult life was standing shirtless next to Levrone in the mirror on the eve of the 2000 Olympia. But hey, at least it was a private moment. I'd gladly pay for Garraeth's public errr, humbling.
why were you shirtless with Levrone in a "private moment" :-X
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You're a cheap date. I'm gonna hold you to that number and raise the fundage to get that pic up here on Getbig. Have Milos take one next time you and JOJ are together and we'll trust you to post it once the money is in. Just to make it easy, I'll put up the second $50!
Getbiggers, get your Paypal on! The most humbling/humiliating physique moment of my adult life was standing shirtless next to Levrone in the mirror on the eve of the 2000 Olympia. But hey, at least it was a private moment. I'd gladly pay for Garraeth's public errr, humbling.
hehe, kewl...I'll even pose with a grapefruit again if you like (pants ON, of course!). ;D
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why were you shirtless with Levrone in a "private moment" :-X
That was what you got for $1500 in the old Olympia VIP "Package". Things have really gone downhill since Wayne left!
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That was what you got for $1500 in the old Olympia VIP "Package". Things have really gone downhill since Wayne left!
:o $1500 to spend some "private time" with Levrone shirtless??
You really are a schmoe ;D
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:o $1500 to spend some "private time" with Levrone shirtless??
You really are a schmoe ;D
Perhaps, but at least Levrone showed up in the hotel room, not like that Bethany dude!
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Perhaps, but at least Levrone showed up in the hotel room, not like that Bethany dude!
:-X
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HAHAHHAHHAA
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Interesting.
Milos looks better than joj
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Some cool pics:
(http://www.koloseum.com/gallery/Galleries//1/43/IMG_4209.JPG)
(http://www.koloseum.com/gallery/Galleries//1/43/IMG_4241.JPG)
Me being tiny:
(http://www.koloseum.com/gallery/Galleries//1/43/IMG_4246.JPG)
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Mean Most Muscular by JJ! Give us some inside scoop G...what's it like training with these guys? Do you all joke around or is it all business?
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THIS DUDE HAS ARMS FROM HELL.
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Your calves look bigger than his.
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Let's see how long will the friendship last
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JoJ has tapped out...The only thing Milos is going to do to him is make his waist grow...Thats it...He trains hard and fcking heavy...Tiny weights are not going to help him...And nothing is going to help his calves....
Remember Milo's...You don't agree with synthol for it almost killed you...Ha ha ha..
Have you guys ever wonder how Valentino can pump gallons of synthol in his body and even shove nail sized pins in his arms to drain them but Milo's uses synthol fcking once and almost dies...Haha give me a break...And some of you believe what he has to say about pro cycles...
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johnny has def brought his arms up over the yrs...
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So did Milos get rid of his gyno?
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Wow... JOJ will do those giant sets and never lift heavy with his famous slappy form again?
Thats funny to see.
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Nice pics Garraeth...but eventually I got tired of looking at 17 different pics of the same 2-inches of movement. I did make it all the way to 158 though, which had 0 views before I got there, so I guess I outlasted everyone else in my schmoe-ness.
You're looking pretty big in some pics. How much can we paypal you to see you standing shirtless next to Johnnie O?
hahaha i wonder who the clown is who takes all those thousands of pictures
koloseum must have a 24 hour photographer or video cameras all over the ceiling
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milos seems to have the scoop on drug advice and if you've been around as long as him, you would too.
so on that front i reckon joj might improve. he really needs to do SOMETHING with those calves too.
however, if joj does actually embrace milos' training theories and train with him permanently i'm betting he'll start losing his trademark thickness and density.
won't happen overnight (he didn't get that way over night) but it will happen given time.
note the difference in density and detail on a milos trained athlete (hide) to someone with years of heavy training under his belt (joj).
most of the training pics ie bloated arms, etc is because of the super pumps you get from giant sets (especially if you take gear or have a lot of water retention).
however, when it comes time for getting up on stage next to a heavy trainer like, say, ronnie coleman, the milos trained athletes will hit the dust on detail, thickness and density.
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its not drugs... its the pre and post workout drinks!
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I like JOJ and would love it if Milos was able to guide JOJ on how to improve his lower body. You never know what those magic shakes are capable of.
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its not drugs... its the pre and post workout drinks!
ah yes.that's it..the secret elixir of the pros..Milos pre and post work out shakes..look at how much it has worked for garreth ::)
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what show is jackson doing next?
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what show is jackson doing next?
Mr Gut.
He has won Mr Tits for so many years, time for sth new.
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what show is jackson doing next?
condidering that he is now working with Milos I expect some kind of IFBB contriversy that will prevent him from entering any sanctioned shows for the forseeable future
so with that said I expect to be in the grapefruit grand prix with Kai
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3-4 months then its over.
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Sorry but I just got here and found out Johnny already left...so no pic w/ me and him... :'(
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another insulined up gut monster comming up :-\
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Sorry but I just got here and found out Johnny already left...so no pic w/ me and him... :'(
I was waiting all day too :'(
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hidetada looks like a cartoon compared to JOJ in this comparison
are you kidding? JOJ is light years ahead, just look at the bigger arms, delts, chest and traps + better shape on JOJ.
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are you kidding? JOJ is light years ahead, just look at the bigger arms, delts, chest and traps + better shape on JOJ.
no, i'm serious...hidetada looks awful compared to JOJ....a cartoon isn't a good thing in this instance.
hope this helps.
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i had a lengthy debate with milos on his 'sprint a marathon' theory ::).
of course milos ended up quitting on me then too with his usual, "well, come to my gym and..."
milos was actually trying to convince me that you can go flat out for an extended period. i couldn't believe a highly paid trainer could be that stupid.
so here is milos' opportunity to prove me wrong.
joj has the power and strength to deadlift 800lbs+ apparently. load up an 800lb bar and have this movement as part of multiple giant sets in a typical milos giant set back workout, only have that deadlift as the last exercise done in that compound.
according to milos' theory, joj should be able to do it no problem. indeed, it is only a matter of desire.
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i had a lengthy debate with milos on his 'sprint a marathon' theory ::).
of course milos ended up quitting on me then too with his usual, "well, come to my gym and..."
milos was actually trying to convince me that you can go flat out for an extended period. i couldn't believe a highly paid trainer could be that stupid.
so here is milos' opportunity to prove me wrong.
joj has the power and strength to deadlift 800lbs+ apparently. load up an 800lb bar and have this movement as part of multiple giant sets in a typical milos giant set back workout, only have that deadlift as the last exercise done in that compound.
according to milos' theory, joj should be able to do it no problem. indeed, it is only a matter of desire.
are you as dumb as you sound?
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The next question is will Robin dock Johnnie's two months pay?
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milos was actually trying to convince me that you can go flat out for an extended period. i couldn't believe a highly paid trainer could be that stupid.
TO MILOS (no disrespect u are a great bodybuilder with a legendary physique which i look up to):
intensity and endurance are two different things, maybe milos should read mike mentzer's literature (namely 'high intensity training the mike mentzer way') to learn about the true meaning of intensity.
to break it down easier for milos:
a sprinter runs his race for 10 seconds in 100 meters.
u then get him to run it again after two minutes. (it will be a slower time)
then u get him to run it a third time (this time it is even slower than the first two)
Did running the 2nd and 3rd time feel hard to the runner? yes! was the intensity the same? no, could the muscles generate the same force and power as the first race? no!
with weights u want to attain the highest possible performance and most intense lifts and contractions, with each subsequent set ur bodies ability to generate this intensity diminishes. its human nature. u can't run 100 meter sprints for 10 seconds flat ten times in a day.
remember u want to reach a level where u get an adaptive response an overload of the muscles beyond that of last time.
If u want to turn bodybuilding into an endurance event to see 'how long' u can lift weights at ur best lifting capacity (a low intensity endeavour) that is fine.
If u want bodybuilding to be a high-intensity event that generates the most intensity which requires the least amount of exercise, or should i say the exact amount! and no more, then do otherwise.
maybe ask your friend dorian yates....u know that guy, i think he won a few olympias.
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Does this mean he gets a discount when it comes to Milos' shakes?
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Dean - few weeks ago (Dean - remember the date?) - CONSIDERABLY IMPROVED since we started...(can't find starting pics at the moment...Dean - do you have it?)
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Dean - today 07/19/07
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;)
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;D
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8)
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Will Milos let JOJ do G4P to support his Milos shake habit?
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Milos, why did you post a ton of pictures of this dude?
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Wow im stoked that Joj is with milos. I bet he is gonna look sick when hes on the new program
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And...by the way - I must say that after reading all these brilliant comments and ideas (available only here on getbig) ...what high intensity is all about, what muscle can or cannot do...generating power...highest possible performance and most intense lifts and contractions...adaptive response to overload....and other "loads of - you know what" coming to the gyms near you this summer from who else but "getbiger's- we know everything and it shows!"...I am only going to show you few pics here and there of some of "my guys" on worthless supplements training with brutal dumbbells - somehow transforming faster than anyone else (well, minus "TRANSFORMERS"...)
Well, as we have already established that my workouts are for babies...supplements for dogs...and my "cycle - recommendations" not believable (thus laughable)...can someone guess how and why guys improve so much?
And speaking of Johnnie...I have only one thing to say: PAY ATTENTION (We have only 8 weeks to do "something"...but that is 56 days - each and every with long 24 hours...For "believers" that is MORE THAN ENOUGH TIME... ;D)
Well, here is another photo of Dean...who switched from "strongman" type of training to "pink-dummbbells"...
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nice biceps garreath!
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Milos, why did you post a ton of pictures of this dude?
I am proud of my new training partner... ;)
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And...by the way - I must say that after reading all these brilliant comments and ideas
I understand u have one of the best physiques ever so hearing someone from a forum say this sounds stupid, but in seriousness wat is ur opinion on mike mentzer's definition and theory of intensity, it directly conflicts with your theory and also have you read it? (please reply, i am not trying to be an asshole)
Well, as we have already established that my workouts are for babies...
you're training would be brutal in fact nauseating, however like mike mentzer said the definition of 'INTENSITY' is not endurance, and with each subsequent set, etc its natural and logical that the body cannot maintain the 'same level' and ability for 'duration'. duration/high volume/endurance and maximum intensity are in direct conflict with each other. its a paradox. both cannot logically co-exist in a workout.
supplements for dogs..
ur supplements are fine, however i believe they are very expensive (just my opinion). Plus i do enjoy the humour of joking about the line and remember imitation is the highest form of flattery so i am still a fan.
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I'm speechless...
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I'm speechless...
I await the reply of Milos.
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and you should be, i was lucky enough to meet garreath at last years olympia, and he looks about 100x better!
good job mishko!
I am proud of my new training partner... ;)
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the thickness of a small-average dose self hormonizer= my friend gareth,,good thickness but it looks like pieces of diff person all come together thats why no chance on stage,,but good thickness! its just that the symetry and proportion is out of wack and in the npc all is about symetry and proportion inorder to win a pro card or a freak or the combo of both,,but good thickness! ;)
and that bring me to johnny boy ,,the thickness of a heavy self hormonizer,,all out receptor-bodybuilder love affair,, = jackson and thats why he has a pro card
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garraeth, are you still clean? I remember you said you didn't juice anymore.
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Garraeth your tris needs "a lot" of work.
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garraeth has alot of size! but in those pictures the muscle looks a little 'weird' maybe he's holding water or something. i really cannot tell wat it is.
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this is not a clean bodybuilder,,its on,,and yes im taking to consideration everything from lights to post session pump to bananas and waxy mazes
this is what aas does to you,,it thickens you the right way,,you dont get there with out hormones,,rest is up for your genetic repond and god given symetry and balance,,muscle shape and proportions,,that is what makes or break a competetive bodybuilder,,his symetry,,proportion,,and balance ,,,there are 140lb winning pro cards because they have it,,some do some dont,,you are born with it
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I think the Mentzer-Jones intensity theory is not true. That theory has been around for decades now and if it were true then we all would know it. The truth is most bodybuilders use more volume. If this is true then intensity is only one factor in hypertrophy. What I have found is hypertrophy requires lots of sets with a maximum resistance. Milos has volume plus intensity plus speed. There are precedents for speed re Sergio and Larry Scott. In a nutshell. Lots of sets in short period of time with as much weight as you can lift = bigger muscles. Exactly how many sets, how much resistance and how fast have not been determined. Milos seems to have figured one method out and his lads seem to get results.
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Yes, he's not clean in those pics, just curious to see if he would claim it. Holding a lot of water in body and face.
He has good thickness. The MCT oil in his biceps doesn't look too good though.
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I think the Mentzer-Jones intensity theory is not true. That theory has been around for decades now and if it were true then we all would know it. The truth is most bodybuilders use more volume. If this is true then intensity is only one factor in hypertrophy. What I have found is hypertrophy requires lots of sets with a maximum resistance. Milos has volume plus intensity plus speed. There are precedents for speed re Sergio and Larry Scott. In a nutshell. Lots of sets in short period of time with as much weight as you can lift = bigger muscles. Exactly how many sets, how much resistance and how fast have not been determined. Milos seems to have figured one method out and his lads seem to get results.
I thought DOMS was the most important factor in hypertrophy, according to your previous rambling. Man, you are confused. You have zero understanding on what causes hypertrophy.
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Yes, he's not clean in those pics, just curious to see if he would claim it. Holding a lot of water in body and face.
He has good thickness. The MCT oil in his biceps doesn't look too good though.
I thought garraeth stop using synthol. Did Milos give something more than shakes to him?
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I thought garraeth stop using synthol. Did Milos give something more than shakes to him?
That would explain his titties.
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the thickness of a small-average dose self hormonizer= my friend gareth,,good thickness but it looks like pieces of diff person all come together thats why no chance on stage,,but good thickness! its just that the symetry and proportion is out of wack and in the npc all is about symetry and proportion inorder to win a pro card or a freak or the combo of both,,but good thickness! ;)
and that bring me to johnny boy ,,the thickness of a heavy self hormonizer,,all out receptor-bodybuilder love affair,, = jackson and thats why he has a pro card
examples
freak = tropopin/justin from this board,,will have hard time to get a pro card but eventually with enough size will,,maybe even sooner than later
symetry and proportion = lee labrada,,shawn ray,,frank zane,,milos sacrev,,thats the best physiqe you can hope for but not everyone is that lucky,,good for npc not so good for ifbb now days,,ifbb want the next version
combo of both = ron colman,,lee priest,,jason cutler,,myself
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I think the Mentzer-Jones intensity theory is not true. That theory has been around for decades now and if it were true then we all would know it.
this is a very illogical statement. 'everybody' (the majority of population) seems to know (thinks) that buying abdominal equipment and doing sit ups reduces your waistline (eg- spot reducing). 'most' people (not people knowledgable in fitness) believe this. yet it is not true. also most bodybuilders get BAD results or stay at the same level not growing (having reached their critical point of overtraining). most people who begin to bodybuild, train as advised in arnold or weider's approach 4 or 5 days per week, get bad results for so many hours put in, and give up.
There are precedents for speed re Sergio and Larry Scott. In a nutshell. Lots of sets in short period of time with as much weight as you can lift = bigger muscles.
speed creates momentum, which takes the load off the muscle (eg-makes it easier for the muscle, takes load off muscle, less isolation). explosive movements are good for fast twitch fiber recruitment however they are destructive on the joints.
Exactly how many sets, how much resistance and how fast have not been determined.
then this is a mish mash of ideas. it is not specific. it is not scientific. mentzer had a complete exercise science that was specific, it was a thesis written in academic form and was specific! EXACT!
not a mish mash of ideas such as weiders 'principles' (more is better) or arthur jones (less is better) but rather mike mentzer 'the exact amount is best'.
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Ah, debating hypertrophy when the basic concepts are not defined clearly and precisely.
By speed I meant between sets. Fast is having very little rest. Slow is having up to 3 minutes between sets. Sergio and Larry diminished the rest between sets. Sergio improved to where he was lifting heavy weights for all sets in a row. Few trainers recommend fast training but some suggest fast reps might trigger different fibers. Repetition speed doesn't seem to be critical for hypertrophy.
100% intensity is many things. To Jones it was lifting 100% of what you are capable of lifting for 1 rep. Clearly this is not bodybuilding but a strength concept. There seems to be a threshold above which hypertrophy occurs. What advanced bodybuilders need to find out is how to sustain growth. If the growth can be sustained at a rapid rate then that is the ultimate method as long as it is safe. What this means is that as long as you train at something over 75 or 80 percent of your 1 rep capacity you should trigger hypertrophy. There doesn't seem to be any advantage to train closer to 100% intensity. When you select a resistance that you can do for 15 reps your intensity will be around the 75% level and that is just fine. The extra reps will generate more pump and this helps to avoid injuries and poor form.
I think we know that training with maximum intensity, a la Jones, Mentzer and Darden is unlikely to generate maximum growth unless combined with sufficient volume as demonstrated with Oliva. The idea that brief sprinting training leads to larger and larger muscles is false. I haven't seen one person achieve maximum size with brief training. Not one. Conclusion? Something is missing. Therefore, HIT is false and insufficient to cause maximum hypertrophy.
Milos can present his own theories. He doesn't seem to care to debate everyone here and that is his choice. He is showing us with images.
DOMS is a feedback phenomenon that can help one know when he is growing rapidly. Not all DOMS indicates rapid growth but rapid growth will probably generate DOMS. The trick is to get sore using heavy weights and lots of maximum sets with the right exercises. Whether you need to do the sets with little rest between them is not established. I doubt time between sets is critical. If you can sustain using the same heavy resistance you will need longer rests between sets and the two methods might overlap re effectiveness. Resting more might take a bit longer and not be so hard on the total systems of the body. In other words, lazy guys don't have to kill themselves and can still grow rapidly. There has to be some equivalent methods that end up doing the same thing.
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By speed I meant between sets. Fast is having very little rest.
I think we know that training with maximum intensity, a la Jones, Mentzer and Darden is unlikely to generate maximum growth unless combined with sufficient volume as demonstrated with Oliva.
VINCE IN REGARDS TO SPEED - mentzer says the quicker the workout is over the better, the less time spent between sets the better.
in regards to volume - do u think something like dorian yate's approach bridges the gap? doing only one set of exercise for only several exercises in a workout is the best?
and thirdly - ur view on rest between workout?
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Milos can present his own theories. He doesn't seem to care to debate everyone here and that is his choice.
milos, should reply and give us his opinion regarding mentzer.
YOU ARE 'THE MIND'....LET THE MIND SPEAK MILOS!
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I believe Mike was wrong about exercise briefness. The fowl in the experiment had weights on one wing and the resistance was increased every so often to see what happened. Antonio got the best result with some birds growing one muscle 300% in one month. Imagine is even a third of that result was possible in humans? Bryan on HST believes 8 hours training a day might generate maximum hypertrophy in humans. 4 hours might generate over 50% of what is possible.
Mike was convinced his theory was correct. There was supposed to be only one true theory and he felt he and Jones had figured it out. They were both mistaken. Brief training and rapid training with short rests is not optimum training as far as I can tell. That is why Milos requires his students to do lots of sets. The requirement for hypertrophy is a physical requirement and not something one speculates about. Experience can help us find the specific requirement for us. Whether that is the same for everyone is unknown. However, most people have similar systems so there should be more similarity than differences.
I found the trick is to have maximum resistance sets done over and over and over and over. Up to 10 or more maximum sets. If you do 15 reps you will go down to about 10 reps after 5 sets if you are supersetting arms or another exercise. Eg., triceps extensions with lat pulldowns. If you reduce the resistance you can reduce the time between sets. I recommend keeping the resistance constant and increasing the time between sets instead. Lots of maximum sets will cause growth and you will experience DOMS for several days. You train that muscle before the soreness goes away. That is when to train again. In practice this will be every 3rd or 4th day. It may be possible to train more frequently but it is unknown if you will grow faster.
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interesting vince. ;)
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What happens with most guys who bodybuild is that they don't know if they are growing or not. They just assume if they keep lifting they will get bigger. Well, most get fair results and then stop growing. The science tells us the body tries to conserve resources so will not hypertrophy unless it absolutely has to. Doing the same thing over and over will not generate hypertrophy if you rest too long between training days. What seems to happen is the muscle has a RBE or repeated bout effect. Therefore it is imperative that you avoid full adaptation and try to keep the muscle in a state of growth. In other words, keep the muscle sore. Train the target muscle for about a month and see what happens. Don't worry about training every muscle. You might be surprised at how the other muscles keep their size when you are doing hypertrophy training. I doubt you can make all the muscles grow at the same time. So select say arms and thighs and see what happens. If you want to just train arms to see how you go that is fine, too. Once you know how to make muscles grow rapidly your training will never be the same.
Some exercises do not cause further growth. Eg., triceps pressdowns. You need to keep the muscle sore. If what you are doing is not causing soreness you have to do something else. What should be a simple process can soon be very complex.
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Ah, debating hypertrophy when the basic concepts are not defined clearly and precisely.
By speed I meant between sets. Fast is having very little rest. Slow is having up to 3 minutes between sets. Sergio and Larry diminished the rest between sets. Sergio improved to where he was lifting heavy weights for all sets in a row. Few trainers recommend fast training but some suggest fast reps might trigger different fibers. Repetition speed doesn't seem to be critical for hypertrophy.
100% intensity is many things. To Jones it was lifting 100% of what you are capable of lifting for 1 rep. Clearly this is not bodybuilding but a strength concept. There seems to be a threshold above which hypertrophy occurs. What advanced bodybuilders need to find out is how to sustain growth. If the growth can be sustained at a rapid rate then that is the ultimate method as long as it is safe. What this means is that as long as you train at something over 75 or 80 percent of your 1 rep capacity you should trigger hypertrophy. There doesn't seem to be any advantage to train closer to 100% intensity. When you select a resistance that you can do for 15 reps your intensity will be around the 75% level and that is just fine. The extra reps will generate more pump and this helps to avoid injuries and poor form.
I think we know that training with maximum intensity, a la Jones, Mentzer and Darden is unlikely to generate maximum growth unless combined with sufficient volume as demonstrated with Oliva. The idea that brief sprinting training leads to larger and larger muscles is false. I haven't seen one person achieve maximum size with brief training. Not one. Conclusion? Something is missing. Therefore, HIT is false and insufficient to cause maximum hypertrophy.
Milos can present his own theories. He doesn't seem to care to debate everyone here and that is his choice. He is showing us with images.
DOMS is a feedback phenomenon that can help one know when he is growing rapidly. Not all DOMS indicates rapid growth but rapid growth will probably generate DOMS. The trick is to get sore using heavy weights and lots of maximum sets with the right exercises. Whether you need to do the sets with little rest between them is not established. I doubt time between sets is critical. If you can sustain using the same heavy resistance you will need longer rests between sets and the two methods might overlap re effectiveness. Resting more might take a bit longer and not be so hard on the total systems of the body. In other words, lazy guys don't have to kill themselves and can still grow rapidly. There has to be some equivalent methods that end up doing the same thing.
vince, this was not what arthur jones advocated at all. you should learn your subject matter before your lecture begins and maybe you'll have more credibility.
i would suggest that the thickness garraeth has is directly attributal to his previous heavy lifting along with aas as is with joj.
what garraeth has accomplished with milos is much the same muscle mass with significantly less fat. a very good result and a win for team milos.
DL.5 Milos is probably not answering your questions because he is still crying over the beating he took on his supplement.
unfortunately for people like milos, it helps to have a thick skin around here and massive egos like milos tend to melt easily.
joj has been somewhat haphazard in his approach to contests in the past and he has largely got by on his heavy training caused density and thickness, which is very very handy when dieting down.
milos is obviously going to get joj's drugs organised and will help fill in the gaps physique wise. i don't think milos can do much damage to joj's thickness in 8 weeks and the extra capillary growth from all that blood might fill him up a bit. then again, milos might give him too much slin and gh and thus do a dennis james on him.
it will be interesting to see the results come olympia time and you can bet milos will be keenly aware of the affect that another disastrous result will have on his credibility. :-[
i hope milos gets this one right.
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I have a fair grasp of what Arthur Jones and Mike Mentzer advocated. Most of us tried those methods decades ago and had mixed results. The Sergio-Jones leg routine was just too difficult and required free adjacent equipment to execute.
It is my belief that HIT is false as a theory. It does not explain maximum hypertrophy and makes a lame attempt to explain lack of growth from hard training.
My method explains all growth and non growth. Training at near maximum intensity is both unnecessary and usually dangerous.
After Arthur Jones exercise theory changed forever and no one can train without doing lots of things he advocated.
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DL.5 Milos is probably not answering your questions because he is still crying over the beating he took on his supplement.
cool. i don't think he should be mad at me, i have made some jokes about the price of his supplement, but i have given him major respect for his career and ideas.
we will see over the coming days if he is in fact pissed off.
and regardless of what i said, i will be buying koloseum gear to work out in. so this should counter-act my bad humour
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he is improved a lot, if he can bring up the legs, he would be unstoppable, upper body one of the best in the biz right now.
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Garraeth your tris needs "a lot" of work.
So do his bologna tits. Lay off the decline work for a while sport. Other than that keep up the good work.
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1. vince shut the fuck up. you have never been able to tell us what "your" theory of training is, no practical advice. just bs. besides, training is not complicated just pick a simple 4-5 day split and work it...
2. "dean" needs to squat and leg press gh15 style (12-15 reps moderate weight)
3. no more synthol in arms
4. mentzer is all bullshit. i laugh at the mofos brainswashed by his crap. mentzer was always raving about arnolds 20 sets to failure, so he said lets do one set to failure instead.(typical bodybuilders mindset, always thinking in extremes)) but you know what? there is no fucking need to go to failure on every set.. by not going to failure on every set you will acheive supreme loading of the muscle (=growth) because you will be able to work the muscle with more volume (sets).
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hahaha vince writes alot, you would think that he is mr. olympia ....brutal not practicing what you preach
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he's starting to look HOT! ;)
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hahaha vince writes alot, you would think that he is mr. olympia ....brutal not practicing what you preach
so you are saying that Tiger Wood's golf coach should be best player in the world? that makes no sense
same goes for any athletic involved activity?
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hahaha vince writes alot, you would think that he is mr. olympia ....brutal not practicing what you preach
exactly, i havent even read what vince has posted in this thread as i read his training theory bs before. also some people dont understand that mentzers (a good bodybuilder for sure) "theories" are just crap. german scientists proved already back in the 60s how important loading is for muscle growth (measured as amount of reps done in a workout). i could totally crush mentzers theories, but all im gonna say that doing 1-2 sets per muscle group will make you detrained !
the only time low volume should be used is if you have been doing something called planned overreaching which basically is overtraining your body on purpose and then after weeks of that drastically lowering volume in order to give the body heal and overcompensate.
ohh also if you been one of those stupid fucks that always go to failure on everything ("no pain" bs)..then of course lowering volume will give your body a chane to recouperate. but a better solution is to not go to total failure on every set and thereby allowing you to use higher volume. alot better for muscle growth.
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hidetada looks like a cartoon compared to JOJ in this comparison
Very few BBers past and present have a chest (or traps) compared to JOJ. Hidetada looks like he needs JOJ chest training manual---. The pic of JOJ using a armblaster and his chest overhanging it is sick.
But in reality both bbers would get lost in a mid 90's line-up, the only thing that would stand out is JOJ chest and lack of legs and Hide's lack of shape.
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Very few BBers past and present have a chest (or traps) compared to JOJ. Hidetada looks like he needs JOJ chest training manual---. The pic of JOJ using a armblaster and his chest overhanging it is sick.
But in reality both bbers would get lost in a mid 90's line-up, the only thing that would stand out is JOJ chest and lack of legs and Hide's lack of shape.
agreed & bump
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exactly, i havent even read what vince has posted in this thread as i read his training theory bs before. also some people dont understand that mentzers (a good bodybuilder for sure) "theories" are just crap. german scientists proved already back in the 60s how important loading is for muscle growth (measured as amount of reps done in a workout). i could totally crush mentzers theories, but all im gonna say that doing 1-2 sets per muscle group will make you detrained !
the only time low volume should be used is if you have been doing something called planned overreaching which basically is overtraining your body on purpose and then after weeks of that drastically lowering volume in order to give the body heal and overcompensate.
ohh also if you been one of those stupid fucks that always go to failure on everything ("no pain" bs)..then of course lowering volume will give your body a chane to recouperate. but a better solution is to not go to total failure on every set and thereby allowing you to use higher volume. alot better for muscle growth.
interesting..do you have a practical application of your theory to demonstrate to us?
I am guessing no
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Slaveboy1980. It is always refreshing and a privilege to hear the opinion of a real expert.
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bloody hell, Vince B is still alive
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cool. i don't think he should be mad at me, i have made some jokes about the price of his supplement, but i have given him major respect for his career and ideas.
we will see over the coming days if he is in fact pissed off.
and regardless of what i said, i will be buying koloseum gear to work out in. so this should counter-act my bad humour
lol
ffs D.L. 5 don't be ridiculous. do you really think milos gives a flying fuck about you?
he doesn't come to this board to get his arse kissed. he can do that on his own board.
then again, he doesn't come here for intelligent debate either. who does?
he comes here for the same reason getbig beats every other board in the ratings game, to read what people really think (specifically about him). that's why he can't resist posting, not to help anyone (let's face it, in over 2500 posts, how many questions has he actually answered) but because he can't stand reading an opinion that is less than perfect about himself.
you see, like a lot of bbers (let's be honest - 90% at least) milos is vain. so much so that having his arse kissed on his board is not enough. he can't stand the thought that someone somewhere might not think he's actually...'the mind'.
milos knows very well that his supplements are bullshit, otherwise he would have provided evidence of his claims by now. at $210 u.s an order is it too much for a potential customer to ask for some evidence to prove ONE of the claims that he himself made on the advertisement?
apparently so, so i offered him $1000.00 pay pal and he asked me to hit him with my best shot.
of course i am far too respectful of the great 'mind', milos sarcev to do this ie ask him to prove ALL of his claims so i merely asked him to prove ONE of his claims for $1000.00.
...but alas, something that apparently is so easy to explain that his 9 year old daughter could do it somehow escapes the great 'mind', milos sarcev and he is incapable of collecting the easiest $1000.00 he's ever made in his life.
easiest IF he was not actually deceiving his potential client base that is. ;)
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I have a fair grasp of what Arthur Jones and Mike Mentzer advocated. Most of us tried those methods decades ago and had mixed results. The Sergio-Jones leg routine was just too difficult and required free adjacent equipment to execute.
It is my belief that HIT is false as a theory. It does not explain maximum hypertrophy and makes a lame attempt to explain lack of growth from hard training.
My method explains all growth and non growth. Training at near maximum intensity is both unnecessary and usually dangerous.
After Arthur Jones exercise theory changed forever and no one can train without doing lots of things he advocated.
Vince, i have the pleasure to say that, without knowing it, i have been backing up your theories almost to a 'T'!
Since the beginning of the year,and thanks to a thread started here on getbig.com by Serge Nubret himself, he posted his training program and I decided to follow it for change of pace, but applied with a personal twist. My 'twist' is exactly, and found by accident, what Vince explains here: whilst him and Serge advocate up to 8 sets per exercise (12 or 15 in Vince's case) i applied 6 sets per exercise, but only one muscle group per session (different from what Serge advocates) and all six sets are done UNTIL FAILURE, not using forced reps, rest pauses, super sets or any of these bullshit, not counting 2 warm up sets for every exercise. All of those 6 sets are maximum sets, done with 1 minute of rest between them (like Serge preached and contrary to Vince) and always with the goal of seeking DOMS on subsequent days.
Vince, believe me: IT WORKS!!! i'M BETTER THAN EVER!!
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1. vince shut the fuck up. you have never been able to tell us what "your" theory of training is, no practical advice. just bs. besides, training is not complicated just pick a simple 4-5 day split and work it...
Vince gets more and more confused by the year. Decades of trying to "figure it out" and where is he? Nowhere! He ignores all the research there is and keeps thinking he will eventually stumble on the "master theory" that causes uninterrupted growth for everyone. Vince is more confused than a psychotic Mentzer was just prior to his death.
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Vince gets more and more confused by the year. Decades of trying to "figure it out" and where is he? Nowhere! He ignores all the research there is and keeps thinking he will eventually stumble on the "master theory" that causes uninterrupted growth for everyone. Vince is more confused than a psychotic Mentzer was just prior to his death.
you're not wrong
he misrepresents arthur jones and thinks doms is the indicator of hypertrophy.
so if i go on a 15 mile run and get doms (as i would at this point) does that mean i've stimulated hypertrophy?
what a load of bs.
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ohh also if you been one of those stupid fucks that always go to failure on everything ("no pain" bs)..then of course lowering volume will give your body a chance to recouperate.
would u label dorian yates as one of these stupid fucks, cos thats the approach he took. one set to failure. he counteracted this failure by resting more.
however he has said that not many people could handle the way he trained genetically. (so they would have to do even less than him)
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MILOS! SPEAK.
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All that arguing about which training style is best is total BS.
Dorian was big with HIT, Mentzer was big with HIT, Arnold did 20sets of squats three times in one day.
It's not fucking rocket science, it's about forcing the body into getting stronger. Rest is proper nutrition (and of course drugs)
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All that arguing about which training style is best is total BS.
Dorian was big with HIT, Mentzer was big with HIT, Arnold did 20sets of squats three times in one day.
It's not fucking rocket science, it's about forcing the body into getting stronger. Rest is proper nutrition (and of course drugs)
Yeah, yesterday we did super heavy back work, in a "normal" straight set style -- so even Milos, with his "pink dumbells", does heavy stuff when it's appropriate.
Sticking with just one thing and blindly following it always is no bueno.
Edit: but it can get really complicated...or, maybe "complicated" isn't the right word...cuz before we did the heavy back, we did some lighter stuff to get our blood flowing (lessen chance of injury). Milos had to teach me how to do a cable row. heh. Obviously I'm self-taught...and I self-taught myself to do it the wrong way -- using a ton of bicep to pull the weight to my stomach. And he showed me how to do it right to use the lats, rather than bis, to pull the weight. ...that's a big "OOOOooooohhhh" for me...
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Yeah, yesterday we did super heavy back work, in a "normal" straight set style -- so even Milos, with his "pink dumbells", does heavy stuff when it's appropriate.
Sticking with just one thing and blindly following it always is no bueno.
Captain Obvious to the rescue.
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slaveboy1980: when do you think one should go to failure?
vince: HIT isnt for hypertrophy, but whatabout strength?
not everyone is interested in mass, a lot of people are just trying to get stronger - some even without getting bigger as it would be negative to them.
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vince: HIT isnt for hypertrophy,
blasphemy bluto.
however, i will say one thing...h.i.t is a crazy world. and sometimes in debates u just think fuck all this ideas lets all chill out and GET MASSED.
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blasphemy bluto.
however, i will say one thing...h.i.t is a crazy world. and sometimes in debates u just think fuck all this ideas lets all chill out and GET MASSED.
well according to vince it isnt, so my question was if he think it will work for strength
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well according to vince it isnt, so my question was if he think it will work for strength
vince gets quite confusing. he's all over the joint like a Taiwanese hooker on roller skates.
however he is always interesting to read.
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All that arguing about which training style is best is total BS.
Dorian was big with HIT, Mentzer was big with HIT, Arnold did 20sets of squats three times in one day.
It's not fucking rocket science, it's about forcing the body into getting stronger. Rest is proper nutrition (and of course drugs)
YES BUT WE WANNA HEAR WAT MILOS HAS TO SAY SINCE 1- HE HAS HIS THEORY WHICH CONFLICTS WITH IT AND 2- HE IS 'THE MIND'!
HOWEVER, MIKE MENTZER WAS ALSO A GREAT MIND.
SO LETS SEE WAT MILOS THINKS...
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1. Does Milos advocate not training the triceps?
2. Nice gyno on Garath
3. Nice gut on Garath, is that a side effect of the shakes>>?
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1. Does Milos advocate not training the triceps?
2. Nice gyno on Garath
3. Nice gut on Garath, is that a side effect of the shakes>>?
Garrateh doesn't have a gut moron.
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Garrateh doesn't have a gut moron.
But you do. ;)
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I am not all over the place. What I advocate is clear and distinct. What is confusing are the minds of the flotsam experts here on Getbig who cannot grasp that my theory is reverse engineered. I start with whatever causes growth and work backwards. Therefore my theory has to be right. My main fault is being unable to communicate what I have to say in simple enough terms that some of the select intellects here can grasp. HIT isn't false because I say so but because it simply doesn't work. It it did work for everyone Darden, and formerly Mentzer, wouldn't still be writing books trying to convince everyone. There is a certain intellectual dishonesty about most of the theories of hypertrophy seen on the internet. I abandon false theories. The test is simple. See if they work. If not, and you are doing them properly, then abandon them and try something else.
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lol
ffs D.L. 5 don't be ridiculous. do you really think milos gives a flying fuck about you?
he doesn't come to this board to get his arse kissed. he can do that on his own board.
lol. well if he is like that. well then i won't bother asking him. thanks
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I am not all over the place. What I advocate is clear and distinct. What is confusing are the minds of the flotsam experts here on Getbig who cannot grasp that my theory is reverse engineered. I start with whatever causes growth and work backwards. Therefore my theory has to be right. My main fault is being unable to communicate what I have to say in simple enough terms that some of the select intellects here can grasp. HIT isn't false because I say so but because it simply doesn't work. It it did work for everyone Darden, and formerly Mentzer, wouldn't still be writing books trying to convince everyone. There is a certain intellectual dishonesty about most of the theories of hypertrophy seen on the internet. I abandon false theories. The test is simple. See if they work. If not, and you are doing them properly, then abandon them and try something else.
Have you EVER written a program or given ANYTHING tangible that people can use?!!
Please post your fabulous training program. I'm pretty sure most everyone here is as confused as me, I have no idea how you would structure a training program. All I read is a bunch of BS rambling.
Does anyone here know what kind of program Vince advocates? What does it look like, what are the nuts and bolts of it?
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Don't go tough on Vince.. He invented the Internet for you bitches
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I am not all over the place. What I advocate is clear and distinct. What is confusing are the minds of the flotsam experts here on Getbig who cannot grasp that my theory is reverse engineered. I start with whatever causes growth and work backwards. Therefore my theory has to be right. My main fault is being unable to communicate what I have to say in simple enough terms that some of the select intellects here can grasp. HIT isn't false because I say so but because it simply doesn't work. It it did work for everyone Darden, and formerly Mentzer, wouldn't still be writing books trying to convince everyone. There is a certain intellectual dishonesty about most of the theories of hypertrophy seen on the internet. I abandon false theories. The test is simple. See if they work. If not, and you are doing them properly, then abandon them and try something else.
vince, tbh, i think you have some good ideas, but you are far too dismissive of other concepts and ideas. and for that reason i have the impression that your mind is closed just like jones' was. also, as pointed out, you have not done proper experimentation either on yourself or anyone else to verify what, at the end of the day, is your opinion.
imo what donkey kong says is most correct.
i feel i'm in a better position than most in that i don't care how big my muscles are. in fact, for a long time i have actively tried not to get too big for my sport, but i love strength and i love lifting weights, so i have some time and i've just said 'fuck it' and recently just trained as hard and as focused with the weights as i can with the intention of just continually moving more weight for more reps, everything more, which has worked great.
the advantage i have is that i haven't been concerned with hypertrophy, just loving the challenge of getting stronger and because i haven't relied on hypertrophy i have achieved good results with it.
let me explain: there is no current science that gives an absolute clear guideline to creating hypertrophy ie nobody actually knows. yes, people surmise and have theories but what causes hypertrophy is not clear cut by any means, probably because there are so many variables ie drugs, genetics, sex, environment, nutrition, body mass/fat, motivation, tolerance to pain, etc etc (seriously, i could go on all day) so specifically relying on feedback from something that is not clear cut is obviously going to be very frustrating especially if you are natural.
so, imo, if what your doing is making you stronger (and that has variables too like skill/efficiency of movement which gives a false indicator ie powerlifter/weightlifter/strongman) and increasing your muscular capacity to cope with fatigue (but that also is only my opinion, just like so many others)
i approach strength training differently to what i see from most athletes. most amateur and professional athletes see weight training as something they need to do as part of their strength and conditioning and simply do what their told with mixed results depending on the aforementioned variables.
i have realised that actual strength progression requires extremely dedicated focus and is not something you just go through the motions with, but then i probably enjoy it more than most athletes. ;D
i am sympathetic to the dedicated recreational bber. this poor animal has got to somehow be coach, motivator and trainee all in one. his goal (hypertrophy) has not even been clarified yet so it's no wonder he exists in a state of perpetual confusion. add to that the spectre of drugs, genetics, etc and how the hell is this poor animal supposed to know exactly what to do in the gym.
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I am not all over the place. What I advocate is clear and distinct. What is confusing are the minds of the flotsam experts here on Getbig who cannot grasp that my theory is reverse engineered. I start with whatever causes growth and work backwards. Therefore my theory has to be right. My main fault is being unable to communicate what I have to say in simple enough terms that some of the select intellects here can grasp. HIT isn't false because I say so but because it simply doesn't work. It it did work for everyone Darden, and formerly Mentzer, wouldn't still be writing books trying to convince everyone. There is a certain intellectual dishonesty about most of the theories of hypertrophy seen on the internet. I abandon false theories. The test is simple. See if they work. If not, and you are doing them properly, then abandon them and try something else.
vince i was just making a joke at ur expense (how nice of me huh...not)
wat is ur opinion on this Darden fellow. never heard of him i will look him up.
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Don't go tough on Vince.. He invented the Internet for you bitches
Vince invented himself before he invented the internet.
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what is it you dont understand from vince? he believes volume is needed for hypertrohopy. and he also doesnt seem to believe going to failure is necessary.
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so, imo, if what your doing is making you stronger (and that has variables too like skill/efficiency of movement which gives a false indicator ie powerlifter/weightlifter/strongman) and increasing your muscular capacity to cope with fatigue (but that also is only my opinion, just like so many others)
i approach strength training differently to what i see from most athletes. most amateur and professional athletes see weight training as something they need to do as part of their strength and conditioning and simply do what their told with mixed results depending on the aforementioned variables.
i have realised that actual strength progression requires extremely dedicated focus and is not something you just go through the motions with, but then i probably enjoy it more than most athletes. ;D
i am sympathetic to the dedicated recreational bber. this poor animal has got to somehow be coach, motivator and trainee all in one. his goal (hypertrophy) has not even been clarified yet so it's no wonder he exists in a state of perpetual confusion. add to that the spectre of drugs, genetics, etc and how the hell is this poor animal supposed to know exactly what to do in the gym.
"so, imo, if what your doing is making you stronger"
then what? complete the sentence
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what is it you dont understand from vince? he believes volume is needed for hypertrohopy. and he also doesnt seem to believe going to failure is necessary.
Man, the Dude is over 60!!!!!
Surely he wouldn't survive forced reps, negative sets and muscle failure after 6 reps. The geezer would die on the spot.
For old people, lighter weights, more reps and no muscle failure is great, but for a 20something i think you have to go to the limits your body sets up.
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Man, the Dude is over 60!!!!!
Surely he wouldn't survive forced reps, negative sets and muscle failure after 6 reps. The geezer would die on the spot.
For old people, lighter weights, more reps and no muscle failure is great, but for a 20something i think you have to go to the limits your body sets up.
why do you think that
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why do you think that
Older people don't have regeneration abilities like younger people. I have always made the best gains when i was pushing myself over the limit, be it with a HST or a HIT program or DC, which i am currently at.
I have worked out at a gym that was specialized on rehab and old people for a long time, and the PT all had some sort of medical degree. All of them were saying that old people should do resistance training without going to muscle failure because it would overload their nervous system.
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Older people don't have regeneration abilities like younger people. I have always made the best gains when i was pushing myself over the limit, be it with a HST or a HIT program or DC, which i am currently at.
I have worked out at a gym that was specialized on rehab and old people for a long time, and the PT all had some sort of medical degree. All of them were saying that old people should do resistance training without going to muscle failure because it would overload their nervous system.
but it overloads everyones nervous system. not just old people.
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but it overloads everyones nervous system. not just old people.
Yes, you're right.
But as regeneration is faster in young people, they can overload their system in training over a time and then, as in DC cruising, heal up and start again.
Old people would not be able to do that as they overload very fast and need a loooong time to heal up.
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"so, imo, if what your doing is making you stronger"
then what? complete the sentence
lol, sorry about that. i got lost in all the variables i guess.
IMO hypertrophy is best accomplished by both increasing it's contactile force + the muscle's energy supply.
i think we all agree that hypertrophy is not going to be a continuem unless it has to, because 240lb ripped humans is not what nature intended (too energy expensive to run) so nature ie your body will fight you all the way ie homeostasis.
the only way to overcome that is to make your body an offer it can't refuse ie force it to adapt.
of course it's not that simple and if you're not smart about it, your body will resist and make you an offer you can't refuse ie cut back or i'll hurt you.
so, IMO, the only way to get around that is to make sure you adapt in a positive incline, but don't do anything your body can't handle. basically you need to train like an animal (well, you want to look like one don't you?), but listen to your body's signals. this is the hard part and if you don't know your body very well you will probably need a good trainer.
thing is, unless you're an athlete, marine or someone that has pushed his/her body to it's true breaking point, you have no idea what your body is capable of. when i see recreational bbers training in the gym i'm shocked by how easy they take things eg. chatting between sets, slapping on a few weights here, a few there, looking in the mirror all the time/other people, checking their hair/nails, huffing and puffing/roaring, ILS - it's fucking ridiculous and it's not hard to see why they don't progress. why would your body progress under these conditions, it's snoring it's fucking head off.
my advice is to forget what you think your failure point is, forget the nervous system or what you're going to eat/drink, forget how you look (apart from getting the proper mind set focused on the muscle your training using ALL your sensory powers), forget who's watching/what they might think, forget gym ettiquette etc and focus on what matters ie training heavy, hard and focused and push yourself to your true breaking point.
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Garrateh doesn't have a gut moron.
yes he does no where as big as Dennis James, but its still there look closely - he should have a vacuum in these poses. it must what milos gives everybody he ruining physiques.
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I don't know what it is, but he looks like shit.
tits are bad too. maybe the skin??
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I don't know what it is, but he looks like shit.
tits are bad too. maybe the skin??
oh lighten up, he's a work in progress
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oh lighten up, he's a work in progress
ok ok, i'm sorry.
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would u label dorian yates as one of these stupid fucks, cos thats the approach he took. one set to failure. he counteracted this failure by resting more.
however he has said that not many people could handle the way he trained genetically. (so they would have to do even less than him)
not completely true...dorian did lower his volume compared to what bodybuilders did in the 80s (i agree about that)..but several people say that he didnt do the routines he said he did in the magazines . Personally i dont think this is true tho, and i dont think yates completely lied about that.(stretched the truth tho.).but..: if you look at his videos what he does isnt that much different from what anyone else does..just that he doesnt count the pyramid sets....so he was basically doing the same amount of sets as cormier, levrone, ray, ronnie etc...Thats one of the big things that are never mentioned in the HIT vs volume discussions..how you count warmup and pyramid sets (when doing a pyramid up to a top weight) Also yates never did exactly what mentzer advocated..he had his own version which isnt that much different from what the majority of prose do. The magazines and yates himself have tried to distance yates trainingstyle from that of other pros do, partly inorder to create a niche, and make money of it.
Mentzer also tried to take credite for yates success, and even claimed he trained yates which is bullshit as yates never had a "trainer", sure he had people help him out but never a trainer. Yates did spend 3 days training with mentzer in the early 90s..but he always adapted things and did his own way. Besides training with yates for 3 days doesnt make mentzer yates trainer. the fact that mentzer trained with yates for 3 days was something he used in his personal training business, but he exaggerated it.
another important aspect, is that all you hear when talking about dorian is that he got big and won olympia thanks to his training style..i dont agree with this..i think he would have been even bigger or gotten to the size he reached ..even faster with abit more volume. This doesnt mean that im saying he should do an 80s split..and do every bodypart twice a week with 25 sets each time. instead im saying he could have done 3 working sets on each exercise, (which he also recommends to bodybuilders in his articles...sometimes he says 1 and 2 working sets per exercise too) for a total of 12-20sets working sets ,and not pushed to failure as often he did. And to be honest...i dont think it matters what the fuck he did..as dorian was on so much hormones that how he trained didnt matter that much. Also yates consistency would have made most training programmes work.
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All that arguing about which training style is best is total BS.
Dorian was big with HIT, Mentzer was big with HIT, Arnold did 20sets of squats three times in one day.
It's not fucking rocket science, it's about forcing the body into getting stronger. Rest is proper nutrition (and of course drugs)
true. just fucking go to the gym and workout hard!
but dont be so damn scared of overtraining folks!
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lol, sorry about that. i got lost in all the variables i guess.
IMO hypertrophy is best accomplished by both increasing it's contactile force + the muscle's energy supply.
i think we all agree that hypertrophy is not going to be a continuem unless it has to, because 240lb ripped humans is not what nature intended (too energy expensive to run) so nature ie your body will fight you all the way ie homeostasis.
the only way to overcome that is to make your body an offer it can't refuse ie force it to adapt.
of course it's not that simple and if you're not smart about it, your body will resist and make you an offer you can't refuse ie cut back or i'll hurt you.
so, IMO, the only way to get around that is to make sure you adapt in a positive incline, but don't do anything your body can't handle. basically you need to train like an animal (well, you want to look like one don't you?), but listen to your body's signals. this is the hard part and if you don't know your body very well you will probably need a good trainer.
thing is, unless you're an athlete, marine or someone that has pushed his/her body to it's true breaking point, you have no idea what your body is capable of. when i see recreational bbers training in the gym i'm shocked by how easy they take things eg. chatting between sets, slapping on a few weights here, a few there, looking in the mirror all the time/other people, checking their hair/nails, huffing and puffing/roaring, ILS - it's fucking ridiculous and it's not hard to see why they don't progress. why would your body progress under these conditions, it's snoring it's fucking head off.
my advice is to forget what you think your failure point is, forget the nervous system or what you're going to eat/drink, forget how you look (apart from getting the proper mind set focused on the muscle your training using ALL your sensory powers), forget who's watching/what they might think, forget gym ettiquette etc and focus on what matters ie training heavy, hard and focused and push yourself to your true breaking point.
With all your expert knowledge you must be a monster, 'BEAST 8962' ::)
1] Milos competed and was sucessful in the toughest era of bodybuilding.
2] He is still regarded as having one of the best physiques on the planet.
3] He trains many champions, ex champions and future champions. All go to him for expert 'advices' on training, diet, supplemants and 'science'.
4] He is known throughout the industry as someone that speaks his mind and genuinely wants to promote the sport of bodybuilding. [Shawn and Lee Thompson]
5] Instead of sitting on his ass and complaining about dodgy placings and corrupt officials, he is actually doing something about it ;)
6] He has a gorgeous wife. [off topic, but i bet you haven't]
YOU are an anonymous internet warrior that probably doesn't even work out. Yep, Milos has got alot to fear from you, 'BEAST 8962' ::)
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true. just fucking go to the gym and workout hard!
but dont be so damn scared of overtraining folks!
When i was doing HST, i was having 3h workouts. when i came home i had to sleep 4 hours because i was so exhausted.
The time is the main reason i do HIT or DC. HST is great, but i have a gf, a job and friends. It's impossible to train 3 hours 3-4 times a week and sleep 4 hours afterwards. ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D
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i have a gf, a job and friends.
Sure you do ::)
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When i was doing HST, i was having 3h workouts. when i came home i had to sleep 4 hours because i was so exhausted.
The time is the main reason i do HIT or DC. HST is great, but i have a gf, a job and friends. It's impossible to train 3 hours 3-4 times a week and sleep 4 hours afterwards. ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D
:) i can an understand that. i been busy as hell lately too!
HIT is for lazy people. but ill stay out of that discussion....almost all true HITTERS look like shit and get detrained and unathletic.
one final thing:
you dont need a perfect routine ;consistency over 3, 5, 10, 15 years, will take away the need to optimize anything.
besides ..as a natural there is only so far you can go. if you have 100 meters of distance to cover..does it really matter if you walk, drive a ferrari, take a bike or crawl....if you have 10 years time to cover the distance? a few seconds more or less, wont make a difference in the end.
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Sure you do ::)
If you ever come to germany give me a call.
I'll be marrying in august, my future wife will make a nice japanese dinner and then we'll go to a real german Biergarten and get tanked. ;D ;D ;D
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If you ever come to germany give me a call.
I'll be marrying in august, my future wife will make a nice japanese dinner and then we'll go to a real german Biergarten and get tanked. ;D ;D ;D
just curious are you near bavaria?
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:) i can an understand that. i been busy as hell lately too!
HIT is for lazy people. but ill stay out of that discussion....almost all true HITTERS look like shit and get detrained and unathletic.
one final thing:
you dont need a perfect routine ;consistency over 3, 5, 10, 15 years, will take away the need to optimize anything.
besides ..as a natural there is only so far you can go. if you have 100 meters of distance to cover..does it really matter if you walk, drive a ferrari, take a bike or crawl....if you have 10 years time to cover the distance? a few seconds more or less, wont make a difference in the end.
I agree. There are some dudes in my gym in their 40s. They have NO fucking clue of how to train. 2 inch ROM reps, bad form, but they train consistently for 20 years and look good. Not perfect, but good.
They could look better though, most of them are lazy.
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If you ever come to germany give me a call.
I'll be marrying in august, my future wife will make a nice japanese dinner and then we'll go to a real german Biergarten and get tanked. ;D ;D ;D
Will be in 'Krautland' next year for the Manowar festival!
HIT is for lazy people. but ill stay out of that discussion....almost all true HITTERS look like shit and get detrained and unathletic.
Most honest post of the day.
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just curious are you near bavaria?
No, i'm living in the Ruhr area, near the netherlands.
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focus on what matters ie training heavy, hard and focused and push yourself to your true breaking point.
great post.
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Will be in 'Krautland' next year for the Manowar festival!
Most honest post of the day.
When is it and where?
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Also yates never did exactly what mentzer advocated..he had his own version which isnt that much different from what the majority of prose do.
no he didnt, and mike commented on this.
however i still believe it is way different to wat other pro's do.
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When is it and where?
This time next year, 'Bad Arolson'. A village in the middle of no where thats almost impossible to get to.
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:) i can an understand that. i been busy as hell lately too!
HIT is for lazy people. but ill stay out of that discussion....almost all true HITTERS look like shit and get detrained and unathletic.
you are not knowledge in exercise physiology. you are making generalizations.
and to your comment 'h.i.t is for lazy people', u couldnt last one workout with myself, mentzer, dorian, or dave palumbo.
to quote john romano "if u think u can't do a workout in 5-7 sets then you haven't trained with mentzer, dorian or myself'
end of story, why dont u show a picture of ur 'great physique' if ur routine works so well???? come on post it.
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This time next year, 'Bad Arolson'. A village in the middle of no where thats almost impossible to get to.
haha. Always the same with metal festivals.
If you're in the Ruhr area, i'll invite you to a beer. ;D ;D ;D
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you are not knowledge in exercise physiology. you are making generalizations.
and to your comment 'h.i.t is for lazy people', u couldnt last one workout with myself, mentzer, dorian, or dave palumbo.
to quote john romano "if u think u can't do a workout in 5-7 sets then you haven't trained with mentzer, dorian or myself'
end of story, why dont u show a picture of ur 'great physique' if ur routine works so well???? come on post it.
dorian would do about 16 sets. don't include him in your 'HIT' crusade.
Mentzer was a druggie and Palumbo is a convicted crook that looks like shit. Great examples ::)
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haha. Always the same with metal festivals.
If you're in the Ruhr area, i'll invite you to a beer. ;D ;D ;D
I'll have a double bock and a platter of sausages :P
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you are not knowledge in exercise physiology. you are making generalizations.
and to your comment 'h.i.t is for lazy people', u couldnt last one workout with myself, mentzer, dorian, or dave palumbo.
to quote john romano "if u think u can't do a workout in 5-7 sets then you haven't trained with mentzer, dorian or myself'
end of story, why dont u show a picture of ur 'great physique' if ur routine works so well???? come on post it.
i done brutal HIT SHIT workouts. its not a question about being tough enough to do them. its even harder to do more volume with almost same intensity..besides, working out isnt about "lasting workouts with anyone".....its about being able to workout year after year with sufficient intensity to grow.
also. try doing 4-5 sets of 15-20 reps of squats to almost failure (1-2 reps from failure) with one minute rest in between....that shit is alot harder than doing one set of squats to failure.
hope this helps, uncle motrabulic, you little macho man ;D
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i have discussed training numerous times with HIT fanatics (they behave like they are in some kind of sect). so no need to post anymore dl5 , i heard it all before...
they think that anyone not doing one set to total failure are pussies. what they dont understand is that doing insane amounts of forced reps isnt the best way to go..instead do more sets to almost failure with some sets taken to failure...and do it with a fast pace...that is alot harder than doing a few sets to failure. more loading = more growth.
also arnold trained alot harder than mentzer. ;D.........so did platz..and he sure didnt do HIT..so please go tell platz he worked out like a pussy :-*
finally: you dont need platzian intensity to grow...platz took intensity to far, the way he trained he increased risk of injury too much.
you need to be intense in the gym sure..but you dont have to scream and act like an animal in the gym to grow. stimulate the muscle and then get out.
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moronic training =
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If you ever come to germany give me a call.
I'll be marrying in august, my future wife will make a nice japanese dinner and then we'll go to a real german Biergarten and get tanked. ;D ;D ;D
i didnt know 12 year old was legal to marry
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i have discussed training numerous times with HIT fanatics (they behave like they are in some kind of sect). so no need to post anymore dl5 , i heard it all before...
they think that anyone not doing one set to total failure are pussies. what they dont understand is that doing insane amounts of forced reps isnt the best way to go..instead do more sets to almost failure with some sets taken to failure...and do it with a fast pace...that is alot harder than doing a few sets to failure. more loading = more growth.
also arnold trained alot harder than mentzer. ;D.........so did platz..and he sure didnt do HIT..so please go tell platz he worked out like a pussy :-*
finally: you dont need platzian intensity to grow...platz took intensity to far, the way he trained he increased risk of injury too much.
you need to be intense in the gym sure..but you dont have to scream and act like an animal in the gym to grow. stimulate the muscle and then get out.
how can you tell how hard arnold trained? i think thats been debated, if i recall pumpster didnt think he trained that hard
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slaveboy1980 when do you think people should to go failure? never?
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moronic training =
yeah cause it didnt work for him ::)
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yeah cause it didnt work for him ::)
his legs would have been just as big without all the crazy forced reps and half reps, and quarter reps etc.
his 605 for 15 rep sets would been enough. the high reps with heavy weight made his legs huge..not the partial shit.
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With all your expert knowledge you must be a monster, 'BEAST 8962' ::)
1] Milos competed and was sucessful in the toughest era of bodybuilding.
2] He is still regarded as having one of the best physiques on the planet.
3] He trains many champions, ex champions and future champions. All go to him for expert 'advices' on training, diet, supplemants and 'science'.
4] He is known throughout the industry as someone that speaks his mind and genuinely wants to promote the sport of bodybuilding. [Shawn and Lee Thompson]
5] Instead of sitting on his ass and complaining about dodgy placings and corrupt officials, he is actually doing something about it ;)
6] He has a gorgeous wife. [off topic, but i bet you haven't]
YOU are an anonymous internet warrior that probably doesn't even work out. Yep, Milos has got alot to fear from you, 'BEAST 8962' ::)
ok uk gold, i'm aware that you are partial to taking it in the rectum but milos is not going to reward you for your misplaced defense of him with a chutney drilling, sorry.
show me where in that post that i attacked milos stupid?
my previous issue with milos was the outrageous claims that he made re his product. i know, for example, that he is probably going to find himself in some hot water over his 'anabolic' claims and he should no better than to say that you can gain 30-40lbs of muscle in a couple of weeks, but hey, buy the sugar and protein. milos might aso throw in a jerbal that you can shove up your ass too.
i don't claim to instill fear upon milos and i have no personal problem at all with him. my objective was to expose those claims as bullshit and i believe, by his lack of response to my challenge, i have accomplished that. smart people know what's up so i really do think the product would be of benefit to you. you should place an order immediately if you haven't already done so. place one for your boyfriend too. :D
i have repeatedly acknowledged milos' credentials as a bber. he was, indeed, very successful and no one can take that away from him, but that doesn't mean he can piss on me and call it lemonade. i can appreciate that you are the type of person that has already conjured up 6 different fantasies on the thought of milos pissing on you, but you have a very different outlook on life than me.
so, in short, go fuck yourself (and in your case i know you will do your untmost to make that happen). :-X
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ok uk gold, i'm aware that you are partial to taking it in the rectum but milos is not going to reward you for your misplaced defense of him with a chutney drilling, sorry.
show me where in that post that i attacked milos stupid?
my previous issue with milos was the outrageous claims that he made re his product. i know, for example, that he is probably going to find himself in some hot water over his 'anabolic' claims and he should no better than to say that you can gain 30-40lbs of muscle in a couple of weeks, but hey, buy the sugar and protein. milos might aso throw in a jerbal that you can shove up your ass too.
i don't claim to instill fear upon milos and i have no personal problem at all with him. my objective was to expose those claims as bullshit and i believe, by his lack of response to my challenge, i have accomplished that. smart people know what's up so i really do think the product would be of benefit to you. you should place an order immediately if you haven't already done so. place one for your boyfriend too. :D
i have repeatedly acknowledged milos' credentials as a bber. he was, indeed, very successful and no one can take that away from him, but that doesn't mean he can piss on me and call it lemonade. i can appreciate that you are the type of person that has already conjured up 6 different fantasies on the thought of milos pissing on you, but you have a very different outlook on life than me.
so, in short, go fuck yourself (and in your case i know you will do your untmost to make that happen). :-X
Meltdown
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his legs would have been just as big without all the crazy forced reps and half reps, and quarter reps etc.
his 605 for 15 rep sets would been enough. the high reps with heavy weight made his legs huge..not the partial shit.
how do you know
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Meltdown
the truth hurts hey uk gold ??? :'(
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hope this helps, uncle motrabulic, you little macho man ;D
i turned into "uncle motrabulic, the little macho man" when i read 'h.i.t is lazy shits'.
couldnt help it ;)
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how do you know
many have tried heavy high rep squats with dissimilar results to platz.
in fact, platz is a good example of what i meant by most people simply being unaware of what true failure actually is. platz would start a set where most would stop.
i don't know whether platz was on meth when he trained or something but the guy trained like an animal. he trained so hard that his legs could do nothing but grow and respond. of course the dballs, test, gh and anapolon would have helped with this process.
it is interesting that he didn't achieve the same results with his upper body. i haven't seen much of tom's upper body training but my understanding is that, for some reason, he didn't go as heavy and hard on arms.
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i have discussed training numerous times with HIT fanatics (they behave like they are in some kind of sect). so no need to post anymore dl5 , i heard it all before...
they think that anyone not doing one set to total failure are pussies. what they dont understand is that doing insane amounts of forced reps isnt the best way to go..instead do more sets to almost failure with some sets taken to failure...and do it with a fast pace...that is alot harder than doing a few sets to failure. more loading = more growth.
u have an axe to grind with h.i.t that is ur own personal issue. i dont hold anything against any other methods, however when someone says h.i.t is for lazy people it just proves to me that 1 - they have a personal agenda or 2- they are not knowledgable and have never done it.
there is nothing lazy about h.i.t and there is nothing lazy about volume training.
just going to the gym make u 'not lazy' most people eat corn chips and cant be bothered wiping their own ass....now that is lazy.
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Milos, get off ur ass and answer the questions.
how can u expect support if u think u are 'above' answering questions. i think beast must have hit the nail on the head.
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Milos, get off ur ass and answer the questions.
how can u expect support if u think u are 'above' answering questions. i think beast must have hit the nail on the head.
heh, he's probably busy...have patience, he'll be back when he's got time.
In the mean time, here's what he said about glutamine: http://milossarcev.com/board/index.php?topic=1602.0
cuz I know some of you think it's garbage...
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heh, he's probably busy...have patience, he'll be back when he's got time.
In the mean time, here's what he said about glutamine: http://milossarcev.com/board/index.php?topic=1602.0
cuz I know some of you think it's garbage...
ok i'll check it out. thanks. i'll give milos more time.
also, i dont remember if u answered this, are the koloseum jumpers 'normal fit' or baggy (i want it to be fitted)?
and the tank tops, wat size u think for 205 pounds male 5 '11.
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ok i'll check it out. thanks. i'll give milos more time.
also, i dont remember if u answered this, are the koloseum jumpers 'normal fit' or baggy (i want it to be fitted)?
and the tank tops, wat size u think for 205 pounds male 5 '11.
I have no clue...I'm not good at apparel. Call them...
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heh, he's probably busy...have patience, he'll be back when he's got time.
In the mean time, here's what he said about glutamine: http://milossarcev.com/board/index.php?topic=1602.0
cuz I know some of you think it's garbage...
An Error Has Occurred!
The topic or board you are looking for appears to be either missing or off limits to you.
and it's not just some of us who THINK it's garbage - it's every scientist that ever done a study on it who KNOW it is
the only way for milos to counter that would be to mention NUMEROUS studies showing it's efficiency. which he cant. game over.
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u need to join the forum to see it. then get approved by the admin. ;)
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im loyal to getbig and join no other forums
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u have an axe to grind with h.i.t that is ur own personal issue. i dont hold anything against any other methods, however when someone says h.i.t is for lazy people it just proves to me that 1 - they have a personal agenda or 2- they are not knowledgable and have never done it.
there is nothing lazy about h.i.t and there is nothing lazy about volume training.
just going to the gym make u 'not lazy' most people eat corn chips and cant be bothered wiping their own ass....now that is lazy.
nope. most guys who do HIT are people who didnt have the drive to do real workouts and pussied out and looked for an excuse..."overtraining". Overtraining isnt a myth, but its not as easy to overtrain as many people believe...also the body can be conditioned to handle more and more volume.
and yes i tried HIT...and know alot about it and its history (jones, darden, mentzer, bryzcki)...
finally: there are many variations of HIT....and the stuff im talking about are the extreme low volume routines.
not the 6-7 working set workouts..which isnt optimal, but certainly can work.
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i dont agree with u. we'll leave it at that.
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nope. most guys who do HIT are people who didnt have the drive to do real workouts and pussied out and looked for an excuse..."overtraining". Overtraining isnt a myth, but its not as easy to overtrain as many people believe...also the body can be conditioned to handle more and more volume.
and yes i tried HIT...and know alot about it and its history (jones, darden, mentzer, bryzcki)...
finally: there are many variations of HIT....and the stuff im talking about are the extreme low volume routines.
not the 6-7 working set workouts..which isnt optimal, but certainly can work.
i agree with you slaveboy in that you need to increase the load on the musculoskeletal sytem to get that real muscle fatigue.
the problem with hit is not so much the theory, but the fact that you don't spend enough time really fatigueing the muscle. most people quit when the lactic acid sets in. of course lactic acid is going to end up forcing you to end your set, that's it's job to prevent injury, but that doesn't mean the muscle is truly fatigued yet.
another problem with 1 set to failure with forced reps etc is that the trainee only gets one chance per exercise and he/she fails every time.
why is this relevant IF you have reached true failure?
well, this is my point, most people have NO IDEA where their true failure point is.
in this day and age brutally hard physical work is eschewed. from the time you're old enough to lift something people are telling you not to lift it eg. mother to son, "don't lift that johnny, it's too heavy." ; "use the fork lift for that bud, you'll hurt your back.", etc. unless you're a professional athlete what the hell would you know what your body is capable of ???
think about it. eg. an accountant that spends all day sitting at a desk. all of a sudden 5:00pm comes along and he's going to the gym to do some hit training with an espresso on the way.
he gets to the gym, does a warm up, gets under his 135lb bench press and ALL HE'S THINKING ABOUT IS WHEN FAILURE'S GOING TO HIT. of course once it does he stops the set and he's done. this guy believes in his mind that he reached true failure but his body's fast asleep. that's because his mind has pooped way before his body has.
how does this happen?
because every time this man goes to the gym he does 1 set of bench presses and he ALWAYS fails, so the mind tells the body, "don't stress this one, i've got it. we've seen this all before a thousand times and it don't mean shit. i'll tell him to quit right about the same point i always do."
meanwhile the guy may be going, "please don't fail at 10 again, please don't fail at 10 again, pleeeeeeease donnnn't faiiiiiiiiiii...DAMN! >:( i failed at 10 again."
that's what's wrong with hit. you're training your mind to fail over and over every time you work out which is exactly the opposite to the way a successful athlete conditions his mind. a successful athlete conditions his mind to succeed (seems obvious), to believe that he can achieve the impossible.
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beast,
great observation. i think it takes a h.i.t trainee 6 months to a year to be able to build up to full failure (i call this failure of the entire body...true failure makes u dig deeper than the muscle, it means pushing every possible momentary energy, strength and effort of ur being.
this is very advanced and intense...u have to build up to it.
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i agree with you slaveboy in that you need to increase the load on the musculoskeletal sytem to get that real muscle fatigue.
the problem with hit is not so much the theory, but the fact that you don't spend enough time really fatigueing the muscle. most people quit when the lactic acid sets in. of course lactic acid is going to end up forcing you to end your set, that's it's job to prevent injury, but that doesn't mean the muscle is truly fatigued yet.
another problem with 1 set to failure with forced reps etc is that the trainee only gets one chance per exercise and he/she fails every time.
why is this relevant IF you have reached true failure?
well, this is my point, most people have NO IDEA where their true failure point is.
in this day and age brutally hard physical work is eschewed. from the time you're old enough to lift something people are telling you not to lift it eg. mother to son, "don't lift that johnny, it's too heavy." ; "use the fork lift for that bud, you'll hurt your back.", etc. unless you're a professional athlete what the hell would you know what your body is capable of ???
think about it. eg. an accountant that spends all day sitting at a desk. all of a sudden 5:00pm comes along and he's going to the gym to do some hit training with an espresso on the way.
he gets to the gym, does a warm up, gets under his 135lb bench press and ALL HE'S THINKING ABOUT IS WHEN FAILURE'S GOING TO HIT. of course once it does he stops the set and he's done. this guy believes in his mind that he reached true failure but his body's fast asleep. that's because his mind has pooped way before his body has.
how does this happen?
because every time this man goes to the gym he does 1 set of bench presses and he ALWAYS fails, so the mind tells the body, "don't stress this one, i've got it. we've seen this all before a thousand times and it don't mean shit. i'll tell him to quit right about the same point i always do."
meanwhile the guy may be going, "please don't fail at 10 again, please don't fail at 10 again, pleeeeeeease donnnn't faiiiiiiiiiii...DAMN! >:( i failed at 10 again."
that's what's wrong with hit. you're training your mind to fail over and over every time you work out which is exactly the opposite to the way a successful athlete conditions his mind. a successful athlete conditions his mind to succeed (seems obvious), to believe that he can achieve the impossible.
you may think y
i agree with some of the things you say..but im not gonna comment on everything:.. the thing that a guy like him should do is: stop one or two reps before failure ..and do 3 more sets of the bench press...then working at a fast pace...head over to incline dumbbell press do 8-12 reps and do the same thing...maybe failure on the last set.but certainly not several forced reps...then maybe some kind of machine press..and finally some cable crossovers..
nothing special...with the exeception that failure isnt the primary goal...the goal is to work with a manageble weight+good pace+maximum pump+ 12-20 sets. (6-12 reps most of the time,)
this is alot better than doing one set of bench press with mind focused on failure...instead its better stop before failure inorder to succeed....kinda like lee haney said ; "stimulate dont annihilate".
this isnt anything really new. but the ego and people being overly afraid of overtraining+lazyness...gets in the way.
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beast,
great observation. i think it takes a h.i.t trainee 6 months to a year to be able to build up to full failure (i call this failure of the entire body...true failure makes u dig deeper than the muscle, it means pushing every possible momentary energy, strength and effort of ur being.
this is very advanced and intense...u have to build up to it.
absolute bullshit! this is the kind of training you should avoid 99% of the time. it can be used for short periods of time for "shocking the body" (planned overreaching..as the russians call it) but certainly not workout after workout.
and it doesnt take a hit trainee 6months to learn going to true failure...(if he/she has can do the movement properly). he or she can learn it in one workout...if they have some prior workout experience and are pushed hard enough.
finally: failure of the entire body isnt something that you want or need so it really doesnt matter how long it takes to learn it..(but certainly doesnt take 6monts to learn it...it can be done in 45minutes)
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u are a clown.
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u are a clown.
= you where sodomized by the truth
ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhahaha hahhha :-*
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just shut the fuck up and train like ronnie
3 exercises for chest
twice a week
3 sets
thats it
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just shut the fuck up and train like ronnie
3 exercises for chest
twice a week
3 sets
thats it
3x3=9
9 x 2 =18
read and learn. blutobasic.
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3x3=9
9 x 2 =18
read and learn. blutobasic.
yes i can count
learn what thats what i said
follow ronnie and you cant go wrong
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yes i can count
learn what thats what i said
follow ronnie and you cant go wrong
you should take your own advice :-*
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= you where sodomized by the truth
where is not a verb, you meant to say 'were'.
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read and learn.
judging by this logic u can also follow mike mentzer and dorian yates to get a great physique.
u can also follow the genetic freak who doesnt know shit but grows either way.
in other words it has no logic. :-* :-* :-* :-*
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judging by this logic u can also follow mike mentzer and dorian yates to get a great physique.
u can also follow the genetic freak who doesnt know shit but grows either way.
in other words it has no logic. :-* :-* :-* :-*
nope all it ment was that 2x9=18.
:-*
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Some cool pics:
(http://www.koloseum.com/gallery/Galleries//1/43/IMG_4209.JPG)
(http://www.koloseum.com/gallery/Galleries//1/43/IMG_4241.JPG)
Me being tiny:
(http://www.koloseum.com/gallery/Galleries//1/43/IMG_4246.JPG)
i must say johnnie has brought his arms up tremendously
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I am not all over the place. What I advocate is clear and distinct. What is confusing are the minds of the flotsam experts here on Getbig who cannot grasp that my theory is reverse engineered. I start with whatever causes growth and work backwards. Therefore my theory has to be right. My main fault is being unable to communicate what I have to say in simple enough terms that some of the select intellects here can grasp. HIT isn't false because I say so but because it simply doesn't work. It it did work for everyone Darden, and formerly Mentzer, wouldn't still be writing books trying to convince everyone. There is a certain intellectual dishonesty about most of the theories of hypertrophy seen on the internet. I abandon false theories. The test is simple. See if they work. If not, and you are doing them properly, then abandon them and try something else.
Post a sample workout that you would recommend.
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nope all it ment was that 2x9=18.
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thank you :-* :-* :-* :-*
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The most revolutionary training system ever developed is The Delczeg Training System go to www.fitnessenterprises.c om
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The most revolutionary training system ever developed is The Delczeg Training System go to www.fitnessenterprises.c om
elaborate on its theory
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The Delczeg System is Negativ vs Positive, we`ve all heard about incorporating negative movements into our workouts. You see, traditional negative training might well be ineffectual after all. That`s because during regular negative training, the targeted muscle passively resists the weight by involving the maximun amount of muscle fibers. And in order to move the weight back up to the start position, the aditional aid of external help is necessary. A training partner must involve himself to get the weight back to a point of stability. At this poin, a portion of the motor units (fibers and nerve connections) involved shut off and the effectiveness of the negative repetition is significantly reduced. With the Delczeg Training System, the effectiveness of the negative portion of the movement is what will cause you to gain more muscle in less time!
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D.L.5
Here`s what happens with the Dlczeg System
You`ll warm-up thoroughly for at least 10 minutes. This time doesn`t count in the overall time of the workout, but it`s essential for preserving joint health and for getting blood ihto the muscle prior to actually lifting hevy weights.
The warm-up will consist of 1 light set of 20 reps followed by 1 set of 10 reps with a moderate weight. The warm-up concludes with a moderate-heavy set for 5 reps, never use weights that cause you to struggel to complete the last few reps during the warm-up.
Next suppose you can perform 4 strict, full repetitions on the incline bench presses with a maximun weight of 200 pounds. Your heavy workout for the incline bench presses should be 200 pounds. Now, compute 25% of 200 pounds = 50 pounds. This is your incremental weight.
I will continue the rest of Delczeg System tomorrow.
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please do. sounds great. i love negatives. they are vital.
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Post a sample workout that you would recommend.
Good luck with that request!
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Benifits of the Delczeg Training System :
Does not produce to much lactic acid build up during sets because of the low volume of repetitions.
Will produse maximum results in less time of traditional workouts.
Doesn`t cause significant mental stress because workouts are very brief ( attention span and concentration diminishes after45 minutes).
Increases size of muscles becouse more fibers are utilized throughout workout (works both fast-twich and slpw-twich fibers to maximum capacity).
It`s the only training system in wich the lifter does all of the work during the positive phase of the lift!
Workout Execution:
The workout is comprised of heavy and moderate workout days, based on fiber specialization (heavy days target primarily fast-twitch fibers, while moderate days target both fast and slow-twitch fibers) and alternating poundages for joint health (frequent heavy workouts can result in joint damage)
The Delczeg System , which incorporates the use of 2 separate spotters, heavy weight, incremental wejght, and negative repetitions thet end up benefitting the muscle fibers, withouth stressing the joints excessively.
More information tomorrow.
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Delczeg Training System
TRY THIS SYSTEM ONLY IF YOU ARE A PROFESIONAL BB, OR YOU ARE A VERY ADVANCED BB.
Heavy Workout:
The weight required for this workout is a weight that can managed for 4 strict repetitions. Perform 3 total sets, with 5 minutes rest periods between sats. On each set, perform 4 normal repetitions before adding and stripping the incremental weight for 4 more repetitions.
Moderate Workout:
The weight required forthis work out is a weight that can be managed for 8 strict repetitions. Perform 3 total sets,with 2 minutes rest period in between sets. On each set,perform 8 normal repetitions before adding and striping the incremental weight for 3-4 more repetitions.
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Delczeg Training System
MUSCLE BUILDING DIET
Diet is one of the most important factors involved in muscle growth. Many pepole would argue that it`s the amount of weight, or the degree of intensity that build muscla size. But in fact,supplying the body with the necessary nutrients is really what makes growth possible because the dody needs proteins, carbohydrates, and fats to rebuild the muscle tissue damage that occurs during weight training. Finding a good balance of nutrients is a challenge,because balancing ratios of proteins to carbohydrates and fats is difficult and may be different for each individual. Discovering what works best for both adding muscle size and losing body fat is often a tral and error pursuit.
And just as you adhere to a method of training, you must adhere to a method of eating that will support whatever it is you are trying to do with your training. This is an important part of your success with this program, or any other. But with the Delczeg T S it`s crucial because you`ll be creating a giant need to feed more muscle fiberrs, and to support more overall growth within a shorter period of time than traditionally possible with other methods.
When you talk about a growth diet, you`re talking about a diet whereby you are literally providing assistance to areas of the body that are broken down and to be rebuilt. Because this system of training is so revolutionary,it requires tremendous thought to develop an eating plan that fully supports all of the complwx principles involved with rebuildin damage musce fibers without exceeding cellular metabolism ( building muscle wthout gaining fat).
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The informations on Delczeg Training System is intented for educational and informational purposes only. Proceed with the D.T.S at your own risk.
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dave semenko knocked Delczeg into lompoc