Getbig.com: American Bodybuilding, Fitness and Figure
Getbig Main Boards => Gossip & Opinions => Topic started by: Trev on November 12, 2007, 08:59:33 AM
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Does anyone think Bodybuilders are better today????
http://www.kulturistika.com/picturesweb/porovnani/porovnani11.jpg
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Useless without pics damnit.
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Useless without pics damnit.
Pic ( Direct Comparison ) on the link above dude!
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Pic ( Direct Comparison ) on the link above dude!
That first comparison pic is one of those infamously horrible iron age shots. Neither is a good representation. Accidentally on purpose they seem to put bad pics of contemporary BBs on their site.
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Sergio had better taper, but that's about it. Oh, and better calves.
Coleman dominated him in all other regards, never been impressed w/ sergio.
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Sergio. 'Nuff said. :)
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Sergio dominates Ronnie. If it hadn't been for Arnold and Sergio's fight with Weider, Sergio would have been Mr. Olympia 6 or 7 years straight.
Ronnie probably beats Sergio from the back, but he has no aesthetics and can't compare when you take the full package into account.
I'd like to see Ronnie match this...
(http://www.kulturistika.net/image/gallery/200505311404_oliva.jpg)
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If you were to bring Ronnie back to the 70's Sergio would have easily dominated him, and if Sergio were to be in his prime now, he would have drugs he didn't back then, so again Sergio gets the win here.
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bodybuilders today have too much muscle and their legs are too big, it ruins the look!
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Two very different bb who were judged by different standards. I would want to look like Sergio but Ronnie at his best is the best bb I have ever seen.
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anyway to answer the question, based on genetics(and i think that is all you can compare them on..diet drugs etc makes today a completely different ball game to 30 odd years ago) alone Sergio is superior to Ronnie!
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sergio had a lot of the same qualities that make ronnie at his best the greatest ever:
eg. full muscle bellies, tiny waist, wide as hell back.
but, when you compare them, Sergio does get owned.
but is it really fair to compare a 1969 champion to a 1999 champion?
not really.
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Two very different bb who were judged by different standards. I would want to look like Sergio but Ronnie at his best is the best bb I have ever seen.
Best in what way? He is one of the biggest and certainly was drier than Sergio (thanks to supps and diuretics and knowledge available today), but don't see how you can call him the best. He doesn't have the balance and symmetry of Sergio and certainly doesn't have calves or small waist to match The Myth.
Know it has been debated over and over again, but Ronnie didn't deserve half of the Sandows he won. Olympia judging in the 90's and 00's sucked (and still sucks, isn't that right Jay?). Yates and Coleman got several gifts over the past 15 years of Olympia judging.
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I think when you look at the package of the crazy small waist and incredibly huge back... You just have to say The Myth.
The Myth has always been the best in my opinion, and others disagree... which is cool...
Just seems to me, that Sergio takes it if you add the sum of all the parts together.
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Ronnie vs. anyone = Ronnie wins.
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sergio had a lot of the same qualities that make ronnie at his best the greatest ever:
eg. full muscle bellies, tiny waist, wide as hell back.
but, when you compare them, Sergio does get owned.
but is it really fair to compare a 1969 champion to a 1999 champion?
not really.
Sergio crushes Ronnie in the structure department he has a better natural structure he has a real tiny waist Ronnie doesn't , Ronnie has a narrow waist however his GUT protrudes even at very low weights you didn't see this with Sergio
Sergio has better balance & proportion he has calves that compliment his quads as well as forearms that are in proportion with his huge arms , Ronnie's never had great balance & proportion. Ronnie has the clear advantage in muscularity thanks to Teh Chad who dried him out but thats an advantage of modern ' supplements ' if Sergio was born in say 1965 he would have been everything Ronnie was and more
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Sergio crushes Ronnie in the structure department he has a better natural structure he has a real tiny waist Ronnie doesn't , Ronnie has a narrow waist however his GUT protrudes even at very low weights you didn't see this with Sergio
Sergio has better balance & proportion he has calves that compliment his quads as well as forearms that are in proportion with his huge arms , Ronnie's never had great balance & proportion. Ronnie has the clear advantage in muscularity thanks to Teh Chad who dried him out but thats an advantage of modern ' supplements ' if Sergio was born in say 1965 he would have been everything Ronnie was and more
In 1985, Sergio looked very, very well! Photographic evidence below...
REVIEW OF THE CONTEST:
http://www.bodybuildingpro.com/mrolympiareport1985.html
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In 1985, Sergio looked very, very well! Photographic evidence below...
REVIEW OF THE CONTEST:
http://www.bodybuildingpro.com/mrolympiareport1985.html
No he didn't he looks like garbage same as in 84 it was a novelty seeing him compete but like Coleman his best days were far from over .
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Sergio crushes Ronnie in the structure department he has a better natural structure he has a real tiny waist Ronnie doesn't , Ronnie has a narrow waist however his GUT protrudes even at very low weights you didn't see this with Sergio
Sergio has better balance & proportion he has calves that compliment his quads as well as forearms that are in proportion with his huge arms , Ronnie's never had great balance & proportion. Ronnie has the clear advantage in muscularity thanks to Teh Chad who dried him out but thats an advantage of modern ' supplements ' if Sergio was born in say 1965 he would have been everything Ronnie was and more
::) :-[
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::) :-[
Great retort ! :)
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No he didn't he looks like garbage same as in 84 it was a novelty seeing him compete but like Coleman his best days were far from over .
He only looked like garbage by his own personal standards! Much the same as Ronnie did. He did place eighth at that show so give him some credit! He was much improved from 1984 where he did not look very good!
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He only looked like garbage by his own personal standards! Much the same as Ronnie did. He did place eighth at that show so give him some credit! He was much improved from 1984 where he did not look very good!
He was off by his standards and his competitors as well .
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when you consider raw potential then Sergio by a mile!! But obviously Ronnie out weighed Sergio by 35-40lbs and bigger over all. That being said the myth makes Ronnie look like a bloated pig
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when you consider raw potential then Sergio by a mile!! But obviously Ronnie out weighed Sergio by 35-40lbs and bigger over all. That being said the myth makes Ronnie look like a bloated pig
Lord Humungous has spoken !
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Great retort ! :)
im not a fanboy of anybody.. but
damn do u hate coleman....
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Sergio crushes Ronnie in the structure department he has a better natural structure he has a real tiny waist Ronnie doesn't , Ronnie has a narrow waist however his GUT protrudes even at very low weights you didn't see this with Sergio
Sergio has better balance & proportion he has calves that compliment his quads as well as forearms that are in proportion with his huge arms , Ronnie's never had great balance & proportion. Ronnie has the clear advantage in muscularity thanks to Teh Chad who dried him out but thats an advantage of modern ' supplements ' if Sergio was born in say 1965 he would have been everything Ronnie was and more
::)
the stupidity of the ronnie bashing continues..
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im not a fanboy of anybody.. but
damn do u hate coleman....
tell me about it.
he hates coleman so much his assessments about coleman's physique are about as far removed from real life as you can get. ::)
for example, he just ranted about how much better sergio's 'balance and proportion' were among other things and look at the comparison I just posted.
do you see any of the bullshit in ND's post about how much better sergio is?
of course not.
ND posts bullshit, plain and simple.
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im not a fanboy of anybody.. but
damn do u hate coleman....
You're so full of shit , almost as much as Hulkster stating the obvious isn't ' hating ' on Coleman Sergio enjoys advantages Ronnie doesn't not same with Ronnie with conditioning stop reading into my statements more than they are and the moment I join the bashing Ronnie's speech and his articulation abilities then you might have something to work with but until then keep fishing.
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ND's stupidity knows no bounds:
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tell me about it.
he hates coleman so much his assessments about coleman's physique are about as far removed from real life as you can get. ::)
for example, he just ranted about how much better sergio's 'balance and proportion' were among other things and look at the comparison I just posted.
do you see any of the bullshit in ND's post about how much better sergio is?
of course not.
ND posts bullshit, plain and simple.
meltdown
thats NOT Sergio at his best , but one wouldn't expect you to post an ' fair ' comparison lol a old B&W of Sergio at 226 pounds compared to a professional studio shot of Ronnie at 257 pounds you certainly proved me wrong ::)
Ronnie had a gut at low bodyweights watch me prove you wrong , so much for Ronnie having a tiny waist it was narrow thats about it
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ND's stupidity knows no bounds:
Thanks for proving my point jackass , notice one has great balance & proportion throughout their physique i.e. matching calves and forearms that compliment the rest if his physique and Ronnie has some unknown substance injected in his ;)
Segio is complete Ronnie is NOT thats the difference
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Sergio crushes Ronnie in the structure department he has a better natural structure he has a real tiny waist Ronnie doesn't , Ronnie has a narrow waist however his GUT protrudes even at very low weights you didn't see this with Sergio
Sergio has better balance & proportion he has calves that compliment his quads as well as forearms that are in proportion with his huge arms , Ronnie's never had great balance & proportion. Ronnie has the clear advantage in muscularity thanks to Teh Chad who dried him out but thats an advantage of modern ' supplements ' if Sergio was born in say 1965 he would have been everything Ronnie was and more
Yes ND........."IF". And "if" my grandmother had balls, she'd be my grandfather :P
But as it stands they looked the way they looked and going strictly by contest judging standards (which you love to utilize ;D), Ronnie absolutely annihilates Sergio. He's got 40 lbs. of pure muscle on the guy and Is light years ahead of him on condition. Sergio at his peak wouldn't even be a pro today. Not hating on Sergio but there's been 25 years of "progress" since he competed. Same thing goes for Arnold
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Yes ND........."IF". And "if" my grandmother had balls, she'd be my grandfather :P
But as it stands they looked the way they looked and going strictly by contest judging standards (which you love to utilize ;D), Ronnie absolutely annihilates Sergio. He's got 40 lbs. of pure muscle on the guy and Is light years ahead of him on condition. Sergio at his peak wouldn't even be a pro today. Not hating on Sergio but there's been 25 years of "progress" since he competed. Same thing goes for Arnold
Contest judging standards include balance & proportion , symmetry you're born with these and Sergio was born with these Ronnie wasn't , I've already said Ronnie has a clear advantage in conditioning but again thats because of the advancement of chemicals same with the advantage in size and who cares Ronnie didn't look better with the extra 40 pounds
Sergio would crush Ronnie if they were born the same year , no questions about it .
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25 years of progress lol
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25 years of progress lol
Let's be fair now
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Let's be fair now
Same contest
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No offense to Sergio because he was incredible for his time
but genetically did not have the clavicle width nor back width
to ever be as good as Ronnie. He may have been able to beat
Ronnie in the most muscular pose with todays chemicals though.
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great post!
its always nice to see smart people owning ND as usual.
I have made it quite the hobby of mine.
notice how ND is getting badly owned by all of us, and in response he posts some gut shots of ronnie relaxed in transition, or a 98 shot of him 30 miles away from hitting an arm pose.. ::)
the man is a desperate, pathetic idiot.
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"Whoever wins......WE LOSE".
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great post!
its always nice to see smart people owning ND as usual.
I have made it quite the hobby of mine.
notice how ND is getting badly owned by all of us, and in response he posts some gut shots of ronnie relaxed in transition, or a 98 shot of him 30 miles away from hitting an arm pose.. ::)
the man is a desperate, pathetic idiot.
You talk so much shit fan-boy I proved my point about Ronnie NOT having great balance & proportion in relation to Sergio and others ;) and this theory he has a tint waist LMFAO hence the many gut pics at just 247 pounds
Hulkster you still have NOT proven me wrong stop over using the word " owning " you've proven zero Ronnie has arms to big for his torso , a short torso to boot , calves lacking in relation to his quads and same with the forearms you can't counter this , try I dare you.
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No offense to Sergio because he was incredible for his time
but genetically did not have the clavicle width nor back width
to ever be as good as Ronnie. He may have been able to beat
Ronnie in the most muscular pose with todays chemicals though.
Sergio is incredible for ANY time and are you saying he's narrow? he would beat Ronnie in ANY pose with today's chemicals , Sergio has the structure , the balance & proportion and the size all he needed was the conditioning and he would beat just about anyone .
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They both won.. so why keep score?
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Ronnie on the chemicals Sergio took = zero Sergio on the chemicals Ronnie tool = unbeatable
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You talk so much shit fan-boy I proved my point about Ronnie NOT having great balance & proportion in relation to Sergio and others
what good is proving a point to yourself that no one else agrees with?
::)
you are just being naive that you think you are right.
everyone else thinks you are wrong. and can prove it quite easily.
just like they are owning you on this and many other threads involving Ronnie.
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Sergio had some of the finest genetics ever dished out to a human for the sport of bodybuilding , Ronnie is a collection of parts with no continuity or harmony , Sergio was 240 pounds with a 29" waist Ronnie was 247 pounds and looked pregnant , Sergio is a genetic masterpiece Ronnie is a genetic finger painting
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Ronnie is a collection of parts with no continuity or harmony
see, this is why you get owned so incredibly badly:
::)
you type this utter bullshit as if it is actually TRUE.
one quick glance at real life reveals how stupid and wrong you truly are:
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what good is proving a point to yourself that no one else agrees with?
::)
you are just being naive that you think you are right.
everyone else thinks you are wrong. and can prove it quite easily.
just like they are owning you on this and many other threads involving Ronnie.
I don't think I'm right I know I'm right ;) you can't prove me wrong its IMPOSSIBLE Ronnie does NOT have great balance & proportion period , you've tried in vain for 1500 pages to counter this and FAILED
Sergio's genetics shit all over Ronnie's anyone who knows a damn thing about bodybuilding knows this , this is privy information to the people who know , you're retarded you think Ronnie has great balance & proportion lol he needs calves to match his quads , he needs forearms that match his biceps/triceps , he needs glutes that don't show from the front , he needs a torso that matches the length of his arms , you can't counter this all you do is type and NO ONE has owned me on this no one
its funny most of the people on page one said Sergio but somehow I'm getting owned LMFAO great logic the moment someone agrees with your ignorance you automatcially think you're right , they're just as stupid as you are and I'm right and you have yet to counter me
Sergio has better muscle proportion & balance and overall symmetry period anyone who argues to the contrary is ignorant .
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both had the genetics. sergio maybe moreso due to the calves, waist and overall thickness. however ronnie got more diced, bigger, and generally in better shape than sergio. sergio looked better in some shots, as did ronnie. ronnie 1999 would most likely beat sergio from any point in time. thats just because they competed 30 years apart.
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see, this is why you get owned so incredibly badly:
::)
Again you've do NOTHING except prove my fucking point lol you're retarded your ' education ' was a waste of money ask for a refund post haste
the hands clasps picture shows exactly what I'm talking about biceps/triceps dominating his forearms , his ASS can be seen from the front , hey wow look his quads are dwarfing his calves never see that before ::) he still has a short torso , he's a collection of impressive parts
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you're retarded you think Ronnie has great balance & proportion lol he needs calves to match his quads , he needs forearms that match his biceps/triceps , he needs glutes that don't show from the front , he needs a torso that matches the length of his arms , you can't counter this all you do is type and NO ONE has owned me on this no one
like I said, look at shots of 99 ronnie or even 98 ronnie that I posted.
none of your bullshit is true.
you say all I do is type, when in reality I post pics that show your words to be bullshit.
just keep telling yourself all this ND.
it really doesn`t matter because no one is going to agree with you. LMAO.
just have fun being alone in your assertions. LOL
it is sad that you lack the knowledge about basic bodybuilding to be right, but not everyone is intelligent.
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both had the genetics. sergio maybe moreso due to the calves, waist and overall thickness. however ronnie got more diced, bigger, and generally in better shape than sergio. sergio looked better in some shots, as did ronnie. ronnie 1999 would most likely beat sergio from any point in time. thats just because they competed 30 years apart.
Sergio has better genetics period he's complete Ronnie isn't , he has better balance & proportion between all of his muscle groups , Sergio looks fantastic from all angles Ronnie doesn't
The only reason Ronnie has the edge on conditioning is plasma expanders and diurectics , Sergio with todays drugs would make Ronnie look redundant .
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LOL ND is just being owned by everyone.
this is great!
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like I said, look at shots of 99 ronnie or even 98 ronnie that I posted.
none of your bullshit is true.
you say all I do is type, when in reality I post pics that show your words to be bullshit.
just keep telling yourself all this ND.
no one is going to agree with you. LMAO.
Loser retort , you can't prove me wrong so your retort is LOOK at the pics I back up my critique with a thorough explanation , you say " no thats not true no one agrees with you "
BULL SHIT who is saying Ronnie has better balance & proportion? I don't see that and if they do I'll correct them too .....................nex t line of excuses.
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LOL ND is just being owned by everyone.
this is great!
You're not in my league ..................you know nothing. ;)
I hope this helps.
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Sergio has better genetics period he's complete Ronnie isn't , he has better balance & proportion between all of his muscle groups , Sergio looks fantastic from all angles Ronnie doesn't
not all angles. on the 1st or 2nd page, there is a pic of him hitting a most muscular where his quads disappear.
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I don't think I'm right I know I'm right ;) you can't prove me wrong its IMPOSSIBLE Ronnie does NOT have great balance & proportion period , you've tried in vain for 1500 pages to counter this and FAILED
Sergio's genetics shit all over Ronnie's anyone who knows a damn thing about bodybuilding knows this , this is privy information to the people who know , you're retarded you think Ronnie has great balance & proportion lol he needs calves to match his quads , he needs forearms that match his biceps/triceps , he needs glutes that don't show from the front , he needs a torso that matches the length of his arms , you can't counter this all you do is type and NO ONE has owned me on this no one
its funny most of the people on page one said Sergio but somehow I'm getting owned LMFAO great logic the moment someone agrees with your ignorance you automatcially think you're right , they're just as stupid as you are and I'm right and you have yet to counter me
Sergio has better muscle proportion & balance and overall symmetry period anyone who argues to the contrary is ignorant .
These are things that You, and you alone....perceive as major flaws on Coleman. He somehow managed to win 8 olympias with such terrible ::) genetics. And is universally regarded as the greatest BBer of all time. But i get it. We ALL don't know what we are talking about, only you do ;)
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These are things that You, and you alone....perceive as major flaws on Coleman. He somehow managed to win 8 olympias with such terrible ::) genetics. And is universally regarded as the greatest BBer of all time. But i get it. We ALL don't know what we are talking about, only you do ;)
He won for two reasons SIZE & CONDITION period and relative to his competition who had better balance & proportion Cormier easily why didn't he win? CONDITIONING with equal or superior condition & size Cormier would crush Ronnie , and I know that Ronnie's balance & proportion leaves a LOT to be desired if you think otherwise you're ignorant , I've explained exactly why he's lacking in this department I don't care if you agree or not it doesn't change the fact.
greatest bodybuilder of all time because he has the most Olympias and pro wins and some will argue to the contrary
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I'd rather look like sergio. To me, the small waist is everything...if you dont have it and it doesn't visually bring the whole package together its pointless.
Small waist or go home.
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I'd rather look like sergio. To me, the small waist is everything...if you dont have it and it doesn't visually bring the whole package together its pointless.
Small waist or go home.
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with equal or superior condition & size Cormier would crush Ronnie
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Again with the "IFS"....and IF Ronnie had a perfect six-pack and calves he would have been absolutely perfect, but guess what......It is what it is.
and I know that Ronnie's balance & proportion leaves a LOT to be desired if you think otherwise you're ignorant
I know he wasn't perfect. Guess what....none of them are, and that includes Dorian, Sergio, Flex etc.. The way you rip ronnie's proportions you would think he was Dave Palumbo....get real.
greatest bodybuilder of all time because he has the most Olympias and pro wins and some will argue to the contrary
The proof is in the pudding 'nuff said
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I know he wasn't perfect. Guess what....none of them are, and that includes Dorian, Sergio, Flex etc.. The way you rip ronnie's proportions you would think he was Dave Palumbo....get real.
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exactly. like I said, reality does not match up to ND's rants.
the man is an idiot.
at least we can all see that.
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These are things that You, and you alone....perceive as major flaws on Coleman. He somehow managed to win 8 olympias with such terrible ::) genetics. And is universally regarded as the greatest BBer of all time. But i get it. We ALL don't know what we are talking about, only you do ;)
great post!
ND is so clueless..
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Again with the "IFS"....and IF Ronnie had a perfect six-pack and calves he would have been absolutely perfect, but guess what......It is what it is.
I know he wasn't perfect. Guess what....none of them are, and that includes Dorian, Sergio, Flex etc.. The way you rip ronnie's proportions you would think he was Dave Palumbo....get real.
The proof is in the pudding 'nuff said
No no one is perfect HOWEVER some are clearly better than other and Sergio was one of them , he's among the top of the food chain when it comes to genetics , either you're born with a perfect structure or not Sergio was and its futile to argue otherwise , sure he had his flaws but he;s still leaps & bounds better than Ronnie in terms of symmetry
and wow 8 straight over ho-hum competition big deal look at his win/loss ratio
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exactly. like I said, reality does not match up to ND's rants.
the man is an idiot.
at least we can all see that.
I don't think he's an idiot at all, just blind for some reason when it comes to Ronnie
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exactly. like I said, reality does not match up to ND's rants.
the man is an idiot.
at least we can all see that.
Again you've accomplished NOTHING you haven't proven wrong you're just hell bent on slander now because thats all you have left lol
again you're not in my league come back when you can more than post pictures and scream ' see '
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I don't think he's an idiot at all, just blind for some reason when it comes to Ronnie
hence, he is an idiot when in comes to physique evaluations.
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I don't think he's an idiot at all, just blind for some reason when it comes to Ronnie
Blind ? NO that would be his fans lol they seem to see great balance & proportion where there is none , Ronnie is real impressive but he's lacking in this department its simply not debateable .
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No no one is perfect HOWEVER some are clearly better than other and Sergio was one of them , he's among the top of the food chain when it comes to genetics , either you're born with a perfect structure or not Sergio was and its futile to argue otherwise , sure he had his flaws but he;s still leaps & bounds better than Ronnie in terms of symmetry
and wow 8 straight over ho-hum competition big deal look at his win/loss ratio
Sergio's structure was far from perfect. Kinda narrow and downright weird arms
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Blind ? NO that would be his fans lol they seem to see great balance & proportion where there is none , Ronnie is real impressive but he's lacking in this department its simply not debateable .
Your'e not Irish by any chance are you?
It would explain a lot ;D
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hence, he is an idiot when in comes to physique evaluations.
Again you type empty words , prove me wrong lol show me these fantastic diamond shape calves that are perfect proportion in relation to his quads , show me these glutes that don't stick way out and CAN'T be seen from the front , show me these Lee Priest forearms that blend so well with his massive biceps/triceps , show me this arms that aren't to long for his torso , show me me the physique without long legs and a short torso
YOU-fucking-CAN'T lol
its OKAY Hulkster Ronnie still looks great despite these flaws but lets not pretend he's Chris Cormier in structure & symmetry with Padilla type balance & proportion because he's not.
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Sergio's structure was far from perfect. Kinda narrow and downright weird arms
Narrow my ass lol and the shape of his biceps is weird by as far as clavicle width and naturally small waist & hips , super tiny joints , great quad sweep and balance & proportion he's almost without equal .
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He was off by his standards and his competitors as well .
Top 10 in the world is never a bad thing!
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its OKAY Hulkster Ronnie still looks great despite these flaws but lets not pretend he's Chris Cormier in structure & symmetry with Padilla type balance & proportion because he's not.
And by the same token let's not make HIM out to be Hieko Keillbach and EVERYBODY ELSE is Bob Paris.
You said it yourself....Ronnie won on Size and condition. Same reason Dorian won
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sergio just had long, low insertions. like shawn ray or kevin levrone. the detail wasnt there for the most part, though. but that comes with being 30 years prior to those guys
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Sergio's structure was far from perfect. Kinda narrow and downright weird arms
Narrow was the least of Sergio's problems. In fact many consider him the widest bodybuilder they have ever seen, including Serge Nubret himself. Sergio's proportions are ideal. He is what bodybuilding should be. Only thing you could critisize him on is his conditioning and even that is debatable.
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sergio didnt have wide clavicles, but his long arms made him look very wide in front and back double bis.
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Here is a pic of Sergio in his prime.
He's not gaspari narrow, but he sure isn't Paul Dillet either
(http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=180441.0;attach=211197;image)
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And by the same token let's not make HIM out to be Hieko Keillbach and EVERYBODY ELSE is Bob Paris.
haha I love it.
ND owned badly!
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like I said, it is really not fair to compare two great champions 30 years apart.
as I said in the my first post:
many of the reasons that Sergio was so far ahead of his time are the SAME reasons (despite what "I'm alone in my assertions" ND says ::)) that Ronnie is considered to be the best ever (when in shape).
wide lats, narrow waist, amazing full muscle bellies.
thats Ronnie.
thats Sergio.
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like I said, it is really not fair to compare two great champions 30 years apart.
as I said in the my first post:
many of the reasons that Sergio was so far ahead of his time are the SAME reasons (despite what "I'm alone in my assertions" ND says ::)) that Ronnie is considered to be the best ever (when in shape).
wide lats, narrow waist, amazing full muscle bellies.
thats Ronnie.
thats Sergio.
Yeah but Hulkster look at the horrible proportions on him
What an abomination, it's a wonder he even got his pro card ::)
(http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=180441.0;attach=211335;image)
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Yeah but Hulkster look at the horrible proportions on him
What an abomination, it's a wonder he even got his pro card ::)
(http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=180441.0;attach=211335;image)
like I said, ND is not exactly that great when it comes to physique evaluations.. :-\
the whole board knows this by now.
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ND doesn't know what the hell he's talking about.
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In 1985, Sergio looked very, very well! Photographic evidence below...
REVIEW OF THE CONTEST:
http://www.bodybuildingpro.com/mrolympiareport1985.html
This dude puts so much into this site . . . it is one of the most comprehensive out there.
Impressive.
The Beef
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sergio might have had more upperbody mass than coleman at their peaks. it would be really close.
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Here is a pic of Sergio in his prime.
He's not gaspari narrow, but he sure isn't Paul Dillet either
(http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=180441.0;attach=211197;image)
Thats not his prime , his prime is when he was working with Arthur Jones early to mid 70s
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haha I love it.
ND owned badly!
Don't break your arm patting yourself on the back , you've accomplished NOTHING you post a picture where Sergio is no where near his prime and you think you've done something , seriously stop beating the ' ND owned badly " nonsense you fear Sergio at his best for a reason ;)
by the same token
Hulkster self-owned badly
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like I said, ND is not exactly that great when it comes to physique evaluations.. :-\
the whole board knows this by now.
Stop speaking for ' the board ' and you're the retard who said Dorian Yates lost the 1993 Mr Olympia , and Ronnie dominated Jay in 2001 by losing the whole prejudging , I may not know everything but I sure know a hell of a lot more than you
again same problems with Ronnie as before you'll never escape that , Sergio doesn't have the flaws Ronnie does its a fact get over it.
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Fuck, Ronnie is dwarfed there :o
Sergio all day, every day hahaha....I love it when Hulkster gets owned :-*
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Yeah but Hulkster look at the horrible proportions on him
What an abomination, it's a wonder he even got his pro card ::)
(http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=180441.0;attach=211335;image)
Compared to Sergio his balance & proportion is lacking
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like I said, it is really not fair to compare two great champions 30 years apart.
as I said in the my first post:
many of the reasons that Sergio was so far ahead of his time are the SAME reasons (despite what "I'm alone in my assertions" ND says ::)) that Ronnie is considered to be the best ever (when in shape).
wide lats, narrow waist, amazing full muscle bellies.
thats Ronnie.
thats Sergio.
I love how you now have to amend your critique to ' narrow ' waist lol and why? because I shut your dumb ass up on it being tiny 1999 Ronnie was pregnant , hey wait he had a protruding gut in 1998 , and 2000 , and 2001 , 2002 , 2003 , 2004 you get the point
and Hulkster where is Ronnie's amazing full muscle bellies in his calves? in his forearms? oh wait he doesn't have them he also doesn't have Sergio's deep ribcage or muscular balance & proportion , you always try so hard to be correct and you type such bullshit and always get corrected by ME
So now you have to stop typing he has a tiny waist , why? because I shut you up with numerous pics of Ronnie looking pregnant you'll never find that of Sergio , you have to stop typing Ronnie has ' amazing full muscle bellies ' because his calves are anything but full ( they're full of something though lol ) and amazing they're oddly shaped and high , the same with his forearms they look like bowling pins , again NOT full or amazing , wow and you're questioning other people's physique analysis abilities what do you know? NOTHING
owned lol amazing full muscle bellies what a fucking tool .
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awesome how sergio built that physique just with basic drugs.
sergio over ronnie anytime.
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Stop speaking for ' the board ' and you're the retard who said Dorian Yates lost the 1993 Mr Olympia , and Ronnie dominated Jay in 2001 by losing the whole prejudging , I may not know everything but I sure know a hell of a lot more than you
again same problems with Ronnie as before you'll never escape that , Sergio doesn't have the flaws Ronnie does its a fact get over it.
are you bias or what? from what i understand, u and hulkster agreed that ronnie's best is 1999.... not 1995. and sergio's pic is also larger than ronnie's, making sergio appear bigger. boy u should work for flexonline.com. im happy there are people like me who see these tactics and can point them out to others who may think that ronnie is worse than sergio because of an unfair comparison by a guy who hates big ron.
if u dont think ronnie has a deep ribcage, u must be hard of seeing.
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Ronnie vs. anyone = Ronnie wins.
WRONG
Ronnie (with massive drugs) vs Sergio = Ronnie wins
Ronnie vs Sergio = Ronnie owned!!
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you can see in the 95 ( ::)) shot that ND posted how much better Ronnie became.
his frame looked fucked up with not as much muscle.
a few years later, he was a different physique entirely.
and went from placing out of the top 15 at the olympia to winning 8 of them..
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sorry. but this thread does nothing but expose how bad ND is at evaluating physiques.
its not really fair to compare Ronnie and Sergio.
Ronnie annihilates him, and has he should. he is a champion compared to the best 30 years ago...
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Thats not his prime , his prime is when he was working with Arthur Jones early to mid 70s
Bingo!
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sergio just had long, low insertions. like shawn ray or kevin levrone. the detail wasnt there for the most part, though. but that comes with being 30 years prior to those guys
It wasn't just that, he had problems dieting and getting cut even in relation to some guys back then. His best shape was with Jones for a short time, essentially with someone else cracking the whip.
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These are the best shots of Sergo I have ever seen... :o
(http://www.bodybuilding-pics.com/167/images/Sergio_Oliva_201.jpg)
(http://www.bodybuilding-pics.com/167/images/Sergio_Oliva_199.jpg)
(http://www.bodybuilding-pics.com/167/images/Sergio_Oliva_133.jpg)
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(http://cache.viewimages.com/xc/3051782.jpg?v=1&c=ViewImages&k=2&d=17A4AD9FDB9CF193B3EA2C03450C9486037E40EF25186C6C5A5397277B4DC33E)
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ND doesn't know what the hell he's talking about.
Precisely what's seen on the truce thread over and over again. Funny stuff akin to the ramblings of a mental patient, since he lives for the attention.
Letting him ramble on is priceless.
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Only thing you could critisize him on is his conditioning and even that is debatable.
Most of the time he lacked detail, especially for example on arms. He's rarely if ever mentioned on short lists of the best all-time arms for this reason, despite their size.
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Sergio destroys Ronnie, Sergio has a waist 8'' smaller than Ronnie, bigger arms and chest and real calves....no sythonal
Oliva had a better structure & balance, but didn't have the detail most of the time so it's not as clear-cut as you're saying there are pros and cons. Even at his best, his arms had nowhere near Coleman's detai, striations or peak in fact he had no detail in his bis at all.
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These are the best shots of Sergo I have ever seen... :o
Very smooth in those shots and in fact smooth in the majority of shots available online. In the 70s he wasn't around good physique photographers in general, and thus most of the pics available online aren't good representations of his best condition. Too many of them are from the mid-80s or earlier in his career.
The best ones available were taken around but not on the day of the '72 Olympia, his condition after training with Jones. He didn't peak the day of the contest.
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sergio might have had more upperbody mass than coleman at their peaks. it would be really close.
Completely the opposite of reality. In the 70s this shot of Oliva was the definition of massiveness, i didn't think anyone could exceed it. Yet here we see Coleman actually making Sergio look slim in comparison. :o
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Most of the time he lacked detail, especially for example on arms. He's rarely if ever mentioned on short lists of the best all-time arms for this reason, despite their size.
lol just check out the flex issue with the 20 best arms.. he is in it. Heck he could be in any "the best of" parts!
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are you bias or what? from what i understand, u and hulkster agreed that ronnie's best is 1999.... not 1995. and sergio's pic is also larger than ronnie's, making sergio appear bigger. boy u should work for flexonline.com. im happy there are people like me who see these tactics and can point them out to others who may think that ronnie is worse than sergio because of an unfair comparison by a guy who hates big ron.
if u dont think ronnie has a deep ribcage, u must be hard of seeing.
Wow you're not to bright I was doing that was response to Hulkster posting pictures of Sergio obviously NOT at his best , which is why I posted that ' comparison ' and 1999 is NOT Ronnie's best sorry he looked better 2001 ASC and Ronnie doesn't have a deep rib cage thats obvious in his side chest shot do you need anything else corrected?
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you can see in the 95 ( ::)) shot that ND posted how much better Ronnie became.
his frame looked fucked up with not as much muscle.
a few years later, he was a different physique entirely.
and went from placing out of the top 15 at the olympia to winning 8 of them..
Hypocrite ( nothing new ) you posted pics of Sergio at 226 pounds NOT his best so that was a Hulkster-type response showing your bias and stupidity thanks for partiscipating , jackass .
Sergio was NOT his best in 67-69 Auther Jones years Sergio was outstanding.
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sorry. but this thread does nothing but expose how bad ND is at evaluating physiques.
its not really fair to compare Ronnie and Sergio.
Ronnie annihilates him, and has he should. he is a champion compared to the best 30 years ago...
Again stop projecting your stupidity on me , you're the fucking moron who types how Ronnie & Sergio both have amazing full muscle bellies lmfao this show your ignorance , how does one have full muscle bellies when Ronnie has high short calves , and bowling pin shaped forearms? let me answer they can't period , Sergio's structure kills Ronnie you can't counter this .
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It wasn't just that, he had problems dieting and getting cut even in relation to some guys back then. His best shape was with Jones for a short time, essentially with someone else cracking the whip.
He was still great even post Jones years when he was competining in the WBBG or whatever that was , he was never as sharp as Arnold or Zane , we're talking strictly struture , balance & proportion.
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Oliva had a better structure & balance, but didn't have the detail most of the time so it's not as clear-cut as you're saying there are pros and cons. Even at his best, his arms had nowhere near Coleman's detai, striations or peak in fact he had no detail in his bis at all.
You're a fucking idiot for many reasons lol but this one specifically because you just typed I don't know what I'm talking about then fucking agree with me that Sergio has a better structure and balance , at least you can admit the obvious
and were not talking about conditioning , we're talking about balance & proportion , and natural structure , pay attention.
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sorry. but this thread does nothing but expose how bad ND is at evaluating physiques.
its not really fair to compare Ronnie and Sergio.
Ronnie annihilates him, and has he should. he is a champion compared to the best 30 years ago...
Again talking out of your ass " Annihilates " him in what? Size no one is arguing size , or condition ( God you people can't pay attention ) Ronnie does NOT I repeat does not beat Sergio in natrual born structue and proportion 30 years has NOTHING to do with this , either you're born like Sergio or not and Ronnie was NOT you can't train for that sorry idiot , wrong again
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These are the best shots of Sergo I have ever seen... :o
(http://www.bodybuilding-pics.com/167/images/Sergio_Oliva_201.jpg)
(http://www.bodybuilding-pics.com/167/images/Sergio_Oliva_199.jpg)
(http://www.bodybuilding-pics.com/167/images/Sergio_Oliva_133.jpg)
Th front double biceps shows crystal clear how much better Sergio's structure was to Ronnie's full diamond shaped calves in perfect proportion with his huge flaring quads , narrow waist & hips and a FLAT abdomen , small joints perfect torso length in relation to his lower body , FULL low insertions on his forearms in proportion with his biceps triceps , wide clavicles , Ronnie doesn't compare to this anyone who thinks he's comparable or better is ignorant period.
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in a modern bodybuilding contest, Ronald would destroy him.
but realistically sergio 'looked' better.
if sergio were competing today he would be unstoppable, better even that ronald was.
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Again talking out of your ass " Annihilates " him in what? Size no one is arguing size , or condition ( God you people can't pay attention ) Ronnie does NOT I repeat does not beat Sergio in natrual born structue and proportion 30 years has NOTHING to do with this , either you're born like Sergio or not and Ronnie was NOT you can't train for that sorry idiot , wrong again
The name of the thread is "Sergio vs Ronnie - WHO WINS??" not "Who had better natural born structure"
And as far as THAT question goes, The edge goes to Sergio, by a very narrow margin, which is more than made up for by Ronnie's god-given muscular detail. All the steroids in the world don't create that look, just ask Jay :P
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The name of the thread is "Sergio vs Ronnie - WHO WINS??" not "Who had better natural born structure"
And as far as THAT question goes, The edge goes to Sergio, by a very narrow margin, which is more than made up for by Ronnie's god-given muscular detail. All the steroids in the world don't create that look, just ask Jay :P
What if someone asked the question.
Who would you rather look like?
Would everyone who picked Ronnie still say him in regards to that question?
I'd rather look like The Myth myself, but that's just me.
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What if someone asked the question.
Who would you rather look like?
Would everyone who picked Ronnie still say him in regards to that question?
I'd rather look like The Myth myself, but that's just me.
I don't want to look like either one of them. I'm a good looking white person, fuck that. And I'm quite happy with my genetics, although I wouldn't cry if i woke up one day with a 30 inch waist and Arnold's pecs ;D
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I don't want to look like either one of them. I'm a good looking white person, fuck that. And I'm quite happy with my genetics, although I wouldn't cry if i woke up one day with a 30 inch waist and Arnold's pecs ;D
Haha!!!
I heard that...
Personally, I'd like to have the structure of Mr. Oliva there, but I don't hate on the way I look myself. I just don't look like THAT.
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The name of the thread is "Sergio vs Ronnie - WHO WINS??" not "Who had better natural born structure"
And as far as THAT question goes, The edge goes to Sergio, by a very narrow margin, which is more than made up for by Ronnie's god-given muscular detail. All the steroids in the world don't create that look, just ask Jay :P
The topic arose and Hulkster ( as usual ) was corrected I wasn't arguing about conditioning or size just the base , Sergio with his base born in 1970 using the same products of Ronnie would crush everyone Ronnie included , lets see how great Ronnie would look popping a few Dianabols a day now where near impressive.
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Sergio is vastly genetically superior to Ronnie. This is not even debatable. Ronnie has:
- Relatively high lats.
- High calves.
- A lower body that is longer than the upper body - the opposite of Shawn Ray, who has short thighs and a long torso.
- High outer triceps head.
- Far less dramatic clavicle width to hip width than Sergio.
- Bigger joints than Sergio, giving a far less dramatic impression of size.
Not to say that Ronnie is not genetically gifted. He is. But he can't hold a candle to The Myth in the genetics department. The only thing that Ronnie trumps Sergio at is sheer mass and vascularity, which is something that all bodybuilders from the 1990s and beyond defeat Sergio at. Basically, any guy can be bigger than Sergio with the amount of drugs bodybuilders take nowadays.
SUCKMYMUSCLE
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Sergio is vastly genetically superior to Ronnie. This is not even debatable. Ronnie has:
- Relatively high lats.
- High calves.
- A lower body that is longer than the upper body - the opposite of Shawn Ray, who has short thighs and a long torso.
- High outer triceps head.
- Far less dramatic clavicle width to hip width than Sergio.
- Bigger joints than Sergio, giving a far less dramatic impression of size.
Not to say that Ronnie is not genetically gifted. He is. But he can't hold a candle to The Myth in the genetics department. The only thing that Ronnie trumps Sergio at is sheer mass and vascularity, which is something that all bodybuilders from the 1990s and beyond defeat Sergio at. Basically, any guy can be bigger than Sergio with the amount of drugs bodybuilders take nowadays.
SUCKMYMUSCLE
Great post ! as usual hey Hulkster ever notice how the smater guys usually come to the same conclusions? lol
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Great post ! as usual hey Hulkster ever notice how the smater guys usually come to the same conclusions? lol
sorry ND...I had to point it out....
genetically I think Sergio is probably the best alltime but some people can't take into account different era's when they speak about these things, sergio in his prime was competing in the early 70's so think about the advantages Ronnie has in terms of almost everything aside from genetics...drugs, diet, higer standards for conditioning etc.
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sorry ND...I had to point it out....
genetically I think Sergio is probably the best alltime but some people can't take into account different era's when they speak about these things, sergio in his prime was competing in the early 70's so think about the advantages Ronnie has in terms of almost everything aside from genetics...drugs, diet, higer standards for conditioning etc.
No problem thats what happens when I type to quick lol and Hulkster another who knows Sergio's genetics are unmatched .
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Wow you're not to bright I was doing that was response to Hulkster posting pictures of Sergio obviously NOT at his best , which is why I posted that ' comparison ' and 1999 is NOT Ronnie's best sorry he looked better 2001 ASC and Ronnie doesn't have a deep rib cage thats obvious in his side chest shot do you need anything else corrected?
my bad... as far as side chest goes, ronnie doesnt thrust out his chest and expand his ribcage like in the old days. he does a more twisting shot to flex the intercostals and serratus, as alot of pros do now. not a good representation of his ribcage height or depth at all. here's a better shot:
http://www.muscletime.com/photos/v/professional-bodybuilding/arnold-classic-contest/2001-arnold-classic/2001-arnold-classic-onstage/2001-arnold-classic-81.jpg.html
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ND doesn't know what the hell he's talking about.
the whole board knows this!
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Sergio destroys Ronnie, Sergio has a waist 8'' smaller than Ronnie, bigger arms and chest and real calves....no sythonal
bigger arms and chest?
I doubt that.
Ronnie was 257 at his best. Segio was what? 235?
and no evidence of synthol has ever been shown in Ronnie's calves - people look at a pic and cry synthol, without having the brains to compare calves with his calves at the beginning of his career. they have have always looked the same, although obviously a slight size increase as he gained 50 pounds of muscle.
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ps ronnie's side chest, along with basically every other pose, blows sergio away.
and as it should, there is a 30 year difference.
I can't believe the dorian nuthuggers from the truce thread (ND, Suckmyasshole etc) are here in full force arguing otherwise ::).
just goes to show you how little they know about judging and bodybuilding in general, just as we can see in the completely stupid truce thread, where dorian has been getting killed for 1500 pages now.. :-\
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the whole board knows this!
LMFAO not quite kid even your boy pumpster admits the obvious , Sergio's structures KILLS Ronnie go back and read all the pro-Sergio comments , like all your other critiques this one is ignorant.
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ps ronnie's side chest, along with basically every other pose, blows sergio away.
and as it should, there is a 30 year difference.
I can't believe the dorian nuthuggers from the truce thread (ND, Suckmyasshole etc) are here in full force arguing otherwise ::).
just goes to show you how little they know about judging and bodybuilding in general, just as we can see in the completely stupid truce thread, where dorian has been getting killed for 1500 pages now.. :-\
You're so pathetic lol NO ONE with any intelligence agrees with you even pumpster abandoned ship lol and stop trying to bad mouth me at every turn and prove me wrong ...............I'm waiting and NOT for excuses .
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Sergio is vastly genetically superior to Ronnie. This is not even debatable. Ronnie has:
- Relatively high lats.
- High calves.
- A lower body that is longer than the upper body - the opposite of Shawn Ray, who has short thighs and a long torso.
- High outer triceps head.
- Far less dramatic clavicle width to hip width than Sergio.
- Bigger joints than Sergio, giving a far less dramatic impression of size.
Not to say that Ronnie is not genetically gifted. He is. But he can't hold a candle to The Myth in the genetics department. The only thing that Ronnie trumps Sergio at is sheer mass and vascularity, which is something that all bodybuilders from the 1990s and beyond defeat Sergio at. Basically, any guy can be bigger than Sergio with the amount of drugs bodybuilders take nowadays.
SUCKMYMUSCLE
your list of 'flaws' in Ronnie in no way shape or form prevent him from totally owning sergio.
thats why ND got owned so bad earlier, and you are just as bad:
all of these "flaws" do not hold up to reality in that Ronnie 99 has mandatory poses that are all out of this world.
if these flaws were so true, his mandatories would SUCK.
but they don't.
they are AMAZING:
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LMFAO not quite kid even your boy pumpster admits the obvious , Sergio's structures KILLS Ronnie go back and read all the pro-Sergio comments , like all your other critiques this one is ignorant.
you are missing the whole point as usual.. ::)
just because Sergio has a better structure, does NOT mean he would win, or could win for that matter.
simply because:
1. Ronnie at his best had a pretty damn small waist too, esp compared to his lat width
and
2. just as when Arnold got into great shape and beat Sergio, Ronnie would do the same.
why?
because all the genetic gifts in the world won't help you if you have muscularity, detail and vascularity that do not hold up.
eg. compare sergio's arm shape (tris and bis) to ronnie's is sad.
genetic 'structure' only gets you so far in contest. there is TONS more characteristics and qualities that the judges consider.
the fact that you do not know this is not surprising because you know so little about judging.
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your list of 'flaws' in Ronnie in no way shape or form prevent him from totally owning sergio.
thats why ND got owned so bad earlier, and you are just as bad:
all of these "flaws" do not hold up to reality in that Ronnie 99 has mandatory poses that are all out of this world.
if these flaws were so true, his mandatories would SUCK.
but they don't.
they are AMAZING:
I've yet to get OWNED by anyone including you , you have NOT proven me wrong because you can't , you see what you want to see in pics , all the flaws I said he has are present in every single mandatory poses from every single angle keep running lol because you can't escape it . ;)
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you are missing the whole point as usual.. ::)
just because Sergio has a better structure, does NOT mean he would win, or could win for that matter.
simply because:
1. Ronnie at his best had a pretty damn small waist too, esp compared to his lat width
and
2. just as when Arnold got into great shape and beat Sergio, Ronnie would do the same.
why?
because all the genetic gifts in the world won't help you if you have muscularity, detail and vascularity that do not hold up.
eg. compare sergio's arm shape (tris and bis) to ronnie's is sad.
genetic 'structure' only gets you so far in contest. there is TONS more characteristics and qualities that the judges consider.
the fact that you do not know this is not surprising because you know so little about judging.
See this is when you know you're completely and utterly owned when you're force to amend your statement and change the topic lmfao you're so screwed you're trying to argue points I NEVER commented on and again don't question my comprehension of the judging criteria because you never even seen it never mind understood it until I posted it and you still don't get it I proved my point that Sergio has a better structure and balance & proportion than Ronnie no one agrees with you except the ignorant even your comrade said the obvious , so once again you don't know jack ! ;)
Now I'll comment on what you now claim is your argument , Sergio 1972 VS Ronnie 1999 , Ronnie wins hands down no questions about it , however MORON I said if all things were equal and Sergio was born in 1970 he would CRUSH Ronnie , Ronnie would have NO advantages on Sergio if he was using the gear of today and understood the diets and drugs of today , man you look stupid just like the truce thread. ;)
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Now I'll comment on what you now claim is your argument , Sergio 1972 VS Ronnie 1999 , Ronnie wins hands down no questions about it , however MORON I said if all things were equal and Sergio was born in 1970 he would CRUSH Ronnie , Ronnie would have NO advantages on Sergio if he was using the gear of today and understood the diets and drugs of today , man you look stupid just like the truce thread. ;)
This simply is not de facto truth.
Take Chris Cormier for example. He had structure, proportion, and balance far superior to Coleman yet was still blown away by Ronnie, not even close. To this date, the only man capable of being Coleman was Yates, period.
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This simply is not de facto truth.
Take Chris Cormier for example. He had structure, proportion, and balance far superior to Coleman yet was still blown away by Ronnie, not even close. To this date, the only man capable of being Coleman was Yates, period.
The only thing Chris was lacking was conditioning if he had that Yates himself said he would beat Ronnie because Ronnie would enjoy NO advantages in size , structure , balance & proportion and if he had the conditioning so Chris would relegate Ronnie two #2 but Yates did have all those hence why he dominated .
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lmao now chris could beat Ronnie with a bit more conditioning?
::)
he need a BACK first folks...not to mention better arms, chest, etc.
he had better abs. thats about it. oh, and calves too, but who doesn't.
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what the fuck are you guys smoking anyway?
::)
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you guys must be on crack.. ::)
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lmao now chris could beat Ronnie with a bit more conditioning?
::)
he need a BACK first folks...not to mention better arms, chest, etc.
he had better abs. thats about it. oh, and calves too, but who doesn't.
Chris would beat Ronnie with size & conditioning being equal NO ifs and or buts about it.
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what the fuck are you guys smoking anyway?
::)
The standing relaxed Chris is just utterly destroying Ronnie I mean its night & day .
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Sergio in 1985 looked VERY good and at age 44 to boot! He may not have been at his best, but he placed eighth in a very competitive lineup and at a relatively advanced age!
http://www.bodybuildingpro.com/mrolympiareport1985.html
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coleman had a tiny waist? where? inside his other abnormally large one?
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coleman had a tiny waist? where? inside his other abnormally large small one?
Fixed.
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your list of 'flaws' in Ronnie in no way shape or form prevent him from totally owning sergio.
thats why ND got owned so bad earlier, and you are just as bad:
all of these "flaws" do not hold up to reality in that Ronnie 99 has mandatory poses that are all out of this world.
if these flaws were so true, his mandatories would SUCK.
but they don't.
they are AMAZING:
Since this post was directed at me, I will reply to it. Hulkster, no one is arguing that Ronnie didn't look superb in most mandatory poses; after all, he did win the Olympia eight times and you don't do that without winning the majority of the mandatories. Obviously, despite his flaws Ronnie had less flaws overral than his competitors otherwise he wouldn't have beaten them.
However, my point is that Ronnie had more flaws than The Myth, and if they were to compete at their bests, it would be a liability to Ronnie.
Like I said, the only thing Coleman has on Sergio is sheer mass, and Oliva would easily defeat Ronnie at everything else. But having mass on Oliva means nothing, because pactically all bodybuilders of the last 20 years have more mass than Oliva ever had.
SUCKMYMSUCLE
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The standing relaxed Chris is just utterly destroying Ronnie I mean its night & day .
just like your opinion compared the rest of the planet is like Night and Day... ::)
keep telling yourself that you are right ND.
we will all continue to own you.
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just like your opinion compared the rest of the planet is like Night and Day... ::)
keep telling yourself that you are right ND.
we will all continue to own you.
LMFAO No one agree with you stop speaking for the masses that aren't backing you lol even your homo pumpster knows Ronnie is behind Sergio its old news except to the delusional , Cormier is like a black Bob Paris and his aesthetics & balance are just purely superior
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LMFAO No one agree with you stop speaking for the masses that aren't backing you lol even your homo pumpster knows Ronnie is behind Sergio its old news except to the delusional , Cormier is like a black Bob Paris and his aesthetics & balance are just purely superior
Sergio looked very good in 1985!!
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Sergio looked very good in 1985!!
He looked good , very good NO
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Chris would beat Ronnie with size & conditioning being equal NO ifs and or buts about it.
and shawn ray would beat dorian if he had his size.... what is the point of writing this shit ::)
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and shawn ray would beat dorian if he had his size.... what is the point of writing this shit ::)
LOL tell me about it.
yet more words of wisdom from ND.. ::)
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and shawn ray would beat dorian if he had his size.... what is the point of writing this shit ::)
Keep telling yourself that ! he'd still be narrow , he'd still be unbalanced , he'd still have a long torso and short legs and high calves .
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LOL tell me about it.
yet more words of wisdom from ND.. ::)
I love how you can't counter what I'm saying so you just wait for another ignorant person to agree with you lol it's funny
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yes, ND we get it.
the entire bb community is ignorant except you... ::)
in case you haven't noticed: almost everyone feels peak Ronnie is better than dorian, shawn ray should have won in 94, and that if shawn had dorian's size he would have been a multi time Mr. O winner..negating Yates to second or third at best.
but we are all wrong and only you are 'right'. we know.. ::)
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yes, ND we get it.
the entire bb community is ignorant except you... ::)
in case you haven't noticed: almost everyone feels peak Ronnie is better than dorian, shawn ray should have won in 94, and that if shawn had dorian's size he would have been a multi time Mr. O winner..negating Yates to second or third at best.
but we are all wrong and only you are 'right'. we know.. ::)
Again stop speaking for the ' entire bodybuilding community " it look silly when you do so and as far as how contests are judged 90% of the people I've seen post on bodybuilding boards are ignorant absolutely and you've established your ignorance LONG ago and continue to do so
See argument ad poplulum for the majority opinion NOT making it correct ;)
Shawn Ray HIMSELF said he got the place he deserved in 1994 ;) ( man you look stupid right now ) lol
And if Shawn had Dorian's size he'd look really stupid because he's only 5'7" his structure was maxed out with just 205 pounds never mind 260 , he his balance & proportion would even be worse , he's still have a long torso and short legs , high calves and no clavicle width , see above you look fucking stupid again , showing your complete ignorance about physique evaluation and common sense
anything else?
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ND, if you paid any attention at all you would realize that when I say the entire bb community, it is pretty damn close.
spend some time on the net at this and other boards, or read some magazines.
you will see that your assertions are by far the bizarro minority, because you don't know how to evaluate a physique properly.
your never ending comments on ronnie's supposedly major flaws that no one else can see are just one example.
you have been getting owned badly lately on many threads at once..
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See argument ad poplulum for the majority opinion NOT making it correct
you are not evaluating physiques properly.
the rest of the bodybuilding community, including pros, net fans, writers etc. ARE.
especially when it comes to evaluating a peak Ronnie Coleman.
that makes you incorrect.
period.
-
ND, if you paid any attention at all you would realize that when I say the entire bb community, it is pretty damn close.
spend some time on the net at this and other boards, or read some magazines.
you will see that your assertions are by far the bizarro minority.
Again stop speaking for the ' entire bodybuilding community ' you look silly doing so and it doesn't matter what the masses think Shawn Ray himself said he got the placing he deserved in 1994 this silences you and all the other idiots who think other wise if you knew the first thing about bodybuilding you'd know exactly why he lost and here's the kicker Shawn Ray was trailing behind Levrone after the pre-judging and he only beat him on th posing rounds lol you know what that means Mr Ignorant? he was NEVER ever close to beating Dorian he was lucky to beat Levrone and the crowd in attendance ( the bodybuilding community ) Booed when Shawn was placed ahead of Kevin lol wow so much for what you and the rest of the idiots know .
and Oh I haven't just spent some time on the boards and on the net , I was following bodybuilding when there was NO internet lol the first time I touched a weight was 1986 chances are you weren't even born , I've read most of the books on the subject of professional bodybuilding and have most the the magazines from 1986 ON and some from well before I'm very well read on the subject and I may not know everything but I sure as fuck know more than you and most people I see on these boards
anything else you need corrected? ;)
-
you are not evaluating physiques properly.
the rest of the bodybuilding community, including pros, net fans, writers etc. ARE.
especially when it comes to evaluating a peak Ronnie Coleman.
that makes you incorrect.
period.
Hulkster I've never once see ANY quote from anyone that says Ronnie has better balance & proportion than Dorian , so thats a LIE I've posted numerous quotes saying Yates has when specifically compared to Ronnie which verifies my claim and crushes yours
again who is contradicting my claim Ronnie's calves suck? NO ONE lol or they lack proportion in relation to his quads
I mean Ronnie weighed just 247 pounds in 1998 is anyone contradicting that claim too? lol and I wrong there ? is it wrong to say Dorian has a advantage in muscular bulk when he's an inch shorter and weighs 13 more pounds? who proved me wrong on that?
You claimed Ronnie has a better side chest shot than Dorian , Ronnie himself said Dorian had the best side chest shot he ever seen , I'll take it from the horses mouth NOT yours
Ronnie said Dorian had the thickest & freakiest back he ever seen , you're arguing with him? see a pattern here? this makes you incorrect
Ronnie said his best Olympia apperance was 1998 because his conditioning was spot on and this is verified by Peter McGough , again how is this proving me wrong? its NOT
Hulkster you're not in my league I could go on and on but the point is made.
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So according to ND Frank Zane and Dorian are better balanced that Shawn? ???
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Hulkster I've never once see ANY quote from anyone that says Ronnie has better balance & proportion than Dorian , so thats a LIE I've posted numerous quotes saying Yates has when specifically compared to Ronnie which verifies my claim and crushes yours
again who is contradicting my claim Ronnie's calves suck? NO ONE lol or they lack proportion in relation to his quads
I mean Ronnie weighed just 247 pounds in 1998 is anyone contradicting that claim too? lol and I wrong there ? is it wrong to say Dorian has a advantage in muscular bulk when he's an inch shorter and weighs 13 more pounds? who proved me wrong on that?
You claimed Ronnie has a better side chest shot than Dorian , Ronnie himself said Dorian had the best side chest shot he ever seen , I'll take it from the horses mouth NOT yours
Ronnie said Dorian had the thickest & freakiest back he ever seen , you're arguing with him? see a pattern here? this makes you incorrect
Ronnie said his best Olympia apperance was 1998 because his conditioning was spot on and this is verified by Peter McGough , again how is this proving me wrong? its NOT
Hulkster you're not in my league I could go on and on but the point is made.
honestly, you must be the dumbest poster on this board.
:-\
you miss the whole point entirely.
as usual.
your argument seems to be that because dorian has better balance and proportion, that he would win.
problem is, the muscular shape, detail and vascularity that Ronnie has causes him to win almost all the mandatory poses.
so the SLIGHT difference in balance/proportion don't help him at all.
for example, what good are dorian's advantages in balance and proportion in these comparisons of two mandatories below?
answer: NOTHING, for the reasons I listed above.
your argument is based on a flawed premise - that the slight advantage that dorian may have in balance/proportion (which is DEBATABLE because even nin 93 his arms are undersized for his frame - check any most muscular pose, lat spread etc) somehow overshadows the glaring differences in muscular shape, detail, dryness and vascularity.
it doesn't.
never has. never will.
the rest of your post is equally stupid.
eg. you are saying that despite the 99 side chest shots owning anything dorian ever presented, that his side chest MUST be better because Ronnie said so?
are you stupid and cannot see?
::)
it amazes me how stupid you can be. it really does.
eg. has anyone ever DISagreed with you that dorian has better calves. hell no. so what the FUCK are you talking about?? ::)
you really are dumb. sorry. but I really hope you don't act like this at McDonalds. you might be stuck there for life. :-\
-
Ronnie said Dorian had the thickest & freakiest back he ever seen , you're arguing with him? see a pattern here? this makes you incorrect
umm..hello?
tons of people including your fucking hero Peter McGough say Ronnie has the greatest back EVER.
OVER DORIAN.
its not just me you blithering idiot.. ::)
serious question:
are you on something? ???
-
Ronnie said his best Olympia apperance was 1998 because his conditioning was spot on and this is verified by Peter McGough , again how is this proving me wrong? its NOT
I don't have to prove you wrong.
the video and pic evidence proves you wrong quite nicely, idiot. ::)
and Ronnie stated in 99 that he was in better shape than 98.
check the legs if you still feel you are correct. ::)
Ronnie was visibly just as hard if not harder in 99.
and his quads were way more cut. as verified by Lonnie Teper and..Real fucking life..
-
ND is an atheist but I'm not sure if he is a rationalist. He understands that religious people will justify their own inconsistent point of views just to come to terms with them in their own minds, yet seems to do it himself regarding bodybuilding.
He can't simply state that he prefers the physiques of Arnold, Frank Zane, and Dorian. Instead he takes these apples and oranges and tries to explain how, objectively, they are superior to a whole array of other bodybuilders, yet the individual qualities of these bodybuilders are all over the map: Arnold is superior due to his "balance" which consists of small but separated quads, Dorian is superior because he has a wide structure and incredible back detail, and Frank Zane - I'm not even sure how ND includes him in this list.
Yet what is obvious is that there is no consistency in these standards. Dorian and Arnold have drastically different physiques yet he compares them as if they can be compared in any direct manner.
I prefer the physiques of Bob Paris and Milos over the physiques of Ronnie or Victor Martinez but that does not mean I would have the audacity to try to justify why they should beat either of the two in contest, since objectively, they would not have the qualities to beat Ronnie or Victor.
I just wish ND would state his preferences without trying to justify why those preferences should win on a bodybuilding stage against superior bodybuilders. It just makes him sound silly.
-
It just makes him sound silly.
he sounds silly because he makes no fucking sense. see his last post.
the man is a complete and total idiot.
plain and simple.
he will ALWAYS look silly as a result.
he has no consistencies becaues he has no idea how to evaluate a physique or, how to prove a position in a debate.
he has no clue.
he thinks if he can find one quote agree with his 'opinion' that it MUST be true NO MATTER WHAT ELSE IS SHOWN.
which, in this sport is completely stupid.
eg. If I were to find a quote by an eyewitness (say a pro like Dexter) saying that Porter Cotrell has better arms than Ronnie Coleman, would that automatically make it true?
according to ND, yes it would. after all, who am I to argue with Dexter?
it doesn't matter what real life shows, dexter MUST be right..
::)
you can clearly see the ridiculousness of ND's 'proofs' to his arguments in this simple example.
the man seriously needs to learn bodybuilding, and to learn how to defend a position properly.
:-\
-
Some comparisons for fun...
Most are from Sergio 1972 which I think
most consider to be his best overall condition.
1. Most Muscular
-
Side Chest...
-
Front Lat Spread
-
(http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=180441.0;attach=211935;image)
holy shit is ronnie getting dwarfed and owned.
-
Rear Lat Spread...
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Semi Relaxed...
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umm..hello?
tons of people including your fucking hero Peter McGough say Ronnie has the greatest back EVER.
OVER DORIAN.
its not just me you blithering idiot.. ::)
serious question:
are you on something? ???
not only are you the biggest guy on this board, but also the biggest hypocrite.
you have constantly ridiculed mcgough and have even stated that you know more than him when it comes to bbing.
now, all of a sudden, when his words match YOUR opinion, your praise and quotes of pete is endless.
well, what about ronnie's words.
ronnie's says various things about yates, but yet, you refuse to accept it.
one of the greatest bbers of all time has words that you dont recognize or acknowledge?
from FLEX, july 2003:
ronnie coleman, big picture:
DESCRIBE DORIAN YATES: A close friend. Dorian is very intelligent, a great Mr. Olympia. He had the best side-chest pose and the thickest freakiest back I have ever seen.
as i previously mentioned, i pretty much do own you in virtually every post you make.
-
Side Triceps...
-
why is ronnie two different colors in the above pics of that rear and semi relaxed from lat spreads?
arent those pics from the same contest?
very strange......
(even if they are from 2 different media sources, ronnie should be the same color. notice the various color shots of sergio from different media sources - his skin is the same color in all of them.)
-
Front double bicep...
-
i've always liked the long biceps look that sergio had.
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Hulkster, I actually think ND is intelligent in a number of ways, I just don't think that he is applying it in his argumentation on here because he isn't even aware of his own bias which are obvious based on the inconsistencies of his bodybuilding heroes. Say what you will about our point of view, we are at least consistent in our argumentation.
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Last One...Back double bi...
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why is ronnie two different colors in the above pics of that rear and semi relaxed from lat spreads?
arent those pics from the same contest?
very strange......
(even if they are from 2 different media sources, ronnie should be the same color. notice the various color shots of sergio from different media sources - his skin is the same color in all of them.)
The blue trunks are from prejudging and the purple trunks are from the night routine.
This is exactly how it looks on video or DVD. The lighting was different or they may have
stood farther back at night making the shades different. There are sets of these pics out there and you can line them up and see the difference between prejudging and at night. Nobody's messed with the pics
unless you count adding a little brightness to them if they are too dark. Many of the muscletime
pics are often too dark and I often lighten them to make everybody look better.
-
First pic is prejudging untouched.
Second pic is the night show untouched.
-
coleman had a tiny waist? where? inside his other abnormally large one?
At one time he actually did have a very small waist...
-
honestly, you must be the dumbest poster on this board.
:-\
you miss the whole point entirely.
as usual.
your argument seems to be that because dorian has better balance and proportion, that he would win.
problem is, the muscular shape, detail and vascularity that Ronnie has causes him to win almost all the mandatory poses.
so the SLIGHT difference in balance/proportion don't help him at all.
for example, what good are dorian's advantages in balance and proportion in these comparisons of two mandatories below?
answer: NOTHING, for the reasons I listed above.
your argument is based on a flawed premise - that the slight advantage that dorian may have in balance/proportion (which is DEBATABLE because even nin 93 his arms are undersized for his frame - check any most muscular pose, lat spread etc) somehow overshadows the glaring differences in muscular shape, detail, dryness and vascularity.
it doesn't.
never has. never will.
the rest of your post is equally stupid.
eg. you are saying that despite the 99 side chest shots owning anything dorian ever presented, that his side chest MUST be better because Ronnie said so?
are you stupid and cannot see?
::)
it amazes me how stupid you can be. it really does.
eg. has anyone ever DISagreed with you that dorian has better calves. hell no. so what the FUCK are you talking about?? ::)
you really are dumb. sorry. but I really hope you don't act like this at McDonalds. you might be stuck there for life. :-\
Let me first start by saying meltdown lol seriously you're blowing a gasket lol
your argument seems to be that because dorian has better balance and proportion, that he would win.
problem is, the muscular shape, detail and vascularity that Ronnie has causes him to win almost all the mandatory poses.
so the SLIGHT difference in balance/proportion don't help him at all.
As usual you don't get it ( old news ) my argument is this ( pay attention moron ) Dorian would beat Ronnie because he has a clear advantage in balance & proportion , and couple that with ( especially compared to 1998 ) another clear advantage in muscular bulk ( 247 pounds VS 260 pounds ) and while conditioning may be a push , Dorian has a clear advantage in density , he's more complete , while both are NO Labrada when it comes to posing , Dorian is a better technical poser , and he doesn't have bitch tits
Now seeing you have NO clue how bodybuilding contests are judged we don't separate these things they're all judged in unison because all rounds are physique rounds , again lets follow the criteria that the IFBB uses not the criteria Hulkster hyperfocuses on and I hate to break it to you son there is much more than a slight difference in balance & proportion we're talking torso length , arm length in relation to the torso , rib cage depth , calves in relation to quads , glutes that stick out and can be seen from the front , you'd know this if you were savy which you're obviously not
And you post a side chest from 1992 Obviously NOT Dorian at his best ( wow another decpetive move by Hulkster ) and a shot from 1993 which is 1) poor quality and 2) set way to far back and the best part is you think you've accomplished something by doing so , when in fact Ronnie himself said Dorian had the best side chest he's ever seen period , and Shawn Ray laments how Ronnie's side chest ( and side triceps ) where never that great , again common knowledge to people who know how to evaluate a professional bodybuilding physique ( not you ) and I'm saying Dorian' side chest is better because ( compared to 1998 ) he meets the criteria better than Ronnie period , he has better balance & proportion , a deeper rib cage , equal if not better conditioning , better density , he's more complete ( has calves ) and his side chest isn't dominated by overdeveloped arms & delts which if you posted a SIDE CHEST of Ronnie's in profile like the judges ask for this is clearly been shown , so like all the other mandatory poses Dorian beats Ronnie because ........................ ..he meets the criteria better than Ronnie and is more complete , learn this , sure you can find advantages for Ronnie in poses but OVERALL ( how contests are judged ) Dorian satisfies the criteria better than Ronnie , better than Flex , better than Levrone , better than Ray , better than Dillett ...................in fact better than anyone in the 1990s lol
so like on the truce thread you've exposed your very weak position , still can't seem to grasp mine which I've repeated to you ad nausem and are still ignorant of how contests are judge , you hyper focus on just ONE part of the criteria and forget all the others thats not how it works kid and thats why your melting down page after page lol ;)
-
why is ronnie two different colors in the above pics of that rear and semi relaxed from lat spreads?
arent those pics from the same contest?
very strange......
(even if they are from 2 different media sources, ronnie should be the same color. notice the various color shots of sergio from different media sources - his skin is the same color in all of them.)
what is even more strange is how a human being can be as stupid as you.. ::)
you are STILL going on about this shit? ::)
you are not capable of understanding or learning are you?
:-\
damn.
IceCold has been crying adjusted pics from the moment 99 ronnie shots were posted showing how good he was.
I guess he will never learn, no matter how many people post screencaps.
he will always cry fake, because he can't deal with how good ronnie was.
-
if coleman 99 wasnt lean, then munzer wasnt ripped. what u should remember about coleman is that he generally has a smooth look to him even when he can hit a shot and striations and detail pop out everywhere. just like how dorian could display little detail yet his skin appear hard and grainy. bbing isnt judged on how ur skin looks (at least i dont think so)
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look how shitty sergio looks compared to ronnie LOL. better structure my ass, he has a no fucking back, little quad sweep and a narrow structure. compared to ronnies sick biceps, wide back and narrow waist at lower bodyweights, extreme detail and flaring quads.
i barely see any structural benefits owned by sergio, dude looks a little narrow to me across the clavicle. crazy waist on him though.
-
ND's spiels are like all the apologist literature on "intelligent design". They seem fancy and well written but they are not necessarily accurate! Just deceiving since they are properly articulated and rich in vocabulary.
-
Chris would beat Ronnie with size & conditioning being equal NO ifs and or buts about it.
If my grandfather had a vagina, he would be my grandmother.
-
Trying to compare Mr. Olympia's from different eras is stupid - unless it's 98 or after.
-
Look at this rear dbl bicep comparison I made some years ago...
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There is a reason why people called Sergio "the Myth"! He was the best bodybuilder physique wise.
-
what is even more strange is how a human being can be as stupid as you.. ::)
you are STILL going on about this shit? ::)
you are not capable of understanding or learning are you?
:-\
damn.
IceCold has been crying adjusted pics from the moment 99 ronnie shots were posted showing how good he was.
I guess he will never learn, no matter how many people post screencaps.
he will always cry fake, because he can't deal with how good ronnie was.
I shed a little light
on Hulksters 99 side chest pic. I do this as well with any pics
that are too dark including Dorian's.
Your boy Bizzy has admitted to working Ronnie photos already and seeing the 99 screencaps have 4 different colors its obvious they all can't be the same
-
ND, ronnie is the best of all time...deal with it. Dorian was good but not like Ronnie.....jeezus christ let it go, let it go...
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I don't have to prove you wrong.
the video and pic evidence proves you wrong quite nicely, idiot. ::)
and Ronnie stated in 99 that he was in better shape than 98.
check the legs if you still feel you are correct. ::)
Ronnie was visibly just as hard if not harder in 99.
and his quads were way more cut. as verified by Lonnie Teper and..Real fucking life..
You don't have to prove me wrong....Just Ronnie & Peter McGough ;) maybe you missed the Pro Bodybuilding Weekly show , you know the one where it was a tribute to Ronnie Coleman and his career and when asked what was his best Olympia showing he said his first and specifically because his conditioning was ' spot on ' now you're going to tell the man when his best showing was LMFAO you're a simpleton
Quote Peter McGough Flex Magazine Jan 2001
RONNIE COLEMAN : ( 264lbs As big as a house , but holding water. In '98 , he was shredded and bone dry at 250 pounds. Last year ( 1999 ) he was 257 pounds but NOT as sharp as '98. This year ( 2000 ) at 264 pounds , he's not as sharp as 99 , which would seem to say that Ronnie is better at a lighter weight .
Peter McGough echoing Ronnie's sentiments and these two people were there so this crushes your dumb fucking opinion ,
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ND, ronnie is the best of all time...deal with it. Dorian was good but not like Ronnie.....jeezus christ let it go, let it go...
Wow this is a great post , Ronnie is the best of all time and thats it lol
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umm..hello?
tons of people including your fucking hero Peter McGough say Ronnie has the greatest back EVER.
OVER DORIAN.
its not just me you blithering idiot.. ::)
serious question:
are you on something? ???
Samir Bannout says Dorian has the best back , so does Ellington Darden, Ph.D. Markus Rhul , Ronnie himself said it I mean do I need to continue?
-
ND is an atheist but I'm not sure if he is a rationalist. He understands that religious people will justify their own inconsistent point of views just to come to terms with them in their own minds, yet seems to do it himself regarding bodybuilding.
He can't simply state that he prefers the physiques of Arnold, Frank Zane, and Dorian. Instead he takes these apples and oranges and tries to explain how, objectively, they are superior to a whole array of other bodybuilders, yet the individual qualities of these bodybuilders are all over the map: Arnold is superior due to his "balance" which consists of small but separated quads, Dorian is superior because he has a wide structure and incredible back detail, and Frank Zane - I'm not even sure how ND includes him in this list.
Yet what is obvious is that there is no consistency in these standards. Dorian and Arnold have drastically different physiques yet he compares them as if they can be compared in any direct manner.
I prefer the physiques of Bob Paris and Milos over the physiques of Ronnie or Victor Martinez but that does not mean I would have the audacity to try to justify why they should beat either of the two in contest, since objectively, they would not have the qualities to beat Ronnie or Victor.
I just wish ND would state his preferences without trying to justify why those preferences should win on a bodybuilding stage against superior bodybuilders. It just makes him sound silly.
You're all over the map with this post , my preferences have NOTHING to do with if Yates could beat Ronnie and why and your analogy about Paris & Milos is terrible and why? because neither can compare to Ronnie & Victor in all aspects of the bodybuilding criteria and Dorian can
here is why Dorian could beat Ronnie , he has equal or superior muscular bulk depending on the year 1998 Ronnie was 247 pounds Yates in 1995 was 260 pounds thats a clear advantage , Dorian has a clear cut advantage in terms of balance & proportion compared to any year Ronnie , Dorian has a clear advantage in terms of conditioning compared to Ronnie depending on the year although Ronnie may have matched Yates for dryness in 1998 and 2001 , Ronnie's not as dry in 99 as 98 and in 03 his conditioning suffered even more , Dorian has a clear advantage in density vs Ronnie all years , Dorian's a better technical poser , these are exactly the reasons why I think Dorian would beat Ronnie which have NOTHING to do with what I prefer .
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So according to ND Frank Zane and Dorian are better balanced that Shawn? ???
At their best absolutely , do you even know what balance & proportion are? Shawn has narrow clavicles , he has a long torso and short legs , his quads are to big for his smallish high calves thats not great balance & proportion or structure you don't find these flaws on Zane or Yates
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Mmm weird for a guy whos not a ronnie fan... you are on 90% of threads with the name ronnie in the title....
??? ???
-
LOL ND is being owned by everyone yet again!
ND, when are you going to realize that the reason that everyone is ganging up on you is that you don't know how to evaluate physiques properly.
if you listened to us, you could learn a whole lot.
we are just trying to teach you, because you clearly have a whole lot to learn..
-
Mmm weird for a guy whos not a ronnie fan... you are on 90% of threads with the name ronnie in the title....
??? ???
Wrong I don't post on most Ronnie threads .
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Samir Bannout says Dorian has the best back , so does Ellington Darden, Ph.D. Markus Rhul , Ronnie himself said it I mean do I need to continue?
what is your fucking point?
if Dexter said Porter had better arms than Ronnie would he automatically be right?
::)
like I said, my simple example that I illustrated earlier is exactly what you do all the time.
you find a quote that agrees with you, and defend it no matter what even if all the visual evidence proves this quote to be 100% wrong.
you don't care.
you will cling to anything.. :-\
its sad, really.
-
Wrong I don't post on most Ronnie threads .
yeah, and a bear doesn't shit in the woods.. ::)
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LOL ND is being owned by everyone yet again!
ND, when are you going to realize that the reason that everyone is ganging up on you is that you don't know how to evaluate physiques properly.
if you listened to us, you could learn a whole lot.
we are just trying to teach you, because you clearly have a whole lot to learn..
You always type this empty statement and thats what it is , you've yet to counter anything I've said , and FYI go back and read on many people said Sergio is better period ;) and how you're the only one who thinks Ronnie has a better structure even your boy pumpster isn't that dumb ONLY you are you're alone in that statement lol
And you just agreed I'm right that Yates has better balance & proportion and its about time lol its common knowledge except to you and the other idiots you still can't counter my argument and have given up trying and have been reduced to bad mouthing me in every post because thats what you're left with lol keep posting most musculars kid you're a defeated man .
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yeah, and a bear doesn't shit in the woods.. ::)
Bull shit you're the fan boy who injects your delusion in every thread and every member here calls it its a joke " How long before Hulkster posts with his nonsense? " lol its old news I don't need to defend my opinion like you in every single thread.
owned ;)
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what is your fucking point?
if Dexter said Porter had better arms than Ronnie would he automatically be right?
::)
like I said, my simple example that I illustrated earlier is exactly what you do all the time.
you find a quote that agrees with you, and defend it no matter what even if all the visual evidence proves this quote to be 100% wrong.
you don't care.
you will cling to anything.. :-\
its sad, really.
The point is its not out of the realm of possibility Yates does indeed have the best back , its out of the realm that Potter has better arms ;) wow great analogy there Hulkster lol fucking retard
and Ronnie himself said it thats validation enough ;)
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ND's spiels are like all the apologist literature on "intelligent design". They seem fancy and well written but they are not necessarily accurate! Just deceiving since they are properly articulated and rich in vocabulary.
I love how you type a baseless claim and yet don't explain what isn't ' accurate ' lets talk turkey Matt whats not accurate so I can correct you .
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I love how you type a baseless claim and yet don't explain what isn't ' accurate ' lets talk turkey Matt whats not accurate so I can correct you .
dude your an idiot, put the best pictures or fucking sergio against the best pictures of ronnie, its obvious. are you seriously arguing that sergio was better then ronnie? if so your a moron.
dude please stop the nonsense, ronnie destroys sergio in the pictures where comparisons are made.
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dude your an idiot, put the best pictures or fucking sergio against the best pictures of ronnie, its obvious. are you seriously arguing that sergio was better then ronnie? if so your a moron.
dude please stop the nonsense, ronnie destroys sergio in the pictures where comparisons are made.
All I think ND is saying is that all things equal (namely, drugs) Sergio would defeat Ronnie based on superior balance, proportion and aesthetics while carrying similar mass.
-
All I think ND is saying is that all things equal (namely, drugs) Sergio would defeat Ronnie based on superior balance, proportion and aesthetics while carrying similar mass.
but that assumes the following:
1. that sergio could get as cut and detailed as ronnie
2. that serigo could get as vascular as ronnie
we don't really know how segio would look super cut, dry and vascular like Ronnie..
thats the problem.
you can't base everything simply on genetics. Just ask Flex Wheeler.
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Ronnie is the best of all time and thats it
Agreed!!
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2. that serigo could get as vascular as ronnie
Vascularity has absolutely nothing to do with who wins a contest. Some people find it grotesque. Personally, I like it and I think it adds to the freakness factor. But it doesn't decide who wins. The proof? Flex Wheeler, Dorian Yates, Lee Haney, Jay Cutler, Kevin Levrone, and I could go on. All had relatively low amounts of vascularity. On the flip side, look at Paul Dillet. He was probably the most vascular BB of all-time, yet he could barely win a show.
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I don't think most people see anything wrong
with taking a picture that is too dark and adding
a little light to it. I'm not changing colors, stretching an image
or enhancing it except that you can see the picture better.
Any of those screen caps earlier in this thread of 3 different color
Ronnies; None of those came from me.
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Dorian's size in that shot is mind-boggling :o
-
I shed a little light
on Hulksters 99 side chest pic. I do this as well with any pics
that are too dark including Dorian's.
Your boy Bizzy has admitted to working Ronnie photos already and seeing the 99 screencaps have 4 different colors its obvious they all can't be the same
Somebody who doesn't like Ronnie made him Orange and smooth. ;D
-
....
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dude your an idiot, put the best pictures or fucking sergio against the best pictures of ronnie, its obvious. are you seriously arguing that sergio was better then ronnie? if so your a moron.
dude please stop the nonsense, ronnie destroys sergio in the pictures where comparisons are made.
You're mom should have been pro choice lol you're infecting the gene pool , Sergio destroys Ronnie in structure and balance & proportion , please pay attention to what I'm typing you idiot
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All I think ND is saying is that all things equal (namely, drugs) Sergio would defeat Ronnie based on superior balance, proportion and aesthetics while carrying similar mass.
hey someone who gets it lol
Thank you !
-
but that assumes the following:
1. that sergio could get as cut and detailed as ronnie
2. that serigo could get as vascular as ronnie
we don't really know how segio would look super cut, dry and vascular like Ronnie..
thats the problem.
you can't base everything simply on genetics. Just ask Flex Wheeler.
Sure Ronnie wasn't as cut as he always was and why? two words.................Te h Chad diuretics and plasma expanders , and please spare me this vascularity nonsense lol thats NOT a noteworthy advantage why you type is is beyond me its a straw you always grasp at , Sergio doesn't need to look like Ronnie he would have equal if not superior size , much better balance & proportion and conditioning is unanswered question but couple Sergio lack of proper diet and supplements I think he'd be very close .
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Somebody who doesn't like Ronnie made him Orange and smooth. ;D
Nonsense I didn't touch ANY of those pics , those are all pics they posted on the truce thread and they kept changing
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Vascularity has absolutely nothing to do with who wins a contest. Some people find it grotesque. Personally, I like it and I think it adds to the freakness factor. But it doesn't decide who wins. The proof? Flex Wheeler, Dorian Yates, Lee Haney, Jay Cutler, Kevin Levrone, and I could go on. All had relatively low amounts of vascularity. On the flip side, look at Paul Dillet. He was probably the most vascular BB of all-time, yet he could barely win a show.
Another great point , he gets desperate he needs angles and he grasps as straws , he's clueless on how competitive bodybuilding contests are judged , excess vasculairty is actually frowned upon.
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Agreed!!
Matthew you made a claim I was inaccurate elaborate on this !
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I don't think bodybuilding wise anybody is even close to Sergio at his prime.
Ron Coleman and Dorian Yates can only dream about beeing built like that!
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Nonsense I didn't touch ANY of those pics , those are all pics they posted on the truce thread and they kept changing
LOL, I certainly had no one particular in mind when
saying that. Do you honestly think I would think you would do that?
I was just making a cheesy joke. It was probably someone with a jacked
up computer or video capture for the caps to come out that bad.
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...
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LOL, I certainly had no one particular in mind when
saying that. Do you honestly think I would think you would do that?
I was just making a cheesy joke. It was probably someone with a jacked
up computer or video capture for the caps to come out that bad.
You're full of shit period . you're responding to my post with this
Somebody who doesn't like Ronnie made him Orange and smooth.
and I'm supposed to take that it wasn't directed at me? lol sure ;)
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...
;)
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Sergio = Complete from head to toe!
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You're full of shit period . you're responding to my post with this
Somebody who doesn't like Ronnie made him Orange and smooth.
and I'm supposed to take that it wasn't directed at me? lol sure ;)
I hope your physique analysis is better than your psychic ability
because it wasn't directed @ you. PEACE!!
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Sergio = Complete from head to toe!
Right
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I hope your physique analysis is better than your psychic ability
because it wasn't directed @ you. PEACE!!
Again who did you respond to? if it wasn't directed towards me it wouldn't have been in response to MY thread ;)
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Right
YEAH!
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YEAH!
fucking idiot usmoke sayd Sergio is narrow and has NO back lmfao
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Dorian's size in that shot is mind-boggling :o
so is his glaring imbalances.
ie twig arms on a barrel torso that ND and Co. seem to forget, but harp on ronnie for far more minor issues.. ::)
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fucking idiot usmoke sayd Sergio is narrow and has NO back lmfao
Well who you going to believe? usmoke or Serge Nubret?
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so is his glaring imbalances.
ie twig arms on a barrel torso that ND and Co. seem to forget, but harp on ronnie for far more minor issues.. ::)
Sorry sport these aren't twig arms ;)
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Vascularity has absolutely nothing to do with who wins a contest. Some people find it grotesque. Personally, I like it and I think it adds to the freakness factor. But it doesn't decide who wins. The proof? Flex Wheeler, Dorian Yates, Lee Haney, Jay Cutler, Kevin Levrone, and I could go on. All had relatively low amounts of vascularity. On the flip side, look at Paul Dillet. He was probably the most vascular BB of all-time, yet he could barely win a show.
Another great point , he gets desperate he needs angles and he grasps as straws , he's clueless on how competitive bodybuilding contests are judged , excess vasculairty is actually frowned upon.
dear god yet another one who can't seem to understand the basic fundamental concept of judging that traits like vascularity are not looked at in isolation but rather in combo with other traits in synergy.
the more I see England_1 post, the more I realize he is just like ND...makes the same basic mistakes to a T.
conicidence?
hmmm...
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Sorry sport these aren't twig arms ;)
oh yes they are:
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dear god yet another one who can't seem to understand the basic fundamental concept of judging that traits like vascularity are not looked at in isolation but rather in combo with other traits in synergy.
the more I see England_1 post, the more I realize he is just like ND...makes the same basic mistakes to a T.
conicidence?
hmmm...
I've read the entire IFBB judging criteria and NO WHERE does it mention vasculairty you're full of shit and wrong
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I don't think bodybuilding wise anybody is even close to Sergio at his prime.
Ron Coleman and Dorian Yates can only dream about beeing built like that!
I love sarcasm! 8)
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oh yes they are:
No they're not they can't be twigs in one pose and then get massive in another
Bev Francis : Bodybuilder's phsyique you most admire ?
The man Dorian Yates , his combonation of size and shape makes for an awesome physique , unlike a lot of big guys he's not a load of massive parts just thrown together , His symmetry is almost perfect , Everything is in proportion , no weak bodyparts .
This is from an IFBB judge read the quote , accept it and move on , notice the mention of Ronnie " a load of massive parts just thrown together " lol
owned Ronnie's lack of balance & proportion is NOT minor its a major liability compared to someone with equal or great size , equal or better conditioning and has no bitch tits and can actually pose .
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I've read the entire IFBB judging criteria and NO WHERE does it mention vasculairty you're full of shit and wrong
no, its called the difference between what is literally written and what is actually practiced in reality.
its called interpretation. (just like in the legal profession).
if you go stictly by what is written on the page, the word detail is not even mentioned if I recall..
thus, technically, striations, dieting down, it all doesn't matter.
but of course we know that this is not the case.
well, all of us but you, that is.. ::)
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I love how when ND is getting owned (which is often) he alway runs back to his useless quotes... ::)
he can't even think for himself.
so sad.
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no, its called the difference between what is literally written and what is actually practiced in reality.
its called interpretation. (just like in the legal profession).
if you go stictly by what is written on the page, the word detail is not even mentioned if I recall..
thus, technically, striations, dieting down, it all doesn't matter.
but of course we know that this is not the case.
well, all of us but you, that is.. ::)
yeah his vasculairty is going to make up for his lack of balance & proportion lol great logic
anymore straws to grasp at?
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yeah his vasculairty is going to make up for his lack of balance & proportion lol great logic
anymore straws to grasp at?
yeah, his balance and proportion is so bad he only won 8 Mr. Olympia titles, an Arnold Classic title, and more pro wins than anyone else in history..
::)
as was mentioned in another thread, ND continues to make a fool out of himself.. :'(
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I think nasser would win
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I love how when ND is getting owned (which is often) he alway runs back to his useless quotes... ::)
he can't even think for himself.
so sad.
Owned how? ??? you admitted Dorian has better balance & proportion , everyone agrees Sergio does ( except you lol ) a majority agree Sergio stands alone , again owned how? stop typing bull shit empty claims and long before I posted that quote I always maintained Yates has great balance & proportion and that quote is useless to you because it crushes you utterly and it verifies my original claim which shows I know what I'm talking about and you don't
insult to injury ;)
Interview with David Robson
[ Q ] What were some of your better physical qualities as a bodybuilder, do you think?
Obviously I carried a lot of muscle mass and my trademark was to come into a show in super hard condition. I think my muscles had a certain quality and density from all the years of heavy training that a lot of guys didn't have.
One thing that I think people underrated me on - it was never really mentioned because of my sheer physical size and condition - was my balance and proportion. Not only from muscle group to muscle group, but from upper body to lower body. My skeletal structure and everything else was there and in good balance.
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yeah, his balance and proportion is so bad he only won 8 Mr. Olympia titles, an Arnold Classic title, and more pro wins than anyone else in history..
::)
as was mentioned in another thread, ND continues to make a fool out of himself.. :'(
Hulkster against Dorian? NO ;) against mediocre competition? YES his balance & proportion was shit , it always was thats NOT why he won he won because of size & conditioning , at times his balance & proportion were very good for RONNIE COLEMAN but he never faced ANYONE like Dorian Yates who would match him in size , beat him in conditioning , crush him in balance & proportion , and density didn't have bitch tits knew how to hit a madatory pose , at his best he had his hands full with a ' soft ' Flex a man who Dorian destroyed sorry slick Dorian would walk all over Ronnie.
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Ok Coleman comes pretty close to Sergio.
(http://www.schwarzenegger.it/mro/coleman/rc473.jpg)
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;)
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;)
lol good point. NO CIGAR!!
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I mean this is as good as it gets
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ND,
You have said I think; that Ronnie's arms were too big for
his torso. Do you not think that Sergio's arms are in proportion
to his back which is part of the torso?
-
sergio's were WAY too big for his torso, at least at certain points in his career..
but of course ND will deny this until death, and claim that Ronnie's are.. ::)
just compare:
ronnie's arms are well balanced compared to his back/torso
on the other hand, sergios look like they belong on a 320 pounder..
-
sergio's were WAY too big for his torso, at least at certain points in his career..
but of course ND will deny this until death, and claim that Ronnie's are.. ::)
just compare:
ronnie's arms are well balanced compared to his back/torso
on the other hand, sergios look like they belong on a 320 pounder..
I myself will disagree with that statement... personally, I've never thought your arms could be too big.
I've never seen anyone with arms I thought were TOO big (at least not a bodybuilder)
I think Sergio's arm / torso ratio is just about perfect.
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lol, do we really need another comparison thread??
Already up to 11 pages.
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ND,
You have said I think; that Ronnie's arms were too big for
his torso. Do you not think that Sergio's arms are in proportion
to his back which is part of the torso?
In that PARTICULAR pose yes from all angles NO
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sergio's were WAY too big for his torso, at least at certain points in his career..
but of course ND will deny this until death, and claim that Ronnie's are.. ::)
just compare:
ronnie's arms are well balanced compared to his back/torso
on the other hand, sergios look like they belong on a 320 pounder..
In that particular pose in that particular angle sure but NOT in all poses ;) you have to look at the big picture and NOT base your opinion on a single pic or angle .....oppps you should know this being Mr Knowledgeable lol
-
but that assumes the following:
1. that sergio could get as cut and detailed as ronnie
2. that serigo could get as vascular as ronnie
we don't really know how segio would look super cut, dry and vascular like Ronnie..
thats the problem.
you can't base everything simply on genetics. Just ask Flex Wheeler.
Hulkster, the shape of the bones and the point where the muscles insert in the tendom don't change as you get bigger. We know that if Oliva took the amount and kinds of drugs that pro bodybuilders take nowadays, he would be much bigger with exactly the same structure and long muscle bellies. Hw sould be as big as Coleman, only with a superior structure and with less muscle bellies inserting high in the tendom. A 260 lbs Sergio would destroy Ronnie.
SUCKMYMUSCLE
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Hulkster, the shape of the bones and the point where the muscles insert in the tendom don't change as you get bigger. We know that if Oliva took the amount and kinds of drugs that pro bodybuilders take nowadays, he would be much bigger with exactly the same structure and long muscle bellies. Hw sould be as big as Coleman, only with a superior structure and with less muscle bellies inserting high in the tendom. A 260 lbs Sergio would destroy Ronnie.
SUCKMYMUSCLE
all this talk about a tiny waist, wide lats and flaring quads of sergio seems to imply that Ronnie was lacking in this area..:
he was just as good as Sergio at certain points in his career:
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now THAT is a shoulder to waist differential..and a crazy ass quad sweep to boot..
-
Some Sergio pics I have..
Some are rare and some may be reposts
from this thread.
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...
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...
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...
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...
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...
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Quote from Mike Mentzer, Heavy Duty I:
"All bodybuilders, even top pros, have some genetic flaws. Bodybuilding potential is primarilly related to two things, structure and muscle belly lengh. An ideal bodybuilding structure is characterized by wide clavicles, narrow hips, torso and leg lengh being proportional and by relatively small joints, which add to the impression os size. Muscle belly lengh is determined by where the muscle attaches in the tendom. The lower the muscle attaches in the tendom, the more mass potential the muscle has and the more aesthetic it is. The only exception to the rule that all bodybuilders have some genetic flaws is Sergio Oliva: not only does he have have a perfect structure, but each and every single muscle belly in his body is long."[/u]
Pay close attention to these words, Hulkster. Noy only was Mentzer a borderline genius, but he knew more about bodybuilding than you could learn in ten lifetimes. ;)
SUCKMYMUSCLE
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problem is, sergio's biceps length was too long. it worked against him:
-
Quote from Mike Mentzer, Heavy Duty I:
"All bodybuilders, even top pros, have some genetic flaws. Bodybuilding potential is primarilly related to two things, structure and muscle belly lengh. An ideal bodybuilding structure is characterized by wide clavicles, narrow hips, torso and leg lengh being proportional and by relatively small joints, which add to the impression os size. Muscle belly lengh is determined by where the muscle attaches in the tendom. The lower the muscle attaches in the tendom, the more mass potential the muscle has and the more aesthetic it is. The only exception to the rule that all bodybuilders have some genetic flaws is Sergio Oliva: not only does he have have a perfect structure, but each and every single muscle belly in his body is long."[/u]
Pay close attention to these words, Hulkster. Noy only was Mentzer a borderline genius, but he knew more about bodybuilding than you could learn in ten lifetimes. ;)
SUCKMYMUSCLE
One Great post ! I mean its common knowledge Sergio's genetics are among the best ever , Hulkster need anymore ownings?
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problem is, sergio's biceps length was too long. it worked against him:
At the beginning of the thread it was how Ronnie & Sergio were so alike and to quote your ignorant statement they both have amazingly long full muscle bellies , now Sergio's is too long lol and again why do you insist on posting pictures of guys at obviously not their best it only shows your fear and ignorance , you bitch and complain when people do it about Ronnie and then go right ahead and to it every single time without fail , hypocrite never heard that before huh? ;)
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I don't think Sergio could ever be as good as Ronnie
was even with todays chemicals and I'll give you my reasons:
1. Although Sergio looked wide in some shots such as a front lat spread
his clavicles were not nearly as wide as Ronnie's. He had HUGE shoulder muscles
but not wide clavicles. This is very noticeable in relaxed and semi-relaxed pictures.
The same can't be said for Ronnie
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When Sergio's most muscular is not taken at an angle
he is thick but once again the lack of width is apparent.
-
As we all know Mr. Olympias from 1983 on were won
from the back. Sergio never had the clavicle width
to develop lats that would ever equal Ronnie's. It is apparent
in every picture that is not taken from some upward angle.
Every straight on shot it is very apparent.
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Although Sergio is wider than Bertil Fox; Sergio would
have the same problem competing against Ronnie as Fox
did against Haney. (I'm talking as if Sergio had access to todays
drugs and technology.) I have seen Bertil and Haney both in person
on stage. Alone, Bertil was the most impressive. His arms were as big
as his head. When you put them side by side Haney's wider structure
blew Fox away. Sergio competed against Fox and although Sergio was wider than
Fox it was not a huge difference. If Sergio had used todays chemicals he
may well have been thicker than Ronnie much like Bertil was thicker than Haney
pound for pound. Sergio's narrowerer structure would have never allowed him to
come close to developing a back like Ronnie's overall. (Width and thickness)
-
I wish there were more shots but even from
this angle you can tell that Fox and Sergio had alot
of similarities.
-
There are better back relaxed shots of Ronnie
but I'm using a not so good one because I'm
sure this isn't the best of Sergio... just the best I could find from 1972.
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sergio could have looked as impressive in the backdoublebi as ronnie. he wasnt narrower than him in that shot, he just has thinner upperback muscles, so nothing stands out. it looks smooth. put more muscle there so the traps, lats, rhomboids, etc, 'pop' and u have a ronnie back clone. not to mention his arms totally dwarfing his back for that very reason.
-
Although Sergio had a small waist. Ronnie did
also in his prime.
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great comparisons Bizzy!
sergio is so far behind its hard to see what ND is so in a fuss about.
then again, he has no fucking clue, and will argue that an ant has a better physique than Ronnie.. ::)
sorry sergio:
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Although Sergio had a small waist. Ronnie did
also in his prime.
shhh!!! stop telling the obvious truth to the idiots like ND!
you are going to ruin their delusional fantasy.
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At the beginning of the thread it was how Ronnie & Sergio were so alike and to quote your ignorant statement they both have amazingly long full muscle bellies , now Sergio's is too long lol and again why do you insist on posting pictures of guys at obviously not their best it only shows your fear and ignorance , you bitch and complain when people do it about Ronnie and then go right ahead and to it every single time without fail , hypocrite never heard that before huh? ;)
ya know, you are so incredibly stupid it is irritating.
I said that they had a lot of similar characteristics, not that they were identical in everyway.
there are going to be some differences you fucking illiterate moron.
get back on the boat. lol
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The one last BIG question mark that I forgot to mention
is... Would Sergio have the discipline/genetics to get ripped
enough to compete at todays level. He could not even get in
the condition required back in the 70's/80's. He may have been in good
enough condition once or twice but that's not that impressive over
a whole career.
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When Sergio's most muscular is not taken at an angle
he is thick but once again the lack of width is apparent.
This has nothing to do with clavicle width, but with sheer muscle size. Ronnie is carrying some 30 lbs more muscle than Sergio in that comparison, which means that he his deltoids are much bigger and thus wider. If Oliva gained 20-40 lbs of muscle, his shoulders would be as wide or wider than Ronnie's. I don't think there's a difference in clavicle width between the two, but if there is it probably favors Oliva. ;)
SUCKMYMUSCLE
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Sergio and Ronnie are my two favourite bodybuilders. You really can't compare both guys who are 30 years apart.
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Genetics wise I say it's all Sergio, for overall build I would also say Sergio but if it came down to who actually put it all together the best I have to say Ronnie because he isn't far behind Sergio in genetics and build but way ahead in terms of conditioning and peaking for shows when it really counts.
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Let's drop these ironage "what if" delusions that Sergio would look as good as Ronnie or would have even looked better than he previously had with "today's" drugs. :-X Ever heard of the law of diminishing returns? He would not necessarily continue to improve forever and although I believe he would to a certain extent, I do not believe that he would improve to the point of being able to defeat Ronnie.
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shhh!!! stop telling the obvious truth to the idiots like ND!
you are going to ruin their delusional fantasy.
No just ruin yours ;)
Tiny my ass , see when you truly have a tiny waist its tiny from all angles and in transition NOT when held onto for dear life
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Is this really a thread ??? ??? ???
"Anyone" Vs Ronnie -WHO 'REALLY' WINS??
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great comparisons Bizzy!
sergio is so far behind its hard to see what ND is so in a fuss about.
then again, he has no fucking clue, and will argue that an ant has a better physique than Ronnie.. ::)
sorry sergio:
See you're a stupid person for many reasons but on this occasion its because I admitted Sergio at his best would lost to Ronnie because he's just as big or bigger , has much better conditioning , and muscularity however this is where you get lost Sergio has a better natural structure and balance & proportion and , again you complete moron , please pay attention with all things being equal , size , conditioning , muscularity Sergio would BEAT Ronnie because he has the addition of a better structure and balance & proportion.
again moron I'm not arguing Sergio has a better physique please pay attention
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ya know, you are so incredibly stupid it is irritating.
I said that they had a lot of similar characteristics, not that they were identical in everyway.
there are going to be some differences you fucking illiterate moron.
get back on the boat. lol
fuck me you're simple please explain where I said they were identical , I never did this is your poor reading comprehension skills rearing their ugly head yet again
sergio had a lot of the same qualities that make ronnie at his best the greatest ever:
eg. full muscle bellies, tiny waist, wide as hell back.
but, when you compare them, Sergio does get owned.
this is your quote and now you're owned you're forced to back peddle , its interesting to ponder Ronnie with full muscle bellies when his calves are high and short and his forearms are shaped like bowling pins lol please go long what full muscle bellies mean before looking like a moron the next time you type , Ronnie's muscles are full of oil or whatever he's injecting into them. ;)
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This has nothing to do with clavicle width, but with sheer muscle size. Ronnie is carrying some 30 lbs more muscle than Sergio in that comparison, which means that he his deltoids are much bigger and thus wider. If Oliva gained 20-40 lbs of muscle, his shoulders would be as wide or wider than Ronnie's. I don't think there's a difference in clavicle width between the two, but if there is it probably favors Oliva. ;)
SUCKMYMUSCLE
Great post as usual and common sense and I think it does favor Sergio you couldn't hit this shot with narrow clavicles and you can see Sergio always had a great structure even when he was lighter
-
Despite all the modern advantages Ronnie enjoys Sergio is more than holding his own in this pose.
-
Let's drop these ironage "what if" delusions that Sergio would look as good as Ronnie or would have even looked better than he previously had with "today's" drugs. :-X Ever heard of the law of diminishing returns? He would not necessarily continue to improve forever and although I believe he would to a certain extent, I do not believe that he would improve to the point of being able to defeat Ronnie.
Is it a mere conincidence that all bodybuiilders nowadays are much bigger than those from the time when Sergio was in his prime - late 1960s, early 1970s? Do you have any idea of how little steroids and other drugs bodybuilders from that time used? Make no mistake about this: with the amount and tyoes of drugs that bodybuilders use nowadays, Sergio would carry some 30 lbs more muscle. And he would defeat Ronnie because he would be jsut as big but less flaws, such as not having high calves, high outer triceps head, etc. ;)
SUCKMYMUSCLE
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Despite all the modern advantages Ronnie enjoys Sergio is more than holding his own in this pose.
and yet it illustrates quite clearly how as good as the myth was, he did lack good muscle shape in crucial areas like traps, arms, delts etc. that would make it tough for him to EVER beat Ronnie even with today's technology.
no amount of dieting and drugs would take serigo's arm shape in the above pose and turn it into the amazing shape of Ronnie's right next to him.
to think otherwise is living in a fantasy land.
the more I see these comparisons, the more I believe that Ronnie may have even had better natural muscle shape than Sergio, which is suprising.
but the proof is everywhere in this thread.
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and yet it illustrates quite clearly how as good as the myth was, he did lack good muscle shape in crucial areas like traps, arms, delts etc. that would make it tough for him to EVER beat Ronnie even with today's technology.
no amount of dieting and drugs would take serigo's arm shape in the above pose and turn it into the amazing shape of Ronnie's right next to him.
to think otherwise is living in a fantasy land.
the more I see these comparisons, the more I believe that Ronnie may have even had better natural muscle shape than Sergio, which is suprising.
but the proof is everywhere in this thread.
ND thinks that since Sergio looks more pleasing in the arms overhead pose that this automatically means he beats Ronnie in all other areas.
-
ND thinks that since Sergio looks more pleasing in the arms overhead pose that this automatically means he beats Ronnie in all other areas.
::)
no one said ND was smart when it comes to this sport... :-\
-
::)
no one said ND was smart when it comes to this sport... :-\
ND seems to think he is. ;D
Seriously, if he were to say that Sergio looks more pleasing in the hands overhead pose, no one would refute him. If he were to say Dorian has better back detail or bigger calves than Ronnie, no one would refute him. If he were to say that Arnold looks more pleasing in the front relaxed pose than Ronnie, no one would refute him. But ND's problem is taking poses such as the above which he likes and therefore extending this to imply that the particular bodybuilder he is talking about is better OVERALL and that is plainly ridiculous.
-
ND seems to think he is. ;D
Seriously, if he were to say that Sergio looks more pleasing in the hands overhead pose, no one would refute him. If he were to say Dorian has better back detail or bigger calves than Ronnie, no one would refute him. If he were to say that Arnold looks more pleasing in the front relaxed pose than Ronnie, no one would refute him. But ND's problem is taking poses such as the above which he likes and therefore extending this to imply that the particular bodybuilder he is talking about is better OVERALL and that is plainly ridiculous.
ND wears his anti-Ronnie bias on his sleeve. What should be done is comparisons between BBers in their BEST possible pose for BOTH guys. Showing one guy at his worst compared to the other guy in his signature shot isn't fooling anyone.
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This has nothing to do with clavicle width, but with sheer muscle size. Ronnie is carrying some 30 lbs more muscle than Sergio in that comparison, which means that he his deltoids are much bigger and thus wider. If Oliva gained 20-40 lbs of muscle, his shoulders would be as wide or wider than Ronnie's. I don't think there's a difference in clavicle width between the two, but if there is it probably favors Oliva. ;)
SUCKMYMUSCLE
According to this article: http://www.ironage.us/articles/sergiovarnie.html
Sergio is 240 in those pics. The Ronnie pics range between 247-257 so there
is nowhere near a 30 pound difference unless the Ironage article is wrong.
I would also like to add that Sergio @ 240 has deltoid muscles dang close if not as big as Ronnie's.
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ND thinks that since Sergio looks more pleasing in the arms overhead pose that this automatically means he beats Ronnie in all other areas.
don't presume to think for me , he sure beats Ronnie in terms of natural structure and balance & proportion , and that pose showcases Sergio's structure and proportions thats why I posted it , among others.
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ND seems to think he is. ;D
Seriously, if he were to say that Sergio looks more pleasing in the hands overhead pose, no one would refute him. If he were to say Dorian has better back detail or bigger calves than Ronnie, no one would refute him. If he were to say that Arnold looks more pleasing in the front relaxed pose than Ronnie, no one would refute him. But ND's problem is taking poses such as the above which he likes and therefore extending this to imply that the particular bodybuilder he is talking about is better OVERALL and that is plainly ridiculous.
You can't seem to follow the argument it has NOTHING to do with who's more pleasing in a shot , how you can to that conclusion is beyond me , it has to do with who has a better structure in ALL poses , who has better balance & proportion and this is evident with Sergio , you can't have great balance & proportion when you're calves are nonexistent or your forearms are shaped like bowling pins and are dwarfed by your biceps/triceps and your torso is short and your glutes can be seen from the front and I hate to break it to you Matt you can see these flaws in Ronnie in every single pose , from every single angle
And ironically Hulkster has already argued Ronnie has more detail in his back than Yates lol
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You must have the same prescription glasses as ND if you think Sergio comes anywhere near Ronnie in these pics
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You must have the same prescription glasses as ND if you think Sergio comes anywhere near Ronnie in these pics
In terms of muscle balance & proportion and natural structure he surpasses Ronnie in terms of muscularity & detail NO , I'm talking only the fore mentioned.
-
You must have the same prescription glasses as ND if you think Sergio comes anywhere near Ronnie in these pics
ND needs a new prescription for his brain, never mind his stevie wonder eyes.. :-\
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ND needs a new prescription for his brain, never mind his stevie wonder eyes.. :-\
Are you back to claiming his balance & proportion and natural structure aren't as good as Ronnies? you finally cracked and admitted the obvious Dorian has the advantage and now I'll have to keep correcting you until you get it through you're head , Sergio crushes Ronnie purely from this aspect .
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don't presume to think for me , he sure beats Ronnie in terms of natural structure and balance & proportion , and that pose showcases Sergio's structure and proportions thats why I posted it , among others.
Let's see them.
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Let's see them.
Obviously you haven't been following the thread , go back and see all the pics I posted and then I'll accept your apology , if you're men enough to give it ;)
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LOL ND is getting owned all the time on so many threads at once.
its great!
maybe one day he will realize how wrong he is when it comes to phyisque assesements.
then again, maybe not:
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Ronnie's weaknesses in top form 1999.
1. Genetically odd shaped abs.
Sergio's weaknesses in top form 1972.
1. Lack of back width
2. Lack of back thickness.
3. No peak on biceps.
4. Conditioning was OK but lacking.
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there is no comparison between peak sergio and 99 Ronnie - just look at that.
but then again, is it really fair? because Ronnie 99 is arguably the greatest overall physique ever seen onstage to date.
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you can't have great balance & proportion when you're calves are nonexistent or your forearms are shaped like bowling pins and are dwarfed by your biceps/triceps and your torso is short and your glutes can be seen from the front and I hate to break it to you Matt you can see these flaws in Ronnie in every single pose , from every single angle
And ironically Hulkster has already argued Ronnie has more detail in his back than Yates lol
All of these arguments are grasping at straws. Sergio has just as many small flaws as this and more.
As for Hulkster, he sometimes says silly things too lol.
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what really makes no sense with ND is that he can be so picky with the list of ronnie flaws, and yet not care that dorian has so many major flaws that most people rag on his physique on these boards daily.. ::)
ND is biased against Ronnie, but doesn't seem to care about everyone elses flaws.. ::)
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what really makes no sense with ND is that he can be so picky with the list of ronnie flaws, and yet not care that dorian has so many major flaws that most people rag on his physique on these boards daily.. ::)
ND is biased against Ronnie, but doesn't seem to care about everyone elses flaws.. ::)
That's exactly my point. He picks a dozen little flaws in Ronnie which are indeed accurate but seems to ignore a list of an equal or greater number of flaws on his heroes.
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I wouldn't worry about it Hulkster, not many take ND seriously.
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whats worse? having huge but bowling pin shaped forearms or looking like this?
::)
the guy makes no fucking sense :-\.
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I wouldn't worry about it Hulkster, not many take ND seriously.
this is true.
why would anyone who posts such stupidity be taken seriously?
most just laugh at ND.
I enjoy pointing out how ridiculous he is.
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this is true.
why would anyone who posts such stupidity be taken seriously?
most just laugh at ND.
I enjoy pointing out how ridiculous he is.
I liken ND to a man in a straitjacket who believes that it is in fact the rest of the world that is insane.
That said, he seems to understand the irrationality of religious people yet doesn't see it in his very own opinions on bodybuilding.
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I think if both men were contemporaries it would be a great battle.
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LOL ND is getting owned all the time on so many threads at once.
its great!
maybe one day he will realize how wrong he is when it comes to phyisque assesements.
then again, maybe not:
Hulkser you keep typing empty words , I thought we had the conversation? ;) most of the people on this thread alone agree Sergio is better and they're not talking just about structure either like I am and I've proven my case already on that even your boy pumpster knows this you're the only idiot in denial lol
and how am I wrong? you've yet to explain why because you can't let says everything else is equal with Sergio & Ronnie ( now pay attention idiot this is structure & balance & proportion ) Sergio still is more complete because he had proportionate calves and forearms there for he enjoys advantages Ronnie doesn't i.e. he has better balance & proportion even if the structure was equal and its not
See thats called proving you wrong , instead of typing I'm wrong please explain how I am wrong ( rhetorical )
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Ronnie's weaknesses in top form 1999.
1. Genetically odd shaped abs.
Sergio's weaknesses in top form 1972.
1. Lack of back width
2. Lack of back thickness.
3. No peak on biceps.
4. Conditioning was OK but lacking.
Boy you're delusional as well as dumb , his only weakness is oddly shaped abs ? lol poor muscular balance & proportion , pathetic underdeveloped calves , ummm lets see bitch tits , swollen abdomen , overdeveloped glutes that can be seen from the front
Sergio's back does NOT lack width thats just plain fucking ignorant , same with thickness I mean serious , peaked biceps isn't a weakness , Larry Scott's biceps weren't peaked never stopped them from being outstanding , although Sergio's aren't that impressive
Conditioning you'll get not fight from me .
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whats worse? having huge but bowling pin shaped forearms or looking like this?
::)
the guy makes no fucking sense :-\.
Hulkster thats what called a ' straw man ' but you know that because you've been exposed for setting these up some time now ;) its a stupid argument , please look it up if you were smart you'd steer clear of these but then again you're not smart
1995 Olympia thats from and Dorian was UNBEATABLE
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what really makes no sense with ND is that he can be so picky with the list of ronnie flaws, and yet not care that dorian has so many major flaws that most people rag on his physique on these boards daily.. ::)
ND is biased against Ronnie, but doesn't seem to care about everyone elses flaws.. ::)
When did I ever claim Dorian was without flaws? NEVER another lie , this is what you're working with? lol you have nothing so lets make shit up?
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ND's judgement for what makes a good bb'er is flawed.. I mean he's more concerned about claves than awesome biceps, overall arms, huge legs and a perfect back. He whines about Ronnie's gut, but Ronnie gut doesn't really effect his mandatory poses. Now if ND can argue that Yates' torn bicep didn't effect his poses, then I think Ronnie can be given a pass on his stomach and less than stellar calves.
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That's exactly my point. He picks a dozen little flaws in Ronnie which are indeed accurate but seems to ignore a list of an equal or greater number of flaws on his heroes.
My hero was Steve Reeves and my friend he was with out flaws , flawless thank you.
and I'm glad you agree that the flaws do indeed exist but having poor balance & proportion is not a little flaw .
-
ND's judgement for what makes a good bb'er is flawed.. I mean he's more concerned about claves than awesome biceps, overall arms, huge legs and a perfect back. He whines about Ronnie's gut, but Ronnie gut doesn't really effect his mandatory poses. Now if ND can argue that Yates' torn bicep didn't effect his poses, then I think Ronnie can be given a pass on his stomach and less than stellar calves.
It's not calves alone it lack of balance & proportion within the whole body , Ronnie never won for his outstanding balance & proportion and he didn't need it to beat someone who did like Cormier however with all things being equal , size & conditioning whoever has the better balance & proportion is going to win period , whoever is more complete and is a better poser will win.
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I liken ND to a man in a straitjacket who believes that it is in fact the rest of the world that is insane.
That said, he seems to understand the irrationality of religious people yet doesn't see it in his very own opinions on bodybuilding.
Matt you just contradicted yourself you're agreeing with me about Ronnie's flaws and then you're lamenting I'm some how wrong or my opinion is irrational lol how is pointing out his flaws irrational? its not he has them compared to a lot of people nothing irrational in stating the obvious.
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lol poor muscular balance & proportion , pathetic underdeveloped calves , ummm lets see bitch tits , swollen abdomen , overdeveloped glutes that can be seen from the front.
All of these are your opinions and at Ron's peak only one holds any water
and that is in 1998 his bitch tits were ugly. I think he took care of that by 1999 though.
Where was Ron in 1999 not proportioned? His calves were not a standout body part but still in
proportion with his legs in 1999. The overdeveloped glutes comment is your opinion but
one I think most would disagree with. You mentioned forearms at times too but even that
is something that I believe mainly only your eyes see.
I'll stick to my original statement: Only flaw in 1999 was genetically his abs.
I'll start with forearms.. I'll post a pic you put up with Sergio and Ronnie.
Check Sergios right and then Ronnies left. (Yes, I know Sergio had better forearms
but Ronnie's were not bad and certainly not out of proportion.
-
there is no comparison between peak sergio and 99 Ronnie - just look at that.
but then again, is it really fair? because Ronnie 99 is arguably the greatest overall physique ever seen onstage to date.
I laugh out loud every time you type this nonsense NO WHERE have I ever read 99 Olympia is the greatest overall physique , 2001 sure 1999 lol I mean you and bizzy are the only two think this.
-
Glutes... Look in proportion to me...
-
Calves... Although not Yatesish..Still within the realm
of being in proportion...
-
lol poor muscular balance & proportion , pathetic underdeveloped calves , ummm lets see bitch tits , swollen abdomen , overdeveloped glutes that can be seen from the front.
All of these are your opinions and at Ron's peak only one holds any water
and that is in 1998 his bitch tits were ugly. I think he took care of that by 1999 though.
Where was Ron in 1999 not proportioned? His calves were not a standout body part but still in
proportion with his legs in 1999. The overdeveloped glutes comment is your opinion but
one I think most would disagree with. You mentioned forearms at times too but even that
is something that I believe mainly only your eyes see.
I'll stick to my original statement: Only flaw in 1999 was genetically his abs.
I'll start with forearms.. I'll post a pic you put up with Sergio and Ronnie.
Check Sergios right and then Ronnies left. (Yes, I know Sergio had better forearms
but Ronnie's were not bad and certainly not out of proportion.
You're running neck & neck with Hulkster on delusion he's calves are in proportion with his quads? thats just stupid ontop of wrong his quads dominate his calves ontop of lacking any noteworthy development , they're lacking in the classic diamond shape and they're lacking size in proportion to his quads this isn't debateable its common knowledge , see in the same shot his glutes from the front thats overdeveloped and not in proportion with the rest of his physique , notice the forearms ontop of lacking great shape in the classic sense they're shaped like bowling pins and low and behold they get dwarfed by his massive biceps/triceps and look at the left nipple area it looks like the gyno is still there to me
-
And don't we all wish we had such a puffy stomach...
-
Calves... Although not Yatesish..Still within the realm
of being in proportion...
lmfao they're not even close to being in proportion in relation to his quads not by a long shot please check out this website
www.lenscrafters.com you need it.
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Nd has always tried to argue that in 99 Ronnie had glutes that were oversized.
problem is, as always, he has never EVER been able to show this: ::)
-
LOL ND is ranting like an insane lunatic.
he hates being shown to be clearly wrong and goes on like an incoherent crazy man when it happens..which is all the fucking time!
-
And don't we all wish we had such a puffy stomach...
Same contest , now granted when held on for dear life it was narrow but I watched the 99 Olympia and in transition from one pose to the other the gut is clearly visible and he made no bones about holding it in for years old news , Sergio had ( like Ronnie ) naturally narrow waist & hips however the difference is Sergio's abdomen is totally FLAT and Ronnie's well see for yourself .
-
calves in fine proportion in 99.
no different than anyone else:
-
notice in the last gut shot ND posted Ronnie's calves are in great proportion with his quads!
LMAO.
ND, just stop posting now.
-
calves in fine proportion in 99.
no different than anyone else:
LMFAO thats proportion to you? lol this is your idea of proportionate calves? man thank you for proving my case.
See pictures for future reference lol and take your time to study them because there will be quiz .
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I laugh out loud every time you type this nonsense NO WHERE have I ever read 99 Olympia is the greatest overall physique , 2001 sure 1999 lol I mean you and bizzy are the only two think this.
Hulster and I LOL...
Amazing how many people agree with me and Hulkster
about 1999 when presented with the evidence.
This is just from one thread on another board.
I didn't bother going past the 4th page.
1. In my mind ,thats Ronnies best ever shape. 1999
2. i agree.. that was a great physique alright...
3. the 99 RC is the best physique to ever step onstage
4. 99= Ronnies best ever
5. Thank you! I thought i was the only one who liked the 99' Coleman over the 03' one.
6. I agree with you FLEX 99 he looked the best IMO.
7. That physique is untouchable
8. 99 better than 03, untoucable
9. Ronnie's best ever
10. theres not a soul on this planet that could beat his shape in 99
11. nothings gonna beat his physique from the 1999 O.
12. 99-the best ever ronnie
13. 99 Ronnie Coleman... thge greatest EVER!!! COLEMAN 1999>ANYBODY!!!
-
Nd has always tried to argue that in 99 Ronnie had glutes that were oversized.
problem is, as always, he has never EVER been able to show this: ::)
I mean this isn't even worth a response lol
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I mean this isn't even worth a response lol
what the fuck?
considering I posted a clear shot of 99 Ronnie's entire back and glutes and they are in great proportion, I suggest you try and make an intelligent response otherwise you end up looking like an idiot who can't face the fact that he has been proven to be WRONG.
-
Hulster and I LOL...
Amazing how many people agree with me and Hulkster
about 1999 when presented with the evidence.
This is just from one thread on another board.
I didn't bother going past the 4th page.
1. In my mind ,thats Ronnies best ever shape. 1999
2. i agree.. that was a great physique alright...
3. the 99 RC is the best physique to ever step onstage
4. 99= Ronnies best ever
5. Thank you! I thought i was the only one who liked the 99' Coleman over the 03' one.
6. I agree with you FLEX 99 he looked the best IMO.
7. That physique is untouchable
8. 99 better than 03, untoucable
9. Ronnie's best ever
10. theres not a soul on this planet that could beat his shape in 99
11. nothings gonna beat his physique from the 1999 O.
12. 99-the best ever ronnie
13. 99 Ronnie Coleman... thge greatest EVER!!! COLEMAN 1999>ANYBODY!!!
What the hell is this? rabbits you're pulling out of your hat like your photoshopped 99 Olympia pics? and who are these people? I'm talking about people in the know like delusional people who think is only flaw is abs
to bad Ronnie doesn't agree with you , 1998 Olympia was his best Olympia showing according to Ronnie because his conditioning was spot on , I guess that means his conditioning in 99 wasn't spot on ;)
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Hulster and I LOL...
Amazing how many people agree with me and Hulkster
about 1999 when presented with the evidence.
This is just from one thread on another board.
I didn't bother going past the 4th page.
1. In my mind ,thats Ronnies best ever shape. 1999
2. i agree.. that was a great physique alright...
3. the 99 RC is the best physique to ever step onstage
4. 99= Ronnies best ever
5. Thank you! I thought i was the only one who liked the 99' Coleman over the 03' one.
6. I agree with you FLEX 99 he looked the best IMO.
7. That physique is untouchable
8. 99 better than 03, untoucable
9. Ronnie's best ever
10. theres not a soul on this planet that could beat his shape in 99
11. nothings gonna beat his physique from the 1999 O.
12. 99-the best ever ronnie
13. 99 Ronnie Coleman... thge greatest EVER!!! COLEMAN 1999>ANYBODY!!!
exactly.
but you are trying to be rational and intelligent with a man who has the brains of a pea :-\.
-
what the fuck?
considering I posted a clear shot of 99 Ronnie's entire back and glutes and they are in great proportion, I suggest you try and make an intelligent response otherwise you end up looking like an idiot who can't face the fact that he has been proven to be WRONG.
Hulkster I entertained your ignorance and nonsense way longer than I should , but this is beyond retarded I mean seriously .
-
exactly.
but you are trying to be rational and intelligent with a man who has the brains of a pea :-\.
No , no you admitted I'm smart ;) don't back peddle now .
-
and who are these people?
they are intelligent bodybuilding fans.
unlike you. :-\
ps Ronnie stated in 99 that he was in better shape than in 98. at the olympia contest itself in the Muscle and Fitness contest coverage.
I know you like to sweep this under the table, but facts are facts.
-
LOL ND is ranting like an insane lunatic.
he hates being shown to be clearly wrong and goes on like an incoherent crazy man when it happens..which is all the fucking time!
Hulkster you haven't shown anything , you post pictures and just type empty statements you're deathly afraid to post commentary because you always get exposed for being ignorant .
-
Same contest , now granted when held on for dear life it was narrow but I watched the 99 Olympia and in transition from one pose to the other the gut is clearly visible and he made no bones about holding it in for years old news , Sergio had ( like Ronnie ) naturally narrow waist & hips however the difference is Sergio's abdomen is totally FLAT and Ronnie's well see for yourself .
Did it effect his mandatory poses?
-
Did it effect his mandatory poses?
compared to HIS competition at the time no ! compared to someone who could match his size & conditioning it would .
-
ND,
You seem like an intelligent guy but one thing that you do over and over again
that at least I don't do; is use the worst/distorted possible pictures of Ronnie
to make your points. (You don't do it all the time but alot) You use the orange blurred pics of Ronnie all the time.
If I post a pic of someone I at least try to find a decent representative picture
of them.
-
Hulkster I entertained your ignorance and nonsense way longer than I should , but this is beyond retarded I mean seriously .
still avoiding? ::)
-
compared to HIS competition at the time no ! compared to someone who could match his size & conditioning it would .
and according to ND, this man matches his size and conditioning...: ::)
the man is a complete idiot:
-
they are intelligent bodybuilding fans.
unlike you. :-\
ps Ronnie stated in 99 that he was in better shape than in 98. at the olympia contest itself in the Muscle and Fitness contest coverage.
I know you like to sweep this under the table, but facts are facts.
NO You say he said that and you've been exposed as a liar already when you made up quotes that Shawn Ray said about Dorian Yates
and a few weeks ago after reflecting on his career Ronnie HIMSELF said his best Olympia showing was 1998 because specifically his conditioning was spot on this means his conditioning 1998 was NOT spot on . it was good enough to win but make NO mistake he wasn't as bone dry or rock hard as he was in 1998 .
-
You use the orange blurred pics of Ronnie all the time.
how else is he going to make what many feel is the greatest physique ever look bad?
distortion and out of focus shots are the only way to make this look bad:
-
and according to ND, this man matches his size and conditioning...: ::)
the man is a complete idiot:
No he's bigger and drier and much denser ;)
hulkster see straw men to go along with your other weak argument you know the one from ad populum lol you're not smart like me :)
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ND,
You seem like an intelligent guy but one thing that you do over and over again
that at least I don't do; is use the worst/distorted possible pictures of Ronnie
to make your points. (You don't do it all the time but alot) You use the orange blurred pics of Ronnie all the time.
If I post a pic of someone I at least try to find a decent representative picture
of them.
You know what the irony is? they use to post the same ones and hail them ;) and again maybe I should photoshop the pics you
-
NO You say he said that and you've been exposed as a liar already when you made up quotes that Shawn Ray said about Dorian Yates
and a few weeks ago after reflecting on his career Ronnie HIMSELF said his best Olympia showing was 1998 because specifically his conditioning was spot on this means his conditioning 1998 was NOT spot on . it was good enough to win but make NO mistake he wasn't as bone dry or rock hard as he was in 1998 .
the quote is right there in the magazine idiot.
I am going to see if someone over on one of the other boards still has the mag and get a scan posted to shut you up once and for all.
-
how else is he going to make what many feel is the greatest physique ever look bad?
distortion and out of focus shots are the only way to make this look bad:
Hypocrite see your above post with the 95 screenshot lol sucker
self owned
-
Hypocrite see your above post with the 95 screenshot lol sucker
self owned
that is a great shot of dorian.
he always looked that bad in that pose ::):
dorian wrote the book on upper body smoothness:
-
the quote is right there in the magazine idiot.
I am going to see if someone over on one of the other boards still has the mag and get a scan posted to shut you up once and for all.
Again it doesn't matter what he said EVEN if it true , but we have to take what you say with a grain of salt because you have LIED about quotes before , what matters after reflecting on his career just a couple of weeks ago Ronnie came to the conclusion 1998 was his best Olympia showing and who the fuck are you to argue with him? LOL
-
that is a great shot of dorian.
he always looked that bad in that pose ::):
dorian wrote the book on upper body smoothness:
See strawman ;) anymore weak arguments you'd like to present as evidence? you just bitched about not using the best pics and what do you do? lol what the smart people ( me ) expect you to do revert to straw men , I own you kid.
260 pounds unmatched density , bone dry & rock hard a man the mighty Paul Dillett said was Jesus Christ in the flesh .
-
how else is he going to make what many feel is the greatest physique ever look bad?
distortion and out of focus shots are the only way to make this look bad:
Keep posting photoshopped pics of Ronnie while I laugh at you .
-
Again it doesn't matter what he said EVEN if it true , but we have to take what you say with a grain of salt because you have LIED about quotes before , what matters after reflecting on his career just a couple of weeks ago Ronnie came to the conclusion 1998 was his best Olympia showing and who the fuck are you to argue with him? LOL
who I am to arue with him?
listen moron, if you sat down and showed Ronnie the videos of both the 98 and 99 olympia (like they were posted on youtube) even HE would say he was in better shape in 99.
its that obvious.
who the fuck are you to say that the visual evidence is wrong? because it isn't:
-
If Dillett had only had a back?
-
who I am to arue with him?
listen moron, if you sat down and showed Ronnie the videos of both the 98 and 99 olympia (like they were posted on youtube) even HE would say he was in better shape in 99.
its that obvious.
who the fuck are you to say that the visual evidence is wrong? because it isn't:
Now a real accurate comparison there Hulkster LMMFAO
Don't argue with Ronnie you don't look smart when you do .
When Hulkster is owned what does he do? revert to his ignorant self and post straw men comparisons even when its Ronnie lol
-
If Dillett had only had a back?
He's still lacked conditioning and density .
-
I'm not sure what this pic is supposed to prove but
from this one pic he looks bigger, fuller and grainyer
in the right one.
-
I'm not sure what this pic is supposed to prove but
from this one pic he looks bigger, fuller and grainyer
in the right one.
Oh he's bigger no one is arguing that just not as bone dry or rock hard and grainy is a term I've never heard use to describe Ronnie Coleman but then again what the hell he's also the best anyone ever looked onstage why can't be be grainy too? ::) hey maybe you can photoshop some graininess in?
-
Some amazing screen shots off youtube
1999 British GP...
-
Some amazing screen shots off youtube
1999 British GP...
never seen them before ::) , you ' touch ' those up as well?
-
never seen them before , you ' touch ' those up as well?
That actually cracked me up... Thx for the good laugh ND intended or not.
-
That actually cracked me up... Thx for the good laugh ND intended or not.
That was a legitimate question.
-
According to this article: http://www.ironage.us/articles/sergiovarnie.html
Sergio is 240 in those pics. The Ronnie pics range between 247-257 so there
is nowhere near a 30 pound difference unless the Ironage article is wrong.
I would also like to add that Sergio @ 240 has deltoid muscles dang close if not as big as Ronnie's.
The difference in weight is irrelevant. Why? Because you need to factor in Oliva's much higher bodyfat and water levels. The difference in weight is 17 lbs(240 lbs vs 257lbs) between Sergio and Ronnie at their respective primes, but when you take into consideration Oliva'a much higher bodyfat and water levels compared to Ronnie in his 1999 Olympia form, the actual advantage in muscle that Ronnie has over Sergio is closer to 30 lbs, and that reflects in much bigger and therefore wider deltoids. ;)
SUCKMYMUSCLE
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Oh he's bigger no one is arguing that just not as bone dry or rock hard and grainy is a term I've never heard use to describe Ronnie Coleman but then again what the hell he's also the best anyone ever looked onstage why can't be be grainy too? ::) hey maybe you can photoshop some graininess in?
being striated and vascular is better than being grainy and smooth ::).
why do you think so few people share your opinion that dorian was better than Ronnie at his best?
there is a damn good reason your opinion is so rare:
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Hey SMM,
I'm done with this thread but I'm going to show you some respect by replying to your comment.
Because you need to factor in Oliva's much higher bodyfat and water levels. The difference in weight is 17 lbs(240 lbs vs 257lbs) between Sergio and Ronnie at their respective primes, but when you take into consideration Oliva'a much higher bodyfat and water levels compared to Ronnie in his 1999 Olympia form, the actual advantage in muscle that Ronnie has over Sergio is closer to 30 lbs, and that reflects in much bigger and therefore wider deltoids.
I think you make an intelligent point about the weight difference. (Makes Sense.)
Sergio @ 240 had deltoid muscles close to the size of Ronnie's. Added muscle to the side
delts would make Sergio wider than he was back then but by the pictorial evidence, I believe Ronnie's clavicles are wider than Sergio's. (Taking into account that Sergio @ 240 already had deltoid muscles that came close to matching Ron @ his prime size wise.) (Not that Sergio's are narrow by any means.) Ronnie's clavicles are not as wide as Dillett's or Cutler's. (This is Gossip and Opinions and that's my opinion right or wrong.)
PEACE!!
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Sergio was a great BB with a great structure, but unless i am missing something Ronnie blows him out of the water.
-
Sergio was a great BB with a great structure, but unless i am missing something Ronnie blows him out of the water.
No...not missing anything there. You've pretty well figured it out.
-
Sergio was a great BB with a great structure, but unless i am missing something Ronnie blows him out of the water.
you are not missing anything 8)
-
great minds think alike 8)
-
Sergio Vs Ronnie - WHO WINS ??
Ronnie.
Any other questions, let me know.
-
matt c, straight to the point. ronnie would wipe the floor with sergio in a modern day contest.
-
you are not missing anything 8)
You are ;)
-
being striated and vascular is better than being grainy and smooth ::).
why do you think so few people share your opinion that dorian was better than Ronnie at his best?
there is a damn good reason your opinion is so rare:
Keep using photoshopped picture to ' prove ' your point and Dorian has plenty of striations stop acting like he's Jay Cutler kid , you think by Ronnie having more means he's better conditioned NOT true , Dorian has plenty of striations coupled with DENSITY which is highly prized in a bodybuilding contest you'd know this if you knew anything about competitive bodybuilding but you don't and thats why you've been reduced to using photoshopped pictures if Ronnie lol sucker
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It's safe to say that many people 'prefer' the Sergio look, aesthetically; however, in a bodybuilding contest he wouldn't hold a candle
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It's safe to say that many people 'prefer' the Sergio look, aesthetically; however, in a bodybuilding contest he wouldn't hold a candle
With all things being equal he would .
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deity, define 'all things' and how they can result in sergio beating ronnie, both in best form.
-
deity, define 'all things' and how they can result in sergio beating ronnie, both in best form.
Lets see if Sergio was born about the same time as Ronnie and he had the knowledge of modern diets , diuretics , anabolics , growth hormone , etc he would beat Ronnie because he would have everything Ronnie would and a better natural structure and muscular balance .
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Lets see if Sergio was born about the same time as Ronnie and he had the knowledge of modern diets , diuretics , anabolics , growth hormone , etc he would beat Ronnie because he would have everything Ronnie would and a better natural structure and muscular balance .
ah. i thought u meant on their physiques as we see them now. well that debate will never be resolved unless we get the delorian. ;)
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With all things being equal he would .
That's impossible to say with certainly. Definitely, he has a better bone structure, more pleasing lines and fuller muscle bellies, as well as better proportion and symmetry, so I tend to agree but not resolutely. Many other factors need to be considered
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That's impossible to say with certainly. Definitely, he has a better bone structure, more pleasing lines and fuller muscle bellies, as well as better proportion and symmetry, so I tend to agree but not resolutely. Many other factors need to be considered
Well I'm glad you agree about the structure and its NOT definite just hypothetical to many intangibles
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Keep using photoshopped picture to ' prove ' your point and Dorian has plenty of striations stop acting like he's Jay Cutler kid
photoshopped picture? ::)
is that going to be your new line of excuse every time Ronnie kills dorian?
::)
:-\
-
photoshopped picture? ::)
is that going to be your new line of excuse every time Ronnie kills dorian?
::)
:-\
Here you go ;) Bizzy admitted to ' adjusting ' these
-
Want more proof? lol
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quote and post please.
those are exactly the same as when they were first posted.
the first one by Iceman and the second by Bizzy from his VHS copy.
you are pulling excuses out of your ass.
::)
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LOL there goes ND with his blurry pics.. ::)
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http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?topic=69359.37150
same as when first taken by Bizzy, asshole. :P
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quote and post please.
those are exactly the same as when they were first posted.
the first one by Iceman and the second by Bizzy from his VHS copy.
you are pulling excuses out of your ass.
::)
I shed a little light
on Hulksters 99 side chest pic. I do this as well with any pics
that are too dark including Dorian's.
;)
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I shed a little light
on Hulksters 99 side chest pic. I do this as well with any pics
that are too dark including Dorian's.
;)
sigh.
your lack of intelligence is so fucking irritating.
first of all, the black and white mm I am posting is straight from Iceman1981's post.
what the fuck does Bizzy have to do with that pic? ::)
second of all, Bizzy took new screenshots.
he posted them.
How exactly did you make the leap that they were automatically adjusted?
::)
He adjusted some already existing screenshots and told us which ones as he posted them.
you are so damn stupid. :-\
-
sigh.
your lack of intelligence is so fucking irritating.
first of all, the black and white mm I am posting is straight from Iceman1981's post.
what the fuck does Bizzy have to do with that pic? ::)
second of all, Bizzy took new screenshots.
he posted them.
How exactly did you make the leap that they were automatically adjusted?
::)
MORON he said he adjusted them are you blind? and where do you think that black & white came from? he was created i.e. photoshopped any other excuses ?
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MORON he said he adjusted them are you blind? and where do you think that black & white came from? he was created i.e. photoshopped any other excuses ?
if I recall Bizzy was not the first one to post that pic.
Iceman was.
any other words of wisdom, idiot? ::)
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Any more excuses? ;)
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if I recall Bizzy was not the first one to post that pic.
Iceman was.
any other words of wisdom, idiot? ::)
IDIOT hello Bizzy admitted to ' adjusting ' them and you're using them like a sucker lol any more excuses?
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Hulkster keep posting those photoshopped pics lol you need them
-
ND is melting down because every single shot shows the same:
ronnie being at a level never attained by anyone else to date. LOL
including his heros. LOL
you still don't understand the distinction between a pic purposely altered and differences in pics that are an artifact of different people taking them with different programs from different sources with different monitors etc.
like I said, your lack of basic intelligence is irritating.
no wonder you were notably abscent in the 'academic credentials' thread. LMAO.
:P
-
IDIOT hello Bizzy admitted to ' adjusting ' them and you're using them like a sucker lol any more excuses?
he adjusted pics like the following, NOT the ones I posted, idiot.
but its too complicated for you to understand.
you have no brains at all, do you?
note the difference, highschool grad.
-
ND is melting down because every single shot shows the same:
ronnie being at a level never attained by anyone else to date. LOL
including his heros. LOL
you still don't understand the distinction between a pic purposely altered and differences in pics that are an artifact of different people taking them with different programs from different sources with different monitors etc.
like I said, your lack of basic intelligence is irritating.
no wonder you were notably abscent in the 'academic credentials' thread. LMAO.
:P
OWNED ;)
You're using photoshopped pics kid lol you're desperate and owned
forced reps sceen cap from the DVD and Bizzy's photoshopped DVD screen cap lol keep posting photoshopped pics it show how desperate you are lol
you're fucked kid. ;)
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he adjusted pics like the following, NOT the ones I posted, idiot.
but its too complicated for you to understand.
you have no brains at all, do you?
note the difference, highschool grad.
I love when you get owned besides showing your stupidity it shows your frustration lol and you're the one who posted how smart I was ;)
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forced reps sceen cap from the DVD and Bizzy's photoshopped DVD screen cap lol keep posting photoshopped pics it show how desperate you are lol
like I said, different people, different programs, different monitors etc.
you just don't get it.
I am losing patience with your stupidity.
recall, you idiots tried to say the same thing between foredreps two sets of screencaps and he OWNED your asses and put you in your places.
might want to read this bold statement again so your grade 4 level intelligence can understand it. :-\
-
like I said, different people, different programs, different monitors etc.
you just don't get it.
I am losing patience with your stupidity.
recall, you idiots tried to say the same thing between foredreps two sets of screencaps and he OWNED your asses and put you in your places.
might want to read this bold statement again so your grade 4 level intelligence can understand it. :-\
SUCKER I wasn't there for the forced reps nonsense so don't lump me in ;) and again you are reduced to using PHOTOSHOPPED pictures as proof lol you're so desperate its not funny and it has NOTHING to do with , different people or monitors or programs it got to do with Bizzy admitting he photoshopped pics and you USING them knowingly lol
what excuses are you left with? NONE lol forcedreps screencaps from the DVD VS Bizzy's worked screencaps from the DVD you're fucked and you're
OWNED
you must hate me for exposing you for the idiot you are lol you should have accepted the truce and man have you paid dearly for not doing so lol
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ND is very, very, very intelligent!!!
...
For someone who doesn't know what he's talking about, lol!!!
-
Hey, I've admitted to lighting up ANY pictures
that are too dark. Dorian and Ronnie both. I've done this
WWWAAAAAYYYYY before I ever got involved in this discussion.
The 3 pics I put up from my VCR to DVD transfer don't look too
good in my opinion. I said at that time I had a few kinks to work
out since that was my 1st VHS to DVD transfer. When I lighted
up a few 1999 pics it was because someone had commented
something to the effect; "That how can you even see anything
the pictures are so dark." I said and didn't hide anything, "Let's shed a little light
on 99." When you put a black man against a black backdrop and the pictures
are dark; How are you actually going to be able to tell what they REALLY look
like? If I was stretching or morphing pics I think you would have a legitimate gripe
but adding a little light to a dark picture is just an excuse in my opinion.
I've lightened some of Dorian's pics which other people have used and you havn't
heard one complaint from the Coleman side.
-
Hey, I've admitted to lighting up ANY pictures
that are too dark. Dorian and Ronnie both. I've done this
WWWAAAAAYYYYY before I ever got involved in this discussion.
The 3 pics I put up from my VCR to DVD transfer don't look too
good in my opinion. I said at that time I had a few kinks to work
out since that was my 1st VHS to DVD transfer. When I lighted
up a few 1999 pics it was because someone had commented
something to the effect; "That how can you even see anything
the pictures are so dark." I said and didn't hide anything, "Let's shed a little light
on 99." When you put a black man against a black backdrop and the pictures
are dark; How are you actually going to be able to tell what they REALLY look
like? If I was stretching or morphing pics I think you would have a legitimate gripe
but adding a little light to a dark picture is just an excuse in my opinion.
I've lightened some of Dorian's pics which other people have used and you havn't
heard one complaint from the Coleman side.
NO one is claiming your morphed the pics but there is more than just lighting sorry sport !
-
That's one of the 3 pics from I put up
from the 1st VHS to DVD transfer. I personally
think it looks like crap but you are right. It is lighting
and contrast on those 3 pics. I overdid the contrast
and I think the one on the left looks alot better.
-
That's one of the 3 pics from I put up
from the 1st VHS to DVD transfer. I personally
think it looks like crap but you are right. It is lighting
and contrast on those 3 pics. I overdid the contrast
and I think the one on the left looks alot better.
The one on the left isn't yours
-
BTW - I consider lighting and contrast to go hand in hand.
They are interconnected in the whole lighting process.
I wasn't trying to hide anything just letting you know
everything that was done and why. I have NEVER messed
with colors or anything like that.
-
The one on the left isn't yours
Exactly, I think mine looks like crap. I did quick adjustments
because my 1st VHS to DVD transfer didn't come out that great.
I was making a joke at the time and I think they look like crap.
If you go back to when I first posted them you'll know what I mean.
I had caps of Ronnie looking at different bodyparts and commenting on them.
Your really blowing this WAY out of proportion.
-
Exactly, I think mine looks like crap. I did quick adjustments
because my 1st VHS to DVD transfer didn't come out that great.
I was making a joke at the time and I think they look like crap.
If you go back to when I first posted them you'll know what I mean.
I had caps of Ronnie looking at different bodyparts and commenting on them.
Your really blowing this WAY out of proportion.
I'm blowing it WAY out of proportion ? I don't think so its not an accurate representation of how he really looked I commend you on your honesty but make no mistake Hulkster is using them because he thinks they do look better so he's flat out wrong.
-
When I say they look like crap, I still think Ronnie
looks great in the pics and I can see why Hulkster
would like them. From an artistic perspective they do look
like crap because the contrast is way too high. I was in a hurry
and my 1st Vhs to DVD transfer wasn't set quite right to get
the best picture.
-
Hey SMM,
I think you make an intelligent point about the weight difference. (Makes Sense.)
Sergio @ 240 had deltoid muscles close to the size of Ronnie's. Added muscle to the side
delts would make Sergio wider than he was back then but by the pictorial evidence, I believe Ronnie's clavicles are wider than Sergio's. (Taking into account that Sergio @ 240 already had deltoid muscles that came close to matching Ron @ his prime size wise.) (Not that Sergio's are narrow by any means.) Ronnie's clavicles are not as wide as Dillett's or Cutler's. (This is Gossip and Opinions and that's my opinion right or wrong.)
PEACE!!
The fact that Oliva had shoulders almost as wide as Ronnie's despite carrying some 30 lbs of muscle less is proof that Sergio's clavicles were much wider naturally. ;)
SUCKMYMUSCLE
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ND is very, very, very intelligent!!!
...
For someone who doesn't know what he's talking about, lol!!!
ND is a borderline Iron Age genius, one of their "best". ::) Don't laugh, he's perfectly willing to miscontrue practically anything in efforts to remain permanetly befuddled.
-
ND is a borderline Iron Age genius, one of their "best". ::)
Hey thanks man ! wow you guys got demoralized humble after seeing that Yates video . :)
-
ND is one of Iron Age's "elite". ::) Don't laugh, he's perfectly willing to miscontrue practically anything & is basically permanetly befuddled.
You always change your posts lol leave them alone already you dolt ! ;) and you're the guy who claimed Tiger Woods is overrated and the CFL is just as good as the NFL , please don't comment on people's intelligence ! oh and you might want to learn how to spell misconstrue as well ;)
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You always change your posts lol leave them alone already you dolt ! ;) and you're the guy who claimed Tiger Woods is overrated and the CFL is just as good as the NFL , please don't comment on people's intelligence ! oh and you might want to learn how to spell misconstrue as well ;)
Obsessed with me, now rehashing miscontrued comments from years ago LOL stick to the topic, don't meltdown again and forget about me for a minute bwahahahaaha
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Obsessed with me, now rehashing miscontrued comments from years ago LOL stick to the topic, don't meltdown again and forget about me for a minute bwahahahaaha
man where should I begin ? you're a hypocrite ( old news ) you're obsessed with me hence why you didn't stick to the topic like you suggest and mentioned ME ;) and I've yet to meltdown on any messageboard unlike you who freaked when the BowFlex pics were posted lol and you still spelled misconstrued wrong lol I guess you can't teach old dogs new tricks .