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Getbig Main Boards => Gossip & Opinions => Topic started by: King Shizzo on August 19, 2012, 01:41:12 PM
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What would you do if humans found out that there was no god, no afterlife, etc.... Would you be tempted to sin? Steal, cheat, murder etc....? Would the Police /government matter anymore? Would there be civil wars in every major country? There is a good that comes from religion.
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What would you do if humans found out that there was no god, no afterlife, etc.... Would you be tempted to sin? Steal, cheat, murder etc....? Would the Police /government matter anymore? Would there be civil wars in every major country? There is a good that comes from religion.
Only this one ;D
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Only this one ;D
The world is either going to end in a natural disaster, or through a scenario like the movie The Book Of Eli.
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In a world without religion, we would revert back to a true "survival of the fittest attitude". He who is the strongest, takes what he wants.
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God tells you People > Potatoes.
http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=c5f_1309711220&comments=1 (http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=c5f_1309711220&comments=1)
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Look to the end of the 1st show of Dexter, season 6.
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What would you do if humans found out that there was no god, no afterlife, etc.... Would you be tempted to sin? Steal, cheat, murder etc....? Would the Police /government matter anymore? Would there be civil wars in every major country? There is a good that comes from religion.
Is this a troll or do you not get that the bulk of the population these days are athiests ???
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Is this a troll or do you not get that the bulk of the population these days are athiests ???
You are a true moron if you think this. More people believe in "something" rather than nothing. That is what keeps the moral flood gates from spilling over.
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THE MADMAN
Have you not heard of that madman who lit a lantern in the bright morning hours, ran to the market place, and cried incessantly: "I seek God! I seek God!" -- As many of those who did not believe in God were standing around just then, he provoked much laughter. Has he got lost? asked one. Did he lose his way like a child? asked another. Or is he hiding? Is he afraid of us? Has he gone on a voyage? emigrated? -- Thus they yelled and laughed.
The madman jumped into their midst and pierced them with his eyes. "Whither is God?" he cried; "I will tell you. We have killed him -- you and I. All of us are his murderers. But how did we do this? How could we drink up the sea? Who gave us the sponge to wipe away the entire horizon? What were we doing when we unchained this earth from its sun? Whither is it moving now? Whither are we moving? Away from all suns? Are we not plunging continually? Backward, sideward, forward, in all directions? Is there still any up or down? Are we not straying, as through an infinite nothing? Do we not feel the breath of empty space? Has it not become colder? Is not night continually closing in on us? Do we not need to light lanterns in the morning? Do we hear nothing as yet of the noise of the gravediggers who are burying God? Do we smell nothing as yet of the divine decomposition? Gods, too, decompose. God is dead. God remains dead. And we have killed him.
"How shall we comfort ourselves, the murderers of all murderers? What was holiest and mightiest of all that the world has yet owned has bled to death under our knives: who will wipe this blood off us? What water is there for us to clean ourselves? What festivals of atonement, what sacred games shall we have to invent? Is not the greatness of this deed too great for us? Must we ourselves not become gods simply to appear worthy of it? There has never been a greater deed; and whoever is born after us -- for the sake of this deed he will belong to a higher history than all history hitherto."
Here the madman fell silent and looked again at his listeners; and they, too, were silent and stared at him in astonishment. At last he threw his lantern on the ground, and it broke into pieces and went out. "I have come too early," he said then; "my time is not yet. This tremendous event is still on its way, still wandering; it has not yet reached the ears of men. Lightning and thunder require time; the light of the stars requires time; deeds, though done, still require time to be seen and heard. This deed is still more distant from them than most distant stars -- and yet they have done it themselves.
It has been related further that on the same day the madman forced his way into several churches and there struck up his requiem aeternam deo. Led out and called to account, he is said always to have replied nothing but: "What after all are these churches now if they are not the tombs and sepulchers of God?"
[Source: Friedrich Nietzsche, The Gay Science (1882, 1887) para. 125; Walter Kaufmann ed. (New York: Vintage, 1974), pp.181-82.]
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You are a true moron if you think this. More people believe in "something" rather than nothing. That is what keeps the moral flood gates from spilling over.
Just because there is no god or afterlife don't stop belief, believing in something is a far stretch to believing in god and afterlife. Anyhow I'm not getting in a debate about what percentage of the pop believes in something, in either situation there is a large enough number of atheist to see there is no significant amount of crime found with atheists versus theists.
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Just because there is no god or afterlife don't stop belief, believing in something is a far stretch to believing in god and afterlife. Anyhow I'm not getting in a debate about what percentage of the pop believes in something, in either situation there is a large enough number of atheist to see there is no significant amount of crime found with atheists versus theists.
The truth is that nobody knows for sure. If we knew for a fact that nothing awaited us after death, then there would be total global anarchy. The new "wild west" if you will.
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The truth is that nobody knows for sure. If we knew for a fact that nothing awaited us after death, then there would be total global anarchy. The new "wild west" if you will.
But atheists believe there is no god that is what it means. I'm not talking about agnostics.
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There are plenty of atheists walking around that dont do any of that stuff. Not because they're afraid of a Big Being zapping them, but because those things are wrong. It's childish to need Daddy to tell you "No no no don't do that". Actually many atheists behave better than a many religious people, because they think for themselves and aren't intellectually self arrested. Exceptions to both sides exist of course.
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But atheists believe there is no god that is what it means. I'm not talking about agnostics.
Why can't someone (like me) have the balls to admit that my primitive brain can't comprehend one way or another? I definately don't follow the man-made bible, but I do think that there is a reason why there are billions of planets out there. There is almost no mathematical chance that we are the only living life forms in the universe. I believe in a higher power, I just have no idea who or what it is. None of us do.
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Why can't someone (like me) have the balls to admit that my primitive brain can't comprehend one way or another? I definately don't follow the man-made bible, but I do think that there is a reason why there are billions of planets out there. There is almost no mathematical chance that we are the only living life forms in the universe. I believe in a higher power, I just have no idea who or what it is. None of us do.
Because were creatures based on instincts or emotions, anyhow your far from an atheist.
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Because were creatures based on instincts or emotions, anyhow your far from an atheist.
never said I was an atheist.
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The two biggest head trips in human history. Government and Religion. Get rid of them both and evolve the species.
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The two biggest head trips in human history. Government and Religion. Get rid of them both and evolve the species.
We do need a government for things. A standing army, Building projects, Etc....
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Statistically therea are FAR more criminals who believe "in god" in jail than these who doesn't.. Religion just stole the idea of "being moral" and used it as it's own. Not doing crimes ust because one is affraid (not because one understands the consequances) is a pretty stupid idea anyway..
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Statistically therea are FAR more criminals who believe "in god" in jail than these who doesn't.. Religion just stole the idea of "being moral" and used it as it's own. Not doing crimes ust because one is affraid (not because one understands the consequances) is a pretty stupid idea anyway..
lol "understanding the consequences" ::)
consequences of selling drugs = i get rich, someone gets high. beyond that, good luck with your analysis...
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Statistically therea are FAR more criminals who believe "in god" in jail than these who doesn't.. Religion just stole the idea of "being moral" and used it as it's own. Not doing crimes ust because one is affraid (not because one understands the consequances) is a pretty stupid idea anyway..
I'm not sure they believe. It's probably more like they hope they can be saved.
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Is this a troll or do you not get that the bulk of the population these days are athiests ???
No, the bulk of the population only believes in God when it suits them to do so. People in general are too busy to let god or the belief in god occupy their time.
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Neil deGrasse Tyson
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This thread is a perfect example of why walmart employees suck dick for extra cash cuz making minimum wage ain't pretty.
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deep thread
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This thread is a perfect example of why walmart employees suck dick for extra cash cuz making minimum wage ain't pretty.
Did you know I worked for Walmart? I make far more then mininum wage.
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Did you know I worked for Walmart? I make far more then mininum wage.
Why does the mensroom at Walmart always smell like freshly squeezed feces regardless of whether or not it's been cleaned?
Is there an unwritten rule that states all men must wipe a booger somewhere in the stall they're taking a leak in?
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lol "understanding the consequences" ::)
consequences of selling drugs = i get rich, someone gets high. beyond that, good luck with your analysis...
consequences = REAL fukkin punishment while STILL alive, not in a fukkin imaginable "afterlife" (oh, and if one is "sorry"enough - god will probably forgive anyway..).
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Did you know I worked for Walmart? I make far more then mininum wage.
Of course i knew. Why you think i made that comment, genius?
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Retard and RAtard battling it out over substantive philosophical issues in this thread. Who will reign supreme?
Here are some issues for the combatants to consider:
1. What do you mean by "God"?
2. What does it mean to "believe" something?
3. What do you think you are referring to when you say "morality"?
1. Anything or anyone that could have created the human race.
2. I hope, I don't believe.
3. Morality is a "human" trait. Survival of the fittest would be the best fit for mammals. Humans are mammals. We forget that.
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Retard and RAtard battling it out over substantive philosophical issues in this thread. Who will reign supreme?
Here are some issues for the combatants to consider:
1. What do you mean by "God"?
2. What does it mean to "believe" something?
3. What do you think you are referring to when you say "morality"?
What do you mean by "What"?
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What would you do if humans found out that there was no god, no afterlife, etc.... Would you be tempted to sin? Steal, cheat, murder etc....? Would the Police /government matter anymore? Would there be civil wars in every major country? There is a good that comes from religion.
So believers are only behaving because of reward/punishment ?
The true test is doing the right thing when NO ONE is ' watching '
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No, the bulk of the population only believes in God when it suits them to do so. People in general are too busy to let god or the belief in god occupy their time.
It's like the Philosopher Daniel Dennet says , people believe in belief
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Hope is for control
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modern atheists all have christian beliefs deeply rooted in their mind, but they re not aware of it. It's when things get tough that they realize. But most have forgotten what's inside them, because they parents, grandparents, forgot, too. Every human being has a concept of good and evil/bad. There is only one system of belief that is superior to all of them, though.
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No, the bulk of the population only believes in God when it suits them to do so. People in general are too busy to let god or the belief in god occupy their time.
There are no atheists in foxholes. ;)
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1. Anything or anyone that could have created the human race.
2. I hope, I don't believe.
3. Morality is a "human" trait. Survival of the fittest would be the best fit for mammals. Humans are mammals. We forget that.
even in the human specie, it's all about survival of the fittest. Wait for a world war to start and you ll see. You defend those you need to stay alive, you ignore those who arent useful to your own survival. Most atheists see things that way. You have to feel like you re part of something bigger, to feel empathy, compassion for the suffering of someone you absolutely dont know.
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When you cease to cherish opinions all you will know is truth. There is little truth to be had in life and every bit of it stands before YOU. We must have a basic understanding of all of the truth that is available to us to even begin to get a picture of what really IS in life. The only truth we'll ever truly hold is what we alone have experienced. Even our very own experiences are partially valid. We live in a world of mystery and every wants to call it somethign other than that. Most people have such a thirst for this truth of god they look past the only truth that is available to ANYONE and look to others that say that they know or those that say they've read something written by someone who ''knows.'' It's really strange to see people so caught up in what's so obviously not real. And the wild part is that they're serious.
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"Give me the piece of information this interrogative pronoun refers to, as indicated by this sentence."
WHY do you ask?
Why are some words in quotes (ex: "God", "believe", "morality")? Are you suggesting the words don't exist?
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When you cease to cherish opinions all you will know is truth. There is little truth to be had in life and every bit of it stands before YOU. We must have a basic understanding of all of the truth that is available to us to even begin to get a picture of what really IS in life. The only truth we'll ever truly hold is what we alone have experienced. Even our very own experiences are partially valid. We live in a world of mystery and every wants to call it somethign other than that. Most people have such a thirst for this truth of god they look past the only truth that is available to ANYONE and look to others that say that they know or those that say they've read something written by someone who ''knows.'' It's really strange to see people so caught up in what's so obviously not real. And the wild part is that they're serious.
deep man....deep.
oh, my apologies, forget we're on Getbig......deep man brah....deep.
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What would you do if humans found out that there was no god, no afterlife, etc.... Would you be tempted to sin? Steal, cheat, murder etc....? Would the Police /government matter anymore? Would there be civil wars in every major country? There is a good that comes from religion.
There would be a lot more suicides across the globe for sure. I'm guessing many millions of people would just off themselves.
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Is this a troll or do you not get that the bulk of the population these days are athiests ???
A lot of atheists aren't really atheists on the inside.
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modern atheists all have christian beliefs deeply rooted in their mind, but they re not aware of it. It's when things get tough that they realize. But most have forgotten what's inside them, because they parents, grandparents, forgot, too. Every human being has a concept of good and evil/bad. There is only one system of belief that is superior to all of them, though.
Most atheists were Christians and came the conclusion it's bullshit. I was baptized a ' born again ' Christian , as I got older I realized the obvious religion is bullshit and God is man's feeble attempt at explaining the natural world
We don't need any Bronze age story to explain life anymore God and religion are outdated and obsolete. The only reason they persist is because of people's fear of death and the fantasy that everyone will be reunited in heaven
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Most atheists were Christians and came the conclusion it's bullshit. I was baptized a ' born again ' Christian , as I got older I realized the obvious religion is bullshit and God is man's feeble attempt at explaining the natural world
We don't need any Bronze age story to explain life anymore God and religion are outdated and obsolete. The only reason they persist is because of people's fear of death and the fantasy that everyone will be reunited in heaven
Some atheists were nominal Christians once. There are also a number of aths/ags that became Christians too.
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The two biggest head trips in human history. Government and Religion. Get rid of them both and evolve the species.
The problem is the major governments of the world have secure bunkers very deep in the earth that can house thousands if not millions of souls. They themselves can create a "natural" disaster to wipe out most of humanity all the while their bloodlines stay in complete control in the New World that will be rebuilt. Many people believe that this sort of the thing has been going on for over a billion years on earth.
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Some atheists were nominal Christians once.
That's the problem with Christians , everyone says ' oh he's not a ' real Christian ' ::)
I wasn't given the choice to go to church or get baptized my mother decided that , I could care less about being a Christian especially at that age. The older I got the more I read up on religion and the argument against it and the obvious appeared
You edited your post. I would say more Christians become atheists than vice-versa
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Most atheists were Christians and came the conclusion it's bullshit.
No, atheists are christians who didnt understand faith anymore or have been led to misunderstand/despise it by people who gave a bad name to christianism. Thanks to put things in their correct order, if you want to sound logical and rationalistic.
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Atheists and Christians both speak in absolutes. Because so, they both cancel themselves out of the big picture.
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No, atheists are christians who didnt understand faith anymore or have been led to misunderstand/despise it by people who gave a bad name to christianism. Thanks to put things in their correct order, if you want to sound logical and rationalistic.
No , Atheists were Christians who did understand that's why the are non-believers
like Isaac Asimov said Properly read, the Bible is the most potent force for atheism ever conceived.
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modern atheists all have christian beliefs deeply rooted in their mind, but they re not aware of it. It's when things get tough that they realize. But most have forgotten what's inside them, because they parents, grandparents, forgot, too. Every human being has a concept of good and evil/bad. There is only one system of belief that is superior to all of them, though.
good post.
lot of "atheists" decrying god and religion in one breath, only to turn around and loudly uphold christian morals with the next.
also lol @ "we don't need religion anymore, science tells us the truth!!"
epic still believing in truth, the core of all christianity ::)
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good post.
lot of "atheists" decrying god and religion in one breath, only to turn around and loudly uphold christian morals with the next.
also lol @ "we don't need religion anymore, science tells us the truth!!"
epic still believing in truth, the core of all christianity ::)
Hahahahahaha the ' truth ' being the core of all Christianity ;D
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Life on earth is a test. We re molecules in a test tube, we re grown like grass, and a constant selection is at work everywhere. We re only designed to see/understand a small fraction of the big picture.
Either that, or we re machines programmed to kill each others endlessly until we re wiped by a natural disaster or our own hand.
"Intelligent", educated, faithful people maturing through life understand this. They understand the real meaning of the constant concept of causes/consequences. They cultivate themselves, others, in order to produce life, while others spend their whole life destroying it.
Ultimately they are able to choose, select, for themselves or others, between good and evil. Human life couldnt keep going on if religion(s) didnt exist and if these people didnt exist.
Religion is the cement between human beings. It gives people a meaning to their existence, a story where they can be a character. It explains the past, the present, and the future of mankind itself.
When the world population will be hit by the recession and wars that may follows, religion will be needed again. All of this is cyclical. After too many decades forgetting God, some men are selected to survive, while all the unfaithful ones swimming in their sins disappear massively, until one day the realm of God on earth is created by the very few remaining men.
Then, He will come.
All of those who died giving their life to prepare the kingdom of God on earth will join Him, and their fathers who did the same.
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Hahahahahaha the ' truth ' being the core of all Christianity ;D
All educated , proeminent scientists come from deeply religious families. Atheist families do not produce scientists.
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All educated , proeminent scientists come from deeply religious families. Atheist families do not produce scientists.
The moment you typed ' All ' is the moment you wont be taken seriously.
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That's the problem with Christians , everyone says ' oh he's not a ' real Christian ' ::)
I wasn't given the choice to go to church or get baptized my mother decided that , I could care less about being a Christian especially at that age. The older I got the more I read up on religion and the argument against it and the obvious appeared
You edited your post. I would say more Christians become atheists than vice-versa
Exactly, you just said it yourself....you weren't a real Christian. You had no genuine relationship with Christ. You were taken to church regularly, baptized and went through the motions with your family, but you didn't truly understand as a child. Then when you matured you began studying, asking questions and I assume your folks weren't able to provide sufficient answers to your questions so you made a choice for yourself. It's by no means an uncommon situation. Still regular attendance at a church, being dunked in a small pool of water at church, drinking grape juice and eating stale communion wafers, having Aunt Tilly give you a bible with your name on it does not make a Christian.
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Life on earth is a test. We re molecules in a test tube, we re grown like grass, and a constant selection is at work everywhere. We re only designed to see/understand a small fraction of the big picture.
Either that, or we re machines programmed to kill each others endlessly until we re wiped by a natural disaster or our own hand.
"Intelligent", educated, faithful people maturing through life understand this. They understand the real meaning of the constant concept of causes/consequences. They cultivate themselves, others, in order to produce life, while others spend their whole life destroying it.
Ultimately they are able to choose, select, for themselves or others, between good and evil. Human life couldnt keep going on if religion(s) didnt exist and if these people didnt exist.
Religion is the cement between human beings. It gives people a meaning to their existence, a story where they can be a character. It explains the past, the present, and the future of mankind itself.
When the world population will be hit by the recession and wars that may follows, religion will be needed again. All of this is cyclical. After too many decades forgetting God, some men are selected to survive, while all the unfaithful ones swimming in their sins disappear massively, until one day the realm of God on earth is created by the very few remaining men.
Then, He will come.
All of those who died giving their life to prepare the kingdom of God on earth will join Him, and their fathers who did the same.
Keep ' believing ' that it's all you can do. ;)
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What do you mean by "What"?
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Exactly, you just said it yourself....you weren't a real Christian. You had no genuine relationship with Christ. You were taken to church regularly, baptized and went through the motions with your family, but you didn't truly understand as a child. Then when you matured you began studying, asking questions and I assume your folks weren't able to provide sufficient answers to your questions so you made a choice for yourself. It's by no means an uncommon situation. Still regular attendance at a church, being dunked in a small pool of water at church, drinking grape juice and eating stale communion wafers, having Aunt Tilly give you a bible with your name on it does not make a Christian.
Yes the old ' real Christian ' conundrum, I see people say that all the time Catholics say it about Evangelicals , they say it about Catholics , Seventh Day Adventists say it about both , everyone says Mormons aren't , there is no such thing as a ' real Christian ' everyone else's version isn't the real one ::)
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Let's see how you manage to go thru what's coming being a cynical, nihilistic atheist "NarcissisticDeity" ::)
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Let's see how you manage to go thru what's coming being a cynical, nihilistic atheist "NarcissisticDeity" ::)
Oh noes the rapture is coming lol like I said keep believing it's all you can do.
And I actually chose this name because it perfectly describes the God of the Christian bible
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Yes the old ' real Christian ' conundrum, I see people say that all the time Catholics say it about Evangelicals , they say it about Catholics , Seventh Day Adventists say it about both , everyone says Mormons aren't , there is no such thing as a ' real Christian ' everyone else's version isn't the real one ::)
People are great about defining and labeling each other, but a decision for Christ is an individual decision and an individual walk. The "Christian conundrum" you mention doesn't fit your situation. You were a child that didn't fully understand and didn't make a choice...it was made for you. As you matured you then made a choice for yourself. That said, you weren't a Christian, but you did participate in regular Christian activities. This isn't an insult, this is just the situation you indicated.
I just don't want others reading the suggested notion that "I was a Christian and left the faith for atheism". This didn't happen here.
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that just means I'm mentioning the terms rather than using them. It's the difference between saying 'What does God mean?' and 'What does "God" mean?" The first is asking what the creator of the universe means in some given situation, whereas the second is referring to the WORD God.
LOL!! I appreciate you playing along! Just messin with ya!
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People are great about defining and labeling each other, but a decision for Christ is an individual decision and an individual walk. The "Christian conundrum" you mention doesn't fit your situation. You were a child that didn't fully understand and didn't make a choice...it was made for you. As you matured you then made a choice for yourself. That said, you weren't a Christian, but you did participate in regular Christian activities. This isn't an insult, this is just the situation you indicated.
You'll get no argument from me about me being a ' true Christian ' but that term gets thrown around to much anyway , everyone think's they are a true Christian and thinks everyone else isn't
My mother who is a ' true Christian ' scoffs at Catholics ( ironically my father was one ) and says they are not true Christians because they pray and worship statues :-\
You think you're a true Christian some other Christians probably wouldn't feel you are , like all religions claim to be the one true one
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that just means I'm mentioning the terms rather than using them. It's the difference between saying 'What does God mean?' and 'What does "God" mean?" The first is asking what the creator of the universe means in some given situation, whereas the second is referring to the WORD God.
Bro no offence but this is getbig and half your post's are about correcting people on their English. Bro no one gives a shit, stop with this obsession of yours. Everyone around here understands each other. Fuckman this isn't school brother :-\
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You'll get no argument from me about me being a ' true Christian ' but that term gets thrown around to much anyway , everyone think's they are a true Christian and thinks everyone else isn't
My mother who is a ' true Christian ' scoffs at Catholics ( ironically my father was one ) and says they are not true Christians because they pray and worship statues :-\
You think you're a true Christian some other Christians probably wouldn't feel you are , like all religions claim to be the one true one
Well, I don't disagree with your response here, but my last few replies were more about the statement you made about most atheists being former Christians. Certainly some Christians have become atheists (and vice versa), but by no means are most atheists former Christians. When you included your background it appeared you were using that to emphasize this point, but I just wanted to note for other readers that a baptized child that attended regular Sunday school that made no personal decision for Christ and later as an adult calls himself/herself an atheist was not a former Christian that became an atheist.
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AHAAHAHA!!! He is "syntaxmachine"...it's in the name.
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What would you do if humans found out that there was no god, no afterlife, etc.... Would you be tempted to sin? Steal, cheat, murder etc....? Would the Police /government matter anymore? Would there be civil wars in every major country? There is a good that comes from religion.
Humanity has been living in a world without GOD since time began, people don't need fairy tales to motivate them to behave morally, it is actually in an individuals own best interest to act in a way that is based on minimising the suffering of his fellow man. A world were some believe in GOD has caused millions to die and suffer. Hardly what any decent individual would call "GOOD". Perhaps you should research what your fellow GOD Botherers (The Church) have done to steal, cheat and murder in the name of GOD, God Botherers SINS have known no end, they commit horrendous crimes and attempt to cover them up, from the Spanish Inquisition, burning women at the stake, there support of NAZISM, Pedophilia etc etc. the list is endless of the crimes by God Botherers - they are vile and evil and suffer from the greatest ignorance and indoctrination known to man. I feel sorry for you, that you blindly believe that nonsense.
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In a world without religion, we would revert back to a true "survival of the fittest attitude". He who is the strongest, takes what he wants.
That's what we currently have you idiot! How do you think it is that you ended up an ignorant imbecile with little resources while others run the military, dominate other countries, create and remove laws, have unlimited financial reserves, control the media and what people believe etc, etc, You have made the mistake of thinking that strength is bench pressing 500 pounds, strength in modern day terms is power and control, and those at the top of the tree, do as they please and take what they want.
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Human life couldnt keep going on if religion(s) didnt exist and if these people didnt exist.
Somehow it made through for eons of years... ::)
Uh oh, and statistically (take ANY country) the lesser is the education of a poppulation - the higher is a religiousness (and vice versa). Makes one wonder, eh? ;) (and of course - these dumb uneducated people, but who believe IN GOD must be the driving force to a "brighter tomorrow". Not these "cynical atheists", who are simply educated and analytical people who saw who's putting the gifts under an x-mass tree, so no more "Santa"...).
Religion is the cement between human beings. It gives people a meaning to their existence, a story where they can be a character. It explains the past, the present, and the future of mankind itself.
A "cement" which is one of the main reasons people killed each other for thousands of years (and continue to "divide"each other by "muslim", "christian", etc.. from an early childhood. Quite a "nice" cinditioning from the age when a person doesn'teven know what that means.). A cement based on FALSE beliefs and illusions, which's main goal is to indoctrinate a person, make him non-thinking zombie, touting all these ridiculous nonsenses from the "holly book". Oh, and raising a kid while teaching him to be a good, contributing person in general, help and love other people, etc.. is probably a lot more difficult compared to teaching a kid about an imaginary friend and all that schizoprenic stuff. Even a pit-bull raised by a caring and loving owner will be a "friend for everyone" dog, and a human being MUST believe fairy tales to "survive" and be a "good human being".
SO FULL OF SHIT it's sickening.
When the world population will be hit by the recession and wars that may follows, religion will be needed again. All of this is cyclical. After too many decades forgetting God, some men are selected to survive, while all the unfaithful ones swimming in their sins disappear massively, until one day the realm of God on earth is created by the very few remaining men.
Somehow I suspect that you are a loser whichs only hope to "succeed" is a scenario above ^^
I'll correct you again, as you are wrong. In the case of war - the SMARTEST, richest and most advanced SCIENTIFICALLY will survive, it's not fukkin middle-ages anymore, wake the fukk up.
All educated , proeminent scientists come from deeply religious families. Atheist families do not produce scientists.
Once again - NOT TRUE. By Gallup Media statistical data - 93% of the members of US national academy of sciences are ATHEISTS (and the rest - agnostics, while a very very small fraction - theists).
I agree with you on some stuff when it comes to survival, etc.. you've done your homework, but it baffles me how a well educated person may be so dumb at the same time, it really really baffles me. Freud must've been right - The biggest power of religion comes from a human nature.
Let's see how you manage to go thru what's coming being a cynical, nihilistic atheist
That's not for me, but I almost always get something like that from "believers" every time I get into a discussion on this issue. Well my answer is simple - I've had a few really close brushes with death in my life, and guess what - not even a single thought about "god" came into my head, nor before, nor during, nor after. It was a cold logic and common sense that saved me actually.
Then, He will come.
All of those who died giving their life to prepare the kingdom of God on earth will join Him, and their fathers who did the same.
yeah..he "will" come... right from above the sky. A fukkin psycho, who's so full of himself that created a shithole like earth for people to suffer so they could "enter heaven" after that... Guess what - all that was "just for fun" for that fella, BUT we are the ones who are satisfying fantasies of that sick fucker.
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Why can't someone (like me) have the balls to admit that my primitive brain can't comprehend one way or another? I definately don't follow the man-made bible, but I do think that there is a reason why there are billions of planets out there. There is almost no mathematical chance that we are the only living life forms in the universe. I believe in a higher power, I just have no idea who or what it is. None of us do.
AGREED.
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I'll add - yes, it's about survival and only survival. Religiion is one of the ways to survive and actually NOT DIE (oh, guess what - not dying IS a survival) even after you are dead. What a "smart" strategy. I'm sorry but I'll dissapoint religious nuts by saying that only way humanity lowered (and keep lowering) chances of death is by SCIENCE, not a fukkin religion, which exists just out of pure FEAR OF THAT DEATH we all are so eagerly trying to escape. But what happens if one isn't afraid of feath anymore? Yes - any religion doesn't make sense anymore (aside an education and common sense, which are usualy first ones that eradicate that nonsense out of a persons mind).
Am I afraid of death - FUKK NO. I'm afraid of being very sick, I'm afraid of getting old and crippled, I'm afraid of being in pain before death, but of death by itself? What to be afraid of "nothing" (just the way it was before my birth)? Try to wrap your mind around this one u fukkin bible thumpers..
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religion is a joke..religion hijacked humanity.
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religion is a joke..religion hijacked humanity.
I hate religion, but religion has kept humanity in check.
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I'll add - yes, it's about survival and only survival. Religiion is one of the ways to survive and actually NOT DIE (oh, guess what - not dying IS a survival) even after you are dead. What a "smart" strategy. I'm sorry but I'll dissapoint religious nuts by saying that only way humanity lowered (and keep lowering) chances of death is by SCIENCE, not a fukkin religion, which exists just out of pure FEAR OF THAT DEATH we all are so eagerly trying to escape. But what happens if one isn't afraid of feath anymore? Yes - any religion doesn't make sense anymore (aside an education and common sense, which are usualy first ones that eradicate that nonsense out of a persons mind).
Am I afraid of death - FUKK NO. I'm afraid of being very sick, I'm afraid of getting old and crippled, I'm afraid of being in pain before death, but of death by itself? What to be afraid of "nothing" (just the way it was before my birth)? Try to wrap your mind around this one u fukkin bible thumpers..
Science is a religion, I hope this helps. :-\
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Science is a religion, I hope this helps. :-\
One without a GOD - thank GOD for that! ;D ;)
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good post.
lot of "atheists" decrying god and religion in one breath, only to turn around and loudly uphold christian morals with the next.
also lol @ "we don't need religion anymore, science tells us the truth!!"
epic still believing in truth, the core of all christianity ::)
1. What is a "christian moral"? Do you mean a moral behavior that originated with Christianity or one that somehow only makes sense if Christianity is true? If the former, the behavior can be upheld by atheists regardless of its origins (its origin shouldn't matter if it is a worthy practice), and I don't think the latter describes anything at all. In other words, there isn't any moral behavior a Christian can do that an atheist can't, and thus calling this or that behavior "Christian" doesn't make a lot of sense.
2. Truth is a function of language and attaches to statements, or propositions (the things expressed by sentences). It is an object of study for philosophers and linguists. While there are several competing theories on its precise nature, none of them have anything whatsoever to do with religion, and especially not Christianity. You must be using some bastardized version of the technical term to suppose it is somehow relevant to Christianity.
Science is a religion, I hope this helps. :-\
3. Most atheists will object to this claim but I think it has a kernel of truth: theories are theories, whether they be religious or scientific. They attempt to organize and explain our observations and experiences and meld them into some sort of cohesive model of the world. The difference is that the class of theories we call religions have to date offered bunk explanations of pretty much every empirical phenomena imaginable and have zero predictive efficacy. And this is actually not that surprising, given that they were some of the species' earliest attempts at theorizing. I would have made even shittier theories if I were stuck in that period with that little knowledge of the world.
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1. What is a "christian moral"? Do you mean a moral behavior that originated with Christianity or one that somehow only makes sense if Christianity is true? If the former, the behavior can be upheld by atheists regardless of its origins (its origin shouldn't matter if it is a worthy practice), and I don't think the latter describes anything at all. In other words, there isn't any moral behavior a Christian can do that an atheist can't, and thus calling this or that behavior "Christian" doesn't make a lot of sense.
Right, I guess then we shouldn't say Japan is influenced by American culture? After all, the Japanese can play rock music, buy apple electronics, and hit baseballs just as any American can... doesn't make much sense to call these things American, then.
2. Truth is a function of language and attaches to statements, or propositions (the things expressed by sentences). It is an object of study for philosophers and linguists. While there are several competing theories on its precise nature, none of them have anything whatsoever to do with religion, and especially not Christianity. You must be using some bastardized version of the technical term to suppose it is somehow relevant to Christianity.
I'm still struggling with this issue personally, but "Truth" in the popular sense is a superstition. There's no transcendental all-seeing eye that sees nothing but "ding an sich." This is a core issue in Christian thought, so LOL @ this not having "anything whatsoever to do with religion." But whatever, if you want to act like predicate logic is the father of truth, go right ahead.
3. Most atheists will object to this claim but I think it has a kernel of truth: theories are theories, whether they be religious or scientific. They attempt to organize and explain our observations and experiences and meld them into some sort of cohesive model of the world. The difference is that the class of theories we call religions have to date offered bunk explanations of pretty much every empirical phenomena imaginable and have zero predictive efficacy. What else would one expect from our earliest theories?
I completely agree. Well written. And in a thousand years, if humans are still kicking around, no doubt someone will be having a hearty LOL at many of the precious "universal truths" that we have baptized "scientifically proven" as they browse through a history book.
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It's a mistaken belief that science dictates a non-existence of God...It has been the fundamentalist's mistaken notion of this and their strident rancor on this point that has turned so many against Christianity...
In other words it is the fundamentalists themselves that have given rise to the hostility against Belief.
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It's a mistaken belief that science dictates a non-existence of God...It has been the fundamentalist's mistaken notion of this and their strident rancor on this point that has turned so many against Christianity...
In other words it is the fundamentalists themselves that have given rise to the hostility against Belief.
As it was said that 9/11 was one of the reasons why many American Christians converted to Islam.
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Right, I guess then we shouldn't say Japan is influenced by American culture? After all, the Japanese can play rock music, buy apple electronics, and hit baseballs just as any American can... doesn't make much sense to call these things American, then.
1. I didn't know exactly what you meant by "christian morals" and so had to explore a couple of possibilities. You said "LOL" at atheists doubting Christianity's truth and subsequently "upholding" Christian morals. I said that if by "christian morals" you mean moral ideas originating in Christianity, that it is still perfectly consistent for an atheist to uphold them, given they don't depend on Christianity being true. A theory can have a good idea one can adopt without endorsing the whole theory.
2. My point about calling certain morals "christian morals" was in the context of the other possibility regarding what you may have meant, which is that "christian morals" are those that it only makes sense to practice if Christianity is true. In other words, these would be Christian-specific morals that nobody else would adhere to. I denied that there are such things because I think the moral ideas of Christianity (e.g., the Golden Rule) were co-opted by it. If that is right, then they are not "christian morals" but broad, possibly universal morals that Christianity adopted, meaning it doesn't make sense to call them "Christian."
3. Your baseball analogy communicates the message that certain morals originated with Christianity and that it thus makes sense to call them "Christian." I agree that this would make sense, but deny that there actually are any morals that are like this. Maybe Christianity endorsed certain ideas and thus helped make them more prevalent in Western culture, but that just means Christianity played an important role in the history of those ideas (something we can thank Christianity for), not that the ideas themselves are "Christian."
Can you give me an idea of what you mean by a Christian moral?
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I'm still struggling with this issue personally, but "Truth" in the popular sense is a superstition. There's no transcendental all-seeing eye that sees nothing but "ding an sich." This is a core issue in Christian thought, so LOL @ this not having "anything whatsoever to do with religion." But whatever, if you want to act like predicate logic is the father of truth, go right ahead.
Perhaps there is something being called "truth" at the center of debate in Christian thought, but it seems to mean everything and nothing at the same time. I have found the proposed concepts to be either mumbo jumbo (Jesus is Truth, experiencing God is Truth, or otherwise Truth is an indefinable, magical property that unites Christians despite differences of opinion) or messy and borderline meaningless amalgamations of more clear philosophical concepts (reality, experience, representation).
That's why I say truth has nothing in particular to do with Christianity: I think the legitimate phenomenon referred to by the word is captured by one of the philosophical theories about its being a part of language, not metaphysics like the Christian concepts seem to entail. I reached the conclusion by examining the Christian concepts and seeing their content exhausted by other, more clear ideas in metaphysics, plus the obvious and intuitive fact that truth has everything to do with language, something the Christian concepts seem to ignore.
Are you a Christian and do you think one of the Christian conceptions of Truth makes sense?
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religion is a joke..religion hijacked humanity.
No, humanity has hijacked religion
from Parabola Magazine, Winter 2005, topic "Fundamentalism"
interview with Huston Smith
"We must recognize 'hijacked religion'. Religion is the sitting duck, if I may mix my metaphors, because the primary commitment of politicians is not to religion, but te use of religion for political purposes. What really breeds violence is political differences. We live in a potically divided world in which each half shouts: 'We are are on God's side' the flp side of that is believing your opponents are the devil, the evil axis, the empire of evil. The rhetoric is exactly the same. The vicious circle of religious or political blame games leads to dehumanizing of entire peoples, when, in fact, authentic religion is the search for the deeply real is the greatest humanizing force we have."
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3. Your baseball analogy communicates the message that certain morals originated with Christianity and that it thus makes sense to call them "Christian." I agree that this would make sense, but deny that there actually are any morals that are like this. Maybe Christianity endorsed certain ideas and thus helped make them more prevalent in Western culture, but that just means Christianity played an important role in the history of those ideas (something we can thank Christianity for), not that the ideas themselves are "Christian."
It did just this. And to say the ideas themselves aren't Christian, at this point, is like saying David isn't Michelangelo's sculpture, just a rock.
Are you a Christian and do you think one of the Christian conceptions of Truth makes sense?
Not at all, on either count. "Truth" is a metaphysical concept, and metaphysics is nonsense. The basic point of my original post was that the same "atheists" who moan so loudly about the falsity of Christian beliefs are still usually proponents of Christian morals (meaning the fundamental rules for behavior arising from Christian valuations) and pursue "the truth" just as rabidly as their religious counterparts.
As Nietzsche explained, literal belief in the Bible and the Christian God is dead; what remains is the Christian method of evaluating the world -- of saying what is good, and what is bad. In forums of all types and in all places, "anti-religious" people like to point out how stupid you have to be to believe in God at this point, the scientific impossibility of various stories in the bible, etc. The irony is that, after the debate is over, both sides go home to lead the exact same sort of life. Whether Christian valuation is "good" ::) or not, it's amusing...
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Einstein expressed his skepticism regarding an anthropomorphic deity, often describing it as "naďve" and "childlike". He stated, "It seems to me that the idea of a personal God is an anthropological concept which I cannot take seriously. I feel also not able to imagine some will or goal outside the human sphere. My views are near those of Spinoza: admiration for the beauty of and belief in the logical simplicity of the order which we can grasp humbly and only imperfectly. I believe that we have to content ourselves with our imperfect knowledge and understanding and treat values and moral obligations as a purely human problem—the most important of all human problems. I do not believe in a personal God and I have never denied this but have expressed it clearly. If something is in me which can be called religious then it is the unbounded admiration for the structure of the world so far as our science can reveal it.
The idea of a personal God is quite alien to me and seems even naďve." And to Eric Gutkind he wrote, "The word God is for me nothing more than the expression and product of human weaknesses, the Bible a collection of honourable, but still primitive legends which are nevertheless pretty childish. No interpretation no matter how subtle can (for me) change this. These subtilised interpretations are highly manifold according to their nature and have almost nothing to do with the original text. I believe in Spinoza's God, who reveals himself in the harmony of all that exists, not in a God who concerns himself with the fate and the doings of mankind.
I do not believe in immortality of the individual, and I consider ethics to be an exclusively human concern with no superhuman authority behind it. I cannot conceive of a God who rewards and punishes his creatures, or has a will of the type of which we are conscious in ourselves. An individual who should survive his physical death is also beyond my comprehension, nor do I wish it otherwise; such notions are for the fears or absurd egoism of feeble souls.
Your question [about God] is the most difficult in the world. It is not a question I can answer simply with yes or no. I am not an Atheist. I do not know if I can define myself as a Pantheist. The problem involved is too vast for our limited minds. May I not reply with a parable? The human mind, no matter how highly trained, cannot grasp the universe. We are in the position of a little child, entering a huge library whose walls are covered to the ceiling with books in many different tongues. The child knows that someone must have written those books. It does not know who or how. It does not understand the languages in which they are written. The child notes a definite plan in the arrangement of the books, a mysterious order, which it does not comprehend, but only dimly suspects. That, it seems to me, is the attitude of the human mind, even the greatest and most cultured, toward God. We see a universe marvelously arranged, obeying certain laws, but we understand the laws only dimly. Our limited minds cannot grasp the mysterious force that sways the constellations.
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There's nothing more depressing than the idea that you need a big judgemental surveillance camera in the sky to behave semi-decent.
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There's nothing more depressing than the idea that you need a big judgemental surveillance camera in the sky to behave semi-decent.
Surprised this hasn't been mentioned yet. Doesn't reflect well on the individuals who only 'follow the rules' for fear of being spanked.
I fully agree with Einstein regarding the notion of an Anthropomorphic Deity. It's absurd.
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Surprised this hasn't been mentioned yet. Doesn't reflect well on the individuals who only 'follow the rules' for fear of being spanked.
I fully agree with Einstein regarding the notion of an Anthropomorphic Deity. It's absurd.
I find it incredible that people also need to be rewarded for every damned thing they do in life. There's always got to be a carrot on a stick for cretins to chase.
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Science is a religion, I hope this helps. :-\
Read the definition of "religion" before talking nonsense like this.
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That Carlin quote has always nailed it for me. It's supposed to be funny, but it ends up being dead on. Paints the picture of god as a horrible father, who waits for his children to misbehave so he can beat their asses. All with a smile on his face.
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Read the definition of "religion" before talking nonsense like this.
The word religion can be used metaphorically, like "shopping is the new religion" in this sense it is defined as a cause, principle, system of tenets held with ardor, devotion, conscientiousness and faith, a value held to be of supreme importance, or A quality, condition, custom, or thing inspiring zealous devotion, conscientious maintenance, and cherishing.
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No, the bulk of the population only believes in God when it suits them to do so. People in general are too busy to let god or the belief in god occupy their time.
Agree 100%! As Jessie Ventura once said" God is a tool for the weak and the ignorant."
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The word religion can be used metaphorically, like "shopping is the new religion" in this sense it is defined as a cause, principle, system of tenets held with ardor, devotion, conscientiousness and faith, a value held to be of supreme importance, or A quality, condition, custom, or thing inspiring zealous devotion, conscientious maintenance, and cherishing.
My reply would very simple: Science is POSITIVE, i.e. - does not have an "object" to believe in.
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My reply would very simple: Science is POSITIVE, i.e. - does not have an "object" to believe in.
Sure they do, it's "I am right and you are wrong."
one could say it's the truth, and one uses the scientific method to do so, and then when said "truth" is proven or found, which many times later on it's found out that that it wasn't true, it is heralded like the Gospel and scientists and professors become the messengers, the caliphs, the pastors, the monks, the preachers, the bishops, the archbishops...
Same effing deal, human beings want to worship something---whether it be a golden calf, a rock, a supernatural being, or "science". And each of these things must define man, man always sticks himself into the equation, "where do I exist, what does mean for me, how does this affect me?"
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What would you do if humans found out that there was no god, no afterlife, etc.... Would you be tempted to sin? Steal, cheat, murder etc....? Would the Police /government matter anymore? Would there be civil wars in every major country? There is a good that comes from religion.
You are all a bunch of evil sinners, in world without a god you would continue to be what you are a bunch of sinners, but every time you jerk off to kai green and eat a grapefruit remember god is watching you.
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Sure they do, it's "I am right and you are wrong."
one could say it's the truth, and one uses the scientific method to do so, and then when said "truth" is proven or found, which many times later on it's found out that that it wasn't true, it is heralded like the Gospel and scientists and professors become the messengers, the caliphs, the pastors, the monks, the preachers, the bishops, the archbishops...
Same effing deal, human beings want to worship something---whether it be a golden calf, a rock, a supernatural being, or "science". And each of these things must define man, man always sticks himself into the equation, "where do I exist, what does mean for me, how does this affect me?"
Have you any other methid to suggest, other than scientific, to assess the reality surrounding us in a more clear way?
Have you seen two scientists fighting each other due to argument of how many atoms are in the glass of water, instead of using science to find it out?
Scientists have NO trouble changing their viewpoint if new data is available. while religious nuts have a grip of steel on these from thousands years ago and insists that's the ONLY and unquestionable truth.
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The truth is that nobody knows for sure. If we knew for a fact that nothing awaited us after death, then there would be total global anarchy. The new "wild west" if you will.
So you are saying the only thing keeping you from raping and killing is a belief in god? is that correct?
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A world without a God would allow people to think more freely. It would allow for sciences to excel and speed up the destruction of our earth.
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So you are saying the only thing keeping you from raping and killing is a belief in god? is that correct?
No. I don't believe in the bible version of god. I am saying that there would be no concept of right or wrong anymore. Morals? gone.
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No. I don't believe in the bible version of god. I am saying that there would be no concept of right or wrong anymore. Morals? gone.
Everyone knows what is "good" or "bad", religious or not. The idea of morality is a completely separate idea, that religion "borrowed". Somehow in Japan, where most ppl are atheists - crimes are lowest in the world. Strange, eh?
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Everyone knows what is "good" or "bad", religious or not. The idea of morality is a completely separate idea, that religion "borrowed". Somehow in Japan, where most ppl are atheists - crimes are lowest in the world. Strange, eh?
Really? What is good or bad? Is it wrong to murder someone? Maybe our brains have overdeveloped in this sense. We are mammals. Nature lives without rules.
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Really? What is good or bad? Is it wrong to murder someone? Maybe our brains have overdeveloped in this sense. We are mammals. Nature lives without rules.
People instinctively try to hide the "bad" stuff they know they did, simple as that. At to rise a conscious human being, a do-well person, religion is absolutelly not a MUST.
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People instinctively try to hide the "bad" stuff they know they did, simple as that. At to rise a conscious human being, a do-well person, religion is absolutelly not a MUST.
You are right. Unfortunately, there are alot of dumb people in this world.
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You are right. Unfortunately, there are alot of dumb people in this world.
You mean like the guy who thought there were Muslims to be found inside a Sikh temple?
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You are right. Unfortunately, there are alot of dumb people in this world.
Well than let's spread an education, not a doctrine that makes 'em even dumber..
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You mean like the guy who thought there were Muslims to be found inside a Sikh temple?
You bring up a good point. Street justice would reign supreme in a godless world.
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You bring up a good point. Street justice would reign supreme in a godless world.
Actually, I was talking about you. You're the one who thought he had gone after Muslims in the Sikh temple.
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Why can't someone (like me) have the balls to admit that my primitive brain can't comprehend one way or another? I definately don't follow the man-made bible, but I do think that there is a reason why there are billions of planets out there. There is almost no mathematical chance that we are the only living life forms in the universe. I believe in a higher power, I just have no idea who or what it is. None of us do.
Perfect post...
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Actually, I was talking about you. You're the one who thought he had gone after Muslims in the Sikh temple.
It proves my point. I don't follow religion enough to know the difference between a Sikh and a Muslim. I thought it was another branch of islam. :-* I hate politics too.
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Maybe the "higher power" is the mixture of life-giving elements that paved the way for us to be created. I have no doubt that this cycle has repeated itself countless times on other planets. With each one being in a different state of evolution. Those are our aliens.
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Maybe the "higher power" is the mixture of life-giving elements that paved the way for us to be created. I have no doubt that this cycle has repeated itself countless times on other planets. With each one being in a different state of evolution. Those are our aliens.
**yawn**
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**yawn**
Just as believable as any religion.
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Just as believable as any religion.
Congratulations, you've discovered what Arthur C. Clarke hypothesized forty-five years ago.
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A godless society would be more peaceful. Religion is used as an excuse for violence.
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Congratulations, you've discovered what Arthur C. Clarke hypothesized forty-five years ago.
Smart man.
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A godless society would be more peaceful. Religion is used as an excuse for violence.
Some of the dumbest people are the most devout. Imagine if that population was let loose. Oh Lawd!!!!!!!!
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There are no atheists in foxholes. ;)
I am tired of this oft-used saying. So cliche.
And false.
I believe in nothing that might resemble a "god". Sure, maybe aliens, but ... no god.
Our species is shackled with religion and its utter nonsense.
Pathetic humans
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A godless society would be more peaceful. Religion is used as an excuse for violence.
Non-religious violence far outweighs historical violence committed in the name of God.
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Some of the dumbest people are the most devout. Imagine if that population was let loose. Oh Lawd!!!!!!!!
Some of the dumbest people are also nonbelievers.
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I am tired of this oft-used saying. So cliche.
And false.
I believe in nothing that might resemble a "god". Sure, maybe aliens, but ... no god.
Our species is shackled with religion and its utter nonsense.
Pathetic humans
How in your life are you shackled by religion?
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How in your life are you shackled by religion?
I said our species is shackled ... and therefore, by extension, yes, I am, as well.
Please take a minute to grasp what has been said (and ponder the statement) before replying. It will save you embarrassment.
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I said our species is shackled ... and therefore, by extension, yes, I am, as well.
Please take a minute to grasp what has been said (and ponder the statement) before replying. It will save you embarrassment.
I understood, now, how are you shackled by religion?
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I understood, now, how are you shackled by religion?
Really? REALLY?
So much of how we educate, train and maintain "order" is a result of religious indoctrination down through the ages.
Like it or not, we have all been brainwashed to varying degrees by nonsensical religious doctrine and law.
(Hell, if I live with a woman for any length of time the state then considers us married ... essentially. Don't fool yourself, either: Such invasiveness is mostly testimony to a puritan ideology derived from religion.)
Are you really asking me this?!!
I do not believe you are this dim. Possibly heavily brainwashed, sure, but not this simple as to not grasp the overriding influence of religion, in all its permutations, across all mankind.
Just stop.
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Non-religious violence far outweighs historical violence committed in the name of God.
::)
(http://www.waterdunen.nl/inquisitie.jpg)
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Who created the matrix? Don't know. But one thing is certain, who ever is in charge of this realm, it has no empathy and looks at all of us as its slaves.
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Really? REALLY?
So much of how we educate, train and maintain "order" is a result of religious indoctrination down through the ages.
Like it or not, we have all been brainwashed to varying degrees by nonsensical religious doctrine and law.
(Hell, if I live with a woman for any length of time the state then considers us married ... essentially. Don't fool yourself, either: Such invasiveness is mostly testimony to a puritan ideology derived from religion.)
Are you really asking me this?!!
I do not believe you are this dim. Possibly heavily brainwashed, sure, but not this simple as to not grasp the overriding influence of religion, in all its permutations, across all mankind.
Just stop.
Here's hoping you and your common law wife aren't forced to attend anymore Sunday school.
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Here's hoping you and your common law wife aren't forced to attend anymore Sunday school.
You're out to lunch.
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You're out to lunch.
Whatever helps you sleep at night.
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Non-religious violence far outweighs historical violence committed in the name of God.
you mean violence in the name of no god? or just violence with no religious motives? because not having a belief in god can have no logical in roads towards violence, the implications you subjectively attribute to no god is your issue.
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you mean violence in the name of no god? or just violence with no religious motives? because not having a belief in god can have no logical in roads towards violence, the implications you subjectively attribute to no god is your issue.
sure thing champ
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Well, I don't disagree with your response here, but my last few replies were more about the statement you made about most atheists being former Christians. Certainly some Christians have become atheists (and vice versa), but by no means are most atheists former Christians. When you included your background it appeared you were using that to emphasize this point, but I just wanted to note for other readers that a baptized child that attended regular Sunday school that made no personal decision for Christ and later as an adult calls himself/herself an atheist was not a former Christian that became an atheist.
So let me get this straight , are you claiming that no children of Christian parents are ' true Christians ' until they decide to seek Christ for themselves?
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Really? REALLY?
So much of how we educate, train and maintain "order" is a result of religious indoctrination down through the ages.
Like it or not, we have all been brainwashed to varying degrees by nonsensical religious doctrine and law.
(Hell, if I live with a woman for any length of time the state then considers us married ... essentially. Don't fool yourself, either: Such invasiveness is mostly testimony to a puritan ideology derived from religion.)
Are you really asking me this?!!
I do not believe you are this dim. Possibly heavily brainwashed, sure, but not this simple as to not grasp the overriding influence of religion, in all its permutations, across all mankind.
Just stop.
Good post.
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So let me get this straight , are you claiming that no children of Christian parents are ' true Christians ' until they decide to seek Christ for themselves?
Well, an individual must first be able to make a choice like that for themselves...be able to understand sin and the consequences therein. In the instance of small children or the mentally handicapped they wouldn't be held accountable for their actions and in that sense would be considered Christians like their Christian parents. God knows the contents of our hearts and judges us accordingly. For those children mature enough to make a genuine decision, that possess a comprehension of sin and salvation, they would not be considered a Christian like their Christians parents and would then need to make an individual decision for Christ.
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Good post.
He could've posted "religion is nonsense and Christians are dumb" and gotten the same response out of most.
"good post"
"this"
etc...
Just gotta be on the God haters side and all posts are deemed quality.
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He could've posted "religion is nonsense and Christians are dumb" and gotten the same response out of most.
"good post"
"this"
etc...
Just gotta be on the God haters side and all posts are deemed quality.
Not at all. If you've followed my posts in this thread, you'll see I've irked the "God haters" more than the "God lovers." I thought Fortress had a good post because it objected to "religion" (i.e. Christianity) on important and relevant grounds (i.e. the effects of Christianity on human development as a whole), not the usual "LOLZ CAN'T BELIEVE U BELIEF IN FAERY TAILZ" cacophony, which is usually spewed by people with the exact same intelligence as your average Christian, who would undoubtedly be Christians had they been born two hundred years ago.
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Look bro, it's an emotional choice. You want to feel as if you've got an omnipotent father figure watching after you, fine, it's your predicament. You want to belong to a tradition that is hundreds of years old and share a feeling of kinship with other like-minded people, that's fine too, humans have an innate sense to belong... the rest of it is a big old hocus pocus voodoo old wives' tale from a very long and extremely gruesome period in the history of the species... this is how people coped back then, do you understand? Religion is evolutionary buggage, it's not needed anymore, which is why in every nation (apart from America and maybe Ireland) where the standard of living goes up, faith goes down.
The problem is that most nonbelievers know everything about God yet have no relationship with God. Nonbelievers casually dismiss a genuine relationship with God labeling it as "fantasy", "fairytales", "hocus pocus" and continue on with no genuine, personal experience in this regard. I'm told 25-50 times a week how stupid I am because of my beliefs and how my postion demands proof. You know what? I agree my position requires proof. The best proof is in the divine pudding LOL. You want to understand God? Then desire to know him, call on him with an open, honest heart and close the evidential gap.....see if he doesn't respond. I've been with and without belief....most have just been without.
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Not at all. If you've followed my posts in this thread, you'll see I've irked the "God haters" more than the "God lovers." I thought Fortress had a good post because it objected to "religion" (i.e. Christianity) on important and relevant grounds (i.e. the effects of Christianity on human development as a whole), not the usual "LOLZ CAN'T BELIEVE U BELIEF IN FAERY TAILZ" cacophony, which is usually spewed by people with the exact same intelligence as your average Christian, who would undoubtedly be Christians had they been born two hundred years ago.
Sorry I don't get a chance to follow everyone's posts....it's usually 10 on 1 in these threads. Not everyone that doesn't belief responds as such, but as I mentioned most do....that's all I meant by the post.
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call on him with an open, honest heart and close the evidential gap....
I tried to call him, fucker hung up on me after I said I fucked his mom. :|
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Look bro, it's an emotional choice. You want to feel as if you've got an omnipotent father figure watching after you, fine, it's your predicament. You want to belong to a tradition that is hundreds of years old and share a feeling of kinship with other like-minded people, that's fine too, humans have an innate sense to belong... the rest of it is a big old hocus pocus voodoo old wives' tale from a very long and extremely gruesome period in the history of the species... this is how people coped back then, do you understand? Religion is evolutionary buggage, it's not needed anymore, which is why in every nation (apart from America and maybe Ireland) where the standard of living goes up, faith goes down.
Maybe there might be a coorrelation between the people who worked hard/had a great ethic and believed in GOD, and then when they get the desired result, they or their children want to sit back, enjoy everything, and like spoiled brats, don't want give "big ups" to God---because it takes the attention away from them?
America is home to the "self made" God---gods in their own minds, "move out my way haterz, cause I'm coming thru!"
who is going to believe in GOD, when that just takes too much time and takes too much attention away from themselves? Kinds like how obese people dot want to put in the time and work to lose the weight, and change their eating habits, they want to lose the weight now, and eat whatever they want.
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if you believe in the "BIG BOOM" theory, you're already a god within your own rights.... ;)
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for the people who believe in life after death, when was the last time your dead loved ones contacted you, or have they updated you about how much fun they're having in heaven/hell or where the fuck ever they are?....I'm curious to know
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for the people who believe in life after death, when was the last time your dead loved ones contacted you, or have they updated you about how much fun they're having in heaven/hell or where the fuck ever they are?....I'm curious to know
How many people have risen form nothing? Where were you here beforee the year you were born? Nowhere? You sprang form nothing? Rebirth for life is as certain as death is so long as there is a species. Get it retard?
Our ego may die but life goes on. If you don''t see this oging on as we speak you're a fucking moron. It's called the cycle of life.
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Look bro, it's an emotional choice. You want to feel as if you've got an omnipotent father figure watching after you, fine, it's your predicament. You want to belong to a tradition that is hundreds of years old and share a feeling of kinship with other like-minded people, that's fine too, humans have an innate sense to belong... the rest of it is a big old hocus pocus voodoo old wives' tale from a very long and extremely gruesome period in the history of the species... this is how people coped back then, do you understand? Religion is evolutionary buggage, it's not needed anymore, which is why in every nation (apart from America and maybe Ireland) where the standard of living goes up, faith goes down.
funny, cause natality rates also go down there.
Fucking moron.
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for the people who believe in life after death, when was the last time your dead loved ones contacted you, or have they updated you about how much fun they're having in heaven/hell or where the fuck ever they are?....I'm curious to know
I had a cousin who as a child, was always seeing her "grandma"...
She would make statements like "Grandma is in the room, and she says hi"
thing is, she was born after "grandma" died.
But, I guess if you want to go talk and chill with your peeps for a while, just go and do what Edgar Cayce did---Deep Trance Meditation.
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I had a cousin who as a child, was always seeing her "grandma"...
She would make statements like "Grandma is in the room, and she says hi"
thing is, she was born after "grandma" died.
But, I guess if you want to go talk and chill with your peeps for a while, just go and do what Edgar Cayce did---Deep Trance Meditation.
Cayce was an interesting fellow.
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The problem is that most nonbelievers know everything about God yet have no relationship with God. Nonbelievers casually dismiss a genuine relationship with God labeling it as "fantasy", "fairytales", "hocus pocus" and continue on with no genuine, personal experience in this regard. I'm told 25-50 times a week how stupid I am because of my beliefs and how my postion demands proof. You know what? I agree my position requires proof. The best proof is in the divine pudding LOL. You want to understand God? Then desire to know him, call on him with an open, honest heart and close the evidential gap.....see if he doesn't respond. I've been with and without belief....most have just been without.
You have NO ' relationship ' with God. You just don't. everything you know or have ' learned ' about God is from someone else or a book. God doesn't talk to you or he hasn't revealed himself to you. You just can't expect to be taken seriously when you type this honestly
And blame the believer because he didn't try as hard as you or wasn't lucky enough to be blessed by God for a personal relationship. ::) weak very weak
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How many people have risen form nothing? Where were you here beforee the year you were born? Nowhere? You sprang form nothing? Rebirth for life is as certain as death is so long as there is a species. Get it retard?
Our ego may die but life goes on. If you don''t see this oging on as we speak you're a fucking moron. It's called the cycle of life.
you're citing lots of Poems....you still can't tell me where that life goes after you die.......are you aware of anything while you're sleeping?.......
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funny, cause natality rates also go down there.
Fucking moron.
Not sure what that has to do with anything.
You're excused though, theist :-*
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From what I ' know ' about God that's enough to make me NOT want a relationship with him.
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you're citing lots of Poems....you still can't tell me where that life goes after you die.......are you aware of anything while you're sleeping?.......
Wouldn't it be great if the afterlife was like a dream instead of oblivion...
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Wouldn't it be great if the afterlife was like a dream instead of oblivion...
yes it would.......I believe the concept of death is beyond human comprehension. it's just natural to say that once we die, the physical body is resting, but the soul is still alive and conscious somewhere. and that has been a subject of Great debate from several civilizations..........
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You have NO ' relationship ' with God. You just don't. everything you know or have ' learned ' about God is from someone else or a book. God doesn't talk to you or he hasn't revealed himself to you. You just can't expect to be taken seriously when you type this honestly
And blame the believer because he didn't try as hard as you or wasn't lucky enough to be blessed by God for a personal relationship. ::) weak very weak
But he has revealed himself via the holy spirit. Have the holy spirit wash over you once and you'll never be the same.
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But he has revealed himself via the holy spirit. Have the holy spirit wash over you once and you'll never be the same.
You never heard of the ' holy spirit ' until someone told you , taught you and then you ' felt ' his presence. You deluded yourself into feeling this.
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You never heard of the ' holy spirit ' until someone told you , taught you and then you ' felt ' his presence. You deluded yourself into feeling this.
Go on....tell me about myself.....
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But he has revealed himself via the holy spirit. Have the holy spirit wash over you once and you'll never be the same.
That sounds cultish.
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That sounds cultish.
The indwelling of the Holy Spirit in believers is in scripture, but it's ok you don't understand what I'm saying. It's a personal experience....moments I cherish in my faith and walk with Christ. Moments of prayer, worship, humility, love, etc....are sometimes very powerful, private experiences and the presence of the Holy Spirit is tangible.
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But he has revealed himself via the holy spirit. Have the holy spirit wash over you once and you'll never be the same.
You never heard of the ' holy spirit ' until someone told you , taught you and then you ' felt ' his presence. You deluded yourself into feeling this.
Holy Spirit HA HA HA HA - Is feeling the presence of the Holy Spirit like when you have a super wank, and you drift off into deep fantasy and you visualise so hard that you are sure there is some beautiful woman riding your cock. If it is, that feeling disappears right after I blow my load. Holy Spirit HA HA
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Go on....tell me about myself.....
I already did. You knew nothing about no holy spirit until you were thought about him. This wasnt revealed to you you convinced yourself after the fact.
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I already did. You knew nothing about no holy spirit until you were thought about him. This wasnt revealed to you you convinced yourself after the fact.
I don't often say what i'm about to, but you just don't know what you're saying. I'm genuinely sorry to say that, but you possess an unrelenting, absolute ignorance in this particular topic. I disclose something personal about myself and you simply say, "that didn't happen, you're deluded." That type of back and forth is meaningless, but I hope others read and pursue their own relationship with Christ. I can't soften hardened hearts on my own, but I can encourage and I can share and I can be honest. Occassionally i receive a PM from a Getbigger thanking me for being honest and sharing my faith....that's the point, that's the goal....helping others and sharing the good news.
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Holy Spirit HA HA HA HA - Is feeling the presence of the Holy Spirit like when you have a super wank, and you drift off into deep fantasy and you visualise so hard that you are sure there is some beautiful woman riding your cock. If it is, that feeling disappears right after I blow my load. Holy Spirit HA HA
Posts such as this....I don't need to converse with you. Take your filth elsewhere.
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The indwelling of the Holy Spirit in believers is in scripture, but it's ok you don't understand what I'm saying. It's a personal experience....moments I cherish in my faith and walk with Christ. Moments of prayer, worship, humility, love, etc....are sometimes very powerful, private experiences and the presence of the Holy Spirit is tangible.
Posts such as this....I don't need to converse with you. Take your filth elsewhere. - did you ever consider people find your evangelical nonsense as perverse.
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Surely there's no need to personally denigrate soemone based on what they do or don't beleive. If you believe in God then do what you have to do and if you don't then just continue on. No one here is affected by anyone else's beliefs in any material way so live and let live.
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No one here is affected by anyone else's beliefs in any material way so live and let live.
::)
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"If you talk to God, you are praying; If God talks to you, you have schizophrenia"
---Thomas Stephen Szasz
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i would like to chill with "mon of steel" and contemplate fucking 17 year old blonde fine ass hoes and learn his thoughts on the matter
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How much violence has to happen by God believers for the other God Botherers to acknowledge the sickness of theology. Hitler was a Christian - killed 6 million Jews - Harry Truman was a Baptist and dropped nuclear bombs on civilian populations - Bush was a Christian and even believed God was encouraging him in certain directions, Bush claimed to know what God wanted for him 'I feel like God wants me to run for President. I can't explain it, but I sense my country is going to need me. Something is going to happen... I know it won't be easy on me or my family, but God wants me to do it.'. There are many religious leaders responsible for massive massive atrocities and extreme violations of human rights. The fact of whether a person is religious or not has no bearing on morality. Personally, I think religious people are a greater evil as they commit violence on some pretence that they are morally superior therefore they can never change, as they never believe what they did was wrong, they actually take some sick twisted pride in their violence and they never feel the necessary guilt or remorse for such actions. Religion is Poison!
You have to worry about an ideology that encourages converting non-believers - if something is worthwhile people will work it out for themselves, no conversion necessary - the fact is, people who have faith in something they are not sure about need to attract others as a deluded way of feeling better about their uncertain faith, plus it's one less person they have to worry about calling them a Fucking tool for believing in fairy tales. Be wary of those who claim to know the ultimate truth, anyone who has investigated the matter knows that humans are unlikely to know the deeper reasons for existence, they are just not capable due to their inherit limitations. People cling to false beliefs because it is less anxiety provoking than saying "I Dont know"
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You really are on a slippery slope here. Hitler didn't kill jews in the name of God and neither did Harry Truman. Hitler killed jews because he thought they were ruining his utopian society and ruman dropped the bomb to end a war. Stalin killed more than the 2 of them put together with no practising religious affiliation that I know of. I see people killing in the name of God as those who just want to impose their will upon others and then use rekligion as their right/excuse to do so.
Ghenghis Khan killed quite a few as did the egyptians and not a christian or muslim in sight.
If people want to spread the word about God and you don't want to hear it just say "no thanks" just like you do when you don't want another slice of meatloaf.
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I already did. You knew nothing about no holy spirit until you were thought about him. This wasnt revealed to you you convinced yourself after the fact.
The fact that you do not believe MOS has had an experience with the Lord does not mean he hasn`t.
I don`t believe you love your family ;)
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Arguing with religious nutcases is useless.
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The fact that you do not believe MOS has had an experience with the Lord does not mean he hasn`t.
I don`t believe you love your family ;)
I don't believe you believe the statement in that post!
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Arguing with religious nutcases is useless.
Arguing with atheists is useless 8)
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Arguing with atheists is useless informative even though it threatens to crack my lifelong highly indoctrinated level of denial
:o
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:o
silence, no one here takes you seriously you absolute nutcase. I am in the norm believing in God at least.
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silence, no one here takes you seriously you absolute nutcase. I am in the norm believing in God at least.
HA HA like I would take the opinion of an indoctrinated God Botherer seriously, why don't you go and pray to GOD to covert all those Nutcase Atheists to whatever sick religion you currently practice, we all know that God answers prayers, yeah right!
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HA HA like I would take the opinion of an indoctrinated God Botherer seriously
You can`t possibly be serious here, wow, let me get this straight. You don`t know, really ??? , that everyone around here thinks you have a few loose screws, wtf you can`t be in that much denial to not know this. You think there is 1 person here who takes you serious, unreal, if you actually believe anyone even considers your views, reality check, hello, you are the getbig NUTCASE of all time, everyone here knows this
REALITY CHECK IS A BITCH.....WOW
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HA HA like I would take the opinion of an indoctrinated God Botherer seriously
You can`t possibly be serious here, wow, let me get this straight. You don`t know, really ??? , that everyone around here thinks you have a few loose screws, wtf you can`t be in that much denial to not know this. You think there is 1 person here who takes you serious, unreal, if you actually believe anyone even considers your views, reality check, hello, you are the getbig NUTCASE of all time, everyone here knows this
REALITY CHECK IS A BITCH.....WOW
>:( Back off!!! I have more loose screws than E- kul ;D
End of the day we are all free to believe in what we want - still should not stop us getting along and respecting each others choices right :)
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>:( Back off!!! I have more loose screws than E- kul ;D
End of the day we are all free to believe in what we want - still should not stop us getting along and respecting each others choices right :)
Yes sir, you are 100% right and believe me I respect everyone`s opinions and beliefs, including Wiggs`` annunaki and niburo, genetic engineering of humans mumbo jumbo but .......but.............. ......but...........
but.......... 8)........... ;D
E-kul is just a big bitch ;D
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Yes sir, you are 100% right and believe me I respect everyone`s opinions and beliefs, including Wiggs`` annunaki and niburo, genetic engineering of humans mumbo jumbo but .......but.............. ......but...........
but.......... 8)........... ;D
E-kul is just a big bitch ;D
This is True also - E Kul take those fuckin Lacey panties off ;D
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i dont need a fairytale book to not do bad things, religionists want to believe that so badly.
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i dont need a fairytale book to not do bad things, religionists want to believe that so badly.
No, that`s not true. I believe in God and I know atheist that are a hell of a lot more moral then me and I also know religious people who are a bunch of low-life SOB.
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HA HA like I would take the opinion of an indoctrinated God Botherer seriously
You can`t possibly be serious here, wow, let me get this straight. You don`t know, really ??? , that everyone around here thinks you have a few loose screws, wtf you can`t be in that much denial to not know this. You think there is 1 person here who takes you serious, unreal, if you actually believe anyone even considers your views, reality check, hello, you are the getbig NUTCASE of all time, everyone here knows this
REALITY CHECK IS A BITCH.....WOW
HA HA HA HA HA Must of touched a nerve - Once again you believe something you cant prove - I am not trying to win friends and influence people - and even if the whole of the planet thought I had a screw loose - I couldn't care less - Self acceptance is far more important than others view of me. I just enjoy posting on a forum and reading others opinions, upsetting narrow mindedness is just a bonus.
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Great, another low-life with no shame :'(
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HA HA HA HA HA Must of touched a nerve - Once again you believe something you cant prove - I am not trying to win friends and influence people - and even if the whole of the planet thought I had a screw loose - I couldn't care less - Self acceptance is far more important than others view of me. I just enjoy posting on a forum and reading others opinions, upsetting narrow mindedness is just a bonus.
You've basically indicated that your posts concerning topics of religion, God, etc... are essentially meaningless.....thx for the heads up.
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I don't often say what i'm about to, but you just don't know what you're saying. I'm genuinely sorry to say that, but you possess an unrelenting, absolute ignorance in this particular topic. I disclose something personal about myself and you simply say, "that didn't happen, you're deluded." That type of back and forth is meaningless, but I hope others read and pursue their own relationship with Christ. I can't soften hardened hearts on my own, but I can encourage and I can share and I can be honest. Occassionally i receive a PM from a Getbigger thanking me for being honest and sharing my faith....that's the point, that's the goal....helping others and sharing the good news.
There is no ignorance to the topic , you convinced yourself that your belief is real and when people don't feel the same way are somehow lacking an ability that you pocess or an open heart , the default is with the person that doesn't share your sentiment.
God is a man made creation , it was feeble man's attempt at explanation of the natural world , at first it was passed down from one generation to the next and then finally written down in book form. It always reminds me of the old saying if God were rreal there would be no need for religion.
That's why God is contingent on beleif because he's not a fact , that's what faith is for. You've been sold this wonderful story and you made it ' real ' God is a story in a book written by man you will never be able to escape this fact.
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There is no ignorance to the topic , you convinced yourself that your belief is real and when people don't feel the same way are somehow lacking an ability that you pocess or an open heart , the default is with the person that doesn't share your sentiment.
God is a man made creation , it was feeble man's attempt at explanation of the natural world , at first it was passed down from one generation to the next and then finally written down in book form. It always reminds me of the old saying if God were rreal there would be no need for religion.
That's why God is contingent on beleif because he's not a fact , that's what faith is for. You've been sold this wonderful story and you made it ' real ' God is a story in a book written by man you will never be able to escape this fact.
You could experience God in the same way I have or in even more meaningful ways that I haven't. It would erase your disbelief, but my assumption is you simply refuse to do so, correct?
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I was raised into religious faith and study and gave myself to it with a whole heart for many, many years.
Not once did I have a prayer "answered" and not once did I experience awakening or communion with a holy spirit.
Then, in my late 20s, I started to really consider, with strength of mind and intellect, all that I had been taught to believe. With each passing year the fog that is brainwashing lifted and the utter nonsense of all religious faith struck me hard.
Now, many years after being UNborn, I feel total contempt for religion and what it's done to humankind and its development.
But if I am wrong, and one day I meet this maker, I will admit my mistake ... and then spit in his/her/its face.
An all-powerful god that allows such misery to encompass a creation it claims to love is no god worth worshipping or following. It is a sadistic and hateful god and deserves to be ostracized by all.
But that's all fantasy thinking, anyway.
There is no god.
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I was raised into religious faith and study and gave myself to it with a whole heart for many, many years.
Not once did I have a prayer "answered" and not once did I experience awakening or communion with a holy spirit.
Then, in my late 20s, I started to really consider, with strength of mind and intellect, all that I had been taught to believe. With each passing year the fog that is brainwashing lifted and the utter nonsense of all religious faith struck me hard.
Now, many years after being UNborn, I feel total contempt for religion and what it's done to humankind and its development.
But if I am wrong, and one day I meet this maker, I will admit my mistake ... and then spit in his/her/its face.
An all-powerful god that allows such misery to encompass a creation it claims to love is no god worth worshipping or following. It is a sadistic and hateful god and deserves to be ostracized by all.
But that's all fantasy thinking, anyway.
There is no god.
You sound like a guy who takes his philosophy of life from black metal lyrics.
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You sound like a guy who takes his philosophy of life from black metal lyrics.
Thanks!
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I was raised into religious faith and study and gave myself to it with a whole heart for many, many years.
Not once did I have a prayer "answered" and not once did I experience awakening or communion with a holy spirit.
Then, in my late 20s, I started to really consider, with strength of mind and intellect, all that I had been taught to believe. With each passing year the fog that is brainwashing lifted and the utter nonsense of all religious faith struck me hard.
Now, many years after being UNborn, I feel total contempt for religion and what it's done to humankind and its development.
But if I am wrong, and one day I meet this maker, I will admit my mistake ... and then spit in his/her/its face.
An all-powerful god that allows such misery to encompass a creation it claims to love is no god worth worshipping or following. It is a sadistic and hateful god and deserves to be ostracized by all.
But that's all fantasy thinking, anyway.
There is no god.
Not clear if you were a believer or a strong student of theology? Regardless I'm sorry you lost your faith if that's the case and hope one day you can regain it.
I've met a few atheists that claim to be former Christians that turned to atheism. Some just flat out lie about that fact simply to strengthen their arguments, others were misguided/misinformed and were nominal Christians at best, but there are some that were genuine believers that decided to give up their faith. Those folks shared one thing in common in that they prayed and prayed for an ill/injured loved one to be healed and unfortunately the loved one passed. That type of situation is the most common I hear or they suffered through some terrible abuse. I've encountered some that claim it was pure study and science, history and philosophy that turned them from Christianity and later find out something deeply emotional and tragic occurred that was the real culprit.
I certainly hope you haven't lost someone close to you or that you suffered a personal tragedy.
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You could experience God in the same way I have or in even more meaningful ways that I haven't. It would erase your disbelief, but my assumption is you simply refuse to do so, correct?
I would have to have a lobotomy first.
You make the story ' real '
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I would have to have a lobotomy first.
You make the story ' real '
Unfortunately you responded like I thought you might. "I can't engage in faith because....well.....I have a brain." Almost all comments are laced with either insults and/or hostility.
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Unfortunately you responded like I thought you might. "I can't engage in faith because....well.....I have a brain." Almost all comments are laced with either insults and/or hostility.
When you claim to have a personal relationship with a literary character you expect to be taken seriously? If God were real I still wouldn't want to have a personal relationship with him and if he were real he would be absolutely NOTHING like the God of the Christian bible
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Swedens original white population is something like 70% atheist and very peaceful low crime people. much less so that countries with strong religious population. our crimerates are imported. just saying..
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I was raised into religious faith and study and gave myself to it with a whole heart for many, many years.
Not once did I have a prayer "answered" and not once did I experience awakening or communion with a holy spirit.
Then, in my late 20s, I started to really consider, with strength of mind and intellect, all that I had been taught to believe. With each passing year the fog that is brainwashing lifted and the utter nonsense of all religious faith struck me hard.
Now, many years after being UNborn, I feel total contempt for religion and what it's done to humankind and its development.
But if I am wrong, and one day I meet this maker, I will admit my mistake ... and then spit in his/her/its face.
An all-powerful god that allows such misery to encompass a creation it claims to love is no god worth worshipping or following. It is a sadistic and hateful god and deserves to be ostracized by all.
But that's all fantasy thinking, anyway.
There is no god.
Hear Hear
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Arguing with atheists is useless 8)
I'm not an atheist, and I'm not religious.
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Hear Hear
So, you agree that because pain (to humans) exists in this world, that means God doesn't exist?
So, we all should be happy, happy and sing the Smurfette song, and nobody dies, nobody gets killed, people do not get ill? That is if God exists, one big effing orgy, a pleasurable place, everything that makes you feel good.
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So, you agree that because pain (to humans) exists in this world, that means God doesn't exist?
So, we all should be happy, happy and sing the Smurfette song, and nobody dies, nobody gets killed, people do not get ill? That is if God exists, one big effing orgy, a pleasurable place, everything that makes you feel good.
How do we know about God? Man , God was man's primitive attempt at explaining the world around him , and he stinks of his lowly human origins projected unto their ' God ' jealously , hate , bigotry , cruelty , fear , spite and anger.
God and religion were at first spoken word handed down though oral tradition from one generation to the next and finally written down into a collection of stories carefully modified over the centuries and used a tool.
Anyone who says they know what God wants because it was divinely revealed to them is a LIAR anyone who claims to have spoken to and knows what this God wants us to do is a LIAR.
There may be some entity that created the Uni/Multiverse ( no probable ) but it most certainly wouldn't be anything like the God as described in the Christian bible , the Holy bible is laughable and it most certainly cannot be taken seriously anymore , the concept of religion is outdated and no longer needed , we have excellent explanations for our natural world and this silly book is no longer required , the only reasons it persists is tradition , fear of death and the hope to have a better world in the afterlife.
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9 pages and God hasn't dropped a post. What a surprise.
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When you claim to have a personal relationship with a literary character you expect to be taken seriously? If God were real I still wouldn't want to have a personal relationship with him and if he were real he would be absolutely NOTHING like the God of the Christian bible
What incentive do I have to lie about my experience? I'm verbally abused day in and day out around here because of my faith. It would be better for me, in Getbig terms, to just remain silent or play along with the other cool kids.
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How do we know about God? Man , God was man's primitive attempt at explaining the world around him , and he stinks of his lowly human origins projected unto their ' God ' jealously , hate , bigotry , cruelty , fear , spite and anger.
God and religion were at first spoken word handed down though oral tradition from one generation to the next and finally written down into a collection of stories carefully modified over the centuries and used a tool.
Anyone who says they know what God wants because it was divinely revealed to them is a LIAR anyone who claims to have spoken to and knows what this God wants us to do is a LIAR.
There may be some entity that created the Uni/Multiverse ( no probable ) but it most certainly wouldn't be anything like the God as described in the Christian bible , the Holy bible is laughable and it most certainly cannot be taken seriously anymore , the concept of religion is outdated and no longer needed , we have excellent explanations for our natural world and this silly book is no longer required , the only reasons it persists is tradition , fear of death and the hope to have a better world in the afterlife.
:o
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What incentive do I have to lie about my experience? I'm verbally abused day in and day out around here because of my faith. It would be better for me, in Getbig terms, to just remain silent or play along with the other cool kids.
I don't feel you are lying , I feel you really do believe you have a personal relationship with Jesus but I also feel you deluded yourself into feeling this way. Your personal experiences aren't proof of God.
You think being an Atheist is cool? I grew up with a born-again Christian mother and a father who was Catholic trust me it wasn't cool telling these people I'm an Atheist. Most of my large family are believers with me being the black sheep
on GetBig you may be the minority but in life you're among the majority , especially considering like 80% of the US consider themselves Christians. You seem like a nice guy and I don't want to be overtly rude to you but when push comes to shove I can't take people seriously when say they have a personal relationship with God , I believe in a persons right to practice any religion he wants my problem with Christians is them trying to constantly force their position on the rest of society , this I find very unacceptable and among my main problems with believers.
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HA HA like I would take the opinion of an indoctrinated God Botherer seriously
You can`t possibly be serious here, wow, let me get this straight. You don`t know, really ??? , that everyone around here thinks you have a few loose screws, wtf you can`t be in that much denial to not know this. You think there is 1 person here who takes you serious, unreal, if you actually believe anyone even considers your views, reality check, hello, you are the getbig NUTCASE of all time, everyone here knows this
REALITY CHECK IS A BITCH.....WOW
QFT. E-Kul is a nutjob of the highest order.
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lol
Hi Dr. Chimps!
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QFT. E-Kul is a nutjob of the highest order.
Oddly enough, when narrow minded indoctrinated fools label me a nutjob, I know I am on the right track - I take it as a compliment.
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There wouldn't be any bitches !!!!
now that is some serious shit
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I don't feel you are lying , I feel you really do believe you have a personal relationship with Jesus but I also feel you deluded yourself into feeling this way. Your personal experiences aren't proof of God.
You think being an Atheist is cool? I grew up with a born-again Christian mother and a father who was Catholic trust me it wasn't cool telling these people I'm an Atheist. Most of my large family are believers with me being the black sheep
on GetBig you may be the minority but in life you're among the majority , especially considering like 80% of the US consider themselves Christians. You seem like a nice guy and I don't want to be overtly rude to you but when push comes to shove I can't take people seriously when say they have a personal relationship with God , I believe in a persons right to practice any religion he wants my problem with Christians is them trying to constantly force their position on the rest of society , this I find very unacceptable and among my main problems with believers.
Well, here lies the problem, thousands if not millions have experienced a relationship with the Lord,of course every experience is unique in the same way you experience love for your children. I always compare love with the experience I have with the Lord because it is something only you can feel within and you cannot show others this feeling, but the best you can do is describe it.
Now let us cut all the BS, I am self employed with my own roofing business. I deal with clients everyday and some hand me cheques for 10 000 dollars, I have 2 awesome children, I have competed in bodybuilding and will again,I enjoy going places, watching movie, and my biggest hobbie is studying history. So I am pretty normal and you know I am not crazy cause I agree with you that Yates slaughters Coleman ;D . What is my point.... well my point is this... my experience with God is stronger then the love I have for my children and that is infinite, so I am more likely to be mistaken that I love my children then the experience I have with my Lord and there is no chance of that.
My question to you is do you love your family and if you do is there a chance you are mistaken about that.
Funny how all you guys always say ....my problem with Christians is them trying to constantly force their position on the rest of society .........all I see around here is the opposite, every thread started here on this subject is done by some mocking, being rude and making fun of others belief.
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DOG is great
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"Fear not, for I am with you; be not dismayed, for I am your Dog; I will strengthen you, I will help you, I will uphold you with my righteous right hand"
Isaiah 41:10
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Well, here lies the problem, thousands if not millions have experienced a relationship with the Lord,of course every experience is unique in the same way you experience love for your children. I always compare love with the experience I have with the Lord because it is something only you can feel within and you cannot show others this feeling, but the best you can do is describe it.
Now let us cut all the BS, I am self employed with my own roofing business. I deal with clients everyday and some hand me cheques for 10 000 dollars, I have 2 awesome children, I have competed in bodybuilding and will again,I enjoy going places, watching movie, and my biggest hobbie is studying history. So I am pretty normal and you know I am not crazy cause I agree with you that Yates slaughters Coleman ;D . What is my point.... well my point is this... my experience with God is stronger then the love I have for my children and that is infinite, so I am more likely to be mistaken that I love my children then the experience I have with my Lord and there is no chance of that.
My question to you is do you love your family and if you do is there a chance you are mistaken about that.
Funny how all you guys always say ....my problem with Christians is them trying to constantly force their position on the rest of society .........all I see around here is the opposite, every thread started here on this subject is done by some mocking, being rude and making fun of others belief.
Well, here lies the problem, thousands if not millions have experienced a relationship with the Lord,of course every experience is unique in the same way you experience love for your children. I always compare love with the experience I have with the Lord because it is something only you can feel within and you cannot show others this feeling, but the best you can do is describe it.
They believe they experienced a relationship with the Lord , I have no doubt that they believe that but that doesn't make it true. Again people are taught about the Lord and then they develop this ' relationship ' after learning about how wonderful he is and how great he was for dying for you.
My question to you is do you love your family and if you do is there a chance you are mistaken about that.
Wait let me get this straight , you can't really love your family unless you believe in God? ???
Funny how all you guys always say ....my problem with Christians is them trying to constantly force their position on the rest of society .........all I see around here is the opposite, every thread started here on this subject is done by some mocking, being rude and making fun of others belief.
Here isn't reality , most people are exaggerated versions of themselves , some aren't. But in reality in the U.S. Christians are CONSTANTLY forcing their beliefs on the rest of us via policy , Abortion , stem cell research , trying to push that bullshit ' intelligent design ' gay marriage , profanity in music and movies , etc , etc
And the thing with Christians taking a lot of heat for their beliefs is that in this day-and-age , people can be very critical of religion , before people were killed for even suggesting there was no God , or not believing in the ' right ' God. Now we can openly say your beliefs are nonsense with no fear of reprisals
You can believe in your religion just don't expect others to take it seriously.
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"A man’s heart plans his way, but the Dog directs his steps."
Proverbs 16:9
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Cmon ND, you missed my point entirely
Quote
My question to you is do you love your family and if you do is there a chance you are mistaken about that.
Wait let me get this straight , you can't really love your family unless you believe in God?
NO no no, that is not what I meant. Let`s assume you answered yes, you only believe that you love them, you can`t be certain right. That is what you are saying to us about our experience with God, there is absolutely no difference.
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QFT. E-Kul is a nutjob of the highest order.
Wackko no one even comes close
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Cmon ND, you missed my point entirely
Quote
My question to you is do you love your family and if you do is there a chance you are mistaken about that.
Wait let me get this straight , you can't really love your family unless you believe in God?
NO no no, that is not what I meant. Let`s assume you answered yes, you only believe that you love them, you can`t be certain right. That is what you are saying to us about our experience with God, there is absolutely no difference.
The difference being, families exist, GOD Does not
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Oh, boy. Welcome to Getbig Theological Seminary. Funny, whenever I see this board, I imagine a Don Lafontainesque voice saying, "In a world without God..."
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"The Dog will guide you continually, and satisfy your needs in parched places"
Isaiah 58:11
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What if Dog suddenly "pusses" out on a hike?
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2189640/Canine-custody-battle-Hiker-climbed-13-000ft-rescue-Missy-German-Shepherd-wants-owner-forced-leave-dog-mountain.html?ITO=1490
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The difference being, families exist, GOD Does not
Again,missing the point. How do you know if you love them or only think you love them
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"Dog is faithful and he will not let you be tempted beyond your strength"
1 Cor. 10:13
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:P
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Again,missing the point. How do you know if you love them or only think you love them
You know you love them when you care about their wellbeing, when you express this concern through kind and supportive actions, by desiring good outcomes for them. You know you hate them when you want to see them all dead either by your own hand or someone elses. Stop confusing the issue, it isn't hard to know when people love something. People gravitate to the things they love, if people love chocolate, they eat it regularly, if they don't love chocolate, they avoid it. I know for some God Botherers they have trouble with simple logic like this, but for normal people, it's not too hard too work out.
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Cmon ND, you missed my point entirely
Quote
My question to you is do you love your family and if you do is there a chance you are mistaken about that.
Wait let me get this straight , you can't really love your family unless you believe in God?
NO no no, that is not what I meant. Let`s assume you answered yes, you only believe that you love them, you can`t be certain right. That is what you are saying to us about our experience with God, there is absolutely no difference.
I disagree wholeheartedly , I don't have a belief in my family , I don't have faith they are my family They are living , breathing and tangible
And what is love? it's different to all people and who are you do decide what love is or isn't for other people? love is a word we used to describe our feelings towards others and it means different things to different people.
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I disagree wholeheartedly , I don't have a belief in my family , I don't have faith they are my family They are living , breathing and tangible
And what is love? it's different to all people and who are you do decide what love is or isn't for other people? love is a word we used to describe our feelings towards others and it means different things to different people.
I agree, but you can not prove you love someone to someone else. So I say to you you only think you love them you don`t really know right
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You know you love them when you care about their wellbeing, when you express this concern through kind and supportive actions, by desiring good outcomes for them. You know you hate them when you want to see them all dead either by your own hand or someone elses. Stop confusing the issue, it isn't hard to know when people love something. People gravitate to the things they love, if people love chocolate, they eat it regularly, if they don't love chocolate, they avoid it. I know for some God Botherers they have trouble with simple logic like this, but for normal people, it's not too hard too work out.
A complete stranger can do this too.
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You know you love them when you care about their wellbeing, when you express this concern through kind and supportive actions, by desiring good outcomes for them. You know you hate them when you want to see them all dead either by your own hand or someone elses. Stop confusing the issue, it isn't hard to know when people love something. People gravitate to the things they love, if people love chocolate, they eat it regularly, if they don't love chocolate, they avoid it. I know for some God Botherers they have trouble with simple logic like this, but for normal people, it's not too hard too work out.
Listen to what KRS-One says in the beginning and the whole song, And then read your chocolate comment. Too many people overuse the word love---in actuality it really means they really "like" something. Love should be reserved for something higher, not chocolate, not a car, not a piece of jewelry, not a house, nor shoes.
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I agree, but you can not prove you love someone to someone else. So I say to you you only think you love them you don`t really know right
The only ones I need to ' prove ' it to is them. and you can prove it to them with your actions. But you can say that I only think I love them but I don't really know it doesn't change the fact.
And I fail to see what this has to do belief in a deity ???
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I don't feel you are lying , I feel you really do believe you have a personal relationship with Jesus but I also feel you deluded yourself into feeling this way. Your personal experiences aren't proof of God.
You think being an Atheist is cool? I grew up with a born-again Christian mother and a father who was Catholic trust me it wasn't cool telling these people I'm an Atheist. Most of my large family are believers with me being the black sheep
on GetBig you may be the minority but in life you're among the majority , especially considering like 80% of the US consider themselves Christians. You seem like a nice guy and I don't want to be overtly rude to you but when push comes to shove I can't take people seriously when say they have a personal relationship with God , I believe in a persons right to practice any religion he wants my problem with Christians is them trying to constantly force their position on the rest of society , this I find very unacceptable and among my main problems with believers.
Absolutely my experiences are proof of God. I already know the vast majority of cliched responses, generalizations and standard atheist replies; in addition, I'm versed in the apologetic defenses as well so we can skip all that. In short, my experiences are validated by the body of believers who've also experienced the risen Christ. Your refusal to have an experience of your own leaves you handicapped and deluded. I hate to say it like that, but that's how you've chosen to phrase things so hopefully that resonates with you better.
I have no doubt being raised in household of believers was very difficult. I'm guessing your family was unable to provide sufficient answers to your questions and doubts and that's unfortunate. Most believers don't engage in apologetics and graduate level theological studies. Reason being is those genuine believers have experienced the risen Christ so their doubts have already been removed. Most atheists jam-pack their minds with everything from science, mathematics, history, philosophy to theology and every religious study under the sun; yet, they engage in zero theological application (ex: try to experience Christ for themselves in an honest, sincere way). Ignoring the most important aspect of Christianity with a mask of intellectual superiority and arrogance leaves the atheist handicapped. I've experienced all that atheism and Christianity have to offer intellectually, but I've also made the crucial leap of faith and Christ's revelation therein.
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The only ones I need to ' prove ' it to is them. and you can prove it to them with your actions. But you can say that I only think I love them but I don't really know it doesn't change the fact.
And I fail to see what this has to do belief in a deity ???
-BINGO, EXACTLY...... that is my point, thank you. You can say that I only think I have an experience with God but doesn`t change the fact.
8)
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WTF?
hey mr moderator why did you move my totally unrelated thread "In a world without a "Dog". into this shit thread??
who the fuck cares about God, we were talking about Dog. Please can you move it back as an independent thread. I dont want to be part of a thread with juvenile wanna be philosophers discussing "God". You need to be under 25 to embark on that old chestnut
Grown ups discuss Dog.
Mr moderator beware of the famous saying:
" For the Dog gives wisdom; from His mouth come knowledge and understanding. He stores up sound wisdom for the upright; He is a shield to those who walk in integrity, guarding the paths of justice"
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WTF?
hey mr moderator why did you move my totally unrelated thread "In a world without a "Dog". into this shit thread??
who the fuck cares about God, we were talking about Dog. Please can you move it back as an independent thread. I dont want to be part of a thread with juvenile wanna be philosophers discussing "God". You need to be under 25 to embark on that old chestnut
Grown ups discuss Dog.
Mr moderator beware of the famous saying:
" For the Dog gives wisdom; from His mouth come knowledge and understanding. He stores up sound wisdom for the upright; He is a shield to those who walk in integrity, guarding the paths of justice"
LMAO, oh my, I just pissed my pants in laughter. funny shit right here
I was wondering where those post where coming from
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Absolutely my experiences are proof of God. I already know the vast majority of cliched responses, generalizations and standard atheist replies; in addition, I'm versed in the apologetic defenses as well so we can skip all that. In short, my experiences are validated by the body of believers who've also experienced the risen Christ. Your refusal to have an experience of your own leaves you handicapped and deluded. I hate to say it like that, but that's how you've chosen to phrase things so hopefully that resonates with you better.
I have no doubt being raised in household of believers was very difficult. I'm guessing your family was unable to provide sufficient answers to your questions and doubts and that's unfortunate. Most believers don't engage in apologetics and graduate level theological studies. Reason being is those genuine believers have experienced the risen Christ so their doubts have already been removed. Most atheists jam-pack their minds with everything from science, mathematics, history, philosophy to theology and every religious study under the sun; yet, they engage in zero theological application (ex: try to experience Christ for themselves in an honest, sincere way). Ignoring the most important aspect of Christianity with a mask of intellectual superiority and arrogance leaves the atheist handicapped. I've experienced all that atheism and Christianity have to offer intellectually, but I've also made the crucial leap of faith and Christ's revelation therein.
Absolutely my experiences are proof of God. I already know the vast majority of cliched responses, generalizations and standard atheist replies; in addition, I'm versed in the apologetic defenses as well so we can skip all that. In short, my experiences are validated by the body of believers who've also experienced the risen Christ. Your refusal to have an experience of your own leaves you handicapped and deluded. I hate to say it like that, but that's how you've chosen to phrase things so hopefully that resonates with you better.
No they are not , the way you feel isn't proof of God existence. It's proof of the way you feel. Proof is physical evidence which can be independently verified. Your personal experiences can't be. You may be wrong ever consider that? especially considering all religions claim to be the one true religion and all others are fake. You believe your version of the story is the correct one doesn't mean it is.
Apologetics is damage control , a poor attempt at trying to come up with excuses for the majority of major problems with Christianity. And that's Apologetics job is try and combat the compelling arguments against it , hence why you are familiar with the responses from Atheists because you have been corrected many times already.
And to supplement your argument for the proof of God you just used more faulty logic Argument Ad Populum , appeals to the masses , a lot of people have claimed a personal experience with Jesus so he's real , doesn't prove anything. And again don't blame me because I can't/wont entertain your belief and then say it's my fault I can't see what you see the way you do , you still refuse to entertain there may be a possibility you may have picked the wrong religion.
I have no doubt being raised in household of believers was very difficult. I'm guessing your family was unable to provide sufficient answers to your questions and doubts and that's unfortunate. Most believers don't engage in apologetics and graduate level theological studies. Reason being is those genuine believers have experienced the risen Christ so their doubts have already been removed. Most atheists jam-pack their minds with everything from science, mathematics, history, philosophy to theology and every religious study under the sun; yet, they engage in zero theological application (ex: try to experience Christ for themselves in an honest, sincere way). Ignoring the most important aspect of Christianity with a mask of intellectual superiority and arrogance leaves the atheist handicapped. I've experienced all that atheism and Christianity have to offer intellectually, but I've also made the crucial leap of faith and Christ's revelation therein.
And maybe the answers weren't sufficient or acceptable ever consider that? Apologetics is damage control aimed and the many flaws with Christianity it doesn't offer any real answers. And Atheism begins and ends with " I don't have a belief in God ' anything else beyond that is anto-theism. Many Atheists can be without a belief in God and still not care anything about science or mathematics , philosophy.
Believers throw out all rational thought and let a 2000 year old story think for them , and just take it all on good faith , some us need more than that and that's a more intellectually honest conclusion to come to than just taking a leap of faith.
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-BINGO, EXACTLY...... that is my point, thank you. You can say that I only think I have an experience with God but doesn`t change the fact.
8)
There is NO fact family is real God is a story. So people say they have a personal experience with Zeus that it's true because you can't tell them it's not?
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You love someone when this special someone increase/maintain your odds of survival because she/he has something you need. She/He is special because she/he cares about you, that's what makes her/him special. Others people who have nothing to bring, are ignored. People who cannot increase your odds of survival are ignored or despised. Basically you have interest in others only when they have something you need to improve or maintain your odds of survival. If you happen to also maintain or increase theirs bringing something they need, then maybe a relationship can start.
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You love someone when this special someone increase/maintain your odds of survival because she/he has something you need. Others people who have nothing to bring, are ignored. People who cannot increase your odds of survival are ignored or despised. Basically you have interest in others only when they have something you need to improve or maintain your odds of survival. If you happen to also maintain or increase theirs bringing something they need, then maybe a relationship can start.
::)
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There is NO fact family is real God is a story. So people say they have a personal experience with Zeus that it's true because you can't tell them it's not?
You had the point now you lost it again. My point is not 1 single action can prove that you love someone as not one single action can prove my experience with God.
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You had the point now you lost it again. My point is not 1 single action can prove that you love someone as not one single action can prove my experience with God.
No personal experience claim can prove God exists , not twenty of them or hundreds. have you ever entertained the possibility that you may be wrong? your personal experience is something you deluded yourself into believing or feeling?
Did God come at you when you were 10 and say ' This is God I want have a personal relationship with you '? NO you were taught about God and taught how to have a ' personal relationship ' with him and convinced yourself you do , this doesn't make it A) true or B) prove God exists
Why is religion and God belief based? faith based? because it's NOT a fact and you're force to only believe because it's all you can do. It's not a fact , they presented you this wonderful story and promised you eternal life if you believe and give yourself to Jesus
What is God? it's a story that people can choose to believe or not
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Because we seem to have ventured into a discussion about Love here at Getbig Theological Seminary, some might be interested in the distinctions that have been made in the philosophical and theological literature. I'm not interested in debating the merits and demerits of these terms. Just food for thought, as it were.
1. Eros or desirous love. Sometimes tied to sensuality. The thing about erotic love is that the lover objectifies what she desires to possess, i.e., the 'object of desire.' This is an ends-related love. For example, "I love you because you give me X, or because you make me feel like Y, or because you have quality-Z, etc. Eros is also tied to reproductive love (see, e.g., Aristophanes' speech in Plato's Symposium).
2. Philia or love in friendship. Philia relies on people having some thing or some pursuit in common, which is attractive. If you love, say, the iron game, you might become friends with others who have the same interest/attraction.
3. Agape or unconditional love. This designation was developed most fully by Christian theologians, and is used to describe God's love. It is also used to describe self-sacrificing love. This is the purest kind of love.
There is another kind of love, Storge or familial affection, which is discussed by C.S. Lewis in The Four Loves. Personally, I prefer Anders Nygren’s scholarly Agape and Eros, and Allan Soble’s compendium, Eros, Agape, and Philia.
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Absolutely my experiences are proof of God. I already know the vast majority of cliched responses, generalizations and standard atheist replies; in addition, I'm versed in the apologetic defenses as well so we can skip all that. In short, my experiences are validated by the body of believers who've also experienced the risen Christ. Your refusal to have an experience of your own leaves you handicapped and deluded. I hate to say it like that, but that's how you've chosen to phrase things so hopefully that resonates with you better.
I have no doubt being raised in household of believers was very difficult. I'm guessing your family was unable to provide sufficient answers to your questions and doubts and that's unfortunate. Most believers don't engage in apologetics and graduate level theological studies. Reason being is those genuine believers have experienced the risen Christ so their doubts have already been removed. Most atheists jam-pack their minds with everything from science, mathematics, history, philosophy to theology and every religious study under the sun; yet, they engage in zero theological application (ex: try to experience Christ for themselves in an honest, sincere way). Ignoring the most important aspect of Christianity with a mask of intellectual superiority and arrogance leaves the atheist handicapped. I've experienced all that atheism and Christianity have to offer intellectually, but I've also made the crucial leap of faith and Christ's revelation therein.
I don't think the Almighty Gnome approves of this post.
I'm versed in the apologetic defenses as well
Sweet, so we can have a discussion centred on Plantinga's modal argument for the existence of God and what it suggests about the cogency of S5 modal logic?
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Proof is physical evidence which can be independently verified.
Apologetics is damage control , a poor attempt at trying to come up with excuses for the majority of major problems with Christianity.
There are good and bad apologists just like there are good and bad scientists and doctors. Atheists don't like apologetics because good, sound apologetics provide legitimate, peer-reviewed, theological answers to the vast majority of questions LOL. You and I both know what the atheist does then....so enough of that.
Exactly what you said above is correct on proof and exactly what I've been saying.....have an honest experience of your own and you'll then join the body of believers some of which have had the same tangible, physical experiences with Christ via the Holy Spirit. A personal experience will then be verified, peer-reviewed and deemed sufficient proof.
Still, you can't change a grown adult. Virtually every grown adult on this planet must experience everything on their own regardless of the experiences of family, friends and coworkers. "Hey, it didn't happen to me so it ain't or can't be real." So why not see what all the hype is about and try the risen Christ for yourself? "No, I have a brain." Tremendous.
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This pretty much destroys the claim from personal experience
"Millions of people personally know God through an inner spiritual experience. People who doubt God have not had a personal experience with Him." So says the Christian.
Religionists don't realize how meaningless this statement appears to Rationalists To the less sympathetic rationalist, it appears pathetic. To a skeptic, such a statement about Personal Experience won't advance your argument at all, but rather, it will set you back. Empirical Rationalism is a system of thought based on evidence that can be independently verified, and potentially falsified, and the use of common sense and verifiable experience. In the real world, anyone is free to say anything, without the strength of supporting evidence. Are all claims therefore to be taken at face value, and given equal weight? The person who says he saw Elvis at the supermarket, or the person who says he was abducted by an alien spacecraft, or the person who says salvation is waiting in the tail of a comet... is all anecdotal evidence valid? In a court of law, witness testimony is given and evaluated. If it is not in accord with factual evidence, it is in doubt. In a court, the burden of proof is on the prosecution (the skeptics). But in the search for scientific truths (in this case, the ultimate origin of the universe), it is the opposite. The burden of proof is on the person making the claim that God exists, or the defendant.
Some say that we cannot deny the existence of the spirit (because it would require one to prove that the spirit does not exist), but this is to misunderstand logic. It is a logical error called shifting the burden of proof. It is unnecessary for Rationalists to deny the existence of the spirit; they would say that the existence of spirit is unproven (and unlikely) based on current scientific knowledge, and in the absence of proof, they would simply ignore the possibility of the spirit for more meaningful and tangible pursuits, until such proofs are made available.
Anecdotal evidence and arguments from authority are meaningless in science, and in any search for empirical truths. There is either a god or there isn't, and popular opinion means nothing. For example: 500 years ago, everyone KNEW the Earth was flat. It was an important doctrine of Christianity, as was geocentrism (the Earth sitting at the center of the universe), and to speak against these religious doctrines could result in your death at the hands of the Roman Catholic Church. 500 years ago, probably 99.9% of the population believed in a flat Earth. The belief was based on perception and personal experience. But personal experience can be in error, imagined, contrived, or done out of conformity. It CANNOT be relied on for establishing universal truths. IT'S POSSIBLE for the entire population to believe wrongly! It took many years for the idea of a round Earth to gain acceptance, but (thanks to science) it eventually did. Even today, there are many Creationists who still claim that the Earth is flat.
Some religionists have claimed that dreams are analogous to the Personal Experience Argument, in the form of the premise: “Dreams are non-physical, and can’t be proved. We accept their existence from the evidence of accounts from personal experience.” But everyone has dreams. They are a common shared experience. No one doubts their occurrence, because we all have them. Dreams are a product of firing synapses in the brain, and can be detected with scientific tests. Comparing dreams to personal religious experience (something that is totally unverifiable) is a false analogy. It is trying to compare apples with oranges. Instead of dreams, it is more appropriate to compare the personal religious experience with the claim that someone saw Elvis at the supermarket, because both Elvis and a personal religious experience are equally unverifiable, are not a shared experience, and must be taken completely on faith.
The Argument from Personal Experience is also a circular argument. In other words: “The proof of God is that I believe in Him.” The conclusion is assumed in the premise. These kinds of statements are absolutely worthless in establishing the truth. Another very common circular argument is as follows: “God is real because the bible says so, and the bible is true because it is the inspired word of God.” Another is: “The proof of the miracles contained in the bible is that God can do anything he wants.”
If you are asked to prove the existence of god, don't bother stating your personal relationship with him as proof. Saying so will only make you appear to be a brainwashed individual who cannot distinguish fantasy from reality. As an argument, it carries no weight, and does nothing to counter the mountain of biblical errors, obscenities and absurdities.
Most theists claim their god can be known through prayer, but such experiences POINT TO NOTHING OUTSIDE THE MIND. We know that many humans habitually invent myths, hear voices, hallucinate and talk with imaginary friends. We do not know that there is a god.
“But there are millions of people who have a personal relationship with God!” This is a statement about humanity, not about god. It speaks about the belief in a god, not the existence of a god. Truth is not something that is determined by vote. Religions arose not from truth, but to deal with the saddness of death, emotional weakness, the terror of dreams, a desire for explanations and the fear of the unknown. If you consider such popular numbers to be significant, then of what significance is the fact that there are more non-Christians in the world than there are Christians?
The 1998 World Almanac and Book of Facts ranks Non-Religious first in world population, with a whopping 2,669,737,500... outranking Christians (all denominations combined) at 1,955,229,000, and Muslims at 1,126,325,000. The Almanac sites the 1997 Encyclopedia Britannica Book of the Year as its source. In the U.S. alone, polls consistently show about 10% of Americans call themselves 'non-religious'. That's 26 million Americans. In Europe, Russia, the Orient and Australia, it is much higher. What about people working in scientific fields? A recent poll of scientists revealed that only 7% of them believe in a god of any kind.
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I don't think the Almighty Gnome approves of this post.
Sweet, so we can have a discussion centred on Plantinga's modal argument for the existence of God and what it suggests about the cogency of S5 modal logic?
Versed in regards to the topic at hand....not versed in every apologetic topic.
Besides, your waaay too smart for me.
Let me know if I spelled and punctuated this reply correctly.
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What would you do if humans found out that there was no god, no afterlife, etc.... Would you be tempted to sin? Steal, cheat, murder etc....? Would the Police /government matter anymore? Would there be civil wars in every major country? There is a good that comes from religion.
Religion hasn't stopped most people from stealing, cheating and murdering etc.. People who do these things, do them regardless of their religious beliefs.
Many of the early mafia folk were Italian. A lot of Italians practiced and still do practice Catholicism. When they murder, cheat and steal, they go to confession and ask to be forgiven for their sins. Many times the priest obliges them. Same thing with the Irish, whether Catholic or Protestant. Throughout history, wars have been fought in the name of religion. Countless people have died in the because of religion and religious beliefs.
The reward for being a good person who does steal, cheat or murder etc. is how it makes you feel. If you "do onto others as you would have them do unto you," Luke 6.31 the chances are you will live a pretty fulfilling life.
Incidentally, some police and some governments steal, cheat and murder etc.
Have you ever sinned? If so, why didn't your religious beliefs prevent you from doing this? Pretty much everyone makes mistakes along the way. Hopefully, not to the degree of murdering folks though. If you are lucky, you'll learn from your mistakes and not repeat them.
BTW, I have no issue with religion. If it works for you or others, great! However, it obviously does not work for everyone.
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This pretty much destroys the claim from personal experience
"Millions of people personally know God through an inner spiritual experience. People who doubt God have not had a personal experience with Him." So says the Christian.
Religionists don't realize how meaningless this statement appears to Rationalists To the less sympathetic rationalist, it appears pathetic. To a skeptic, such a statement about Personal Experience won't advance your argument at all, but rather, it will set you back. Empirical Rationalism is a system of thought based on evidence that can be independently verified, and potentially falsified, and the use of common sense and verifiable experience. In the real world, anyone is free to say anything, without the strength of supporting evidence. Are all claims therefore to be taken at face value, and given equal weight? The person who says he saw Elvis at the supermarket, or the person who says he was abducted by an alien spacecraft, or the person who says salvation is waiting in the tail of a comet... is all anecdotal evidence valid? In a court of law, witness testimony is given and evaluated. If it is not in accord with factual evidence, it is in doubt. In a court, the burden of proof is on the prosecution (the skeptics). But in the search for scientific truths (in this case, the ultimate origin of the universe), it is the opposite. The burden of proof is on the person making the claim that God exists, or the defendant.
Some say that we cannot deny the existence of the spirit (because it would require one to prove that the spirit does not exist), but this is to misunderstand logic. It is a logical error called shifting the burden of proof. It is unnecessary for Rationalists to deny the existence of the spirit; they would say that the existence of spirit is unproven (and unlikely) based on current scientific knowledge, and in the absence of proof, they would simply ignore the possibility of the spirit for more meaningful and tangible pursuits, until such proofs are made available.
Anecdotal evidence and arguments from authority are meaningless in science, and in any search for empirical truths. There is either a god or there isn't, and popular opinion means nothing. For example: 500 years ago, everyone KNEW the Earth was flat. It was an important doctrine of Christianity, as was geocentrism (the Earth sitting at the center of the universe), and to speak against these religious doctrines could result in your death at the hands of the Roman Catholic Church. 500 years ago, probably 99.9% of the population believed in a flat Earth. The belief was based on perception and personal experience. But personal experience can be in error, imagined, contrived, or done out of conformity. It CANNOT be relied on for establishing universal truths. IT'S POSSIBLE for the entire population to believe wrongly! It took many years for the idea of a round Earth to gain acceptance, but (thanks to science) it eventually did. Even today, there are many Creationists who still claim that the Earth is flat.
Some religionists have claimed that dreams are analogous to the Personal Experience Argument, in the form of the premise: “Dreams are non-physical, and can’t be proved. We accept their existence from the evidence of accounts from personal experience.” But everyone has dreams. They are a common shared experience. No one doubts their occurrence, because we all have them. Dreams are a product of firing synapses in the brain, and can be detected with scientific tests. Comparing dreams to personal religious experience (something that is totally unverifiable) is a false analogy. It is trying to compare apples with oranges. Instead of dreams, it is more appropriate to compare the personal religious experience with the claim that someone saw Elvis at the supermarket, because both Elvis and a personal religious experience are equally unverifiable, are not a shared experience, and must be taken completely on faith.
The Argument from Personal Experience is also a circular argument. In other words: “The proof of God is that I believe in Him.” The conclusion is assumed in the premise. These kinds of statements are absolutely worthless in establishing the truth. Another very common circular argument is as follows: “God is real because the bible says so, and the bible is true because it is the inspired word of God.” Another is: “The proof of the miracles contained in the bible is that God can do anything he wants.”
If you are asked to prove the existence of god, don't bother stating your personal relationship with him as proof. Saying so will only make you appear to be a brainwashed individual who cannot distinguish fantasy from reality. As an argument, it carries no weight, and does nothing to counter the mountain of biblical errors, obscenities and absurdities.
Most theists claim their god can be known through prayer, but such experiences POINT TO NOTHING OUTSIDE THE MIND. We know that many humans habitually invent myths, hear voices, hallucinate and talk with imaginary friends. We do not know that there is a god.
“But there are millions of people who have a personal relationship with God!” This is a statement about humanity, not about god. It speaks about the belief in a god, not the existence of a god. Truth is not something that is determined by vote. Religions arose not from truth, but to deal with the saddness of death, emotional weakness, the terror of dreams, a desire for explanations and the fear of the unknown. If you consider such popular numbers to be significant, then of what significance is the fact that there are more non-Christians in the world than there are Christians?
The 1998 World Almanac and Book of Facts ranks Non-Religious first in world population, with a whopping 2,669,737,500... outranking Christians (all denominations combined) at 1,955,229,000, and Muslims at 1,126,325,000. The Almanac sites the 1997 Encyclopedia Britannica Book of the Year as its source. In the U.S. alone, polls consistently show about 10% of Americans call themselves 'non-religious'. That's 26 million Americans. In Europe, Russia, the Orient and Australia, it is much higher. What about people working in scientific fields? A recent poll of scientists revealed that only 7% of them believe in a god of any kind.
Have an experience for youself ND.
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No personal experience claim can prove God exists , not twenty of them or hundreds. have you ever entertained the possibility that you may be wrong? your personal experience is something you deluded yourself into believing or feeling?
Did God come at you when you were 10 and say ' This is God I want have a personal relationship with you '? NO you were taught about God and taught how to have a ' personal relationship ' with him and convinced yourself you do , this doesn't make it A) true or B) prove God exists
Why is religion and God belief based? faith based? because it's NOT a fact and you're force to only believe because it's all you can do. It's not a fact , they presented you this wonderful story and promised you eternal life if you believe and give yourself to Jesus
What is God? it's a story that people can choose to believe or not
Well, thanks for having patients with me :D
No one is disagreeing with this statement, but the exact same is true about love and you refuse to accept this fact. The fact that no action and like you put it not even 20 of them can prove you love someone, if you think actions can prove love then name one action and I will prove that that action you stated is not proof. point is we use the same rational reasoning in believing we love someone as Christians do when they believe their experience with God
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There are good and bad apologists just like there are good and bad scientists and doctors. Atheists don't like apologetics because good, sound apologetics provide legitimate, peer-reviewed, theological answers to the vast majority of questions LOL. You and I both know what the atheist does then....so enough of that.
Exactly what you said above is correct on proof and exactly what I've been saying.....have an honest experience of your own and you'll then join the body of believers some of which have had the same tangible, physical experiences with Christ via the Holy Spirit. A personal experience will then be verified, peer-reviewed and deemed sufficient proof.
Still, you can't change a grown adult. Virtually every grown adult on this planet must experience everything on their own regardless of the experiences of family, friends and coworkers. "Hey, it didn't happen to me so it ain't or can't be real." So why not see what all the hype is about and try the risen Christ for yourself? "No, I have a brain." Tremendous.
There are good and bad apologists just like there are good and bad scientists and doctors. Atheists don't like apologetics because good, sound apologetics provide legitimate, peer-reviewed, theological answers to the vast majority of questions LOL. You and I both know what the atheist does then....so enough of that.
LMAO ' peer-reviewed ' by other Apologetics? stop trying to compare Apologetics to Science and use words like peer-reviewed , Apologetics is damage control nothing more and lots of damage has been done to God and Christianity
Exactly what you said above is correct on proof and exactly what I've been saying.....have an honest experience of your own and you'll then join the body of believers some of which have had the same tangible, physical experiences with Christ via the Holy Spirit. A personal experience will then be verified, peer-reviewed and deemed sufficient proof.
Wrong see above , personal experience is NOT proof. You wont get away with typing that , I'm sure you believe it but you put lots of faith in things you have no proof for. par for the course.
Still, you can't change a grown adult. Virtually every grown adult on this planet must experience everything on their own regardless of the experiences of family, friends and coworkers. "Hey, it didn't happen to me so it ain't or can't be real." So why not see what all the hype is about and try the risen Christ for yourself? "No, I have a brain." Tremendous
You keep clinging to there is something wrong with ME if I don't experience what you have , I'm just not trying hard enough , or my heart just isn't open , or not being honest. Don't blame me because I don't believe what you do.
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``Wrong see above , personal experience is NOT proof. You wont get away with typing that , I'm sure you believe it but you put lots of faith in things you have no proof for. par for the course. `` ND
so do you.... loving your family..... can not be proven has to be taken by faith
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Well, thanks for having patients with me :D
No one is disagreeing with this statement, but the exact same is true about love and you refuse to accept this fact. The fact that no action and like you put it not even 20 of them can prove you love someone, if you think actions can prove love then name one action and I will prove that that action you stated is not proof. point is we use the same rational reasoning in believing we love someone as Christians do when they believe their experience with God
I don't have a desire or need to prove I love anyone. And again personal experience is not proof , people have claimed they can and do talk to the dead doesn't mean it's true. people believe they are Napoleon doesn't make it true , people believe all sorts of things doesn't make them true and again have you thought about the possibility that you might be mistaken?
When you say you have a personal relationship with God what does that even mean? ???
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Have an experience for youself ND.
read it in it's entirety , this puts to bed your claim from personal experience but you wont accept it because it doesn't fit your agenda.
Again even if God were true I wouldn't worship him or want to have any personal experiences with him especially not the God of the Christian bible
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``Wrong see above , personal experience is NOT proof. You wont get away with typing that , I'm sure you believe it but you put lots of faith in things you have no proof for. par for the course. `` ND
so do you.... loving your family..... can not be proven has to be taken by faith
The two or not comparable , family is real , God is a story.
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I agree, but you can not prove you love someone to someone else. So I say to you you only think you love them you don`t really know right
Love isn't words it's an action - it's loving action that conveys the concept of love, so of course you know if someone lobves you, it is evident in every action towards you, not that complicated, it amazes me how people get confused by the concept of love, their are many type of love, motherly love, brotherly love etc... but they all equate to the same thing - showing an overt concern for someone else through action, nothing to do with saying I love you - it's determined by the way you treat other people.
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LMAO ' peer-reviewed ' by other Apologetics? stop trying to compare Apologetics to Science and use words like peer-reviewed , Apologetics is damage control nothing more and lots of damage has been done to God and Christianity
Wrong see above , personal experience is NOT proof. You wont get away with typing that , I'm sure you believe it but you put lots of faith in things you have no proof for. par for the course.
You keep clinging to there is something wrong with ME if I don't experience what you have , I'm just not trying hard enough , or my heart just isn't open , or not being honest. Don't blame me because I don't believe what you do.
Yep, peer-reviewed by other theologians. Fact that you aren't a theist doesn't change that.
I don't think anything is wrong with you. You're just supremely confident about that which you don't understand. I'm suggesting that you try the risen Christ for yourself and close the gap.
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The two or not comparable , family is real , God is a story.
We've had this conversation on here before... As I've said... I can PHYSICALLY assist and aid... I PHYSICALLY can touch family.
God doesn't PHYSICALLY touch anything. No matter what you try to say, God doesn't put his HAND on you.
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I don't have a desire or need to prove I love anyone. And again personal experience is not proof , people have claimed they can and do talk to the dead doesn't mean it's true. people believe they are Napoleon doesn't make it true , people believe all sorts of things doesn't make them true and again have you thought about the possibility that you might be mistaken?
When you say you have a personal relationship with God what does that even mean? ???
OK we are getting somewhere, you still aren`t clear at what I am saying but my fault not yours. I am not trying to prove to you God exist. I am trying to prove to you that atheist such as yourself use the same type of reasoning and faith Christians use in their everyday lives.
You said it yourself you don`t have to prove to anyone your love but nevertheless the love you speak of has to be taken by faith so again my point is you guys are being hypocrites when addressing the that we are stupid because we rely on faith when in fact you too rely on faith every single day.
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read it in it's entirety , this puts to bed your claim from personal experience but you wont accept it because it doesn't fit your agenda.
Again even if God were true I wouldn't worship him or want to have any personal experiences with him especially not the God of the Christian bible
A block of text won't change a thing about what I've experienced or that others have experienced or that you could experience. I'll be brutally honest here, I could care less what it says LOL and I don't mean that to be ugly either so don't worry with the "I'm close-minded" stuff. Most likely I'll read it tomorrow at lunch out of respect. It may help you sleep tonight, but it doesn't eliminate the fact that you haven't had an experience of your own.
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Love isn't words it's an action - it's loving action that conveys the concept of love, so of course you know if someone lobves you, it is evident in every action towards you, not that complicated, it amazes me how people get confused by the concept of love, their are many type of love, motherly love, brotherly love etc... but they all equate to the same thing - showing an overt concern for someone else through action, nothing to do with saying I love you - it's determined by the way you treat other people.
again an action can not prove love is so state an action that proves you love someone. Love is by faith only, anyone can claim it and doesn`t make it so
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OK we are getting somewhere, you still aren`t clear at what I am saying but my fault not yours. I am not trying to prove to you God exist. I am trying to prove to you that atheist such as yourself use the same type of reasoning and faith Christians use in their everyday lives.
You said it yourself you don`t have to prove to anyone your love but nevertheless the love you speak of has to be taken by faith so again my point is you guys are being hypocrites when addressing the that we are stupid because we rely on faith when in fact you too rely on faith every single day.
Again you can't compare the two , family is real , God is a story. I don't have faith my family loves me or vice versa I ask them and get an answer and they prove it with their actions , you can't compare that to a belief in a supernatural being who will reward you with eternal life
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read it in it's entirety , this puts to bed your claim from personal experience but you wont accept it because it doesn't fit your agenda.
Again even if God were true I wouldn't worship him or want to have any personal experiences with him especially not the God of the Christian bible
Please understand my intentions here. I fully....FULLY...underst and you have no desire to believe or pursue a relationship with Christ. I have absolutely no confidence whatsoever that my words will even slightly alter your opinions let alone change your mind, syntaxmachine's mind, avxo's mind, etc.... As of this stage in your life you have absolutely, 100% made your choice.
My reasons for continuing on have to do with others that have not.
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You know you love them when you care about their wellbeing, when you express this concern through kind and supportive actions, by desiring good outcomes for them. You know you hate them when you want to see them all dead either by your own hand or someone elses. Stop confusing the issue, it isn't hard to know when people love something. People gravitate to the things they love, if people love chocolate, they eat it regularly, if they don't love chocolate, they avoid it. I know for some God Botherers they have trouble with simple logic like this, but for normal people, it's not too hard too work out.
A complete stranger can do this too.
Exactly, One cannot say they love someone and yet hold contempt for the rest of humanity - Love is a concern for the whole of humanity, it's not something you can segregate and say I love this person but not that person, if you are a loving individual, that concern will be applied to all people, not just a select few, that's where love has been corrupted, two people saying too one another that they love one another, when in reality they are together because they derive some benefit from the other, the moment one or the other no longer benefits but may even suffer because of the relationship, it is over, it doesn't mean that they fall out of love, they were never in love in the first place. I believe Love is an art-form, and like any art-form it needs to be practised, not an easy thing to do. Ironically, this is why Jesus stated that you must love your enemy, as anybody can love those that think were wonderful, the moment you can extend kindness and compassion to your enemy is the moment you have realised what love is, the majority of people can't do this, as they have a skewed conception of love, generally associating it with erotic love and not realising the deeper meaning of it, and because they think they know what love is they never seek for a deeper understanding, the path to understanding love is too first admit that maybe you don't know what it is.
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A block of text won't change a thing about what I've experienced or that others have experienced or that you could experience. I'll be brutally honest here, I could care less what it says LOL and I don't mean that to be ugly either so don't worry with the "I'm close-minded" stuff. Most likely I'll read it tomorrow at lunch out of respect. It may help you sleep tonight, but it doesn't eliminate the fact that you haven't had an experience of your own.
I knew it wouldn't change anything because you have given up reason and logic in favor for faith and belief. You can't think for yourself and prefer some ancient text to do it for you.
I've honestly asked myself is there a God? it's how I became and Atheist.
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Rhodes scholars of peace.
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Please understand my intentions here. I fully....FULLY...underst and you have no desire to believe or pursue a relationship with Christ. I have absolutely no confidence whatsoever that my words will even slightly alter your opinions let alone change your mind, syntaxmachine's mind, avxo's mind, etc.... As of this stage in your life you have absolutely, 100% made your choice. My reasons for continuing on have to do with others that have not.
I do. And dont ever underestimate that again, OK PETER?
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Again you can't compare the two , family is real , God is a story. I don't have faith my family loves me or vice versa I ask them and get an answer and they prove it with their actions , you can't compare that to a belief in a supernatural being who will reward you with eternal life
But I am not talking about God or family so that part is irrelevant. I am talking about love is given or accepted by faith alone, you can not deny this, hence this puts you in the same category as you questioning the next guy who you said can claim to be Napoleon but doesn``t make it so.
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again an action can not prove love is so state an action that proves you love someone. Love is by faith only, anyone can claim it and doesn`t make it so
You truly are ignorant, many people claim to love without knowing what it is, if the declaration is backed up by action, then it is love, not hard to work out, if my enemy is hanging from a cliff and I have an opportunity to be rid of him and I take that opportunity, that is NOT LOVE, if I save his life - that is LOVE. I feel sorry for the people in your life, you have trouble understanding the most basic of human emotions. An infant has a broader and deeper understanding of LOVE than you, between these ridiculous arguments and your evangelical religious posts I wonder what could have truly happened to you to get so lost and confused. No one is suggesting that LOVE is easy to practice, but knowing what it is can be comprehended by even the simple minded. I think you suffer from paralysis by analysis.
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You truly are ignorant, many people claim to love without knowing what it is, if the declaration is backed up by action, then it is love, not hard to work out, if my enemy is hanging from a cliff and I have an opportunity to be rid of him and I take that opportunity, that is NOT LOVE, if I save his life - that is LOVE. I feel sorry for the people in your life, you have trouble understanding the most basic of human emotions. An infant has a broader and deeper understanding of LOVE than you, between these ridiculous arguments and your evangelical religious posts I wonder what could have truly happened to you to get so lost and confused. No one is suggesting that LOVE is easy to practice, but knowing what it is can be comprehended by even the simple minded. I think you suffer from paralysis by analysis.
Says who says you. It doesn`t matter you can not know fo certain someone loves you, you can only believe they do and that ois my whole point, love is a thing of faith. No action can definitively prove love period, get over it.
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Says who says you. It doesn`t matter you can not know fo certain someone loves you, you can only believe they do and that ois my whole point, love is a thing of faith. No action can definitively prove love period, get over it.
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Says who says you. It doesn`t matter you can not know fo certain someone loves you, you can only believe they do and that ois my whole point, love is a thing of faith. No action can definitively provelove period, get over it.
That is absurd, by your definition you can't know anything for certain, if somebody shoots you in the face and then declares they hate you, you don't take that on faith and say to them, you can't know for sure that you hate me, your emotion of hate is based on faith, you can't truly believe that, your actions prove nothing, you can shoot me in the face as much as you like and I will never believe that you hate me as i know there is no way for you to actually prove it to me. Your argument is so absurd to make me wonder about your mental state, for someone who Bothers God on a regular basis it amazes me that you struggle so much with the concept of love. You must drive your friends and family nuts. You see abstraction where there is none.
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That is absurd, by your definition you can't know anything for certain, if somebody shoots you in the face and then declares they hate you, you don't take that on faith and say to them, you can't know for sure that you hate me, your emotion of hate is based on faith, you can't truly believe that, your actions prove nothing, you can shoot me in the face as much as you like and I will never believe that you hate me as i know there is no way for you to actually prove it to me. Your argument is so absurd to make me wonder about your mental state, for someone who Bothers God on a regular basis it amazes me that you struggle so much with the concept of love. You must drive your friends and family nuts. You see abstraction where there is none.
Ekul, way too much intellectualizing, relax.
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Ekul, way too much intellectualizing, relax.
Took very little intellect actually, the concept is understood by a child, I am always relaxed, even when discussing serious topics.
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Took very little intellect actually, the concept is understood by a child, I am always relaxed, even when discussing serious topics.
ok.
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Versed in regards to the topic at hand....not versed in every apologetic topic.
Besides, your waaay too smart for me.
I don't think I've ever played the "HAHA I'M SMART UR DUMB!!" atheist card on you, have I? If so, it was when I was grumpy, and I apologize. We can have fruitful discussions without any assumptions about intelligence holding us back
Let me know if I spelled and punctuated this reply correctly.
It receives my stamp of approval (I'd complain about the unnecessary use of ellipses but I need to prioritize my efforts here)!
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The Argument from Personal Experience is also a circular argument. In other words: “The proof of God is that I believe in Him.” The conclusion is assumed in the premise. These kinds of statements are absolutely worthless in establishing the truth.
If you are asked to prove the existence of god, don't bother stating your personal relationship with him as proof. Saying so will only make you appear to be a brainwashed individual who cannot distinguish fantasy from reality. As an argument, it carries no weight, and does nothing to counter the mountain of biblical errors, obscenities and absurdities.
I don't know what the "Argument from Personal Experience" is supposed to look like, but it doesn't have to be circular. Here's a simple version I invented just now, using probably the most common inference human beings make:
1. I just had an amazing experience completely outside of anything else I've ever felt.
2. The best explanation for this amazing experience is that I just came into contact with God.
3. Therefore, I just came into contact with God.
I'm sure something like this happens in a religious person's mind: they experience whatever it is they experience, then seek an explanation. They fasten upon what they feel is the best explanation, and this is their justification for what they believe about the experience. This is perfectly valid logically, even if it ends up not being true (for example, I think there are better explanations for religious experience out there).
In other words, there's nothing logically wrong with arguing from personal experience.
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Your reality tunnel or (belief system) is generally defined by genetics, parenting, early schooling, sexual awakening and blind luck. That's why societal evolution tends to happen slowly. There are set restrictions that humans must conform to at each state of growth. You can't pass to the 4th grade until you've conformed to the requirements of the third grade and so on. Humans have simplistic needs and tools to aquire those needs. Crying, whinning behavior tends to bring mommy and love is the reward. Dad's love requires a more complex set of skills. Friends and packs require further sets of skills and conforming to succeed. The sexualy awakening adds another powerful hormonal change and comes with all that baggage. I would wager to say that most men are unconsiously attracted to their first love/sex girlfriend. Maybe even marry women who resemble them. Higher Education continues to conforming forces. To get that important degree that provides money (survival tickets) needed to live you have to agree with their thoughts and memorize their appointed agendas.
Add 30 years of wage slaving, kikds of their own, debt and physical deterioation its no wonder this is the planet of walking wounded people. All of your belief systems (BS) are an expression of the creation of your reality tunnel based off of specific neurological imprints at different time in human growth. These reality tunnels also do an amazing job of rejecting infromation that doesn't fit into your "correct belief" system. Welcome to all politics and religions here.
At the end of the day a Born again Christians would be born again Hindus if the set of their live was slightly altered and vice versa
To be born is to be brainwashed.
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Your reality tunnel or (belief system) is generally defined by genetics, parenting, early schooling, sexual awakening and blind luck. That's why societal evolution tends to happen slowly. There are set restrictions that humans must conform to at each state of growth. You can't pass to the 4th grade until you've conformed to the requirements of the third grade and so on. Humans have simplistic needs and tools to aquire those needs. Crying, whinning behavior tends to bring mommy and love is the reward. Dad's love requires a more complex set of skills. Friends and packs require further sets of skills and conforming to succeed. The sexualy awakening adds another powerful hormonal change and comes with all that baggage. I would wager to say that most men are unconsiously attracted to their first love/sex girlfriend. Maybe even marry women who resemble them. Higher Education continues to conforming forces. To get that important degree that provides money (survival tickets) needed to live you have to agree with their thoughts and memorize their appointed agendas.
Add 30 years of wage slaving, kikds of their own, debt and physical deterioation its no wonder this is the planet of walking wounded people. All of your belief systems (BS) are an expression of the creation of your reality tunnel based off of specific neurological imprints at different time in human growth. These reality tunnels also do an amazing job of rejecting infromation that doesn't fit into your "correct belief" system. Welcome to all politics and religions here.
At the end of the day a Born again Christians would be born again Hindus if the set of their live was slightly altered and vice versa
To be born is to be brainwashed.
and for animal (humans included)and vegetal life forms life is about surviving (outsmarting / outperforming and dominating others) fighting constantly, learning -how to better fuck others in the ass instead of being fucked by them-, reproduce with the best female/male depending of our own strenghts/weaknesses, teach the strategies of survival you learned to an offspring, strangers or write them down in a book , which will make you feel "part of the big thing", "useful" ...and ultimately you die. Going thru life blindly, subconsciously, imitating, following what the preprogrammed behaviors, beliefs that you didnt choose and that are embeded in your brain and body "tell you to do", successfully -you dominate and people envy you, instead of being envious of them and dominated by them- makes you "happy" and admired by others, failing to do so makes you frustrated, depressed...but willing to do "better". Nobody likes losers, everyone like dominating characters. Want to learn from them how to become like them. Wether they re fair, moral, loyal or not doesnt really matter for most. People only see "power".
Most people fail to be successful , to dominate, to reach goals -most have none- and only go from a desilusion to another. Still, they have the automatically generated by the reptilian brain "simple" pleasures of life to motivate them to stay alive and wake up everyday. They can envision themselve taking a dump, beating someone else less powerful, eating, watching a soap that will allow them to flee the reality of their condition and imagine they re someone else , the character they re identifying with... And it makes their day.
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Your reality tunnel or (belief system) is generally defined by genetics, parenting, early schooling, sexual awakening and blind luck. That's why societal evolution tends to happen slowly. There are set restrictions that humans must conform to at each state of growth. You can't pass to the 4th grade until you've conformed to the requirements of the third grade and so on. Humans have simplistic needs and tools to aquire those needs. Crying, whinning behavior tends to bring mommy and love is the reward. Dad's love requires a more complex set of skills. Friends and packs require further sets of skills and conforming to succeed. The sexualy awakening adds another powerful hormonal change and comes with all that baggage. I would wager to say that most men are unconsiously attracted to their first love/sex girlfriend. Maybe even marry women who resemble them. Higher Education continues to conforming forces. To get that important degree that provides money (survival tickets) needed to live you have to agree with their thoughts and memorize their appointed agendas.
Add 30 years of wage slaving, kikds of their own, debt and physical deterioation its no wonder this is the planet of walking wounded people. All of your belief systems (BS) are an expression of the creation of your reality tunnel based off of specific neurological imprints at different time in human growth. These reality tunnels also do an amazing job of rejecting infromation that doesn't fit into your "correct belief" system. Welcome to all politics and religions here.
At the end of the day a Born again Christians would be born again Hindus if the set of their live was slightly altered and vice versa
To be born is to be brainwashed.
Damn!! We got Carl Yung in the house, great post man!
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Well, thanks for having patients with me :D
No one is disagreeing with this statement, but the exact same is true about love and you refuse to accept this fact. The fact that no action and like you put it not even 20 of them can prove you love someone, if you think actions can prove love then name one action and I will prove that that action you stated is not proof. point is we use the same rational reasoning in believing we love someone as Christians do when they believe their experience with God
Before you have a conversation about whether you can prove you love someone or they love you or not, you need to define love. That might be somewhat difficult to do since what love means to one person can be very different from what it means to another.
There is nothing wrong in having faith in something or someone. However faith does not make something so except perhaps to the person who believes it does. For example, if someone believes they have faith in God then for them that makes God real. It doesn't make god real for someone who does not have faith in God.
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and for animal (humans included)and vegetal life forms life is about surviving (outsmarting / outperforming and dominating others) fighting constantly, learning -how to better fuck others in the ass instead of being fucked by them-, reproduce with the best female/male depending of our own strenghts/weaknesses, teach the strategies of survival you learned to an offspring, strangers or write them down in a book , which will make you feel "part of the big thing", "useful" ...and ultimately you die. Going thru life blindly, subconsciously, imitating, following what the preprogrammed behaviors, beliefs that you didnt choose and that are embeded in your brain and body "tell you to do", successfully -you dominate and people envy you, instead of being envious of them and dominated by them- makes you "happy" and admired by others, failing to do so makes you frustrated, depressed...but willing to do "better". Nobody likes losers, everyone like dominating characters. Want to learn from them how to become like them. Wether they re fair, moral, loyal or not doesnt really matter for most. People only see "power".
Most people fail to be successful , to dominate, to reach goals -most have none- and only go from a desilusion to another. Still, they have the automatically generated by the reptilian brain "simple" pleasures of life to motivate them to stay alive and wake up everyday. They can envision themselve taking a dump, beating someone else less powerful, eating, watching a soap that will allow them to flee the reality of their condition and imagine they re someone else , the character they re identifying with... And it makes their day.
you are a repressed homosexual.
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Blah, blah, blah....And it makes their my day.
Fixed!
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Before you have a conversation about whether you can prove you love someone or they love you or not, you need to define love. That might be somewhat difficult to do since what love means to one person can be very different from what it means to another.
There is nothing wrong in having faith in something or someone. However faith does not make something so except perhaps to the person who believes it does. For example, if someone believes they have faith in God then for them that makes God real. It doesn't make god real for someone who does not have faith in God.
EXCELLENT POST. What you said is all I have been trying to say all along.
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I don't think I've ever played the "HAHA I'M SMART UR DUMB!!" atheist card on you, have I? If so, it was when I was grumpy, and I apologize. We can have fruitful discussions without any assumptions about intelligence holding us back
It receives my stamp of approval (I'd complain about the unnecessary use of ellipses but I need to prioritize my efforts here)!
No worries, I was just goofin around....you've never been ugly in your approach...it's all good.
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I knew it wouldn't change anything because you have given up reason and logic in favor for faith and belief. You can't think for yourself and prefer some ancient text to do it for you.
I've honestly asked myself is there a God? it's how I became and Atheist.
As I said, most likely today I would read the block of text out of respect...and I have. Respectfully, I've read this type of stuff before and I agree with this, but honestly I reached these conclusions independently in the past. I fully recognize the shortcomings of empiricism, but my position is outside the scope of this block of text. I'm not suggesting that my personal experience is sufficient proof in and of itself. Again, my point is simple, if you want to understand my experience and recognize the proof then you need to have experience the risen Christ yourself. I know millions of people speak of their personal experiences and individually they are meaningless, but as a collective they're powerful; still, only aligning yourself with the collective provides you the missing perspective and fills in the gap. As I've said, refuse to do that and you're simply left with the block of text and no insider perspective. Does it require a "leap of faith"? Absolutely. I know you atheists scoff at the very notion of faith, but it's the crux of the argument and the missing piece. Human beings reasoning faith away doesn't change that fact. Blanketing oneself with intellectual arrogance and calling others deluded idiots doesn't change the fact. Giving the ole "even if God is real I wouldn't want to know that God" copout doesn't change the fact. It's about faith. You have to want to know Christ? Then you have to open the door yourself because he isn't gonna open it for you; still, the door is never locked. Again, I know this is meaningless to you personally, but my words are aimed at others that haven't made a choice. Would I love for everyone, including the staunch Getbig atheists to have a change of heart? Without a doubt, but I know adults refuse that kind of change. They have to want to change and must experience everything on their own regardless of what everyone around them has already experienced. "Hey Joe, this milk smells sour, it's gone bad!" "Here let me smell that......yep, it's gone bad."
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....my point is simple, if you want to understand my experience and recognize the proof then you need to have experience the risen Christ yourself.
Tell us about how you experienced the risen Christ. Explain how we can have this experience and how it will provide us the proof you speak of.
What about people who have faith in religions, such as Judaism as one example, which don't believe Christ is the son of God? Does this invalidate their belief in God or a higher power? Will all the millions of good and honorable people the world over who are Buddhist, Jewish, Muslim etc. not be allowed into heaven? Is heaven only for the believers? Where will all these fine religious people go when all is said and done?
Did you know that Catholic religion teaches that if a baby dies before it is baptized, its soul will go to limbo and not to heaven because it is born with original sin? At the end of the day, God will decide if all those babies and others who have been waiting for an eternity in limbo will go to heaven or hell. This is thanks to Adam and Eve's mistakes which resulted in God casting them out of Eden. If you don't agree with this religious teaching or ask for proof, you are told you must take it on faith.
Why is it that only when something cannot be proved or is otherwise difficult for us to fathom, we are told to take it on faith?
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Your reality tunnel or (belief system) is generally defined by genetics, parenting, early schooling, sexual awakening and blind luck. That's why societal evolution tends to happen slowly. There are set restrictions that humans must conform to at each state of growth. You can't pass to the 4th grade until you've conformed to the requirements of the third grade and so on. Humans have simplistic needs and tools to aquire those needs. Crying, whinning behavior tends to bring mommy and love is the reward. Dad's love requires a more complex set of skills. Friends and packs require further sets of skills and conforming to succeed. The sexualy awakening adds another powerful hormonal change and comes with all that baggage. I would wager to say that most men are unconsiously attracted to their first love/sex girlfriend. Maybe even marry women who resemble them. Higher Education continues to conforming forces. To get that important degree that provides money (survival tickets) needed to live you have to agree with their thoughts and memorize their appointed agendas.
Add 30 years of wage slaving, kikds of their own, debt and physical deterioation its no wonder this is the planet of walking wounded people. All of your belief systems (BS) are an expression of the creation of your reality tunnel based off of specific neurological imprints at different time in human growth. These reality tunnels also do an amazing job of rejecting infromation that doesn't fit into your "correct belief" system. Welcome to all politics and religions here.
At the end of the day a Born again Christians would be born again Hindus if the set of their live was slightly altered and vice versa
To be born is to be brainwashed.
so products of environments, yes? good stuff.
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While the current topic of discussion at Getbig Theological Seminary seems to focus on the phenomenological aspects of knowing or experiencing God, I think we ought first articulate a coherent response to that age-old conundrum, The Problem of the Evil Noggin Beast, i.e., if God is omnibenevolent, why does He allow the existence of this?
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Not clear if you were a believer or a strong student of theology? Regardless I'm sorry you lost your faith if that's the case and hope one day you can regain it.
I've met a few atheists that claim to be former Christians that turned to atheism. Some just flat out lie about that fact simply to strengthen their arguments, others were misguided/misinformed and were nominal Christians at best, but there are some that were genuine believers that decided to give up their faith. Those folks shared one thing in common in that they prayed and prayed for an ill/injured loved one to be healed and unfortunately the loved one passed. That type of situation is the most common I hear or they suffered through some terrible abuse. I've encountered some that claim it was pure study and science, history and philosophy that turned them from Christianity and later find out something deeply emotional and tragic occurred that was the real culprit.
I certainly hope you haven't lost someone close to you or that you suffered a personal tragedy.
Was a total believer. And I NEVER want to again devolve into one who has "faith". What a laughable curse.
Tragedy has happened since being UNborn and I thank my stars religion and faith has been nowhere in my sights. With strength of mind and body I have risen above a need to utilize a crutch as lame as religion and belief in a god.
My mind is my own, thank you very much.
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Tell us about how you experienced the risen Christ. Explain how we can have this experience and how it will provide us the proof you speak of.
What about people who have faith in religions, such as Judaism as one example, which don't believe Christ is the son of God? Does this invalidate their belief in God or a higher power? Will all the millions of good and honorable people the world over who are Buddhist, Jewish, Muslim etc. not be allowed into heaven? Is heaven only for the believers? Where will all these fine religious people go when all is said and done?
Did you know that Catholic religion teaches that if a baby dies before it is baptized, its soul will go to limbo and not to heaven because it is born with original sin? At the end of the day, God will decide if all those babies and others who have been waiting for an eternity in limbo will go to heaven or hell. This is thanks to Adam and Eve's mistakes which resulted in God casting them out of Eden. If you don't agree with this religious teaching or ask for proof, you are told you must take it on faith.
Why is it that only when something cannot be proved or is otherwise difficult for us to fathom, we are told to take it on faith?
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Stalemate of peace. :D
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I've deep-dicked the mothers of everyone who's posted more than once in this thread :o
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RELIGION........the never ending debate/debate of enternity.
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While the current topic of discussion at Getbig Theological Seminary seems to focus on the phenomenological aspects of knowing or experiencing God, I think we ought first to articulate a coherent response to that age-old conundrum, The Problem of the Evil Noggin Beast, i.e., if God is omnibenevolent, why does He allow the existence of this?
Hehe. Because it is his pleasure? ;D
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While the current topic of discussion at Getbig Theological Seminary seems to focus on the phenomenological aspects of knowing or experiencing God, I think we ought first to articulate a coherent response to that age-old conundrum, The Problem of the Evil Noggin Beast, i.e., if God is omnibenevolent, why does He allow the existence of this?
Eve was made from the noggin of Adam.
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Although no satisfactory theodicy can be posited for God allowing such an abomination as tbombz to exist, it might have been for the "goof of all time."
hahaha i've gotta watch this
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Page 13 xoxoxoxoxoxoxoxo
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(http://www.hinesindustries.com/images/webpage/propeller-balancing.gif)
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While the current topic of discussion at Getbig Theological Seminary seems to focus on the phenomenological aspects of knowing or experiencing God, I think we ought first to articulate a coherent response to that age-old conundrum, The Problem of the Evil Noggin Beast, i.e., if God is omnibenevolent, why does He allow the existence of this?
God did not allow the existence of that; it would be more to the point to speculate on the inherited personality traits coupled with widespread culture-specific memes (often disseminated by mass-media) combined with the inevitable peer pressure that turned a young and fresh faced man named Taylor to a prematurely-aged, steroid-injecting, forum-haunting, attention-seeking creature called tbombz.
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God did not allow the existence of that; it would be more to the point to speculate on the inherited personality traits coupled with widespread culture-specific memes (often disseminated by mass-media) combined with the inevitable peer pressure that turned a young man and fresh faced man named Taylor to a prematurely-aged, steroid-injecting, forum-haunting, attention-seeking creature called tbombz.
TEAM NOGGIN IN THE HIZOUSE!! ;D
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8)
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8)
Great pic by Sexual Mustard. I always wondered whether TA got the original. That would be such a keeper.
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I believe in Spinoza's God who reveals himself in the orderly harmony of what exists, not in a God who concerns himself with the fates and actions of human beings. (Albert Einstein)
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You're bananas.
(http://t3.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcQjKVy2FRiG7LfwWRjqNHXiIoI8Is2ut6wLPWLD7VvD0K1IetPduJQUtQub)
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"If you talk to God, you are praying; If God talks to you, you have schizophrenia"
---Thomas Stephen Szasz
God DOES NOT literally " talk " too us. I have PSYCHOSIS and have " RELIGIOUS COMMAND DELUSIONS "......So having GOD talking to me in the middle of the night and telling me too go outside and stand on the street corner and scream at the top of my lungs " GOD IS COMING "........thats not being psychotic? sure is.
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God DOES NOT literally " talk " too us. I have PSYCHOSIS and have " RELIGIOUS COMMAND DELUSIONS "......So having GOD talking to me in the middle of the night and telling me too go outside and stand on the street corner and scream at the top of my lungs " GOD IS COMING "........thats not being psychotic? sure is.
I agree, if you are of sound mind, he does speak to you in processes of daily life.
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I agree, if you are of sound mind, he does speak to you in processes of daily life.
AGREED.
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I would much rather live in a world that excluded liberals because they interfere in the lives of hard working men and women far more than God, gods and goddesses combined ever have. People squeal all the time about how God and religion try and take over their lives. Right...Liberals don't try, they legislate. Grow up. If you don't believe in God that is fine with me.
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I would much rather live in a world that excluded liberals because they interfere in the lives of hard working men and women far more than God, gods and goddesses combined ever have. People squeal all the time about how God and religion try and take over their lives. Right...Liberals don't try, they legislate. Grow up. If you don't believe in God that is fine with me.
Fuck politics.......Liberal = liberate = " FREE ". Im free from Worldly religion.
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AGREE
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Love that movie.
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Proof of God, bacon...this shows that there is a god.
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You should speak of things like turkey sandwiches. Things you might encounter in reality.
LOL god. Humans takling of ''god'' or anyhting for that matter is like dogs barking. It's just noise that means nothing.
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You should speak of things like turkey sandwiches. Things you might encounter in reality.
LOL god. Humans takling of ''god'' or anyhting for that matter is like dogs barking. It's just noise that means nothing.
Turkey Club, turkey with bacon...proof that there not only a God, but that God loves us.
Another proof that there is a God, that no matter what bodily fluid that a human possesses or exudes, someone will try to sell it, and someone will try and buy it...
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bodybuilding related
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v417/Lurmonious/lordhelpus.png)
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.
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.
End of thread
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Turkey Club, turkey with bacon...proof that there not only a God, but that God loves us.
Another proof that there is a God, that no matter what bodily fluid that a human possesses or exudes, someone will try to sell it, and someone will try and buy it...
pork consumption?
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pork consumption?
Bacon. Meat candy. Pay attention. ;)
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.
Dead bang
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End of thread
Yes, cause if Freud said it....
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Yes, cause if Freud said it....
Yes , cause if Matthew , Mark , John and Luke said it....
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I would much rather live in a world that excluded liberals because they interfere in the lives of hard working men and women far more than God, gods and goddesses combined ever have. People squeal all the time about how God and religion try and take over their lives. Right...Liberals don't try, they legislate. Grow up. If you don't believe in God that is fine with me.
the repubs try to tell people what to believe, if they can have abortions, if they can marry the same gender, what forms of birth control they can use, fuck off.
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Yes, cause if Freud said it....
No, because it's so well said. And based in such logic, reality and reason.
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No, because it's so well said. And based in such logic, reality and reason.
You're exactly right, it is well said and based in logic, reality and reason.
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No, because it's so well said. And based in such logic, reality and reason.
I find this reasoning very 1 dimensional, Freud espoused many theories on the abstract, alchemical, and spirtual, His collegue Carl Jung even more. There are many words of wisdom and life principals to be found in Mathhew, Mark, Luke, and John THE REVELATOR. But some of you might to to intellectual for that stuff. ;)
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who did freud help live better exactly?
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who did freud help live better exactly?
This thread is NOT about Freud.
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What would you do if humans found out that there was no god, no afterlife, etc.... Would you be tempted to sin? Steal, cheat, murder etc....? Would the Police /government matter anymore? Would there be civil wars in every major country? There is a good that comes from religion.
Only morally immature individuals would be affected by that. Morally advanced people understand principles of morality and feel empathy towards their fellow men. Hence, they don't need an authoritaritan "god" to punish or reward them for their behavior
Not all people need a nanny in the sky...
NN
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“All matter originates and exists only by virtue of a force… We must assume behind this force the existence of a conscious and intelligent Mind. This Mind is the matrix of all matter.”
― Max Planck
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Only morally immature individuals would be affected by that. Morally advanced people understand principles of morality and feel empathy towards their fellow men. Hence, they don't need an authoritaritan "god" to punish or reward them for their behavior
Not all people need a nanny in the sky...
NN
There is no such thing as morality. It is something that humans made up. Do other mammals have "morality?" No, they will either eat you or rip your balls off.
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There is no such thing as morality. It is something that humans made up. Do other mammals have "morality?" No, they will either eat you or rip your balls off.
hahahahha
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There is no such thing as morality. It is something that humans made up. Do other mammals have "morality?" No, they will either eat you or rip your balls off.
That's why we are better than just every other mammal.
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That's why we are better than just every other mammal.
Humans are technically superior, but have no natural morality - hence the reason we need to come up with a heap of rules on how to behave, because instinctually most humans have no idea.
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“All matter originates and exists only by virtue of a force… We must assume behind this force the existence of a conscious and intelligent Mind. This Mind is the matrix of all matter.”
― Max Planck
LOL oh brother
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Humans are technically superior, but have no natural morality - hence the reason we need to come up with a heap of rules on how to behave, because instinctually most humans have no idea.
I dunno man... I think I knew from the time I was born to not steal and kill... I certainly don't need any rules to tell me that.
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Humans are technically superior, but have no natural morality - hence the reason we need to come up with a heap of rules on how to behave, because instinctually most humans have no idea.
You are a sociopath who understands the N.W.O agenda, all too well. I have a natural morality and that is why I call out injustice. You on the other hand want accolades.
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LOL oh brother
Max PlanckFrom Wikiquote
Jump to: navigation, search
I regard consciousness as fundamental. I regard matter as derivative from consciousness. We cannot get behind consciousness.Max Karl Ernst Ludwig Planck (23 April 1858 – 4 October 1947) was one of the most important German physicists of the late 19th and early 20th century, winning the Nobel Prize in Physics in 1918; he is considered to be the founder of quantum theory.
[edit] Quotes
In the last analysis, we ourselves are part of nature and therefore part of the mystery that we are trying to solve.
New scientific ideas never spring from a communal body, however organized, but rather from the head of an individually inspired researcher who struggles with his problems in lonely thought and unites all his thought on one single point which is his whole world for the moment.I regard consciousness as fundamental. I regard matter as derivative from consciousness. We cannot get behind consciousness. Everything that we talk about, everything that we regard as existing, postulates consciousness.
As quoted in The Observer (25 January 1931)
We have no right to assume that any physical laws exist, or if they have existed up to now, that they will continue to exist in a similar manner in the future.
The Universe in the Light of Modern Physics (1931)
Anybody who has been seriously engaged in scientific work of any kind realizes that over the entrance to the gates of the temple of science are written the words: Ye must have faith. It is a quality which the scientist cannot dispense with.
Where Is Science Going? (1932)
It is not the possession of truth, but the success which attends the seeking after it, that enriches the seeker and brings happiness to him.
Where Is Science Going? (1932)
Science cannot solve the ultimate mystery of nature. And that is because, in the last analysis, we ourselves are part of nature and therefore part of the mystery that we are trying to solve.
Where is Science Going? (1932)
Variants:
Science cannot solve the ultimate mystery of nature. And that is because, in the last analysis, we ourselves are a part of the mystery that we are trying to solve.
Science cannot solve the ultimate mystery of nature, for in the final analysis we ourselves are part of the mystery we are trying to solve.
New scientific ideas never spring from a communal body, however organized, but rather from the head of an individually inspired researcher who struggles with his problems in lonely thought and unites all his thought on one single point which is his whole world for the moment.
Address on the 25th anniversary of the Kaiser-Wilhelm Gesellschaft (January 1936), as quoted in Surviving the Swastika : Scientific Research in Nazi Germany (1993) ISBN 0-19-507010-0
Both Religion and science require a belief in God. For believers, God is in the beginning, and for physicists He is at the end of all considerations… To the former He is the foundation, to the latter, the crown of the edifice of every generalized world view.
Religion and Natural Science (Lecture Given 1937) Scientific Autobiography and Other Papers, trans. F. Gaynor (New York, 1949), pp. 184
As a man who has devoted his whole life to the most clear headed science, to the study of matter, I can tell you as a result of my research about atoms this much: There is no matter as such. All matter originates and exists only by virtue of a force which brings the particle of an atom to vibration and holds this most minute solar system of the atom together. We must assume behind this
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I dunno man... I think I knew from the time I was born to not steal and kill... I certainly don't need any rules to tell me that.
The commandment to not kill is retarded, most of the human population benefit from the mass slaughter of animals, unless your a vegetarian your participating in the killing of all types of shit, the fact is to live in a modern world, heaps of life is killed to make way for greedy humans, including other humans. Unless you live an agrarian lifestyle on your own on some isolated island, we're all benefiting from killing. As for stealing, the whole capitalist system is based on the stealing or profiting from fucking someone else over.
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The commandment to not kill is retarded, most of the human population benefit from the mass slaughter of animals, unless your a vegetarian your participating in the killing of all types of shit, the fact is to live in a modern world, heaps of life is killed to make way for greedy humans, including other humans. Unless you live an agrarian lifestyle on your own on some isolated island, we're all benefiting from killing. As for stealing, the whole capitalist system is based on the stealing or profiting from fucking someone else over.
What the hell are you talking about...., why speak on something you have not read and act like you know something about The Bible. Everyone knows that commandment has nothing to do with animals. Humans only, read the Bible if you are going to reference it next time, wow.
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Animal Farm is a good book
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What the hell are you talking about...., why speak on something you have not read and act like you know something about The Bible. Everyone knows that commandment has nothing to do with animals. Humans only, read the Bible if you are going to reference it next time, wow.
Whatever man, the bible is the biggest POS Hypocritical book ever written to indoctrinate the gullible and weak minded, the commandments are vague and open to thousands of Interpretations, Idiots interpret to suit their own ends, The old saying "All generalisations are dangerous, including this one" is a perfect example of why the commandments suck - they're vague generalisations that don't mean anything. I can't believe in this day and age of logic and knowledge that idiots still fall for that garbage. The bibles lack of regard for all life is disgusting and just one more reason it is to be ignored.
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Whatever man, the bible is the biggest POS Hypocritical book ever written to indoctrinate the gullible and weak minded, the commandments are vague and open to thousands of Interpretations, Idiots interpret to suit their own ends, The old saying "All generalisations are dangerous, including this one" is a perfect example of why the commandments suck - they're vague generalisations that don't mean anything. I can't believe in this day and age of logic and knowledge that idiots still fall for that garbage. The bibles lack of regard for all life is disgusting and just one more reason it is to be ignored.
Think what you want, fine it`s vague, but this particular point is not. Everyone knows this, no one has ever argued that. The Bible makes it perfectly clear that you can kill animals and makes it perfectly clear that it is ONLY referring to humans in that commandment
If you want I can list 100 verse, yes 100 of them where it says it`s OK to kill animals.
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Max PlanckFrom Wikiquote
Jump to: navigation, search
I regard consciousness as fundamental. I regard matter as derivative from consciousness. We cannot get behind consciousness.Max Karl Ernst Ludwig Planck (23 April 1858 – 4 October 1947) was one of the most important German physicists of the late 19th and early 20th century, winning the Nobel Prize in Physics in 1918; he is considered to be the founder of quantum theory.
[edit] Quotes
In the last analysis, we ourselves are part of nature and therefore part of the mystery that we are trying to solve.
New scientific ideas never spring from a communal body, however organized, but rather from the head of an individually inspired researcher who struggles with his problems in lonely thought and unites all his thought on one single point which is his whole world for the moment.I regard consciousness as fundamental. I regard matter as derivative from consciousness. We cannot get behind consciousness. Everything that we talk about, everything that we regard as existing, postulates consciousness.
As quoted in The Observer (25 January 1931)
We have no right to assume that any physical laws exist, or if they have existed up to now, that they will continue to exist in a similar manner in the future.
The Universe in the Light of Modern Physics (1931)
Anybody who has been seriously engaged in scientific work of any kind realizes that over the entrance to the gates of the temple of science are written the words: Ye must have faith. It is a quality which the scientist cannot dispense with.
Where Is Science Going? (1932)
It is not the possession of truth, but the success which attends the seeking after it, that enriches the seeker and brings happiness to him.
Where Is Science Going? (1932)
Science cannot solve the ultimate mystery of nature. And that is because, in the last analysis, we ourselves are part of nature and therefore part of the mystery that we are trying to solve.
Where is Science Going? (1932)
Variants:
Science cannot solve the ultimate mystery of nature. And that is because, in the last analysis, we ourselves are a part of the mystery that we are trying to solve.
Science cannot solve the ultimate mystery of nature, for in the final analysis we ourselves are part of the mystery we are trying to solve.
New scientific ideas never spring from a communal body, however organized, but rather from the head of an individually inspired researcher who struggles with his problems in lonely thought and unites all his thought on one single point which is his whole world for the moment.
Address on the 25th anniversary of the Kaiser-Wilhelm Gesellschaft (January 1936), as quoted in Surviving the Swastika : Scientific Research in Nazi Germany (1993) ISBN 0-19-507010-0
Both Religion and science require a belief in God. For believers, God is in the beginning, and for physicists He is at the end of all considerations… To the former He is the foundation, to the latter, the crown of the edifice of every generalized world view.
Religion and Natural Science (Lecture Given 1937) Scientific Autobiography and Other Papers, trans. F. Gaynor (New York, 1949), pp. 184
As a man who has devoted his whole life to the most clear headed science, to the study of matter, I can tell you as a result of my research about atoms this much: There is no matter as such. All matter originates and exists only by virtue of a force which brings the particle of an atom to vibration and holds this most minute solar system of the atom together. We must assume behind this
i wonder if he knew nietzsche wrote all the same things
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Think what you want, fine it`s vague, but this particular point is not. Everyone knows this, no one has ever argued that. The Bible makes it perfectly clear that you can kill animals and makes it perfectly clear that it is ONLY referring to humans in that commandment
If you want I can list 100 verse, yes 100 of them where it says it`s OK to kill animals.
I can also find verses were God gives the OK to kill other humans, I know there are verses in the bible that state it is OK for man to use animals for his own convenience, I was taking about the commandments, which are pretty black and white statements. Thou shall not kill/murder seems pretty closed to interpretation to me, if it was open to interpretation in would say Thou musn't kill other humans, but it is OK to kill life-forms you find tasty and high in protein. It's ironic how people always interpret the bible to suit their needs/wants. The Bible is the most genocidal book known to man, the God of the Bible—not only did he order His chosen people to carry out literal genocide— to wipe out every Amalekite to the last man, woman, child, God also threatened to destroy every living creature on earth because some humans irritated Him. Great God!
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Whatever man, the bible is the biggest POS Hypocritical book ever written to indoctrinate the gullible and weak minded, the commandments are vague and open to thousands of Interpretations, Idiots interpret to suit their own ends, The old saying "All generalisations are dangerous, including this one" is a perfect example of why the commandments suck - they're vague generalisations that don't mean anything. I can't believe in this day and age of logic and knowledge that idiots still fall for that garbage. The bibles lack of regard for all life is disgusting and just one more reason it is to be ignored.
Hmmm... and what "Book" do you believe in?
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I can also find verses were God gives the OK to kill other humans, I know there are verses in the bible that state it is OK for man to use animals for his own convenience, I was taking about the commandments, which are pretty black and white statements. Thou shall not kill/murder seems pretty closed to interpretation to me, if it was open to interpretation in would say Thou musn't kill other humans, but it is OK to kill life-forms you find tasty and high in protein. It's ironic how people always interpret the bible to suit their needs/wants. The Bible is the most genocidal book known to man, the God of the Bible—not only did he order His chosen people to carry out literal genocide— to wipe out every Amalekite to the last man, woman, child, God also threatened to destroy every living creature on earth because some humans irritated Him. Great God!
Bro stop playing dumb, the commandment is referring to humans, no one mistaken`s this for animals, wow your dumb as an ox, wooooooosh
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Hmmm... and what "Book" do you believe in?
::) Why the hell would I believe in any book - that's a retarded question to ask - the fact you need to cling to a book is a sign of your inferiority, weak mindedness and extreme indoctrination. HA HA And what book do you believe in HA HA. I believe in myself, no book needed ;D
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Bro stop playing dumb, the commandment is referring to humans, no one mistaken`s this for animals, wow your dumb as an ox, wooooooosh
Sounds convenient! Who the hell would believe in any religion that treats non humans as worthless beings not worthy of life and are to be sacrificed for god or humans = What a bunch of freaks!
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::) Why the hell would I believe in any book - that's a retarded question to ask - the fact you need to cling to a book is a sign of your inferiority, weak mindedness and extreme indoctrination. HA HA And what book do you believe in HA HA. I believe in myself, no book needed ;D
You sound a little Defensive and appear to know so much about the "bible" for someone who only believes in himself, as in someone who has a hidden agenda, if you dont believe in any "book" why the drawn out Conclusions and analysis on this subject of the Bible?
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You sound a little Defensive and appear to know so much about the "bible" for someone who only believes in himself, as in someone who has a hidden agenda, if you dont believe in any "book" why the drawn out Conclusions and analysis on this subject of the Bible?
I am interested in all schools of thought, I don't have particularly much interest in the bible, I read a Children's version when I was about ten and went to church of my own bat for about 6 months (my parents weren't religious, although my mother had a religious bent, but my father was definitely an agnostic/atheist but they never forced any belief system on me), I just see it as another field of inquiry, and it's best to know a little about the things you don't agree with or are critical of. I'm not about about to study the bible to win an argument on getbig, personally, I just think knowledge has evolved well beyond the bible, and blindly believing in things that aren't true or empirically unprovable is only holding back human innovation, technology and a deeper understanding of the world around us. It is quite possible that humans will never know the Ultimate truths as they are also a part of the cosmos, but we sure are on our way to solving some of the deeper mysteries that have plagued humanity. It's apparent to the casual observer that humans have a destructive nature, and religion was a great control system of the masses until knowledge and logic became popular and questioned the bizarre statements made in the Bible, most of which children can see the lack of logic in. Churches and religion have been fighting academia now for quite some time, and they are losing the battle.
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I am interested in all schools of thought, I don't have particularly much interest in the bible, I read a Children's version when I was about ten and went to church of my own bat for about 6 months (my parents weren't religious, although my mother had a religious bent, but my father was definitely an agnostic/atheist but they never forced any belief system on me), I just see it as another field of inquiry, and it's best to know a little about the things you don't agree with or are critical of. I'm not about about to study the bible to win an argument on getbig, personally, I just think knowledge has evolved well beyond the bible, and blindly believing in things that aren't true or empirically unprovable is only holding back human innovation, technology and a deeper understanding of the world around us. It is quite possible that humans will never know the Ultimate truths as they are also a part of the cosmos, but we sure are on our way to solving some of the deeper mysteries that have plagued humanity. It's apparent to the casual observer that humans have a destructive nature, and religion was a great control system of the masses until knowledge and logic became popular and questioned the bizarre statements made in the Bible, most of which children can see the lack of logic in. Churches and religion have been fighting academia now for quite some time, and they are losing the battle.
Paragraphs motherfucker, can you use them?
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I am interested in all schools of thought, I don't have particularly much interest in the bible, I read a Children's version when I was about ten and went to church of my own bat for about 6 months (my parents weren't religious, although my mother had a religious bent, but my father was definitely an agnostic/atheist but they never forced any belief system on me), I just see it as another field of inquiry, and it's best to know a little about the things you don't agree with or are critical of. I'm not about about to study the bible to win an argument on getbig, personally, I just think knowledge has evolved well beyond the bible, and blindly believing in things that aren't true or empirically unprovable is only holding back human innovation, technology and a deeper understanding of the world around us. It is quite possible that humans will never know the Ultimate truths as they are also a part of the cosmos, but we sure are on our way to solving some of the deeper mysteries that have plagued humanity. It's apparent to the casual observer that humans have a destructive nature, and religion was a great control system of the masses until knowledge and logic became popular and questioned the bizarre statements made in the Bible, most of which children can see the lack of logic in. Churches and religion have been fighting academia now for quite some time, and they are losing the battle.
Fair enough, Personally i don't believe in any Religion, in any Culture, in any Country, IMO it all Equals Brainwashing witch starts for some from birth, witch in turn... leads to Envy/"superiority"/Mistrust/Deceit//Death and all in that order for the fanatics all over the place.
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Paragraphs motherfucker, can you use them?
I believe if he read the Bible, hs would have learned how to use them.
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Fair enough, Personally i don't believe in any Religion, in any Culture, in any Country, IMO it all Equals Brainwashing witch starts for some from birth, witch in turn... leads to Envy/"superiority"/Mistrust/Deceit//Death and all in that order for the fanatics all over the place.
Agree 100%.
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I dunno man... I think I knew from the time I was born to not steal and kill... I certainly don't need any rules to tell me that.
That brings up a good question. Why do people steal and kill in the first place? Lack of intelligence? Desperation? (poor, hungry), maybe they couldn't control their primitive urges.
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Sounds convenient! Who the hell would believe in any religion that treats non humans as worthless beings not worthy of life and are to be sacrificed for god or humans = What a bunch of freaks!
That is not the point here is it
The point is you thought the commandment ``thou shalt not kill`` included animals. lmao dumbass :D
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We live in a world without god already, its reality. What we really need is a world without the concept of god and all the petty nastiness it brings.
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who did freud help live better exactly?
Ask some of his patients....of course, they are likely all dead now.
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That is not the point here is it
The point is you thought the commandment ``thou shalt not kill`` included animals. lmao dumbass :D
I believe it does, it's pretty black and white - You freaks can INTERPRET the Bible any way you want, I'll just take the words as they are PRINTED - To kill means to deprive a life-form of it's life-force, seems a pretty twisted concept to take a black and white statement like THOU SHALL NOT KILL and then say BUT - with the exception of high protein tasty life-forms, just another example of the pure hypocrisy of religious NUTJOBS. The fact you feel good about the killing of animals for mass consumption shows what a HELLISH individual you are. If you are an example of a GOD BOTHERER, then no wonder decent folk steer well clear of GOD and the BIBLE!
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I believe it does, it's pretty black and white - You freaks can INTERPRET the Bible any way you want, I'll just take the words as they are PRINTED - To kill means to deprive a life-form of it's life-force, seems a pretty twisted concept to take a black and white statement like THOU SHALL NOT KILL and then say BUT - with the exception of high protein tasty life-forms, just another example of the pure hypocrisy of religious NUTJOBS. The fact you feel good about the killing of animals for mass consumption shows what a HELLISH individual you are. If you are an example of a GOD BOTHERER, then no wonder decent folk steer well clear of GOD and the BIBLE!
No one ever thought what you just did, no one is that dumb, that is 1 verse out of a chapter, out of a 40 chapter book (exodus) It is 100% clear that it only means humans, it clarifies this in previous verses and in verses after.You would have to be a complete idiot to think it includes animals, it is the most clearest of points in the entire Bible.
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I believe it does, it's pretty black and white - You freaks can INTERPRET the Bible any way you want, I'll just take the words as they are PRINTED - To kill means to deprive a life-form of it's life-force, seems a pretty twisted concept to take a black and white statement like THOU SHALL NOT KILL and then say BUT - with the exception of high protein tasty life-forms, just another example of the pure hypocrisy of religious NUTJOBS. The fact you feel good about the killing of animals for mass consumption shows what a HELLISH individual you are. If you are an example of a GOD BOTHERER, then no wonder decent folk steer well clear of GOD and the BIBLE!
How the fuck would we eat moron? Animals and plants have "life-forces".
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How the fuck would we eat moron? Animals and plants have "life-forces".
He is dumb, everyone knows, including every single person who does not believe in God that the Bible tell us to kill animals a billion time over. Millions of animals are killed in the Bible for food, for clothing and for sacrifices, yet this fool wants us to believe that the commandment ``thou shalt not kill`was referring to animals as well, what a dummy
BTW good point with the plant and animals having life, lol so he believe`s the commandment also means don`t cut down trees. lmao
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How the fuck would we eat moron? Animals and plants have "life-forces".
Plants do not have a consciousness, they do not feel pain and aren't sentient beings, this is how fucked up religious indoctrinated retards are, they compare animals to plants where the huge biological and genetic disparity between the two is obvious to a toddler. The argument is, Bible bashers have no problem with causing other sentient beings suffering, whether it be human life or animal life, the Bible should be called the Big Book of genocide and God labelled an angry sociopath. Keep believing your Bible Bashing Nonsense because it helps you fit in down at the local church, but you will never be considered a free thinking independent rational being. Anybody with a shred of lucidness and intellect will look at you the way a grown man looks at a child. Like I said, I think the ten commandments are retarded, delivered to humanity by a schizophrenic and taken as gospel by schizophrenics.
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give it up dumbass, it did not mean animals and you`re dumb for thinking so.
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He is dumb, everyone knows, including every single person who does not believe in God that the Bible tell us to kill animals a billion time over. Millions of animals are killed in the Bible for food, for clothing and for sacrifices, yet this fool wants us to believe that the commandment ``thou shalt not kill`was referring to animals as well, what a dummy
BTW good point with the plant and animals having life, lol so he believe`s the commandment also means don`t cut down trees. lmao
I don't even believe in the bible, it's full of fanciful child like stories for the simple minded, my point is the hypocrisy, Thou shall not kill can be interpreted any way you like and often is for the convenience of the reader.
God was a genocidal maniac, God commanded his chosen people to carry out literal genocide - I mean, wipe out every Amalekite to the last man, woman, child, and, you know, donkey and so on, because hundreds of years ago they got in your way when you were trying to cross the desert - not only did He do things like that, but, after all, the God of the Bible was ready to destroy every living creature on earth because some humans irritated Him. That's the story of Noah. I mean, that's beyond genocide - you don't know how to describe this creature. Somebody offended Him, and He was going to destroy every living being on earth? And then He was talked into allowing two of each species to stay alive - that's supposed to be gentle and wonderful
Talk about hypocrisy, and were supposed to take the commandment thou shall not kill seriously, Oh Brother. Anybody who believes and follows the Bible is a simpleton and more than likely will be a barbaric individual with little to no conscience or thought to the sufferings he imposes on others, because the bible tells them so. What a bunch of freaks.
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I don't even believe in the bible, it's full of fanciful child like stories for the simple minded, my point is the hypocrisy, Thou shall not kill can be interpreted any way you like and often is for the convenience of the reader.
God was a genocidal maniac, God commanded his chosen people to carry out literal genocide - I mean, wipe out every Amalekite to the last man, woman, child, and, you know, donkey and so on, because hundreds of years ago they got in your way when you were trying to cross the desert - not only did He do things like that, but, after all, the God of the Bible was ready to destroy every living creature on earth because some humans irritated Him. That's the story of Noah. I mean, that's beyond genocide - you don't know how to describe this creature. Somebody offended Him, and He was going to destroy every living being on earth? And then He was talked into allowing two of each species to stay alive - that's supposed to be gentle and wonderful
Talk about hypocrisy, and were supposed to take the commandment thou shall not kill seriously, Oh Brother. Anybody who believes and follows the Bible is a simpleton and more than likely will be a barbaric individual with little to no conscience or thought to the sufferings he imposes on others, because the bible tells them so. What a bunch of freaks.
Not when it clarifies that it does not include animals in the following verses ding dong.
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give it up dumbass, it did not mean animals and you`re dumb for thinking so.
Oh, you're one of them zealot Religious NutJobs - you have a monopoly on what the BIBLE meant exactly, that's why you freaks are hated, you walk around spouting what you believe to be true because a bunch of weak minded people got together and determined an interpretation that suits you. That's the point, it's open to interpretation, it's a book full of hypocrisy and vague generalisations and because of that you could get ten thousand interpretations. Thank God for Aristotle and the discovery of LOGIC, too bad it was lost on the simple minded fol at the church. You would buy anything your local Pastor told you, that much is more than obvious, more than likely your local priest is a member of North American Man/Boy Love Association (NAMBLA)
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Not when it clarifies that it does not include animals in the following verses ding dong.
Are you that ignorant, that's the hypocrisy everyone hates about the bible, it makes black and white statements That says, you musn't kill, but then goes on to say except under these circumstances. face it, every modern day thinker worth his salt heaps scorn on the childishness and ridiculousness of the bible, from the 7 day creation to women coming from the rib of a man, any fool could tell you, that's not the way the world works, unless you're an indoctrinated bible basher who has never critically analysed his indoctrination. I'm waiting for the, oh no, that passage meant this and that passage meant that. Bible freaks are a laughing stock and there GOD is a vengeful, hypocritical, genocidal MANIAC
Deuteronomy 2:
33 And the LORD our God delivered him before us; and we smote him, and his sons, and all his people.
34 And we took all his cities at that time, and utterly destroyed the men, and the women, and the little ones, of every city, we left none to remain
And this from Deuteronomy 20:
16 However, in the cities of the nations the LORD your God is giving you as an inheritance, do not leave alive anything that breathes.
17 Completely destroy them - the Hittites, Amorites, Canaanites, Perizzites, Hivites and Jebusite - as the LORD your God has commanded you.
And from Joshua 11:
20 For it was of the LORD to harden their hearts, that they should come against Israel in battle, that He might utterly destroy them, and that they might receive no mercy, but that He might destroy them, as the LORD had commanded Moses.
Next, the account of what Joshua, at God's command, did to the inhabitants of Ai (Joshua 8):
24 And it came to pass when Israel had made an end of slaying all the inhabitants of Ai in the field, in the wilderness where they pursued them, and when they all had fallen by the edge of the sword until they were consumed, that all the Israelites returned to Ai and struck it with the edge of the sword.
25 So it was that all who fell that day, both men and women, were twelve thousand - all the people of Ai.
26 For Joshua did not draw back his hand, with which he stretched out the spear, until he had utterly destroyed all the inhabitants of Ai.
(Joshua 6:21):
21 They devoted the city to the LORD and destroyed with the sword every living thing in it - men and women, young and old, cattle, sheep and donkeys.
Kings 2: 23-24:
23 Then he went up from there to Bethel; and as he was going up the road, some youths came from the city and mocked him, and said to him, "Go up, you baldhead! Go up, you baldhead!"
24 So he turned around and looked at them, and pronounced a curse on them in the name of the LORD. And two female bears came out of the woods and mauled forty-two of the youths.
Not too mention the story of Noah and Gods almost complete destruction of life on the planet save a handful of people
Genesis 7:23.
Every living thing on the face of the earth was wiped out; men and animals and the creatures that move along the ground and the birds of the air were wiped from the earth. Only Noah was left, and those with him in the ark..
What sick fuck would believe in such a sick, depraved and sociopathic Divine being - not hard to work that out - a sick, depraved and sociopathic human being.
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Plants do not have a consciousness, they do not feel pain and aren't sentient beings, this is how fucked up religious indoctrinated retards are, they compare animals to plants where the huge biological and genetic disparity between the two is obvious to a toddler. The argument is, Bible bashers have no problem with causing other sentient beings suffering, whether it be human life or animal life, the Bible should be called the Big Book of genocide and God labelled an angry sociopath. Keep believing your Bible Bashing Nonsense because it helps you fit in down at the local church, but you will never be considered a free thinking independent rational being. Anybody with a shred of lucidness and intellect will look at you the way a grown man looks at a child. Like I said, I think the ten commandments are retarded, delivered to humanity by a schizophrenic and taken as gospel by schizophrenics.
I don't believe in the bible, or "religion". I know that we have to kill to survive though. ::)
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I dunno man... I think I knew from the time I was born to not steal and kill... I certainly don't need any rules to tell me that.
The super wealthy who are running politics, technology and big pharma will slit the throats of any humans who get in their way. We really don't matter to the people who are running shit.
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The super wealthy who are running politics, technology and big pharma will slit the throats of any humans who get in their way. We really don't matter to the people who are running shit.
If the super wealthy run politics, it is because the voting public and everyone else allows this to happen. Others give them their power. Life is a survival of the fittest. In today's world money equates to being the fittest (most powerful). This will be true until there is a revolution as there has been in times past.