Well said pellius,^
These diets are all almost as stupid as one another and have been created and are adopted by equally stupid people. As you say we evolved as omnivores, so that's the best diet... It's that simple.
You forgot the kale, Wes! THE KALE! It's all about the KALE! Nothing works without the KALE!What an oversight on my part...........what was I thinking ? <LOL ;D
To me, these extreme diet plans just never made intuitive sense. We survived as omnivores and are constructed to eat a wide variety of foods. Why would you want to cut out completely one of the macronutrients or one of the food groups? In my circle of family and friends, I have my share of health-conscious types that for some reason always like to advertise and post pics of the food they eat. Like they are so proud that they believe is so healthy. It's always some kind of vegetable or fruit salad affair so lovingly and attractively presented. Today it was a concoction of blueberries, pineapple and cantaloupes. The one thing that they all seem to have in common is that they lack protein and the presenters are all fat. When I look at food I automatically look at its macronutrient profile and not so much the actual food itself. So I look at that colorful bowl of fruit as a bowl of fructose.
Of course the same goes for those all, or mostly all, meat/protein diets like carnivore or keto. Anyway, finally, I saw a video that explained this all to me and though it deals with the carnivore diet it can be applied to all.
Try each diet for a month.
i tried carnivore for 2 weeks ( i removed all plant foods, still consumed dairy and eggs) and i looked more ripped than i actually thought i was. This is my go to quick fix routine before vacation
if you just a normal bloke lifting weights for recreational purpose just eat whatever you like, if start getting fat just eat less. Fuck being miserable and restricting foods if there is no real purpose behind it ie contest or you make a living from physique ect
Mines partly to do with my kidney stone issues, my diet is very low in oxalates that were causing me the problems
Its not even like dieting, I can eat as much as i like as long as I stick to animal products only, I haven't eaten a vegetable since xmas
Try each diet for a month.
i tried carnivore for 2 weeks ( i removed all plant foods, still consumed dairy and eggs) and i looked more ripped than i actually thought i was. This is my go to quick fix routine before vacation
To me, these extreme diet plans just never made intuitive sense. We survived as omnivores and are constructed to eat a wide variety of foods. Why would you want to cut out completely one of the macronutrients or one of the food groups? In my circle of family and friends, I have my share of health-conscious types that for some reason always like to advertise and post pics of the food they eat. Like they are so proud that they believe is so healthy. It's always some kind of vegetable or fruit salad affair so lovingly and attractively presented. Today it was a concoction of blueberries, pineapple and cantaloupes. The one thing that they all seem to have in common is that they lack protein and the presenters are all fat. When I look at food I automatically look at its macronutrient profile and not so much the actual food itself. So I look at that colorful bowl of fruit as a bowl of fructose.
Of course the same goes for those all, or mostly all, meat/protein diets like carnivore or keto. Anyway, finally, I saw a video that explained this all to me and though it deals with the carnivore diet it can be applied to all.
Imo your just dropping water weight from very low carbs...
This Joe Dirt video doesn't explain anything. Looks like it was meant to be funny, but it wasn't.
The keto diet is not a protein diet, and it doesn't cut out completely any of the macronutrients. It has been used successfully since the 1920s by medical professionals and scientists in reversing many health issues. It's sustainable, and it's safe.
Is it extreme? Any lifestyle can be extreme to the person who doesn't follow it.
The standard western diet is very extreme, with very extreme results: Morbid obesity, heart disease, diabetes, fatty liver, cancer, acid reflux, kidney stones, leaky gut, autoimmune disease, mental illness, dementia, etc..
The main culprits are years of daily high blood glucose levels and consumption of "vegetable" oils (Canola oil, soybean oil, corn oil, cottonseed oil, sunflower oil, peanut oil, sesame oil, rice bran oil, etc.)
It's a gold mine for the food and pharmaceutical industries, the same ones who spend fortunes to fool people and make them believe the keto diet is extreme, unsustainable, and dangerous.
As for the carnivore diet, here is a video that actually explains things, with data to back it up:
been carnivore since xmas, I still eat dairy and eggs, best shape I have ever been in and not even restricting calories, Im always full and never hungry, if I decide to compete later this year covid allowing then I only need to cut out my tub of yoghurt (500 cals) and i will be ready in ten weeks
This Joe Dirt video doesn't explain anything. Looks like it was meant to be funny, but it wasn't.
The keto diet is not a protein diet, and it doesn't cut out completely any of the macronutrients. It has been used successfully since the 1920s by medical professionals and scientists in reversing many health issues. It's sustainable, and it's safe.
Is it extreme? Any lifestyle can be extreme to the person who doesn't follow it.
The standard western diet is very extreme, with very extreme results: Morbid obesity, heart disease, diabetes, fatty liver, cancer, acid reflux, kidney stones, leaky gut, autoimmune disease, mental illness, dementia, etc..
The main culprits are years of daily high blood glucose levels and consumption of "vegetable" oils (Canola oil, soybean oil, corn oil, cottonseed oil, sunflower oil, peanut oil, sesame oil, rice bran oil, etc.)
It's a gold mine for the food and pharmaceutical industries, the same ones who spend fortunes to fool people and make them believe the keto diet is extreme, unsustainable, and dangerous.
As for the carnivore diet, here is a video that actually explains things, with data to back it up:
How much can you lift over your head with barbell
Nothing but a well balanced, natural foods diet with a moderate to low amount of protein for me.
Tried the Paleo diet a few times a while back. Got super lean and also got kidney stones. Each and every time. Turns out these extreme diets create extremes in body chemistry. In my case the uric acid levels skyrocketed in my urine causing uric acid stones. Confirmed by 24 hour tests performed at the urologist.
Humans were not geared to eat high levels of protein without also eating far more fiber via plants. We also hadn't evolved to live off highly refined carbohydrate diets.
The best diet I have used is just a natural one consisting of about 0.8-1 g protein per kg bodyweight and the rest as plants and natural fats. To get lean i calorie count and leave room for about a 10-20% error in calorie values. Currently leaning out (1.5-2 lbs per week) on a 2200 calorie a day diet. Works predictably without any negative side effects.
you eating normal supermarket eggs and dairy?
how are the shits?
free range eggs and full fat milk, cottage cheese and Yoghurts
Had shits for a couple of weeks, now regular
Was concerned at first about lack of fibre, but when I looked into it its fats that keep you regular.
Nothing but a well balanced, natural foods diet with a moderate to low amount of protein for me.
Tried the Paleo diet a few times a while back. Got super lean and also got kidney stones. Each and every time. Turns out these extreme diets create extremes in body chemistry. In my case the uric acid levels skyrocketed in my urine causing uric acid stones. Confirmed by 24 hour tests performed at the urologist.
Humans were not geared to eat high levels of protein without also eating far more fiber via plants. We also hadn't evolved to live off highly refined carbohydrate diets.
The best diet I have used is just a natural one consisting of about 0.8-1 g protein per kg bodyweight and the rest as plants and natural fats. To get lean i calorie count and leave room for about a 10-20% error in calorie values. Currently leaning out (1.5-2 lbs per week) on a 2200 calorie a day diet. Works predictably without any negative side effects.
Dieting, in the sense of losing weight, is one of those things that is simple but not easy. Simple in the sense that the only way, THE ONLY WAY, to lose weight is to be at a caloric deficit. But it's not easy because people like to eat. In our culture, unlike how it use to be for most of history and for a large part of the world, going hungry, even just slightly, is intolerable for most. They just have never experienced it and for most, if they miss lunch, then they are "starving" by 5 pm. "Starving". There's a guy at work that when he's late taking his lunch because of he got slammed with clients complains to me that he goes "crazy" if he doesn't eat "on time". If he's an hour late he told me he starts climbing the walls. An hour late for lunch.I've found that when I ate 4-6 meals a day I (bodybuilding type diet) missing even 1 meal caused great discomfort whereas there was less discomfort even on a 1 meal a day diet. The body adjusts to just 1 meal but I don't know if eating all food at once is good as we get older. In the end a calorie is just a calorie.
So everybody is always looking for easy ways and tricks and secrets to lose weight without the slightest bit of discomfort.
Of course, I do believe there are some ways that are better than others for losing fat.
Protein is the most important macronutrient. Everybody would benefit from eating at least 1g/lbs. And humans can live with no intake of fiber. The fiber thing has been debunked.
That is BS. You NEED fiber in your diet. It's the essential nutrient that no one ever talks about.I havent eaten any fibre since xmas and my bowel movements are fine
A diet poor in fiber should not be assumed to be the cause of chronic constipation. Some patients may be helped by a fiber-rich diet but many patients with more severe constipation get worse symptoms when increasing dietary fiber intake.https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3435786/
Very good post.
I tried keto twice... I was in my 20's (now 54). Both times I was on it for 6 months straight, and I did not cheat or deviate from the protocol. I did not gain any more muscle and did not lose much fat either. Performing intense workouts (especially legs) was almost impossible. Your body/muscles want glucose NOT ketones.
You young guys can get away doing bizarre things to yourselves because you're young... no other reason. Youth tends to smooth-over nutritional deficiencies and imbalances. However, the problems will start to show as you age.
Dr. Shawn Baker, on carnivore diet, primarily eats rib eye 3-5 pounds a day for the last 3 years. Pretty damn impressive at 53, strong mofo too.
(http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=665546.0;attach=1169950;image)
It's actually the other way around. A young body can tolerate the abuse of daily high levels of blood glucose and industrial seed oil consumption for years. But eventually your cells become insulin resistant as a result, and you start developing fatty liver, fatty pancreas, etc.
This is why people start to get fatter as they age, even if they keep the same level of activity and eating the same portions of the same foods. If they don't correct the problem by eating less carbs and eliminating these seed oils, pre-diabetes, diabetes, heart disease, cancer, mental illness, dementia, etc. will soon follow.
I havent eaten any fibre since xmas and my bowel movements are fine
There are studies and evidence that people with constipation have fibre removed from their diets and fats added to allow better digestion
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/15654804https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3435786/
Yes, people get fat as they get old... BECAUSE they don't exercise and eat lots of junk food and sugars. You're doing your best to say that glucose/carbs are evil, which is simply not true at all.
Want to lose weight?... eat less calories and avoid simple sugars and fructose. It's not complicated at all.
Medical studies have shown that dietary fiber at best is slightly helpful for people who abuse carbohydrates. At worse, it is harmful. People who eat lots of fat and no more than 150g carbs per day don't need it.
Vegetarians, who consume high levels of dietary fiber, are more likely to develop colon cancer than meat eaters.
People who supplement with are actually more likely to develop colon cancer too.
I said people who get fat as they age even when they continue to exercise the same and eat the same portions of the same foods as they did when they were young. It happens all the time. It's called insulin resistance.
What about the many patients on the keto diet who lose hundreds of pounds of fat without exercise? They can't exercise because of an injury or because they are crippled.
I never said carbohydrates are evil, but all carbohydrates do get converted to glucose. And years of high levels of blood glucose is indeed toxic to the human body and leads to all kinds of health issues. That's a fact.
I havent eaten any fibre since xmas and my bowel movements are fine
There are studies and evidence that people with constipation have fibre removed from their diets and fats added to allow better digestion
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/15654804https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3435786/
If you live long enough EVERYONE becomes insulin resistant.
Yes high levels of sugars are toxic... no argument there. This is why we're suppose to limit simple sugar intake and eat more complex carbs.
This is total BS. That Dr must have some type of agenda.
How long have you been on your meat-no fiber "diet"?... a couple months?... years?
I've been taking psyllium fiber everyday for the last 35 years. Had a colonoscopy done 2 years ago. Doctor said it was the cleanest colon he's ever seen. When I sit down on the toilet it takes 30 seconds and I'm done.
Since xmas huh? 5 months and now you're an expert on colon health. ::)
Nothing but a well balanced, natural foods diet with a moderate to low amount of protein for me.
Tried the Paleo diet a few times a while back. Got super lean and also got kidney stones. Each and every time. Turns out these extreme diets create extremes in body chemistry. In my case the uric acid levels skyrocketed in my urine causing uric acid stones. Confirmed by 24 hour tests performed at the urologist.
Humans were not geared to eat high levels of protein without also eating far more fiber via plants. We also hadn't evolved to live off highly refined carbohydrate diets.
The best diet I have used is just a natural one consisting of about 0.8-1 g protein per kg bodyweight and the rest as plants and natural fats. To get lean i calorie count and leave room for about a 10-20% error in calorie values. Currently leaning out (1.5-2 lbs per week) on a 2200 calorie a day diet. Works predictably without any negative side effects.
been carnivore since xmas, I still eat dairy and eggs, best shape I have ever been in and not even restricting calories, Im always full and never hungry, if I decide to compete later this year covid allowing then I only need to cut out my tub of yoghurt (500 cals) and i will be ready in ten weeks
I do a pretty loose carnivore style diet throughout my work week now, meats and eggs are huge in my diet. I’m not really cutting down any different than I would with a suffering diet, but I feel a lot better honestly. I have a nagging knot on my shoulder blade that seems to disappear completely on a near zero carbohydrate diet. Come Sunday after relaxing a bit and having beers, it starts to slowly creep back. So that’s absolutely not placebo.
I also have no cravings. If I eat oats or other “healthy carbs” for breakfast, without fail I will be craving junk food by 10.
I’ve found that if you’re going to cut carbs, you have to eat tons of high fat items, or constipation is a concern. I’ll shit every other day on near zero carb diets, toss 8 oz of ribeye and I’ll ruin a shitter.
Why? He presented the data. What have you got?
All the same benefits reported by everyone who tries the carnivore diet for a month or longer.
I have my 35 years of life experience, 2 colonoscopies and NO health issues whatsoever.
How long you been eating a no-fiber diet?
BTW, psyllium fiber is not expensive when you buy it in bulk.
It's been well known for some time that excess sugars cause inflammation.
We literally could go on and on here:
Sugar is poison... alcohol is poison... pesticides are poison... drugs/hormones they feed cattle are poison... pharmaceutical drugs are poison... etc.
As I’ve gotten older I need to put fibre in my protein shakes or I will tear my ass. That’s my study.With a name like Jizzmonkey a torn also may be a fitting orifice!
But you said to limit simple sugars and eat more complex carbs, which is an oxymoron when it comes to preventing or reversing insulin resistance because ALL carbs are turned into simple sugars in your body.
Consuming more than 120g - 150g carbs, complex or not, per day will eventually lead to insulin resistance and then all kinds of other health issues will soon follow.
Glad it worked for you. Does it follow that supplementing with fiber is good for everyone, and medical studies on the matter must be stopped?
How long have I been on a no-fiber diet? What's a no-fiber diet, and when did I say I'm in one?
Thanks, but psyllium fiber supplementation is not necessary and potentially harmful. So I'll never buy or use it again.
Veganism makes a lot of sense. Unless you like inflicting pain, suffering and death to other living beings. Many vegans have eating disorders and anorexia though.
Absolute nonsense lol. You can live just fine on 0.5-1.0 grams per kg. I have gone as high as 2.5 gms per kg and it was a total waste. You have heard of gluconeogenesis haven't you? The unused protein converts to glucose via a very inefficient cycle and of course loads your kidneys down with high nitrogen levels in the form of uric acid. And the conversion of protein to carbs just makes you fat.
Nobody will turn protein into glucose on 1g/lbs. Nonsense. And your ''healthy'' kidneys can take care of that protein with no problem at all. With age your body's capability of utilizing protein from food gets impaired so older folks should eat higher amounts as well.
As for "the fiber thing being debunked" - you are on crack. Without plant fiber to expedite elimination and control blood sugar in the human body you end up with extremely slow transit times through the bowels - leading to potentially septic conditions. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3257631/
Your smooth muscles take care of that. If you don't consume plant foods, what sugar will this fiber intake control? oh and I can do the same:
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3435786/
Humans can live with no intake of food, let alone fiber, lol. They just eventually die.
Long chain sugars are quite different than short chain and get absorbed and different rates. Ever heard of the glycemic index and glycemic load?
You are an oxymoron.
With a name like Jizzmonkey a torn also may be a fitting orifice!Semencow was already taken.
You forgot the kale, Wes! THE KALE! It's all about the KALE! Nothing works without the KALE!
No need to resort to insults and name calling.
I'm very familiar with the glycemic index and the glycemic load, and they are mentioned in detail in one of the two videos above. You should watch them. You might learn something.
The glycemic index and glycemic load measure how those long and short chain carbohydrates affect your blood glucose levels when you eat them. They don't measure how years of daily high blood glucose gradually destroy your health. Both long and short chain carbohydrates get turned to glucose in your body.
Fiber is NOT harmful - lol. You are promoting outright lies and total nonsense.
Our bodies and brain were designed to run optimally on glucose NOT ketones.
And you are condescending. I don't have to watch those vids, I already experimented on my own body and know all I need to know. I tried keto twice for 6 months at a time, just to make sure I was not doing it incorrectly. I cannot train intensely on a keto diet. If you can manage to do it, good for you.
I want the glucose in my body... the preferred source of brain, muscle and liver energy, not ketones. I look 10 years younger than my current age of 54. Glucose is working beautifully for me, thank you.
For you to say psyllium husk/fiber is bad for you is absolutely ridiculous.
Psyllium = ispaghula
High-fibre supplement linked to cancer risk
"Researchers have found that a daily dose of ispaghula husks, a supplement sold as a natural laxative, increases the number of polyps in the guts"
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/1370123/High-fibre-supplement-linked-to-cancer-risk.html
Supplementation with fibre as ispaghula husk may have adverse effects on colorectal adenoma(polyps) recurrence
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/11073017
The lower limit of dietary carbohydrate compatible with life apparently is zero, provided that adequate amounts of protein and fat are consumed.
https://www.nap.edu/read/10490/chapter/8#275
Moreover, the heart has virtually no glycogen reserves. Fatty acids are the heart's main source of fuel, although ketone bodies as well as lactate can serve as fuel for heart muscle. In fact, heart muscle consumes acetoacetate in preference to glucose.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/books/NBK22436/
Your bowel movements may be moving now, but what does the inside of your colon look like? You keep eating a diet lacking in fiber and colon cancer is in your future.
You NEED FIBER IN YOUR DIET. I don't care what that bogus ncbi article says.
I take Potassium citrate solution every day, a teaspoon 15gms of powder in 1.5 litres of sugar free cordial, it neutralised the acidity of your body and stone formation is halted.
I used it prior to lithotripsy for my kidney stones and the consultant doing the treatment said he had never seen stones break up and disintegrate as fast
I was scheduled to have 2 surgeries to remove the stones but I convinced him to try lithotripsy after a gave him the evidence I had regarding potassium citrate usage.
No, Im not constipated..
when did I claim to be an expert on anything?
I havent eaten any fibre since xmas and my bowel movements are fine
There are studies and evidence that people with constipation have fibre removed from their diets and fats added to allow better digestion
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/15654804https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3435786/
I dont think you have enough to form a circle
Me.........I`m gonna eat grass clippings,plenty of Old Milwaukee beer,broken glass sammiches,Argo Starch by the boxful,along with dog bisuits and fertile duck eggs.
How can I lose with the stuff I use?
Semencow was already taken.LOL ;D
Sure, I have pics all over this site with me with friends and family. As for you, the only pictures are you nude, wearing a tiny thong with a thread of material pulled up your ass crack, and other pics just posing and showing us all how much you love yourself.(https://media1.tenor.com/images/1ec457d53bd3657982d577c9ac97f271/tenor.gif?itemid=6241621)
Sergio Oliva favorites were Hostess Twinkies and Mountain Dew.
:D
Biscuit Oliva (ビスケット・オリバ, Bisuketto Oriba), is a fictional character from anime and manga series of Baki the Grappler.
In the English dub of the second season, his name was changed to Oliver.
His appearance and name are based on former Mr. Universe and three-time Mr. Olympia Sergio Oliva.
We have two conflicting opinions.
Fiber causes colon cancer.
vs.
Fiber prevents colon cancer.
To me, these extreme diet plans just never made intuitive sense. We survived as omnivores and are constructed to eat a wide variety of foods. Why would you want to cut out completely one of the macronutrients or one of the food groups?
So, this thread, started two days ago and already at 4 pages, perfectly explains why these extreme diets become popular. We really don't know shit about how food affects the human body. Sure, we know we need it to live and that it fuels biological processes, but in terms of how it drives health, there isn't a lot of solid science. Every 10 - 15 years, what is considered conventional wisdom changes. One day dietary fat is the bad and the cause of weight gain, next it is good and has nothing to do with weight gain. One day excess protein can damage your kidneys and make you fat and kill you, next day there is no such thing as excess protein and the body doesn't store it as fat. One day being active is the key to maintaining goal weight, next day activity has absolutely nothing to do with maintaining weight it's strictly what you eat.
If we're lucky, we get 50 good years and 30 years after that will hopefully be okay if we did enough things right. Obviously, anyone that cares about being healthy and leading a healthy life is gonna take a look around at how what we supposedly "know" about diet constantly changes and be somewhat susceptible to exploring new things. Just because something has always been done one way doesn't mean it is the best way.
We have two conflicting opinions.
Fiber causes colon cancer.
vs.
Fiber prevents colon cancer.
(https://media1.tenor.com/images/1ec457d53bd3657982d577c9ac97f271/tenor.gif?itemid=6241621)
Caught in another lie and left speechless. Not only have you run our of lame comebacks, you've run out of lame gifs and keep repeating the same one. You're becoming the poor man's version of Roast Beef Pecs.
We have two conflicting opinions.
Fiber causes colon cancer.
vs.
Fiber prevents colon cancer.
Hadn't heard this. Not sure why it would cause it, but too much of anything is not good.