Ben Weider on PBW - REPLAY is READY!

[Original Sin]

Same here in England athletes were old if they go to the PDI event

 

You don't give yourself enough credit your not that old.
Ronnie next to go? he is getting pretty old.

Must be a Freudian thing with Ben.

[VIENIO]

Don't bother asking Bob any serious questions, he only answers those that he can make a smart ass remark on.  DO you actually think that he'll answer questions that put down his boss or the federation he works for.  He talks about how outspoken he is and blah blah blah, too bad hes only outspoken about issues that he can be outspoken about, other than that he keeps quiet and hides.

[VIENIO]

Bob puts down the PDI because:

-Its a threat to the organization he works for, he's probably worried that he'll lose his job or his salary-but if he knew a little about economics, competition would only increase his wages

-He hates Wayne

-He's selfish, only thinks about himself, not upportunities for bodybuilders to make money-nice athletes rep

Other than that, why do you put the PDI down so much?-dont worry I know you wont answer

[Original Sin]

Bob puts down the PDI because:

-Its a threat to the organization he works for, he's probably worried that he'll lose his job or his salary-but if he knew a little about economics, competition would only increase his wages

-He hates Wayne

-He's selfish, only thinks about himself, not upportunities for bodybuilders to make money-nice athletes rep

Other than that, why do you put the PDI down so much?-dont worry I know you wont answer

I assume you directed this at me...

1) I don't trust Wayne, can't say I really know him but the incident at the Olympia meeting with the athletes says volumes.  He might be a great promoter but the IFBB didn't start the crap with the athletes since Wayne left.

2) Wayne and his big "power play" to try take things over says a lot about his ethics.  He deserved to get fired.  It would happen in any business when a subordinate tries to make a power play against the company.

3) The PDI has made MANY promises about shows that never appeared with no notification that they were not going to happen.  Even Onlyme was taken off guard about this.

4) The medical benefits turned out to be pure garbage.  They are what a physical check up and nothing more.

5) Wayne has 100% control over the Athletes, he can let anybody go because he determines that their physique doesn't match up.  With the back ground I gave above Wayne can use this to terminate anybody who is willing to any kind of stance that might improve things.

6) Bob just started making changes for the better, many of them have been very good.  Most of them he has just presented and they have been approved.  This wasn't possible under Wayne.  Ben was still the head guy but Manion is willing to listen, and obviously Ben and Manion are willing to make positive changes.
I think they need to be given a little time.

7) Vince, Vinny and others who have seen the inside got the hell out, something isn't right with that.  Ask Vinny why he left.  None of his reasons are about gifts from the IFBB but promises from Wayne that never materialized.  Shows and seminars that were promised and never happened.

8 ) I asked many question about the PDI and got trashed big time, but was not given any answers until Jack came along and tried to help but even he didn't and still doesn't have all the answers.

I can go on if you like, I have many more things that make me not trust the PDI.

[G o a t b o y]

Why did you change your name from "NiceRacq" to "Original Sin"?

[Original Sin]

Why did you change your name from "NiceRacq" to "Original Sin"?

Jack

[onlyme]

I assume you directed this at me...

1) I don't trust Wayne, can't say I really know him but the incident at the Olympia meeting with the athletes says volumes.  He might be a great promoter but the IFBB didn't start the crap with the athletes since Wayne left.  Wayne from what I understand demanded respect from the athletes.  They came in late or something to the meeting that everyone else came on time for then he got mad.  The Olympia was 100% out of pocket for Wayne.  That means 100's of thousands of dollars, not a few thousand like at other shows.  HE paid for the hotels, airfare and per diem.  With that he demanded certain things from the athletes.  The problem is these atheltes think they are primadonnas.  THEY ARE NOT CLOSE.  Ever played pro football or baseball (or even high school) when you do something wrong the coach yells his brains out at you in front of everyone.  No matter who you are.  These complaints from IFBB pros about Wayne's antics at meetings is hilarious and childish.  If they are pros then they better be prepared to be treated like one and act like one.  This is a mute issue that Chic seems to always bring up.  Stupid and not worth mentioning yet he does to try to stack against Wayne.  All it does is make the pros like like idiots.

2) Wayne and his big "power play" to try take things over says a lot about his ethics.  He deserved to get fired.  It would happen in any business when a subordinate tries to make a power play against the company.  Not sure what power play.  He wanted to get some things done and the IFBB didn't want them cause they would lose control over certain issues.  DO you think Wayne wined when he got fired.  He has proven that is was a blessing. It wasn't that Wayne was trying to do any kind of power play but rather that Wayne wanted to do things that would take away some of the IFBB power.  No way would the IFBB let that happen.  They have been operating a shady business for many years.  Any kind of major change would just draw unwanted attention.  Why do you think no other sponsors outside of what they can control are solicited.  Cause major sponsors like Budweiser, Amercian Express, and many others demand accounting practices that can be traced so they don't get in trouble.  The last thing the IFBB wants any kind of tax accounting.  Hopefully Lee will be able to get this out along with a few others that seem to be looking into the IFBB tax problems.  How long do you think the IFBB will be around when the IRS starts there investigation.  Not long.  

3) The PDI has made MANY promises about shows that never appeared with no notification that they were not going to happen.  Even Onlyme was taken off guard about this.  Yes it did bother me.  But, then I have to look at the IFBB.  They do the same thing.  As with the Toronto Pro, and the Fresno Pro.  So I guess cancelling shows is something that goes with the territory.  The only problem I have is why would a company 40+ years old not have their shit together by now and have a set schedule.

4) The medical benefits turned out to be pure garbage.  They are what a physical check up and nothing more.   I know nothing about this issue.  I do know the IFBB medical plan is also a little misguided.  It is not a full medical plan like told.  And if it was why don't the pros take advantage of it.

5) Wayne has 100% control over the Athletes, he can let anybody go because he determines that their physique doesn't match up.  With the back ground I gave above Wayne can use this to terminate anybody who is willing to any kind of stance that might improve things.  SO does the IFBB.  The IFBB picks and choses who will have their pro card and who will win.  They too can get rid of anyone they wish.  But they do it a little worse they will have you keep paying dues, entry fees and contest prep and just make sure you finish out of the top 5 or money positions.  They just do it dirty.

6) Bob just started making changes for the better, many of them have been very good.  Most of them he has just presented and they have been approved.  This wasn't possible under Wayne.  Ben was still the head guy but Manion is willing to listen, and obviously Ben and Manion are willing to make positive changes.
I think they need to be given a little time.  There won't be enough time for them.  Once the mags sell, their demise is just around the corner.   What major changes have been made?  Don't mention the Olympia prize money cause Chic didn't do that.  The money was already there.  Does every IFBB pro get all their expenses paid to the shows they do like airfare, hotels and per diem.  From what I understand the major reason St. Cloud went to the PDI is because the IFBB wouldn't pay his way to Europe.  He called Wayne and he said no problem.  So he went won some money probably did a seminar or two and had fun.  Horrible thing isn't it.

7) Vince, Vinny and others who have seen the inside got the hell out, something isn't right with that.  Ask Vinny why he left.  None of his reasons are about gifts from the IFBB but promises from Wayne that never materialized.  Shows and seminars that were promised and never happened.  He won't say it (no way) but I bet he kind of wishes he stayed.  He could have made some money be ready to make even more next year with 9 shows and get booked all throughout Europe like Lee was.  Vinny is a nice guy but he will not make the money in the IFBB like he could have made in the PDI.  Vince just got hislast paycheck from the IFBB.  So even that decision wasn't good.

8 ) I asked many question about the PDI and got trashed big time, but was not given any answers until Jack came along and tried to help but even he didn't and still doesn't have all the answers.  People weren't asking questions, they were making derogertory statements in the from of a questions.  Big difference. Well the "questions" have been answered and the PDI is under way and will only get better.

I can go on if you like, I have many more things that make me not trust the PDI.  Go ahead, the PDI has shut every naysayer down already with two very successful shows and 9 more next year (possibly more).  Why do you think the IFBB has officials go to the shows.  they are SCARED stiff, thats why.  They should be.  A new sheriff is in town and soon will be taking over and then finally BB can get the positive reaction from the public it should instead of the negative imgae it portrays now.

[jwb]

Cuase they are idiots.Same here in England athletes were old if they go to the PDI event they wouldnt place well next show.Isnt that fixing shows? It is all bullshit there is room for other organizations there is competition in every other form of buisness.Why didnt Dan ask about not paying the taxes or the promoters from here not with holding taxes and how Ben tried to distance himself from the Pro side to stay with WADDA ..If WADDA only knew what was really going on...
I am so sick of hearing look what BEN and Joe have done for bodybuilding....NO the question is look at what bodybuilding and the Athletes have done for them....look at what they have made from the athletes compared to what they have given back.You dont think if there was no Ben and Joe show bodybuilding would not exsist..that someone else would not have done it?

That is the funniest part... ben acts like the sport wouldn't exist without him!

the truth is it'd probably be bigger and better if the weider monopoly never existed...

[Chick]

What planet are you on, exactly?

Talk about a view that is skewed...

BTW...The Pro's have every accessability to get full Group Health coverage...and many have already. Don't talk about things you don't know.

I also have to say....your idea of "Two very successful shows" is laughable.

[G o a t b o y]

What planet are you on, exactly?

Talk about a view that is skewed...

BTW...The Pro's have every accessability to get full Group Health coverage...and many have already. Don't talk about things you don't know.

I also have to say....your idea of "Two very successful shows" is laughable.

Ben Weider's attack dog speaks barks!   

[G o a t b o y]

Jack

 

[VIENIO]

Thanks for the reply Bob, awesome response.

What planet are you on, exactly?

Talk about a view that is skewed...

onlyme-come on man dont you know that if its not Bobs view then its wrong, he knows everything
Funny how he has the correct view on things considering that he's not in the PDI and knows just as much as me and you

[onlyme]

Thanks for the reply Bob, awesome response.

onlyme-come on man dont you know that if its not Bobs view then its wrong, he knows everything
Funny how he has the correct view on things considering that he's not in the PDI and knows just as much as me and you

Well, he is great at dodging the facts.  And you are right it's funny how everything he said is fact when in reality nothing he says is actually him speaking but Weider and Manion.  People that answer questions that need clarification or explanation yet answer them with one liners are people who don't know the answers.  If he does come back to answer it's because Manion is typing out the answers.  But, no matter what there are no answers to statements that are true.

What planet are you on, exactly?

Talk about a view that is skewed...

BTW...The Pro's have every accessability to get full Group Health coverage...and many have already. Don't talk about things you don't know.

I also have to say....your idea of "Two very successful shows" is laughable.

Yes my view is straight and compared to how you see things (the IFBB view) then yes I can see where you think my views are skewed.

Your insurance was laughable, proven by the lack of participation.

And yes I think both NOC shows were great successes.  Here's why;

1. they still went on even with the IFBB trying everything in their power to stop them.  Now that is laughable.  Incredibly laughable and you know it just won't admit it.
2. the IFBB failed to get Lee to cave into their baseless threats.  The others that went back were obviously weak and had to go back.  This tactic did nothing to hurt the two shows.  NOTHING
3. the IFBB even had the tallest IFBB stooge standing at the door of the NOC and it did nothign but embarrass (again) the IFBB.  Again, incredibly laughable.
4. You everyday came on saying where is the money.  Well unlike the IFBB show in that western state that bounced checks, the money was directly deposited into the competitors account.  NOW that is successful.  Nothing negative can be said about that.
5. No matter what, both shows took place and both shows were close to full at the night show.   Not your made up number that you think cause you say everyone should believe you.  Like I said, call the box office and see.  Don't be scared.  The NOC wasn't a flop like the Atlantic City Show.  An IFBB Pro competing in front of less than 300 spectators at the night show is INCREDIBLY laughable.  In fact it is HILARIOUS.  What you should do is stay out of these fields marketing, promotion, advertising, accounting and basically anything to do with getting people together or letting people know about something.  Your attendance record for your IFBB meetings you schedule should be the first hint.
5. The sound, staging, back stage, announcer, music, lighting seemed to be perfect at both shows.  Jeez even Kevin said that about London.
6.  Not one competitor has complained.  Hey Bob............. thats a another hint that the shows were probably successful.

See your point of view has no weight on anything concerning the PDI.  Nothing.  It's not even your opinion.  It's someone else's that tells you what to say.  everyone knows it.  we know you can't and won't admit it, but we already know.

Anyway, hey keep talking about the PDI like you do.  It's great.  I think your check is in the mail.

[Chick]

Well, he is great at dodging the facts.  And you are right it's funny how everything he said is fact when in reality nothing he says is actually him speaking but Weider and Manion.  People that answer questions that need clarification or explanation yet answer them with one liners are people who don't know the answers.  If he does come back to answer it's because Manion is typing out the answers.  But, no matter what there are no answers to statements that are true.

Yes my view is straight and compared to how you see things (the IFBB view) then yes I can see where you think my views are skewed.

Your insurance was laughable, proven by the lack of participation.


Really? Well, please feel free to tell me how many people have signed up and are using the group health?[/glow]

And yes I think both NOC shows were great successes.  Here's why;

1. they still went on even with the IFBB trying everything in their power to stop them.  Now that is laughable.  Incredibly laughable and you know it just won't admit it.


There is nothing the IFBB could do to stop the PDI from taking place...They have been their own worst enemy in getting things off the ground.
2. the IFBB failed to get Lee to cave into their baseless threats.  The others that went back were obviously weak and had to go back.  This tactic did nothing to hurt the two shows.  NOTHING

The IFBB made no "threats" to lee...he broke the rules, he pays the price.
3. the IFBB even had the tallest IFBB stooge standing at the door of the NOC and it did nothign but embarrass (again) the IFBB.  Again, incredibly laughable.
4. You everyday came on saying where is the money.  Well unlike the IFBB show in that western state that bounced checks, the money was directly deposited into the competitors account.  NOW that is successful.  Nothing negative can be said about that.
5. No matter what, both shows took place and both shows were close to full at the night show.   Not your made up number that you think cause you say everyone should believe you.  Like I said, call the box office and see.  Don't be scared.  The NOC wasn't a flop like the Atlantic City Show.  An IFBB Pro competing in front of less than 300 spectators at the night show is INCREDIBLY laughable.  In fact it is HILARIOUS.  What you should do is stay out of these fields marketing, promotion, advertising, accounting and basically anything to do with getting people together or letting people know about something.  Your attendance record for your IFBB meetings you schedule should be the first hint.

Once again, Keith...filling an autorium with FREE tickets isn't that tough. As long as you mentioned Kevin, ask him how many people were at the British show...
5. The sound, staging, back stage, announcer, music, lighting seemed to be perfect at both shows.  Jeez even Kevin said that about London.
6.  Not one competitor has complained.  Hey Bob............. thats a another hint that the shows were probably successful.

Why would the competitors complain?

See your point of view has no weight on anything concerning the PDI.  Nothing.  It's not even your opinion.  It's someone else's that tells you what to say.  everyone knows it.  we know you can't and won't admit it, but we already know.

Anyway, hey keep talking about the PDI like you do.  It's great.  I think your check is in the mail.

[kmhphoto]

 WHo is promoting the Olympia next year.  Why isn't the Olympia and the Grand Prix shows on the IFBB website yet all others are.  Simple questions.

Robin Chang. It is listed on the site. GP's will be listed when the promoters fnalize the details.

[kmhphoto]

5. No matter what, both shows took place and both shows were close to full at the night show.   Not your made up number that you think cause you say everyone should believe you.  Like I said, call the box office and see. 

The British wasm't full.
Call the box office for the figure then come back here and report it.

[kmhphoto]

.Why didnt Dan ask about not paying the taxes or the promoters from here not with holding taxes

Lee, do you mean previous UK promoters not withholding taxes?

[onlyme]

Robin Chang. It is listed on the site. GP's will be listed when the promoters fnalize the details.

But he won't be there next year once the show is sold or are the new owners going to keep him and already told him that.

[TheGoldenPrince]

Weider should be more open; had the AAU dstroyed the IFBB back then, there would be no Mr O today.

[onlyme]

Lee, do you mean previous UK promoters not withholding taxes?

Any of the promoters in the US and probably the UK do not withold taxes do they?  When a promoter pays the IFBB a snaction fee, does the promoter take the taxes out of the check the give the IFBB or does the IFBB pay the tax themselves.  Well we all know the answer, just thought it would be nicer to ask it this way.

[onlyme]

Chic, the IFBB telling Lee he would be suspended if he competed in the NOC from all indications was threatening.  Then once they implemented the suspension and disallowed him to compete in the Olympia they offer him a smaller sentance (suspension) if he reconsidered and not do the British NOC.  that to me is threatening.  The did everything they could to try and get Lee back.  But, Lee has balls and he definitely more than any person associated with the IFBB sticks to what he believes in.  For anyone to think thatLee is in this fight just for himself they are pretty stupid and ignorant.  Cause from what I heard he lost a $100,000 contract with Twinlabs.  Someone in for themselves I wouldn't think would do this.

You are right about one thing.  There is nothing the IFBB could do to stop the PDI.  You finally got one right!  No matter how much they tried, everything failed.  It's pretty sad when you think about it.  The IFBB pretends the PDI doesn't bother them but they do everything they can to try and stop them and FAILED badly.  That must have really hurt the old man and Manion.  Wait till next year, it is only going to get worse.

You and I and everyone else knows that the IFBB was hoping to get Lee back ONLY because they figured it would destroy the PDI.  That is a 100% fact no matter how much you might say it isn't.  you know it is true 100%.  No double talk can deny that fact.

And you say filling an autorium with free tickets isn't hard.  Well maybe the IFBB should start using this tactic cause an empty house at the Atlantic City  show and non-sellout at the NY Pro sure could have been more impressive.  And again you talk out of your Manion ass when you throw out numbers.  You have no idea what you are talking about. 

And by the way the Titanic sunk, thats a fact, even though there were no pictures to prove it like you always want.

[kmhphoto]

But he won't be there next year once the show is sold or are the new owners going to keep him and already told him that.

Robin is the promoter. AMI have not sold the magazines. Feel free to continue speculating though.

[kmhphoto]

Any of the promoters in the US and probably the UK do not withold taxes do they?  When a promoter pays the IFBB a snaction fee, does the promoter take the taxes out of the check the give the IFBB or does the IFBB pay the tax themselves.  Well we all know the answer, just thought it would be nicer to ask it this way.

I don't know if promoters in the US have to deduct tax. The situation in the UK is differentt.

[onlyme]

Robin is the promoter. AMI have not sold the magazines. Feel free to continue speculating though.

You mean not yet.  Just a matter of time.  YOu can only go so long losing money. And loans need to be paid

[Original Sin]

You mean not yet.  Just a matter of time.  YOu can only go so long losing money. And loans need to be paid

This is one of my PDI points.  The PDI hasn't made a dime yet.  How could of it with no sponsorship and giving away so many tickets?  But yet you say the IFBB is dead in the water because of lack of money?
You are so biased that you can't even hold an objective debate about the topic.  I don't think the IFBB is running well and yes the athletes have been screwed over for many years.  It happened in professional hockey for decades but they changed all that, sort of what Bob and Manion are working towards (I hope).
But I am willing to give them the benefit of the doubt and time.  It has only been two years and the bigger the beast the harder it is to make changes.

I wasn't around for the WBF fiasco but I sure don't want the athletes to be screwed over like happened then.

Wayne might be a great promoter but his marketing of the PDI is disastrous.  How can ANY fan based organization survive with keeping so much in the dark.  We don't even know who is going to compete, or when, or prize money, etc...  Sami had to come on here and tell us all about the British NOC.  If Wayne was a little more on the ball with presenting the package instead of hiding it, I might change my mind.

Jack London has tried to answer any question I presented to him, but he isn't even privy to the answers for a lot of my questions and he was the number one PDI guy. does that make sense?

How about Lee Priest?
Lee was always somebody who said what he meant and you could trust what he said.  But since his slant to the PDI everything he says you can't really trust anymore.  I don't even mean the stuff about the PDI.  He promised us fans twice to be on the Olympia stage and backed out.  He says he wanted to be on stage this year but got suspended so he couldn't be, how dumb is that.  A four year old would know what was going to happen, but now Lee uses it as a good excuse. How about stolen plane tickets? or the promised lawsuit?  Is Lee waiting for the graduating class of 2008?
Lee always used to have integrity but since hooking up with Wayne he is losing it fast, which again says volumes about Wayne.

We can examine the Colorado Pro show next if you like....