Author Topic: Sergio 1976 - 1985 (Read 45263 times)

Sergio and Arnold faced each other four times

1969 Mr Olympia - Sergio 1st - Arnold 2nd
1970 Mr World - Arnold 1st - Sergio 2nd
1970 Mr Olympia - Arnold 1st - Sergio 2nd
1972 Mr Olympia - Arnold 1 st - Sergio 2nd

* 1969 Sergio beat Arnold in a 4-3 win it was a close contest *

Arnold beat Sergio 3 out of 4 times Arnold was a better bodybuilder.

DIVISION · « **Reply #231 on:** December 17, 2006, 09:06:14 AM »

Quote from: realkarateblackbelt on December 16, 2006, 11:54:56 PM

That's semantics.

Most people would call him a black guy.

You obviously haven't talked to Sergio.

The guy is Hispanic or Latino if you prefer.

He speaks spanish and that's his culture.

You think he identifies with guys like Flex, Cormier or Shawn Ray?

Hell no......

You have no clue what ethnicity means........it's not a skin color issue.

DIV

Sergio Rules 77 · « **Reply #232 on:** December 17, 2006, 02:41:16 PM »

Quote from: NarcissisticDeity on December 16, 2006, 07:55:22 PM

I'm telling you Arnold said this about Flex Wheeler especially after his 1993 Arnold Classic win but at the time they competed he said Sergio was the best.

I'm pretty sure it was sometime around 1980 where Arnold was quoted as saying that Sergio was the greatest ever. Arnold, Dorian & Ronnie came close in '74, '93 & '99 respectively but I still think Arnold's words ring true 26 years later. The link below also states Arnold said it, but it dosn't give a source.

http://www.bodybuilders.com/sergio.htm

SERGIO!!!!

realkarateblackbelt · « **Reply #233 on:** December 17, 2006, 02:44:33 PM »

Quote from: DIVISION on December 17, 2006, 09:06:14 AM

You obviously haven't talked to Sergio.

The guy is Hispanic or Latino if you prefer.

He speaks spanish and that's his culture.

You think he identifies with guys like Flex, Cormier or Shawn Ray?

Hell no......

You have no clue what ethnicity means........it's not a skin color issue.

DIV

hahaha. I have no clue? I'm not talking about his ethnicity - I'm talking about his race/genetics. People are quick to say any black guy is blessed genetically, even when a white bodybuilder has a superior build. The white guys are always labeled hard trainers, black bodybuilders are stereotyped as being lazy trainers, but genetically gifted.

logical? · « **Reply #234 on:** December 17, 2006, 03:50:57 PM »

Quote from: realkarateblackbelt on December 17, 2006, 02:44:33 PM

hahaha. I have no clue? I'm not talking about his ethnicity - I'm talking about his race/genetics. People are quick to say any black guy is blessed genetically, even when a white bodybuilder has a superior build. The white guys are always labeled hard trainers, black bodybuilders are stereotyped as being lazy trainers, but genetically gifted.

Yeah, Ronnie Coleman is really a lazy trainer

You're talking out of your ass- I haven't said anything like that in this thread. Sergio could be Chinese for all I care, he still had better bodybuilding genetics.

And ND, as usual of course, just because Arnold beat him in contentious contests, doesn't mean that he was the better bodybuilder.

It means he was the better competitor.

NarcissisticDeity · « **Reply #235 on:** December 17, 2006, 03:52:35 PM »

Quote from: logical? on December 17, 2006, 03:50:57 PM

Yeah, Ronnie Coleman is really a lazy trainer

You're talking out of your ass- I haven't said anything like that in this thread. Sergio could be Chinese for all I care, he still had better bodybuilding genetics.

And ND, as usual of course, just because Arnold beat him in contentious contests, doesn't mean that he was the better bodybuilder.

It means he was the better competitor.

Just because Sergio had a better structure doesn't mean he was a better bodybuilder

logical? · « **Reply #236 on:** December 17, 2006, 03:53:56 PM »

Quote from: NarcissisticDeity on December 17, 2006, 03:52:35 PM

Just because Sergio had a better structure doesn't mean he was a better bodybuilder

That's not what I said, either.

NeoSeminole · « **Reply #237 on:** December 17, 2006, 03:55:15 PM »

Quote from: NarcissisticDeity on December 17, 2006, 03:52:35 PM

Just because Sergio had a better structure doesn't mean he was a better bodybuilder

you are isolating one variable. Sergio had better structure, muscle shape and proportion than Arnold.

NarcissisticDeity · « **Reply #238 on:** December 17, 2006, 04:01:41 PM »

Quote from: NeoSeminole on December 17, 2006, 03:55:15 PM

you are isolating one variable. Sergio had better structure, muscle shape and proportion than Arnold.

Arnold had better development and conditioning with equal size as well being a better poser ! you're isolating only the variables that favor Sergio !

logical? · « **Reply #239 on:** December 17, 2006, 04:04:03 PM »

Quote from: NarcissisticDeity on December 17, 2006, 04:01:41 PM

Arnold had better development and conditioning with equal size as well being a better poser ! you're isolating only the variables that favor Sergio !

Arnold had better 'development'? Better development where, in his chest? Yeah, fine- we've all acknowledged that. Nowhere else though.

Yes, we've also conceded he had better conditioning, youi would be a lunatic not to. And yes, he was a better poser. We've said all this, and more.

However, does better posing make him a better bodybuilder or a better competitor? Clearly itdoesn't influence his physique as a whole, merely the displaying of it. It doesn't make him a better bodybuilder, only a better contestant, that's why posing is irrelevant to this discussion.

NarcissisticDeity · « **Reply #240 on:** December 17, 2006, 04:33:24 PM »

Quote from: logical? on December 17, 2006, 04:04:03 PM

Arnold had better 'development'? Better development where, in his chest? Yeah, fine- we've all acknowledged that. Nowhere else though.

Yes, we've also conceded he had better conditioning, youi would be a lunatic not to. And yes, he was a better poser. We've said all this, and more.

However, does better posing make him a better bodybuilder or a better competitor? Clearly itdoesn't influence his physique as a whole, merely the displaying of it. It doesn't make him a better bodybuilder, only a better contestant, that's why posing is irrelevant to this discussion.

Chest yes

Back - Arnold had a better developed back ! Sergio had great sweep to his lats and his back was thick but it lacked Arnold's development

abdominals - Arnold Sergio had a smaller waist but his abs were almost nonexistant

Quads - Sergio's had a better shape but Arnold's have better detail and development especially in the rectus femoris

Calves - Arnold - Sergio had thick calves but again Arnold's were better , better defined and developed

Sergio had a more overall pleasing shape but that doesn't trump equal size and better conditioning.

Iceman1981 · « **Reply #241 on:** December 17, 2006, 04:52:05 PM »

Quote from: NarcissisticDeity on December 17, 2006, 04:33:24 PM

Chest yes

Back - Arnold had a better developed back ! Sergio had great sweep to his lats and his back was thick but it lacked Arnold's development

abdominals - Arnold Sergio had a smaller waist but his abs were almost nonexistant

Quads - Sergio's had a better shape but Arnold's have better detail and development especially in the rectus femoris

Calves - Arnold - Sergio had thick calves but again Arnold's were better , better defined and developed

Sergio had a more overall pleasing shape but that doesn't trump equal size and better conditioning.

lol. "abs were almost nonexistant". lol. that right there takes away about everything you "claim" to know about bodybuilding. what a joke.

NarcissisticDeity · « **Reply #242 on:** December 17, 2006, 05:00:34 PM »

Quote from: Iceman1981 on December 17, 2006, 04:52:05 PM

lol. "abs were almost nonexistant". lol. that right there takes away about everything you "claim" to know about bodybuilding. what a joke.

Please show me a picture of a 240 pound Sergio with well defined abs, intercostales and serattus please do .

Here is a 240 pound Arnold with well defined abdominals , intercotals and a very sharp serattus

and the pics you posted are Sergio at 220 pounds and the pic in 84? lol his midection is lacking.

body88 · « **Reply #243 on:** December 17, 2006, 05:10:54 PM »

Quote from: Iceman1981 on December 17, 2006, 04:52:05 PM

lol. "abs were almost nonexistant". lol. that right there takes away about everything you "claim" to know about bodybuilding. what a joke.

You are the joke. Sergio's abs sucked. He looks to weigh about 210 in the first pic. The last picture you posted is hilarious. His abs look like total shit.

NarcissisticDeity · « **Reply #244 on:** December 17, 2006, 05:12:48 PM »

Quote from: body88 on December 17, 2006, 05:10:54 PM

You are the joke. Sergios abs sucked. He looks to weigh about 210 in the first pic. The last picture you posted is halarious. His abs look like total shit.

I know he posts a pic from 84 when Sergio was way off and thats supposed to hightlight his great ab development.

body88 · « **Reply #245 on:** December 17, 2006, 05:13:59 PM »

Amazing how bad he looks in that last example. Shadow of his former self.

realkarateblackbelt · « **Reply #246 on:** December 17, 2006, 05:21:00 PM »

Arnold is god.

logical? · « **Reply #247 on:** December 17, 2006, 05:57:34 PM »

Yes, Arnold is God, we've established that. But that's not the argument

ND, you throw the word development around without defining it. Sergio had great sweep to his lats and was very thick, you say. But somehow it lacked Arnold's development. Please define this term. Likewise with calves etc.

Sorry, but everything you've posted so far that criticises Sergio comes under the umbrella group of Sergio. Yes, Sergio had crappy abs at his high bodyweight. Yes, his quads lacked detail compared to Arnold. Yes, his calves lacked detail to Arnold.

However, this was as a result from having poor conditioning, not from somehow not having the muscle there, or the shape.

You can't penalise him twice, once for saying he has poor overall conditioning and definition, and once for then also saying his quads lacked definition and conditoning.

Sergio lacked conditioning compared to Arnold. Arnold's chest was also better. Some prefer Arnold's bis.

That's about it.

realkarateblackbelt · « **Reply #248 on:** December 17, 2006, 06:07:47 PM »

Can't we get more comparison picks up?

With the two on stage I mean.

"Logical" keeps making straw man arguments.

The fact is Arnold had full AND peaked biceps (Sergio was just full), superior chest (overwhelming majority of people agree), better proportion, better definition. Taken all together, he was superior.

Sergio was a guy with big arms, unusually small waste, and average everything else. Oh, and powerlifter thighs.

Chest, biceps, and shoulders are key bodyparts when it comes to presenting an Olympian "alpha" physique. Arnold exudes this quality. His stage presence was tremendous. He was tall, ripped, and balanced. (Did Sergio even diet?) Olympia grade-A material. Next to Sergio he looked positively giant. I think you could make a better argument for Serge Nubret, but I prefer Arnold. Nubret was more balanced. He was the Shawn Ray of his time. Serge is comparable to offseason Lee Priest or Capriese Murray.

It's amazing, because people were saying Cutler won in 01 because Ronnie's conditioning is off. Yet, Sergio gets a pass for terrible conditioning because he's a "legend" in Logic's mind hahahahaha.

Parker · « **Reply #249 on:** December 17, 2006, 06:13:05 PM »

Quote from: realkarateblackbelt on December 16, 2006, 11:54:56 PM

That's semantics.

Most people would call him a black guy.

Sergio, is of a latino of African descent. There you have it. In America he would be called "the black guy".

And no, Arnold is not a god. God's do not admit that one has superior genetics as Arnold did with Flex Wheeler. Yet Flex is neither a god. The Ideal bodybuilding God has not been found yet.