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Author Topic: Training for mass - please help!  (Read 2999 times)
240 is Back
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« on: January 29, 2008, 05:16:16 PM »

hey guys, I need a lifting program that I can use to put some size on me again. 

I'm weighing 170 right now, after being 220 in the past.  I gradually lost the 50 pounds, as a result of healthier living, clean diet, and being more actuve, but my lifting has definitely been on the 'bitch' side lately - I'm weaker on all the lifts than I was at 220 obviously, but i'm not making big gains anymore. 

I need to lift 4 days per week.  Please throw some ideas at me - anything.  I typically do 2 mass movements and 1 isolation movement, 8 rep range, total of maybe 12 sets per workout.  I've tried going all out for minimal sets, 3 days a week, but the intensity is just not there.  thanks!



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Emmortal
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« Reply #1 on: January 29, 2008, 05:22:14 PM »

You should check out DC training, I haven't personally run it yet (going to in a few months) but I've seen a lot of guys really blow up on it.
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240 is Back
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« Reply #2 on: January 29, 2008, 05:25:18 PM »

got any links?  I seriously need something new to shock me into growing.
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mass 04
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« Reply #3 on: January 29, 2008, 06:40:38 PM »

shouldn't you have this down by now?  Wink
Here is a link to DC training. I've never tried it, i've always used volume with good results.
http://www.intensemuscle.com/dogg-pound.html
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Emmortal
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« Reply #4 on: January 29, 2008, 06:45:30 PM »

got any links?  I seriously need something new to shock me into growing.

http://www.intensemuscle.com/  - Dantes website.
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candidizzle
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« Reply #5 on: January 29, 2008, 09:28:48 PM »

got any links?  I seriously need something new to shock me into growing.
240...eat eat and eat some more. i can tell you have troubles with your appetite. just eat "clean" foods...a whole lot of chicken, oatmeal, brown rice, lean beef, salmon....complex carbohydrates, animal proteins, omega fats. you need to give your body what it neeeds for tissue repair. its an extensive process. and dont forget to eat vegetables as well..fiber and phytonutrients are great for building muscle.


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Geo
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« Reply #6 on: January 29, 2008, 10:41:45 PM »

hey guys, I need a lifting program that I can use to put some size on me again. 

I'm weighing 170 right now, after being 220 in the past.  I gradually lost the 50 pounds, as a result of healthier living, clean diet, and being more actuve, but my lifting has definitely been on the 'bitch' side lately - I'm weaker on all the lifts than I was at 220 obviously, but i'm not making big gains anymore. 

I need to lift 4 days per week.  Please throw some ideas at me - anything.  I typically do 2 mass movements and 1 isolation movement, 8 rep range, total of maybe 12 sets per workout.  I've tried going all out for minimal sets, 3 days a week, but the intensity is just not there.  thanks!





I can't believe you're asking that question after being around here for the last 4 or 5 years ?

you know (or should know) that the fastest way is to start pulling and squattin !



frankley I'm disappointed in you !
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LatsMcGee
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« Reply #7 on: January 30, 2008, 12:23:30 AM »

I think you should do GVT on an upper/lower split.  One exercise per muscle group.  Train each muscle group twice a week.  Consider only doing something like 3x8 for the smaller muscle groups like arms and calves.  Your split would look something like this.

Day One Upper
5x5 or 6x6 Incline or Flat Presses
5x5 or 6x6 Row Variation
5x5 or 6x6 Shoulder Press or Pull
3x8 Curl
3x8 Tricep Exercise

Day One Lower
5x5 or 6x6 Some Squat Variation
5x5 or 6x6 SLDL
3x8 Calve Raise

Day Two Upper
5x5 or 6x6 Same as day one for chest
5x5 or 6x6 Chin ups or Pull Ups
5x5 or 6x6 Upright Row or Shrugs
3x8 Curl Variation
3x8 Tricep Exercise

Day Two Lower
5x5 or 6x6  Squat Variation
5x5 or 6x6  Leg Presses
3x8 Calve Raises

Don't worry about ab work.   Try to keep your rest periods brief. Keep your time in the gym to a minimum. 
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« Reply #8 on: January 30, 2008, 03:50:52 AM »

I can't believe you're asking that question after being around here for the last 4 or 5 years ?

you know (or should know) that the fastest way is to start pulling and squattin !



frankley I'm disappointed in you !

He's mostly spamming here.

I;m really even more disappointed that he posts his question HERE, on the training board.

If he had paid some attention, he would know that you can't train for mass or definition or whatever. It's a quesiton of nutrition.
With the best diet, you will grow if you stimulate the muscle, no matter if you do higher reps like in HST or Giant Sets or do a higher load like in HIT or DC.

I did all of them, actually i still do and change the style every 6 months to a year or so. I grew on all of these styles, just do little adjustments inside the style throughout the 6 months.
With all programs, increase the weight constantly and have a week or 2 off every 6-8 weeks.
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« Reply #9 on: January 30, 2008, 09:21:06 AM »

I agree with Geo. And maybe "240 Is Back" should change his handle to "170 and Confused". 

K.I.S.S. needs to be applied here. Do not need 4 training sessions a week or any isolation movements if gaining muscle mass in the shortest period of time is the goal. Two training days a week devoted to the heavier Big Boy exercises can produce minor miracles for most people. Full body workouts.

If doing three training day a week, than have monday for lower body, wednsday for upper body and friday for lower body again. The following monday start with upper body, wednsday lower body and friday upper body again. Alternate every monday . If you can not generate enough intensity with this 3 days a week plan than you are not approaching workouts with serious intent.  Have at least one resting day between any workout. As a general rule, two workout days in a row is never required. That can reduce recovery time for the CNS, the key to progress.

As DonkeyKong suggest, boost the nutrition but not to the point of eating like a pig. You want impressive muscle mass gains, not winding up looking like the Philsberry Dough Boy. If your eating clean now than just add enough good calories beyond the normal maintenance  requirements of a active body. Good Luck.
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« Reply #10 on: January 30, 2008, 09:21:55 AM »

i'd go with lats suggestion. lots of volume might be what youre looking for to put on mass. i wouldnt go to failure on all those sets though.

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Z
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« Reply #11 on: January 30, 2008, 04:23:57 PM »

i'd go with lats suggestion. lots of volume might be what youre looking for to put on mass. i wouldnt go to failure on all those sets though.


not unless your jay cutler and your going to be eating 1000 grams of brown rice and 400 grams of protein every day; and have the money for 12+ hours of sleep every day and deep tissue massages and yoga training...     no way a guy like 240 could possibly train high volume effectively. requires too much calories too much rest and too much testosterone.
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« Reply #12 on: January 30, 2008, 04:35:04 PM »

not unless your jay cutler and your going to be eating 1000 grams of brown rice and 400 grams of protein every day; and have the money for 12+ hours of sleep every day and deep tissue massages and yoga training...     no way a guy like 240 could possibly train high volume effectively. requires too much calories too much rest and too much testosterone.
That depends on his body.  You can't make blanket statements like that.  High volume can be productive in spurts.  Work on power moves for 3 months, high volume for the next three and then repeat.  I've seen guys do this.  As long as the body recovers then you are okay.  Granted 240 has household responsibilities but in that setting he has a lot of time to eat and also sit whereas others might not.  Good to see you down here Rob.
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Squishy face retard
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« Reply #13 on: January 30, 2008, 04:43:44 PM »

I agree with Geo. And maybe "240 Is Back" should change his handle to "170 and Confused". 

K.I.S.S. needs to be applied here. Do not need 4 training sessions a week or any isolation movements if gaining muscle mass in the shortest period of time is the goal. Two training days a week devoted to the heavier Big Boy exercises can produce minor miracles for most people. Full body workouts.

If doing three training day a week, than have monday for lower body, wednsday for upper body and friday for lower body again. The following monday start with upper body, wednsday lower body and friday upper body again. Alternate every monday . If you can not generate enough intensity with this 3 days a week plan than you are not approaching workouts with serious intent.  Have at least one resting day between any workout. As a general rule, two workout days in a row is never required. That can reduce recovery time for the CNS, the key to progress.

As DonkeyKong suggest, boost the nutrition but not to the point of eating like a pig. You want impressive muscle mass gains, not winding up looking like the Philsberry Dough Boy. If your eating clean now than just add enough good calories beyond the normal maintenance  requirements of a active body. Good Luck.
hahahaha, a day of rest between every workout Roll Eyes oh brother, great "advice". Grin
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« Reply #14 on: January 30, 2008, 04:51:37 PM »

hahahaha, a day of rest between every workout Roll Eyes oh brother, great "advice". Grin

What do you suggest instead?
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« Reply #15 on: January 30, 2008, 05:07:12 PM »

What do you suggest instead?
well shit you at least have to train right?  taking a day off after every workout you hardly ever train. Roll Eyes
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The Master
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« Reply #16 on: January 30, 2008, 05:32:43 PM »

well shit you at least have to train right?  taking a day off after every workout you hardly ever train. Roll Eyes

Training every other day means 4 workouts one week an 3 workouts the next week. That can be sufficient, given that the split is done correctly, or if the person does HST (which trains the whole body 3x per week).
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« Reply #17 on: January 30, 2008, 05:43:41 PM »

You should check out DC training, I haven't personally run it yet (going to in a few months) but I've seen a lot of guys really blow up on it.

DC or rest/pause.. rest pause gave me insane strength that carried over well to powerlifting..was VERY motivating.. and I grew like a fucking weed on it.
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The Squadfather
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« Reply #18 on: January 30, 2008, 06:02:02 PM »

Training every other day means 4 workouts one week an 3 workouts the next week. That can be sufficient, given that the split is done correctly, or if the person does HST (which trains the whole body 3x per week).
Roll Eyes laziness, you get out of anything what you put in.
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Bluto
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« Reply #19 on: January 30, 2008, 06:06:17 PM »

didnt mentzer advice once every 2 weeks to some clients  Cheesy

bottom line you gotta find out what works for you
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« Reply #20 on: January 30, 2008, 09:31:48 PM »

squat and eat, then squat and eat some more.....
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The Master
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« Reply #21 on: January 31, 2008, 06:09:21 AM »

Roll Eyes laziness, you get out of anything what you put in.

Wow, that was a great argument Roll Eyes
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natural al
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« Reply #22 on: January 31, 2008, 07:26:35 AM »

being natural and doing tons of volume more than 4 times a week=mistake.

I think 240 said he has 4 days a week to train..ok, do max-ot, just condense it a little.  DC could work but it's a different mind set than 99% of people are used to.
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nasser=piece of shit
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« Reply #23 on: January 31, 2008, 07:32:49 AM »

being natural and doing tons of volume more than 4 times a week=mistake.

I think 240 said he has 4 days a week to train..ok, do max-ot, just condense it a little.  DC could work but it's a different mind set than 99% of people are used to.

Why would you say that?

I have had good results with high volume and 5 WO per week.
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natural al
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« Reply #24 on: January 31, 2008, 07:40:43 AM »

Why would you say that?

I have had good results with high volume and 5 WO per week.

just my opinion.  I THINK there are certain ways that a natty should train vs. traditional volume training.  I see tons of guys who are in the gym everyday doing endless sets and reps and they go nowhere.  I think 90% of these guys would do better if they cut out the bullshit movements that don't do anything and got down to brass tax so to speak.  grab some heavy ass weight and pound the shit out of a movement, once you start doing that I think it's a good idea to cut down the volume. 

if it works for you great, I was speaking in a general sense.
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