Chiropractic Dangers

[Moosejay]

It seems the Chiro I go to regularly right now, makes sense he has me doing excersise at home, Cerv traction, head weights, forming thingys you lay on, wooble chair.  My xrays showed not much curve in neck, thoratic cob (bend in spine).  So I have been being adjusted 3 times a week for the first 3 months then on to maintenece. The neck adjustments took some getting used to thats for sure.

I was always sceptical of chiros but now think they have lots to offer, they teach the whole lifestyle approach which makes sense also.  This helped convince me they can help, when i did the wobble chair thing I noticed it would cause a pain in my left testicle when I moved to one side.  After a while thinking not much of it told the DC and he said thats a pinched nerve.  He adjusteted me on my side where they push bent legs down and after that the pain in the nuts was gone.  It has come back a bit to a lesser degree now and then but much less than before and very infrequently now, it suprised me how well it worked.

Anyhow It seems they push that being adjusted is a lifelong thing, yeah it keeps the money coming in for them.  But it makes sense to me especially if training heavy and stressing my spine pretty hard.  Does 2 times a month sound about right for maintence?  Im sure it varys with the individual.  My insurance covers 40 visits a year so that should have me covered.

Yes...sounds like you have a good DC and as long as you keep pounding the iron, you may need continued care. Good luck!

[timfogarty]

I've never been to a chiropractor and don't think I could get over my skepticism to do so.    While I own the domain name fogarty.org, the domain fogarty.com use to be a chiropractic organization of some sort.  They've since abandoned the site, so when mail bounces, senders say 'oh it must be .org'.   So I get tons of chiro spam and inquires.

[brent2741]

Moosejay;

135Kpatients/18 years = 7,500/year= /50weeks= 150week=/5days=30 patients per day=/8hours=3.75 patients per hour-everyday, 50 weeks per year for 18 years.......Me thinks MJ exaggerating.

my chiro will see anywhere from 85-125 patients in a day, so me thinks you're an idiot!!

[timfogarty]

my chiro will see anywhere from 85-125 patients in a day, so me thinks you're an idiot!!

wow, assembly line...um...medicine at it's best.

[onlyme]

How many patients does Franco have?

Franco used to practice on us in the gym for free while he was studying.  It was great

[dr.chimps]

wow, assembly line...um...medicine at it's best.

Well, that is the nature of conventional medicine, these days, too. 

[onlyme]

How come none of the chiroprators answered my questions about prolotherapy

[shiftedShapes]

Put it this way:

Everyone has something to offer in helping patients. He's wasting his time with the negativity.

If it was the case that Chiroprators are hurting patients, and he demonstrates that with research such that fewer people go to chriopractors and get injured then he would be helping patients right? 

[Moosejay]

How come none of the chiroprators answered my questions about prolotherapy

Because I am just logging on.

One of the pioneers of Prolotherapy, Lloyd Saberski, M.D., of Yale Pain Management, uses these sugar injections for maladies such as lateral epicondylitia with great success. Problem is, insurance does not pay as the 'reasearch' is not there.

[Moosejay]

If it was the case that Chiroprators are hurting patients, and he demonstrates that with research such that fewer people go to chriopractors and get injured then he would be helping patients right? 

Just as much as alerting people to anyone who was doing harm in any type of profession.

[Moosejay]

wow, assembly line...um...medicine at it's best.

Yes, and you are very credible.

[Moosejay]

MDs are above chiros, you guys seem so defensive, like you have to prove something. All they ask is for proof, science will reveal the truth.

Umm, other way around. I make more than the average MD...and if you think its not ALL about money...think again

for the record, chiros are great, osteopaths better imo. Certainly not quackery, but all the energetic shit etc.. that some do is ridiculous

[Moosejay]

Not sure if this was asked.  I had prolotherapy done on my wrist.  It hurt so bad during treatment but the end result was awesome and above what I suspected.  My good friend also had it done on his shoulder when every other form of treatment did nothing, prolotherapy works wonders.  Why is it that only chiropractors did this therapy and why was it illegal and so many chiropractors lost their license for doing it.  Why didn't MD's use this therapy.

Probably because it works

[ether]

Just over 5 years in medical practice.

15 with medical school, residency and fellowship.

Have seen 5 vertebral artery dissections from chiropractic manipulation.

Something to think about.

I don't have any concrete numbers as to the actual incidence, but, I am sure it is much higher than the
one in several "millions" quoted by chiros.

[Moosejay]

Just over 5 years in medical practice.

15 with medical school, residency and fellowship.

Have seen 5 vertebral artery dissections from chiropractic manipulation.

Something to think about.

I don't have any concrete numbers as to the actual incidence, but, I am sure it is much higher than the
one in several "millions" quoted by chiros.

Far, far outweighed by all the folks you guys fuck up with surgery and meds.

[Luv2Hurt]

Yes...sounds like you have a good DC and as long as you keep pounding the iron, you may need continued care. Good luck!

Thank you for the response doc and sorry about the tiff we had before. 

[Brutal_1]

Far, far outweighed by all the folks you guys fuck up with surgery and meds.

BOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO OOM!!!!!!!!!!

[WhiteCastle]

Moosejay;

135Kpatients/18 years = 7,500/year= /50weeks= 150week=/5days=30 patients per day=/8hours=3.75 patients per hour-everyday, 50 weeks per year for 18 years.......Me thinks MJ exaggerating.

owned

[bodybuildermdpitt]

Far, far outweighed by all the folks you guys fuck up with surgery and meds.

Going over my posts, I think i may have been a bit too harsh on your profession. I think conservative therapy is quite effective for ACUTE problems. However, chronic manipulations is plain "quackery." I would also like to admit that yes MDs make may mistakes. However, it is just stupidity to state that MDs make much more mistakes than chiropracters. You can look at the NFL, NBA, NHL, and all competitive NCAA programs. All of their sport medicine doctors are real doctors (usuallly orthopods), not one chiropracter. Although chiropracters work with these teams, they work UNDER the guidance of MDs. The problem with chiropracters is that you guys manipulate and mislead the general public. Your profession is not based on science, as defined by evidence based medicine. There is nothing wrong with SOME techniques of your profession, but the MAJORITY of your profession is just plain BULLSHIT. You know it and I know it. You can peddle your bullshit as much as you want, but at the end of the day you have to ask yourself if making money of other people's misery is worth the money. Money will come and go but your legacy of bullshit will smell forever. The only purpose of this thread to make aware to the general public that may be mislead by your crap. Clearly your defensive posts by you and your colleagues reiterates your insecurity and guilt of your profession. To others, do you really want to place your Central Nervous System on an individual that believes scientific research is "jazz."


cheers,

bodybuildermdpitt

[bodybuildermdpitt]

Yes...sounds like you have a good DC and as long as you keep pounding the iron, you may need continued care. Good luck!

Absolutely BULLSHIT. Wow, can you smell the bullshit as it comes out of your mouth.

[Brutal_1]

Absolutely BULLSHIT. Wow, can you smell the bullshit as it comes out of your mouth.

seriously though, could you share why it is you feel this way about chiropractors?  Was there a specific incident or did you lose a ff to a chiropractor, what?

[Necrosis]

seriously though, could you share why it is you feel this way about chiropractors?  Was there a specific incident or did you lose a ff to a chiropractor, what?

chiropractic medicine is not evidence based for the most part but medicine in inherently intuitive, look at psychiatry. Polypharmacy and shotgun approachs are examples of partly intuitive practices, it is my problem when medicine is based on mostly intuitive practice and has to much individuality to allow for varied care. I have seen total body modification, vials of substances placed on the body, other retarded practices done by chiros on me. Claiming to cure allergies etc... all bullshit.

you can treat with spinal manipulations, but diseases of organ systems etc you cannot, how can you call yourself a doctor if you cannot treat multiiple aliments and offer some assitance for a wide variance of disease?

[bodybuildermdpitt]

seriously though, could you share why it is you feel this way about chiropractors?  Was there a specific incident or did you lose a ff to a chiropractor, what?

After 4 years of undergrad, 4 of medical school, 10 (yes 10 years) years of residency, I became a doctor. I am a GI surgeon and you would not believe how many patients ask me solutions about the problems caused by you guys. STROKES, yes STROKES, caused by you guys is the new epidemic. Nothing irritates me more than planned and manipulative idiocy, perpetuated by your profession. Like the "electromagnetic" bullshit of the early 20th century, your bullshit is next. Do yourself a favor, take the MCATs and become a real doctor.

[Necrosis]

After 4 years of undergrad, 4 of medical school, 10 (yes 10 years) years of residency, I became a doctor. I am a GI surgeon and you would not believe how many patients ask me solutions about the problems caused by you guys. STROKES, yes STROKES, caused by you guys is the new epidemic. Nothing irritates me more than planned and manipulative idiocy, perpetuated by your profession. Like the "electromagnetic" bullshit of the early 20th century, your bullshit is next. Do yourself a favor, take the MCATs and become a real doctor.

md's who do not embrace CAM to some degree will be left behind imo. Healthcare without prevention, nutrition, supplementation, stress control, counselling etc and just remedial measures is sorely lacking, hence people looking for alternatives. Alot of drugs suck.

[Luv2Hurt]

Absolutely BULLSHIT. Wow, can you smell the bullshit as it comes out of your mouth.

Really you are being pretty harsh on this subject.  I think he is right that someone would need continued care when they are always pushing the body.  I was always sceptical of chiros before,  But the things they seek to do makes logical sense to me.

With MDs it is either drugs or surgery for the treatment, really they are just buying time and amusing thier patients with drugs till the body heals itself in most cases.  Some of the surgical procedures are done very prematurely without trying alternatives, once they fuse your spine there is no going back.  From what I understand the goal of chiro is to get your body working 100% by itself by opening up the entire CNS and having it working with out any bottlenecks.