Author Topic: Police Union condemns Obama over "stupid" comments. (Read 19526 times)

Cap · « **Reply #275 on:** July 30, 2009, 09:24:08 AM »

Based on what I have seen, the tazers are a replacement for fighting and batons. Sure there are the rare cases when you have people who are high and combative but most often you have non-compliant suspects and the tazer makes them comply.

Hugo Chavez · « **Reply #276 on:** July 30, 2009, 09:28:26 AM »

Quote from: Cap on July 30, 2009, 09:24:08 AM

Based on what I have seen, the tazers are a replacement for fighting and batons. Sure there are the rare cases when you have people who are high and combative but most often you have non-compliant suspects and the tazer makes them comply.

so what you're saying is they were full of fucking shit when they assured the public these would only be used as a replacement for deadly force. Thanks for the confirmation of the obvious.

Cap · « **Reply #277 on:** July 30, 2009, 09:36:13 AM »

Quote from: Hugo Chavez on July 30, 2009, 09:28:26 AM

so what you're saying is they were full of fucking shit when they assured the public these would only be used as a replacement for deadly force. Thanks for the confirmation of the obvious.

I think it was the easiest way for departments to avoid lawsuits for suspects being hit with night sticks or having officers get injured subduing suspects. It's also an easy way to take down combative people. No matter how big or strong you are, you are going down.

240 is Back · « **Reply #278 on:** July 30, 2009, 09:40:04 AM »

Quote from: 333386 on July 30, 2009, 07:46:26 AM

The cops' collegues disagree.

no surprise there.

seriously tho, they're both pricks in this situation. either could have diffused everything with a cool head.

Hugo Chavez · « **Reply #279 on:** July 30, 2009, 09:40:33 AM »

Quote from: Cap on July 30, 2009, 09:36:13 AM

I think it was the easiest way for departments to avoid lawsuits for suspects being hit with night sticks or having officers get injured subduing suspects. It's also an easy way to take down combative people. No matter how big or strong you are, you are going down.

how is this a reply to what the points/facts I stated?

tonymctones · « **Reply #280 on:** July 30, 2009, 09:43:15 AM »

Quote from: tonymctones on July 30, 2009, 08:12:56 AM

hahahahah hugo hows the new kid brosky?

ok so they advertised the tazers as a way of not using their guns which it certainly is they didnt lie, you just misinterpreted...they didnt say it would totally replace the guns they said it would take the place of guns in some situations. It would be totally ignorant to think that tazers where there to replace guns...

theres your response hugo

Cap · « **Reply #281 on:** July 30, 2009, 09:45:37 AM »

Quote from: Hugo Chavez on July 30, 2009, 09:40:33 AM

how is this a reply to what the points/facts I stated?

Are you mad I didn't agree with you? You didn't state fact, just an angry opinion. If you stop people before things escalate, you rarely have to use deadly force. Hope that helps.

Hugo Chavez · « **Reply #282 on:** July 30, 2009, 10:06:14 AM »

Quote from: tonymctones on July 30, 2009, 09:43:15 AM

theres your response hugo

that's not what I said. That's not what they said. That's not what they're doing. I'm sure you've seen all the videos of people being tazed when they would not have been shot. There are videos of people getting tazed for hardly anything. Not like they would have just pulled out a gun and shot them in the face. I didn't say it was a replacement, I said they justified tazers saying they would only be used in instances that they would have otherwise used a gun, thus saving lives. That as stated turns out to be a complete lie. That's a fact tony.

Hugo Chavez · « **Reply #283 on:** July 30, 2009, 10:08:51 AM »

Quote from: Cap on July 30, 2009, 09:45:37 AM

Are you mad I didn't agree with you? You didn't state fact, just an angry opinion. If you stop people before things escalate, you rarely have to use deadly force. Hope that helps.

A. I'm not mad. B. yes it's a fact that they justified the intoduction of tazer by telling the public they would be used as an alternative to lethal force. Hope that helps you, just pointing out their lies and they did obviously lie, unless you have not seen the jillion wth tazer vids...

tonymctones · « **Reply #284 on:** July 30, 2009, 12:48:57 PM »

Quote from: Hugo Chavez on July 30, 2009, 10:06:14 AM

that's not what I said. That's not what they said. That's not what they're doing. I'm sure you've seen all the videos of people being tazed when they would not have been shot. There are videos of people getting tazed for hardly anything. Not like they would have just pulled out a gun and shot them in the face. I didn't say it was a replacement, I said they justified tazers saying they would only be used in instances that they would have otherwise used a gun, thus saving lives. That as stated turns out to be a complete lie. That's a fact tony.

well i first of all never saw or heard them use that phrase when advocating the use of tazers so if you could give me an instance id be more apt to accept that. I have certainly seen instances where it wasnt a life or death situation but as cap has pointed out in most cases it is probably better then breaking out a baton and possibly breaking limbs in the process.

splinterhands · « **Reply #285 on:** July 31, 2009, 12:52:02 PM »

Quote from: Hugo Chavez on July 30, 2009, 10:06:14 AM

that's not what I said. That's not what they said. That's not what they're doing. I'm sure you've seen all the videos of people being tazed when they would not have been shot. There are videos of people getting tazed for hardly anything. Not like they would have just pulled out a gun and shot them in the face. I didn't say it was a replacement, I said they justified tazers saying they would only be used in instances that they would have otherwise used a gun, thus saving lives. That as stated turns out to be a complete lie. That's a fact tony.

IF they were advertised that way it was a lie. A taser is not an alternative to deadly force. Deadlier force is the answer to deadly force.

We don't carry tasers but our use of force is
1) verbal commands
2) hands on control
3) OC spray
4)ASP baton- these aren't the wood clubs, these are metal and designed to seriously hurt, break bones, split muscles, ect. This is the same level as the tasers. I would take getting tasered any day over the ASP.
5) deadly force

I would never say that a taser couldn't be misused because I'm sure they are occasionally. Even as a cop, I sometimes see video's that seems to be excessive force by using them. Just don't be so quick to judge because normally all you see is the final few seconds before the taser is used. You don't see the entire encounter that led to the incident.

ToxicAvenger · « **Reply #286 on:** July 31, 2009, 04:17:44 PM »

Quote from: BerzerkFury on July 26, 2009, 09:20:55 PM

ToxicAvenger is an alcoholic, steroid abusing, drug addict who has spent the last decade in and out of rehab.

BitchFury is an all star lacrosse player at a prestegious univ who got outed on getbig a few yrs back and had several getbig members call his mommy at home...

the result...the wittle bitch disappeared off of getbig...and ws the subject of the most massive owning in getbig history...

BitchFury has also been in timeout several times as a result of me shooting 1 pm to Ron...he has been warned over n over again by Ron personally but i guess heehaw hasn't learned his lesson

ToxicAvenger · « **Reply #287 on:** July 31, 2009, 04:19:59 PM »

Quote from: splinterhands on July 26, 2009, 09:16:07 PM

I'm a cop with two degree's, own my own cabinet shop, and the only time I ever got my ass beat was in a boxing ring. I could care less about legalizing drugs, my job is enforcing laws and not creating them. 99% of the problems are caused by users of drugs, not caused by cops "busting" people for using them. Almost all of the interactions I have with the public are positive. If you're a criminal, the interactions aren't going to be so positive though.

As far as writing tickets, that is a very small part of law enforcement. That's just the most visable part to the public. Most is dealing with neighbors that can't get along, checking suspicious persons, taking larceny reports, investigating accidents and so on.

BTW..if you're a criminal, the cops are out to get you. If not, you're a paranoid SOB.

2 whole degrees and you still chose to earn menial wage eh...

loser

legalize drugs...and you r out of a job

PS alcohol = ethanol is also a drug

ToxicAvenger · « **Reply #288 on:** July 31, 2009, 04:24:25 PM »

Quote

tsk, tsk, ...c'mon Toxie, you know cops do more than that.
Granted alot of cops have "issues", ...especially when it comes to relating to civilians, but that's just the nature of the beast. You try doing what they do, and see if you don't experience a few issues of your own. It's no picnic.

WHY would i try to do what they do and get paid shit for it judi?

Quote

It's not easy being a cop. Nobody is perfect, ...least of all them. They make mistakes. It happens.
Then you have the complete and total jerks who have no business wearing the uniform. You got all kinds.
You can't however be under the impression that society is better off without them, ...just the dick head cops.

takes a certain personality type to wanna wear a badge while getting shit on constantly...
and making close to what someone at a fast food place makes
ie ..serious self esteem problems...which BY DEFINITION = guy...

sorry..i DO know some cool cops...but they r the exception to the rule...WHY do you think the FBI takes over when ever there is a SERIOUS problem...

COPS = social trashmen

splinterhands · « **Reply #289 on:** July 31, 2009, 04:42:32 PM »

Quote from: ToxicAvenger on July 31, 2009, 04:19:59 PM

2 whole degrees and you still chose to earn menial wage eh...

loser

legalize drugs...and you r out of a job

PS alcohol = ethanol is also a drug

I do it because I love it. You do drugs because you love it, I do something to help society because I love it. Who's the fucking loser, dipshit?

I'm not wealthy by any means but I do ok.

Legalize drugs...and you're still a druggie.

ToxicAvenger · « **Reply #290 on:** July 31, 2009, 04:50:51 PM »

Quote

I do it because I love it

.
so says the trashman also

Quote

You do drugs because you love it, I do something to help society because I love it. Who's the fucking loser, dipshit?

typical low IQ dipshit cop mentality...jumping to conclusions...i never said i do drugs

you just proved my point that cops for the most part would be better used as dog food

24KT · « **Reply #291 on:** July 31, 2009, 04:53:04 PM »

Quote from: splinterhands on July 31, 2009, 12:52:02 PM

IF they were advertised that way it was a lie. A taser is not an alternative to deadly force. Deadlier force is the answer to deadly force.

We don't carry tasers but our use of force is
1) verbal commands
2) hands on control
3) OC spray
4)ASP baton- these aren't the wood clubs, these are metal and designed to seriously hurt, break bones, split muscles, ect. This is the same level as the tasers. I would take getting tasered any day over the ASP.
5) deadly force

I would never say that a taser couldn't be misused because I'm sure they are occasionally. Even as a cop, I sometimes see video's that seems to be excessive force by using them. Just don't be so quick to judge because normally all you see is the final few seconds before the taser is used. You don't see the entire encounter that led to the incident.

In this case you do:

24KT · « **Reply #292 on:** July 31, 2009, 05:01:18 PM »

Quote from: splinterhands on July 26, 2009, 09:16:07 PM

BTW..if you're a criminal, the cops are out to get you. If not, you're a paranoid SOB.

...or an innocent man who a cop unfortunately believes to be a criminal.
Once it's established you are not a criminal, ...the "I'm gonna nail this guy" mentality needs to be switched off.

24KT · « **Reply #293 on:** July 31, 2009, 05:13:37 PM »

Quote from: ToxicAvenger on July 31, 2009, 04:24:25 PM

WHY would i try to do what they do and get paid shit for it judi?

takes a certain personality type to wanna wear a badge while getting shit on constantly...
and making close to what someone at a fast food place makes
ie ..serious self esteem problems...which BY DEFINITION = ####...

I don't disagree that there is a particular personality issue that appears to be common in police officers.
Whether that be what motivates them to join the force, ...or whether it is the result of being on the force is yet to be determined. However, despite their "issues" for want of a better word, ...it doesn't negate the fact that theirs is not an easy profession, and they do indeed perform a very valueable service to society. If you're unable to see that, then perhaps you should walk a mile in their shoes, ...just so you can develop an appreciation for what it is they do, and the strength of character it takes to engage in that profession, and come away unscathed.

Quote

sorry..i DO know some cool cops...but they r the exception to the rule...WHY do you think the FBI takes over when ever there is a SERIOUS problem...

COPS = social trashmen

Social trashmen? Good Grief! Well Toxie, as someone who has been witnessing a month long strike by municipality of Toronto outside workers, ...I can assure you that both the Toronto City Council, as well as the residents of Toronto have developed a new found appreciation for their trashmen. {lol} 30 days without garbage pickup has been a nightmare. It's a good thing this have been a relatively cool summer. The stink has become horrendous, ...but the rats, and the raccoons are having a party... A PARTY!!!!

doison · « **Reply #294 on:** July 31, 2009, 06:35:24 PM »

Cop was in a lose-lose situation.

What if someone WAS breaking into his house and Gates come home right after that, and the burglar held him or his family hostage in some way. The burglar tells Gates to "tell the cop it's your house and everything is fine or I'll fucking shoot you." So Gates tells the cop "Everything is fine."

The cop leaves it at that and Gates is later found dead with a bullet to the head.

The next day the news is covered with "Racist cop leaves black Harvard professor Henry Louis Gates's home while Gates was being held hostage by an intruder. The police were called to the scene when a neighbor reported the break in, but the cop made no attempt to investigate the situation and left Gates to die."

Everyone would be on here saying "If that was a white guy's house, you KNOW the cop would have asked the guy to come outside where he could speak to him in private, make sure the calls about a break-in were false and there wasn't an intruder holding his family hostage inside!"

"Because Gates was black, the cop didn't even care enough to check out the situation, just turned right around and left Gates there with the gunman."

"If that was a white guy, the cop would have searched the house inside and out to make sure there was no intruder and had Gates step outside of his home where he could be safe from the clutches of the gunman. Instead, the cop just left him to die!"

headhuntersix · « **Reply #295 on:** July 31, 2009, 06:41:58 PM »

Well bud thats common sense on a level the insulated idiots on here never think about.

24KT · « **Reply #296 on:** July 31, 2009, 06:51:09 PM »

Quote from: doison on July 31, 2009, 06:35:24 PM

Cop was in a lose-lose situation.

What if someone WAS breaking into his house and Gates come home right after that, and the burglar held him or his family hostage in some way. The burglar tells Gates to "tell the cop it's your house and everything is fine or I'll fucking shoot you." So Gates tells the cop "Everything is fine."

The cop leaves it at that and Gates is later found dead with a bullet to the head.

The next day the news is covered with "Racist cop leaves black Harvard professor Henry Louis Gates's home while Gates was being held hostage by an intruder. The police were called to the scene when a neighbor reported the break in, but the cop made no attempt to investigate the situation and left Gates to die."

Everyone would be on here saying "If that was a white guy's house, you KNOW the cop would have asked the guy to come outside where he could speak to him in private, make sure the calls about a break-in were false and there wasn't an intruder holding his family hostage inside!"

"Because Gates was black, the cop didn't even care enough to check out the situation, just turned right around and left Gates there with the gunman."

"If that was a white guy, the cop would have searched the house inside and out to make sure there was no intruder and had Gates step outside of his home where he could be safe from the clutches of the gunman. Instead, the cop just left him to die!"

No, I did take that into consideration, however we see from Crowley's own report, he stated he requested Gates step outside due to accoustics, not to secure the premises and determine there were no burglars present. Furthermore, what are we to make of his comment that he was told that 2 black men had broken into the residence when it appears so abundantly evident he was not. From where did he get the 2 black men he wrote of in the report he filed? This needs to be answered.

240 is Back · « **Reply #297 on:** July 31, 2009, 06:56:43 PM »

Quote from: doison on July 31, 2009, 06:35:24 PM

Cop was in a lose-lose situation.

What if someone WAS breaking into his house and Gates come home right after that, and the burglar held him or his family hostage in some way. The burglar tells Gates to "tell the cop it's your house and everything is fine or I'll fucking shoot you." So Gates tells the cop "Everything is fine."

The cop leaves it at that and Gates is later found dead with a bullet to the head.

The next day the news is covered with "Racist cop leaves black Harvard professor Henry Louis Gates's home while Gates was being held hostage by an intruder. The police were called to the scene when a neighbor reported the break in, but the cop made no attempt to investigate the situation and left Gates to die."

Everyone would be on here saying "If that was a white guy's house, you KNOW the cop would have asked the guy to come outside where he could speak to him in private, make sure the calls about a break-in were false and there wasn't an intruder holding his family hostage inside!"

"Because Gates was black, the cop didn't even care enough to check out the situation, just turned right around and left Gates there with the gunman."

"If that was a white guy, the cop would have searched the house inside and out to make sure there was no intruder and had Gates step outside of his home where he could be safe from the clutches of the gunman. Instead, the cop just left him to die!"

great point...

he did lie in the report tho, it looks like

doison · « **Reply #298 on:** July 31, 2009, 06:58:15 PM »

Quote from: headhuntersix on July 31, 2009, 06:41:58 PM

Well bud thats common sense on a level the insulated idiots on here never think about.

I'm definitely not biased against Obama in this. I voted for Obama, mostly because I could not vote for a ticket with Sarah Palin. I'm not a Billy Mimnaugh, Obama bashing, misspelling fiasco of blinded hate. But this whole situation is ridiculous.
The cop was called to the house because people called 911 and said someone is breaking into the house. If that was my house, when the cop came to the door I'd step outside with him, present my id, THANK HIM for coming so quickly to make sure his home was safe and do whatever he needed me to do to verify that I was in my own home and there was no break in or intruder in the home.

Who the hell yell's "I'll speak with your mama outside?" That's just plain asinine and goading the cop to arrest him.

What if Gates was told to yell "I'll speak with your mama outside!" by the intruder holding a gun to his head.

Again, if the cop left the scene, we'd all be here bickering about the racist cop that "left Gates to die in his own home after being CALLED TO THE SCENE because of a break in. Gates was obviously acting out of character with that statement and the cop should have known something was up!"

"Gates is a Harvard professor! He would never yell 'I'll speak with your mama' unless provoked for some reason. It was obviously a cry for help. If the cop would have just had Gates step outside, Gates would have been able to tell the cop that a gunman was inside the house. But because Gates was black, the cop just turned his back on Gates and left him to die!"

OzmO · « **Reply #299 on:** July 31, 2009, 07:07:22 PM »

Quote from: doison on July 31, 2009, 06:35:24 PM

Cop was in a lose-lose situation.

What if someone WAS breaking into his house and Gates come home right after that, and the burglar held him or his family hostage in some way. The burglar tells Gates to "tell the cop it's your house and everything is fine or I'll fucking shoot you." So Gates tells the cop "Everything is fine."

The cop leaves it at that and Gates is later found dead with a bullet to the head.

The next day the news is covered with "Racist cop leaves black Harvard professor Henry Louis Gates's home while Gates was being held hostage by an intruder. The police were called to the scene when a neighbor reported the break in, but the cop made no attempt to investigate the situation and left Gates to die."

Everyone would be on here saying "If that was a white guy's house, you KNOW the cop would have asked the guy to come outside where he could speak to him in private, make sure the calls about a break-in were false and there wasn't an intruder holding his family hostage inside!"

"Because Gates was black, the cop didn't even care enough to check out the situation, just turned right around and left Gates there with the gunman."

"If that was a white guy, the cop would have searched the house inside and out to make sure there was no intruder and had Gates step outside of his home where he could be safe from the clutches of the gunman. Instead, the cop just left him to die!"

The cops were not at fault for asking for the ID or approaching the situation the way they did because of the type of call they were responding to. They were also with in their protocol to arrest Gates. The thing is, once it was established it was Gates house they should have just dropped it and walked away. Arresting him only fed into Gate's BS.