Ronald Reagan Speaks Out Against Socialized Medicine

[Stavios]

you are a hard working man Joe, I respect you for that 

[Lion666]

Ever go to the VA...it's not terrific care...that's what you get with socialized medicine. 

usmc friend back from the dessert had appendix surgery same day as mine,,, he went to va, i went to community hosp,
(be it i'm friends with both the board chairman and the biggest $ giver, both happend to show up and talk to the dr that performed the surgery but still)
we both had the cut, not laparoscopy,

he got a 6-8 inch frankenstein scar, which he still owns.
i had a half inch line and without applying any "scar" creams or stuff of the likes to make it go away, it can barely be seen to where i can't find it anymore

just a story for what it's worth.

[The Luke]

Joe/JME,


Just a quick question, as I would appreciate the insight into your point of view:

What would you do if (not wishing you ill) you, or one of your kids, were to suffer a catastrophic illness: heart attack, cancer, liver or kidney failure... and you ended up being one of those unfortunate 15-17% of INSURED Americans who are simply denied coverage in such a catastrophic instance?

I know you'd like to think you could fix such a situation on you own, (an admirable if somewhat misguided macho notion) but do you really feel you and your family should go bankrupt; lose your house; end up homeless... if say, you had a car accident and the insurace company decided simply not to pay and lumber you with a couple of million dollars worth of medical bills...?

Seriously, do you consider corporate profiteering more important than your self and your family?

Serious question.


The Luke

[Voice of Doom]

Jesus hates socialized medicine...he believes that it takes manna from the rightfully ordained elites to care for the lepers in the street.

Jesus hates lepers...

he also hates fags...so you fags just deal with it!

[peruke]

Who's this Ronald Regan that everyone keeps talking about?

One of the dead Presidents

[peruke]

Jesus hates socialized medicine...he believes that it takes manna from the rightfully ordained elites to care for the lepers in the street.

Jesus hates lepers...

he also hates fags...so you fags just deal with it!

Jesus called, and he said, STFU!

[tweeter]

BINGO!

Stavios, I started with NOTHING, I did not come from a wealthy family, I didn't take any bank loans, no help from friends or family and didn't even dream of using the government for help. I make a good living (like thousands in this country) because I worked my ass off for it. Yes, most able bodied people who use the government for support are LAZY!

Yeah, but what about people who can't get health insurance due to pre-existing conditions? That has nothing to do with being lazy.

[buffdnet]

there's risk involved in trying to achieve whatever your dreams are.
one of those risks is your health and it's associated costs.
how the hell anyone expects the usa to remain a free country
when so many refuse to accept any risk when things get tough.
going broke, bankrupt etc is part of the risks. it's the terms you
must accept to live and persue your dreams in this country.
otherwise take your dumb fucking wetback asses back to where ya came from
and enjoy your socialized healthcare.

btw for those that don't know, the va is not free if you make over 985 a month.
after then you are charged co pays and then more based on your income.
not too many freeloaders in the va unlike the rest of our healthcare system.

[buffdnet]

but what about people who can't get health insurance due to pre-existing conditions? That has nothing to do with being lazy.

see my post above. there are risks in life and no one has the
right to expect or demand an insurance company to write bad policies that
will only loose money. obama seems to think so but he wants to socialize
the entire country and everything in it and can't create a single worthwhile job

[tbombz]

heres the reason why we should be legally required to have AT LEAST full government coverage for all medical costs for those who either cant get coverage ( pre existing conditions) or cant afford coverage.....

the government does not have the right to tell a business that they MUST accept customers with health problems who want to buy health insurance... in essence, that would be the government forcing a business to make a bad deal.. that is unconstitutonal, you cannot force someone to lose money.. thats theft at gunpoint....   so the Obama proposal that would block health insurance companies from denying coverage to those with pre existing conditions is inapplicable as it stands in opposition to the basic principles of the constitution.

because of the fact that the gov. can not force companies to accept people with pre existing conditions, the government is required to make sure that the people with pre existing treatments right to LIFE is not impeached upon by sudden preventable illness....

[Immortal_Technique]

US blows, thank goodness I live in the UK, in this argument anyway.

[buffdnet]

government is required to make sure that the people with pre existing treatments right to LIFE is not impeached upon by sudden preventable illness.

and they do. it's called the emergency room or free clinic. there are also
advocates for anything but the common cold that will help
defray or cover costs.
your still a dumb fucking felon

[Mars]

reagan is dead

[Immortal_Technique]

and they do. it's called the emergency room or free clinic. there are also
advocates for anything but the common cold that will help
defray or cover costs.
your still a dumb fucking felon

It's "you're".

[buffdnet]

at my age you don't give a crap if it's your a dumbass
or you're a dumbass.
why?
because you are indeed a dumbass for pointing this out either way

[Immortal_Technique]

If you're going to call people stupid on the internet it's best not to write like you're stupid.

[Mars]

[Coach is Back!]

Joe/JME,


Just a quick question, as I would appreciate the insight into your point of view:

What would you do if (not wishing you ill) you, or one of your kids, were to suffer a catastrophic illness: heart attack, cancer, liver or kidney failure... and you ended up being one of those unfortunate 15-17% of INSURED Americans who are simply denied coverage in such a catastrophic instance?

I know you'd like to think you could fix such a situation on you own, (an admirable if somewhat misguided macho notion) but do you really feel you and your family should go bankrupt; lose your house; end up homeless... if say, you had a car accident and the insurace company decided simply not to pay and lumber you with a couple of million dollars worth of medical bills...?

Seriously, do you consider corporate profiteering more important than your self and your family?

Serious question.


The Luke

I'm going to have assume without looking at any stats that the out of those 15-17% were turned downed for other reasons besides just for the sake of being turned down for no reason. I know our health care systems has to be revamped in some ways, what system this big doesn't?

Now getting back to the question, I'd rather be in debt for the rest of my life knowing they got the best possible care the medical community can provide than to lose my wife or son as opposed to being denied lets say certain medications because the government does not see fit to pay for it because that particular medication is too expensive. Or lets someone in my family or I does get cancer and it's caught in the early stages but we can't get another appointment for another 3 or 6 months and by then it might be too late, what happens then?

I am all for keeping the health care private and having doctors doing for their patients what they feel necessary to treat patients not what the government whats them to do. My first wifes father died in a VA hospital from diabetes, later after he passed she did some investigating and found that the VA was negligent but by then it was too late, he lost both legs and half an arm from amputation. Why? well one of the reasons was it took them forever to get an appointment and again....like my scenario above, it was too late. 

[tbombz]

and they do. it's called the emergency room or free clinic. there are also
advocates for anything but the common cold that will help
defray or cover costs.
your still a dumb fucking felon

so you oppose universal healthcare but your ok with free clinics? you realise they are basically the same thing.

i brought it up to point out the legal principle that would require the gov to provide healthcare

[timfogarty]

and they do. it's called the emergency room or free clinic. there are also
advocates for anything but the common cold that will help defray or cover costs.

if you believe that because of the ER no one goes without health care in this country (which is not true, but anyway...) then the argument becomes is this the most economical way to provide health care.  your insurance premiums are higher because of the uninsured going to the ER.

[Coach is Back!]

Tim, if hospitals are in the US are refusing health care it's nothing short of illegal. Not saying it doesn't happen but if caught it's serious trouble.

[The Luke]

Tim, if hospitals are in the US are refusing health care it's nothing short of illegal. Not saying it doesn't happen but if caught it's serious trouble.

Dude,

Aside from the fact that you never answered my original question, (instead quoting a list of pseudo-capitalist delusions and justifying your reasoning with blatant falsehoods) but now you are making an argument that is so totally out of touch it's frightening.

Haven't you seen that video footage of hospital staff dumping badly injured homeless alzheimer patients outside homeless shelters dressed only in hospital gowns... in the snow... in the middle of the night?


Let's introduce a few facts here... MOST bankruptcies in the US are caused by medical bills; and MOST of those going bankrupt due to medical bills HAVE health insurance.


So having morons like Joe here spout off with such certainty with only propaganda screamed by Rush Limbaugh on behalf of theiving insurance companies for reference... is a bit rich.


Facts are facts... there is at least a 15% denial rate by US health insurers in cases of catastrophic health problems (the only situation people buy insurance for)... and that denial is simply a random denial hoping the patient dies before recouping the money owed.

So, apart from billionaires and politicians (and those on Medicare), NO ONE paying private health insurance is fully covered.


So Joe, you only have 85% coverage... like eveyone else who is so scared of fair and equitable "socialised" healthcare. Think about that.


The Luke

[buffdnet]

so you oppose universal healthcare but your ok with free clinics? you realise they are basically the same thing.
i brought it up to point out the legal principle that would require the gov to provide healthcare

free clinics are generally not under fed gov control. more likely state or local gov
or more than likely tied to a charity. the va has no free clinics.
if your income is over 985 a month you begin to pay after that.
there are very very few free clinics regardless and no free dental
not even va.

if you believe that because of the ER no one goes without health care in this country (which is not true, but anyway...) then the argument becomes is this the most economical way to provide health care.  your insurance premiums are higher because of the uninsured going to the ER.

your assuming alot. with or without the er people are not going without health care. the 30 million
fucking wetbacks in this country are proof enough. look in an er lately.  there's a big problem
with premiums. if not 30 million there's no denying this country is full of wetbacks.
I don't have an answer for that but giving them insurance? out of the question.
the er in most cases would be better than the va on their best day and both herd
you like cattle. many many people go to the er everyday and their insurance pays part
and they pay part. you never hear about those figures. only the number of wetback soon
to be democrat voters.

know any good deals on ammunition anyone?

[Voice of Doom]

Jesus called, and he said, STFU!

Jesus doesn't like when people put words in his mouth!

[Matt C]

You're behind the times.  

http://www.washingtonmonthly.com/features/2005/0501.longman.html

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2005/08/21/AR2005082101073.html

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2006/12/08/eveningnews/main2243606.shtml

however, that's beside the point, as no one is arguing for socialized medicine for all in the US.  Single payer, on the other hand, would be the best solution to our current mess.

What current mess?  That 13% of the population is black and they are responsible for 50% of the welfare claims?  That this same group largely doesn't take care of its health and so America's health care system is considered to be so bad as a result.  In reality, it is probably the best system in the world - for people who buy insurance anyway.

It reminds me of Canadians who say Americans commit so much gun crime...yeah..."Americans".  

Tim, do you live in Los Angeles yet you remain liberal and unable to connect the racial dots?