Obama's 17-minute, 2,500-word response to woman's claim of being 'over-taxed'

[Coach is Back!]

CHARLOTTE - Even by President Obama's loquacious standards, an answer he gave here on health care Friday was a doozy.

Toward the end of a question-and-answer session with workers at an advanced battery technology manufacturer, a woman named Doris stood to ask the president whether it was a "wise decision to add more taxes to us with the health care" package.

"We are over-taxed as it is," Doris said bluntly.

Obama started out feisty. "Well, let's talk about that, because this is an area where there's been just a whole lot of misinformation, and I'm going to have to work hard over the next several months to clean up a lot of the misapprehensions that people have," the president said.

He then spent the next 17 minutes and 12 seconds lulling the crowd into a daze. His discursive answer - more than 2,500 words long -- wandered from topic to topic, including commentary on the deficit, pay-as-you-go rules passed by Congress, Congressional Budget Office reports on Medicare waste, COBRA coverage, the Recovery Act and Federal Medical Assistance Percentages (he referred to this last item by its inside-the-Beltway name, "F-Map"). He talked about the notion of eliminating foreign aid (not worth it, he said). He invoked Warren Buffett, earmarks and the payroll tax that funds Medicare (referring to it, in fluent Washington lingo, as "FICA").

Always fond of lists, Obama ticked off his approach to health care -- twice. "Number one is that we are the only -- we have been, up until last week, the only advanced country that allows 50 million of its citizens to not have any health insurance," he said.

A few minutes later he got to the next point, which seemed awfully similar to the first. "Number two, you don't know who might end up being in that situation," he said, then carried on explaining further still.

"Point number three is that the way insurance companies have been operating, even if you've got health insurance you don't always know what you got, because what has been increasingly the practice is that if you're not lucky enough to work for a big company that is a big pool, that essentially is almost a self-insurer, then what's happening is, is you're going out on the marketplace, you may be buying insurance, you think you're covered, but then when you get sick they decide to drop the insurance right when you need it," Obama continued, winding on with the answer.

Halfway through, an audience member on the riser yawned.

But Obama wasn't finished. He had a "final point," before starting again with another list -- of three points.

"What we said is, number one, we'll have the basic principle that everybody gets coverage," he said, before launching into the next two points, for a grand total of seven.

His wandering approach might not matter if Obama weren't being billed as the chief salesman of the health-care overhaul. Public opinion on the bill remains divided, and Democratic officials are planning to send Obama into the country to persuade wary citizens that it will work for them in the long run.

It was not evident that he changed any minds at Friday's event. The audience sat politely, but people in the back of the room began to wander off.

Even Obama seemed to recognize that he had gone on too long. He apologized -- in keeping with the spirit of the moment, not once, but twice. "Boy, that was a long answer. I'm sorry," he said, drawing nervous laughter that sounded somewhat like relief as he wrapped up.

But, he said: "I hope I answered your question."

http://voices.washingtonpost.com/44/2010/04/obamas-17-minute-2500-word-res.html

[Desolate]

It's a miracle he answered the queston without TOTUS.

[Wiggs]

We aren't overtaxed.  Look at other countries in the west.  We get off fucking easy...Yes the rich pay more but you have a moral obligation to pay more if you make more.  It's not like they get taxed into the poor house and these dirty motherfuckers move and hide money anyway.

[Wiggs]

It's a miracle he answered the queston without TOTUS.

You fucking idiots complain that he uses the teleprompter too much....lol.

After the fucking idiot you had in the White House before Obama you nimcumpoots have no room to talk.  If that's the best you can do it's pretty pathetic.

You fucks are done for a while and the Dems are waiting for you idiots to try and  repeal this bill, cause you'll look like morons.   There's already a memo out for repubs to take credit for key portions of the bill that they ALL voted against...LOL.

Republicans are so predictable...

[stick_nasty]

We aren't overtaxed.  Look at other countries in the west.  We get off fucking easy...Yes the rich pay more but you have a moral obligation to pay more if you make more.  It's not like they get taxed into the poor house and these dirty motherfuckers move and hide money anyway.

A "MORAL" obligation to pay more taxes if you make more money.  REALLY?  I would love to see a flat tax; fair is fair.

[Dorian01]

I saw that thing on Drudge and thought it was pretty weak of that closet homo matt drudge. Slow news day.

[Desolate]

You fucking idiots complain that he uses the teleprompter too much....lol.

After the fucking idiot you had in the White House before Obama you nimcumpoots have no room to talk.  If that's the best you can do it's pretty pathetic.

You fucks are done for a while and the Dems are waiting for you idiots to try and  repeal this bill, cause you'll look like morons.   There's already a memo out for repubs to take credit for key portions of the bill that they ALL voted against...LOL.

Republicans are so predictable...

MELTDOWN.

[ThaRealist]

We aren't overtaxed.  Look at other countries in the west.  We get off fucking easy...Yes the rich pay more but you have a moral obligation to pay more if you make more.  It's not like they get taxed into the poor house and these dirty motherfuckers move and hide money anyway.

Who the hell says we have a "moral obligation" to pay more in taxes just because you make more money? Sounds like someone bought into "the system" as it is....I agree on a flat tax for everyone....You think I would be ashamed of hiding my funds from uncle sam if all he wanted to do was take them from me to support mis-management of funds by senators and congress men???

[Wiggs]

Who the hell says we have a "moral obligation" to pay more in taxes just because you make more money? Sounds like someone bought into "the system" as it is....I agree on a flat tax for everyone....You think I would be ashamed of hiding my funds from uncle sam if all he wanted to do was take them from me to support mis-management of funds by senators and congress men???

I don't expect greedy motherfuckers to agree with me.  Yeah, it's really fair for a person that makes $20,000 to pay 10% = $18,000 net vs. $200,000 x 10% = $180,000 net and $2,000,000 x 10% = $1,800,000 net as an example....Really fucking fair assholes.

At least I can be happy knowing this crazy bullshit will never happen.

I'm sure you wouldn't be ashamed it's not like most people report what they really took in anyway.  I haven't brought in to any system.  I'm doing whats right and I'd believe the same thing if I made alot of money.  A progressive tax is the fairest way of taxing.  Flat tax is bullshit and just another way of rich people of getting out of paying their fair share.  Pure capitalism is not a good system.  I love and hate capitalism.  It brings out the best and worst in people.
It doesn't account for everyone and leaves the door open for a few to dominate and use their economic power as politcal power...Walla you have America.  Not saying I want a socialist country, I'd just put alot more limitations on the way business is ran, tax the fuck out of the super rich, close loopholes so sheisty motherfuckers don't try and get through, cut taxes for small business and give them a shit load of tax credits.  Redefine the term, "small business"
I can go on if you'd like...

[Wiggs]

Republicans are the same people that believe that people that are poor or not rich are that way because they didn't work hard enough LOL
Gentlemen, I'm a registered independent.  Dems have their probs repubs are straight fucked.  Their 19th century model is old and outdated kind of like conservatives in general.  Conserving old ways and not changing with the times.  Then playing on the Constitution when it benefits them.  Fuckers would still have slaves if it were legal.

Thank God the Jews control things to keep you bastards in line.

I await "Cooch" and the other bass-ackwards thinking morons and their conservative principles.  Like business and other things in existence, we must be constantly changing and adjusting to our environment and society.  There are some principles and ideas i.e. The Consitution and Bill of Rights that should remain.  We don't even have to make this about Obama we can just debate principles. Abortion, War on Drugs (oh brother )Taxes, Immigration (fuck we all lose on that shit), National Defense, etc...

[buffdnet]

your the lazy negro using drugs to diet and you want
to debate what? regardless your not old enough or educated
enough in life principles to enter any worthwhile debate.

[240 is Back]

"A "MORAL" obligation to pay more taxes if you make more money.  REALLY?  I would love to see a flat tax; fair is fair."


Definitely more fair.

My guess is that it woudln't work though.  Poor and middle class already spend about 100% of their earnings at walmart.  You toss in a 20% flat tax and they spend 20% less.  You take away 1/5 of american spending, and a lot of industries will close.  

But it would be tons more fair.  I have supported one for years.  Are there any examples of other nations who have used a flat tax succesfully?

[Red Hook]

over the course of human history has there even been person that has felt under taxed?  even if you cut the tax rate in half you would still have people complaining about being over taxed.

more to the point, those feeling over taxed usually feel that the government is not spending those tax dollars on programs and services that benefit that directly.

by the way through out the course of human history has there ever been an efficient and effective government on a mass scale?


the poor always feel that the rich should pay more taxes
the rich always feel that they should be taxed less
and the middle class is always ambivalent towards the poor and envy the rich and so are always complaining about being over taxed.

the real truth is that every government eventually ends up in a Plutonomy
 

[Wiggs]

your the lazy negro using drugs to diet and you want
to debate what? regardless your not old enough or educated
enough in life principles to enter any worthwhile debate.

Because I'm using ECA and t-3 mean I can't debate?  Really valid argument
I'm more than educated enough and old enough so whenever your ready to rumble gramps
Your first sentence tells me your ability to reason and make valid arguments = FAIL.

So go ahead, take the pussy's way out.

[Shockwave]

Because I'm using ECA and t-3 mean I can't debate?  Really valid argument
I'm more than educated enough and old enough so whenever your ready to rumble gramps
Your first sentence tells me your ability to reason and make valid arguments = FAIL.

So go ahead, take the pussy's way out.

I dont understand why people think that the rich shouldnt be taxed more than the poor. That doesnt make any fucking sense. The poor barely scrape by living on their means, where 5,000 a year is the difference between eating and not eating... (Im not talking about people living on welfare), The rich wouldnt even notice if they lost 5,000 a year.

 It just doesnt make any sense to me. IMHO, people with a huge % of the wealth should pay a large % of the taxes. I would say a flat tax would be viable if everyone had an equal share of the wealth, but its not that way. How much of the wealth is owned by the wealthy?

Ive heard the whole 90% of the wealth is in the hands of 10% of the people, if thats the case, why in hell would you say everyone should pay an equal share? Becuase you don't want to see your stocks drop a half a fucking point?

[chaos]

Because I'm using ECA and t-3 mean I can't debate?  Really valid argument

Your posts lately have taken a bitter and angry turn, maybe you should cut the dosage, WiggletX.

[powermaxx9]

your the lazy negro using drugs to diet and you want
to debate what? regardless your not old enough or educated
enough in life principles to enter any worthwhile debate.

arent you john D the supplement guy?  youre no natty yourself!

[George Whorewell]

Your posts lately have taken a bitter and angry turn, maybe you should cut the dosage, WiggletX.

LOL

[buffdnet]

Because I'm using ECA and t-3 and taking the pussy way out means I can't debate?

exactly.

[tbombz]

coach is being thorough a bad thing?

lmao.. our president sucks so bad.. he is fully explanatory and gives answers that cover all related information   

dummy's love dummy's

[Voice of Doom]

I wonder how Jesus felt about the poor?   Anyone know?  Coach...you follow that myth can you enlighten us as to what the Bible says about 'feeding and clothing the poor'?  Does it say anything about rich people?  Anything about their chances of getting to heaven?

[Coach is Back!]

We aren't overtaxed.  Look at other countries in the west.  We get off fucking easy...Yes the rich pay more but you have a moral obligation to pay more if you make more.  It's not like they get taxed into the poor house and these dirty motherfuckers move and hide money anyway.

Since when do I have a 'Moral" obligation to work for anyone else but my family?

[David M]

Since when do I have a 'Moral" obligation to work for anyone else but my family?

part time christians.... on easter no less.... sad

[Coach is Back!]

I don't expect greedy motherfuckers to agree with me.  Yeah, it's really fair for a person that makes $20,000 to pay 10% = $18,000 net vs. $200,000 x 10% = $180,000 net and $2,000,000 x 10% = $1,800,000 net as an example....Really fucking fair assholes.

At least I can be happy knowing this crazy bullshit will never happen.

I'm sure you wouldn't be ashamed it's not like most people report what they really took in anyway.  I haven't brought in to any system.  I'm doing whats right and I'd believe the same thing if I made alot of money.  A progressive tax is the fairest way of taxing.  Flat tax is bullshit and just another way of rich people of getting out of paying their fair share.  Pure capitalism is not a good system.  I love and hate capitalism.  It brings out the best and worst in people.
It doesn't account for everyone and leaves the door open for a few to dominate and use their economic power as politcal power...Walla you have America.  Not saying I want a socialist country, I'd just put alot more limitations on the way business is ran, tax the fuck out of the super rich, close loopholes so sheisty motherfuckers don't try and get through, cut taxes for small business and give them a shit load of tax credits.  Redefine the term, "small business"
I can go on if you'd like...

Greedy? I've asked this before and I will ask YOU again. How much of your income (assuming you have a job) do you VOLUNTARILY give each year?

If you add all the taxes we pay (property, federal, state, sales, etc,etc) we put out over 50% in taxes. So don't sit there and give your socialist lecture to people who actually WORK hard for their families and assets.

[body88]

Since when do I have a 'Moral" obligation to work for anyone else but my family?

Agreed, this is a free market, if you want to get ahead, work harder.