Hot Stove in Baseball - Who's going where?

[funk51]

cliff lee to the phillies last minute deal, rotation of halladay, lee, oswalt, hamels could be historic if all stay healthy. blanton rumoured to be going to redsox.

[body88]

Yankess being owned hard this offseason.

Lee turns down 50 million extra bones from NY. I guess he called the owner of the Rangers direct to say he would not be taking the deal, and then had his agent call Cashmen.

Yankess fans who dumped beer and spit on Lee's wife on suicide watch.

[Fury]

Yankess being owned hard this offseason.

Lee turns down 50 million extra bones from NY. I guess he called the owner of the Rangers direct to say he would not be taking the deal, and then had his agent call Cashmen.

Yankess fans who dumped beer and spit on Lee's wife on suicide watch.

Won't matter when Boston is still playing second-fiddle to the Yanks despite dropping 9 figures on Crawford.

Will be even funnier when you still try to use the "Boston doesn't buy championships" excuse when we all know that's been bullshit for a decade now.

[Grape Ape]

Yankess being owned hard this offseason.

Lee turns down 50 million extra bones from NY. I guess he called the owner of the Rangers direct to say he would not be taking the deal, and then had his agent call Cashmen.

Yankess fans who dumped beer and spit on Lee's wife on suicide watch.

Not really, they have different needs than Boston.  Boston absoutely had to replace the lost production of Beltre and Martinez, and they didn't have the farm system to do it.

The Lee contract is not 50 million less than the one NY offered, either, at least by my calcs.  In fact, the Philadelphia offer had the highest AAV out of all the offers.  Lee called  Texas personally because he was hunting on Nolan Ryan's ranch during the negotiations.  He completely used them.  He never was going to NY.

If the Yanks get Pettitte back they're back to being a team that won 96 games last year, with their #2 out two months, their C out two months, their AS first baseman doing nothing for the first six weeks, etc......

They'll add someone on top of that by the ASB.

[body88]

Won't matter when Boston is still playing second-fiddle to the Yanks despite dropping 9 figures on Crawford.

Will be even funnier when you still try to use the "Boston doesn't buy championships" excuse when we all know that's been bullshit for a decade now.

Clearly you don't pay attention to what I write. Of course Boston spends big money. They can do that when guys like Bucky and Lester cost them 7 million a year. Half the team came from their farm system. While the Sox spend big bucks and "buy titles" (just like several other teams) they don't spend like the Yankees, and it says it all when a guy turns down FIFTY MILLION extra bucks to play for someone else.

As I understand it, Boston has just as many titles as NY over the last ten years.

I don't even have to argue with you as you do a fantastic job of embarrassing yourself to anyone who is not 9 years old. Why are the Sox going to play second fiddle to the yankees next year?

Something tells this post will turn out to be like your pre season Patriots prediction, ha ha.

[body88]

Not really, they have different needs than Boston.  Boston absoutely had to replace the lost production of Beltre and Martinez, and they didn't have the farm system to do it.

The Lee contract is not 50 million less than the one NY offered, either, at least by my calcs.  In fact, the Philadelphia offer had the highest AAV out of all the offers.  Lee called  Texas personally because he was hunting on Nolan Ryan's ranch during the negotiations.  He completely used them.  He never was going to NY.

If the Yanks get Pettitte back they're back to being a team that won 96 games last year, with their #2 out two months, their C out two months, their AS first baseman doing nothing for the first six weeks, etc......

They'll add someone on top of that by the ASB.

All the reports I heard have the Yankee contract worth 50 million more. It’s 100 million total, correct? Lee could have got more than that from NY.

Come on man, any reasonable person calls each one of the two teams offering him a mega deal and declines if a third party wins out. Why would Lee take the time to call the Texas owner and not Cashmen?

You’re right…the Yankees will be a good team and they will add players. That being said, they have lost out big time this offseason considering their spending power.

[Fury]

Clearly you don't pay attention to what I write. Of course Boston spends big money. They can do that when guys like Bucky and Lester cost them 7 million a year. More then half the team came from their farm system. While the Sox spend big bucks (just like several other teams) they don't spend like the Yankees, and it says it all when a guy turns down FIFTY MILLION extra bucks to play for someone else.

As I understand it, Boston has just as many titles as NY over the last ten years.

I don't even have to argue with you as you do a fantastic job of embarrassing yourself to anyone who is not 9 years old. Why are the Sox going to play second fiddle to the yankees next year?

Something tells this post will turn out to be like your pre season Patriots prediction, ha ha.

The Sox don't spend like the Yankees? They just gave Crawford $142 million. You're a spitting image of the Yankees, minus the dozens of championships and continued success.  

[Grape Ape]

Clearly you don't pay attention to what I write. Of course Boston spends big money. They can do that when guys like Bucky and Lester cost them 7 million a year. More then half the team came from their farm system. While the Sox spend big bucks (just like several other teams) they don't spend like the Yankees, and it says it all when a guy turns down FIFTY MILLION extra bucks to play for someone else.

Please stop saying 50M.

Lee contract:

5 years $120 million ($24 million annual)
6th year vesting option of $27.5 million that vests if he pitches 200 innings in year 5, or 400 innings between years 4-5
Total potential contract value: 6 years, $147.5 million
OR a buyout of the 6th year of $12.5 million

Worst case scenario he signed a 5 year $132.5 million contract (120 + the buyout of 12.5).  Best case it's 147.5M.

Yankees offer to Cliff Lee:
6 years $136 million (22.6 million AAV)
$16 million player option for seventh year
Max Payout: $152M

So the difference between the two offers is a maximum of 19.5 million and a minimum of 4.5M.  And it doesn't say anything about the Yankees at all.  He also turned down more money to play in  Texas.  Lee just wanted to go to Philly all along.   He completely used Texas, and, to a lesser extent the Yankees.

[Grape Ape]

Come on man, any reasonable person calls each one of the two teams offering him a mega deal and declines if a third party wins out. Why would Lee take the time to call the Texas owner and not Cashmen?

I also explained this.  He had a relationship with Texas.  He was hunting on Nolan Ryan's ranch during the negotiations.  That's why he called Texas.  No player calls the other teams who are bidding - that's the agent's job.

This deal says nothing negative about NY, just that Lee preferred Philly over them AND Texas.

NY will just have to be patient and see what's next.   They're still a playoff team at this point.

[body88]

The Sox don't spend like the Yankees? They just gave Crawford $142 million. You're a spitting image of the Yankees, minus the dozens of championships and continued success.  

What do you not understand about overall payroll? Over the last decade both teams have 2 titles. What has each team spent to acquire those two titles. Has one team spent way more than the other?

[body88]

Please stop saying 50M.

Lee contract:

5 years $120 million ($24 million annual)
6th year vesting option of $27.5 million that vests if he pitches 200 innings in year 5, or 400 innings between years 4-5
Total potential contract value: 6 years, $147.5 million
OR a buyout of the 6th year of $12.5 million

Worst case scenario he signed a 5 year $132.5 million contract (120 + the buyout of 12.5).  Best case it's 147.5M.

Yankees offer to Cliff Lee:
6 years $136 million (22.6 million AAV)
$16 million player option for seventh year
Max Payout: $152M

So the difference between the two offers is a maximum of 19.5 million and a minimum of 4.5M.  And it doesn't say anything about the Yankees at all.  He also turned down more money to play in  Texas.  Lee just wanted to go to Philly all along.   He completely used Texas, and, to a lesser extent the Yankees.

So you're in the Yankee camp downplaying the magnitude of this debacle?  Not that big a deal that Lee didn't sign with NY, given the unlimited resources?

[body88]

I also explained this.  He had a relationship with Texas.  He was hunting on Nolan Ryan's ranch during the negotiations.  That's why he called Texas.  No player calls the other teams who are bidding - that's the agent's job.

This deal says nothing negative about NY, just that Lee preferred Philly over them AND Texas.

NY will just have to be patient and see what's next.   They're still a playoff team at this point.

Do you have a way of varifying this? We might have to disagree, as I believe the no call to Cashmen was deliberate.

I think it's about 50/50 in NYC regarding what this says about the Yankees.

[Grape Ape]

So you're in the Yankee camp downplaying the magnitude of this debacle?  Not that big a deal that Lee didn't sign with NY, given the unlimited resources?

I don't consider it a debacle because it's now apparent that Lee didn't want to play there and did want to play in Philly.  There's nothing that NY could have done, other than offers something completely stupid that would outweigh what Lee brought to the table.  Now, if the Yankees passed on Danny Haren last year because they thought they had Lee in the bag, then it would be a little more so.  But I don't know that.

Do I think it would have been incredible to have Lee on the Yankees?  Of course.  Are they done because of it?  Not by a long shot.

[Grape Ape]

Do you have a way of varifying this? We might have to disagree, as I believe the no call to Cashmen was deliberate.

I think it's about 50/50 in NYC regarding what this says about the Yankees.

I heard that on the radio (WFAN) during the negotiations, but I'll see what I can find.  But we don't need to google anything to know that Lee was on the Texas Rangers, had a personal relationship with Nolan Ryan, and that he respected the ownership.  But it's also true he used them.

As for the Cashman thing, the players don't usually make that call.  That's why the call to the Rangers is getting press.  

Boras told Epstein he wasn't getting Teixeira.  Did that show resentment towards Boston on  Teixeira's behalf?  Of course not - it's just how the system works.  Trying to make more out of it is just something Red Sox fans want it to be.

[Grape Ape]

B88:

My wife said to me tonight "Why did Cliff Lee take FIFTY MILLION less......."   

I asked why everyone is saying that.  She said that's what they were saying on WBZ and the news stations.  I give you a pass.   

[2ND COMING]

Lee took the more lucrative deal. Plus when you factor in ny state tax etc.

Yankees will be fine. They limped in to the post season and still made it to the alcs last year. Jeter had the worst season of his career and still racked up 100 runs. Teix and arod couldnt hit a beach ball. They both should have bounce back years. Re-sign wood. The top of theyre rotation is still solid. Develop nova, who has the tools to be a solid starter.

[Grape Ape]

Lee took the more lucrative deal. Plus when you factor in ny state tax etc.

Yankees will be fine. They limped in to the post season and still made it to the alcs last year. Jeter had the worst season of his career and still racked up 100 runs. Teix and arod couldnt hit a beach ball. They both should have bounce back years. Re-sign wood. The top of theyre rotation is still solid. Develop nova, who has the tools to be a solid starter.

Yup.  96 wins with their #2 missing two months, Posada missing two months, Teixeira and Arod having down years, Granderson injured and/or non existent for 6 weeks, Burnett pitching horribly, Javy Vazquez pitching horribly...etc.

All teams have this stuff going on, but it points to the fact that it's not unreasonable to expect improvement.  Cano and Gardner will not likely have repeat seasons, but shouldn't fall off a cliff either.

They need Pettitte, though.

[funk51]

why did the yankees sign russell martin, they already have no pop cervelli old man posada and jesus montero top prospect already in the fold? how many catchers do you need.

[CalvinH]

why did the yankees sign russell martin, they already have no pop cervelli old man posada and jesus montero top prospect already in the fold? how many catchers do you need.

Posada was told he will be the DH this year.they don't think of Cervelli as the future,and if they wanna trade for a stud pitcher they're gonna have to give up one of the two prospects.

[funk51]

latest rumour is phillies talking to pedro martinez to be number five next year. pedro  is a youngster compared to jamie moyer.

[Grape Ape]

why did the yankees sign russell martin, they already have no pop cervelli old man posada and jesus montero top prospect already in the fold? how many catchers do you need.

Posada will be the full time DH.

Montero will compete for the starting catcher job with Martin.  If Martin is the back up, at worst he is Cervelli's equivalent except with good defense, at best, he regains his form from two years ago and returns to being an above-average hitting catcher.  It's an upgrade to Cervelli no matter how you look at it.

[2ND COMING]

If montero doesnt get dealed, could he be the next captain? 

[Grape Ape]

If montero doesnt get dealed, could he be the next captain? 

No.

[CalvinH]

If montero doesnt get dealed, could he be the next captain? 

Haha,I think maybe he should play at least one game before they name him captain

[2ND COMING]

Haha,I think maybe he should play at least one game before they name him captain

 

Well jeter is gone in 2-3 years.

Next in line is cano possibly. Teix i dont know.