Newbies should read this before cycling

[Army of One]

Alot of naturals here lately wondering if they should hit the sauce, I thought this post summed it up well

"I've been cycling on/off now for almost 11 years. I am 30 yrs old. If you have not done steroids before, you better think long and hard about what you want out of life long term. Because here is where the problems begin; cycle after cycle your natural levels fall shorter and shorter, especially as you close in on 30 yrs old. Sure, people are going to talk about PCT , and do this or that to get your levels back to normal. But over time, normal isn't normal anymore, so when your not on cycle you have a harder time burning fat than Natural Joe, you dont have a good sense of well being like you should unless your cycling test usually, and gains come to an end. If your running 750 mg/wk of test , 50 mg/day dbol , and 600 mg/wk of EQ , what would make you think that you would surpass that naturally? Or maintain that much naturally? You wont, and dont let anybody else tell you different. Once you are hitting 240-250 lbs at under 12% bf or so, for most the only thing thats going to push that envelope further is Growth Hormone .


As for myself, this is probably my 25th cycle I'm on right now, there is no coming back. I came off for a solid 6 months and it was enough to tell me I've hit a fork in the road. So I'm back on cycle now, and will most likely use HRT dosages the rest of my life. This is not a choice anymore, I HAVE TO in order to have any quality of life, because I've cycled enough to screw it up naturally. If you've never cycled before, just think long and hard. It'll never be just 1 cycle , trust me"

[SmallPole]

that's kind of true, but you really have only 2 choices...

you either cycle as a part of a natural progression of a gym goer
or
quit entirely

cause i sure as fuck wouldn't be busting my balls at the gym for years just to look like a fucking twink without any possibility of progressing

so my advice for anyone who's thinking about gearing up (are there really any naturals on this board lol?) would be:
either roid up if you really love the gymnasium or take up another hobby, like boxing or some other shit (which could incorporate SOME strength training also, but just for the purpose of the sport)

[nosleep]

ITS A CHOICE FOR LIFE. BOTTOM LINE.

[MrBigandCut]

Bodybuilding and drugs were married from the beginning of time!!

[MAXX]

that's kind of true, but you really have only 2 choices...

you either cycle as a part of a natural progression of a gym goer
or
quit entirely

cause i sure as fuck wouldn't be busting my balls at the gym for years just to look like a fucking twink without any possibility of progressing

so my advice for anyone who's thinking about gearing up (are there really any naturals on this board lol?) would be:
either roid up if you really love the gymnasium or take up another hobby, like boxing or some other shit (which could incorporate SOME strength training also, but just for the purpose of the sport)

I am. But I also do not consider myself a bodybuilder anymore. And I did just as you suggested took up another hobby/sport. Basically I think bodybuilding is not worth it.

[The Grim Lifter]

It can and would take longer than 6 months for him to go back to normal. He didn't ride it out long enough.

PCT returning you to normal or keeping your gains is fucking broscience and fuck anyone who says differently. Those who say differently haven't tried it on themselves. gh15 speaks the truth on this. You can't post that anywhere else because you get attacked.

[Steve Namat]

Alot of naturals here lately wondering if they should hit the sauce, I thought this post summed it up well

"I've been cycling on/off now for almost 11 years. I am 30 yrs old. If you have not done steroids before, you better think long and hard about what you want out of life long term. Because here is where the problems begin; cycle after cycle your natural levels fall shorter and shorter, especially as you close in on 30 yrs old. Sure, people are going to talk about PCT , and do this or that to get your levels back to normal. But over time, normal isn't normal anymore, so when your not on cycle you have a harder time burning fat than Natural Joe, you dont have a good sense of well being like you should unless your cycling test usually, and gains come to an end. If your running 750 mg/wk of test , 50 mg/day dbol , and 600 mg/wk of EQ , what would make you think that you would surpass that naturally? Or maintain that much naturally? You wont, and dont let anybody else tell you different. Once you are hitting 240-250 lbs at under 12% bf or so, for most the only thing thats going to push that envelope further is Growth Hormone .


As for myself, this is probably my 25th cycle I'm on right now, there is no coming back. I came off for a solid 6 months and it was enough to tell me I've hit a fork in the road. So I'm back on cycle now, and will most likely use HRT dosages the rest of my life. This is not a choice anymore, I HAVE TO in order to have any quality of life, because I've cycled enough to screw it up naturally. If you've never cycled before, just think long and hard. It'll never be just 1 cycle , trust me"

Great post!

[MikMaq]

I wish someone would of said this 5 years ago so I could skip this site altogether.

[TrueGrit]

Great post!

Steve, I get the feeling you're a bit disillusioned with the bbing life..

[njflex]

Steve, I get the feeling you're a bit disillusioned with the bbing life..

he realized cost and competing are too much.he has a fantastic build and knows what to use and how much to get there,,to get higher and win might need a bit more .

[howardroark]

I'm not buying all this bullshit about steroids permanently ruining your natural testosterone production. If you run smart cycles, then you can come off steroids with normal testosterone production. It's all about proper on-cycle therapy, post cycle therapy, and running short (but frequent) cycles.

[da_vinci]

It's obviously a life long choice. As gh15 says - there are NO "cycles" for a true bb'er. It's a - continuous usage. But try to think it in other terms - "regular joe" is on a downhill anyway, and as a bodybuilder you can get better and better year after year, even - decade after a decade. if you are smart with your game (and can afford gh lol). It's in a sense - being a different kind of "human", an enhanced one (Transhumanism, if anyone is familiar with this term. I think - bodybuilders are one of the first thranshumanists even if they doesn't know this.).
 Being on some test for life isn't anything horrible anyway, in case you couldn't recover (to what... a 35yo test levels.. a 45yo? Why would you want to be on the decline anyway?). Oh, and 6 months are nothing for a recovery after a decade of gearing up lol.. There was a dude on another board I remember. He was diagnose "hypogonadism" and used to tell he'll nee to be on a hrt for the rest of his life. Fast forward - he "found god", ditched the roids and... a year or so later he was back on track with his hormone levels.
 Bodybuilding is a mind state first and foremost. Be smart.

[dustin]

I'm not buying all this bullshit about steroids permanently ruining your natural testosterone production. If you run smart cycles, then you can come off steroids with normal testosterone production. It's all about proper on-cycle therapy, post cycle therapy, and running short (but frequent) cycles.

No, it does screw things up. You'll never really feel the same, even if your blood work comes back looking okay on paper.

That being said, you probably wouldn't have to worry about being hypogonadal as people have been brought back from the abyss. It's a big life decision though. Cycling is stupid. You either stay on for a long time or shouldn't use steroids at all.

[howardroark]

No, it does screw things up. You'll never really feel the same, even if your blood work comes back looking okay on paper.

That being said, you probably wouldn't have to worry about being hypogonadal as people have been brought back from the abyss. It's a big life decision though. Cycling is stupid. You either stay on for a long time or shouldn't use steroids at all.

Of course you'll "never feel the same." Obviously, steroids give you an edge unlike anything else. But if you ever decide to go back to being natural, it's definitely doable as long as you haven't stayed on for ridiculously long times and as long as you've made proper use of gonadotropins, SERMs, AIs, and dopamine agonists.

[da_vinci]

You either stay on for a long time or shouldn't use steroids at all.

This. People I know who've been using for a few decades, made this a lifestyle. Some breaks here and there, but otherwise - just rotating compounds and being on and on and on..

[chaos]

If lifting weights is really a passion, then physical appearance will play second fiddle after the first few years.

I'd rather continue to get stronger and see those gains on the bar than continue to "focus on the contraction" while eating a poisonous cocktail of gh/steroids/meth/t3/painkillers and whatever else these junkies are abusing.

Strength > glittery thongs.

[dustin]

Of course you'll "never feel the same." Obviously, steroids give you an edge unlike anything else. But if you ever decide to go back to being natural, it's definitely doable as long as you haven't stayed on for ridiculously long times and as long as you've made proper use of gonadotropins, SERMs, AIs, and dopamine agonists.

You don't need to use all that shit. Your HPTA will do a fine job bringing you where you need to be, granted you'll never "feel" the same.

When people use too many ancillaries their body can't do it's job properly. It takes a little while to register and respond, and exogenous hormones will only keep your body in a state of flux. I don't oppose using some ancillaries to aid your body's recovery, but people have taken things too far which is costly, counter-productive and really fucking annoying (see: bro science). People have lost sight of things and don't realize that they're trying too hard to do what their body should be doing by itself. There's little danger in AIDING the process, but don't take it too far.

Only time when that stuff is necessary is if you're not recovering and have severe side affects like infertility or sexual dysfunction. Those are situations where more aggressive treatment may be required. Otherwise, understand and appreciate that you WILL take a hit coming off and you'll feel like shit for quite some time. It's the price we pay. So to me it's better to simply stay on. There are so many environmental factors that are screwing with our natural hormones anyway, so you'd might as well juice and be happy because you're fucked either way.

[MAXX]

If lifting weights is really a passion, then physical appearance will play second fiddle after the first few years.

I'd rather continue to get stronger and see those gains on the bar than continue to "focus on the contraction" while eating a poisonous cocktail of gh/steroids/meth/t3/painkillers and whatever else these junkies are abusing.

Strength > glittery thongs.

top strength athletes uses a shitload of steroids too Nancy

[dustin]

top strength athletes uses a shitload of steroids too Nancy

This. Plus, I never understood the fascination with brutal retard strength. I'm a twinky pussy but even I have benched 350lbs, pulled 450lbs and squat 405lbs all for reps. Once you can lift way more than the general population and get into the dangerous injury zone, I don't see the point unless you're doing competitions.

[Vince B]

What a bunch of brainwashed fools most bodybuilders are. You don't need steroids, oil, growth hormone, supplements or any of that crap. If you know how to train you switch on your growth processes in the muscles and away you go. Of course, I can't expect such dense individuals to actually believe this. They prefer to believe that criminal gh15 who is advocating insane drug usage. Guys like him should be booted off this site forever. This place has gone to the dogs. A pity the owner doesn't train because that would make a huge difference to what is accepted around here.

[da_vinci]

This. Plus, I never understood the fascination with brutal retard strength. I'm a twinky pussy but even I have benched 350lbs, pulled 450lbs and squat 405lbs all for reps. Once you can lift way more than the general population and get into the dangerous injury zone, I don't see the point unless you're doing competitions.

Lol.. exactly.. I'm repping 320 pretty easily currently, and while it's not "a lot" in powerlifting terms - I can see regular gym twinks starring, not to mention regular people (had a conversation with one "heavy" lad a while ago, he was bragging he benched 250lb (for one rep lol) and was the strongest out of his circle (they were having some kind of contest at work or smth). Then I said I rep 320 regulary. *blank stare*

[dustin]

What a bunch of brainwashed fools most bodybuilders are. You don't need steroids, oil, growth hormone, supplements or any of that crap. If you know how to train you switch on your growth processes in the muscles and away you go. Of course, I can't expect such dense individuals to actually believe this. They prefer to believe that criminal gh15 who is advocating insane drug usage. Guys like him should be booted off this site forever. This place has gone to the dogs. A pity the owner doesn't train because that would make a huge difference to what is accepted around here.

Sorry Vince, you're a delusional old man. You can only get so far training naturally.

You peak after a few years of solid training, then a decade or two later you squeak out the teeniest little gains and that's about it. A life time of training for a physique that can't even turn heads. The local douche bag guido crews can juice for a couple months and look better than any natural lifter from anywhere in the world.

[chaos]

No shit "MAXX" but even as a natural when muscular size stops strength gains continue. Drugs are in every sport, across the board, but that doesn't mean the average person has to take them to enjoy those sports.

[Hulkotron]

speak for yourself. just because you looked like shit as a natural and could only make gains using drugs doesn't mean there are a lot of naturals who can look good.

x2 + lol at running steroids as "the natural progression of a gym goer" oh brother

Gayer than focusing on feeling the contraction.

[local hero]

What a bunch of brainwashed fools most bodybuilders are. You don't need steroids, oil, growth hormone, supplements or any of that crap. If you know how to train you switch on your growth processes in the muscles and away you go. Of course, I can't expect such dense individuals to actually believe this. They prefer to believe that criminal gh15 who is advocating insane drug usage. Guys like him should be booted off this site forever. This place has gone to the dogs. A pity the owner doesn't train because that would make a huge difference to what is accepted around here.

your a fucking senile clown........... anyone whos had a few yrs under there belt in the gym knows this to be utter rubbish, youd best stick to pissing your self and keeping your mouth shut