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Author Topic: Deadlifts are not the best back exercise  (Read 7102 times)
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« Reply #50 on: February 22, 2012, 09:49:18 AM »

I did BB rows for years before i learned how to do them properly.

I have also had great results from one arm DB rows.



Cool
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« Reply #51 on: February 22, 2012, 09:50:35 AM »

In my opinion correct cheating is important for back if you are too strict (or only do very strict training) you will limit poundages and make no progress. This is my experience. At the same time just throwing around the weights is not gonna build your back either. But I do believe in explosive movements but there should obviously be some kind of control.
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« Reply #52 on: February 22, 2012, 09:54:08 AM »

^^^Arnold called it 'controlled cheating" and you are right but feeling the back is very important.


If we always got a upper back pump that was comparable to an arm pump,we would all have better back development,but this is hardly the case for most people.
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« Reply #53 on: February 22, 2012, 09:59:38 AM »

The plain truth is that it's easy to target most muscles, such as biceps, triceps, shoulders, hams, calves, etc because you can directly work them.

Muscles like back and chest (less so) are harder to hit because you can't really hit them very well directly.  SO, to compensate, some cheat with heavier poundages or bad form thinking it better for growth.  This is a no-no.  You need less weight. 

Drop weight on chest exercises too in lieu of increased reps and more strict form and you will see growth.  Some of my best chest days (and also were it was most muscular) is when I hit sets of 15 with flat and incline dbs.  Less weight of course.
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« Reply #54 on: February 22, 2012, 10:00:20 AM »

The plain truth is that it's easy to target most muscles, such as biceps, triceps, shoulders, hams, calves, etc because you can directly work them.

Muscles like back and chest (less so) are harder to hit because you can't really hit them very well directly.  SO, to compensate, some cheat with heavier poundages or back form thinking it better for growth.

Drop weight on chest exercises too in lieu of increased reps and more strict form and you will see growth.
X 2 once again.
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« Reply #55 on: February 22, 2012, 10:05:44 AM »

how old are you?  " Roll Eyes", typical comment of a short sighted, ignorant and immature moron.

Keep destroying your back then, several hours a week, and tell me how it feels when you re in your 40s/50s, fucktard. It's even more retarded when you know that you can develop those muscular groups doing less harmful exercises instead.

How old am I?.....42

How are you twat?  Do tell how standing barbell curls 'destroy the spine'.  How do deadlifts 'destroy the spine'.  Come on, back your shit up. 
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« Reply #56 on: February 22, 2012, 10:11:53 AM »

Deadlifts are a good mass builder that works many parts of the body, including lower back.

the superior back exercise however are barbell rows.

hope this helps.

they hit different bodyparts and it's comparing apples and oranges

hope this helps
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« Reply #57 on: February 22, 2012, 10:33:34 AM »

Yeah it's like comparing front squat and stiff leg deadlift as a leg builder.
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« Reply #58 on: February 22, 2012, 10:33:42 AM »

What's up with the shitty attitude here dude?  Just giving you my opinion on some back exercises.  I don't need your condescending bullshit.


Its Uberman the religious zealot nihilist. I don't think he has smiled in the last 20 years, it's par for the course with him.
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« Reply #59 on: February 22, 2012, 10:41:07 AM »

The greatest exercise for back is picking up your tren and GH vials, reaching for your needles/syringes and injecting that shit into your ass.

Thank me later.
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« Reply #60 on: February 22, 2012, 01:46:18 PM »

I guess that's where we differ uberman.  I"m 33 and have been lifting since 13.  I still feel that I am slowly putting on size without super heavy weights.  Back is one bodypart that I feel you need control and form with.  Most "hardcore mass builders" for back are performed with lousy technique and a lot of cheating, i.e. bent rows.  Most perform these with horrible form.

Some back movements I like that still add size imo:

1.  Seated ONE arm cable rows--  Pause them at peak contraction (where hand is at your side).  I toss these in sometimes second on my list of exercises. 
2.  Seated two arm cable rows
3.  Underhand pulldowns.  Again, strict movement with just a little leaning back during the rep.  Higher rep, around 12-13.  Need to squeeze the back.
4.  DB rows.  Again, paused at peak contraction.  Not too heavy (in able to pause for that brief moment). 

Key number one for building a good back is to feel the back working and fililng with blood.  Also getting that stretch during the movement. 

x 2 on this. For years I did back like one of Danta's retards with choppy reps, 9 plates on the tbar and heavy deadlifts every week. After a few years of that my lower back and hips were ground into dust. These days I only do romanian deads, and rarely over 315 for high reps. My back isn't any 'bigger' but it's not a constant mess of pain
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« Reply #61 on: February 24, 2012, 12:41:58 PM »


Hurt my back years ago doing heavy hacks.................wa s training for several contests and my back was acting up so I threw in lying barbell rows..............lie on a high bench and row.

Takes legs and any heaving out of the exercise.........really a great movement, give them a shot.


That’s Vince Gironda style right there Tim. I almost forgot about that movement. I used to do it all the time when I trained at a gym that had a bench you could adjust on BOTH ends. Now all the gyms have bolted their benches down so you can’t prop them up so the closest you can come to duplicating this movement would be low inclines face down. Good movement but not the same as you are getting.


I guess that's where we differ uberman.  I"m 33 and have been lifting since 13.  I still feel that I am slowly putting on size without super heavy weights.  Back is one bodypart that I feel you need control and form with.  Most "hardcore mass builders" for back are performed with lousy technique and a lot of cheating, i.e. bent rows.  Most perform these with horrible form.

Some back movements I like that still add size imo:

1.  Seated ONE arm cable rows--Pause them at peak contraction (where hand is at your side).  I toss these in sometimes second on my list of exercises.  
2.  Seated two arm cable rows
3.  Underhand pulldowns.  Again, strict movement with just a little leaning back during the rep.  Higher rep, around 12-13.  Need to squeeze the back.
4.  DB rows.  Again, paused at peak contraction.  Not too heavy (in able to pause for that brief moment).  

Key number one for building a good back is to feel the back working and filling with blood.  Also getting that stretch during the movement.  


Great post. I’ve been getting back to doing a controlled 1 second positive and 4 second negative on almost every movement in the gym. By controlled I mean I have to initiate the movement with the target muscle. For back that means ZERO lower back swing or leg hitch.

Gironda used to recommend––if you were having trouble with back growth––that you hold the contracted position for 6 seconds. I found this a bit excessive but it definitely seems to increase your muscle/nerve acuity in any muscle where this does not occur for you IF you select and exercise that offers the maximum resistance in the contracted position which most rowing or pulling movements do yet Deadlifts do NOT offer.  

Fortunately for me back has been one of my easy growing body parts. Almost everyone who meets me in person, comments about how wide I am or how wide my shoulders are. However, it’s not my delt development that they’re commenting on but my back width.

One thing that I do a little different than what is mentioned here is how I perform pulldowns with either a close or wide grip overhand or underhand. I always start fully upright and S-L-O-W-L-Y lean back to about a 45% upper body angle––there is ZERO swinging or momentum the way I do this. Therefore the resistance curve mimics what was achieved with a Nautilus Pullover and my elbows go through a wide range of motion in relation to my torso.  

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« Reply #62 on: February 24, 2012, 12:44:27 PM »

Chin-ups
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« Reply #63 on: February 24, 2012, 01:05:42 PM »

I swear by pausing at the contraction for most back movements.  Not for a full 6 seconds, but about 2 seconds. 
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« Reply #64 on: February 24, 2012, 01:18:02 PM »

That’s Vince Gironda style right there Tim. I almost forgot about that movement. I used to do it all the time when I trained at a gym that had a bench you could adjust on BOTH ends. Now all the gyms have bolted their benches down so you can’t prop them up so the closest you can come to duplicating this movement would be low inclines face down. Good movement but not the same as you are getting.

Great post. I’ve been getting back to doing a controlled 1 second positive and 4 second negative on almost every movement in the gym. By controlled I mean I have to initiate the movement with the target muscle. For back that means ZERO lower back swing or leg hitch.

Gironda used to recommend––if you were having trouble with back growth––that you hold the contracted position for 6 seconds. I found this a bit excessive but it definitely seems to increase your muscle/nerve acuity in any muscle where this does not occur for you IF you select and exercise that offers the maximum resistance in the contracted position which most rowing or pulling movements do yet Deadlifts do NOT offer.  

Fortunately for me back has been one of my easy growing body parts. Almost everyone who meets me in person, comments about how wide I am or how wide my shoulders are. However, it’s not my delt development that they’re commenting on but my back width.

One thing that I do a little different than what is mentioned here is how I perform pulldowns with either a close or wide grip overhand or underhand. I always start fully upright and S-L-O-W-L-Y lean back to about a 45% upper body angle––there is ZERO swinging or momentum the way I do this. Therefore the resistance curve mimics what was achieved with a Nautilus Pullover and my elbows go through a wide range of motion in relation to my torso.  


Its nice to think that when you don't see that part outside of mirror arrangements + photos
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« Reply #65 on: February 24, 2012, 01:55:56 PM »



I swear by pausing at the contraction for most back movements.  Not for a full 6 seconds, but about 2 seconds. 


I think it’s key.


It’s nice to think that when you don't see that part outside of mirror arrangements + photos


Hey, I’m entitled to my own reality of grandeur. Since I’m not interested in competing (standing on stage in thongs for a panel of “judges”with the eyesight of Mr. Magoo) and I’m only in having a “good physique” for a guy in his late 50’s I’ll take it as reality. Now if I were interested in competing then yes I would have to look with a more discerning eye. 
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« Reply #66 on: February 24, 2012, 01:59:22 PM »

I think Gironda et al say/said 4-6 seconds for the contraction because nobody is really gonna count seconds, more of a quick 1-2-3-4 count.

To me, it basically means... use a weight where you can hold it statically in a pause while contracting the back, not just go up and down. Wink
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« Reply #67 on: February 24, 2012, 02:02:56 PM »

thi is how to work back,,

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rku_uvmBIi4" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rku_uvmBIi4</a>
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« Reply #68 on: February 24, 2012, 02:06:55 PM »

thi is how to work back,,

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rku_uvmBIi4" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rku_uvmBIi4</a>
Ha ha ha
Deads is the best. back exercise  hands down
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« Reply #69 on: February 24, 2012, 02:13:55 PM »

Uberman, you obviously have no clue.

How can you know you destroyed your back from squats and deads and not for instance millitary presses and barbell rows? Have you ever read any article regarding biomechanics and how by applying proper and smart weight training actually make your back HEALTHIER? It's all about proportions of strength and for example if you do standing millitary presses with retarted weight while your core muscles are not strong enough you will hurt your back.

You have absolutely no clue about training, or life, or anything. Shut the fuck up you negative, depressed bitch.

And before you start writing your usual bullshit about education, father figures and so on (ahahahah) when you don't have any arguments I do have proper education, FAR better than you, you moron. And then I have far better IQ than you, I will have more money than you and just outperform you in every area of life there is. AVE SATAN YOU FUCKING BITCH.

So shut the fuck up and think before you start writing your preachings about "what to do in life to be happy" because life is a game where some of us, fucking juiceheads as you call it, OUTPERFORM YOU IN EVERY ASPECT. And again, HAIL SATAN.
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« Reply #70 on: February 24, 2012, 02:15:12 PM »

thi is how to work blow out your lower back,,

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rku_uvmBIi4" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rku_uvmBIi4</a>

corrected.
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« Reply #71 on: February 24, 2012, 02:28:19 PM »

like it matters what exercise you do Roll Eyes

as long as you stimulate the muscle and have enough drugs in you it grows, oh big deal you did bent over rows and not some hammer strength machina Roll Eyes Roll Eyes Roll Eyes u think that's what makes you a bodybuilder ?

good back exercises are those which active the back mucles, so any form of row,pull over,reverse fly,chin/pull ups

well this is pretty much true, but I still like to do barbell rows for my own personal gratification. Only problem with those is I have to bring my straps to the gym or else I lose my grip
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Max_Rep
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« Reply #72 on: February 24, 2012, 02:30:28 PM »

thi is how to work back,,

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rku_uvmBIi4" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rku_uvmBIi4</a>

Time under tension was about .5 seconds up and .5 seconds down with 1-2 seconds rest between reps. Hey, if it works for him great. I do love T-bars and do use kind of form when I want to pump up my ego... my legs... my hips... my lower back and make believe I'm strong.

Seriously I do believe there is a place for this. Just not all the time or as a staple.  
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« Reply #73 on: February 24, 2012, 02:53:21 PM »

I don't feel shit when I do T-bar rows. I deadlift once a month or so, on other back workouts I stick to pull down, dumbbell rows, pull ups and some machine shit I don't know the name of.
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« Reply #74 on: February 24, 2012, 02:58:53 PM »

Cable rows and stiff-legged deadlifts seem to be working well for me.
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