if capitalism worked, everyone should be rich by now

[Roger Bacon]

capitalism is supremely efficient at allocating resources to where they are most valued and is the best economic system we have available to us.  in theory a central command economy could be more efficient if governed properly, but in the real world there are far too many complex issues involved in the production and distribution of goods in order for a central command to be efficient. all that aside, it is the only system which puts individual liberty above all other concerns. which makes it vastly superior to other systems which try to achieve equality by means of reducing liberty.

You surprise me everyday, you've definitely taken steps back towards reality! 

[tbombz]

You surprise me everyday, you've definitely taken steps back towards reality! 

you mean that to be a compliment, but i take it as an insult! 

that being said..

thanks, i guess.

[Roger Bacon]

you mean that to be a compliment, but i take it as an insult! 

that being said..

thanks, i guess.

[Ropo]

think about it, a lifetime of working should generate enough income to put some spare money aside.

then you die and the children inherit whats left.

get the idea?

everyone should have plenty of money by now, how comes it isnt so?

its not the case in the western world, and it certainly is not the case in the so called shitholes aka 3rd world countries.

the majority of people are permanently broke-kint and live from paycheck to paycheck.

so, where is the problem?

Problem is that you don't understand it. Principle of American capitalism is quite simple. There is two group of people. One group owns all the food, all places to work, all goods, etc. and another group do all the work. First group will keep all the prices so high, that your work is never enough to rise you from the working class to the upper class, for that you need some kind of lottery ticket etc. You have to invent something useful for example, like wireless electricity. If you can't, you will be in the working class all your life, no matter how hard you work. This is how American capitalism works. There is no matter if you have your own business or not, if you have to buy goods to sell them for your customers, you are still in the second hand, while first hand take most of the money. If you don't obey and be nice, they take your work, and outsource it to some third world country, and that's it. It isn't quite same anywhere in the world, USA has tweaked it up to the max.

[Roger Bacon]

think about it, a lifetime of working should generate enough income to put some spare money aside.

then you die and the children inherit whats left.

get the idea?

everyone should have plenty of money by now, how comes it isnt so?

its not the case in the western world, and it certainly is not the case in the so called shitholes aka 3rd world countries.

the majority of people are permanently broke-kint and live from paycheck to paycheck.

so, where is the problem?

It does work, I have a few older cousins that have inherited tons of money from a few generations back.  I know other people with irresponsible parents that aren't getting shit.

There's no reason a normal healthy person can't build a big savings to pass onto their children.  If they've instilled values, responsibility and a good work ethic in their children, that inheritance will be built up and passed on again.  

It all comes down to choices, that's why some people work in Paper Mills all their life, they have children before they're ready, spend their extra money on beer and cigarettes, rent their furniture from one of those places that rape you, etc... POOR CHOICES IN LIFE.  I don't think you realize how dumb some people are, luckily though... The world needs ditch diggers too.

[Wiggs]

Capitalism is bullshit.  Why?  Because in order for it to work, there must always be someone rich and always someone poor.  It's true.  That's the way the system is set up.  Then you are sold some bullshit fucking dream 99% of people will never achieve.  The only good that comes of it is new products and technologies that inevitably become consumed by the oligarchs.

Does that mean we should go full commy or socialist?  No on both.  Does that mean we should get out of the business of capitalism?  In my perfect world yes. There are many other ideas but we're so used to this bullshit monetary system (not backed by gold or silver) just money printed from thin air, loaned to banks etc... 

As long as they keep sellin' you the dream and you keep buying, the wheel keeps spinnin'. 
When we're ready to make real, actual, change as in ditching the monetary system, count me in.

[War-Horse]

Great paradox of capitalism is that if everyone had the same opportunities and potential everyone would have exactly the same amount of wealth.

Exactly.

[freespirit]

 

[Roger Bacon]

Everyone isn't equal though, and probably never will be.

Capitalism provides a role for everyone, from those people that hold advertisements on the side of the road to Nuclear Physicists.

[_bruce_]

Capitalism is bullshit.  Why?  Because in order for it to work, there must always be someone rich and always someone poor.  It's true.  That's the way the system is set up.  Then you are sold some bullshit fucking dream 99% of people will never achieve.  The only good that comes of it is new products and technologies that inevitably become consumed by the oligarchs.

Does that mean we should go full commy or socialist?  No on both.  Does that mean we should get out of the business of capitalism?  In my perfect world yes. There are many other ideas but we're so used to this bullshit monetary system (not backed by gold or silver) just money printed from thin air, loaned to banks etc... 

As long as they keep sellin' you the dream and you keep buying, the wheel keeps spinnin'. 
When we're ready to make real, actual, change as in ditching the monetary system, count me in.

The time  is now and nobody with power who benefits from the current system will support your deeds.
Buy local as much as you can, grow your own stuff and do not buy any new gadgets(mobile, pc, shitbox890, clit buzz, ...) but acquire used ones instead, build strong strategic connections with like minded people around you, organize ... the list goes on.
Joe/tte Blow will never buy into this so "your" on "you're" own.

[tbombz]

Capitalism is bullshit.  Why?  Because in order for it to work, there must always be someone rich and always someone poor. 

i understand why you would think that. however my understanding of economics is that it isnt a "zero sum" game. meaning that everyone can get rich at the same time, with no need for there to be any losers.

[dr.chimps]

'If capitalism worked, everyone should be rich by now.'  See: Marxist Theory 101.

[Dr Dutch]

Everyone is rich by now, compared to 150 yrs ago....

[a_ahmed]

Everyone is rich by now, compared by 150 yrs ago....

No everyone has an IPHONE compared to 150 years ago, but are broke as shit and in debt.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/08/21/afford-food-americans_n_1818280.html

The lifestyle and way of life of the west is a combination of liberalism, consumerism and capitalism. A pile of crap where children are born and raised from a young age to be consumers and while growing up to adulthood trained to be consumers.

First it's toys, videogames, for girls makeup, songs, music, movies, everything is 'fun fun fun', then clubbing, shopping, the whole life revolves around working and spending and that is all there is to the purpose of life. So my co-workers kill themselves so they can 'retire' as if you know for sure you are going to live past 60+.

Everything is about enjoying, fun and spending. It's an illusion.

It's an obsession of being a consumer.

So everything is about the latest gadget, latest toy, latest computer, latest phone, latest movie, latest song, that's how the western social model lives and breaths and the pawns in it, consumers, you, me, everybody, (although I rather not include myself), is a sheeple that works works works and spends spends spends.

But if you get slapped for a moment, no one owns that brand new car, no one owns that house, no one owns even maybe that phone they have.

It's owned by financial institutions, loans, banks, government, etc...

This whole system is sooo flawed and ready to crumble, it only takes a sudden thick and spring of a string to cause an earthquake.



Hell if interenet, google and wikipedia dissapeared today, we'd have one dumb populance who doesn't know shit about anywhere or anything. Take away everyone's smart phones, facebook, internet, google, computer, etc... you have a piece of clueless meat that was being trained to only consumme

[Wiggs]

i understand why you would think that. however my understanding of economics is that it isnt a "zero sum" game. meaning that everyone can get rich at the same time, with no need for there to be any losers.

Taking human nature into consideration.  Capitalism will never result in everyone being financially successful.

[Coach is Back!]

think about it, a lifetime of working should generate enough income to put some spare money aside.

then you die and the children inherit whats left.

get the idea?

everyone should have plenty of money by now, how comes it isnt so?

its not the case in the western world, and it certainly is not the case in the so called shitholes aka 3rd world countries.

the majority of people are permanently broke-kint and live from paycheck to paycheck.

so, where is the problem?

Hahaha, I knew I had to check back in for a reason. Comedy relief. Hahahahaha.

[dr.chimps]

Hahaha, I knew I had to check back in for a reason. Comedy relief. Hahahahaha.

You lasted a day!? Longer than I thought you would.   

[LATS]

Kinda of a silly question in this thread.. You are assuming that every human being has the same drive to be successful.. Not everyone can be rich.. But the biggest fault of capitalism is that too many are just lazy.. Plain and simple..everyone can be more successful than what they are that is the basis of capitalism.. Most are just too damn lazy.. Some have actual social and economic obstacles that do make it harder.. But not impossible..
 
I have a friend that is form the uk.. He actually told me one time " I would never want to live in the united states.. I like to visit.. But you people work too hard".. I told him that is what gets you a head in life.. He said "no thanks. I'll stay lazy and just get by".. Then just laughed..

[daddy8ball]

If bodybuilding worked -- everybody would be huge by now.
If writing operating systems worked and made you rich - everyone would be Bill Gates by now.
If practicing basketball made you skilled -- everyone would be Micheal Jordan by now.

[Coach is Back!]

You lasted a day!? Longer than I thought you would.   

Hey, If Obama can go back on his word to the world, I can write this one off for a gimmick.

[dr.chimps]

Hey, If Obama can go back on his word to the world, I can write this one off for a gimmick.

There's no explaining nutty thinking. Glad you came back.    

[a_ahmed]

Kinda of a silly question in this thread.. You are assuming that every human being has the same drive to be successful.. Not everyone can be rich.. But the biggest fault of capitalism is that too many are just lazy.. Plain and simple..everyone can be more successful than what they are that is the basis of capitalism.. Most are just too damn lazy.. Some have actual social and economic obstacles that do make it harder.. But not impossible..
 
I have a friend that is form the uk.. He actually told me one time " I would never want to live in the united states.. I like to visit.. But you people work too hard".. I told him that is what gets you a head in life.. He said "no thanks. I'll stay lazy and just get by".. Then just laughed..

I think you really misunderstood your friend.

I've been to europe, africa, middle east and north america.

You'd be surprised how much, much happier people are around the world outside of north america.

People kill themselves to buy the latest stupid gadget and just PAY BILLS in north america.

While in other places of the world, people worry about having a home and food, other things are extra, not priority in life.

Because consumerism is the life style, norm, purpose in life, people KILL themselves at the expense of health and everything else just to 'attain' the unattainable.

"Famous" people, "stars", media, "fashion", movies, music, millionares or rather billionaires today further skew the reality and purpose of life and people kill themselves to be like these people.

Hence North America has the largest rate of prescription of pharmaceutical drugs, in particular anti-depressants and other psycho drugs.

People are indeed very unhappy and poor in north america. It's an illusion of wealth, no one owns shit. Just look at the US government. What is it now 17 trillion dollars in debt? Can you even picture that number. The same goes for the consumer citizens.

Foreclosed homes? Paying 40 years for a house? It's slavery for life. You kill yourself your entire life, to die.

The system is designed to make the already rich, richer. And those that want to 'step it up', 'everyone can do it', is not exactly as the fantasy foretells. You have to kill, steal, run and step over a few people, establish connections and then when you maybe reach up there, you become just like those other already rich who will exploit those below them.

This society is designed to keep the rich rich and the poor poor, just working slaves that spend and spend.

[Wiggs]

You seem to be a very well informed man Mr. Ahmed. keep it up.


What's your background Ahmed?....No homo-land security.
Aren't you the white Arab?  What's your educational background?

[Wiggs]

Good to see you back Coach.

[LATS]

 No.. Did not misunderstand him.  We have had that conversation before.. He basically gets money from
Government  and works very little.. He does side jobs ect and still has all the latest gadgets.. He came here and tried to work for a buddy of mine who needed himat 5 am.. He thought that was ridiculous.. He wanted to work for me at my gym.. I told hi. He could open the gym at 5 30 am.. He asked why so early.? I told him people get Up and workout before their jobs.. He said gyms in the uk did not open that early and said we were crazy ect.. Now before you think that he was particular case I have heard this from my cousins in Scotland too..
 Now I am not saying you are wrong I regard to health of USA.. I do think we are silly in many regards.. My job is now making us work on thanksgiving this year among other holidays to get a "better share of the market".. And sadly most people will not be able to retire and will work their whole lives..
 
   Now that being said look at Greece and others who's people are actually rioting because they cant afford to let people retire I their 50s.. And most of the rioters are not even working yet lol.. Socialism doesnot work well after a while either.. The gov just can't afford it.. So nothing is perfect but I would rather make my own way than be too much further indentured to the gov..