Author Topic: Minimum Wage - Depressing Numbers  (Read 17798 times)

Earl1972

  • Getbig V
  • *****
  • Posts: 22061
  • #EarlToo
Re: Minimum Wage - Depressing Numbers
« Reply #100 on: January 04, 2014, 08:05:52 PM »
again Earl, what dollar amount is "making a living" for you?

what luxuries does that constitute?

you do know that most "poor" ppl live in a decent residence with plenty of room, have multiple tv's with cable, if they have kids they have a gaming system, eat out etc.



they should make at least 10 dollars an hour, you don't think mcdonalds can afford it or you just don't want to see people make a better wage?

how do you know who has what in their home and where they live?

i'm not denying many of them are dumb with their money, maybe these gadgets help them deal with their sad existence of working in fast food

E
E

tonymctones

  • Getbig V
  • *****
  • Posts: 26520
Re: Minimum Wage - Depressing Numbers
« Reply #101 on: January 04, 2014, 08:06:51 PM »
Greed sucks. Its like how the petrol companies keep raising prices cause of shortages and refinery outages yet post $100 billion profit year over year.
Yea what about the greedy ass workers who feel like they deserve to get paid more simply b/c their company makes money?

You guys rant and rave about greedy companies but not the greedy ass workers who have the ability to better themselves and get better jobs but choose to sit on their ass and just bitch and moan.

Earl1972

  • Getbig V
  • *****
  • Posts: 22061
  • #EarlToo
Re: Minimum Wage - Depressing Numbers
« Reply #102 on: January 04, 2014, 08:09:49 PM »
then you would be really pissed off that the majority of ppl on welfare are single mothers, under 30, with 2+ kids and at most a high school diploma if that....

you see you advocate for paying them a "liveable wage" but cannot say what a liveable wage is. You say you have no sympathy for ppl who have kids they cant afford yet dont realize the same idiots your advocating for are the same idiots you supposedly have no sympathy for......

Education Earl, its a powerful thing

they made dumb choices at a young age, does that mean they deserved to be fucked for life?

E
E

tonymctones

  • Getbig V
  • *****
  • Posts: 26520
Re: Minimum Wage - Depressing Numbers
« Reply #103 on: January 04, 2014, 08:11:01 PM »
they should make at least 10 dollars an hour, you don't think mcdonalds can afford it or you just don't want to see people make a better wage?

how do you know who has what in their home and where they live?

i'm not denying many of them are dumb with their money, maybe these gadgets help them deal with their sad existence of working in fast food

E
I know Earl b/c there have been many a study done on this subject, many a census has been poured over to get data such as this...again Education is a powerful thing.

Whether McDonalds can afford it is not the question, you think that a workers compensation should be linked to the profitability of the company? Maybe you should tell the greedy ass unions about that who refuse to cut pay, benefits and pensions when they company or municipality is facing bankruptcy.

The question is should a person be paid more than they are worth?

SamoanIrishman

  • Getbig IV
  • ****
  • Posts: 2052
  • Why stress the little people..
Re: Minimum Wage - Depressing Numbers
« Reply #104 on: January 04, 2014, 08:11:44 PM »
Yea what about the greedy ass workers who feel like they deserve to get paid more simply b/c their company makes money?

You guys rant and rave about greedy companies but not the greedy ass workers who have the ability to better themselves and get better jobs but choose to sit on their ass and just bitch and moan.

Boeing workers up here are doing just that. They voted to strike and risked Boeing 777 being moved out of state because they wanted more money and pension though they make way more than any other union for Boeing in other states. It was silly it Boeing bluff worked as the union just signed the ok to terms.

tonymctones

  • Getbig V
  • *****
  • Posts: 26520
Re: Minimum Wage - Depressing Numbers
« Reply #105 on: January 04, 2014, 08:12:53 PM »
they made dumb choices at a young age, does that mean they deserved to be fucked for life?

E
Exactly THEY made bad choices...Does that mean their fuck ups are other peoples responsibility?

Earl1972

  • Getbig V
  • *****
  • Posts: 22061
  • #EarlToo
Re: Minimum Wage - Depressing Numbers
« Reply #106 on: January 04, 2014, 08:25:08 PM »
Exactly THEY made bad choices...Does that mean their fuck ups are other peoples responsibility?


why do you only care about yourself? ME ME ME

mcdonalds or any business doesn't function at all if those workers don't show up to work so they should care

E








E

pellius

  • Getbig V
  • *****
  • Posts: 22827
  • RIP Keith Jones aka OnlyMe/NoWorries. 1/10/2011
Re: Minimum Wage - Depressing Numbers
« Reply #107 on: January 04, 2014, 08:27:22 PM »
i buy them a pizza or fast food, i've given money but i prefer not to because they might spend it on alcohol or drugs, if you think i should give money instead i will consider it, i don't run into the homeless that often because i live in the suburbs

i don't consider myself a liberal, more middle of the road

why is it wrong to want others to make a living?  why do you think the head honchos at mcdonalds aren't rich enough and shouldn't pay the people that work for them? 

i have no idea what your salary is but do you really relate more with a multi millionaire fat cat ceo than a mcdonalds worker?  think about that

E







Nothing wrong with someone wanting to make a living, my friend. Forcing someone to provide for someone else's living is another thing entirely.

I know what it is like to be homeless, sleeping on park benches and doing my laundry in the bathroom of a beach restroom. But I never begged for money and always knew that I could better my situation. You just have to go out there and hustle. Nobody owe you anything, let alone a living, in this world.

tonymctones

  • Getbig V
  • *****
  • Posts: 26520
Re: Minimum Wage - Depressing Numbers
« Reply #108 on: January 04, 2014, 08:27:43 PM »
why do you only care about yourself? ME ME ME

mcdonalds or any business doesn't function at all if those workers don't show up to work so they should care

E
LMFAO are you fucking kidding me?????

thats exactly what these fucking retards are doing and your not only backing them up but excusing the fuck ups that put them in the situation in the first place

At least when Im talking about ME ME ME im not saying YOU need to give ME more money!!!!

Slapper

  • Getbig V
  • *****
  • Posts: 4299
  • Vincit qui se vincit
Re: Minimum Wage - Depressing Numbers
« Reply #109 on: January 04, 2014, 08:29:05 PM »
What century are you talking about? You think the owners of businesses want to exploit children? When I was a 10 years I was paid a penny a minute to do yard work. I didn't think I was being exploited. It was the only job I could get at the time until I was old enough to get a paper route (damn child labor laws). And I was happy to have that job since my only other alternative was nothing. That's life.

I'm not saying the business owners want to exploit children, what I am saying is that business owners will not oppose it if it means more profits for them. It's happened before in American history.

On the issue of you getting a paper route... look, what I am saying is that some people have an astonishing inability to relate. There's a difference between earning extra cash (to buy a car or magazines or candy) and having to work to help mom and dad pay the rent so that you don't end up living under a bridge. And this is where we're headed. Years ago, back in the 50s and 60s, a middle class father's salary was enough to pay for a house, college as well as vacation. That's gone.    

Quote
Getting what you get because those are the only choices available is what life is. Nobody, or very few, get exactly what they want. They always want more for less. I buy a Ford because I can't afford a Porche. If someone is still getting minimum wage after six months to a year on the job there is either something wrong with him or he should get another job. Virtually all fast food restaurants start at over the minimum and give raises as time and skill level goes up. Some even get promoted to higher positions. No one works for years in the same job at minimum wage.

Dude, you're so far off the mark... it's not about buying a Ford instead of a Porsche... it's about having to spend your day working so that your kids can have a plate of food in front of them 3 times a day.

Quote
Sure, some people have to work several jobs to make ends meet. I was one of them. I worked three jobs seven days a week but during that time I also got an education.

You don't believe that for a second. And neither do I. When you get to the point that you have to lie to state your case you've drank the cool aid.

Quote
It took me nearly eight years to get a college degree. Sure it was a lot harder than for someone who came from a rich family and had his way financed for him. It's unfair that someone else was born with better opportunities than I was. It's one of the things I hate about this world. How unfair it is. But that's how it is.

Being "fair" or not is a personal opinion. That people can't survive or live a decent life at the current minimum salary is a fact backed by numbers. The big fast food chains are making a killing in profits, so if people decide to unionize and take it to the big corporations, so be it. You may find it "unfair", but I'm sure the 360,000 people who are trying to unionize will beg to differ. See, they're not even messing around with your right to have to work 3 jobs and go to college for 8 years.

Quote
Would it be more "fair" to force someone to pay what you think they should get to make a good living? How much should that be? Can you really make a good living making $15.00 an hour? How about $20/hr? In fact, why don't we start everybody at $50 grand a year. They won't be rich but I think you can living comfortably on that. And what effect will that have on the economy and business?

How much is something that should be discussed between the workers and the company. It should not be dictated by either the government or anyone else. That would be the ideal. But we all know that the shareholders and the officers always end up conspiring against the worker, and it's usually because of money, so it should not come as a surprise that more people are trying to unionize.

Quote
Again, it's very easy to be generous with other people's money and tell them how much you have determined that they can afford.

Wanna hear something? I am a net tax contributor to the economy, both at the federal and state level. If you ever got any financial aid or food stamps or any kind of government assistance... I want my part back. I don't want to finance your sorry ass.

pellius

  • Getbig V
  • *****
  • Posts: 22827
  • RIP Keith Jones aka OnlyMe/NoWorries. 1/10/2011
Re: Minimum Wage - Depressing Numbers
« Reply #110 on: January 04, 2014, 08:35:14 PM »
Greed sucks. Its like how the petrol companies keep raising prices cause of shortages and refinery outages yet post $100 billion profit year over year.

Do you know the difference between net profits and profit margin? And do you think Oil companies, or any companies, would do better: create more jobs, lower prices, increase production... if they reduced their profits?

tonymctones

  • Getbig V
  • *****
  • Posts: 26520
Re: Minimum Wage - Depressing Numbers
« Reply #111 on: January 04, 2014, 08:35:29 PM »
Slapper most "poor" in the US are not malnurished and yes minimum wage is enough for a single person to survive on. It wouldnt be a plush or pleasent life but thats why they should do what they need to do to get a better job.

Slapper

  • Getbig V
  • *****
  • Posts: 4299
  • Vincit qui se vincit
Re: Minimum Wage - Depressing Numbers
« Reply #112 on: January 04, 2014, 08:41:33 PM »
LOL son, I went to school at night while working for both my undergrand and grad school. I did this by making good life decisions, not having children I couldnt afford, not buying shit I couldnt afford and yes taking out student loans for what I couldnt afford.

You're saying you went to undergraduate as well as graduate school... and yet you say "undergrand" instead of undergrad. Did you even finish high school Billy Bob?

Quote
I have a better idea than most of the interweb libtard progressives including yourself.

I live in the same neighborhood as Bill Clinton so please spare me the "better idea" part. I pay the fucks that pay the fucks that pay the fucks that pay you.

Capisci?

Quote
Im not special at all, so why should I or anyone else expect anything less from someone else?

You see, you're projecting your opinion on someone else. That's not OK. People do have a right to unionize and seek a higher minimum wage. Your insinuation that they do not possess such a right, even though it's on the constitution, is what's really fucked up.

Quote
The main question is why do liberal progressives have such low standards for these people?

Huh?

pellius

  • Getbig V
  • *****
  • Posts: 22827
  • RIP Keith Jones aka OnlyMe/NoWorries. 1/10/2011
Re: Minimum Wage - Depressing Numbers
« Reply #113 on: January 04, 2014, 08:41:53 PM »
why do you only care about yourself? ME ME ME

mcdonalds or any business doesn't function at all if those workers don't show up to work so they should care

E



Because you are responsible for yourself. Charity should be voluntary. Make no mistake, McDonald's, Walmart, Burger King. Costco... all the big companies do far more in enriching other peoples lives but providing them with an opportunity to make an income that they wouldn't have other wise. There's a  reason why people line up for an opportunity to work for these companies.

And what is this nonsense about they should care because if people didn't show up for work they would be out of business. It works both ways, my friend. People don't show up for their jobs because they care about the company. They show up because the company pays them. And if they don't show up there are others that will.


Earl1972

  • Getbig V
  • *****
  • Posts: 22061
  • #EarlToo
Re: Minimum Wage - Depressing Numbers
« Reply #114 on: January 04, 2014, 08:42:58 PM »
LMFAO are you fucking kidding me?????

thats exactly what these fucking retards are doing and your not only backing them up but excusing the fuck ups that put them in the situation in the first place

At least when Im talking about ME ME ME im not saying YOU need to give ME more money!!!!

ok tony how does it affect you if they get a better wage?

you think the job is too easy so they shouldn't be paid?

you aren't one of those double majors in creative arts/art history guys are you?

E
E

Slapper

  • Getbig V
  • *****
  • Posts: 4299
  • Vincit qui se vincit
Re: Minimum Wage - Depressing Numbers
« Reply #115 on: January 04, 2014, 08:48:24 PM »
Slapper most "poor" in the US are not malnurished and yes minimum wage is enough for a single person to survive on. It wouldnt be a plush or pleasent life but thats why they should do what they need to do to get a better job.

No it's not.

That you think it is is what's really fucked up.

tonymctones

  • Getbig V
  • *****
  • Posts: 26520
Re: Minimum Wage - Depressing Numbers
« Reply #116 on: January 04, 2014, 08:48:32 PM »
You're saying you went to undergraduate as well as graduate school... and yet you say "undergrand" instead of undergrad. Did you even finish high school Billy Bob?

I live in the same neighborhood as Bill Clinton so please spare me the "better idea" part. I pay the fucks that pay the fucks that pay the fucks that pay you.

Capisci?

You see, you're projecting your opinion on someone else. That's not OK. People do have a right to unionize and seek a higher minimum wage. Your insinuation that they do not possess such a right, even though it's on the constitution, is what's really fucked up.

Huh?
you got ball slapper I made a typo ::) I must be a minimum wage making dumb ass LOL

what does you living in Bill "I didnt have sexual relations with that woman" Clinton have to do with you have a better idea than me about working and doing whats needed to get a better job?

and where did I say they didnt have the right?

are you fuking retarded?

tonymctones

  • Getbig V
  • *****
  • Posts: 26520
Re: Minimum Wage - Depressing Numbers
« Reply #117 on: January 04, 2014, 08:50:13 PM »
ok tony how does it affect you if they get a better wage?

you think the job is too easy so they shouldn't be paid?

you aren't one of those double majors in creative arts/art history guys are you?

E

Again what does that have to fucking do with it?

whether or not it effects me personally which is certainly would b/c yes the companies actions would change whether it was in higher prices, maybe offering less services products etc. doesnt justify paying someone more than they are worth.


tonymctones

  • Getbig V
  • *****
  • Posts: 26520
Re: Minimum Wage - Depressing Numbers
« Reply #118 on: January 04, 2014, 08:51:05 PM »
No it's not.

That you think it is is what's really fucked up.
actually it is, that you think it isnt shows the idiocy that you believe in...

Earl1972

  • Getbig V
  • *****
  • Posts: 22061
  • #EarlToo
Re: Minimum Wage - Depressing Numbers
« Reply #119 on: January 04, 2014, 08:52:18 PM »
Because you are responsible for yourself. Charity should be voluntary. Make no mistake, McDonald's, Walmart, Burger King. Costco... all the big companies do far more in enriching other peoples lives but providing them with an opportunity to make an income that they wouldn't have other wise. There's a  reason why people line up for an opportunity to work for these companies.

And what is this nonsense about they should care because if people didn't show up for work they would be out of business. It works both ways, my friend. People don't show up for their jobs because they care about the company. They show up because the company pays them. And if they don't show up there are others that will.

they provide a shit income when they can afford to provide more, they take advantage of their desperation, wow thanks for the "opportunity"

i know that's their mentality, that's why they pay shit because some other desperate person without options will take the job, there will always be far more "fuck ups" than fat cats

your thoughts on the homeless just shows lack of empathy considering you were homeless, not everybody has the ability to "hustle" whatever you mean by that, does that mean you resorted to crime?  

E

E

Thin Lizzy

  • Getbig V
  • *****
  • Posts: 18452
  • It’s all a fraud
Re: Minimum Wage - Depressing Numbers
« Reply #120 on: January 04, 2014, 08:52:51 PM »
Economically illiterate Liberals think everything happens in a vacuum. If McDonalds were to dramatically raise wages the marginally profitable franchises would go out business and the others might find it more profitable to replace workers with machines or computers. This decreases employment.

In addition, the majority of fast food workers are very young and for many, it's their first job. So, there's more than just the wages. It's learning to show up on time and be accountable. When you raise wages above market rates, you cut out the first rung of the ladder for those need it the most, the poor. You know, the people Liberals supposedly care so much about.

Earl1972

  • Getbig V
  • *****
  • Posts: 22061
  • #EarlToo
Re: Minimum Wage - Depressing Numbers
« Reply #121 on: January 04, 2014, 08:54:52 PM »
Again what does that have to fucking do with it?

whether or not it effects me personally which is certainly would b/c yes the companies actions would change whether it was in higher prices, maybe offering less services products etc. doesnt justify paying someone more than they are worth.



why are you so passionate about them not making a better wage?  i never participate in these conversations but you have for years, why does it bother you?

higher prices would just be mcdonalds greed, if you like a big mac so much what is another buck to you?  i mean you can afford it right you work so hard and earned everything...

E
E

pellius

  • Getbig V
  • *****
  • Posts: 22827
  • RIP Keith Jones aka OnlyMe/NoWorries. 1/10/2011
Re: Minimum Wage - Depressing Numbers
« Reply #122 on: January 04, 2014, 08:56:45 PM »
On the issue of you getting a paper route... look, what I am saying is that some people have an astonishing inability to relate. There's a difference between earning extra cash (to buy a car or magazines or candy) and having to work to help mom and dad pay the rent so that you don't end up living under a bridge. And this is where we're headed. Years ago, back in the 50s and 60s, a middle class father's salary was enough to pay for a house, college as well as vacation. That's gone.

Both parents work because they want more people because the want a higher standard of livig. Standards of living are much higher now. The garage is full of cars. We only had one when I was growing up. For the first time in history their are more TVs in the house than people. Just look at the "entertainment centers" in the average home? House are much bigger now. They have a/c, washer/dryer, microwaves, two refrigerators....    

Dude, you're so far off the mark... it's not about buying a Ford instead of a Porsche... it's about having to spend your day working so that your kids can have a plate of food in front of them 3 times a day.

No I'm not. The point is that everyone has limited choices and trade offs in life. I was a burger flipper because I couldn't get any other higher paying or better job. But I got work experience and an education and was able to advance in life. It is not someone else's responsibility to insure that I succeed and make a good living.

You don't believe that for a second. And neither do I. When you get to the point that you have to lie to state your case you've drank the cool aid.

What don't I believe? What am I lying about?

Being "fair" or not is a personal opinion. That people can't survive or live a decent life at the current minimum salary is a fact backed by numbers. The big fast food chains are making a killing in profits, so if people decide to unionize and take it to the big corporations, so be it. You may find it "unfair", but I'm sure the 360,000 people who are trying to unionize will beg to differ. See, they're not even messing around with your right to have to work 3 jobs and go to college for 8 years.

What do you mean people can't survive? How many people are dying on the streets because they are working minimum wage jobs? When I was 18 I was working seven days a week at two security guard jobs. I live in a one room studio with no kitchen sink or over. I had a hot plate and did my dishes in the shower. But still I manage to survive and save up some money and move to the mainland where I had better opportunities. How many jobs have you provider for others? How many people have you enabled to make a good living. Nothing is easier than to require other people to do what you want and think they should do.

How much is something that should be discussed between the workers and the company. It should not be dictated by either the government or anyone else. That would be the ideal. But we all know that the shareholders and the officers always end up conspiring against the worker, and it's usually because of money, so it should not come as a surprise that more people are trying to unionize.

Wanna hear something? I am a net tax contributor to the economy, both at the federal and state level. If you ever got any financial aid or food stamps or any kind of government assistance... I want my part back. I don't want to finance your sorry ass.

Well, I can see compassion goes out the window quickly when someone disagrees with you. But don't worry. I've been in worse circumstance than you'll ever be and I survived without a handout from anyone.

Slapper

  • Getbig V
  • *****
  • Posts: 4299
  • Vincit qui se vincit
Re: Minimum Wage - Depressing Numbers
« Reply #123 on: January 04, 2014, 08:58:35 PM »
you got ball slapper I made a typo ::) I must be a minimum wage making dumb ass LOL

Well, that plus the fact that your grammar is awful tells me you have the IQ of an iPhone.  

Quote
what does you living in Bill "I didnt have sexual relations with that woman" Clinton have to do with you have a better idea than me about working and doing whats needed to get a better job?

I am part of a higher echelon of society. I have a better idea on how to milk the system. I knew what it took to get to where I am and I did it. Now, do I think everyone should do what I did? Nope. Do I opine that if people do not meet my own personal standards and make mistakes (we're all human after all) they should be left to die by society? Nope.

Quote
and where did I say they didnt have the right?

I didn't say you "said", I said you insinuated such a thing. If you don't believe me read your own comments.

Quote
are you fuking retarded?

"fuking"?  ;D

tonymctones

  • Getbig V
  • *****
  • Posts: 26520
Re: Minimum Wage - Depressing Numbers
« Reply #124 on: January 04, 2014, 09:01:24 PM »
they provide a shit income when they can afford to provide more, they take advantage of their desperation, wow thanks for the "opportunity"

i know that's their mentality, that's why they pay shit because some other desperate person without options will take the job, there will always be far more "fuck ups" than fat cats

your thoughts on the homeless just shows lack of empathy considering you were homeless, not everybody has the ability to "hustle" whatever you mean by that, does that mean you resorted to crime?  

E


companys are not there to provide jobs, jobs are a by product of the companies goal of providing services/products for a profit.

Understand that Earl, you nor anyone else is ENTITLED to a job.

Jobs are something that are given on merit and the compensation is comsumerate with that merit.

Your argument is based solely on emotion and envy b/c they have more then others...