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Author Topic: who trains to failure?  (Read 3652 times)
CalvinH
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« Reply #50 on: September 27, 2013, 06:42:40 AM »

i train as hard as i can on any given day

sometimes im an animal

sometimes i go through the motions

i dont beat myself up about it

if im in animal mode i go all out and maximise the session

if its aint there i try and mix it up a little maybe do circuits



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Powerlift66
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« Reply #51 on: September 27, 2013, 10:17:08 AM »

Who here even trains at all?

I just thought this was a Schmoe, thong loving website   Grin
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« Reply #52 on: September 27, 2013, 10:39:56 AM »

There are times I train to failure but in doing so I also keep in mind that I should rest to recover.  That's true of anyone that trains although drugs allow (among other "benefits") a far quicker rate of recovery.

I believe Mentzer used the phrase, train to momentary muscular failure.  And again, he stressed that recovery was just as important.  Train to failure (or not) but remember to rest to recover.  And eat.   Grin
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« Reply #53 on: September 27, 2013, 10:40:16 AM »

Always. I never understood people who don't. Are they just lazy or have a low tolerance of the "pain"?

If training to failure wasn't necessary you could make the argument that you could pick up a weight you can do 12 reps to failure with, pick it up one time, and get the same result. And that argument is valid. Train to failure for results.
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« Reply #54 on: September 27, 2013, 11:00:25 AM »

Powerlifters and Olympic lifters don't train to failure but some bodybuilders feel that every time you hit the gym make sure you can't get one more rep. There is a time to go to failure. If you really went to failure every time you lifted you would get burned out in a week or two.

Imagine if a runner in training was told today is 3 mile day. Keep a note book and every 3 mile day you have to beat your previous time. If anyone followed this training protocol they would just burn out completely. The way runners train if they feel good then they burn it. If not a slower run is better than no run.

Training to failure using a note book to log weight, reps and time to complete a workout is a good tool. In reality though how strong can you get if you have been training hard for 10 years? Training to failure is a workout tool but not the only tool. Training for muscular strength endurance for lack of a better description will carry you far and is better than a pure strength protocol for building muscle. If getting stronger was the magic bullet for growth we would all warm up and train for sets of single reps.

 Most builders train with volume. So if the first exercise for chest is the bench they might do something like 4 sets of 10 reps. The first set after warm up the imaginary trainer might stop at 10 knowing he could have got 15. The second set he will stop at 10 knowing he probably could have gotten 12. The third he gets 10 and he is really close to failure. His last set he grits his teeth and fails at 9 reps. Some HIT guys will counter why didn't he just use more weight and do one work set to failure?  Muscle fibers are completely on or off. Just doing one set to failure doesn't mean all fibers were hit.  Using the volume method more muscle fibers are worked.
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« Reply #55 on: September 27, 2013, 11:04:21 AM »

Used to always, now prefer more sets of low reps.

The way i see it you can do

X amout of weight for 11 reps to failure

Or

The same weight for 5 sets of 6 reps for a total of 30 reps.

Works far better for me.
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« Reply #56 on: September 27, 2013, 11:08:57 AM »

Powerlifters and Olympic lifters don't train to failure but some bodybuilders feel that every time you hit the gym make sure you can't get one more rep. There is a time to go to failure. If you really went to failure every time you lifted you would get burned out in a week or two.

Imagine if a runner in training was told today is 3 mile day. Keep a note book and every 3 mile day you have to beat your previous time. If anyone followed this training protocol they would just burn out completely. The way runners train if the feel good that they burn it. If not a slower run is better than no run.

Training to failure using a note book to log weight, reps and time to complete a workout is a good tool. In reality though how strong can you get if you have been training hard for 10 years? Training to failure is a workout tool but not the only tool. Training for muscular strength endurance for lack of a better description will carry you far and is better than a pure strength protocol for building muscle. If getting stronger was the magic bullet for growth we would all warm up and train for sets of single reps.

 Most builders train with volume. So if the first exercise for chest is the bench they might do something like 4 sets of 10 reps. The first set after warm up the imaginary trainer might stop at 10 knowing he could have got 15. The second set he will stop at 10 knowing he probably could have gotten 12. The third he gets 10 and he is really close to failure. His last set he grits his teeth and fails at 9 reps. Some HIT guys will counter why didn't he just use more weight and do one work set to failure?  Muscle fibers are completely on or off. Just doing one set to failure doesn't mean all fibers were hit.  Using the volume method more muscle fibers are worked.
yes
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« Reply #57 on: September 27, 2013, 11:17:01 AM »

Powerlifters and Olympic lifters don't train to failure but some bodybuilders feel that every time you hit the gym make sure you can't get one more rep. There is a time to go to failure. If you really went to failure every time you lifted you would get burned out in a week or two.

Imagine if a runner in training was told today is 3 mile day. Keep a note book and every 3 mile day you have to beat your previous time. If anyone followed this training protocol they would just burn out completely. The way runners train if the feel good that they burn it. If not a slower run is better than no run.

Training to failure using a note book to log weight, reps and time to complete a workout is a good tool. In reality though how strong can you get if you have been training hard for 10 years? Training to failure is a workout tool but not the only tool. Training for muscular strength endurance for lack of a better description will carry you far and is better than a pure strength protocol for building muscle. If getting stronger was the magic bullet for growth we would all warm up and train for sets of single reps.

 Most builders train with volume. So if the first exercise for chest is the bench they might do something like 4 sets of 10 reps. The first set after warm up the imaginary trainer might stop at 10 knowing he could have got 15. The second set he will stop at 10 knowing he probably could have gotten 12. The third he gets 10 and he is really close to failure. His last set he grits his teeth and fails at 9 reps. Some HIT guys will counter why didn't he just use more weight and do one work set to failure?  Muscle fibers are completely on or off. Just doing one set to failure doesn't mean all fibers were hit.  Using the volume method more muscle fibers are worked.
An Olympic lifter trains technique and speed. That's why they do sets that are not to failure. Their type of training is not targeting muscle hypertrophy exclusively. which is the goal for bodybuilders. and most people on this site are more or less bodybuilders, not Olympic lifters right?
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« Reply #58 on: September 27, 2013, 11:29:08 AM »

Powerlifters and Olympic lifters don't train to failure but some bodybuilders feel that every time you hit the gym make sure you can't get one more rep. There is a time to go to failure. If you really went to failure every time you lifted you would get burned out in a week or two.

Imagine if a runner in training was told today is 3 mile day. Keep a note book and every 3 mile day you have to beat your previous time. If anyone followed this training protocol they would just burn out completely. The way runners train if the feel good that they burn it. If not a slower run is better than no run.

Training to failure using a note book to log weight, reps and time to complete a workout is a good tool. In reality though how strong can you get if you have been training hard for 10 years? Training to failure is a workout tool but not the only tool. Training for muscular strength endurance for lack of a better description will carry you far and is better than a pure strength protocol for building muscle. If getting stronger was the magic bullet for growth we would all warm up and train for sets of single reps.

 Most builders train with volume. So if the first exercise for chest is the bench they might do something like 4 sets of 10 reps. The first set after warm up the imaginary trainer might stop at 10 knowing he could have got 15. The second set he will stop at 10 knowing he probably could have gotten 12. The third he gets 10 and he is really close to failure. His last set he grits his teeth and fails at 9 reps. Some HIT guys will counter why didn't he just use more weight and do one work set to failure?  Muscle fibers are completely on or off. Just doing one set to failure doesn't mean all fibers were hit.  Using the volume method more muscle fibers are worked.

that's me in a nutshell... warmup, and then warm up some more.  make sure your shit is firing on all cylinders. then hit it hard.  how many times have you done your last "hard set" and thought...."I had more in me. I wasn't there yet" or something similar ?  do an extra set or two at less than maximal effort and wake everything up 100%.

it's a delicate balance..you don't want to try too hard and spend money, and you don't want to be dicking around either..takes a little time to figure out your zone.
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« Reply #59 on: September 27, 2013, 11:33:56 AM »

biologically it simply doesn't work like that. for it to work like that, your body would also have to produce just a little more anabolic hormones than it did for your last workout lol. Roll Eyes

I have no idea what you are saying. 

You get stronger over time, over months, years.  You add reps, add weight, add intensity. 

Training to failure is a mental exercise.  As someone else has mentioned, it depends on your motivation.

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« Reply #60 on: September 27, 2013, 11:34:19 AM »

i do 2 sets per exercise,.. the first is very heavy (6-8 reps) and the second is with moderate weight.. both must be to failure..

i train each part once a week including abs and calves..
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« Reply #61 on: September 27, 2013, 12:12:56 PM »

that was me, its got to do everything with mental readyness.

sometimes a huge pump sets in and central nervous system is on fire and that triggers mental will and in those sessions one goes way beyond what he usualy does.

too many factors, failure is too much vague term.


i really only go to failure with bodyweight exercises or very near. Dips or push ups.
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« Reply #62 on: September 27, 2013, 12:39:20 PM »

An Olympic lifter trains technique and speed. That's why they do sets that are not to failure. Their type of training is not targeting muscle hypertrophy exclusively. which is the goal for bodybuilders. and most people on this site are more or less bodybuilders, not Olympic lifters right?

Max the biggest factor in Olympic lifting is strength and power. There are no weak but skillful Olympic lifters. Technique plays a role but it isn't as big a factor as non Olympic lifters think. Power lifters only train to failure at the end of a cycle. Most training days are far from failure. Why do bodybuilders think every day is failure day?
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