The Irony of buying a gun vs. voting

[Straw Man]

No its not - we have a problem w ghetto gang bangers and thugs. 

sure it's only ghetto gang bangers and thugs

btw - great job making a clam and providing no proof

[Soul Crusher]

sure it's only ghetto gang bangers and thugs

btw - great job making a clam and providing no proof

Yes it is - take away the crimes and murders committed by ghetto skells and thugs and there is no problem at all. 

[Archer77]

Yes it is - take away the crimes and murders committed by ghetto skells and thugs and there is no problem at all. 

You mean to tell me that when you take the total number of legal gun owners in the United States and you compare that number to the total number of gun deaths and gun crimes, you find the number of legal gun owners committing crimes with a gun is very low? 

[headhuntersix]

it shows you can get a gun in this country without a photo ID

gun violence is an actual problem in this country where as voter fraud is so infrequent as to be statistically inconsequential

the only consequential result of requiring a photo ID when voting is to disenfranchise voters

btw - very odd that the pro-gun members of our board seem unaware of the "gun show loophole" (and of course it's not just gun shows)

Stuart Smalley is in congress because of it.  Voter ID is just another Lib issue to keep blacks and latino's in their voter block. Your to stupid to get an ID so we'll work to make sure you don't need to...who's racist again?

[Shockwave]

Think harder


http://www.salon.com/2013/08/29/clintons_line_was_true_the_sad_facts_about_assault_weapons_and_voting/

Lol.

The only way to stop a private seller from selling a firearm to another person without a background check is a registry. And that wont happen. And even if it did, all the firearms in circulation that ARENT registered would still be sold under the table and kept hidden.

Do not support that.

Thats a loophole, not the rule, as purchasing a firearm from dealers require ID.

[Straw Man]

You mean to tell me that when you take the total number of legal gun owners in the United States and you compare that number to the total number of gun deaths and gun crimes, you find the number of legal gun owners committing crimes with a gun is very low? 

try comparing the total number of voters to the total number of incidents of fraudulent voters

[Archer77]

try comparing the total number of voters to the total number of incidents of fraudulent voters

Ask yourself this, if someone commits voter fraud and isn't caught how do you ever know an act of fraud was committed?

[Soul Crusher]

Ask yourself this, if someone commits voter fraud and isn't caught how do you ever know an act of fraud was committed?

LOL - don't confuse straw w reality

[JOHN MATRIX]

In virtually every state in the country you can purchase a gun without a photo ID

What is the argument we most often hear from Republicans in objection to even the most modest gun legislation?
They say it would create an unfair burden on law abiding citizens AND the criminals would still find a way to get a gun anyway so what is the point?

If you believe that argument then the same exact argument applies to voting.   If you were intent of being a fraudulent voter it wouldn't be that difficult to get a fake ID (probably easier then getting a real one) and does in fact create a burden on law abiding citizens who would to cast a legitimate vote

Also, we know that gun violence is a REAL problem and we have zero proof that fraudulent voting is a real problem

So how about some consistency from our Republican friends or at least some honesty. 

You have no clue what the process is for buying a gun. You most certainly do need an ID

[Straw Man]

You have no clue what the process is for buying a gun. You most certainly do need an ID

I do in California where I live but there are many (vast majority) of states where certain kinds of sales do not require a photo ID

I've already posted that info in this thread

[Shockwave]

I do in California where I live but there are many (vast majority) of states where certain kinds of sales do not require a photo ID

I've already posted that info in this thread

yeah, 1 kind, private seller to private seller. Thats it. Good luck stopping that.

[Dos Equis]

This really is a dumb comparison.  But then again, this is the same person who started a thread calling George Washington a filthy stinking liberal.  lol   

Gun Buying Guide
 By Michael J. Simpson
© Flickr user Magic Robot

I frequently hear from people who want to know how to go about buying a gun. If you are new to gun ownership or gun collecting, you may not know more than what you’ve seen on television. Unfortunately, this information is not always accurate. Even when it is, the information may not be applicable to every state. In any case, here are the things you need to know about buying a gun. If you have a question I haven’t covered, please email me and I will do my best to answer your question.

Who can buy a gun?:

According to federal law an individual may purchase a long gun (rifle or shotgun) at age 18 and a handgun at age 21, as long as the purchaser is not any of the following:

Anyone currently under indictment for a crime punishable by more than a year in prison
Anyone who has been previously convicted of such a crime
A fugitive
User of any controlled substance
Anyone who has been committed to a mental institution or deemed mentally defective
An illegal alien
Anyone who has been dishonorably discharged from the military
Anyone who has renounced his or her U.S. citizenship
Anyone who currently has a restraining order against him or her from an intimate partner or child of said partner
Anyone who has been convicted of a domestic violence misdemeanor
Do I need a license to own a gun?:

Federal law does not require any sort of licensing to own a gun. In most states and municipalities, a license is not required to own a gun but is required to carry a gun on your person.

Where can I buy a gun?:

The short answer is pretty much anywhere. If you are new to the gun buying process, I recommend buying a gun locally as it is easier and requires fewer steps. Depending upon the type of gun you want, you can buy a gun at a gun shop, gun show, pawn shop, shooting range, sporting goods store, or even Walmart. When possible, I would suggest trying a shooting range first. Not only will there be plenty of knowledgeable staff on hand to answer questions, you may also be able to try out the gun on the range before buying it.

You can also purchase a gun from an individual but if you do, be sure to document the sale carefully for your records.

How do I buy a gun?:

If you are buying a gun from a Federal Firearms Licensed dealer (FFL), they will collect the necessary paperwork from you and run the required background check. Unless you are buying a gun from an individual, you will almost certainly be buying it from an FFL. All of the above recommended places to buy a gun are FFLs.

Federal law does not require you to undergo a background check when purchasing a gun from an individual, nor does it require individuals to notify them of a private gun sale. However, the seller is still prohibited from selling a gun to anyone who is otherwise prohibited from buying a gun by federal law.

Can I buy a machine gun?:

You can purchase a machine gun that was built before 1986. Because of the Firearm Owners Protection Act of 1986 (FOPA), a private citizen cannot own an assault weapon manufactured during or after that year.

Do I have to register my guns?:

Federal law does not require registering a gun unless it is what is known as an NFA weapon. Such weapons include machine guns, short-barreled rifles, silencers, grenades, and a few others.

When buying a gun from an FFL, of course, there is a record of the sale filed with the ATF.

What about local laws?:

Gun owners and collectors have to consider local laws in addition to federal gun laws. You can check the gun laws in your state here or contact a nearby gun range or gun shop for resources on local laws.

http://weapons.about.com/od/buyingagun/p/Gun-Buying-Guide.htm

[240 is Back]

"However, the seller is still prohibited from selling a gun to anyone who is otherwise prohibited from buying a gun by federal law."

BUT there is no required way to check.  All I have to do is get his "word" that he's not a felon, etc.   And felons, well, they tend to lie.  So while "legally", i'm covered if I sell a truckload of AK-47s to a dude in a prison jump suit who claims he's never been arrested, we all know what's going on.

I don't understand "republicans" that loved Romney's gun-bill-writing ass, that also love the loophole.  You're all screwed up lol.  You're all over the map.

[Dos Equis]

I don't understand people who repeatedly lie about their party affiliation, like this self-professed Republican calling himself a libertarian:

I'm a libertarian.

http://www.bobbarr2008.com/

[240 is Back]

I don't understand people who repeatedly lie about their party affiliation, like this self-professed Republican calling himself a libertarian:

attack the messenger when I point out a real mess that is your ideology.

Tell us how one can support romney and his anti-gun bill writing self... and still support the loophole.  I can see choosing one of these, but BOTH?   

The loophole is how criminals get guns, plain and simple.  I dont know why you are supporting it.  You even bolded the part about the seller not being allowed to sell to someone who fails... but they don't konw... and that's why loopholes are designed, so you can sell a truck load of AR15s to a dude in a prison jump suit who tells you it's just his halloween costume with a nod.

Shaking my head.

[Dos Equis]

attack the messenger when I point out a real mess that is your ideology.

Tell us how one can support romney and his anti-gun bill writing self... and still support the loophole.  I can see choosing one of these, but BOTH?   

The loophole is how criminals get guns, plain and simple.  I dont know why you are supporting it.  You even bolded the part about the seller not being allowed to sell to someone who fails... but they don't konw... and that's why loopholes are designed, so you can sell a truck load of AR15s to a dude in a prison jump suit who tells you it's just his halloween costume with a nod.

Shaking my head.

Actually you are lying about my ideology.  But then again you lie about everything. 

Why did you call yourself a libertarian in the quote I posted? 

And why did you call yourself a Republican here?

I'm voting republican, unless Palin is the nominee. 

[240 is Back]

you spent all afternoon yesterday quoting 8 year old quotes about my political affiliation. 

[Dos Equis]

you spent all afternoon yesterday quoting 8 year old quotes about my political affiliation. 

I spent about 15 minutes posting the same quotes.  Do you ever tell the truth? 

But you haven't answered the question.  Why do you repeatedly misrepresent your political affiliations? 

i voted libertarian and will continue to do so.  

I am soooo confused. 

[JOHN MATRIX]

240 leaping in to deflect attacks on the dems yet again.

[headhuntersix]

Nobody defends Obama harder with limp wristed "Bush did it" defenses then ol 240...who supposedly didn't vote for Barry. I have no idea why a guy who didn't vote for Obama, defends him so hard.

[Dos Equis]

[Straw Man]

This really is a dumb comparison.  But then again, this is the same person who started a thread calling George Washington a filthy stinking liberal.  lol   

Gun Buying Guide
 By Michael J. Simpson
© Flickr user Magic Robot

I frequently hear from people who want to know how to go about buying a gun. If you are new to gun ownership or gun collecting, you may not know more than what you’ve seen on television. Unfortunately, this information is not always accurate. Even when it is, the information may not be applicable to every state. In any case, here are the things you need to know about buying a gun. If you have a question I haven’t covered, please email me and I will do my best to answer your question.

Who can buy a gun?:

According to federal law an individual may purchase a long gun (rifle or shotgun) at age 18 and a handgun at age 21, as long as the purchaser is not any of the following:

Anyone currently under indictment for a crime punishable by more than a year in prison
Anyone who has been previously convicted of such a crime
A fugitive
User of any controlled substance
Anyone who has been committed to a mental institution or deemed mentally defective
An illegal alien
Anyone who has been dishonorably discharged from the military
Anyone who has renounced his or her U.S. citizenship
Anyone who currently has a restraining order against him or her from an intimate partner or child of said partner
Anyone who has been convicted of a domestic violence misdemeanor
Do I need a license to own a gun?:

Federal law does not require any sort of licensing to own a gun. In most states and municipalities, a license is not required to own a gun but is required to carry a gun on your person.

Where can I buy a gun?:

The short answer is pretty much anywhere. If you are new to the gun buying process, I recommend buying a gun locally as it is easier and requires fewer steps. Depending upon the type of gun you want, you can buy a gun at a gun shop, gun show, pawn shop, shooting range, sporting goods store, or even Walmart. When possible, I would suggest trying a shooting range first. Not only will there be plenty of knowledgeable staff on hand to answer questions, you may also be able to try out the gun on the range before buying it.

You can also purchase a gun from an individual but if you do, be sure to document the sale carefully for your records.

How do I buy a gun?:

If you are buying a gun from a Federal Firearms Licensed dealer (FFL), they will collect the necessary paperwork from you and run the required background check. Unless you are buying a gun from an individual, you will almost certainly be buying it from an FFL. All of the above recommended places to buy a gun are FFLs.

Federal law does not require you to undergo a background check when purchasing a gun from an individual, nor does it require individuals to notify them of a private gun sale. However, the seller is still prohibited from selling a gun to anyone who is otherwise prohibited from buying a gun by federal law.

Can I buy a machine gun?:

You can purchase a machine gun that was built before 1986. Because of the Firearm Owners Protection Act of 1986 (FOPA), a private citizen cannot own an assault weapon manufactured during or after that year.

Do I have to register my guns?:

Federal law does not require registering a gun unless it is what is known as an NFA weapon. Such weapons include machine guns, short-barreled rifles, silencers, grenades, and a few others.

When buying a gun from an FFL, of course, there is a record of the sale filed with the ATF.

What about local laws?:

Gun owners and collectors have to consider local laws in addition to federal gun laws. You can check the gun laws in your state here or contact a nearby gun range or gun shop for resources on local laws.

http://weapons.about.com/od/buyingagun/p/Gun-Buying-Guide.htm

Thanks for proving my point Bum

No mention of any requirement to show a photo ID when buying from a private party, and no mention at all of gun shows or buying over the internet

Did you notice this part Bum

Federal law does not require you to undergo a background check when purchasing a gun from an individual, nor does it require individuals to notify them of a private gun sale.

I noticed you did bold this part

However, the seller is still prohibited from selling a gun to anyone who is otherwise prohibited from buying a gun by federal law.

how many private party sales do you think comply with this (and again it still requires no photo id) when Federal law does not require notification of the private gun sale ?

Thanks again for helping to prove my point

[Straw Man]

Lol.

The only way to stop a private seller from selling a firearm to another person without a background check is a registry. And that wont happen. And even if it did, all the firearms in circulation that ARENT registered would still be sold under the table and kept hidden.

Do not support that.

Thats a loophole, not the rule, as purchasing a firearm from dealers require ID.

in other words you can buy a gun without providing a photo ID or undergoing any kind of a back ground check and federal law also does not require any notification of the sale

[James]

My whole family - all Republicans - are voting Obama.  i'm driving them to the station later - buying everyone dinner - making it a real family event.

240 did you take the family out for dinner and "make it a real family event" again after Obama won the 2nd term?

[Dos Equis]

Now I'm really confused.