Harley Breite - Appreciation thread

[pellius]

Dear Pellius,
  Some families scrape up money when their loved ones are in trouble, but most don't.
  Maybe sometimes, an attorney takes pity and cuts his rate because he sees a crying mother who can't afford
the cab to his office sitting across from him crying on top of his custom made conference table.
  Maybe sometimes, an attorney takes pity and charges nothing at all knowing that a Public Defender won't even visit
the accused in jail for at least 6 months. 
Harley

What do you do? What did you do in this case?

 Also the last case you mentioned, I already forgot the details but it had something to do with an immigrant, a murder, he looked like a gangster -- you know, I'm going to have to check back because I can't remember the details, but I also wondered how he afforded a private attorney. I've run afoul with the law on a bull shit charge and though I was guilty the circumstance where definitely not the norm. Looking back I believe I would have done much better had I had a private attorney than a PD. 

[chaos]

Dear Pellius,
  Your first question works on two different planes so I will do my best to explain my honest answer:
  It is more important that my client received a fair trial if there were a Guilty Verdict.  That would mean, to me, that the system is working
as is designed.  I don't ever second guess myself in terms of "Did I do my utmost best in representing this person at trial?"  I always give my
best.
  However, if my client received an unfair trial yet despite this, there were a verdict of "Not Guilty" then I would be happy.  I do all I can to make a judge
give me a fair trial but much of that is out of the attorneys' hands.  Winning is important to me.  If I have a stupid judge and win despite his ludicrous
rulings, then more power to me and less power to a government that permits politics not merit, to decide who becomes a judge.
  I represented a young Jamaican fellow named Ruel Powell who was indicted on First Degree Aggravated Assault charges for both anally and vaginally
penetrating his 5 year old sister.  The young girl immediately after the alleged incident told family members and gave a video taped interview and
demonstrated with dolls just what she believed occurred. 
  At the trial, the Judge, through out the entire case made ridiculous rulings in favor of the State in a clear attempt to crucify my client.
  The alleged victim came in and testified.
  My client did NOT receive a fair trial.
  The verdict came back Not Guilty.  Was I happy?  Of course, who wouldn't be if they did my job?  When the government has a judge assisting them the
whole way and they still lose, you bet I take pride in shoving it down their bureaucratic necks.

  Your second question simply seeks my own personal opinion:
  If I were to get "someone off on a technicality" I would view that as a win.  I found the technicality, I told the State and they still couldn't stop me.
  The role of a Defense Attorney is not to "seek justice" but rather, ensure that an INJUSTICE in terms of the legality of the investigation, charge and trial
does not occur.  I am making the "world a better place" by keeping the government from jumping to conclusions and not proving their case according to the
rules.  To prevent them from cheating and cutting corners is to ensure that racism, corruption and ego do not destroy the integrity of the trial.
  As far as being on my death bed, I will be thinking of all the "Perfect Moments" I have experienced (especially lately).  I already know I did the right thing in
the courtroom so I won't waste any time on my death bed thinking about my career, but rather, the great family, friends, pets and loves I have experienced.
Harley

Would love to beat the fuck out of Ruel Powell.

Harley,
  How do you get your clients?  Do you see a case and offer services or do pieces of shit seek you out?

[Simple Simon]

Would love to beat the fuck out of Ruel Powell.

Harley,
  How do you get your clients?  Do you see a case and offer services or do pieces of shit seek you out?

awww... You cant say that, poor Ruel was victimised by the court, Harley against all odds got him a not guilty, he was then free to rekindle his relationship with his little sister and rebuild his life.

[Simple Simon]

Dear Pellius,
  Your first question works on two different planes so I will do my best to explain my honest answer:
  It is more important that my client received a fair trial if there were a Guilty Verdict.  That would mean, to me, that the system is working
as is designed.  I don't ever second guess myself in terms of "Did I do my utmost best in representing this person at trial?"  I always give my
best.
  However, if my client received an unfair trial yet despite this, there were a verdict of "Not Guilty" then I would be happy.  I do all I can to make a judge
give me a fair trial but much of that is out of the attorneys' hands.  Winning is important to me.  If I have a stupid judge and win despite his ludicrous
rulings, then more power to me and less power to a government that permits politics not merit, to decide who becomes a judge.
  I represented a young Jamaican fellow named Ruel Powell who was indicted on First Degree Aggravated Assault charges for both anally and vaginally
penetrating his 5 year old sister.  The young girl immediately after the alleged incident told family members and gave a video taped interview and
demonstrated with dolls just what she believed occurred.  
  At the trial, the Judge, through out the entire case made ridiculous rulings in favor of the State in a clear attempt to crucify my client.
  The alleged victim came in and testified.
  My client did NOT receive a fair trial.
  The verdict came back Not Guilty.  Was I happy?  Of course, who wouldn't be if they did my job?  When the government has a judge assisting them the
whole way and they still lose, you bet I take pride in shoving it down their bureaucratic necks.

  Your second question simply seeks my own personal opinion:
  If I were to get "someone off on a technicality" I would view that as a win.  I found the technicality, I told the State and they still couldn't stop me.
  The role of a Defense Attorney is not to "seek justice" but rather, ensure that an INJUSTICE in terms of the legality of the investigation, charge and trial
does not occur.  I am making the "world a better place" by keeping the government from jumping to conclusions and not proving their case according to the
rules.  To prevent them from cheating and cutting corners is to ensure that racism, corruption and ego do not destroy the integrity of the trial.
  As far as being on my death bed, I will be thinking of all the "Perfect Moments" I have experienced (especially lately).  I already know I did the right thing in
the courtroom so I won't waste any time on my death bed thinking about my career, but rather, the great family, friends, pets and loves I have experienced.
Harley

see this is where I have suspicions you are trolling, comments like that come across as its not just you doing your job its personal for you, you take pride in shoving it up the system just as much as your client was shoving it up his little sisters ass, you have indicated in your post that  you didn't disbelieve the little girls accusations yet you were happy that Ruel got a not guilty.
Then again why would someone troll about such an emotive subject.
As clever as you are Harley , for me there is something about you that just doesn't sit comfortably with me.

Oh, and for the record it wasn't his sister Harley, she was the daughter of a friend.
http://www.northjersey.com/news/jury-clears-paterson-man-after-trial-on-charges-of-sexually-assaulting-girl-1.1040267

Shame you couldn't remember that fact in such an emotive case, but then again that just re-enforces the argument that its all about you and not the client.

[Princess L]

  I represented a young Jamaican fellow named Ruel Powell who was indicted on First Degree Aggravated Assault charges for both anally and vaginally
penetrating his 5 year old sister.  The young girl immediately after the alleged incident told family members and gave a video taped interview and
demonstrated with dolls just what she believed occurred. 
  At the trial, the Judge, through out the entire case made ridiculous rulings in favor of the State in a clear attempt to crucify my client.
  The alleged victim came in and testified.
  My client did NOT receive a fair trial.
  The verdict came back Not Guilty.  Was I happy?  Of course, who wouldn't be if they did my job?  When the government has a judge assisting them the
whole way and they still lose, you bet I take pride in shoving it down their bureaucratic necks.

  Your second question simply seeks my own personal opinion:
  If I were to get "someone off on a technicality" I would view that as a win.  I found the technicality, I told the State and they still couldn't stop me.
  The role of a Defense Attorney is not to "seek justice" but rather, ensure that an INJUSTICE in terms of the legality of the investigation, charge and trial
does not occur.  I am making the "world a better place" by keeping the government from jumping to conclusions and not proving their case according to the
rules.  To prevent them from cheating and cutting corners is to ensure that racism, corruption and ego do not destroy the integrity of the trial.
  As far as being on my death bed, I will be thinking of all the "Perfect Moments" I have experienced (especially lately).  I already know I did the right thing in
the courtroom so I won't waste any time on my death bed thinking about my career, but rather, the great family, friends, pets and loves I have experienced.
Harley

This is by far one of the most disturbing things I have ever read on Getbig.

[Simple Simon]

This is by far one of the most disturbing things I have ever read on Getbig.

Its taken a while, but I think people are finally seeing him for what he is.

[HarleyBreite]

Be There,
  The girl was his half sister.
  You don't seem to like my responses and that is fine.
  These are difficult topics and make people uncomfortable and that is why most
tend to refuse to give BOTH sides a sincere and honest evaluation.
  Clearly, you and Princess L are disgusted by what a Defense Attorney does for a living
and that is your prerogative. We live in a free society and I wouldn't wish to deny you or
anyone else their opinion.
  However, before you judge someone else's character, such as you and Princess L have done to me,
remember a few things:
  1)  I never said I wasn't morally flawed.
  2)  I know of no one else who isn't flawed.
  3)  I never said that my job demanded that people respect or like me.
  4)  I NEVER said that I believed the victim in the Ruel Powel case- Her own mother and aunt came in and testified
that the girl was a habitual liar.
  5)  The reason people ask and I answer about such topics is to openly and intelligently discuss what some find
are interesting or thought provoking topics.  It's not meant to draw the wrath of others.  You seem to take this quite
personally and lash out at me.  That's fine, to a point.
Harley

[HarleyBreite]

Its taken a while, but I think people are finally seeing him for what he is.

Have I suddenly now changed?  Have I responded any differently today than I have before?
You simply don't like me or the topics when they diverge from your own opinions.
I can't figure out why you continue to come here just to spout angry, personal attacks.
I've seen that you can offer insightful and intelligent thoughts but here, your disdain for me
seems to supercede all else.
Why continue to come here?  It's a rhetorical question. 

[OB1]

I think they got difficulties to understand the fact that being guilty or not guilty at court and everything from the beginning until the final verdict has nothing to do with morality or justice.
Personally I would like it to be different, but that's just the way it is.

[Simple Simon]

I think they got difficulties to understand the fact that being guilty or not guilty at court and everything from the beginning until the final verdict has nothing to do with morality or justice.
Personally I would like it to be different, but that's just the way it is.

I understand it perfectly, if you read my other posts (blame the game not the player) you would know that.
What I have issues with is that Harley appears to relish the fact that he got a not guilty when its likely his client wasn't.

Its all about Harley getting one over on "the man" rather than seeking justice.

[Simple Simon]

Be There,
  The girl was his half sister.
  You don't seem to like my responses and that is fine.
  These are difficult topics and make people uncomfortable and that is why most
tend to refuse to give BOTH sides a sincere and honest evaluation.
  Clearly, you and Princess L are disgusted by what a Defense Attorney does for a living
and that is your prerogative. We live in a free society and I wouldn't wish to deny you or
anyone else their opinion.
  However, before you judge someone else's character, such as you and Princess L have done to me,
remember a few things:
  1)  I never said I wasn't morally flawed.
  2)  I know of no one else who isn't flawed.
  3)  I never said that my job demanded that people respect or like me.
  4)  I NEVER said that I believed the victim in the Ruel Powel case- Her own mother and aunt came in and testified
that the girl was a habitual liar.
  5)  The reason people ask and I answer about such topics is to openly and intelligently discuss what some find
are interesting or thought provoking topics.  It's not meant to draw the wrath of others.  You seem to take this quite
personally and lash out at me.  That's fine, to a point.
Harley

a 5 year old girl being able to demonstrate on a doll what had happened to her indicates strongly to me it happened, how many 5 year olds would be able to describe anal and vaginal sex?

[OB1]

I understand it perfectly, if you read my other posts (blame the game not the player) you would know that.
What I have issues with is that Harley appears to relish the fact that he got a not guilty when its likely his client wasn't.

Its all about Harley getting one over on "the man" rather than seeking justice.

To me it looks like dedication to the job of defending itself rather than dedication to justice.
Which is a requirement for this job imo.
If you want justice it is probably the wrong career choice.
Of course it's often morally wrong in a lot of cases.

[Simple Simon]

To me it looks like dedication to the job of defending itself rather than dedication to justice.
Which is a requirement for this job imo.
If you want justice it is probably the wrong career choice.
Of course it's often morally wrong in a lot of cases.

agreed, you can do the job without the need to relish in the fact that you are doing everything within your power to allow criminals to get away with all manner of offences.
Some people might be able to live with the fact that they let a guy go who raped a child, I myself couldnt.
Even worse that that, some people are overjoyed and feel pride in the fact that they allowed that to happen if it means it looks good on their CV.

[OB1]

agreed, you can do the job without the need to relish in the fact that you are doing everything within your power to allow criminals to get away with all manner of offences.

Just need enough money and influence.
Nothing will happen to you.

[HarleyBreite]

I understand it perfectly, if you read my other posts (blame the game not the player) you would know that.
What I have issues with is that Harley appears to relish the fact that he got a not guilty when its likely his client wasn't.

Its all about Harley getting one over on "the man" rather than seeking justice.

Dear BeThere,
  "When it's likely his client wasn't (not guilty)"
   Were you there?  I wasn't either.  There are only 2 people who know for sure and one is a 5 year old girl who by her own
mother's sworn testimony, is a habitual liar who showed no signs of any penetration to her anus or vagina.
   Did you read the entire file?  No.  I did and even then,  I couldn't say for certainty whether or not Ruel did it.  It's not my
job to know whether or not he did it. 
Harley

[HarleyBreite]

Be There,
  I don't have nor need a CV.
  You can write whatever you like, I am tired of responding to what are just personal attacks rather than
polite philosophical or ethical questions presented in a non-personal manner.
Harley

[HarleyBreite]

Hey Guys,
  While I had hoped to use today to catch up on all of your recent questions, I find myself too spent and
feeling negative about this whole thing.
  I came to GetBig for thought provoking, interesting and fun discussion.
  I get enough death threats, hate mail and negativity from the rest of the world.
  I don't need to solicit it here.
  And before Be There starts cheering, this is not a "meltdown" as I think you call it.
  It's an honest statement that I am tired of the recent personal attacks and will come back when I feel
more positive.
  It does strike me that the majority of the topics here are about my job, which I NEVER mind nor have any
trouble responding to.  It's odd that few questions are asked about bodybuilding and its related topics.  Again, I
am just happy to be here and a part of a neat thread but pretty much all topics are open for discussion just in case
someone gets bored with all this lawyer stuff.
Harley

[Sokolsky]

agreed, you can do the job without the need to relish in the fact that you are doing everything within your power to allow criminals to get away with all manner of offences.
Some people might be able to live with the fact that they let a guy go who raped a child, I myself couldnt.
Even worse that that, some people are overjoyed and feel pride in the fact that they allowed that to happen if it means it looks good on their CV.

You are overly sensitive to what Harley's job entails.

Your last remark is not unique to his job, and occurs in many if not all trades and professions.
Look at manufacturers who cut corners to speed up production, or the use of cheaper lesser reliable produce (not always the case, but you get the gist of it). We live in a prestige driven society, and cherning out numbers is the norm. As a result ethics and norms may become rather fluid for the better or worse, which are to be kept in check by institutions and regulations.

Now ofcourse it is important that Harley does his job well, if he has a poor history of cases in the sense of negligence or blatent bias not only will he not be hired he will also not be deemed reliable. This will negatively effect his job, and credibility of his profession as a whole. A part of Harley's job is do deal with otherwise morally difficult cases, if he was to be biased and not perform his job well, this wouldn't only reflect poorly of his work ethic, but also detract from the justice system as a whole. As has been mentioned several times prior.

To that end, I doubt Harley is very much invested in the 'personal' lives of his clients. But more so in generating an unbiased outcome, either in favor or against. Being able to detach and look at situations objectively is a conscious decision and required for such a job. Just like doctors need to distance themselves from clients as otherwise they wouldn't be able to function properly. This doesn't necessarily mean Harley doesn't have his own opinion about cases, simply that he's professional enough to not express it to others, which may affect an outcome.


Being a defense attorney isn't for everyone, just like factory work or being a CEO isn't for everyone.
Guaranteed though, that you'd be happy having someone like Harley at your side if you were in trouble, just to give a nod to the hipocrisy displayed here.

[HarleyBreite]

Dear Sokolsky,
  Wonderfully stated and very much appreciated.
Harley

[Simple Simon]

Dear BeThere,
  "When it's likely his client wasn't (not guilty)"
   Were you there?  I wasn't either.  There are only 2 people who know for sure and one is a 5 year old girl who by her own
mother's sworn testimony, is a habitual liar who showed no signs of any penetration to her anus or vagina.
   Did you read the entire file?  No.  I did and even then,  I couldn't say for certainty whether or not Ruel did it.  It's not my
job to know whether or not he did it.  
Harley

and only now do you enter additional information to bolster your argument,
That last post is a little bit more than

I represented a young Jamaican fellow named Ruel Powell who was indicted on First Degree Aggravated Assault charges for both anally and vaginally
penetrating his 5 year old sister.  The young girl immediately after the alleged incident told family members and gave a video taped interview and
demonstrated with dolls just what she believed occurred.  
 

The paragraph above pretty much nails your client to the wall.

[Sokolsky]

and only now do you enter additional information to bolster your argument,
That last post is a little bit more than

The paragraph above pretty much nails your client to the wall.

It's hardly reasonable to expect Harley to provide in-detail information about cases.
If the case truly interests you, you'd do well to inform yourself prior to providing criticism.

The latter paragraph you quoted does in fact not nail his client to the wall.
He simply stated his client was indicted [:formally accused] of "First Degree Aggravated Assault charges for both anally and vaginally
penetrating his 5 year old sister.  The young girl immediately after the alleged incident told family members and gave a video taped interview and
demonstrated with dolls just what she believed occurred.", which in itself is not a judgement or verdict.

[Simple Simon]

Hey Guys,
  While I had hoped to use today to catch up on all of your recent questions, I find myself too spent and
feeling negative about this whole thing.
  I came to GetBig for thought provoking, interesting and fun discussion.
  I get enough death threats, hate mail and negativity from the rest of the world.
  I don't need to solicit it here.
  And before Be There starts cheering, this is not a "meltdown" as I think you call it.
  It's an honest statement that I am tired of the recent personal attacks and will come back when I feel
more positive.
  It does strike me that the majority of the topics here are about my job, which I NEVER mind nor have any
trouble responding to.  It's odd that few questions are asked about bodybuilding and its related topics.  Again, I
am just happy to be here and a part of a neat thread but pretty much all topics are open for discussion just in case
someone gets bored with all this lawyer stuff.
Harley

Come on Harley, not a page ago you were thanking me for a comment, now because i disagree with you you spit your dummy out like a spoilt child, it seems to be a pattern of your behaviour in this thread, people climb up your ass you push back, people kick your ass you cry like a baby.

[pellius]

Dear BeThere,
  "When it's likely his client wasn't (not guilty)"
   Were you there?  I wasn't either.  There are only 2 people who know for sure and one is a 5 year old girl who by her own
mother's sworn testimony, is a habitual liar who showed no signs of any penetration to her anus or vagina.
   Did you read the entire file?  No.  I did and even then,  I couldn't say for certainty whether or not Ruel did it.  It's not my
job to know whether or not he did it. 
Harley

If a five year old girl is raped that way there has to be physical evidence.

Was there?

[Kahn.N.Singh]

Dear Harley Breite,

You need not remove yourself to a locus ponytailedtiae to avoid or reduce attempts to blacken your character (unless it is to repent for your criminal coif). You're right to feel a sense of satisfaction in thwarting judges who with unabashed alacrity aim to crook the arm, and tilt the scales, of Lady Justice by distorting the rule of law.  

BTW: Not too long ago, I was called to jury duty in White Plains, NY, for a similar case (child sexual abuse). The voir dire turned into the Kahn show, with yours truly attracting and repelling both the prosecutors (two of them, a female and male -- the latter seemed inexperienced) and the defense, as well as the judge (who had to intervene during questioning because I was running circles around the attorneys' inquiries – she was a suitable MILF, and clearly charmed by my display of playful intelligence ).
      My interrogation during jury selection lasted nearly 30 minutes! I seemed to be both the ideal and worst kind of juror. The gallery, which had at least 100 people who didn’t want to be in court, was abuzz and saying things out loud like, "He's right," and "He knows what he's talking about."

I was bounced (but not before giving out a bunch of high fives on my way to the bathroom during the break).

Ultimately, the scumbag Dominican rapist was found guilty.

[Simple Simon]

Dear Harley Breite,

You need not remove yourself to a locus ponytailedtiae to avoid or reduce attempts to blacken your character (unless it is to repent for your criminal coif). You're right to feel a sense of satisfaction in thwarting judges who, with unabashed alacrity aim to crook the arm, and tilt the scales, of Lady Justice by distorting the rule of law.  

BTW: Not too long ago, I was called to jury duty in White Plains, NY, for a similar case (child sexual abuse). The voir dire turned into the Kahn show, with yours truly attracting and repelling both the prosecutors (two of them, a female and male -- the latter seemed inexperienced) and the defense, as well as the judge (who had to intervene during questioning because I was running circles around the attorneys' inquiries – she was a suitable MILF, and clearly charmed by my display of playful intelligence ).
      My interrogation during jury selection lasted nearly 30 minutes! I seemed to be both the ideal and worst kind of juror. The gallery, which had at least 100 people who didn’t want to be in court, was abuzz and saying things out loud like, "He's right," and "He knows what he's talking about."

I was bounced (but not before giving out a bunch of high fives on my way to the bathroom during the break).

Ultimately, the scumbag Dominican rapist was found guilty.

And what would you have called him if he had been found not guilty?