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Author Topic: MOST IMPRESSIVE NATURALS PICS!!!  (Read 117679 times)
MadisonWI
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« Reply #125 on: March 24, 2006, 10:35:15 AM »


Not really...Africans are naturally larger and more muscular. During the slave days slave owners would selectivly breed their slaves so as they were larger and stronger to be able to do more work. They would breed the largest black men with the largest black women..This is why we see so many blacks above 6'5"...Oh yes..It's definitily genetics. 300 years of selective breeding!

That's a bunch of crap.  They didn't selectively breed slaves.  In fact, most slaveowners WANTED their slaves to get married since they felt they were less likely to try to escape.  Maybe a FEW tried.  But to say that blacks are bigger because of that is a joke.  If that were the case, they would have had to castrate that smaller males and sterilize the smaller black females to prevent them from breeding and "polluting the population".  Dude, slaves were screwing left and right when they got back to their "houses".  There was no systematic "selective breeding".

Black men are not generally taller than whites either.  If you are assuming this because of all of the tall blacks in the NBA (which is where I think your premise comes from) then you have to try to think more "big picture" than the NBA.  What about the classic moniker "7 foot white center"Huh  I would be willing to bet there are MORE 7 foot white guys than black guys in the NBA.

If you think that "300 years" of "selective breeding" occured and would do so much to increase size, then wouldn't "300 years of poor diet" cause blacks to be UNDERSIZED??  Do you think the ol' plantation owner was giving the slaves he wanted bigger, extra food and healthcare??  Prenatal vitamins???  Slaves ate for SHIT.

Owned.
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MadisonWI
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« Reply #126 on: March 24, 2006, 10:38:17 AM »

Here's my take........

Blacks aren't more muscular. 

They have naturally less bodyfat due to the climates that blacks and white typically came from.  Not to mention they have darker skin (obviously).

Less bodyfat and darker skin make for a more muscular LOOKING person.

But if blacks were more muscular, you wouldn't have the WHITEST of WHITE guys from Eastern Europe DOMINATING powerlifting events.
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LuciusFox
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« Reply #127 on: March 24, 2006, 01:09:20 PM »

 Hahahahahaha...I have seen this thread on Getbig 10000x  Grin Have fun boys, I'll make you some lemonade for when you're ready to come back inside.
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Johnny Apollo
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« Reply #128 on: March 24, 2006, 01:13:31 PM »

That's a bunch of crap.  They didn't selectively breed slaves.  In fact, most slaveowners WANTED their slaves to get married since they felt they were less likely to try to escape.  Maybe a FEW tried.  But to say that blacks are bigger because of that is a joke.  If that were the case, they would have had to castrate that smaller males and sterilize the smaller black females to prevent them from breeding and "polluting the population".  Dude, slaves were screwing left and right when they got back to their "houses".  There was no systematic "selective breeding".

Black men are not generally taller than whites either.  If you are assuming this because of all of the tall blacks in the NBA (which is where I think your premise comes from) then you have to try to think more "big picture" than the NBA.  What about the classic moniker "7 foot white center"Huh  I would be willing to bet there are MORE 7 foot white guys than black guys in the NBA.

If you think that "300 years" of "selective breeding" occured and would do so much to increase size, then wouldn't "300 years of poor diet" cause blacks to be UNDERSIZED??  Do you think the ol' plantation owner was giving the slaves he wanted bigger, extra food and healthcare??  Prenatal vitamins???  Slaves ate for SHIT.

Owned.


1.Maybe they did not selectivly breed them however the work they did was extremly tough and many of them died from being overworked. The slaves who were stronger and more fit would of survived and the weaker smaller ones would of died. So the stronger and larger ones were more likely to breed and pass their genes on.

2.Bad nutrition is not inhereted since it's phenotype and not genotypical change. 2 people could of lived the first 20 years of their life with terrible nutrition and be under 5'0" because of that and then have a child who is 6'0". Bad Nutrition can't be inhereted.
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NYCDVR
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« Reply #129 on: March 24, 2006, 04:36:21 PM »

Alex its Eugen Sandow the  father of Modern Bodybuilding

He was a strongman performer in the 1890's He wrote several books on weight training

He also organized the first bodybuildinng contest ever in 1901

Oh yeah and he is the guy whose bronze statue they hand to the winner of the MR Olympia contest every year

You post the blond myth and serge nubret as natural and don't reconize Sandow? Maybe you should look a little further into things.

Or just flame away and speak on subjects you don't know


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« Reply #130 on: March 24, 2006, 04:40:49 PM »

Alex its Eugen Sandow the  father of Modern Bodybuilding

He was a strongman performer in the 1890's He wrote several books on weight training

He also organized the first bodybuildinng contest ever in 1901

Oh yeah and he is the guy whose bronze statue they hand to the winner of the MR Olympia contest every year

You post the blond myth and serge nubret as natural and don't reconize Sandow? Maybe you should look a little further into things.

Or just flame away and speak on subjects you don't know




I know who that is I just denounce any guy man as a bodybuilding legend!
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just push some weight!
The Luke
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« Reply #131 on: March 24, 2006, 06:00:22 PM »

Looks like I'm finishing that article on ethnicity/race and how they relate to bodybuilding just in time... you guys don't seem to undestand anything about heredity or eugenics.

Look for the article late next week on the Natural board.

The Luke
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Johnny Apollo
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« Reply #132 on: March 25, 2006, 04:57:00 AM »

Looks like I'm finishing that article on ethnicity/race and how they relate to bodybuilding just in time... you guys don't seem to undestand anything about heredity or eugenics.

Look for the article late next week on the Natural board.

The Luke


1.I know plenty about heredity.

2.What the fuck does Eugenics have to do with it? Do you even know what eugenics is?
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The Luke
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« Reply #133 on: March 25, 2006, 08:31:18 AM »

Yes I do...

My point was that some of the population pressures mentioned in this thread as being DYSgenic for bodybuilding genes, well, simply... aren't.

The Luke
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Johnny Apollo
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« Reply #134 on: March 25, 2006, 08:51:10 AM »

Yes I do...

My point was that some of the population pressures mentioned in this thread as being DYSgenic for bodybuilding genes, well, simply... aren't.

The Luke

I don't know what you're talking about. Dysgenics is the weakening of a populations genetics due to weak natural selection. For instance WW1 would of caused dysgenics due to the fitter individuals going to war(and dying) and the weaker less fit one's staying home because they were not fit for military purpose thus the porliferation of weaker genetics.
Give me an example of what you mean by population pressures not being dysgenic as mentioned in this thread.

Secondly Eugenics is the selective breeding of those with "Favorable" traits and not breeding those without them so those with favorable traits are more common within a population. I don't see how this has any relation to this topic except for White slave owners selectivly breeding blacks which I myself admited might not of happened.

However this still brings us to the fact that it was not easy being a slave and the work they did was extremly difficult. MILLIONS of africans died on the trip to america and during the work they had to do. The stronger slaves would of survived long enough to breed and the weaker ones would of died out before they could of passed their weaker genetics on to the next generation. Thus the proliferation of "stronger" genetics was the result.


I'm not sure you have enough knowledge of population genetics/Evolutionary biology to write an article on the implications of race differences in bodybuilding.
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analcandy
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« Reply #135 on: March 25, 2006, 09:21:48 AM »

reeves was probably natural. he had the structure of a god.
nubret-no way. theres no way to have that kind of size and fullness AND 100% lean ultra deep abs at the same time with out the use of JUICE

you are gay.
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SteelePegasus
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« Reply #136 on: March 25, 2006, 10:03:21 AM »

Looks like I'm finishing that article on ethnicity/race and how they relate to bodybuilding just in time... you guys don't seem to undestand anything about heredity or eugenics.

Look for the article late next week on the Natural board.

The Luke

Please provide a link I would love to read it
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Here comes the money shot
SteelePegasus
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« Reply #137 on: March 25, 2006, 10:08:34 AM »

Mr. Alexx we are all waiting for that picture of yours.  Show us that all of your talking can be backed up.


Those Arthur Harris pictures are sick
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Here comes the money shot
The Luke
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« Reply #138 on: March 25, 2006, 03:17:03 PM »

I don't know what you're talking about. Dysgenics is the weakening of a populations genetics due to weak natural selection. For instance WW1 would of caused dysgenics due to the fitter individuals going to war(and dying) and the weaker less fit one's staying home because they were not fit for military purpose thus the porliferation of weaker genetics.
Give me an example of what you mean by population pressures not being dysgenic as mentioned in this thread.

Secondly Eugenics is the selective breeding of those with "Favorable" traits and not breeding those without them so those with favorable traits are more common within a population. I don't see how this has any relation to this topic except for White slave owners selectivly breeding blacks which I myself admited might not of happened.

However this still brings us to the fact that it was not easy being a slave and the work they did was extremly difficult. MILLIONS of africans died on the trip to america and during the work they had to do. The stronger slaves would of survived long enough to breed and the weaker ones would of died out before they could of passed their weaker genetics on to the next generation. Thus the proliferation of "stronger" genetics was the result.


I'm not sure you have enough knowledge of population genetics/Evolutionary biology to write an article on the implications of race differences in bodybuilding.

Whoa... whoa...there Johnny Apollo,

Don't you know how to ask for clarification of things you don't understand? Or do you prefer taking umbridge and then launching into unfounded diatribes? Ever post of yours that I read is so defensive and aggressive it encourages me more and more to read less of them in future.

The point I was trying to make, (without pre-empting the theme of my article) was that events such as the slave trade, WW1 and WW2 simply don't have the kind of impact necessary to cause even micro-evolution among populations, despite what people think. The world wars combined only had evolutionary effects for... say 30 years, the slave trade (as it relates to African Americans) for maybe 300 years. Compare that with the cold adaption among northern European whites which lasted approx. 30,000 years. That is the kind of timescale needed to substantially concentrate genetic traits.

I'll go into more detail in my article.

As for your last point:
"I'm not sure you have enough knowledge of population genetics/Evolutionary biology to write an article on the implications of race differences in bodybuilding."
   ...is that your considered opinion based on BOTH the sentences I posted in this thread? Or ar you psychic?

The Luke
 
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bmacsys
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« Reply #139 on: March 25, 2006, 05:57:18 PM »

He was about as natural as a potato with a dick. He used to come to Bill Pearls gym in Pasadena in the mid to late 70's with a boat load of crap from Europe trying to get rid of it. I was there. Bill didn't know a thing but I do know if he found out Nubret would have been a bloody stump!!

You trained at Bill Pearl's gym. He looked rugged. He would have kicked Nubret's ass for real?
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« Reply #140 on: March 25, 2006, 05:58:42 PM »

I read an interview of with him in MuscleMag and he denies ever even touching a drug in his life.

Charlie manson said he never killed anybody also.
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« Reply #141 on: March 25, 2006, 06:00:04 PM »

Reeves was strong for a natural too!

Reeves was the greatest bodybuilder of all time.
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« Reply #142 on: March 25, 2006, 06:01:04 PM »

reeves is the only natural out of those pics.

Man, to have Reeves genetics!
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« Reply #143 on: March 25, 2006, 06:04:18 PM »

BDJ: Could you relay your own experience with drug use?


Sergio Olivia: This is an area of great interest for people. I don't care who wants to take steroids, because that's a personal choice... that's his life. Now, today, everybody has access to them. I even saw in one of the big magazines that Arnold denies having used them, but Arnold was one of the first to bring steroids over to America. And everybody in the old days used them: Zane, Columbu, myself, Arnold, Larry Scott, Harold Poole, Dave Draper, and even Steve Reeves. There's no way to deny it. It wasn't much, nothing like today. But the development of drugs is much different. I used decca and dianabol, and that was something really big at the time; and decca was not considered that bad. It was even prescribed by doctors to help make your bones strong. Today you have guys weighing 200 pounds, and six months later they weigh 250-300 pounds! So you know these guys are taking something unbelievable. When they say they haven't taken any thing, you know that it's phony.

http://www.ironmagazineforums.com/history/topic/46705-1.html



Sergio is full of shit. That story has been debunked over and over. Those drugs weren't even available until 1962, 1963 time period. Reeves last competition was 1952.
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The House that Ruth built
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« Reply #144 on: March 25, 2006, 06:13:18 PM »

Bill pearl natural?

He already had a good body as a natural in the late 50s but you can clearly see a big change in the following years.

Bill in one of his fitness books I got at the library said he took a steroid in the early 1960's. He gained weight and size but said he didn't like the way it made him look. So he experimented that one time and that was it. The book was published in 1985. I read in a forum in susequent later print runs of the book that chapter was deleted as a result of steroids being made a controlled substance by federal law. I believe him because to this day he has a great physique.
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The House that Ruth built
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« Reply #145 on: March 25, 2006, 06:14:58 PM »

He was. I trained with him when I was a teenager for three years.

Ever see Dave Johns or Chris dickerson training?
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The House that Ruth built
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« Reply #146 on: March 25, 2006, 06:20:15 PM »

Finally a voice of reason.


Size and strength have EVERYTHING to do with steroids in bodybuilding. McEnroe wasn't trying to get bigger. He was a fucking tennis player. Bodybuilders ARE using the sauce to get bigger and stronger. Roll Eyes
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The House that Ruth built
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« Reply #147 on: March 25, 2006, 06:22:33 PM »

Yep, steroids have been around for so long. Longer than people are willing to accept

From World Anabolic Review by P. Grunding and M. Bachmann:

"Dianabol is an oral anabolic which was developed in 1956 by the American Dr. John Ziegler in collaboration with Ciba-Geigy Company. In the US it was introduced in the market in 1960 and within a short time it was available in many countries."

Even earlier...From Anabolics by William Llewellin:

"The first solid scientific experiments in this erea, wich eventually led to the discovery and replication of testosterone (and related androgens), where undertaken int the 1800's. During this  century a number of animal experiments where published most of which involved the removal and/or implantation of testicular material from/in a subject. By the turn of the century, scientists were able to produce the first experimental androgen injection. Chemists finally synthesized the structure of testosterone in the mid 1930's, sparking a new wave of interest in this hormone."

If steroids were available in that period, then my conclusion is that they were used in that period. Heck they didnt know much of any side affects..they probaly took it as a dietary supplement.


Yes, but its common knowledge bodybuilders started using them in the 1962/1963 time period.
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The House that Ruth built
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« Reply #148 on: March 25, 2006, 06:25:27 PM »

Reeves retired in 1950 , 6 years before the first oral steroid was produced ( Dianabol ) by Ciba labs and Dr John Ziegler , and his weight at while competing was 215lbs and he remained that for years , after he retired to pursue an acting career , the directors where always asking him to drop weight , so your assesment that he got huge is backwards , durring the mid 50s and early 60s he actually got smaller , when asked directly if he ever took steroids Reeves said outright no , he never even heard of them until the mid 60s , and steroids didn't make their way into the competitive bodybuilding scene until around 1960 and Bill Pearl did admit in Muscle & Fitness he used Dinabol and was one of the first bodybuilders to do so.

All of what you posted is true. Reeves had the greatest physique ever. Not the biggest but the ideal physique. He built it before steroids were readily available. Why do people have to besmirch his reputation which is spotless?
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The House that Ruth built
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« Reply #149 on: March 25, 2006, 06:26:48 PM »

damn Reeves was a strong sob. thats 160 pounds! Shocked


He was VERY strong.
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