Mike Mentzer - Discussion

[Straw Man]

Also, I think Mentzer's dieting advice is basically worthless

Not shitting on the  guy.  He had an amazing build and definitely had good ideas on the need to lower the number of sets, using full extension and contraction, etc..  Not sure that anyone really needs to go to beyond failure with negatives, etc..   Rest pause is a good idea but not a fan of how he did it.  I like the going to failure (or where you would fail on the next rep) and then resting 10-30 seconds and doing a few more reps and maybe doing that once more (ala DC training).  That only works well for some exercises.  Mechanical drop sets are another way to raise intensity without killing your joints.  

[NarcissisticDeity]

 

[NarcissisticDeity]

 

[NarcissisticDeity]

 

[NarcissisticDeity]

 

[NarcissisticDeity]

 

[NarcissisticDeity]

 

[NarcissisticDeity]

Apparently he wasn't

[WalterWhite]

Great pics nd MM was thick!

[NarcissisticDeity]

 

[NarcissisticDeity]

 

[NarcissisticDeity]

 

[NarcissisticDeity]

 

[NarcissisticDeity]

 

[oldschoolfan]

danny padilla always had good things to say about mike in any interview he gave and mike was brought up

[Never1AShow]

Was some kinda Mentzer time capsule or coffin recently opened? 

Without a doubt the most disappointing sighting at Gold's Gym back in the day

[Eric2]

Mentzer trained the entire body 3x a week at the time he won Mr America and I think Ray did the same thing as well (fully body 3x a week) when he won in 1979

Some recent studies have shown that muscle protein synthesis only takes 24 to 48 hours (Jerry Brainum wrote about this in his newsletter earlier this year and had cited the studies. He also said that more experienced trainers tend to be closer to 24 hours.) 

Mentzer's later concepts of very short and very infrequent workouts seemed a bit loony to me even at the time he was promoting them. 

I think the low volume of true working sets per muscle group (~ 4 to 8 depending on the body party and frequency) makes a lot of sense and working each bodypart at least 2 x a week and 3 x if you can handle it.

This is the summary of the article from Brainums site (appliedmetabolics.com)

I won't post the entire article since it is long and it's also a subcription site

Kinda makes sense to a point. I know if I really bomb large muscle groups I have to take several days before I can hit them again. Such as legs chest and back. Yet and arms and calves can be hit three times per week. In fact the smaller muscle groups respond better when I train them more frequently. Large multijoint movements take severL days nd sometimes a full week to recover from.

[Straw Man]

Kinda makes sense to a point. I know if I really bomb large muscle groups I have to take several days before I can hit them again. Such as legs chest and back. Yet and arms and calves can be hit three times per week. In fact the smaller muscle groups respond better when I train them more frequently. Large multijoint movements take severL days nd sometimes a full week to recover from.

yeah, that's the thing.  You really can't bomb anything in terms of volume (I have the same problem too, I always want to do more)

you have to do just enough to stimulate muscle protein synthesis and then stop

another example of the premise here:  https://www.t-nation.com/training/the-best-damn-workout-plan-for-natural-lifters

right now I'm doing upper body Monday, Wednesday , Friday

and lower body Tuesday, Saturday

I prefer slightly more volume on leg day and need a bit more time to recover

Also, you can toggle the volume for various upper body muscle groups on M,W,F or change the rep scheme

[The Scott]

While I still think Mentzer was a very smart individual and waaaaay above average in that respect for a bodybuilder, I still must take into account that he took AAS.  Without the drugs, he would likely have been a good natural. With them, he was a great competitive bodybuilder.  He freely admitted taking AAS but I do not recall him ever quoting his dosage/frequency rates but again, Mike Mentzer was a great competitive bodybuilder in a time many think was the golden era for not just AAS enhanced bodybuilders but all of competitive bodybuilding.

It would be nice if there were a return to sanity.  And yeah, I realize using the word "sanity" in a thread about Mike is a bit of a dichotomy. 

Brooks Kubik is another author on training that thinks like Mentzer in that hard, infrequent training is the way to go.   His concern is primarily strength training and I can't fault him on his choice but he also speaks of size and strength.  Bodybuilding is more of an afterthought to him, if it is a thought at all.

[dj181]

^^^^ he actually did say what he was taking and it was this.... 400 my of deca every 10 days and 5 dbol a day

and yep, you can train arms more often but righ now II'm doing very heavytraining 1-3 reps so tthere's no fuckngway I could ttrain stric curl like that 3 times a week or even twice a week

[Griffith]

He definitely had a unique and very powerful look.

[beakdoctor]

I forgot just how good he looked at one point in his career. Unreal, like an action figure. Alot of these picsites serve to hilight just how far off he was in 1980. He actually looked alot better in 79. He over dieter and lost alot of his thickness without necessarily getting leaner. His subsequent mental breAK down was more of a result of his drug use than the result of the Olympia. No doubt his reliance on methamphetamines reduced his coping abilities and his perceptions of reality.

[FREAKgeek]

Brooks Kubik is another author on training that thinks like Mentzer in that hard, infrequent training is the way to go.   His concern is primarily strength training and I can't fault him on his choice but he also speaks of size and strength.  Bodybuilding is more of an afterthought to him, if it is a thought at all.

and Brooks nearly crippled himself with that mindset

[FREAKgeek]

says it all right there.

Mike did all he could. You just can't alter the genetics.

[Vince B]

Here is an edited photo I took at the 1980 Mr Olympia. Mike looks like the winner here but he didn't do so well in the comparisons and placed a disappointing 5th.

He followed the philosophy of Ayn Rand so figured he had the one correct theory about training. His whole world collapsed after

this contest. Mike was an exceptional writer and one of the few to embrace a comprehensive philosophy that he lived by.