Author Topic: Gironda Training  (Read 6952 times)

JPM

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Gironda Training
« on: June 09, 2006, 02:07:10 PM »
T-nation.com has an interesting article on some of Gironda's training and diet methods. Very interesting stuff. Pic of Larry Scott doing knuckles-in dips on a 'V' dipping bar. Mentioned 'V' bars before as an ideal  piece of equipment that offers  many different means of doing the common dip. Super wide to very narrow, each affects the chest (and the rest of the upper body) with new angles. But rather than me trying to explain them in my less than perfect way, the article & photos give much better examples. Good Luck.

Hedgehog

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Re: Gironda Training
« Reply #1 on: June 09, 2006, 02:12:35 PM »
As empty as paradise

pumpster

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Re: Gironda Training
« Reply #2 on: June 09, 2006, 02:52:28 PM »
Gironda and Arthur Jones were two of the only real innovators. I'm not big on dips both because they're not particularly effective and because the V-bar version's much better, both for both chest and triceps work.

Another Gironda fave that i've previously mentioned is the drag curl. Ron Kosloff's a nice guy and knowledgeable of the Gironda methods; he continues to sell Vince's courses and diet supplements.

Unfortunately Vince was never a promoter or good businessman and died with no money even though guys like Weider looked up to him. Weider even asked Larry Scott to install a version of one of Vince's machines in his own home gym.

mombasa3

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Re: Gironda Training
« Reply #3 on: June 09, 2006, 03:46:37 PM »
Gironda had some great ideas.  I read the article earlier in the day and unfortunatly I had already worked out.  I have never seen the wide grip bench press to neck movement used in the gym ever.  Has anyone here used this movement before?  I will try it on Monday and see how it goes.  I also appreciate the fact that Christian Thibaudeau took the time and effort to put that article together, but then again, that guy (Christian) has some great ideas and seems to be a wonderful trainer. 

pumpster

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Re: Gironda Training
« Reply #4 on: June 09, 2006, 04:34:40 PM »
Quote
  I also appreciate the fact that Christian Thibaudeau took the time and effort to put that article together, but then again, that guy (Christian) has some great ideas and seems to be a wonderful trainer.
Actually it's very much in the interests of guys like Thibaudeau & Polloquin to learn of older alternatives that are invariably re-introduced as "new and improved". Gironda co-invented the German Volume Training idea, now promoted by some current trainers such as Polloquin.

JPM

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Re: Gironda Training
« Reply #5 on: June 09, 2006, 04:53:06 PM »
The BP to the neck (actually lightly touching the neck where it meets with the upper chest), with the extra wide grip,is not for everyone. It's meant for light to moderate weight on the bar, not any heavy stuff. Some can be subjected to shoulder problems, with this movements, if not taking a proper warm-up and using too heavy a weight. Gironda stress form over heavy resistence (weight). A 'V' bar is very well adapted for chinning also. The one shown with Scott is a little shorted than some I've seen & used before.

When done right, a set of sissy squats are man killers. It's the full stretch that most guy's have a hard time with at first. The butt touches the heels every rep and balance can also be a problem.  Can get a burn that is unreal. I've heard that's it's called sissy squats because, when preformed the correct way, it makes sissy's out of the most heavy duty squater's around.

It can be misleading when most of Gironda's exercise are listed in a workout program. Not so much the regular exercises used but the way their done. A little twist here, a little turn there, the way the grip is held, how hard you hold the grip, the way you draw the knees up when doing flat bench work, overhead DB pressing,laterial raises, select calf & some times abs work, etc, etc, etc. You almost have to have someone who really knows the insides and outs of his methods to guide you through a workout, to get the true feel of the way Gironda wanted the movement to work a muscle.

I never cared much about BB and more with heavy lifting myself, but Gironda was one of a kind. A man deserving respect in the field of BB'ing, past or present. I've met a few gyuy's who use to hang at his Ventura Blvd gym. Good Luck.

BallzDeep69

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Re: Gironda Training
« Reply #6 on: June 10, 2006, 12:57:40 AM »
If you wanna be built like a gay swimmer like Gironda, a guy who is against any tough, manly exercise like bench pressing, Squats etc then use his training tips.

brianX

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Re: Gironda Training
« Reply #7 on: June 10, 2006, 01:32:19 AM »
Dips aren't an effective exercise? Could've fooled me.
hahahahahahahahahahahaha

pumpster

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Re: Gironda Training
« Reply #8 on: June 10, 2006, 01:51:21 AM »
Dips are ok for some, for many there are better alternatives.

Thank god we have "balls" to set us straight about Vince. Vince trained plenty of guys who were bigger than balls will ever be.

BallzDeep69

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Re: Gironda Training
« Reply #9 on: June 10, 2006, 04:10:28 AM »
Of course he has, Vince has also trained guys that were bigger before lifting and using AAS than you'll ever be. 

Great genetics + handfulls of dbols 5 times a day = Huge mofo no matter how they train.

pumpster

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Re: Gironda Training
« Reply #10 on: June 10, 2006, 06:49:41 AM »
More idiocy from balls. Solid training principles work with or without drugs; novices don't understand that.

JPM

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Re: Gironda Training
« Reply #11 on: June 10, 2006, 07:44:31 AM »
No disrespect given, but.....BD69 just doesn't get it, sorry to say. Good Luck.

BallzDeep69

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Re: Gironda Training
« Reply #12 on: June 11, 2006, 05:31:57 PM »
LOL...  Whatever.  You wanna look like Gironda, train like him.  Personally I thought he was built like a female gymnast.

BallzDeep69

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Re: Gironda Training
« Reply #13 on: June 11, 2006, 05:33:45 PM »
More idiocy from balls. Solid training principles work with or without drugs; novices don't understand that.

No, you're right.  SOLID training principles do work.  I just don't think his were very SOLID.  Avoiding Bench press, Squats, Deadlifts and probably military presses and chins too?  Real solid training priciples right there... 

Jr. Yates

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Re: Gironda Training
« Reply #14 on: June 11, 2006, 05:35:28 PM »
No, you're right.  SOLID training principles do work.  I just don't think his were very SOLID.  Avoiding Bench press, Squats, Deadlifts and probably military presses and chins too?  Real solid training priciples right there... 
hahaha! no doubt!
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pumpster

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Re: Gironda Training
« Reply #15 on: June 11, 2006, 05:48:16 PM »
Agreed, some of what he said didn't make sense but a lot of it did, there's no way to generalize.

JPM

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Re: Gironda Training
« Reply #16 on: June 11, 2006, 08:50:48 PM »
Actually Gironda did teach squats for certain body type's. Front squats and other variety's were also stressed. He developed systems for larger calves because he didn't want the legs to overshadow them. BP's, wide and to the neck, along with dips for the chest. Chins were a important for a wide & thick back/lats, he never avoided that one in most workouts. Front press were not used heavily. He believe the anterior (front) delts already receive enought exercise from mostly pec/chest work. He did stress the laterial head of the delts strongly and used many different versions of the side raised (standing , inclines,flat bench, etc). Also many versions of DB pressing (you think Arnold thought up the idea of Arnold presses on his own?). Very important part of the male body was shoulder width (Larry Scott comes to mind as a person born with a narrow shoulder structure...check out his complete wide & thick delt development some time using Gironda's methods). A very important exercise for bicep mass at that time was the Gironda/Scott curling bench, Gironda's original. Also had some new ideas for completre (all three heads) triceps advance training, in the same workout. I would guess these (and many more ) training methods were somewhat solid. Goronda also set standard for future BB'ing diets, the use of supplements and the correct times of day to use them. This would include protein feeding also.

So if anyone would take the trouble, and massive amount of time, to read that short article at T-nation.com, than they might be in danger of learning something new. Or probably having someone read it to  them so they can understand it better. Good luck.

gibberj2

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Re: Gironda Training
« Reply #17 on: June 11, 2006, 09:00:32 PM »
I'm very interested in the Gironda diet.

mombasa3

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Re: Gironda Training
« Reply #18 on: June 11, 2006, 09:39:32 PM »
So if anyone would take the trouble, and massive amount of time, to read that short article at T-nation.com, than they might be in danger of learning something new. Or probably having someone read it to  them so they can understand it better. Good luck.

Well said!

gibberj2

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Re: Gironda Training
« Reply #19 on: June 11, 2006, 10:03:30 PM »
i have gironda's book, the wild physique. there are just too many supplements to take and probably hard to find nowadays.

pumpster

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Re: Gironda Training
« Reply #20 on: June 11, 2006, 10:10:19 PM »
Quote
A very important exercise for bicep mass at that time was the Gironda/Scott curling bench, Gironda's original.

Actually it was developed by the Easton Brothers but definitely popularized by Vince.

Sadly, after he died Vince's gym and all the original equipment was sold for not alot of money to another gym; would've made for some nice artifacts.

BallzDeep69

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Re: Gironda Training
« Reply #21 on: June 12, 2006, 01:53:07 AM »
Agreed, some of what he said didn't make sense but a lot of it did, there's no way to generalize.


Wow, so we are in an agreement FOR ONCE! :D

pumpster

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Re: Gironda Training
« Reply #22 on: June 12, 2006, 05:03:42 AM »
 ;D

JPM

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Re: Gironda Training
« Reply #23 on: June 12, 2006, 07:42:15 AM »
I believe there was some debate during that period as to who's original idea the curling bench was. I know the article said the Easton brothers (they started as a handbalancing act). You ask one old timer and he'll tell you one thing and another older guy something different.  Gironda called it a preacher bench, I believe. Some said that even Marcy's might have been the first but that might have been a stretch.

 Interesting how many new BB'ing concepts started in the greather LA area, including Santa Monica/Venice & The Valley. That had to be the birth place of modern BB'ing. In the old days a lot of guy's used to workout at different gyms all the time, just to get and trade new training idea's. More companionship/friendships in those old day's I guess. Not so much attitude & ego than as there is now. Even on this board, too bad. Good Luck.

BallzDeep69

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Re: Gironda Training
« Reply #24 on: June 12, 2006, 08:04:22 AM »
;D


Haha!.... I knew you was cool.  We just had to get one the same page!  :D  No more arguments from us!   :-*  ROFL!  (im drunk)