Getbig.com: American Bodybuilding, Fitness and Figure
Getbig Misc Discussion Boards => Religious Debates & Threads => Topic started by: Oldschool Flip on November 04, 2008, 09:48:41 PM
-
With Obama winning and a strong majority of the vote coming from youth, idea of accepting homosexuality, legal abortion, and reduction of foreign oil will have less resistance in the future. Roe vs Wade will stay around, as it should, and new appointment of a Supreme Court justice looming, you can bet the sway will stay that way.
It's great that youth are starting to see that the US isn't just about "saying your prayers" and praising God. Atheism is growing exponentially since youth are seeing that science and technology are doing things that were once only thought of as being "God's work". This may be the century that religion might be accepted as a fairytale just like the myths of Greek Gods way back in the day.
-
religion will never die, to many insecure people with the need for someone to make everything better.
I cant understand how anyone with decent amounts of intellect can read the bible and beleive it. It is full of contradictions not only wrt the stories but to the principles of god. It defies logic.
-
With Obama winning and a strong majority of the vote coming from youth, idea of accepting homosexuality, legal abortion, and reduction of foreign oil will have less resistance in the future. Roe vs Wade will stay around, as it should, and new appointment of a Supreme Court justice looming, you can bet the sway will stay that way.
It's great that youth are starting to see that the US isn't just about "saying your prayers" and praising God. Atheism is growing exponentially since youth are seeing that science and technology are doing things that were once only thought of as being "God's work". This may be the century that religion might be accepted as a fairytale just like the myths of Greek Gods way back in the day.
Don't diss the Greek gods...
(http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z25/Todesfick/Zeus-1.jpg)
-
With Obama winning and a strong majority of the vote coming from youth, idea of accepting homosexuality, legal abortion, and reduction of foreign oil will have less resistance in the future. Roe vs Wade will stay around, as it should, and new appointment of a Supreme Court justice looming, you can bet the sway will stay that way.
It's great that youth are starting to see that the US isn't just about "saying your prayers" and praising God. Atheism is growing exponentially since youth are seeing that science and technology are doing things that were once only thought of as being "God's work". This may be the century that religion might be accepted as a fairytale just like the myths of Greek Gods way back in the day.
Ummmm...before you start talking about Obama's win and the accepting homosexuality, you may want to note that Florida, Arizona, and California (yes, CALIFORNIA) just passed marriage amendments, defining marriage as a union between one man and one woman, with the latter's amendment reversing a ruling made by the state Supreme Court six months ago.
As for you take on religion, that's wishful thinking on your part. Or did you forget that Obama himself is a self-described Christian, along with the various ministers and church groups that supported Obama en route to his impressive victory.
religion will never die, to many insecure people with the need for someone to make everything better.
I cant understand how anyone with decent amounts of intellect can read the bible and beleive it. It is full of contradictions not only wrt the stories but to the principles of god. It defies logic.
Obama does. And so do many of his supporters and his opponents. Are you now going to declare that Obama doesn't have "decent amounts of intellect"?
-
Ummmm...before you start talking about Obama's win and the accepting homosexuality, you may want to note that Florida, Arizona, and California (yes, CALIFORNIA) just passed marriage amendments, defining marriage as a union between one man and one woman, with the latter's amendment reversing a ruling made by the state Supreme Court six months ago.
As for you take on religion, that's wishful thinking on your part. Or did you forget that Obama himself is a self-described Christian, along with the various ministers and church groups that supported Obama en route to his impressive victory.
Obama does. And so do many of his supporters and his opponents. Are you now going to declare that Obama doesn't have "decent amounts of intellect"?
This is the thing that bothers me the most about Christian nutters; you can't mind your own business. Who cares if gay people want to get married thousands of miles away from you. Why do you worry about crap like that?
I wonder what Stella's position on gay marriage is...?
-
This is the thing that bothers me the most about Christian nutters; you can't mind your own business. Who cares if gay people want to get married thousands of miles away from you. Why do you worry about crap like that?
I wonder what Stella's position on gay marriage is...?
This is a social issue, Deicide. It becomes my business, from a social standpoint, when another state wants to impose its definition of marriage in my state, which has happened far too many times.
I could say the same thing about atheist "nutters". If you're so confident that God doesn't exist, why do some of you (in the USA) bleat and blubber about the words, "under God", in the Pledge of Allegiance. You get worked up over someone you don't even believe to exist. You don't "mind your own business" in that regard.
You wail about the "National Day of Prayer", even though participation in such is VOLUNTARY. And in about a month, we'll hear plenty of "secular Scrooges" weep and gnash their teeth, because someone had the audacity to mention Jesus Christ, during Christmas time.
-
Ummmm...before you start talking about Obama's win and the accepting homosexuality, you may want to note that Florida, Arizona, and California (yes, CALIFORNIA) just passed marriage amendments, defining marriage as a union between one man and one woman, with the latter's amendment reversing a ruling made by the state Supreme Court six months ago.
Once all the old foggies pass away within the next election or two, I'm more than sure you'll see a change. Same sex marriage battle is in it's infancy so just give it time.
As for you take on religion, that's wishful thinking on your part. Or did you forget that Obama himself is a self-described Christian, along with the various ministers and church groups that supported Obama en route to his impressive victory.
Lol, that's why he's Pro Choice and pro stem cell research, right? People "claim" to be Christian all the time, yet won't follow Bible scripture or the delusional mandates made up of men of the cloth. Pretty naive there Mcway.
Obama does. And so do many of his supporters and his opponents. Are you now going to declare that Obama doesn't have "decent amounts of intellect"?
He was smart enough to claim it just enough to win the votes of some "red" states.
-
Ummmm...before you start talking about Obama's win and the accepting homosexuality, you may want to note that Florida, Arizona, and California (yes, CALIFORNIA) just passed marriage amendments, defining marriage as a union between one man and one woman, with the latter's amendment reversing a ruling made by the state Supreme Court six months ago.
As for you take on religion, that's wishful thinking on your part. Or did you forget that Obama himself is a self-described Christian, along with the various ministers and church groups that supported Obama en route to his impressive victory.
Obama does. And so do many of his supporters and his opponents. Are you now going to declare that Obama doesn't have "decent amounts of intellect"?
no atheist would ever win an election, he would say anything to get in. Im sure if you had a sit down with him and asked "did noah actually live to 600 and take two of every animal?" and other silly questions i think he would say no.
do you actually beleive noah took two of every animal on an ark?
-
This is a social issue, Deicide. It becomes my business, from a social standpoint, when another state wants to impose its definition of marriage in my state, which has happened far too many times.
I could say the same thing about atheist "nutters". If you're so confident that God doesn't exist, why do some of you (in the USA) bleat and blubber about the words, "under God", in the Pledge of Allegiance. You get worked up over someone you don't even believe to exist. You don't "mind your own business" in that regard.
You wail about the "National Day of Prayer", even though participation in such is VOLUNTARY. And in about a month, we'll hear plenty of "secular Scrooges" weep and gnash their teeth, because someone had the audacity to mention Jesus Christ, during Christmas time.
That's an easy one to answer. Because of separation of CHURCH and STATE. Though I don't care that much about my money have "In God We Trust" on it, or the Pledge of allegance having "under God" in it even though it was added to the original version, marriage between people is more of a state and court issue then it is of a religious issue. If it was a religious issue, then divorce shouldn't be accepted. That's why courts make the decision on marriages, annulments and divorces. The churches can't annul marriages or complete divorces.
-
no atheist would ever win an election, he would say anything to get in. Im sure if you had a sit down with him and asked "did noah actually live to 600 and take two of every animal?" and other silly questions i think he would say no.
do you actually beleive noah took two of every animal on an ark?
Ditto bro. Hell Noah was over 900 years old too.
-
no atheist would ever win an election, he would say anything to get in. Im sure if you had a sit down with him and asked "did noah actually live to 600 and take two of every animal?" and other silly questions i think he would say no.
do you actually beleive noah took two of every animal on an ark?
So, if McCain had won the election and stated that he's a Christian, you'd believe him (and bash him accordingly for his beliefs). Yet, when Obama says that he's a Christian, now you're saying that he's lying (which apparently is fine with you, since you think or hope he's a closet atheist).
That makes a lot of sense.
-
Once all the old foggies pass away within the next election or two, I'm more than sure you'll see a change. Same sex marriage battle is in it's infancy so just give it time.
Now, there's a tolerant attitude for you, looking forward to those who don't agree with you dying off, so your view becomes the norm.
Lol, that's why he's Pro Choice and pro stem cell research, right? People "claim" to be Christian all the time, yet won't follow Bible scripture or the delusional mandates made up of men of the cloth. Pretty naive there Mcway.
I see! So, you're another one of these folks claiming that Obama's a closet atheist, because you happen to like the guy, and his being (or claiming) to be a Christian just doesn't jive with your philosophical bend.
BTW, plenty of Christians are pro stem cell research (except for the embryonic kind; see my thread about Babytooth Technologies).
He was smart enough to claim it just enough to win the votes of some "red" states.
Are you expecting him to have a press conference and announce that he's really an atheist?
In other words, for all your criticism about the bad things about religion, you think it's cool to lie about being a Christian (and perhaps lie about anything else), as long as you reach your political goals.
I'll keep that in mind, the next time you start complaining about religious people and faith, again.
That's an easy one to answer. Because of separation of CHURCH and STATE. Though I don't care that much about my money have "In God We Trust" on it, or the Pledge of allegance having "under God" in it even though it was added to the original version, marriage between people is more of a state and court issue then it is of a religious issue. If it was a religious issue, then divorce shouldn't be accepted. That's why courts make the decision on marriages, annulments and divorces. The churches can't annul marriages or complete divorces.
I'm sorry. Where is "separation of Church and State" in the federal Constitution again?
Your quip about divorce is a bit off. Divorce was allowed in the OT (primarily in cases of adultery). What has gone terribly wrong is the concept of "no-fault" divorce which (as another poster stated) has made it far too easy to dissolve a marriage. It has been abused by Christians and non-Christians alike.
-
So, if McCain had won the election and stated that he's a Christian, you'd believe him (and bash him accordingly for his beliefs). Yet, when Obama says that he's a Christian, now you're saying that he's lying (which apparently is fine with you, since you think or hope he's a closet atheist).
That makes a lot of sense.
i never said either of those things ::)
im canadian i dont care who wins your election to be honest, mccain is and idiot, obama seems alright from his policies and reforms. I think he is christian i just dont think he is a literal creationist maniac christian.
-
is a self-described Christian, along with the various ministers and church groups that supported Obama en route to his impressive victory.
Obama does. And so do many of his supporters and his opponents. Are you now going to declare that Obama doesn't have "decent amounts of intellect"?
how you derived what you wrote based on my response to this boggles my mind.
i said i dont understand how any logical person can beleive literally in the bible.
-
i never said either of those things ::)
im canadian i dont care who wins your election to be honest, mccain is and idiot, obama seems alright from his policies and reforms. I think he is christian i just dont think he is a literal creationist maniac christian.
If you think he's a christian, why are you claiming that he isn't and was just saying he was to get elected? I'm not sure if Obama believes in Creation or not. If he did, how does that make him a "maniac"?
-
how you derived what you wrote based on my response to this boggles my mind.
i said i dont understand how any logical person can beleive literally in the bible.
That may be what you meant but THIS is what you said:
I cant understand how anyone with decent amounts of intellect can read the bible and beleive it. It is full of contradictions not only wrt the stories but to the principles of god. It defies logic.
That's why I responded the way I did. If Obama reads the Bible and believes it, does this now mean he no longer has "decent amounts of intellect"?
BTW, the late D. James Kennedy read and believed the Bible and he was named one of the most Outstanding Intellectuals of the 20th Century.
-
This is a social issue, Deicide. It becomes my business, from a social standpoint, when another state wants to impose its definition of marriage in my state, which has happened far too many times.
I could say the same thing about atheist "nutters". If you're so confident that God doesn't exist, why do some of you (in the USA) bleat and blubber about the words, "under God", in the Pledge of Allegiance. You get worked up over someone you don't even believe to exist. You don't "mind your own business" in that regard.
You wail about the "National Day of Prayer", even though participation in such is VOLUNTARY. And in about a month, we'll hear plenty of "secular Scrooges" weep and gnash their teeth, because someone had the audacity to mention Jesus Christ, during Christmas time.
I don't fit this category of atheists you are constantly talking about; ask Loco.
So you spend day and night worrying about what two men or two women do when engaging in sexual intercourse thousands of miles away? Why can't two people get married regardless of their gender?
-
So, if McCain had won the election and stated that he's a Christian, you'd believe him (and bash him accordingly for his beliefs). Yet, when Obama says that he's a Christian, now you're saying that he's lying (which apparently is fine with you, since you think or hope he's a closet atheist).
That makes a lot of sense.
Lol, well let's see McCain is Pro life, anti stem cell, anti gay marriage.......duh sounds like he's influenced by religion to me. Obama is the opposite, so chances are he isn't that religious, or not in the way the Christians want him to be.
-
Lol, well let's see McCain is Pro life, anti stem cell, anti gay marriage.......duh sounds like he's influenced by religion to me. Obama is the opposite, so chances are he isn't that religious, or not in the way the Christians want him to be.
Obama is not the opposite. Obama claims to be a Christian and attended church for years. McCain is not anti stem cell, adult stem cell that is. And Obama is just as anti same sex marriage as McCain is.
This thread clearly shows the atheists double standard and bias. Obama claims to be a religious man, but just because you like him, all of a sudden religion and God are okay with you, but only if it's Obama you're talking about.
-
Now, there's a tolerant attitude for you, looking forward to those who don't agree with you dying off, so your view becomes the norm.
And slavery was something the old south was tolerant of, until new ideas came along. If we would have still accepted slavery, like the Bible did, we wouldn't be where we are now. Get over it.
I see! So, you're another one of these folks claiming that Obama's a closet atheist, because you happen to like the guy, and his being (or claiming) to be a Christian just doesn't jive with your philosophical bend.
Not claiming he's a closet atheist, but it's obvious he's not as concerned about what the religious right thinks when it comes to science and women's rights.
BTW, plenty of Christians are pro stem cell research (except for the embryonic kind; see my thread about Babytooth Technologies).
Limiting all options because of what Christians think is a "child" isn't the way science thinks about research. Science looks at all available avenues and don't use a fairytale book for their morality. How the hell do you think we go invitro? Not by reading it in a Bible. And where it was once thought of as "God's work", it's now an acceptable way for a couple who have difficulties conceiving a child.
Are you expecting him to have a press conference and announce that he's really an atheist?
Read above.
In other words, for all your criticism about the bad things about religion, you think it's cool to lie about being a Christian (and perhaps lie about anything else), as long as you reach your political goals.
I'll keep that in mind, the next time you start complaining about religious people and faith, again.
You are naive. You actually believe that people with political power are TRULY religious? Bwahahahahaha! This is classic.
I'm sorry. Where is "separation of Church and State" in the federal Constitution again?
That is true, the phrase "separation of church and state" does not actually appear anywhere in the Constitution. There is a problem, however, in that some people draw incorrect conclusions from this fact. The absence of this phrase does not mean that it is an invalid concept or that it cannot be used as a legal or judicial principle.
There are any number of important legal concepts which do not appear in the Constitution with the exact phrasing people tend to use. For example, nowhere in the Constitution will you find words like "right to privacy" or even "right to a fair trial." Does this mean that no American citizen has a right to privacy or a fair trial? Does this mean that no judge should ever invoke these rights when reaching a decision?
Of course not - the absence of these specific words does not mean that there is also an absence of these ideas. The right to a fair trial, for example, is necessitated by what is in the text because what we do find simply makes no moral or legal sense otherwise.
Your quip about divorce is a bit off. Divorce was allowed in the OT (primarily in cases of adultery). What has gone terribly wrong is the concept of "no-fault" divorce which (as another poster stated) has made it far too easy to dissolve a marriage. It has been abused by Christians and non-Christians alike.
Not according to Matthew 19:6, Malachi 2:16a. But to go off what you said, it is allowed for adultery. However, adultery isn't the only reason Christian and non Christians are divorcing in the US. Lack of commitment, in-laws, finances, alcohol/drug use, etc. So if you're just talking "adultery" than the church should take care of it, however all the others are "not mentioned" in the Bible as reason for divorce so it's a court and state issue to handle and not that of religion.
And while I agree about the no fault divorce, it's not religions responsibility to overlook it. It's the courts. So it shouldn't matter if same sex people want to join in a binding relationship since the church has NOTHING to do with it. They will still pay their taxes, but have rights like married couples. And why does it bother you anyway? You're not gay (I think) so it doesn't affect your paycheck, your house bills, or your job. They are just people that want to have a union like a heterosexual couple do. That's it. And it's just around the corner. US Supreme court will make a ruling on it one day soon.
-
Obama is not the opposite. Obama claims to be a Christian and attended church for years. McCain is not anti stem cell, adult stem cell that is. And Obama is just as anti same sex marriage as McCain is.
This thread clearly shows the atheists double standard and bias. Obama claims to be a religious man, but just because you like him, all of a sudden religion and God are okay with you, but only if it's Obama you're talking about.
What? Lol, Obama isn't letting his personal views of religion affect his decisions on the issues of gays.
Barack Obama and Gay Rights in Illinois:
Barack Obama supported gay rights during his Illinois Senate tenure. He sponsored legislation in Illinois that would ban discrimination on the basis of sexual orientation.
Barack Obama in the United States Senate:
Every two years the Human Rights Campaign, the largest national gay and lesbian organization, issues a scorecard for members of the Senate based on their sponsorship and voting on key issues of importance to gay and lesbian citizens. Barack Obama scored 89 out of 100% in the 2006 scorecard. Here's how HRC rated Barack Obama:
Barack Obama on Hate Crimes:
Barack Obama co-sponsored legislation to expand federal hate crimes laws to include crimes perpetrated because of sexual orientation and gender identity.
Employment Non-Discrimination:
Barack Obama supports the Employment Non-Discrimination Act and believes it should be expanded to include sexual orientation and gender identity.
Don't Ask, Don't Tell - Gays in the Military:
Barack Obama believes we need to repeal the "Don't Ask, Don't Tell" policy and allow gays and lesbians to serve openly in the military. His campaign literature says, "The key test for military service should be patriotism, a sense of duty, and a willingness to serve."
Gay & Lesbian Adoption:
Barack Obama believes gays and lesbians should have the same rights to adopt children as heterosexuals.
Barack Obama and Gay Marriage/ Civil Unions:
Although Barack Obama has said that he supports civil unions, he is against gay marriage. In an interview with the Chicago Daily Tribune, Obama said, "I'm a Christian. And so, although I try not to have my religious beliefs dominate or determine my political views on this issue, I do believe that tradition, and my religious beliefs say that marriage is something sanctified between a man and a woman."
Barack Obama did vote against a Federal Marriage Amendment and opposed the Defense of Marriage Act in 1996.
He said he would support civil unions between gay and lesbian couples, as well as letting individual states determine if marriage between gay and lesbian couples should be legalized.
"Giving them a set of basic rights would allow them to experience their relationship and live their lives in a way that doesn't cause discrimination," Obama said. "I think it is the right balance to strike in this society."
And though he doesn't support the "term marriage" for gays, he supports civil unions. Christians don't want either. They don't want civil unions since it would practically "mirror" what marriage is.
-
What? Lol, Obama isn't letting his personal views of religion affect his decisions on the issues of gays.
Barack Obama and Gay Rights in Illinois:
Barack Obama supported gay rights during his Illinois Senate tenure. He sponsored legislation in Illinois that would ban discrimination on the basis of sexual orientation.
Barack Obama in the United States Senate:
Every two years the Human Rights Campaign, the largest national gay and lesbian organization, issues a scorecard for members of the Senate based on their sponsorship and voting on key issues of importance to gay and lesbian citizens. Barack Obama scored 89 out of 100% in the 2006 scorecard. Here's how HRC rated Barack Obama:
Barack Obama on Hate Crimes:
Barack Obama co-sponsored legislation to expand federal hate crimes laws to include crimes perpetrated because of sexual orientation and gender identity.
Employment Non-Discrimination:
Barack Obama supports the Employment Non-Discrimination Act and believes it should be expanded to include sexual orientation and gender identity.
Don't Ask, Don't Tell - Gays in the Military:
Barack Obama believes we need to repeal the "Don't Ask, Don't Tell" policy and allow gays and lesbians to serve openly in the military. His campaign literature says, "The key test for military service should be patriotism, a sense of duty, and a willingness to serve."
Gay & Lesbian Adoption:
Barack Obama believes gays and lesbians should have the same rights to adopt children as heterosexuals.
Barack Obama and Gay Marriage/ Civil Unions:
Although Barack Obama has said that he supports civil unions, he is against gay marriage. In an interview with the Chicago Daily Tribune, Obama said, "I'm a Christian. And so, although I try not to have my religious beliefs dominate or determine my political views on this issue, I do believe that tradition, and my religious beliefs say that marriage is something sanctified between a man and a woman."
Barack Obama did vote against a Federal Marriage Amendment and opposed the Defense of Marriage Act in 1996.
He said he would support civil unions between gay and lesbian couples, as well as letting individual states determine if marriage between gay and lesbian couples should be legalized.
"Giving them a set of basic rights would allow them to experience their relationship and live their lives in a way that doesn't cause discrimination," Obama said. "I think it is the right balance to strike in this society."
And though he doesn't support the "term marriage" for gays, he supports civil unions. Christians don't want either. They don't want civil unions since it would practically "mirror" what marriage is.
What a waste of words and space. You posted all that stuff about civil unions just to say at the end that Obama does not support same sex marriage? Isn't that what I just said? You said McCain opposes gay marriage and claimed Obama is "the opposite." Well, he is not because he opposes gay marriage too. How is Obama the opposite? You are wrong about your stem cell research claim too.
Lol, well let's see McCain is Pro life, anti stem cell, anti gay marriage.......duh sounds like he's influenced by religion to me. Obama is the opposite, so chances are he isn't that religious, or not in the way the Christians want him to be.
-
What a waste of words and space. You posted all that stuff about civil unions just to say at the end that Obama does not support same sex marriage? Isn't that what I just said? You said McCain opposes gay marriage and claimed Obama is "the opposite." Well, he is not because he opposes gay marriage too. How is Obama the opposite? You are also wrong about stem cell research.
Guess you didn't read the last line:
And though he doesn't support the "term marriage" for gays, he supports civil unions. Christians don't want either. They don't want civil unions since it would practically "mirror" what marriage is.
I claimed McCain opposes most of what Obama stands for. That's why they ran against each other since they don't agree on many issues. Lol, or else they would have been on the same ticket together as a duo. ::) They ran opposite each other and opposed each other's policies. As for stem cell research, McCain does support Adult stem cell research, but is against Embryonic stem cell research only because of religious belief. Obama isn't against embryonic stem cell research and wants the ban lifted. That's pretty opposite wouldn't you say?
Like I mentioned above, it's just a matter of time that it will change for gay "unions", embryonic stem cell research, and other agendas that the religious don't want done. We've overcome the stigma of conception not being in God's hands, but in medical science hands. Invitro is accepted, where not long ago many religious were deeming it as "playing God". Over the last 50 years, religion is playing less and less a role in the morality of human survival. Science and technology are proving more and more that it's not "magic" that made us, cures us and enhances our lives, but good old research and understanding our own biology, DNA, etc.
-
Guess you didn't read the last line:
And though he doesn't support the "term marriage" for gays, he supports civil unions. Christians don't want either. They don't want civil unions since it would practically "mirror" what marriage is.
I claimed McCain opposes most of what Obama stands for. That's why they ran against each other since they don't agree on many issues. Lol, or else they would have been on the same ticket together as a duo. ::) They ran opposite each other and opposed each other's policies. As for stem cell research, McCain does support Adult stem cell research, but is against Embryonic stem cell research only because of religious belief. Obama isn't against embryonic stem cell research and wants the ban lifted. That's pretty opposite wouldn't you say?
Like I mentioned above, it's just a matter of time that it will change for gay "unions", embryonic stem cell research, and other agendas that the religious don't want done. We've overcome the stigma of conception not being in God's hands, but in medical science hands. Invitro is accepted, where not long ago many religious were deeming it as "playing God". Over the last 50 years, religion is playing less and less a role in the morality of human survival. Science and technology are proving more and more that it's not "magic" that made us, cures us and enhances our lives, but good old research and understanding our own biology, DNA, etc.
Why can't you take responsibility for what you said before? No, they don't agree on many issues, but you brought up the two issues they do agree on. You were wrong. They both oppose gay marriage and they both support stem cell research. You did not say anything about civil unions or embryonic stem cells before. You are changing your story now because I called you on it. You are just arguing for the sake of argument and can't admit you were wrong.
According to you and other atheists on the board, Obama is an idiot, uneducated, nut case because he claims to believe in God, claims to be a Christian and believes the Bible. That's what you all have been saying all along. Now, all of a sudden, Obama is okay because he isn't letting his Chrsitian faith affect his decisions. ::)
-
At least Lord Obama's mother was an atheist...
-
Why can't you take responsibility for what you said before? No, they don't agree on many issues, but you brought up the two issues they do agree on. You were wrong. They both oppose gay marriage and they both support stem cell research. You did not say anything about civil unions or embryonic stem cells before. You are changing your story now because I called you on it. You are just arguing for the sake of argument and can't admit you were wrong.
I did admit it if you read loco. You read what you want to hear.
As for stem cell research, McCain does support Adult stem research
And come on loco Obama is for civil unions which is just "PC" for "gay marriage". Marriage is considered a "legal status" in the US.
http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/marriage
mar⋅riage
/ˈmærɪdʒ/ Show Spelled Pronunciation [mar-ij] Show IPA Pronunciation
–noun
1. the social institution under which a man and woman establish their decision to live as husband and wife by legal commitments, religious ceremonies, etc.
2. the state, condition, or relationship of being married; wedlock: a happy marriage.
3. the legal or religious ceremony that formalizes the decision of a man and woman to live as husband and wife, including the accompanying social festivities: to officiate at a marriage.
4. a relationship in which two people have pledged themselves to each other in the manner of a husband and wife, without legal sanction: trial marriage; homosexual marriage.
5. any close or intimate association or union: the marriage of words and music in a hit song.
6. a formal agreement between two companies or enterprises to combine operations, resources, etc., for mutual benefit; merger.
You're nit picking here. Do you think McCain is for civil unions (aka gay marriage) either? Here's what McCain said:
“So you’re for civil unions?” Stephanopoulos asked.
“No,” he said. “I do not believe gay marriage should be legal. I do not believe gay marriage should be legal,” he repeated. “But I do believe that people ought to be able to enter into contracts, exchange powers of attorney, other ways that people have relationships can enter into.”
Later, he came back: “I just want to point out again: I believe that gay marriage should not be legal. OK?”
http://www.azcongresswatch.com/?p=2575
So McCain's understanding of civil union's is gay marriage. Obama is for civil unions (aka gay marriage).
And I admit I misquoted on stem cell research. But for you to say that they're not opposite is going out on a limb of a very thin branch. ::) Are you going to admit that? Or just stick to the 2 things they semi-agree on? ::)
According to you and other atheists on the board, Obama is because he claims tan idiot, uneducated, nut case believe in God, claims to be a Christian and believes the Bible. That's what you all have been saying all along. Now, all of a sudden, Obama is okay because he isn't letting his Chrsitian faith affect his decisions. ::)
Show me where I said anything of what you stated above. I stated that Obama may be a Christian, but doesn't let his religious views hamper in what he believes is right for humanity.
-
I did admit it if you read loco. You read what you want to hear. And come on loco Obama is for civil unions which is just "PC" for "gay marriage". Marriage is considered a "legal status" in the US.
http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/marriage
mar⋅riage
/ˈmærɪdʒ/ Show Spelled Pronunciation [mar-ij] Show IPA Pronunciation
–noun
1. the social institution under which a man and woman establish their decision to live as husband and wife by legal commitments, religious ceremonies, etc.
2. the state, condition, or relationship of being married; wedlock: a happy marriage.
3. the legal or religious ceremony that formalizes the decision of a man and woman to live as husband and wife, including the accompanying social festivities: to officiate at a marriage.
4. a relationship in which two people have pledged themselves to each other in the manner of a husband and wife, without legal sanction: trial marriage; homosexual marriage.
5. any close or intimate association or union: the marriage of words and music in a hit song.
6. a formal agreement between two companies or enterprises to combine operations, resources, etc., for mutual benefit; merger.
You're nit picking here. Do you think McCain is for civil unions (aka gay marriage) either? Here's what McCain said:
So McCain's understanding of civil union's is gay marriage. Obama is for civil unions (aka gay marriage).
And I admit I misquoted on stem cell research. But for you to say that they're not opposite is going out on a limb of a very thin branch. ::) Are you going to admit that? Or just stick to the 2 things they semi-agree on? ::)
Show me where I said anything of what you stated above. I stated that Obama may be a Christian, but doesn't let his religious views hamper in what he believes is right for humanity.
You are the one who brought up the two issues where they are not "opposite".
Are you kidding me? This board is full of your anti-Christian rants. It seems like a full time job for you.
-
You are the one who brought up the two issues where they are not "opposite".
Are you kidding me? This board is full of your anti-Christian rants. It seems like a full time job for you.
So you're saying they agree on both issues fully? The way they view religion is part of how they make their policies. McCain doesn't want embryonic stem cell research because of a perceived child. Religion states that these "children" don't get to make a choice. Yet, it's okay to keep these "children" frozen until their ready to use against their will. Yeah that makes total sense. ::)
And you aren't willing to admit that civil unions are really just gay marriages. If it wasn't gay marriage, then the religious shouldn't have problem with civil unions since it doesn't delude the meaning of "marriage" according to you.
And though I'm anti religious, lol maybe the anti Christ in disguise, your accusations of what I said about Obama aren't true. Never called him an idiot, a nut case, etc.
The tide is turning. We now have an African American president where I thought it would take much longer. This shows America is more open-minded than before. And as time progresses, people are starting to see that religion is nothing more than just a common interest, then really worshiping a deity. It's pretty much that way now. Ask most children, teens and young adults where they would rather be? Playing outside, going to school, having fun and sex in college or FORCED to sitting in pews listening to a sermon? Obviously religion has less of an impact than 50 years ago since violent crime is more apt, people are having sex before marriage much more frequently, science is breaking barriers which what was thought to be "supernatural" powers of God only, etc. There will still be some who will live and breath by the Bible, but that's like any cult today with small followings.
-
So you're saying they agree on both issues fully? The way they view religion is part of how they make their policies. McCain doesn't want embryonic stem cell research because of a perceived child. Religion states that these "children" don't get to make a choice. Yet, it's okay to keep these "children" frozen until their ready to use against their will. Yeah that makes total sense. ::)
And you aren't willing to admit that civil unions are really just gay marriages. If it wasn't gay marriage, then the religious shouldn't have problem with civil unions since it doesn't delude the meaning of "marriage" according to you.
And though I'm anti religious, lol maybe the anti Christ in disguise, your accusations of what I said about Obama aren't true. Never called him an idiot, a nut case, etc.
The tide is turning. We now have an African American president where I thought it would take much longer. This shows America is more open-minded than before. And as time progresses, people are starting to see that religion is nothing more than just a common interest, then really worshiping a deity. It's pretty much that way now. Ask most children, teens and young adults where they would rather be? Playing outside, going to school, having fun and sex in college or FORCED to sitting in pews listening to a sermon? Obviously religion has less of an impact than 50 years ago since violent crime is more apt, people are having sex before marriage much more frequently, science is breaking barriers which what was thought to be "supernatural" powers of God only, etc. There will still be some who will live and breath by the Bible, but that's like any cult today with small followings.
For the sake of this thread and this discussion, who cares about civil unions and how Christians or how McCain define them? I watched the part of the debate where Obama said plain and clear that "marriage" is between a man and a woman only. Where do you think Obama got this idea from?
-
At least Lord Obama's mother was an atheist...
Big Deal. So was Madalyn Murray O'Hair. Her son, William Murray, is a born-again Christian and a minister.
-
For the sake of this thread and this discussion, who cares about civil unions and how Christians or how McCain define them? I watched the part of the debate where Obama said plain and clear that "marriage" is between a man and a woman only. Where do you think Obama got this idea from?
His strategist.
-
Big Deal. So was Madalyn Murray O'Hair. Her son, William Murray, is a born-again Christian and a minister.
But he wasn't elected to the Presidency of the United States. ::) Sounds like a big deal to me.
-
His strategist.
So you are saying that he lied?
-
So you are saying that he lied?
Well let's say he slyly used "PC" language. If it's just the case of the word "marriage" that you're concerned about, then you shouldn't have a problem with civil unions then right?
-
Well let's say he slyly used "PC" language. If it's just the case of the word "marriage" that you're concerned about, then you shouldn't have a problem with civil unions then right?
So he lied to get elected. How convenient for you for the sake of this discussion. I quote him to prove you wrong and you say "he is strategist". ::)
It's impossible to debate you with that attitude. Anyway, Arizona, Florida and...yes, California of all states just banned same sex marriage. Arizona had rejected just such a constitutional amendment only two years ago. That alone proves you wrong on at least one of two. You have to make up your mind. Either you are wrong about the title of this thread, or opposition to same sex marriage has nothing to do with religion. You can't have it both ways.
-
Rahm Emanuel (Hebrew: רם עמנואל) will be Barack Obama's chief of staff.
Rahm Emanuel's wife Amy Rule, a graduate of the Wharton School of the University of Pennsylvania converted to Judaism shortly before her wedding. They are members of Anshe Shalom, a modern Orthodox congregation.
Obama's Israeli adviser: Next White House chief of staff?
http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-3616306,00.html
http://www.highbeam.com/doc/1G1-19054588.html
Modern Orthodox Judaism (or Modern Orthodox or Modern Orthodoxy) is a movement within Orthodox Judaism that attempts to synthesize traditional observance and values with the secular, modern world. Modern Orthodoxy draws on several teachings and philosophies, and thus assumes various forms. In the United States, and generally in the Western world, "Centrist Orthodoxy" — underpinned by the philosophy of Torah Umadda ("Torah and Knowledge/Science) — is prevalent. In Israel, Modern Orthodoxy is dominated by Religious Zionism; however, although not identical, these movements share many of the same values and many of the same adherents.
http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m0411/is_4_47/ai_54600118
-
But he wasn't elected to the Presidency of the United States. ::) Sounds like a big deal to me.
The point is the mother’s religious beliefs (or lack thereof) DID NOT ultimately dictate that of the son, as is the case for both Murray and Obama.
So he lied to get elected. How convenient for you for the sake of this discussion. I quote him to prove you wrong and you say "he is strategist". ::)
It's impossible to debate you with that attitude. Anyway, Arizona, Florida and...yes, California of all states just banned same sex marriage. Arizona had rejected just such a constitutional amendment only two years ago. That alone proves you wrong on at least one of two. You have to make up your mind. Either you are wrong about the title of this thread, or opposition to same sex marriage has nothing to do with religion. You can't have it both ways.
I don't think Obama lied to get elected. It's the same ploy I've seen other non-believers who like certain political candidates but struggle with the profession of faith by those candidates . So, they claim that either Obama is a closet atheist and/or he's simply lying (which apparently is fine, if the deception involves the Christian faith) to get elected, because <<sob, sniff>> "nobody will elect an atheist". Of course, what some don't consider is that maybe HOSTILITY towards faith and religion (rather than simply a lack of belief in such) is the reason why people tend not to pick atheists as political leaders in the USA.
-
So he lied to get elected. How convenient for you for the sake of this discussion. I quote him to prove you wrong and you say "he is strategist". ::)
It's impossible to debate you with that attitude. Anyway, Arizona, Florida and...yes, California of all states just banned same sex marriage. Arizona had rejected just such a constitutional amendment only two years ago. That alone proves you wrong on at least one of two. You have to make up your mind. Either you are wrong about the title of this thread, or opposition to same sex marriage has nothing to do with religion. You can't have it both ways.
Dude you're going to believe that politicians tell people the truth or what they want to hear? And by the way I didn't say "he's a strategist" I said "his strategist". These people HAVE other write up their itineraries.
And so same sex marriage was shot down, but I'm more that confident that civil unions will be allowed within his term. Just like back in the 60's and 70's when inter racial marriage was looked down upon, people will ease up and accept. Patience is a virtue.
-
The point is the mother’s religious beliefs (or lack thereof) DID NOT ultimately dictate that of the son, as is the case for both Murray and Obama.
This happens all the time. Most atheists were raised in religion.
I don't think Obama lied to get elected. It's the same ploy I've seen other non-believers who like certain political candidates but struggle with the profession of faith by those candidates . So, they claim that either Obama is a closet atheist and/or he's simply lying (which apparently is fine, if the deception involves the Christian faith) to get elected, because <<sob, sniff>> "nobody will elect an atheist". Of course, what some don't consider is that maybe HOSTILITY towards faith and religion (rather than simply a lack of belief in such) is the reason why people tend not to pick atheists as political leaders in the USA.
So then explain why Obama the Christian is for embryonic stem cell research, civil unions, and abortion. I'll just start with those. How many Christians are for those? Epic denial.
-
This happens all the time. Most atheists were raised in religion.
So then explain why Obama the Christian is for embryonic stem cell research, civil unions, and abortion. I'll just start with those. How many Christians are for those? Epic denial.
the first argument completely obliterates mcways.. far more people are brought up in a religious setting a switch then the opposite.
-
This happens all the time. Most atheists were raised in religion.
I know that. Didn't I just state that the mother's belief (or lack thereof) doesn't ultimately dictate the faith of the child? Yet, you have, perhaps, THE MOST VEHEMENT ATHEIST in American history, ending up with a son, who is a minister. And there are plenty of others, who did NOT grow in religious households, that became Christians as adults.
So then explain why Obama the Christian is for embryonic stem cell research, civil unions, and abortion. I'll just start with those. How many Christians are for those? Epic denial.
From the people with whom I've interacted, a lot more than you think. I don't agree with them, but that's not the point. It appears you just stated that you can't be a Christian if you support those things.
Plus, notwithstanding your lack of support for your earlier claim, you didn't address the issue of why you seem to think that lying is fine for a political candidate, as long as such relates to his supposedly lying about his Christian faith to be elected.
When people claimed that Obama was Muslim (even though he made it clear that he is not), Obama supporters were angered by it. And, they'd be just as angry with you, claiming that he's not a Christian or that he's lying. But, then again, you are an Obama supporter, which is fine. But, it appears you're trying to solve the philosophical dilemna, because you like the guy, who says he's a man of faith.
-
This happens all the time. Most atheists were raised in religion.
So then explain why Obama the Christian is for embryonic stem cell research, civil unions, and abortion. I'll just start with those. How many Christians are for those? Epic denial.
Explain what? There are other Christians who support embryonic stem cell research, civil unions, and abortion. So what? They are still Christians.
-
From the people with whom I've interacted, a lot more than you think. I don't agree with them, but that's not the point. It appears you just stated that you can't be a Christian if you support those things.
Then that's a double standard. If it's not allowed, then why are they making the decision? Unless of course they are just "Christians" in label only.
Plus, notwithstanding your lack of support for your earlier claim, you didn't address the issue of why you seem to think that lying is fine for a political candidate, as long as such relates to his supposedly lying about his Christian faith to be elected.
It's obvious you take the word of politicians. ::) How about this. I was born a Catholic, so am considered Catholic, but don't follow it. I would bet dollars to donuts that thousands upon thousands of "Christians" that can make that claim.
When people claimed that Obama was Muslim (even though he made it clear that he is not), Obama supporters were angered by it. And, they'd be just as angry with you, claiming that he's not a Christian or that he's lying. But, then again, you are an Obama supporter, which is fine. But, it appears you're trying to solve the philosophical dilemna, because you like the guy, who says he's a man of faith.
They can be mad too, but fact is a Christian whom actually follows the religion WOULDN'T allow those agendas. There's NO ARGUMENT on that. If they do then how can they be a real Christian?
-
Explain what? There are other Christians who support embryonic stem cell research, civil unions, and abortion. So what? They are still Christians.
In label loco. It's forbidden by YOUR CHRISTIAN BIBLE. So are you telling me that it's okay to do this and still be called a Christian? Double standard like I said.
-
In label loco. It's forbidden by YOUR CHRISTIAN BIBLE. So are you telling me that it's okay to do this and still be called a Christian? Double standard like I said.
Show me where in "YOUR CHRISTIAN BIBLE" it says that if a person supports embryonic stem cell research, civil unions, and abortion he/she is not a Christian?
Let me guess, is it next to the part where it says that Christians are not allowed to be happy? ::)
I thought opposition to same sex marriage had more to do with a social, personal conviction than it had to do with the Bible. I mean, are you telling me that there are that many Bible believing Christians in California, Arizona and Florida? Daaaang! ;D
-
Show me where in "YOUR CHRISTIAN BIBLE" it says that if a person supports embryonic stem cell research, civil unions, and abortion he/she is not a Christian?
Let me guess, is it next to the part where it says that Christians are not allowed to be happy? ::)
I thought opposition to same sex marriage had more to do with a social, personal conviction than it had to do with the Bible. I mean, are you telling me that there are that many Bible believing Christians in California, Arizona and Florida? Daaaang! ;D
Didn't you know? God hates fags...
-
Show me where in "YOUR CHRISTIAN BIBLE" it says that if a person supports embryonic stem cell research, civil unions, and abortion he/she is not a Christian?
Let me guess, is it next to the part where it says that Christians are not allowed to be happy? ::)
Need to watch what you post now loco. You are saying at this point that Christians can support this and still be Christians. What is a Christian then?
Chris⋅tian
/ˈkrɪstʃən/ Show Spelled Pronunciation [kris-chuhn] Show IPA Pronunciation
–adjective
1. of, pertaining to, or derived from Jesus Christ or His teachings: a Christian faith.
2. of, pertaining to, believing in, or belonging to the religion based on the teachings of Jesus Christ: Spain is a Christian country.
3. of or pertaining to Christians: many Christian deaths in the Crusades.
4. exhibiting a spirit proper to a follower of Jesus Christ; Christlike: She displayed true Christian charity.
5. decent; respectable: They gave him a good Christian burial.
6. human; not brutal; humane: Such behavior isn't Christian.
–noun
7. a person who believes in Jesus Christ; adherent of Christianity.
8. a person who exemplifies in his or her life the teachings of Christ: He died like a true Christian.
9. a member of any of certain Protestant churches, as the Disciples of Christ and the Plymouth Brethren.
10. the hero of Bunyan's Pilgrim's Progress.
11. a male given name.
According to these definitions Christians aren't allowed to accept the above proposals of Obama.
Civil unions and homosexuality- Corinthians 6:9-11 and Timothy 1:10
embryonic stem cells and abortion- Exo 20:13; Deut 5:17, Gen. 9:5-6, Luke 1:8-44, Job 31:13-15; Psa 51:5; 139:13-16; Matt 1:20.
Again from YOUR CHRISTIAN BIBLE. Not that I believe it, but it's been preached that the proposals are against the will of God, Jesus and his teachings. So according to these: Gal. 1:9, and 2 Pet. 2:1-3; 3:16.
How can Christians that disobey God's word intentionally without remorse (with by supporting those proposals would be) be a Christian in God's eyes?
I thought opposition to same sex marriage had more to do with a social, personal conviction than it had to do with the Bible. I mean, are you telling me that there are that many Bible believing Christians in California, Arizona and Florida? Daaaang! ;D
My mom and dad love my older brother. He is a homosexual. They are also devout Catholics that voted for Prop 8 as well as ALL of the rest of my family members (except the homosexual ones, which number about 5) because of religious belief and not homophobia. But the further you move away from the coastline the more "religious" it gets in CA. Yet the majority of people live on the coast. And though many are accepting of homosexuality (especially since gay bashing is really unacceptable in any workplace or public forum) there are those whom are religious that still will hold true to the word "marriage" as between man and woman because of religious beliefs. But wait till it's propped as "Civil Union" and I bet it passes.
http://www.kcra.com/california-proposition-8/index.html
-
Need to watch what you post now loco. You are saying at this point that Christians can support this and still be Christians. What is a Christian then?
Chris⋅tian
/ˈkrɪstʃən/ Show Spelled Pronunciation [kris-chuhn] Show IPA Pronunciation
–adjective
1. of, pertaining to, or derived from Jesus Christ or His teachings: a Christian faith.
2. of, pertaining to, believing in, or belonging to the religion based on the teachings of Jesus Christ: Spain is a Christian country.
3. of or pertaining to Christians: many Christian deaths in the Crusades.
4. exhibiting a spirit proper to a follower of Jesus Christ; Christlike: She displayed true Christian charity.
5. decent; respectable: They gave him a good Christian burial.
6. human; not brutal; humane: Such behavior isn't Christian.
–noun
7. a person who believes in Jesus Christ; adherent of Christianity.
8. a person who exemplifies in his or her life the teachings of Christ: He died like a true Christian.
9. a member of any of certain Protestant churches, as the Disciples of Christ and the Plymouth Brethren.
10. the hero of Bunyan's Pilgrim's Progress.
11. a male given name.
According to these definitions Christians aren't allowed to accept the above proposals of Obama.
Civil unions and homosexuality- Corinthians 6:9-11 and Timothy 1:10
embryonic stem cells and abortion- Exo 20:13; Deut 5:17, Gen. 9:5-6, Luke 1:8-44, Job 31:13-15; Psa 51:5; 139:13-16; Matt 1:20.
Again from YOUR CHRISTIAN BIBLE. Not that I believe it, but it's been preached that the proposals are against the will of God, Jesus and his teachings. So according to these: Gal. 1:9, and 2 Pet. 2:1-3; 3:16.
How can Christians that disobey God's word intentionally without remorse (with by supporting those proposals would be) be a Christian in God's eyes?
My mom and dad love my older brother. He is a homosexual. They are also devout Catholics that voted for Prop 8 as well as ALL of the rest of my family members (except the homosexual ones, which number about 5) because of religious belief and not homophobia. But the further you move away from the coastline the more "religious" it gets in CA. Yet the majority of people live on the coast. And though many are accepting of homosexuality (especially since gay bashing is really unacceptable in any workplace or public forum) there are those whom are religious that still will hold true to the word "marriage" as between man and woman because of religious beliefs. But wait till it's propped as "Civil Union" and I bet it passes.
http://www.kcra.com/california-proposition-8/index.html
Wait just one minute. I have asked you to show me where in "YOUR CHRISTIAN BIBLE" it says that if a person supports embryonic stem cell research, civil unions, and abortion he/she is not a Christian, and you quote the dictionary?
Then you google a bunch of Bible verses that you probably did not even read?
In label loco. It's forbidden by YOUR CHRISTIAN BIBLE. So are you telling me that it's okay to do this and still be called a Christian? Double standard like I said.
I am going to ask you one more time. Please show me where in the "CHRISTIAN BIBLE" it says that if a person supports embryonic stem cell research, civil unions, and abortion he/she is not a Christian.
-
Wait just one minute. I have asked you to show me where in "YOUR CHRISTIAN BIBLE" it says that if a person supports embryonic stem cell research, civil unions, and abortion he/she is not a Christian, and you quote the dictionary?
Then you google a bunch of Bible verses that you probably did not even read?
I am going to ask you one more time. Please show me where in the "CHRISTIAN BIBLE" it says that if a person supports embryonic stem cell research, civil unions, and abortion he/she is not a Christian.
Does Jebus like big jugs Loco?
-
Wait just one minute. I have asked you to show me where in "YOUR CHRISTIAN BIBLE" it says that if a person supports embryonic stem cell research, civil unions, and abortion he/she is not a Christian, and you quote the dictionary?
Then you must have a better definition. Why not give it?
Then you google a bunch of Bible verses that you probably did not even read?
Which cover what I said. You go back and read them and refute if they are wrong. Of course if they are, then it's a translation problem from Hebrew (which covers my basis on the Hebrew translation thread). Lol, I can't lose.
I am going to ask you one more time. Please show me where in the "CHRISTIAN BIBLE" it says that if a person supports embryonic stem cell research, civil unions, and abortion he/she is not a Christian.
Guess you were so annoyed you missed it. Gal. 1:9, and 2 Pet. 2:1-3; 3:16.
-
A better definition of what? What are you talking about now?
And where exactly in those verses dose it says that if a person does not oppose embryonic stem cell research, civil unions, and abortion he/she is not a Christian? Show me.
-
Does Jebus like big jugs Loco?
Hey deity killer,
Please take your obscene pictures to the porn board and keep them out of this board!
-
Hey deity killer,
Please take your obscene pictures to the porn board and keep them out of this board!
loco you need to respond to me :D
do i have to come looking for you >:( :(
-
I think it's safe to say that there's a backlash for the Bible thumpers in general.
They pressed the issue of ID and fundamentalism a bit too far, and now Christianity will pay for it.
Obama, while being an active Christian (and thus a bit of a lunatic imo) doesn't claim that he's talking to God like Bush did, although he say stupid shit like 'god bless america' without having proof of a God.
Obama also seems able to separate his weird beliefs from his voting.
For the record, I think McCain also would've been a move towards a more secular society.
But I don't think Christians needs to worry. There is no correlation between a Christian society and one which is law abiding, peaceful and 'happy'.
Rather, religious fundamentalism have repeatedly shown to be a troubling factor for societies.
-
A better definition of what? What are you talking about now?
You seem to know a better definition of the word Christian than the dictionary, so please give it.
And where exactly in those verses dose it says that if a person does not oppose embryonic stem cell research, civil unions, and abortion he/she is not a Christian? Show me.
That's the problem loco. According to Bible thumpers, it's the accumulation if scriptures that prove each other. So if the other scriptures I quoted are against the proposals, and being for the proposals are "bad" in God's eyes, and that defying his word and that of Jesus teachings are not followed, that they will be condemned. Now let me see, if you claim Jesus as your Savior you're saved so you're a Christian. But according to God, whom is supposed to override Jesus, these Christians whom commit "sins of omission" blantantly and without remorse, will be condemned for spreading word that those proposals are okay in the eyes of God. So at that point they aren't really followers and can't be Christians anymore because they don't WANT to follow God's and Jesus teachings. How can you not see that in your own Bible? ::)
Lol, this is actually a big joke for me because if you say it's "okay" to accept the proposals and still be a Christian, you know that people hear are going to call you a hypocrite once they read it. Might be time to change your name.
-
loco you need to respond to me :D
do i have to come looking for you >:( :(
I will Necrosis! You are a worthy adversary for science discussion. Unlike others here, you actually know the subjects you are discussing and you don't google crap and post it without even readig it first. I really have to do my homework before responding to you. ;D
-
I think it's safe to say that there's a backlash for the Bible thumpers in general.
They pressed the issue of ID and fundamentalism a bit too far, and now Christianity will pay for it.
Obama, while being an active Christian (and thus a bit of a lunatic imo) doesn't claim that he's talking to God like Bush did, although he say stupid shit like 'god bless america' without having proof of a God.
Obama also seems able to separate his weird beliefs from his voting.
For the record, I think McCain also would've been a move towards a more secular society.
But I don't think Christians needs to worry. There is no correlation between a Christian society and one which is law abiding, peaceful and 'happy'.
Rather, religious fundamentalism have repeatedly shown to be a troubling factor for societies.
Christianity has been used and abused for political gain, and yes it has and it will hurt Christianity. But the true Christians will continue doing God's work, business as usual. Ridicule and persecution have always been part of a Christian's life. Maybe not so much in the US, but in other countries around the world it has.
-
You seem to know a better definition of the word Christian than the dictionary, so please give it.
That's the problem loco. According to Bible thumpers, it's the accumulation if scriptures that prove each other. So if the other scriptures I quoted are against the proposals, and being for the proposals are "bad" in God's eyes, and that defying his word and that of Jesus teachings are not followed, that they will be condemned. Now let me see, if you claim Jesus as your Savior you're saved so you're a Christian. But according to God, whom is supposed to override Jesus, these Christians whom commit "sins of omission" blantantly and without remorse, will be condemned for spreading word that those proposals are okay in the eyes of God. So at that point they aren't really followers and can't be Christians anymore because they don't WANT to follow God's and Jesus teachings. How can you not see that in your own Bible? ::)
Lol, this is actually a big joke for me because if you say it's "okay" to accept the proposals and still be a Christian, you know that people hear are going to call you a hypocrite once they read it. Might be time to change your name.
You keep side stepping the question. Show me where in the Bible is says that a person is not a Christian unless that person opposes same sex marriage, abortion and embryonic stem cell research? You said it was there. Support your claim. I'm still waiting
-
You keep side stepping the question. Show me where in the Bible is says that a person is not a Christian unless that person opposes same sex marriage, abortion and embryonic stem cell research? You said it was there. Support your claim. I'm still waiting
Does Jebus like big jugs or not Loco?
-
You keep side stepping the question. Show me where in the Bible is says that a person is not a Christian unless that person opposes same sex marriage, abortion and embryonic stem cell research? You said it was there. Support your claim. I'm still waiting
Okay I'm game. No direct scripture. Now will you answer questions or just keep asking me for scripture relating to this.
Define Christian? Why is it okay for Christians to support the proposals when it's obviously against what God wants? Just two.
-
Personally I think Jebus likes big jugs...(and Loco does too; ten bucks says he was spanking off to that last pic)... ;D
-
Does Jebus like big jugs or not Loco?
Do you walk up to a dad, look him in the eye and ask him if he likes his own daughter's "big jugs"? I suppose your question is somewhat like that, kinda sick and twisted.
-
Personally I think Jebus likes big jugs...(and Loco does too; ten bucks says he was spanking off to that last pic)... ;D
You owe me ten bucks. Personally, I'm a butt and legs kind of guy. Most Latinos are, it seems like.
-
Ahem, no reply to my last post loco? I'd really like to know.
-
Ahem, no reply to my last post loco? I'd really like to know.
You admitted that your were wrong about your claim, and I respect that about you, and I'm satisfied. :)
As for why some Christians oppose certain social issues, while other Christians support those same issues, while yet a third group of Christians do neither choosing not to get involved, you'll have to ask them individually. I can't speak for them.
-
You admitted that your were wrong about your claim, and I respect that about you, and I'm satisfied. :)
As for why some Christians oppose certain social issues, while other Christians support those same issues, while yet a third group of Christians do neither choosing not to get involved, you'll have to ask them individually. I can't speak for them.
So what is your opinion of the Christians that do approve of them? You're not saying that it's acceptable right? And though it's not your job to judge them, do you believe they are fine in the eyes of God?
-
So what is your opinion of the Christians that do approve of them? You're not saying that it's acceptable right? And though it's not your job to judge them, do you believe they are fine in the eyes of God?
Are you referring to Christians who do not engage in homosexual behavior themselves, who say that it is a sin according to the Bible, but they do or they would vote "YES" on same sex marriage?
-
Are you referring to Christians who do not engage in homosexual behavior themselves, who say that it is a sin according to the Bible, but they do or they would vote "YES" on same sex marriage?
Yes. That and also voting for embryonic stem cell research and abortion to be legal.
-
Yes. That and also voting for embryonic stem cell research and abortion to be legal.
I've never met a Christian like that before. But if I ever did, I'd ask him/her the reasons why and I would listen.
-
I've never met a Christian like that before. But if I ever did, I'd ask him/her the reasons why and I would listen.
Barack Obama. Let me know what you think after you read his reasons.
-
Barack Obama. Let me know what you think after you read his reasons.
I don't know Barack Obama. You said he lied about being a Christian.
-
I don't know Barack Obama. You said he lied about being a Christian.
Obama claims he is a Christian.
As many other Christians he supports gay rights to a certain degree.
Some Christians, like Arnold Schwarzenegger, even supports gay marriage.
What do you think about them?
-
Obama claims he is a Christian.
As many other Christians he supports gay rights to a certain degree.
Some Christians, like Arnold Schwarzenegger, even supports gay marriage.
What do you think about them?
Like I told Oldschool Flip, I don't know them. If I ever had the pleasure to meet them, I'd listen to their reasons.
Arnold Schwarzenegger claims to be a Christian? I did not know that.
-
I don't know Barack Obama. You said he lied about being a Christian.
Course I said he lied. But everyone else including you and MCWAY seem to think he is, so what is your thought of him as a Christian wanting to instill those policies? And again it's just an opinion I'm looking for.
-
Course I said he lied. But everyone else including you and MCWAY seem to think he is, so what is your thought of him as a Christian wanting to instill those policies? And again it's just an opinion I'm looking for.
Don't say Obama because I don't know his reasons and if you copy and paste them for me from some website, how do we know they are really his reasons and not the reasons his "strategists" gave for him? For that matter, how do you even know Obama truly supports those issues and not that this is just politics as usual? Obama dropped his church and his minister("his friend", "his mentor", "his role model") in a heart beat for political gain.
So I can't give you an opinion until I meet such a Christian and ask his/her reasons for supporting those issues. And different Christians will probably give me different reasons why they do. So I would have to form my opinion for each individual and not generalize.
-
loco, why do you constantly try to avoid answering direct questions?
I remember you once gave me some sort of 'ultimatum', that if I refused to answer a couple of questions you had, you would not discuss with me anymore.
And I answered your questions, was no big deal for me.
But here you are, with Old, avoiding his questions over and over again.
What's with the double standard man?
-
loco, why do you constantly try to avoid answering direct questions?
I remember you once gave me some sort of 'ultimatum', that if I refused to answer a couple of questions you had, you would not discuss with me anymore.
And I answered your questions, was no big deal for me.
But here you are, with Old, avoiding his questions over and over again.
What's with the double standard man?
Yeah, that was the thread about Ralph Nader. ;D
I'm not avoiding the question. What you and Old School are asking me to do is to judge other Christians and label them hypocrites before I have a chance to hear what they have to say about why they support those issues. I don't do that.
Too bad you and Old School are not Christians who support those issues so that you yourself can tell me your reasons and then ask my opinion.
-
Yeah, that was the thread about Ralph Nader. ;D
I'm not avoiding the question. What you and Old School are asking me to do is to judge other Christians and label them hypocrites before I have a chance to hear what they have to say about why they support those issues. I don't do that.
Too bad you and Old School are not Christians who support those issues so that you yourself can tell me your reasons and then ask my opinion.
Well that is a start.
Lets take Obama eg.
Claims to be a Christian, goes to church et al.
But supports issues that the Christian Right in the USA deems un-Christian.
Let me ask you this then.
How could his reasons make him anything but a hypocrit in your views?
-
Well that is a start.
Lets take Obama eg.
Claims to be a Christian, goes to church et al.
But supports issues that the Christian Right in the USA deems un-Christian.
Let me ask you this then.
How could his reasons make him anything but a hypocrit in your views?
I don't know his reasons, but it could just be for political gain. Like I wrote above, Obama dropped his church and his minister("his friend", "his mentor", "his role model") in a heart beat for political gain. Got a better example?