Author Topic: Ron Paul Interview on Co Introducing Bill To Decriminalize Marijuana  (Read 3875 times)

Bindare_Dundat

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Freeborn126

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Makes sense.  But there are too many evangelicals in the Republican party to let this one slide. 
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Dos Equis

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According to the clip, it's a bill to decriminalize marijuana on the federal level and let states decide how to regulate it.  He actually made decent arguments in support of that concept.

His comments about heroin are a little simplistic.  Because he asked a room full of people if they would start using heroin if it was legalized tomorrow, and nobody raised their hands, he thinks that supports his belief that legalizing heroin will not increase its use.  I'd say you need a little more complex analysis than that.  

He also said it's easier for a kid to get marijuana than alcohol.  Really?  

Option D

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I agree

Hugo Chavez

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According to the clip, it's a bill to decriminalize marijuana on the federal level and let states decide how to regulate it.  He actually made decent arguments in support of that concept.

His comments about heroin are a little simplistic.  Because he asked a room full of people if they would start using heroin if it was legalized tomorrow, and nobody raised their hands, he thinks that supports his belief that legalizing heroin will not increase its use.  I'd say you need a little more complex analysis than that.  

He also said it's easier for a kid to get marijuana than alcohol.  Really?  
"Earlier this month the National Center on Addiction and Substance Abuse (CASA) issued the results of a survey conducted to get the latest information on teen drug use. The survey, conducted by QEV Analytics, reported that, for the first time ever, a higher percentage of teens find marijuana easier to buy than cigarettes and alcohol"
http://www.ecstasyaddiction.com/PressReleasePages/marijuanaeasiertoget.html

It probably varies depending on where you are. 

Bindare_Dundat

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Probably both are equally easy to get for the most part.


At worst, legalizing drugs would probably increase usage minimally at first as those whose only reason not to try was fear of getting busted. Most people obviously ignore the law anyway and get high, so in the long run I don't think we'd see things get worse or better regarding how many people abuse it compared to today. 

Maybe, attitudes towards addiction and how to deal with it would change for the better.

Hugo Chavez

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Probably both are equally easy to get for the most part.


At worst, legalizing drugs would probably  increase usage at first as those whose only reason not to try was fear of getting busted. Most people obviously ignore the law anyway and get high, so in the long run I don't think we'd see things get worse or better regarding how many people abuse it compared to today.

Maybe, attitudes towards addiciton and how to deal with it would change for the better.
what's scary is that law enforcement would no doubt turn their sights on something else to keep their budgets.  Who knows what that'll be, there's a lot of laws that are silly and not enforced.  Probably target obsenity heavy again and have prisons filled with people doing time for their toys lol...

Hereford

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The problem with marijuana is not marijuana. It's all the associated things the drug addicts do to get it and what they do when on it.

Marijuana (like all drugs) is regulated because the law is too chicken shit to actually regulate the people that cause the problems.

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i diagree with RP on this one

whork25

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I dont think you can really compare Marihuana with Heroin, they are pretty different..
Like comparing mineral water to Vodka

kcballer

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Roger Bacon

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He also said it's easier for a kid to get marijuana than alcohol.  Really?  

I don't know how long ago you were a kid (no disrespect), but that's generally true.  At least where I'm from.


Dos Equis

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I don't know how long ago you were a kid (no disrespect), but that's generally true.  At least where I'm from.



News to me, given how easy it is for a kid to get alcohol. 

chadstallion

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way to go!
this will be entertaining to watch as it develops...
w

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News to me, given how easy it is for a kid to get alcohol. 


yeah.. i think they are equally as easy

Dos Equis

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way to go!
this will be entertaining to watch as it develops...

I doubt it develops.  

Dos Equis

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yeah.. i think they are equally as easy

I know it's all over the place (especially here), but just seems like it would be easier to get a product you can pull right off the shelf than one that is illegal.  But I'll defer to you folks. 

roccoginge

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The problem with marijuana is not marijuana. It's all the associated things the drug addicts do to get it and what they do when on it.

Marijuana (like all drugs) is regulated because the law is too chicken shit to actually regulate the people that cause the problems.
Like people will be sucking dick for weed, come on.

outby43

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i diagree with RP on this one

That's surprising.  Do you have an issue with responsible adult use?

Roger Bacon

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I think it's due to the fact that you generally can't purchase alcohol anymore if you're under 21.  Alcohol come in big containers, hard to keep on the down low. 

All the Marijuana you need fits in a small zip lock bag, goes from pocket to pocket.  Anyone interested probably knows a person, and can get it at the drop of a hat.

Dos Equis

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He makes some good points, particularly the points about addiction and that 97 percent of people in prison over drug crimes are dealers, not users.  Also cites evidence that contradicts the notion that it's easier (or just as easy) to obtain marijuana v. alcohol.
 

Why Barney Frank and Ron Paul are wrong on drug legalization

By William J. Bennett, CNN Contributor
June 30, 2011

Editor's note: William J. Bennett is the Washington fellow of the Claremont Institute. He was U.S. secretary of education from 1985 to 1988 and was director of the Office of National Drug Control Policy under President George H.W. Bush.

(CNN) -- From certain precincts on the left, notably Barney Frank, to certain precincts on the right, notably the editorial page of National Review, we are witnessing a new push to end the so-called war on drugs and legalize drug use, starting with marijuana. Indeed, Ron Paul, Barney Frank's co-sponsor in the latest legislative effort, said recently he would go so far as to legalize heroin.

It's a bad idea. My friends at National Review begin their case by stating the illegalization of drugs has "curtailed personal freedom, created a violent black market and filled our prisons." But the legalization of drugs, including marijuana, would exacerbate each of these problems.

Starting with the basics, keeping drugs illegal is one of the best ways to keep drugs out of the hands -- and brains -- of children. We know three things here: First, children who don't use drugs continually tell us one of the reasons they don't is precisely because they are illegal.

For example, since at least 1975, report after report has found that "perceptions of the risk and social disapproval of drug use correlate very closely with drug taking behavior." When those in the drug prevention community ask teens who don't use drugs why they don't, time and again, the answer comes back "because it's illegal." This, of course, explains why a greater percentage of teens abuse legal substances like tobacco and alcohol over illegal drugs such as marijuana -- even when they say marijuana is easily accessible.

Second, keeping drugs out of the hands of children is the best way to prevent drug addiction generally, as study after study has confirmed that if we keep a child drug free until age 21, the chances of use in adulthood are next to zero.

Third, we don't need to guess at hypothetical legalization schemes. Our experience with legally prescribed narcotics has already proven it, and we now have an epidemic. This, despite doing everything the theorists have asked, from oversight to regulation to prescription requirements.

Normalizing, de-stigmatizing, and legalizing illegal drugs lowers their price and increases their use. As a recent RAND study on California found, legalization of marijuana there would cut the price by as much as 80% and increase use from as little as 50% to as much as 100%. Just what California, just what our society, needs.

As for the current drug policies curtailing personal freedom, the question is: "Whose freedom?" The drug dealers', sure -- the drug consumers, no.

As any parent with a child addicted to drugs will explain, as any visit to a drug rehab center will convey, those caught in the web of addiction are anything but free. And it is not because of their incarceration or rehabilitation, it is because of the vicious cycle of dependency, waste and brain damage addiction and abuse cause.

Let us make no mistake about this, either: Marijuana is much more potent and causes much more damage than we used to know. Today's marijuana tests on average at more than 10% THC (the psychoactive ingredient). We are even seeing samples of more than 30% THC. This is compared to the relatively lower levels of THC most legalizing proponents were more familiar with in generations past (under 4% in the early 1980s, even lower in the 1960s).

Chronic adolescent marijuana use has been found to be associated with "poorer performance on thinking tasks, including slower psychomotor speed and poorer complex attention, verbal memory and planning ability." We are seeing study after study finding adolescent marijuana use responsible for "disrupted brain development" in teens. Worse, we are seeing more and more studies showing teen marijuana use linked to psychosis.

As for the high incarceration rates for simple marijuana use and possession, it is a myth. As government documentation actually shows, over 97% of sentencing on federal marijuana-related charges is for trafficking, less than 2% is for simple possession. Indeed, the only National Review authority with federal prosecutorial experience that I know of backs this point up: "Actual enforcement is targeted at big distributors. People who merely possess drugs for personal use well know they are substantially safe no matter what the statutes say."

We have had a fair amount of experience with legalization and decriminalization schemes. What are those communities now saying? Citizens are trying to put the genie back in the bottle, from Northern California (where residents have complained that medical marijuana has "spawned crime, drug cartels and teenage pot use"), to the Netherlands (where drug tourism, use by minors, and border trafficking has increased), to England (where apologies have been made for endorsing decriminalization in light of the subsequent growth of teen drug treatment needs), to Colorado (where easy access has increased demand, "made a mockery" of the legal system, and is increasingly endangering public safety).

We have an illegal drug abuse epidemic in this country and it has not been given enough attention. But the cultural messages, as much as the law, matter. When we unified on this, as we once did, drug use went down. When we let up, as we now have, use increases.

The libertarian experiment promoted as a novel theory by some will only make things worse. More legalization equals more damage, waste, crime and abuse. Not less. That is why it is no time to surrender.

http://www.cnn.com/2011/OPINION/06/30/bennett.drug.legalization/index.html?hpt=hp_t2

outby43

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^

He keeps going on and on about adolescent use.  Well no shit I don't condone kids getting baked either.  I am only for adult use only in private areas and never while driving or work etc..

Now as far as  nobody goes to Prison for personal use that may be true on the federal level but I know first hand there are plenty of people rotting in county jails over possession.  Those who do not go to jail are sent to Drug court which is 110 times harder than probation.  I estimate that I am $20,000 in the hole because of a simple possession all going to fines, lawyers, gas, treatment, counseling.  So fuck this clown.  The thing now is to put weed smokers in Drug court because by and large we are responsible people.  This will make there success % go up for further funding.  It is all about money and people keeping their jobs.

Dos Equis

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He keeps going on and on about adolescent use.  Well no shit I don't condone kids getting baked either.  I am only for adult use only in private areas and never while driving or work etc..

Now as far as  nobody goes to Prison for personal use that may be true on the federal level but I know first hand there are plenty of people rotting in county jails over possession.  Those who do not go to jail are sent to Drug court which is 110 times harder than probation.  I estimate that I am $20,000 in the hole because of a simple possession all going to fines, lawyers, gas, treatment, counseling.  So fuck this clown.  The thing now is to put weed smokers in Drug court because by and large we are responsible people.  This will make there success % go up for further funding.  It is all about money and people keeping their jobs.

Sorry to hear about your troubles. 

He talks about adolescent use, because that's probably the biggest stumbling block to legalizing drugs.  The data he references says the only thing standing between drug use by a number of kids is illegality.  Remove that barrier, even if it's just for adults, and you'll likely see a dramatic increase in use, abuse, addiction, etc. involving kids. 

tu_holmes

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He also said it's easier for a kid to get marijuana than alcohol.  Really?   

Absolutely true... because alcohol is legal and regulated, kids can't just go get it.

No drug dealer checks ID.

Dos Equis

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Absolutely true... because alcohol is legal and regulated, kids can't just go get it.

No drug dealer checks ID.

Alcohol is about as easy as soda for kids to get.  All they need is an adult to buy it for them.  Or an adult to have it available.

This part of Bennett's article talks about it:

For example, since at least 1975, report after report has found that "perceptions of the risk and social disapproval of drug use correlate very closely with drug taking behavior." When those in the drug prevention community ask teens who don't use drugs why they don't, time and again, the answer comes back "because it's illegal." This, of course, explains why a greater percentage of teens abuse legal substances like tobacco and alcohol over illegal drugs such as marijuana -- even when they say marijuana is easily accessible.

Second, keeping drugs out of the hands of children is the best way to prevent drug addiction generally, as study after study has confirmed that if we keep a child drug free until age 21, the chances of use in adulthood are next to zero.