The issue is this, there are many programs like AA that utilize a group format that have shown to be effective. So, why continue to implement a program which has poor results? As stated, many of the people you mentioned would also do quite well in other group format treatment programs, but they choose AA because of the hype. Perhaps these people would do EVEN better in these programs. You don't know that.
Youre letting your emotions get the best of you. This is about factual evidence and what treatment work and do not work. This objectively about it.
Dude... i fucking hated AA. But im not about to force someone else out of something thats keeping them sober into something else that may or may not work, and risk them losing their sobriety, because i dont agree with ones message, and I like the results better on a different program.
Thats not our decision to make. Thats theirs.
I think YOU guys are letting your emotions cloud your judgement, because you dislike the spirituality angle and because there are other treatments that have been shown to have a better success rate.
Thats all fine and good, but thats no reason to try and take someone out of a program that they found that works for them.
I guarantee you, theyd be pretty pissed if they lost 25 yrs of sobriety because you said 'AA is flawed, you need to try this program instead, it has a better success rate', only for them to decide they hate the programs ideas/message/people, and go get fucked up.
You habr to remember, these people arent rational, theh live on the razora edge, one bad experience away from being fucked up again.
You can disagree with me all you want, thats fine, but ive lived and seen this shit 1st hand.
I hated it. Other guys cant live without it. We dont habe a right to tell them they need to jeaporsizs what works for them because we dont like the idea of AA or its principles.